So it begins- our society will no longer be covert about it. Women will rape and steal from you, this is your place in society. This is acceptable. Arizona statutory rape victim forced to pay child support
Why does the definition of adult change with the needs of the justice system? 18=Adult unless its drugs then its 21 oh unless its murder then you can be 8 and considered an adult.
WTF is our problem?
Men don't change definitions to their whims like this.
The fact that the fucking law enforcers are siding with the rapist and giving said rapist a fucking price is what we are raging about here.
You can imagine what would have been the outcome if the genders where reversed, a man would be already be in jail convicted as a rapist and treated as such. Which I've been told is not pleasant.
"While in high school, Olivas had sex with a 20-year-old woman. As he sees it now, she took advantage of a lonely kid..."
As he sees it now...Now that it's going to cost him, he thinks he might've been raped? Never went to the cops before. How in the world is this rape? And don't give me that "well, if the genders were reversed" bullshit.
Could be. It varies wildly by state and country. He never at any point claimed to be a victim of rape, still doesn't. But hey, you know better than him I guess. Still shouldn't have to pay a dime though.
Feit said if the roles were reversed and the woman was the victim, the scenario would be unthinkable.
"The idea that a woman would have to send money to a man who raped her is absolutely off-the-charts ridiculous," he said. "It wouldn't be tolerated, and it shouldn't be tolerated."
This stuck with me too... As a single dad who pays more than most... All I can ad is fear he felt is real. Foc is relentless... don't get me wrong I love my kid but the foc makes it really hard for me to advocate having more... All in all dont have kids.
You're right, just actually imagine if me, as a 20-something year old, had dubiously consensual sex with a 14 year old girl, which was deemed rape at the time. Then years later demanded that that girl pay me money. It would be jailable to make contact.
28 If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, 29 he shall pay her father fifty shekels[a] of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.
It's cool man. I saw where you were going with it. Have an upvote.
-6 upvotes • [deleted] • 5 years ago
[permanently deleted]
12 upvotes • [deleted] • 5 years ago
The corollary to that rule was that if the woman was not screaming out for help then she couldn't say that she was raped. There was no way for her to have consensual sex and later claim rape. The law nipped women's nature in the bud. And also made it significantly costly to be a real rapist (imagine having to marry the woman you raped).
Oh!.. I was lumping them all in one group lol my bad. These.. Umm.. these things I've talking to lately have been nothing but ball crushing bitches. Even in passing. Eeeaa
the joke is that feminists love to claim they are for equality and giving attention to men's issues, but of course they never actually discuss anything, they just make the claim that they do.
If feminists actually cared about equal rights 95% of their topics would be about men.
The only legitimate problem i know of is that some women are paid about 5% less than an equal man. Then again, unmarried women with no kids aged 25-40 or so are paid 108% of an equivalent man.
Instead they push women's issues like breast cancer (instead of cancer that affects everyone), that being fat is ok, and how birth control should be covered by health insurance.
Basically, anything that costs them less, and men more, is what they want.
First bravo on replying, I'll give you props for that. But here is where you went wrong.
You say you identify yourself as an equalist over feminist. But we weren't talking about equalists, we were talking about feminists. So you disqualified yourself from having a reason to respond.
Then, you proceed to state your platform and how you feel the situation should be handled, but state there is nothing you can do.
Then after you make your post that in no way contributes to the conversation, you get upset because of downvotes, and say "Of course I'm being downvoted. My fault for coming to the red pill with logic and reasoning"
I think you misinterpreted the "bravo" as sarcasm. It's not. Please read his comment. It wasn't insulting at all, and he gave you a well-thought, honest response.
Funny thing about post history is it's chronological. Want to see the post just before this very one? Where you came here waving a white flag and extending an olive branch on behalf of women?
If you're no longer covered by your parent's health insurance, your manufacturer's warranty is over by hexagonzin Showerthoughts [–]For_The_Fail 1 point 2 hours ago I highly doubt if you frequent that sub that any girl would be interested in your neckbeard or your shitty negging tactics.
You clearly were coming here with an open mind since you made that commend about TDP sub. Then this post I'm replying to. Tada!
So it begins- our society will no longer be covert about it. Women will rape and steal from you, this is your place in society. This is acceptable. Arizona statutory rape victim forced to pay child support by redpillschoolin TheRedPill [–]For_The_Fail 5 points 2 hours ago* I subscribed only to reply to you. I'm a woman, but I'd identify as an equalist over a feminist. It's not about one side getting ahead, it's us all being treated like humans. At least that's my view. Anyway, I'd defend him if there's anything I could do. He's not being treated fairly and this is all bullshit. Laws should be in place to stop both men and women from taking advantage of others physically or financially. EDIT: This is why girls don't come here, even if they agree with many of your views on men's rights. Just having a vagina makes people here into bullies. Note how many times I personally insulted anyone (zero) and how many personal insults were thrown my way. I know this is only a small sampling of a larger group, but this sort of thing leads all the rest of Reddit to think this sub is filled with xenophobes. The gist of the comment chain is as follows. My original comment here > Blatant insults > Me pointing out insults > "Boo hoo, gonna cry about it? GTFO" I'm a lesbian, and when straight people feel comfortable to engage me in discussion on the topic, instead of accusing anyone of insensitivity, I answer clearly. I think when women come here, you guys should be extra friendly in order to communicate your views and welcome another demographic to believe in your cause. permalinksavecontextfull comments (116)reportgive gold
If you're no longer covered by your parent's health insurance, your manufacturer's warranty is over by hexagonzin Showerthoughts [–]For_The_Fail 1 point 2 hours ago I highly doubt if you frequent that sub that any girl would be interested in your neckbeard or your shitty negging tactics. permalinksavecontextfull comments (339)reportgive gold
Came to troll. Got caught.
Sad thing? I was looking at your post history to see if you were being blindsided unfairly here.
You are demanding especial treatment just for having a vagina, that doesn't fly here.
We won't be extra friendly (lol) to cater to your feelings.
Also you have been getting well articulated replies, and when you can't make a counter argument you just cry MUH FEELZ®, and its annoying because you shut up any chance of an argument.
Lastly just so you have an excuse to feel insulted:
I think when women come here, you guys should be extra friendly in order to communicate your views and welcome another demographic to believe in your cause.
If this were /r/MensRights, you might have a point (you'd still be wrong, but it would be worth looking at more in depth). Here we actually don't give a single fuck. Really. The more people that swallow the pill, the harder we have it. We don't mind, because we're up to the challenge of increased competition, but there is seriously zero interest in getting other people - random strangers - to buy into it. I care about my brother eventually figuring it out, and he's the only person I'll be careful about my delivery so as not to alienate him.
I think when women come here, you guys should be extra friendly
Could I talk you into a different self-identification? If you understand what you just said - and I suppose you do - you must self-identify as a troll.
This is a place for men. Not a male space, or a place for males or boys or 46XY's; a place for men. There are almost no places for men left. It's not particularly nice in here. If I, a man, say some dumbass thing to another man, that man is quick to call me on it. That's because men don't expect bullshit from each other and don't have to tolerate it.
I don't know what kind of place you were expecting, but you should temper your expectations in favor of the place that you actually found.
when straight people feel comfortable to engage me in discussion
This is a kind of trolling. You can learn more in the sidebar about what kind of trolling is unwanted here; there's a special link all about it. This one would be called a "Code Yellow." I would venture to suggest that, like me, most men don't care what you do in your spare time, especially in your bedroom. I know I don't want to hear about it.
7 upvotes • [deleted] • 5 years ago
The point is, we don't give a shit that you're a female or feminist or anything else. Your statement should stand by itself without you needing special treatment or consideration for being a woman. If it can't, it's useless trash.
When the men talked sarcastically about "help from the feminists", what they meant was publicity, focused political and peer group pressure in the right places, to correct what is an obvious gender-based legal injustice. Equalist feminists are always supposedly looking out for "both men and women", and want to make the world a better place. So they say, which we rightly ignore, to look at what they do: they couldn't care less about correcting that obvious injustice, as it doesn't help them advance their bosses' underlying socialist agenda.
Now that's all nice and clear, it goes without saying that in this culture war of the Titans nobody gives a shit about the opinions or moral positions of the helpless, i.e. you.
Don't take it personally. The reason why you're getting flak is because we live in a society where women will claim they stand up for injustice against men but the majority of the time they just stand idly by like cowards as the man's life is ruined.
Don't be a coward. If you see a girl acting like a sexist cunt then put her in her fucking place. Encourage your friends to do the same. Until we see ladies standing up like that then women are not going to get very far in the respect department, sorry. In all my 27 years I have yet to see a woman stand up to another bitch on behalf of a man. Go out there and be the hero The Red Pill deserves. Have an upvote.
Not completely true. Some women offer articulated, well written posts like veggie_girl but its definitely rare. This is a Man's Club, the only one we have left really, so ladies you can't be expected to be greeted with open arms for having a pussy. We are looking for logical debate here, not muh feelz.
Sorry for the treatment you received for sharing your perspective. This sub's population has taken a turn for the worse over the year that I've been here, as exhibited by your -26 points for stating that people should be treated equally.
Yes. I'm a feminist (a male one) and I think this guy is getting royally screwed. He desperately needs a lawyer but cannot afford one. He needs to contact some of the legal aid societies in his area.
I'm in a sorta similar situation.. well, it's a situation that's part of the same system is probably how I should put it. both my ex wives are not worried about back child support. I'm in school right now so I can make more money later. They both told the judge to lay off.. I have court on the 8th and will probably get 22 days jail time for "contempt of court" for still being behind despite the fact that my ex's and I get along and are on the same page.
Stupid. The lawyer doesn't even care about what's good for my kids, she told me so, she just said she wouldn't, not ask for jail time.
I make too much money being on the G.I. Bill to get an appointed lawyer and can't afford one on my own. yea, the G.I. Bill and my disability check for nerve damage in Iraq are too much for a lawyer, yet I can barely pay my rent much less the child support.
In essence, this is a good thing, because we've now drawn attention to just how fucked up the "best interest of the child" concept is when applying it wholesale to hold men responsible for women's decisions.
In this case, there is quite clearly a line that was crossed in the name of "best interest of the child," which is undeniably wrong-- and yet, is the exact same logic being used in every other case where a woman is free to make a decision that men will ultimately be held accountable for.
If we can prove that "best interest of the child" is not a proper standard to hold random parties responsible for an irresponsible woman's actions, (including theft of sperm and rape), then the entire structure of moving resources from men to women starts to break down.
It's not the interest of the child. These laws protect the interest of the state. If men weren't forced to pay then the state would have to support the female and the child.
Which would then result in the state giving fewer handouts to deadbeat mothers. Feminists would then claim this infringes on the freedom of women to conceive, as they would then be unable to economically support a child that is their right to have.
Jack Nicholson was right, it's really easy to write for a woman when you remove reason and accountability.
My opinion is that anyone who believes in "the best interest of the child at all costs" also has to be unequivocally pro-Life in order to not be committing a blatant lack of coherence.
We as men have a right to protest, morality and ethics is on our side, but really we should be ashamed of ourselves.
They are doing nothing we didn't let, empower them to do and we wrote the fucking laws for it. They're way too nasty and far-reaching to be feminine work.
Exactly, feminism is an extreme left ideology born from over socialization, too much comfort which makes people complacent and lazy, we are in a decadence period in present times.
It happened to China, to Greece, Rome, etc. And its happening now but not just to an empire, but almost world wide. It only goes down from here.
Serious question, do we have good evidence that feminist-like ideologies happened in China, Greece, etc? The most popular cases are Rome and the USSR, as far as I've heard (and the western societies, of course).
You need to study history a bit better. There are many women in the 150+ IQ range that have had an effect on society. 1/7th of intelligent people are women but most of them sit in the middle of the curve. Where as, we as men, fill in the high and low end of the bell curve, mostly.
I also saw this article and was considering posting it. I've been lurking here for a month or so and this is the first article that I've felt compelled to comment on. Some recent posts have highlighted the disposable nature of men and stories like this only confirm that notion.
These men were technically still boys when they were taken advantage of by older women. The fact that rapists can extract payments from their victims is insane. Nick Olivas even has to pay interest and back payments from when he was 14. This poor guy was raped twice.
In the case of statutory rape, it's not up to him or the family to press charges; he doesn't get a say in the matter. It is the state's responsibility, hence the word "statutory". This is a (probably female) prosecutor that either committed gross negligence at best or had sinister intent at worst. Remember, many, many people, even in the justice system, truly hold the belief that a man/boy cannot be "raped".
it's the state's responsibility to pursue charges like these. however, state prosecutors are people and their careers are political, so they don't always pursue cases if it doesn't make their career look any better. the state prosecutors wouldn't have anything to personally gain by winning this case. it wouldn't advance their careers because you can't earn status in the justice system by putting female rapists in jail in our culture. charging single moms for statutory rape, even if it's completely true and deserving of justice, wouldn't help state prosecutors get elected as a judge or district attorney, so why would they?
they're the law, and they'll do what they can to make their own lives better at your expense. remember this whenever you deal with the state and the justice system.
You're right, boys/girls = identical. Gloria Steinem was right after all I guess.
1 upvotes • [deleted] • 5 years ago
Equal in what regard? Being different sexes necessarily means fundamental differences in behavior and physical capabilities but at the simplest level, men and women are both human and should this be equal under the law. As it stands, men are viewed as somehow flawed or inferior in the eyes of the law. That's the point I was trying to make.
Maybe, but the truth of the matter is if the genders were reversed the state would be charging in full speed ahead to arrest and convict a 20 year old guy who fucked a 14 year old girl...
Just because he made a poor decision 4 years before he is considered an adult does not mean his adult life should start 4 years in the hole in terms of debt and really he should not be responsible for the child forced on him by an adult while he was still a child himself.
Really this is a case when the government should grow a pair and just suck it up and deal. Unfortunately, when you insentiveize the need to find someone responsible the court will find someone responsible no matter what hamstering has to be done...
Just imagine if the criminal courts got a kickback for sending people to jail? That's basically what the incentives given to family courts are encouraging similar behavior in the realm of divorce and child support.
The problem is the concept of child support altogether. Ethically, it doesn't make any sense because having the child is solely the woman's choice. A choice that is completely up to person A potentially sending person B to jail makes little sense, but that's our system!
Ethically, it doesn't make any sense because having the child is solely the woman's choice. A choice that is completely up to person A potentially sending person B to jail makes little sense, but that's our system!
absolutely. Either the man gets a say in abortion/not paying child support, or we punish abortion like murder.
If abortion is legal illegal, so the woman has to have the child, and the father doesn't want to take custody, then yes, some child support makes sense. But, in the best interests of the child means having them raised by the more wealthy parent, so the father should always have the option of taking primary custody rather than paying child support.
But, in the best interests of the child means having them raised by the more wealthy parent
I think you hit on a really good point here. If we say that the nurturing side of a woman's persona is a social construct, and that men are equally capable of being caring and nurturing, then does it not make sense to have the child be in the custody of the more financially stable parent? If we are eliminating gender, then does it not make sense to have the parent be the one that can better support the child and provide the things it needs?
Or are we giving custody to the woman because she is more likely to be home to care for the kid in more personal ways? If so, then we are highlighting why the "wage gap" exists. In that women are home more often while men stay at work, and so explaining why they make less.
I think that having custody go to the more financially stable parent is a golden idea. But it will never happen. And the reason has nothing to do with men not being able to raise children, or women being better at it. Its because men are viewed as potential pedophiles and rapists in this society. I really believe that apart from the idea that men are somehow less suited to caring for a child, this belief of mainstream society is what keeps the family courts from awarding custody to men.
After all, what repercussions would the court face if they awarded custody to the father, only to have it be revealed that he ended up raping his daughter? The whole thing is a minefield anyways, family court definitely needs reform, but there are new problems that can definitely be created by the solutions to the current problems.
There have been several articles talking about female pedophiles released in short succession the past couple of days, all starting the same way. The climate has shifted. It won't be too long before most people are aware that women are pedophiles too, and then not much longer until they're aware that women are pedophiles at the same rate.
This is becoming more and more common, I've read quite a few articles on the matter but it still leaves me speechless every time I come across this kind of utter moral decay. It seems to me that the media coverage on these matters emphasizing the lunacy of women actually getting away with it has not discouraged, but emboldened women to go out and commit these crimes with impunity.
The guy in question didn't fight the case. The logical conclusion would be to place a certain amount of blame on him for his situation. However, applying common sense he shouldn't have to defend himself given the circumstances. The underlying factor for this event, and how it played out is truly terrifying. Look at the other discussions tab and count how many feminist or pro-female subreddits are discussing the event. The answer is none.
Remember folks, progressive thought always goes in one direction. It is only a matter of time before the rest country succumbs to complete and utter madness.
This satirical comment should not be getting upvoted because it is stooping to the level of the SJW shame-logical-blame tactic. The comment above saying he did not fight the case and is thus partially responsible is entirely legitimate.
i would also venture to say he should have reported the rape so that the statute of limitations does not run out(IANAL) and she would have been charged appropriately, then maybe file for sole custody and get child support from her.
however its not in our genes as men, or in this case a young boy, to gripe and complain about free sex with a 17 year old girl while hormones are raging.
However, applying common sense he shouldn't have to defend himself given the circumstances.
That is not how the legal system works, and it has never worked like that. I am driving my car, and then run into your parked car and then drive away. I then decide to file a hit and run case again you. You recieve the summons and do not show up in court. Guess what, you will be paying to get my car fixed and what other damages my lawyer can dream up.
A valid point, but the fact he failed to appear for the legal summons means he automatically loses the case.
I did a google, law students are allowed to practice law under the supervision of an attorney in USA, other countries have similar laws. A smart law student will want to get some cases under his belt. And usually law profs are attorneys.
Make some friends with law students. Often a law student will work harder then a licensed attorney because they want to learn. Sometimes in cases like this one it is better to get a lady lawyer. But before you decide, get a feel how the student views the case.
A valid point, but the fact he failed to appear for the legal summons means he automatically loses the case.
Given the state makes sure it doesn't teach its slaves anything about the legal system in schools, this is not surprising. The guy probably read this and thought it was absurd (which it is) so trashed it in the bin.
He could indeed make lawyer student friends, but he's probably too busy trying to keep up with his rent.
Back in the olden days, there was this place called a library which was full of these heavy paper things called books. There was this other thing called a card catalog. You had to look up stuff in it, then walk possibly to another floor to find the right book.
Point I am making is to find out if law students can practice law back in the old days might take an entire morning if you where lucky. With google I found out the same info in 30 seconds.
What amazes me is despite the ease of access to information, general stupidity is increasing.
Watch what 95% of people do while waiting for something. They gaze off into space like some herd animal. Or they are posting some nonsense on facebook.
I am an uneducated hillbilly. But I would always keep a book in my pocket, and when I had a spare moment read a few pages. Or if I didn't have a book, the military taught me to keep a notebook and pencil in my pocket. I would write down my thoughts and ideas.
Nowdays I have this amazing thing called a tablet. It can hold thousands of books, it has lots of notepads inside it. I can share ideas with people from all over the world. This devide is so cheap that almost anyone can afford to buy one. I marvel at this device.
The real root of the matter is what you said at first: The guy didn't fight the case. Then you go off the rails blaming everyone but him for what happened.
From the comments, INSANE if true - RE: no statute of limitations on rape in AZ, he could go ahead and press charges for rape then get custody, right? oh....
From my understanding, the Police told the victim they weren't going to pick up charges on her because it would de-stabilize the child's life, so...
Same laws allowed my mother to kick me (15 at the time) and my dad out of the house, and then steal his gun safe full of his own fire arms, family heirlooms, and various other valuables. This is perfectly legal although she is not legally allowed to carry a firearm, and has never received training on how to maintain/handle one. This "justice" system is horribly flawed, and totally slanted for women to win. Enough with the god damn pussy pass in our courts.
From April 2013 through March 2014, the state recouped just over $14 million in previously dispersed cash assistance through child-support payments.
The state just revealed their attitude: that of a debt collector. Their goal is to "recoup" money otherwise paid out as welfare. There will never be justice for men if the state views us as a revenue stream.
As much as I love the gun and business laws in my state, I'm embarrassed about this.
5 upvotes • [deleted] • 5 years ago
For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.
Things will get mental, yes, but eventually enough people will get fucked over in all walks of life for them to start being represented in government etc.
I feel that support payments should not benefit the parents in any way, form or manner. Both parents should be required to pay cash into a fund that benefits the child, and the child only, and that is administered by a third party. That will put a stop to this nonsense.
Agreed. I worked at a generic service providing establishment, where we charged consumers about 90$ a month for our non necessity service. I spoke to countless mothers who had to wait for their child support to come in to pay their bill.
I'm curious how this can also play out, if at all, in the abortion rights arena. Women get raped, statutorily or otherwise, they have the choice to abort what is essentially seen as the product of a rape. Now we see a young man not only forced to live with the embodiment of his violation, but pay for it personally and financially as ordered by the state.
If I could play Devil's advocate for just a second. If a woman bears a child from rape then isn't she responsible for it's upbringing?
I understand that she has the option to abort, but it's a conception that she didn't want. It seems unfair that anybody has to take the financial burden on such a situation.
The title is kind of misleading but I get the take-away message. If the gender roles were reversed he would be in jail and she would be the poor rape victim.
Putting it on FB, don't really have the guts for it but even worse I doubt most would get it at all.
He said he panicked, ignored the legal documents and never got the required paternity test. The state eventually tracked him down.
Only time paternity test is mentioned. Was one done at all? If not he is a retard.
The issue is that the child is also a victim, and in the logic of the law, the child's interests have to come before the woman's, or the father, who also is a victim in this case.
Ultimately, someone has to pay for this kid's expenses. If the mother picks up the tab, she will appeal to the state for aid. The state would rather pass the bill along to the father than to pay it out of state coffers, even if the father himself was the victim of a crime.
It sucks, but the law has its own infernal logic to it.
I am probably inclined to agree, but it's not clear cut. The child shouldn't suffer for the sins of the mother. Making the father pay means ultimately he could get custody and rescue that kid from his obviously-fucked-up mother. Even if the father's parents do a lot of the heavy lifting, it might ultimately be better for the kid than being the child of a single mother on the public dole.
You can say it's a "rape baby" but the rape is done and over. The baby is just a baby, and shouldn't be just thrown to the wolves. Also, the state has no money of its own, so you're really saying everyone should pay. That's why this is so tricky.
That's a good point, and is something that could be additionally litigated, but it's separate from the issue of the child having food to eat and a roof over their head. The state doesn't say "well, because the mother is evil, the father is free of obligation to the child." If anything, the father having a responsibility to pay for the child, also has the standing to sue the mother for custody, or perhaps to even put the child up for adoption, or whatever other remedy seems appropriate to him. The father also has a responsibility to press charges, if a crime was committed then that would be a further mark against the mother, and in that case the state might end up putting the child in foster care (which also might be abusive, so that's not necessarily the best thing either).
It's a shitty situation all around, but the state is going to put its own interests first, and among the three individuals involved, the child's interests over those of the parents.
I am firmly in support in the forced abortion for all children conceived due to rape!
.. Clear sarcasm, obviously, but I hate the idea that the kid has rights that supersede actual adults. The way I see it, is it's a cop out. If you think it has rights, raise the little shit yourself, instead of leaving it with the horrible kind of person who would rape someone, or the person who is fucked up from being raped.
I really don't think this is going to hold up in court, not only was the man raped as a teenager but he did not know about his daughter for 6 years. While it's great to raise alarm about something like this happening, I'm sure this news source ate up this story to get some hits on their site.
The sad thing is, not only is this guy getting absolutely screwed off going through a traumatic experience.. But the courts are allowing a CHILD PREDATOR RAPIST TO HAVE CUSTODY OF A CHILD.
With that being said, would like to hear how this case turns out in the next few months.
American fuckers who consider themselves men, but at large accept this shit, making nobody fear no backlash, they deserve this society. I'm speaking generally.
This is fucking ridiculous... It is literally male oppression stemming from bullshit feminist propaganda. How a boy who was raped can be forced to pay child support for the child conceived during the rape is one of the most disgusting thing I've ever read. Exactly as they say, if this was the other way round and it was a young girl who was raped she would never in any circumstance even be even considered to be charged with child support payments
This makes my blood boil, I'm literally shaking typing this I'm so angry
I think it's very unfortunate that children end up the victim of irresponsible mothers. But it is her choice how to raise her child. Once consequences start coming to mothers, I think you'll see less fragrant abuses of the system by mothers.
Personally, I think that a rapist is not a fit parent. Therefore, I feel as though that the best thing for the child is either to be placed in a home with fit parents, or to be given to the biological parent who is fit to raise a child.
As long as the child exists, it ought to be looked after by someone. The child didn't ask to be the product of a statutory rape. However, the rape victim should definitely not be responsible for this child.
Child support is not about the woman or the man and you really shout start to understand that. It's about the child. It's not the child's fault that their mom is a rapist and their dad wasn't aware that he/she was born.
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Why does the definition of adult change with the needs of the justice system? 18=Adult unless its drugs then its 21 oh unless its murder then you can be 8 and considered an adult.
WTF is our problem?
Men don't change definitions to their whims like this.
Even if statutory rape is ridiculous. This is still outrageous.
Do you really think age of consent laws don't matter just because he has a penis?
That's not the point tho.
The fact that the fucking law enforcers are siding with the rapist and giving said rapist a fucking price is what we are raging about here.
You can imagine what would have been the outcome if the genders where reversed, a man would be already be in jail convicted as a rapist and treated as such. Which I've been told is not pleasant.
Adult rapes child. State gives custody of child to child molester/rapist. Forces rape victim to pay child support.
What the fuck is happening in this country? She ought to be in prison!
But... but... think of whats best for the kid!
What's best for the kid is to be taught that you can't rape people and get away with it.
The system has a different opinion.
Ok, that absolutely not what happened. Read the article.
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"While in high school, Olivas had sex with a 20-year-old woman. As he sees it now, she took advantage of a lonely kid..."
As he sees it now...Now that it's going to cost him, he thinks he might've been raped? Never went to the cops before. How in the world is this rape? And don't give me that "well, if the genders were reversed" bullshit.
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Could be. It varies wildly by state and country. He never at any point claimed to be a victim of rape, still doesn't. But hey, you know better than him I guess. Still shouldn't have to pay a dime though.
A telling quote from the article:
This stuck with me too... As a single dad who pays more than most... All I can ad is fear he felt is real. Foc is relentless... don't get me wrong I love my kid but the foc makes it really hard for me to advocate having more... All in all dont have kids.
Source - single dad.
To make matters worse is they'll throw you in jail for your failure to pay up. But a woman who has 5 kids from 5 dads seems to be a fit parent.
You're right, just actually imagine if me, as a 20-something year old, had dubiously consensual sex with a 14 year old girl, which was deemed rape at the time. Then years later demanded that that girl pay me money. It would be jailable to make contact.
Were you raising the kid? No I guess you couldn't have been... If you tried to get custody of the 14 year old girl's child, you'd be put in prison.
wtf we have gone back to the days of the Levites
Deuteronomy 22:28-29
28 If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, 29 he shall pay her father fifty shekels[a] of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.
this is literally what is happening.
Except in this one the one who is raped is paying the money and the rapist is being rewarded.
yeah I guess you're right, didn't think this one through.
Anyway it's wrong as fuck
It's cool man. I saw where you were going with it. Have an upvote.
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The corollary to that rule was that if the woman was not screaming out for help then she couldn't say that she was raped. There was no way for her to have consensual sex and later claim rape. The law nipped women's nature in the bud. And also made it significantly costly to be a real rapist (imagine having to marry the woman you raped).
Relevant username. Godamn geinus.
That's not a bad system. :P
Any feminist out there going to defend this man?
Faaaakkk no... That icloud leak has them busy right now. Shouting.. "If you look at the pictures your a monster"
They wouldn't ever, even without something to distract them.
True. Unless it directly helped them.. Maybe an author or MRA chick?.. But still they wouldn't.
Oh, women might, sure, but feminists, never.
Oh!.. I was lumping them all in one group lol my bad. These.. Umm.. these things I've talking to lately have been nothing but ball crushing bitches. Even in passing. Eeeaa
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I didn't realize it was illegal for a woman to abandon a baby with no consequences or payments.
Oh wait, it's not.
hahaha...
the joke is that feminists love to claim they are for equality and giving attention to men's issues, but of course they never actually discuss anything, they just make the claim that they do.
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If feminists actually cared about equal rights 95% of their topics would be about men.
The only legitimate problem i know of is that some women are paid about 5% less than an equal man. Then again, unmarried women with no kids aged 25-40 or so are paid 108% of an equivalent man.
Instead they push women's issues like breast cancer (instead of cancer that affects everyone), that being fat is ok, and how birth control should be covered by health insurance.
Basically, anything that costs them less, and men more, is what they want.
http://content.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,2015274,00.html
They're too busy defending poor JLaw's honor.
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First bravo on replying, I'll give you props for that. But here is where you went wrong.
You say you identify yourself as an equalist over feminist. But we weren't talking about equalists, we were talking about feminists. So you disqualified yourself from having a reason to respond.
Then, you proceed to state your platform and how you feel the situation should be handled, but state there is nothing you can do.
Then after you make your post that in no way contributes to the conversation, you get upset because of downvotes, and say "Of course I'm being downvoted. My fault for coming to the red pill with logic and reasoning"
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Hahaha the worst part is that I was being sincere. Welp, whatever. Have a nice life.
I know, how fucking sheltered must she be to take that as an insult?
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Just for the sake of argument, could you quote him in the parts where you felt insulted by his statement?
Reason? From a feminist? Sir, you go to far!
I think you misinterpreted the "bravo" as sarcasm. It's not. Please read his comment. It wasn't insulting at all, and he gave you a well-thought, honest response.
Funny thing about post history is it's chronological. Want to see the post just before this very one? Where you came here waving a white flag and extending an olive branch on behalf of women?
You clearly were coming here with an open mind since you made that commend about TDP sub. Then this post I'm replying to. Tada!
Came to troll. Got caught.
Sad thing? I was looking at your post history to see if you were being blindsided unfairly here.
EDIT: Formatting.
You are demanding especial treatment just for having a vagina, that doesn't fly here.
We won't be extra friendly (lol) to cater to your feelings.
Also you have been getting well articulated replies, and when you can't make a counter argument you just cry MUH FEELZ®, and its annoying because you shut up any chance of an argument.
Lastly just so you have an excuse to feel insulted:
FUCK YOU, AND FUCK OFF BITCH.
Post on facebook, twitter, get as many eyes as possible seeing it. See if the outrage can spread.
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/u/VarsitySlutTeamCpt said
(not woman), and is what you responded to. Which makes me think the lady doth protest too much.
If you don't use facebook or twitter, email at least one friend and tell them about the story.
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If this were /r/MensRights, you might have a point (you'd still be wrong, but it would be worth looking at more in depth). Here we actually don't give a single fuck. Really. The more people that swallow the pill, the harder we have it. We don't mind, because we're up to the challenge of increased competition, but there is seriously zero interest in getting other people - random strangers - to buy into it. I care about my brother eventually figuring it out, and he's the only person I'll be careful about my delivery so as not to alienate him.
Could I talk you into a different self-identification? If you understand what you just said - and I suppose you do - you must self-identify as a troll.
This is a place for men. Not a male space, or a place for males or boys or 46XY's; a place for men. There are almost no places for men left. It's not particularly nice in here. If I, a man, say some dumbass thing to another man, that man is quick to call me on it. That's because men don't expect bullshit from each other and don't have to tolerate it.
I don't know what kind of place you were expecting, but you should temper your expectations in favor of the place that you actually found.
This is a kind of trolling. You can learn more in the sidebar about what kind of trolling is unwanted here; there's a special link all about it. This one would be called a "Code Yellow." I would venture to suggest that, like me, most men don't care what you do in your spare time, especially in your bedroom. I know I don't want to hear about it.
The point is, we don't give a shit that you're a female or feminist or anything else. Your statement should stand by itself without you needing special treatment or consideration for being a woman. If it can't, it's useless trash.
When the men talked sarcastically about "help from the feminists", what they meant was publicity, focused political and peer group pressure in the right places, to correct what is an obvious gender-based legal injustice. Equalist feminists are always supposedly looking out for "both men and women", and want to make the world a better place. So they say, which we rightly ignore, to look at what they do: they couldn't care less about correcting that obvious injustice, as it doesn't help them advance their bosses' underlying socialist agenda.
Now that's all nice and clear, it goes without saying that in this culture war of the Titans nobody gives a shit about the opinions or moral positions of the helpless, i.e. you.
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Don't let the revolving equality door hit you on your way out, princess!
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Don't take it personally. The reason why you're getting flak is because we live in a society where women will claim they stand up for injustice against men but the majority of the time they just stand idly by like cowards as the man's life is ruined.
Don't be a coward. If you see a girl acting like a sexist cunt then put her in her fucking place. Encourage your friends to do the same. Until we see ladies standing up like that then women are not going to get very far in the respect department, sorry. In all my 27 years I have yet to see a woman stand up to another bitch on behalf of a man. Go out there and be the hero The Red Pill deserves. Have an upvote.
You've insulted everyone here you narcissistic cunt.
Good. This is a forum for men. We don't want you here.
Not completely true. Some women offer articulated, well written posts like veggie_girl but its definitely rare. This is a Man's Club, the only one we have left really, so ladies you can't be expected to be greeted with open arms for having a pussy. We are looking for logical debate here, not muh feelz.
Women post here ALL the fucking time. Typically, though, when they post they share the same views as us. This is why you're getting downvoted.
She's getting downvotes because she's a whiny little bitch that doesn't know when to quit.
Sorry for the treatment you received for sharing your perspective. This sub's population has taken a turn for the worse over the year that I've been here, as exhibited by your -26 points for stating that people should be treated equally.
Yes. I'm a feminist (a male one) and I think this guy is getting royally screwed. He desperately needs a lawyer but cannot afford one. He needs to contact some of the legal aid societies in his area.
I'm in a sorta similar situation.. well, it's a situation that's part of the same system is probably how I should put it. both my ex wives are not worried about back child support. I'm in school right now so I can make more money later. They both told the judge to lay off.. I have court on the 8th and will probably get 22 days jail time for "contempt of court" for still being behind despite the fact that my ex's and I get along and are on the same page.
Stupid. The lawyer doesn't even care about what's good for my kids, she told me so, she just said she wouldn't, not ask for jail time.
I make too much money being on the G.I. Bill to get an appointed lawyer and can't afford one on my own. yea, the G.I. Bill and my disability check for nerve damage in Iraq are too much for a lawyer, yet I can barely pay my rent much less the child support.
This system is so fucked up.
Everybody needs to post this on FB. This is a golden opportunity to spread the word in a way nobody will be able to contest.
In essence, this is a good thing, because we've now drawn attention to just how fucked up the "best interest of the child" concept is when applying it wholesale to hold men responsible for women's decisions.
In this case, there is quite clearly a line that was crossed in the name of "best interest of the child," which is undeniably wrong-- and yet, is the exact same logic being used in every other case where a woman is free to make a decision that men will ultimately be held accountable for.
If we can prove that "best interest of the child" is not a proper standard to hold random parties responsible for an irresponsible woman's actions, (including theft of sperm and rape), then the entire structure of moving resources from men to women starts to break down.
It's not the interest of the child. These laws protect the interest of the state. If men weren't forced to pay then the state would have to support the female and the child.
Which would then result in the state giving fewer handouts to deadbeat mothers. Feminists would then claim this infringes on the freedom of women to conceive, as they would then be unable to economically support a child that is their right to have.
Jack Nicholson was right, it's really easy to write for a woman when you remove reason and accountability.
Edit: clarification.
My opinion is that anyone who believes in "the best interest of the child at all costs" also has to be unequivocally pro-Life in order to not be committing a blatant lack of coherence.
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You're right, but you capitalised the wrong part of the sentence.
Me thinks you are an /r/bitcoin subscriber.
And keep in mind Orwell's Politics and the English Language - don't editorialise. This story speaks volumes for itself.
Shared, with the title "And they say we live in a patriarchy..."
Let the games begin!
I posted it. No likes, but one share.. I know more people saw it but were too chicken to acknowledge it.
At least it gets awareness out.
I'm at 2 comments, no shares. One comment from someone I expected, one comment from someone I didn't. Progress.
We as men have a right to protest, morality and ethics is on our side, but really we should be ashamed of ourselves.
They are doing nothing we didn't let, empower them to do and we wrote the fucking laws for it. They're way too nasty and far-reaching to be feminine work.
Those laws were written when I was still a kid. So no, not we. But yes, still, men.
Yeah but all those "men should work at home like women blah blah" shit is from the newer generation.
Fuck that.
There's hardly anyone my age in government, so still no.
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Utterly disgusting. This is why feminism is pure poison to society.
There are many other reasons why feminism is pure poison.
Exactly, feminism is an extreme left ideology born from over socialization, too much comfort which makes people complacent and lazy, we are in a decadence period in present times.
It happened to China, to Greece, Rome, etc. And its happening now but not just to an empire, but almost world wide. It only goes down from here.
Serious question, do we have good evidence that feminist-like ideologies happened in China, Greece, etc? The most popular cases are Rome and the USSR, as far as I've heard (and the western societies, of course).
Feminism is a product of social decadence in modern times.
Decadence is what I'm saying killed those empires, not feminism.
there are no great women leaders. women have contributed no major inventions. they make terrible decisions based on emotions.
never leave a woman in charge.
You need to study history a bit better. There are many women in the 150+ IQ range that have had an effect on society. 1/7th of intelligent people are women but most of them sit in the middle of the curve. Where as, we as men, fill in the high and low end of the bell curve, mostly.
http://www.eoht.info/page/IQ%3A+150%2B+%7C+Smartest+woman+ever
i read some of the info you linked. there were some good examples in there. thanks.
Nefertiti and Cleopatra. But yeah, not since BCE.
Talk about statutory rape! They're raping him again!
Yeah, but now it's legal.
Remind me again what rights men have that women don't?
I also saw this article and was considering posting it. I've been lurking here for a month or so and this is the first article that I've felt compelled to comment on. Some recent posts have highlighted the disposable nature of men and stories like this only confirm that notion.
These men were technically still boys when they were taken advantage of by older women. The fact that rapists can extract payments from their victims is insane. Nick Olivas even has to pay interest and back payments from when he was 14. This poor guy was raped twice.
Why isn't the mother in jail for RAPING a 14 year old boy? Oh right /r/pussypass
It says in the article that he and his family never pressed charges.
In the case of statutory rape, it's not up to him or the family to press charges; he doesn't get a say in the matter. It is the state's responsibility, hence the word "statutory". This is a (probably female) prosecutor that either committed gross negligence at best or had sinister intent at worst. Remember, many, many people, even in the justice system, truly hold the belief that a man/boy cannot be "raped".
it's the state's responsibility to pursue charges like these. however, state prosecutors are people and their careers are political, so they don't always pursue cases if it doesn't make their career look any better. the state prosecutors wouldn't have anything to personally gain by winning this case. it wouldn't advance their careers because you can't earn status in the justice system by putting female rapists in jail in our culture. charging single moms for statutory rape, even if it's completely true and deserving of justice, wouldn't help state prosecutors get elected as a judge or district attorney, so why would they?
they're the law, and they'll do what they can to make their own lives better at your expense. remember this whenever you deal with the state and the justice system.
He never saw it as rape, still doesn't. That's why.
Are we letting 14 year olds decide now? It's not like they need his testimony when there's physical proof in the form of a child.
No, we're letting him as a grown up decide. He still doesn't consider it rape.
The question was why was the woman not put in jail for raping a 14 year old.
Somehow, you think a valid answer is that 4+ years later the now adult doesn't feel raped.
Either your reading comprehension is bad, or you think they invented a time machine before they decided not to prosecute her.
But a 14 year old girl who fucks a 20 year old man might not see it as rape and the 20 year old man would be sent to jail in a heartbeat.
You're right, boys/girls = identical. Gloria Steinem was right after all I guess.
Equal in what regard? Being different sexes necessarily means fundamental differences in behavior and physical capabilities but at the simplest level, men and women are both human and should this be equal under the law. As it stands, men are viewed as somehow flawed or inferior in the eyes of the law. That's the point I was trying to make.
Maybe, but the truth of the matter is if the genders were reversed the state would be charging in full speed ahead to arrest and convict a 20 year old guy who fucked a 14 year old girl...
Just because he made a poor decision 4 years before he is considered an adult does not mean his adult life should start 4 years in the hole in terms of debt and really he should not be responsible for the child forced on him by an adult while he was still a child himself.
Really this is a case when the government should grow a pair and just suck it up and deal. Unfortunately, when you insentiveize the need to find someone responsible the court will find someone responsible no matter what hamstering has to be done...
Just imagine if the criminal courts got a kickback for sending people to jail? That's basically what the incentives given to family courts are encouraging similar behavior in the realm of divorce and child support.
The problem is the concept of child support altogether. Ethically, it doesn't make any sense because having the child is solely the woman's choice. A choice that is completely up to person A potentially sending person B to jail makes little sense, but that's our system!
And of course, the ultimate combo. I want to keep the baby and make you pay child support & alimony.
absolutely. Either the man gets a say in abortion/not paying child support, or we punish abortion like murder.
I don't completely agree.
If abortion is
legalillegal, so the woman has to have the child, and the father doesn't want to take custody, then yes, some child support makes sense. But, in the best interests of the child means having them raised by the more wealthy parent, so the father should always have the option of taking primary custody rather than paying child support.I think you hit on a really good point here. If we say that the nurturing side of a woman's persona is a social construct, and that men are equally capable of being caring and nurturing, then does it not make sense to have the child be in the custody of the more financially stable parent? If we are eliminating gender, then does it not make sense to have the parent be the one that can better support the child and provide the things it needs?
Or are we giving custody to the woman because she is more likely to be home to care for the kid in more personal ways? If so, then we are highlighting why the "wage gap" exists. In that women are home more often while men stay at work, and so explaining why they make less.
I think that having custody go to the more financially stable parent is a golden idea. But it will never happen. And the reason has nothing to do with men not being able to raise children, or women being better at it. Its because men are viewed as potential pedophiles and rapists in this society. I really believe that apart from the idea that men are somehow less suited to caring for a child, this belief of mainstream society is what keeps the family courts from awarding custody to men.
After all, what repercussions would the court face if they awarded custody to the father, only to have it be revealed that he ended up raping his daughter? The whole thing is a minefield anyways, family court definitely needs reform, but there are new problems that can definitely be created by the solutions to the current problems.
There have been several articles talking about female pedophiles released in short succession the past couple of days, all starting the same way. The climate has shifted. It won't be too long before most people are aware that women are pedophiles too, and then not much longer until they're aware that women are pedophiles at the same rate.
This is becoming more and more common, I've read quite a few articles on the matter but it still leaves me speechless every time I come across this kind of utter moral decay. It seems to me that the media coverage on these matters emphasizing the lunacy of women actually getting away with it has not discouraged, but emboldened women to go out and commit these crimes with impunity.
When I think nothing can surprise me anymore.
Guys, don't worry. Feminism is about helping men, too. I'm sure plenty of feminists will start to rally against this travesty.
The guy in question didn't fight the case. The logical conclusion would be to place a certain amount of blame on him for his situation. However, applying common sense he shouldn't have to defend himself given the circumstances. The underlying factor for this event, and how it played out is truly terrifying. Look at the other discussions tab and count how many feminist or pro-female subreddits are discussing the event. The answer is none.
Remember folks, progressive thought always goes in one direction. It is only a matter of time before the rest country succumbs to complete and utter madness.
Don't teach men to defend against rape, teach rapists to stop charging their victims for child support!
This satirical comment should not be getting upvoted because it is stooping to the level of the SJW shame-logical-blame tactic. The comment above saying he did not fight the case and is thus partially responsible is entirely legitimate.
It wouldn't have helped - even a convicted rapist still got child support money.
It's called satire and can be a great tool to highlight a ridicilous line of thinking.
i would also venture to say he should have reported the rape so that the statute of limitations does not run out(IANAL) and she would have been charged appropriately, then maybe file for sole custody and get child support from her.
however its not in our genes as men, or in this case a young boy, to gripe and complain about free sex with a 17 year old girl while hormones are raging.
Arizona has no statute of limitations on statutory rape IIRC.
He could just send her to jail. There is living proof of her raping a child.
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If the 14yo is a girl, damn right they'll lock the "predator" male up.
Since he was a boy, he can't be a rape victim. He probably wanted it. /s
That is not how the legal system works, and it has never worked like that. I am driving my car, and then run into your parked car and then drive away. I then decide to file a hit and run case again you. You recieve the summons and do not show up in court. Guess what, you will be paying to get my car fixed and what other damages my lawyer can dream up.
Except most people cannot afford lawyers. That's one of the reasons 99% of cases end up in pleas.
The legal system is a farce.
A valid point, but the fact he failed to appear for the legal summons means he automatically loses the case.
I did a google, law students are allowed to practice law under the supervision of an attorney in USA, other countries have similar laws. A smart law student will want to get some cases under his belt. And usually law profs are attorneys.
Make some friends with law students. Often a law student will work harder then a licensed attorney because they want to learn. Sometimes in cases like this one it is better to get a lady lawyer. But before you decide, get a feel how the student views the case.
www.law.georgetown.edu/library/research/guides/StudentPractice.cfm
Given the state makes sure it doesn't teach its slaves anything about the legal system in schools, this is not surprising. The guy probably read this and thought it was absurd (which it is) so trashed it in the bin.
He could indeed make lawyer student friends, but he's probably too busy trying to keep up with his rent.
Ignorance is a choice.
Back in the olden days, there was this place called a library which was full of these heavy paper things called books. There was this other thing called a card catalog. You had to look up stuff in it, then walk possibly to another floor to find the right book.
Point I am making is to find out if law students can practice law back in the old days might take an entire morning if you where lucky. With google I found out the same info in 30 seconds.
What amazes me is despite the ease of access to information, general stupidity is increasing.
Watch what 95% of people do while waiting for something. They gaze off into space like some herd animal. Or they are posting some nonsense on facebook.
I am an uneducated hillbilly. But I would always keep a book in my pocket, and when I had a spare moment read a few pages. Or if I didn't have a book, the military taught me to keep a notebook and pencil in my pocket. I would write down my thoughts and ideas.
Nowdays I have this amazing thing called a tablet. It can hold thousands of books, it has lots of notepads inside it. I can share ideas with people from all over the world. This devide is so cheap that almost anyone can afford to buy one. I marvel at this device.
Ignorance is a choice.
Statutory rape victims don't often press charges it just doesn't make sense.
For example if I sleep with a 14 year old girl , and she thinks its ok, are you really going to criticize her for not pressing charges.
I'd wonder if he still has the option to pursue a case - in BC the statute of limitations starts ticking once you turn 18.
Stop victim blaming, you fuhrer of faeces!
The real root of the matter is what you said at first: The guy didn't fight the case. Then you go off the rails blaming everyone but him for what happened.
The local press seems to be the only one that questions child support laws in America.
From the comments, INSANE if true - RE: no statute of limitations on rape in AZ, he could go ahead and press charges for rape then get custody, right? oh....
Same laws allowed my mother to kick me (15 at the time) and my dad out of the house, and then steal his gun safe full of his own fire arms, family heirlooms, and various other valuables. This is perfectly legal although she is not legally allowed to carry a firearm, and has never received training on how to maintain/handle one. This "justice" system is horribly flawed, and totally slanted for women to win. Enough with the god damn pussy pass in our courts.
This quote is particularly telling:
The state just revealed their attitude: that of a debt collector. Their goal is to "recoup" money otherwise paid out as welfare. There will never be justice for men if the state views us as a revenue stream.
This needs to go to the Supreme court.
Needs to get past chambers first.
>Man forced to pay child support because he was raped.
Good. The more shit hits the fan, the less people will be able to ignore it.
As much as I love the gun and business laws in my state, I'm embarrassed about this.
For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.
Things will get mental, yes, but eventually enough people will get fucked over in all walks of life for them to start being represented in government etc.
I feel that support payments should not benefit the parents in any way, form or manner. Both parents should be required to pay cash into a fund that benefits the child, and the child only, and that is administered by a third party. That will put a stop to this nonsense.
Agreed. I worked at a generic service providing establishment, where we charged consumers about 90$ a month for our non necessity service. I spoke to countless mothers who had to wait for their child support to come in to pay their bill.
All of my rage.
Kid, you can't afford not to have an attorney.
Can we all just take a minute, sit back, and remember when Arizona passed a law because of the movie Splice?
'cause that's a real thing that happened.
I'm curious how this can also play out, if at all, in the abortion rights arena. Women get raped, statutorily or otherwise, they have the choice to abort what is essentially seen as the product of a rape. Now we see a young man not only forced to live with the embodiment of his violation, but pay for it personally and financially as ordered by the state.
If I could play Devil's advocate for just a second. If a woman bears a child from rape then isn't she responsible for it's upbringing?
I understand that she has the option to abort, but it's a conception that she didn't want. It seems unfair that anybody has to take the financial burden on such a situation.
"isn't she responsible for it's upbringing?" No. She can have the baby put up for adoption. Men don't have that option.
Adoption being one option for how best to raise a child.
A man can walk away during pregnancy, a woman doesn't have that option.
"A man can walk away" and right into a cop car whenever they happen to find him.
We're not in disagreement here. I'm just trying to see both sides instead settling into a comfortable "woe is us" mentality
The title is kind of misleading but I get the take-away message. If the gender roles were reversed he would be in jail and she would be the poor rape victim.
Putting it on FB, don't really have the guts for it but even worse I doubt most would get it at all.
Only time paternity test is mentioned. Was one done at all? If not he is a retard.
We've been down this path before.
The issue is that the child is also a victim, and in the logic of the law, the child's interests have to come before the woman's, or the father, who also is a victim in this case.
Ultimately, someone has to pay for this kid's expenses. If the mother picks up the tab, she will appeal to the state for aid. The state would rather pass the bill along to the father than to pay it out of state coffers, even if the father himself was the victim of a crime.
It sucks, but the law has its own infernal logic to it.
In this case, I'd rather see the state pay if the mother can't. The rape victim should have no responsibility for a rape baby.
I am probably inclined to agree, but it's not clear cut. The child shouldn't suffer for the sins of the mother. Making the father pay means ultimately he could get custody and rescue that kid from his obviously-fucked-up mother. Even if the father's parents do a lot of the heavy lifting, it might ultimately be better for the kid than being the child of a single mother on the public dole.
You can say it's a "rape baby" but the rape is done and over. The baby is just a baby, and shouldn't be just thrown to the wolves. Also, the state has no money of its own, so you're really saying everyone should pay. That's why this is so tricky.
Leaving the child in the hands of a confirmed pedophile is making her suffer.
That's a good point, and is something that could be additionally litigated, but it's separate from the issue of the child having food to eat and a roof over their head. The state doesn't say "well, because the mother is evil, the father is free of obligation to the child." If anything, the father having a responsibility to pay for the child, also has the standing to sue the mother for custody, or perhaps to even put the child up for adoption, or whatever other remedy seems appropriate to him. The father also has a responsibility to press charges, if a crime was committed then that would be a further mark against the mother, and in that case the state might end up putting the child in foster care (which also might be abusive, so that's not necessarily the best thing either).
It's a shitty situation all around, but the state is going to put its own interests first, and among the three individuals involved, the child's interests over those of the parents.
The solution then is to give the father the option of custody.
Yes it should. Fuck that.
I am firmly in support in the forced abortion for all children conceived due to rape!
.. Clear sarcasm, obviously, but I hate the idea that the kid has rights that supersede actual adults. The way I see it, is it's a cop out. If you think it has rights, raise the little shit yourself, instead of leaving it with the horrible kind of person who would rape someone, or the person who is fucked up from being raped.
What you just explained is that the state's interests come first...
Yes. And if you disagree, they have a nice cage they'd be happy to put you in, or they can just shoot you if you don't want to go.
See: /r/Anarcho_Capitalism
I really don't think this is going to hold up in court, not only was the man raped as a teenager but he did not know about his daughter for 6 years. While it's great to raise alarm about something like this happening, I'm sure this news source ate up this story to get some hits on their site.
The sad thing is, not only is this guy getting absolutely screwed off going through a traumatic experience.. But the courts are allowing a CHILD PREDATOR RAPIST TO HAVE CUSTODY OF A CHILD.
With that being said, would like to hear how this case turns out in the next few months.
American fuckers who consider themselves men, but at large accept this shit, making nobody fear no backlash, they deserve this society. I'm speaking generally.
But this is unacceptable. What the... Weird...
Best interest of the child? SHE RAPED A CHILD!
Feminists just turn around and blame this on "patriarchy".. Which means it is the fault of men. Nothing is ever the fault of women.
This is fucking ridiculous... It is literally male oppression stemming from bullshit feminist propaganda. How a boy who was raped can be forced to pay child support for the child conceived during the rape is one of the most disgusting thing I've ever read. Exactly as they say, if this was the other way round and it was a young girl who was raped she would never in any circumstance even be even considered to be charged with child support payments
This makes my blood boil, I'm literally shaking typing this I'm so angry
Was this on /r/bestof or /r/news or was that just a dream?
Ohh please. Sorry, I am not buying it. At age 14 he was likely fully aware what he was doing.
Regardless, the law states no person under the age of 15 can give consent.
Yeah, I hear ya...
had the tables been turned the guy would be in jail and the state forced to fund an abortion..
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I think it's very unfortunate that children end up the victim of irresponsible mothers. But it is her choice how to raise her child. Once consequences start coming to mothers, I think you'll see less fragrant abuses of the system by mothers.
Personally, I think that a rapist is not a fit parent. Therefore, I feel as though that the best thing for the child is either to be placed in a home with fit parents, or to be given to the biological parent who is fit to raise a child.
As long as the child exists, it ought to be looked after by someone. The child didn't ask to be the product of a statutory rape. However, the rape victim should definitely not be responsible for this child.
Think of the children?
WTF you idiot, it was a child that was raped. What about him?
Child support is not about the woman or the man and you really shout start to understand that. It's about the child. It's not the child's fault that their mom is a rapist and their dad wasn't aware that he/she was born.
The rape victim was a child, does he not matter?