A common general retort from RPers is that TBP doesn't offer anything better, or anything at all. This is true, but not a sound argument - a sub called /r/kukluxkunts that exclusively makes fun of the KKK is not obligated to provide 'alternative reasoning' to what they see as simple, overt racism/stupidity/whatever.

But I also find a common general retort from TBP that TRP isn't special or unique and 'all the good parts can be found elsewhere'. This is also arguably true, but not a sound argument - if there were 10,000 separate pages talking about a special serving method for ice cream that all had some general relevant information, but there was one specific page that had a comprehensive, step by step, easily understood and digested guide to not only that specific serving method for ice cream, but why the serving method is good, why people like that serving method particularly, how to develop and perfect the method, etc., then it's pretty clear that the latter is the superior source. Even if it happens to have some negative connotation for some reason - let's say they support Satanism, and talk about why Satanism is cool in their site - this doesn't mean that it is no longer the best source; it means that it is the best source, but it has flaws.

So I would like to get very specific about what information TRP has to offer and whether it is a significantly more comprehensive/complete source than others. My argument is that TRP is indeed the (or one of the) most comprehensive resources in regards to learning about sexual strategy, social dynamics, the sexual marketplace, and how to find one's place, meaning, and importance as a man in the modern world.

I think it is important to make clear what we are assuming to be the intention of men who find/read/use TRP. RPers often say most men are just seeking guidance, a model to follow, a branch to cling to, as the sexual and technological revolutions have largely upended the traditional male value proposition. BPers often characterize RPers as racists, sexists, bigots, idiots, or losers, or all the above, whose intentions are to justify their misogyny and circlejerk themselves into a blissful oblivion on reddit.

Here at PPD, I think we're attuned enough to know that there is a spectrum of intentions surrounding TRP. I don't think anyone could reasonably argue that no TRPers are legitimately trying to be better men, nor could anyone reasonably argue that no TRPers are misogynistic morons. But for the purposes of this post, let us assume that people are, in general, looking for some help and guidance in good faith from these sources.

So, without further ado, a list of relevant topics covered by TRP

  • Conversational skills: how to maintain interesting conversations, what topics to avoid, how to develop conversational threads, becoming more aware of the give and take dynamic, how to build rapport, etc.

  • Body language: in-depth discussion of what various body language means, how to be better at interpreting it, how to be congruent with your own body language, what defines 'strong' or 'alpha' body language vs. 'weak' or 'beta' body language

  • Social skills: approach anxiety, the importance and effect of social freedom, how to give others outs, using powertalk and plausible deniability, getting past the 'personal fable', etc.

  • Physical attractiveness: importance of lifting, importance of exercise in general, diet, hygiene, in depth grooming talk (facial hair or no? straight razor or disposable? badger brush? haircut types? skin care? acne prevention? etc.)

  • Inner Game: importance of setting SMART goals, meditation, stoicism/general emotional stability, abundance mentality, being warm and open to others, maximizing the strength of your natural personality instead of fighting to change it (i.e. make silent and strong work for you by putting yourself in situations where it is more likely to work well), putting your own needs before others (within reason, obviously), the importance of simple active interest and engagement with others, a la ''People talking without speaking, people hearing without listening'', being proactive rather than reactive, etc.

  • Lifestyle development: this ties in to inner game a bit, but focusing on maximizing potential in every area of life, pursuing education and career advancement, learning why and how to save and spend money, developing and curating interesting hobbies, surrounding yourself with interesting/valuable/useful people and cutting out toxic ones, seeking out mentors, building lasting, solid relationships with friends and connections, the importance of networking and reputation, etc.

  • Sexual skills: pretty self explanatory. Sex God Method, general discussion of sex tips, positions, importance and utility of communication, recognizing and compromising sexual needs with significant others, etc.

  • Women: whether you agree with the conclusions/ideas or not, there is infinite discussion of every aspect of women, social, sexual, biological, their motivations, their reasoning, their thought processes, dualistic mating, on and on and on. Again, regardless of the accuracy, TRP offers a comprehensive perspective of the female psyche.

  • Men's Issues/Rights: TRP is one of the few places where men can go and say just about anything, and not be called monsters or rapists in training or whatever. TRP acknowledges this lack of ability for men to complain about anything or show any kind of weakness and be taken seriously, and then provides an outlet for that anger and complaint. There is also a fair amount of discussion of how society and/or women are indifferent to male suffering, and that males are generally thought of as disposable; this kind of discussion is taboo in many parts (Charge of Hypersensitivity is a exceedingly common sight in any discussion having to do with men's issues/rights). I would say there is less constructive discussion of men's rights as compared to, say, /r/FeMRADebates, but discussion of men's rights that isn't automatically dismissed as whiny bullshit is progress in my eyes.

  • askTRP: this one is a bit different. TRP has set up a platform for men to ask any questions they may have and gives the TRP perspective on the situation. If we again remove the accuracy judgment, what are we left with? A platform for young men seeking guidance and perspective to get exactly that from other men who have been in the same spot, in language they are likely to understand well. A real time help desk of sorts that offers practical, good-willed (towards the man, at least) advice on any situation they might encounter. A place where men can ask for advice and trust that it will be geared towards getting them what they want, putting their priorities first, as opposed to scolding or shaming or looking for faults or anything else like that that often happens on mainstream subs like askwomen or relationships. This isn't to say that everyone will necessarily be shown kindness and sensitivity (okay, that's the probably the most understated thing I've ever said), but they will also be given serious advice and pointed in the right general direction, as opposed to being shamed or denigrated.

  • Anti-complacency: This can be interpreted in a couple of ways - one is that this is about how all women always want to fuck you over so you can never relax or show any weakness, the other is that you should always be striving to improve and bettering yourself regardless of how awesome you might already be. I don't completely agree with the former, but I do agree with the latter, and I see both ideas come out of RP.

I'm sure other examples of topics or areas that TRP covers will come up that I've forgotten or overlooked, but these seem to me to cover a pretty solid portion of TRP.

So the challenge I present here is to list sources that are similarly comprehensive in nature and similarly deep in scope to TRP.

My own flair is 'TRP - hate = Models' (Models being the book by Mark Manson), but that's a simplification. Models does not go anywhere near as in depth as TRP does with specific details on conversation, body language, and physical attractiveness development, as well as having little to no discussion of men's issues/rights. It also doesn't go particularly in depth with sexual skills.

Would I recommend Models to anyone? Sure. Would I call it similar in level of comprehensiveness to TRP? No.

I also ask that we be cognizant of what we consider 'TRP', 'TRP material', or 'not TRP'. As in, is Models a 'red pill' book? Is 'The Game' a 'red pill' book? Is 'the red pill' significantly different from the collection of works that is linked to by TRP? Is 'the red pill' something completely separate from all the sources/readings it lists, or is it an amalgamation of said sources and readings with an overarching perspective that serves as a foundational framework, or something else entirely?

And finally I ask that this question be taken in good faith. This isn't some grandstanding 'ha ha bp has no good sources rp is right and best'. There's a reason my flair is 'TRP - hate = Models'. If there are sources of information out there that can be as helpful or moreso than TRP without the negative parts that come along with it, I would love to read them.

Edit:

Or, you could just have some core principles of kindness, respect, mental and physical health, always earnestly learning, and social health. And then, apply your own best judgement and common sense. It's not fucking rocket science.

I'll coin this the 'Charge of 'Just Get It''.

Another one!

Exercise, eat well, be less self indulgent, foster the life of the mind, surround yourself with encouraging companions and cut the toxic ones, do unto others as you would have them do to you. Treat all with respect, and demand the same. When I began to conscientiously live like that, my quality of life became exponentially better, and I attained my happiest and healthiest, no sad internet boys' club needed.

Three in a row, on a roll!

A therapist, a circle of friends, a hobby, and a gym membership.

Can we get four on the floor?

you wanna know the secret to attraction besides status? It is to be able to connect to a chick the way you do when you were in school as a kid and the teacher did something weird and everyone looked at each other. Where you feel that level of comfort where you and the chick are the ones who look at each other. that kind of connection. that is all their is to it you and her need to share a narrative together tied together by some symbolic items from a shared experience.

The big five oh!

I think the issue is that you shouldn't need in depth sources or loads of research just to be able to talk to people, to live a normal life.

In the future, please avoid the 'Charge of 'Just Get It''

did you really need TRP to tell you those things you listed? Most of it is common sense. I could have told you that and I'm not a terper

Missed this last one

I didn't think much of red pillers but I didn't realise they needed that much work to pass for normal.

If your answer is some variation of 'you don't need TRP! It's common sense! Just think and have good judgment!' then please fuck right off