333,416 posts

The Sixteen Commandments Of Poon

by redvelvet_oreo on /r/TheRedPill
11 May 2019 03:26 AM UTC

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I. Never say ‘I Love You’ first

Women want to feel like they have to overcome obstacles to win a man’s heart. They crave the challenge of capturing the interest of a man who has other women competing for his attention, and eventually prevailing over his grudging reluctance to award his committed exclusivity. The man who gives his emotional world away too easily robs women of the satisfaction of earning his love. Though you may be in love with her, don’t say it before she has said it. Show compassionate restraint for her need to struggle toward yin fulfillment. Inspire her to take the leap for you, and she’ll return the favor a thousandfold.

II. Make her jealous

Flirt with other women in front of her. Do not dissuade other women from flirting with you. Women will never admit this but jealousy excites them. The thought of you turning on another woman will arouse her sexually. No girl wants a man that no other woman wants. The partner who harnesses the gale storm of jealousy controls the direction of the relationship.

III. You shall make your mission, not your woman, your priority

Forget all those romantic cliches of the leading man proclaiming his undying love for the woman who completes him. Despite whatever protestations to the contrary, women do not want to be “The One” or the center of a man’s existence. They in fact want to subordinate themselves to a worthy man’s life purpose, to help him achieve that purpose with their feminine support, and to follow the path he lays out. You must respect a woman’s integrity and not lie to her that she is “your everything”. She is not your everything, and if she is, she will soon not be anymore.

IV. Don’t play by her rules

If you allow a woman to make the rules she will resent you with a seething contempt even a rapist cannot inspire. The strongest woman and the most strident feminist wants to be led by, and to submit to, a more powerful man. Polarity is the core of a healthy loving relationship. She does not want the prerogative to walk all over you with her capricious demands and mercurial moods. Her emotions are a hurricane, her soul a saboteur. Think of yourself as a bulwark against her tempest. When she grasps for a pillar to steady herself against the whipping winds or yearns for an authority figure to foil her worst instincts, it is you who has to be there… strong, solid, unshakeable and immovable.

V. Adhere to the golden ratio

Give your woman 2/3 of everything she gives you. For every three calls or texts, give her two back. Three declarations of love earn two in return. Three gifts; two nights out. Give her two displays of affection and stop until she has answered with three more. When she speaks, you reply with fewer words. When she emotes, you emote less. The idea behind the golden ratio is twofold — it establishes your greater value by making her chase you, and it demonstrates that you have the self-restraint to avoid getting swept up in her personal dramas. Refraining from reciprocating everything she does for you in equal measure instills in her the proper attitude of belief in your higher status. In her deepest loins it is what she truly wants.

VI. Keep her guessing

True to their inscrutable natures, women ask questions they don’t really want direct answers to. Woe be the man who plays it straight — his fate is the suffering of the beta. Evade, tease, obfuscate. She thrives when she has to imagine what you’re thinking about her, and withers when she knows exactly how you feel. A woman may want financial and family security, but she does not want passion security. In the same manner, when she has displeased you, punish swiftly, but when she has done you right, reward slowly. Reward her good behavior intermittently and unpredictably and she will never tire of working hard to please you.

VII. Always keep two in the kitty

Never allow yourself to be a “kept man”. A man with options is a man without need. It builds confidence and encourages boldness with women if there is another woman, a safety net, to catch you in case you slip and risk a breakup, divorce, or a lost prospect, leading to loneliness and a grinding dry spell. A woman knows once she has slept with a man she has abdicated a measure of her power; when she has fallen in love with him she has surrendered nearly all of it. But love is ephemeral and with time she may rediscover her power and threaten to leave you. It is her final trump card. Withdrawing all her love and all her body in an instant will rend your soul if you are faced with contemplating the empty abyss alone. Knowing there is another you can turn to for affection will fortify your will and satisfy your manhood.

VIII. Say you’re sorry only when absolutely necessary

Do not say you’re sorry for every wrong thing you do. It is a posture of submission that no man should reflexively adopt, no matter how alpha he is. Apologizing increases the demand for more apologies. She will come to expect your contrition, like a cat expects its meal at a set time each day. And then your value will lower in her eyes. Instead, if you have done something wrong, you should acknowledge your guilt in a glancing way without resorting to the actual words “I’m sorry.” Pull the Bill Clinton maneuver and say “Mistakes were made” or tell her you “feel bad” about what you did. You are granted two freebie “I’m sorry”s for the life of your relationship; use them wisely.

IX. Connect with her emotions

Set yourself apart from other men and connect with a woman’s emotional landscape. Her mind is an alien world that requires deft navigation to reach your rendevous. Frolic in the surf of emotions rather than the arid desert of logic. Be playful. Employ all your senses. Describe in lush detail scenarios to set her heart afire. Give your feelings freedom to roam. ROAM. Yes, that is a good word. You’re not on a linear path with her. You are ROAMING all over, taking her on an adventure. In this world, there is no need to finish thoughts or draw conclusions. There is only need to EXPERIENCE. You’re grabbing her hand and running with her down an infinite, labyrinthine alleyway with no end, laughing and letting your fingers glide on the cobblestone walls along the way.

X. Ignore her beauty

The man who trains his mind to subdue the reward centers of his brain when reflecting upon a beautiful female face will magically transform his interactions with women. His apprehension and self-consciousness will melt away, paving the path for more honest and self-possessed interactions with the objects of his desire. This is one reason why the greatest lotharios drown in more love than they can handle — through positive experiences with so many beautiful women they lose their awe of beauty and, in turn, their powerlessness under its spell. It will help you acquire the right frame of mind to stop using the words hot, cute, gorgeous, or beautiful to describe girls who turn you on. Instead, say to yourself “she’s interesting” or “she might be worth getting to know”. Never compliment a girl on her looks, especially not a girl you aren’t fucking. Turn off that part of your brain that wants to put them on pedestals. Further advanced training to reach this state of unawed Zen transcendence is to sleep with many MANY attractive women (try to avoid sleeping with a lot of ugly women if you don’t want to regress). Soon, a Jedi lover you will be.

XI. Be irrationally self-confident

No matter what your station in life, stride through the world without apology or excuse. It does not matter if objectively you are not the best man a woman can get; what matters is that you think and act like you are. Women have a dog’s instinct for uncovering weakness in men; don’t make it easy for them. Self-confidence, warranted or not, triggers submissive emotional responses in women. Irrational self-confidence will get you more pussy than rational defeatism.

XII. Maximize your strengths, minimize your weaknesses

In the betterment of ourselves as men we attract women into our orbit. To accomplish this gravitational pull as painlessly and efficiently as possible, you must identify your natural talents and shortcomings and parcel your efforts accordingly. If you are a gifted jokester, don’t waste time and energy trying to raise your status in philosophical debate. If you write well but dance poorly, don’t kill yourself trying to expand your manly influence on the dancefloor. Your goal should be to attract women effortlessly, so play to your strengths no matter what they are; there is a groupie for every male endeavor. Except World of Warcraft.

XIII. Err on the side of too much boldness, rather than too little

Touching a woman inappropriately on the first date will get you further with her than not touching her at all. Don’t let a woman’s faux indignation at your boldness sway you; they secretly love it when a man aggressively pursues what he wants and makes his sexual intentions known. You don’t have to be an asshole, but if you have no choice, being an inconsiderate asshole beats being a polite beta, every time.

XIV. Fuck her good

Fuck her like it’s your last fuck. And hers. Fuck her so good, so hard, so wantonly, so profligately that she is left a quivering, sparking mass of shaking flesh and sex fluids. Drain her of everything, then drain her some more. Kiss her all over, make love to her all night, and hold her close in the morning. Own her body, own her gratitude, own her love. If you don’t know how, learn to give her squirting orgasms.

XV. Maintain your state control

You are an oak tree. You will not be manipulated by crying, yelling, lying, head games, sexual withdrawal, jealousy ploys, pity plays, shit tests, hot/cold/hot/cold, disappearing acts, or guilt trips. She will rain and thunder all around you and you will shelter her until her storm passes. She will not drag you into her chaos or uproot you. When you have mastery over yourself, you will have mastery over her.

XVI. Never be afraid to lose her

You must not fear. Fear is the love-killer. Fear is the ego-triumph that brings abject loneliness. You will face your fear. You will permit it to pass over and through you. And when your ego-fear is gone you will turn and face your lover, and only your heart will remain. You will walk away from her when she has violated your integrity, and you will let her walk when her heart is closed to you. She who can destroy you, controls you. Don’t give her that power over yourself. Love yourself before you love her.

The closer you follow the letter of these commandments, the easier you will find and keep real, true unconditional love and happiness in your life. Best,

From heartiste

Post Information
Title The Sixteen Commandments Of Poon
Author redvelvet_oreo
Upvotes 1214
Comments 139
Date 11 May 2019 03:26 AM UTC (10 months ago)
Subreddit TheRedPill
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/238070
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/bn7jhg/the_sixteen_commandments_of_poon/
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249 upvotesAuvergnat10 months ago

In 5 years of very active exploration of red pill blogs and books, I still haven’t found more insightful material than this. I need to commit to memory.

58 upvotesredvelvet_oreo [OP]10 months ago

100% This post is essential. This post is the reason why I am in a healthy LTR and have had success spinning plates since finding TRP. Its one thing to be good at game and its another to keep it going after hitting it.

For the people bitching about some of the rules in this post I encourage you to actually try these things first before complaining how immoral some of it feels or sounds like to you.

Remember all these rules are modular. You dont use them in any type of order. You use the right one when necessary. Read it. Remember it and burn in into your soul. These things should come natural to you after some time.

10 upvotesBoovs4life10 months ago

Lately I've considered myself decent with girls thanks to lurking TRP for a few years. However, I just started talking to this girl that I thought I liked and made the mistake of thinking she was a "unicorn" and I broke basically every rule here. Should I cut her off to keep my dignity? I'm not sure if I can turn months of beta tendencies around.

25 upvotesrredhammer10 months ago

Cut your losses. Once she views you as a beta you will always be beta in her eye.

6 upvotesRightHandWolf10 months ago

Once you start down the beta path, forever will it dominate your destiny. Consume you it will . . . as it did Roosh's apprentice.

3 upvotesslip_like_space10 months ago

Who was Roosh's apprentice?

10 upvotesAuvergnat10 months ago

Depends if you value your “dignity” more than everything else you get from her. I wouldn’t let go of amazing love and sex just because I didn’t follow some rules I found on the Internet. But if the sex and love dry up, replaced by drama and headaches, as a consequence of breaking those guidelines for too long, then you know it really is time to jump. If you can keep to rule 16, then you can break all the rest, confident that you’ll know to jump in time to avoid the train wreck.

1 upvotesJussie_Mullet10 months ago

In addition to tomassi's IRON RULES


Illimitableman's. 50 shades

1 upvotesdonkeydodo10 months ago

Plowed through all of IllimitableMan's posts yet? I agree this post is gold though

3 upvotesAuvergnat10 months ago

I read them all. IM was a decent TRP poster. There have been a few. I preferred /u/Archwinger and /u/HumanSockPuppet.

But Roissy's Game posts were better than IM, and those 16 commandments were the pinnacle of his writing.

160 upvotesOperator21610 months ago

This needs to be stickied or sidebar-ed.

12 upvotesDeChef210 months ago

I believe it already is, however, that doesn’t mean it not a good reminder for us all.

Edit: It’s not, must be in the handbook, got the two mixed up

35 upvoteskostni10 months ago

You forgot something

XV. Maintain your state control

You are an oak tree. You will not be manipulated by crying, yelling, lying, head games, sexual withdrawal, jealousy ploys, pity plays, shit tests, hot/cold/hot/cold, disappearing acts, or guilt trips. She will rain and thunder all around you and you will shelter her until her storm passes. She will not drag you into her chaos or uproot you. When you have mastery over yourself, you will have mastery over her.

1 upvotesSpartan159010 months ago

I can say with absolutely certainty that Roissy saved my life back in 2011. Lurking on 4chan, after being madly in love with a girl for months without reciprocation, just suffering and wanting to kill myself, until one destined anon linked to what was called at the time Citizen Renegade.

That Friday I spend my entire night going through all of his posts, squirming in agony while reading his main posts about being a beta and a nice guy. Since then, my whole mindset and world view changed, I literally own this man my life.

Imagine how many others he saved, yet there it is again, censorship stopping even more men from salvation.

43 upvotesomega_dawg9310 months ago

don't worry about the women that are yelling for censorship... don't ever pay attention to what they're saying bc if approached by the right guy, they'll forget all that dumb shit they talk.

the REAL enemy is men... men that REFUSE to read about and accept the true nature of females. they listen to women literally, follow their advice, and wonder why they end-up in dead bedrooms, divorce-raped, or simply dead.

13 upvotesunn4med10 months ago

Glad you mentioned it, we need to bring up how it’s the fault of beta men more often. It’s our fault more than women’s

9 upvotesomega_dawg9310 months ago

dudes become cheerleaders for women's bullshit with the HOPE of the women rewarding them with sex.

some women do it, but many women don't. but if that's the only way those guys can get it...

7 upvotesNuclearMelonMan10 months ago

Who is Roissy, and how do I read all that stuff?

1 upvotesSpartan159010 months ago

Roissy is the same guy that runs Chateau Heartiste and what used to be called Citizen Renegade, you can find an archive of his posts at the sub sticky right now

-4 upvotesedge_lord_super_1710 months ago

Rollo Tomassi, You can find him in the sidebar

8 upvotesBJG7910 months ago

Roissy is not Rollo. Two different people.

2 upvotesJussie_Mullet10 months ago

Three R's

Rollo Roissy Roosh

1 upvotesjeunpeun994 months ago

Roissy and Roosh are the same

3 upvotesdrovid410 months ago

where can i read some myself?

1 upvotesjeunpeun994 months ago

I made a PDF of the Roissy reader. It are selected posts of the Chateau Heartiste webblog, runned by Roosh.


The link is 7 days active. Maybe someone can upload it somewhere else.

27 upvotesRevolutionaryPea710 months ago

First time reading this and it's one of the best and most succinct articles on the topic that I've ever read.

13 upvotestimjr250010 months ago

Found this list last week and quickly started implementing it. The passion with my new LTR just went up a notch this week when All I did was, take longer to respond, respond less, use the 2/3rds rule, throw in some uncertainty and use irrational self confidence to remind myself every girl wants me. And if anything feels wrong about this list, remember that it is to your relationships benefit, that deep down, this is exactly what a woman wants. She wants to feel that when you finally do come to her for passionate sex, that it was your choice and not your obligation.

12 upvotesDarkFunExist10 months ago

I know its annoying for you guys when women tell you that you should be very nice, but the result is not as you expected. Then the woman even leaves you confused and won't give a shit. Its seems really unfair, but its reality. She don't want to tell a man the truth about her female nature, because that means she is trying to help a man. She wants a man who can make her emotional by himself, and not by woman's help.

9 upvotesJussie_Mullet10 months ago

She does not know the Truth about her own female nature

5 upvotesDarkFunExist10 months ago

Great said. Thanks for correcting. She is not consiously aware of her true nature. Thats why she says she hates bad alpha guys, because its socially acceptable to say so.

15 upvotesapskidb10 months ago

We need a heartiste archive link - the site has been taken down

1 upvotesjeunpeun994 months ago

I made a PDF of the Roissy reader. It are selected posts of the Chateau Heartiste webblog, runned by Roosh.


The link is 7 days active. Maybe someone can upload it somewhere else.

7 upvotes • [deleted] • 10 months ago

Never being afraid to loser her is easier said than done, but the rest is true. The oxymoron is when you raise your status and internalize these concepts you dont truly fall in love with women anymore - at least not in the way you used to.

being able to stay attractive to other women and having options is critical. Not so you can go around committing affairs - but that you can continue to command respect and interest. Women want to fuck men who other women want to fuck, it's that simple. Every guy I know in a dead bedroom or engage in transaction sex let them self go and became fully beta-ized to the point that they would have no option if it werent for their wife.

This is all good advice and something ALL women adhere too. This is what the red pill is about. Any of this advice shared in mainstream would be labeled sexist today. But even the most hardcore feminist want a man they cant control who can pick them up and physically have their way with them.

6 upvotes22oregon2210 months ago

I read this once, reflected on it... and then read it again. It’s shocking how I pretty much did the exact opposite of these commandments with the first and only woman I have ever “loved” (because who the fuck even knows what that word even means). And she left me — what a shocker right? I used to despise her for what she did to me after 5 years together, but after some brutal self reflection and a year an a half of perspective I can see perspicuously. I would have left somebody like me if I was her and it’s stunning that she stuck it out for 5 years. She did the right thing, and believe me that is intensely difficult to admit for someone as prideful as myself.

This is why I love TRP philosophy. It exposes you, calls you on your bullshit, and ultimately makes you a better man. Anyways, enough of the wearisome ex-girlfriend diatribe, thanks for the masterful write up.

14 upvotesinFlam0us10 months ago

Did they delete him cause of the Vulvo post?

9 upvotesLogicalOlive10 months ago

Alright so who can just host a website for TRP and have it be free? Because the thing I like about Reddit is that it’s free to access while also having a clean UI. But with the recent removal of CH I don’t think TRP has that much more time on reddit.

11 upvotesgabeangelo10 months ago

Flirt with other women in front of her

Nah, just stick to "be playful and charming" with other women or "making them laugh" in front of her. At least in the case of latina women they really really don't tolerate shit like being flirtatious with other women (I'm from Mexico) unless they're very submissive and passive (which mexican women tend to not be so much).

7 upvotesTwentyEighteen10 months ago

I agree. Flirting when you have a partner is disrespectful, man or woman. But it’s good to be playful and charming with other women in a platonic way as you say.

5 upvotesgabeangelo10 months ago

Exactly. Giving the impression that you have the humor and demeanour to attract other women but choosing not to do so when dating can also be incredibly powerful. It's exactly when you hold back on having sex immediately with the woman when she becomes flirtatious too, it sends the message that you can get a hold of your male urges (having sex and looking and/or flirting with other women) and that is incredibly attractive.

1 upvotesredvelvet_oreo [OP]10 months ago

ah, just stick to "be playful and charming" with other women or "making them laugh" in front of her.

Can still be considered flirting done right. Teasing another women in front for your girl and the person being teased responding back is flirting. Your girl will take notice.

You don't have to be a dick about it. It can be subtle. You don't have to act on it. Its just dread. Dread is essential. Its not the easiest thing to accept but it is essential.

At least in the case of latina women they really really don't tolerate shit like being flirtatious with other women

Stop being a bitch. I've dated Latin women. They can be more aggressive and louder about that matter but that is irrelevant. Your frame is bigger then hers. This petite behavior should not crumble you or cause you to be apologetic. Just ignore her. She will value you more for this as she will see you as high status. Her logic: "Other women want this man. I must keep him."

5 upvotes420KUSHBUSH10 months ago

Not sure if this is the angle you're coming from although if you are, glad to see someone in the comments who understands how respect and honor work while also understanding how to properly handle the situation

2 upvotesComplexProjection10 months ago

And as soon as you tolerate her intolerance, you are in her frame.

3 upvotesgabeangelo10 months ago

Depends on the level commitment with the woman. In monogamous RS that intolerance is expected. And btw, I (and the OP) forgot to add that this rule only applies when the woman is REALLY AND DEEPLY into you. As a "tool" or "move" to make her more attracted at the beginning od flirting is way too risky.

I recently experienced it, btw. An ex of mine found out I dated another girl and asked me out just to fuck like porn actors. She admited having done so out of jealousy and, in her words, felt this viseral need to "mark territory" (lol!)

12 upvotesThePermanentGuest10 months ago

Hate to say it, but as great as the blog was, Roissy has been gone for quite some time now. In the last couple of years, there was a notable shift away from classic posts and topics to an unhealthy obsession with political and racial issues. Not sure if the rumors are true about the original writer selling it off to a conglomerate of posters.

I'm really curious as to the specific instance claimed for violation.

5 upvotesPaulAJK10 months ago

Yeah, and the commenters were idiots as well. You'd get the odd decent game article, but then you'd have to scroll down 50 comments from fifteen commenters to see one about the content of the article. Effing dull rants about jews and and jared Kushner.

7 upvotesjihocech10 months ago

Personal is political. You can not just diconnect from blue pill matrix in intersexual dynamics, and stay the same in political or economical issues.

7 upvotesCollaterLDamage10 months ago

I hate how true these are. You follow these rules, you're gold. Being connected yet hard is difficult.

8 upvotesMiseryboay10 months ago

One of the best posts on this sub!

4 upvotessacecrun10 months ago

It was an eye opener for me about reading this post. On hindsight, I've made so many mistakes.

1 upvotes • [deleted] • 10 months ago

Same, bluepilled a few times lately.

But at least we can learn and improve for the next girl right?

2 upvotesLeonidas_7910 months ago

X is the most important one for me.

They’re all insecure little girls on the inside. Tease a 10 like you would a 6

1 upvotesVirshlee10 months ago

Sexual compliments can't turn them on?

18 upvotesomega_dawg9310 months ago

use them when you are about to have sex and during sex.

for all other times, use innuendo to your best ability. i often use analogies to cooking or the wet weather, etc. to start hinting at sex.

women aren't stupid... she'll pick-up the hints.

13 upvoteswomans_algorithm10 months ago

Wrong. Compliment her after and during sex. It's conditioning her that if she gives sex, she is rewarded. Complimenting her before sex does not increase it.

13 upvotesomega_dawg9310 months ago

i won't say you're wrong... just depends on the woman. some women will take the compliments AFTER sex as, "i won't get compliments until AFTER we've fucked, so that's what i have to do." iow, they'll feel obligated to fuck to get the compliments; that's a turn-off.

"right before sex," builds tension... telling her how she's good at this/that, etc., while you're pushing up against her also gives her the hint of what you want her to do. and the image in her mind is about to happen so it flows. AFTER sex, she's reflecting... thinking... contemplating... and possibly worrying.

TO EACH HIS OWN... but after sex, i find that silence and just letting her drift off into sleep is best.

1 upvotescafeitalia10 months ago

Instead of saying never fear to lose her, it should be never hesitate to leave her.

2 upvotesozaku710 months ago

This sub is so much about recycling old material into poetry.

1 upvotesTwentyEighteen10 months ago

VI. Keep her guessing

This one I have trouble with. I like giving direct and truthful answers

1 upvotes • [deleted] • 10 months ago

My backup is a stunning Russian prostitute for $300. She is a 10 in looks and that's perfect for me because I am an animal and just fuck for purely physical needs. I still get girls from pub but here in Australia they're all fat now

1 upvotesmurderopolis10 months ago

Good and succinct list but.. VIII, "mistakes were made" is a Bill Clinton maneuver? Doesn't everyone know that this line is infamously from Reagan?

1 upvoteslinkofinsanity1910 months ago

Can we put this in the sidebar? Of course, add a note that it's from Roissy so new guys can go look him up if he ever gets uncensored. This is some of the best RP advice out there and while the sidebar contains parts of this throughout the posts, this collects them all together beautiful for review.

1 upvotesVadimDestroyer10 months ago

thanks for the article bro!

1 upvotesShadowslight3x10 months ago

Absolutely awesome post.

Something I've been failing to do is fucking well. I don't know how to improve this though. I'm just not as into sex consistently as a feel Id like to be.

How do I go about actually improving my performance in bed? I've heard of the sex God method but I don't know how to express what he talks about in the moment

1 upvotesjonpe8710 months ago

This is my Bible. Can not believe how much of an asshole I m because of it. Thanks CH.

1 upvotespacopenco10 months ago

These are general rules of attraction that use primal instincts of scarcity, incentives conditioning and social proof.

This is not an amazing debunk of the female mind as some people seem to think.

In fact, all of these rules could equally be used by women to attract men.

1 upvotesnocehr10 months ago

number 2 is stupid af. she can just counter that by flirting with other men, what then? "just hold your frame bro!" "just act as if it doesn't matter bro! have the abundance mentality bro!" what if she ended up have more feelingz with a man that has more SMV than you then?

you're inviting yourself to just more shit-tests. JFL red-pill is full of contradictory bullshits.

9 upvotesAmerican_tourist11610 months ago

You're focusing on one girl. If a girl is flirting with other guys when you go out, literally just keep talking and flirting with other girls. Her actions don't matter if you don't let them matter.

4 upvotesBloodSurgery10 months ago

If she flirts with other men, you keep flirting with other women. You are better than the other men, so she should fear losing you, therefore she should stop trying to make you jealous.

3 upvotesDarkFunExist10 months ago

Damn, your posts just getting shit smashed by downvotes. Feels bad. Btw making her jealous by flirtng with other women makes your value higher, and that makes her desire you more. Even if she flirt with otehr men, as long as you don't let it make you jealous, your value will still be high. But too much abundance and therefore too much flirting with other women will make it worse tho. There must be balance between scarcity and abundance mindset. And yes, mind is one of the keys to attraction too, and gym is for mostly to be in maximum shape.

4 upvotesAndrew5432110 months ago

If she flirts with other men then you are not the prize. Back to the gym for you.

1 upvotesnocehr10 months ago

gym cant fix height or face. do you redpillers really believe gym is all you need. JFL

1 upvotesCaptain_Quick10 months ago

You keep saying "JFL." I have no idea what you're supposed to mean by that.


2 upvotesTwentyEighteen10 months ago

“Just fucking lol” It’s a term from lookism I believe. It’s more expressive way of saying “lol”

11 upvotesAndrew5432110 months ago

Gym is for fixing your weak mind.

1 upvotesnocehr10 months ago

oh so the key to attraction is the mind then. LMAO.

you seem to confuse cause vs. effect

you're probably a teen, or just a very dumb and guillible young adult

2 upvotesxddm265310 months ago

bro stop being such a weakcel and take charge of your life

3 upvotesAndrew5432110 months ago

No you idiot. The key to attraction is spelled out in the rest of this sub. The gym is for your brain to actually earn its dopamine.

Like dude, I know you’re never gonna hit the gym because fucking a girl good is too tiring for you.

2 upvotesFrodolinador10 months ago

Look at his (nocehr) posts. Poor guy.

0 upvotesPusikur10 months ago

Fucken retard height face doesnt matter if u are weak bitch

1 upvotes • [deleted] • 10 months ago

God its so obvious you’re an incel

1 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

Number 2 is ridiculous and immoral af but the rest is good. Women don't like that. Only certain men think women like that. You flirting with others will make her cry if she actually likes you, and other women wanting you will make her angry. It's not fun and sexual, it's stressful and disappointing.

1 upvotesFineCopy210 months ago

what u have to understand is women never exit their sexual strategy. Even if they are in relationship, marriage or whatever, they are always looking for someone better than you. Even though they are happy with you, their search for better man continues. So why should we also stop our strategy??? Because of the society enforcing monogamy, men are at huge disadvantage because women never exit their strategy but men do. So its better always to keep options "open". Not that i am advocating for cheating, but if a girl shows interest , instead of telling you are seeing someone, just don't tell her anything at all and be playful with her too.

-2 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

This is not true. You're starting from a false premise. This is why I think it's incorrect to exclude morals from the argument. And I hear a ton of talk about morals on here even when that word isn't specifically used, so it seems that it's only a facade to try to seem objective and factual when really almost the whole sub is about morals. Back to why it's so necessary to talk about morality... only a disgusting, and yes, immoral, person would keep their options open during a marriage. If someone is doing that they are the problem that must be stopped. It's absurd to stoop to their level.

16 upvoteswhuttupfoo10 months ago

Tf. Are you speaking theoretically or from experience?

Have you actually done this? Or are you just assuming a woman will cry when this happens.

News flash kiddo, a woman will fuck you harder than ever when it happens.

2 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

Experience obviously. Personal experience and everything I've seen in real life.

>News flash kiddo, a woman will fuck you harder than ever when it happens.

This isn't a news flash, nor is it contradictory to what I said. Of course a jealous woman will get more possessive. What point are you trying to make?

17 upvotesredblueninja10 months ago

Good news for us, we're in an amoral sub

-10 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

No, you just have your own set of morals. If you don't like that one word I used in my comment, focus on the rest of the words. It's silly and it's not true. Nobody likes being toyed with and cheated on.

18 upvotesredblueninja10 months ago

Women also "toy" with a lot of betas. Dont you think that's immoral?

And what about finding redpill and developing yourself into your best version and "fooling" women into thinking you're an alpha? Isn't that immoral?

Calling this immoral is just a defense mechanism to avoid stepping into the arena and actually playing the game instead of virtue signaling in the sidelines.

1 upvotesFineCopy210 months ago

On point bro. Women have so many thirsty beta orbiters. Women very well know the intentions of these guys. Still they choose to keep them around because of constant validation and its practically very useful to them coz they do things out of the way for these women in hopes some they they can get in her pants. Women exploit this fact very systematically.

6 upvotesSeasonedRP10 months ago

This is a very good point. And nearly all women do this. The white knights who criticize #2 defend and make excuses for women having guy friends and orbiters. #2 merely recommends that men do the same thing and let women know they have options.

5 upvoteschrisname10 months ago

“Other people do it so I’m going to do it too” = slave mentality.

2 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

>Women also "toy" with a lot of betas. Dont you think that's immoral?

This is so obvious I don't even know how on earth you asked it. It's OBVIOUSLY immoral. Seriously, what do you think the chances are that I thought that was ok?

No it's not immoral to try to make yourself into an alpha or make people think you're one.

>Calling this immoral is just a defense mechanism to avoid stepping into the arena and actually playing the game instead of virtue signaling in the sidelines.

Not for me. You might feel that way but I don't. You're trying to tell me my own opinion.

1 upvotesHock3yGrump10 months ago

-You can't "cheat" on someone unless you have both agreed to monogamy.

-Flirting isn't cheating. It could be seen as disrespectful depending on the context, but not cheating.

-You are contradicting yourself. You disagree with Rule 2, but you claim Rule 7 is " is good".

If you don't like that one word I used in my comment, focus on the rest of the words.

Sorry, but this is ridiculous. Your entire opinion is based around that one word.

1 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

If something says the same thing as rule 2 I'm not going to be overly disagreeable. I'm trying to be agreeable and see the other side. But people on this sub make that difficult with their contradictions and insanely triggered attitudes. You can easily assume I disagree with any cheating.

Maybe your opinion is based on that word, but mine is not. You're literally trying to tell me my own OPINION.

3 upvotesHock3yGrump10 months ago

So, flirting socially is "immoral" to you, but having multiple partners is not?

If speaking to another woman in a bar in a happy, warm, welcoming tone around other women is "immoral", then how can someone be social and be moral under your opinion? How is social conversation "cheating"?

Words have specific definitions, so I am confused by your stance.

1 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

I didn't say having multiple partners is ok. Of course it's not.

If speaking to another woman in a bar in a happy, warm, welcoming tone around other women is "immoral", then how can someone be social and be moral under your opinion? How is social conversation "cheating"?

I'm talking about flirting, this is just regular conversation. Flirting would be sexual, romantic, and/or trying to create something sexual or romantic between you and the other person. Just being friendly, warm, welcoming, pleasant, etc isn't flirting.

25 upvotes319Skew10 months ago

Hypergamy is immoral and so is attraction. A woman would rather share a winner than be saddled with a loser.

Women love drama and feeling.

I see nothing wrong with #2.

8 upvotesRevolutionaryPea710 months ago

Attraction is amoral. Nobody can help who they are attracted to.

1 upvoteswildtimes310 months ago

Is Hypergamy amoral or immoral?

Not a trick question. I’m working on / through the details of the amoral vs immoral debate that continues to rage.

2 upvotes319Skew10 months ago

What debate?

You strip us down to our core and we are animals following the guidelines of nature.

Talking about if hypergamy is amoral/immoral is the same as saying evolution is evil or just. Nature is devoid of morality. Storms aren't prejudice, diseases aren't malicious and a woman branch swinging subconsciously is just that.

Hypergamy exists to ensure that the species survives.

Sort of like how killing someone is different than letting someone die but death overall is devoid of morality.

You can debate the morality of the action itself but not of the state.

2 upvoteswildtimes310 months ago

This has been a recent question via purple IIRC

There is no one definitive answer, as far as I can tell, about sexual strategy (hypergamy, spinning plates) being amoral, immoral or involved with morality at all.

If there is, please link the article that supersedes. I’ve read most.

I’m most comfortable defending all sex strat, hypergamy included, as amoral. I’m just looking for more info. No worries.

Thank you.

1 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

What do you mean attraction is immoral? Attraction to other men besides your partner? Yes I agree.

You didn't explain how #2 is ok. It's still deeply immoral and gross.

4 upvoteswildtimes310 months ago

Do you believe in balance? Reciprocation?

It’s the rare LTR that has zero orbiters. IME even a faithful “good woman” usually has at least 2 until she gets a ring.

Number 2 is suggesting to reciprocate that. It balances her behavior strangely enough.

3 upvotesFatmanO10 months ago

I don't know why the guy insulted you, he obviously can't hold an arguement. Its not moral but women do this to me aswell, not really much you can do. All posters here are playing with hypergamy (example lifting) than against it. Just saying

1 upvotesshaun32010 months ago

I’m not sure if you’re a troll or genuinely clueless and haven’t read the sidebar, but I’ll humor this comment.

First of all, he said attraction is AMORAL, as in “unconcerned with the rightness or wrongness of something. You’re confusing that with IMMORAL, which is not conforming to accepted standards of morality. The Red Pill is AMORAL. We are not concerned with whether something is right or wrong, or how manipulative or gross it may seem. We are concerned with what WORKS, and what gets RESULTS.

2 is ok because it WORKS. A woman wants to know that the man she is concerned with is still desired by other women. NO WOMAN wants to date, marry or fuck a man that nobody else wants. #2 reinforces this in her mind. By making her jealous and entertaining other women, you are letting her know that 1: other women still find you attractive. This makes you more attractive in her eyes (she may be verbally opposed to it but it works) and 2: it lets her (and yourself) know that if she was to walk away right now, that you’d be able to get any woman you wanted. This makes her respect you, and makes her work to keep you.

If you still don’t understand, I recommend you take some time to read the sidebar.

Also, we seriously don’t care for virtue signaling. Saying that something is “immoral” on TRP is like calling out double standards to feminist. NOBODY FUCKING CARES

2 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

Where do you see any confusion about immoral and amoral? I looked for what you are claiming but I don't see it. I was never confused and there's no reason to believe I was that I can see.

It's wildly foolish to ignore morality and pretend to focus on what works. If something is immoral is highly unlikely to work because it will upset people and cause massive disrupt and malfunction.

I have no idea what upset the bloody hell out of you but you need to calm down. You're making yourself look like a joke. You argued for a different thing. You're talking about women finding a man attractive. This post is talking about a man flirting with other women.

2 upvotesshaun32010 months ago

The methods and techniques that are discussed here are a toolkit. The tools themselves are amoral. What you want to do with them is your choice. A hammer can be used to build a house, or to bash someone’s skull. Is the hammer immoral? Or the man? Doesn’t matter, because the hammer works.

Same concept applies here. People may (on the surface) get upset about the methods used here, but at the end of the day they work. It’s up to whoever uses them to decide whether or not they want to adhere to societal morals and norms (relationship, marriage, all that jazz), or if they want to fuck 100000 bitches with absolutely zero regard for who gets upset, whose feelings get hurt, or who thinks of him as a narcissistic, misogynistic, sexist pig who has no regards for peoples feelings. At the end of the day, he gets his dick wet. And that’s the end goal of TRP.

So no, it’s not foolish to ignore morality. What’s foolish is to pretend that doing (what people say is) the right thing all the time will always get you the results you desire.

And no I wasn’t upset. I don’t know how the formatting got like that but I don’t care. It emphasized the points I wanted to highlight anyway.

2 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

If methods make someone upset in romantic relationships or sex... that's not really working. You're also not explaining how anything is amoral. You're just explaining why an individual doesn't care about people's feelings. That's not amoral whatsoever. You can have an opinion on how moral or not that is, but it's anything but amoral.

0 upvotes • [deleted] • 10 months ago

You are a bloop. Of course you don't understand. I bet you also believe NAWALT

7 upvotesThynome10 months ago

Don't sink to just insulting somebody if he has asked a question and is open for discussion. We are not feminists.

1 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

I have yet to meet a person who seriously believes there isn't a single counter example in the world to AWALT.

2 upvotes • [deleted] • 10 months ago

You have no idea what awalt even means. Rookie. Keep lurking

-2 upvotesfriendandadvisor10 months ago

A-moral. He wrote Amoral, not IMmoral.

1 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

He clearly wrote immoral. The word amoral is nowhere in his comment.

1 upvotesfriendandadvisor10 months ago

Don't even know what we're even talking about, now. Comment deleted.

1 upvotesanylegtypes10 months ago

Ok, so leaving aside whether #2 is immoral in and of itself...

How is that your main problem with the list?

You think it's ridiculous and immoral to make a girl jealous, but not to:

  • Consciously maintain options with other women
  • Avoid saying "I'm sorry" even if you are actually guilty
  • Be an asshole over being polite, if you can't see another option

Your objection doesn't seem consistent at all. How is it immoral to make a woman jealous by flirting with other women, but not immoral to actually have other options? How do you even get one without the other?

3 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

>Consciously maintain options with other women

This is pretty close to the same thing as flirting with other women. I don't want to seem overly disagreeable and picking at every piece of the argument when unnecessary because I basically already said that.

>How do you even get one without the other?

Exactly. That's why I didn't repeat myself because they go hand in hand.

The other two are fine. They're not even comparable to flirting with others. The other two are telling men to avoid being submissive. That is fine.

3 upvotesPS2Errol10 months ago

Presumably you are a woman.

6 upvotesNigerianChad10 months ago

You're obviously a woman or a gay.

4 upvotesHock3yGrump10 months ago

You are male thinking for a female. Don't do that.

2 upvotesBrownGummyBear10 months ago

It’s better to make her cry every once in a while out of jealousy than having her dry pussy lead to a dead bedroom

3 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

I would say that's true but neither is better.

2 upvotesbigdudecfc10 months ago

Keep this in mind the next time you read another post,sexual strategy is amoral.Vice versa you're going to lose.

2 upvotesimmaculacy10 months ago

I disagree with that statement. It's not possible for something so emotionally charged to be amoral.

1 upvotesDoneScannedIt10 months ago

make your mission, not your woman, your priority

Your general self-improvement should take priority over your mission. IMHO

8 upvotes0987653789510 months ago

Having a mission and completing it is part of self improvement. Self improvement is a starting point for the new ones, after a certain level of competency is achieved, you have to look for something more than lifting and not stuttering like an idiot when a girl notices you.

9 upvotessymbologythere10 months ago

That is your fucking mission!

1 upvotesDoneScannedIt10 months ago

Read #3, above. The whole section is focusing on woman. Nothing was said about your mission. Is he talking a mission, like starting a business or is he talking about self improvement? No, he isn't talking about mission at all. So neither you nor I know what he means by mission. It's a clear example of what he's saying not-to-do. It just sounds like resentment or regret. Let's talk about Mission!

4 upvotestriavatar10 months ago

Your mission is your mission. In order to accompish most missions you're going to need to improve. By focusing on your mission, you will draw out the rough edges of yourself that need to be shaped to become the man that is able to succeed at the mission.

1 upvotesnocehr10 months ago

XIV is cringe af too. why do you HAVE TO sexually satisfy her to the maximum? to the extend of it being laborious and a physical drain on yourself? I thought red-pill is all about yourself and your own well being? Why are you so insecure that you have to stasify her so much by sacrificing your own wellbeing then?

10 upvotesAndrew5432110 months ago

Where did it say it would be laborious? Why are you fucking women you don’t want to split like a log?

1 upvotesnocehr10 months ago

coz reality. you act as if every men can get 10/10 girls if they subscribe to redpill ideology AYE LMAO so delusional

and even very good looking girls, if you fuck them many times you get sick of it.

7 upvotesAndrew5432110 months ago

Don’t fuck girls you don’t want to fuck.

Aye so stupid.

2 upvotesSkuggasveinn10 months ago

Use some common sense. Just because you fuck her good, that does not mean that you fuck your self.

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