70% of men aged 20-34 aren't married. 50% never will

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March 10, 2015


"The high percentage of bachelors means bleak prospects for millions of young women who dream about a wedding day that may never come. 'It’s very, very depressing," Crouse told CNSNews.com.

"Feminism was supposed to bring women happiness," Crouse said. "But the research shows that women today are much more unhappy then they have been in the past."

Ah, brings a smile to my face. Standing ovation for the American men smartening up. Also, the comments on the article are absolute gold.

Post Information
Title 70% of men aged 20-34 aren't married. 50% never will
Upvotes 702
Comments 439
Date 10 March 2015 05:06 AM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit TheRedPill
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/30050
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/2yj0r3/70_of_men_aged_2034_arent_married_50_never_will/
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Red Pill terms found in post:
the red pillfeminism

[–]2popthatpill205 points206 points  (31 children) | Copy

The problem is very simple: women don't want to get married in their 20s because the carousel is too much fun. Women only want to get married when they see their SMV declining and they want to lock in the best prospect they can before their SMV declines much further. So it doesn't matter how marriageable 20-something men are: women of appropriate age simply aren't interested in getting married and forgoing the fun of the carousel. Marriage is dead for 20-somethings because women simply aren't interested.

Men, however, have gradually started asking themselves: why should I be the backup plan for some used-up ex-slut who didn't get what she really wanted? Why should I pay for used goods that used to be given away free when they were new? Not to mention how the law encourages divorce assraping. So, not surprisingly, men are declining marriage altogether.

So, if marriage is dying, it's dying in the 20s because of women (not interested because carousel), and dying in the 30s because of men (not interested because AFBB and divorce).

[–]GREF_73 points74 points  (12 children) | Copy

If I'm going to make the kind of commitment that marriage is I deserve to enjoy my wife during her blooming 20's.

[–]we_kill_creativity29 points30 points  (11 children) | Copy

Exactly this. I'm 25, don't know if I'll get married. And even if I did it realistically wouldn't be until I'm about 30 for all the reasons listed above. So, if I do get married when I'm 30 it won't be with a 30 year old woman. Fuck that, I'd only marry a girl in her early to mid twenties, aiming low. Watch that start to happen a lot more and then watch society start shaming men like me.

[–]FilthyCasual31640 points41 points  (4 children) | Copy

29 here. I used to say the exact same thing about waiting until 30. Now that it's on the horizon, I think I'm pushing it back to "never." Tons of very serious financial/legal risk from divorce, which in this day and age outweighs the unlikely potential reward. Statistics bear this out.

[–][deleted] 78 points79 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yeah... if you're the kind of guy a girl wants to marry, you're the kind of guy who has a lot to lose from getting married.

[–]lag_rvp19 points20 points  (0 children) | Copy

I could only upvote this once, if I could upvote it more I'd do it until my mouse broke. Very very spot on observation.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

28 here. I feel exactly that way too. Pushing it to "never". Not much incentives, too much work and money just to share a bed with a used up slut.

[–]destraht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I didn't date in high school and just had some opportunistic fucks here and there until I met tons of foreign chicks at my sweet junior college. Now I pretty much am only considering Eastern Europe for long term prospects. I've lived in Ukraine and between ultra-conservative and ultra-sexy parts and the big cultural differences it is hard to get ones head around it at first but I thnk that its the way to go. I've been out of Ukraine to California and then Shanghai for three months and I very much regret having left. I just asked my friend over email if he ever regrets leaving EE and he says: every. single. time. I'm 34 and not even at peak awesome man stuff there. Older men are great for them. Its no kind of consolation prize for them and I just start feeling old real quick when I'm in California. As a 34 year old man I feel like I don't have access to young women in California and that I'm segmented out into older person life there whereas its easier to age mix in EE.

[–]widec1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

If I get married it won't be with a Canadian girl. If I'm taking on that much risk, I want to at least get a citizenship somewhere which the climate isn't fucking awful.

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[–]we_kill_creativity0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Well, that's fucked. I don't use pof though. What I use let's me do that thankfully.

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[–]Doctor_Mayhem0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Boils down to who's shaming who. Plain and simple, we're somehow the assholes and bad guys when we play the game that women play. If women were even capable of recognizing consequences, none of us would be here. If women were actually capable of intellect, they would realize, "I can have fun, but so can men, and I can't have my fun if I want to marry the man I really want." They don't realize that, and they're not capable of any kind of real logic. Thus, we mock them.

[–]vakerr37 points38 points  (2 children) | Copy

If I couldn't have the kitten, I don't want the cat.

"Where are all the men?" "Right where you left them, back in your twenties."

[–]Skank_of_America7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

That reminds me of a gif I saw online. It asked, Where have all the good men gone? YO' ASS PUT THEM ALL IN THE FRIEND ZONE.

[–]Endorsed ContributorRedPillDad17 points18 points  (1 child) | Copy

dying in the 30s because of men

Men in their 30's, with decent Game and ascending SMV, can crank up the pussy carousel. They're the shit now, with zero incentive to lock down damaged goods of equivalent age range. They might have bit the marriage bait back in their mid-20's when they were young and thirsty, but they've wizened up.

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy

Ironic...we're forced to wait for so long that we finally realize the thing we wanted isn't worth the trouble, and that's exactly when we're supposed to jump back on the bandwagon.

[–]Day_man20207 points8 points  (3 children) | Copy

You're absolutely right. From an economics perspective marriage has nothing to offer men anymore.

In the old days there were several incentives.

  1. In the days before rampant premarital sex we had the incentive of regular sexual gratification

  2. Housework really was a way bigger deal before electric power and other modern conveniences so keeping a household was actually a pretty big incentive that women offered going into marriage

  3. Large families were a productive asset especially in agrarian communities

These incentives are pretty much entirely null and void

  1. Premarital sex and hookup culture has eliminated pussy as a real marriage incentive "Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free"

  2. Modern technology has eliminated the drudgery of housekeeping, as an electrician every time I run my vacuum cleaner I imagine the poor saps hanging carpets and beating them with brooms to clean them. Also spring cleaning used to entail scrubbing your house top to bottom to clean out the layers of soot that would accumulate on the walls and ceilings through the winter from the hearth, candles and oil lamps... Yummy

  3. The modern world of work has turned a large family into a liability, people often have to move around for better job opportunities so having a large family (or any really) modern children are generally not productive members of the family so children can be thought of as a liability (from an economic perspective) in modern times rather than the asset they were in times of old

Do your own cost/benefit analysis, for men, really no incentive which is why the "alarming" statics that 70% of men 20-34 aren't married and 50% won't ever.

[–]destraht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Housework really was a way bigger deal before electric power and other modern conveniences so keeping a household was actually a pretty big incentive that women offered going into marriage

My Indian friend who has twenty servants back home was telling me about how they brought in a washing machine and the servant couldn't figure out how to use it and then my friend was asking his mom to get arid of the servant since washing close with a machine is easy as fuck and they decided to keep the servant around out to a long term committment. Anyways, just to demonstrate how much work it is just to wash clothes for a lot of people, especially if they are getting dirty.

[–]jtcribbs-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

On number two I'd disagree that the technology has helped all that much...it's helped in the volume of clothing and dishes that were always done. But the "clean house" of say pre-1985 was much more cleaner than today. American homes were typically immaculate if a wife was home cleaning every day. With both adults dressed in very clean and pressed clothing.

American homes are clean on modern television and movies, but I haven't found that replicates even upper middle class suburban homes today. They're much filthier than 30+ years ago...

[–]Day_man20200 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

If I didn't know any better I'd say you were being a bit overly nostalgic. For one thing just laundry alone would have been a whole day chore before the modern washing machine, today the process is 90% automated. More "convenience" foods on the market today.

I'm not really sure what your point was, my argument was that women's housekeeping skills were part of the deal incentivising young men to get married. If it's true like you say that the standards have slipped that only strengthens my argument, since A: housekeeping has never been easier B: societal standards have allegedly slipped (according to you)

I'm not sure why you picked 1985 as a date, electrification and modern (ish) housekeeping appliances date back way further than that I'm also not convinced that housekeeping standards have slipped, I'd say our houses in general are cleaner, why? Electric light and windows, back in the day houses were dark holes, with small or nonexistent windows (glass used to be way more expensive) and light from feeble candles. Good luck keeping that cave as clean as some people's houses, maybe you know a lot of slobs or something but we're living in the future man. I'd concede that our homes tend to be more cluttered because people in industrial societies accumulate tons of random crap. But overall I'd say they are cleaner yes.

[–]destraht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I'd love to hear that smoking hot brunette psychologist doctor say that on television. Who is that lady, forget her name? She is gorgeous and oozes with Southern charm.

[–]Magnum256488 points489 points  (27 children) | Copy

Disagree with your statement about women becoming lonely and unable to get married. Women can go into survival mode if they're desperate, they can temporarily become submissive and hyper sexual and find a lonely beta who will think she's "the one" after she gives him a blowjob. Once the marriage happens she'll just go 180 back to her original self and know that she has the law and social system on her side and will basically be set.

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[–]Endorsed Contributorgekkozorz0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Honestly, I'm surprised there aren't more RPW than there are. Often times the primary victims of shitty female behavior are other females.

[–]fuck_da_haes77 points78 points  (13 children) | Copy

This needs to be higher. Also that's why there is a several years long vetting period (at least for redpillers).

[–]2Overkillengine74 points75 points  (10 children) | Copy

Years? Think forever vetting. Never marry- keep her on good behavior since she knows at least subconsciously you can walk at any point then.

[–]fuck_da_haes17 points18 points  (9 children) | Copy

I come from a somewhat traditional family (not a single divorce!), this will not fly forever for some us, doesn't mean I will marry without knowing what I can expect from her plus prenuptial agreement (am not from US, prenups work here).

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

What countries do prenups work in? This is valuable information!

[–]fuck_da_haes2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I come from european post-communist country, that's as far as I'm willing to go (because doxxing fucks from srs)

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Why get married? I mean, really, what advantages could one get thanks to marriage?

[–]fuck_da_haes1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Social status in more conservative areas of society, money (taxes reduction) ... that's all I can think of now

Edit: I'm not pro-marriage, I'm not sure what I should, I don't live in western country so we tend it to be different here. Of course some shit seeping in, but very very slowly.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Well I'm not from the US myself but taxes reduction are nothing compared to what a woman and children cost.

[–]1DRMMR761 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Bingo. I can't say I'm 100% opposed to getting married myself (probably about 90%) but if I do ever get into an LTR where it's possible, I'm going to make it clear I will propose when I feel like I'm ready. It could be after dating for five years, could be eight years, or more. If she's willing to stay knowing that it will be totally on my terms and my timeline, and that it may take a full decade of her being a proper First Mate on my life-ship, good. If she bails, so be it.

[–]orographic47 points48 points  (7 children) | Copy

I see a lot of posts from dudes in the anger bitterness stage think they are getting comfort that "women will get what they deserve when they hit the wall." The reality is most women are going to get their cake and eat it too. They will ride the cock carousel when they are young then lock down a beta provider.

[–]redzorp29 points30 points  (2 children) | Copy

Yup. Seen it many times with my own eyes. There is always a beta simp to scrape post-walls sluts off the floor and take care of them. Always!

Knew one former MILF, now 60, she used to be a bit of a white nationalist (not full-on KKK) who only wanted to date white guys in their 20s. She played that game well into her mid 40s, despite being a divorcee with 3 kids and a couple of grand kids. She was definitely hot up to age 45 but then crashed into the wall big time thereafter.

Long story short, at 60 the former white nationalist cougar converts to Mormonism, marries an obese 70-year old black guy (retired engineer with good income) and is now sealed for life to her "soul mate" with their matching magical underwear (That last bit is a Mormon thing, google it).

That's why the vast majority of homeless are men. As a man, you ARE ON YOUR OWN. No one is gonna take care of you. Women, on the other hand, can always find a provider - whether that's a man, the government or numerous charity shelters or services.

[–]HeadingRed11 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy

Can we get this into a movie?

[–]Doctor_Mayhem0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Here's the difference, guy: Just as the obesity epidemic has left us with fewer women for us to even wanna fuck, the countering forces to social Marxism and feminism (100k subscribers, w00t) are going to mean that men willing to commit will be of a lower and lower quality.

To reiterate: The more men get red-pilled, the lower the quality of men willing to take this bum deal. I dunno about you, but married to an omega or obese 70 year old doesn't sound like winning to me.

[–]SgtBrutalisk0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It's a stale, miserable and crummy cake at best.

[–]destraht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I like Ukrainian girls because their wall comes at about 27 and by the time that they hit the Western wall they are majorly freaking the fuck out (and much under 30 is also much better there because of other drastic sociological changes and having a good chance at that not smoking). I don't want a 22 year old woman and I think that its beneficial for them to have a tad of experience past college before marriage/kids. The trick in Ukraine now is to be in the sexier places now as the more conservative places are just being locked down by the BPC (Babushka Pussy Cartel) and PBEA (Pure Blood Enforcement Agency) from what I've seen. People just do more of what they are used to when under stress.

[–]WoahScienceCool0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Youre basing this assumption off of an entirely different generation of men and women. Apples and oranges, man.

Things are going to play out much differently for women in their twenties these days. So much has changed in even just the last ten years. Things like social media, the ratio of women in education/careers, The Great Recession, third wave feminism, etc have warped this generation beyond savior and changed the dynamics of dating, hook-up culture and even earning a living.

Its not fair or accurate to make such absolutist assumptions based on a generation that was never raised around Tinder, Facebook and the displacement of men in education and the workforce.

[–]1grendalor0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Possible - I mean we don't know. There are still a lot of thirsty betas around, however, who are normally the ones whom these women prey on when they are lane changing from AF to BB. It's possible that this completely dries up in the next few years, but we will have to see.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

You need to wait for that honeymoon phase to wear off before you really know who you're with... Don't get married until you've really seen their worst (better yet. Don't get married)

[–]SMEGMA_CHEESE7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

Can confirm. Happened to me. The only difference is I pursued her heavily until she eventually caved. And turned out to be a nightmare.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Needs to be posted to that article, and everywhere else.

[–]AnotherLostCause358 points359 points  (108 children) | Copy

Couldnt have anything to do with a shortage of women who are worthy of marriage.

[–]cock_pussy_up333 points334 points  (47 children) | Copy

If you don't want to marry an obese, ugly, bitchy, middle aged single mother with a truckload of baggage from past relationships, then you're an immature peter pan manchilde in a state of perpetual adolescence.

[–]ITravelin_Man 106 points106 points [recovered] | Copy

Yeah, man up! Be a real man!

[–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil139 points140 points  (10 children) | Copy

Pretty sure thats what they told 18 year old boys before sending them to die in world war one. If someone says man up you should probably man down.

[–]walkingmydog82 points83 points  (9 children) | Copy

British women during WW1 would give young men a white feather if they had not enlisted, the white feather was a way of calling the man a coward. Now that's a cruel shit test if ever I've seen one.

[–]CornyHoosier51 points52 points  (2 children) | Copy

I read that online. There were many instances of them giving our white feathers to men who were in the military but were just on leave.

Bitches gonna bitch

[–]Endorsed ContributorObio141 points42 points  (1 child) | Copy

I'm all for an equal number of women dying in the next war. I assume the feminists will back me up in the name of equality?

< / sarc >

[–]nrjk6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy


"There's too Many Women Dying in War:

We Need to Teach Enemies Not to Enemy"

War: Solved forever

[–]I-Am-Dickish15 points16 points  (1 child) | Copy

Die or shame. Take your pick.

[–]PixelMagic2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Shame. The only way you can be shamed is if you give a shit what others think in the first place.

[–]foldpak1117 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'd staple it to my t shirt and wear it everywhere like a badge of honor. So cute when the matrix and everyone brainwashed by it try to shame me into bossing other countries around. If the government is so big and bad why are they asking me for help? Sounds like I'm the big man tbh

[–]FinallyRed0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

I wonder if those women knew the brutal reality of that war, would they still have pulled that shit? Propaganda affects both sexes.

[–]through_a_ways9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

People are inherently less capable of empathizing with men, so it doesn't matter.

When we see a woman or child in distress, we instinctually want to care for them.

When we see a man show emotional vulnerability, it's cringeworthy.

[–]vakerr2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

They knew men die and get injured/disabled in wars.

[–]tropicalpolevaulting2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Shit son, I consider myself a man but I'm not Captain Ahab...

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

After a year away from my parents home i came back for holidays and spent 2 weeks with my feminist mother. My RP behavior didn't fit well.

"You STFU and obey me because I am your MOTHER, I am OLDER, and I am a WOMAN". She then proceeded to yell at the whole family (there was only males here) that we all must bow down and shut up in front of a woman "to say something obvious", finishing her yelling session by "man up, where have all the good men gone?".

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy

It's not about HER, it's also about SOCIETY and the FUTURE OF THE HUMAN RACE you SHITLORD

[–]vakerr0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Actually it is. But women screwed it up, they should be the ones fixing it.

[–]-Awake-0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I know that this comment was facetious but just knowing that people say this seriously causes me physical pain

[–]ExBABYYy1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's like a new project... he says....

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[–][deleted] 27 points28 points  (2 children) | Copy

Sorry, i'm not going to play daddy to little DaQwan.


But I need money though. I know he called you an asshole and kicked a hole in the wall, but I need $3500 money for his orthodontistry.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

Am I the only one who finds the comparison between lovers and fathers creepy!? I can't be the only one

[–]1Dark-Ulfberht3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Holy shit, I did this back in the day. What occurred was fucking amazing. Single mom's would message me all pissed off, and I'd write the hot ones back with a simple, "maybe I'll make an exception in your case."

I had like a 75% bang-on-the-first-date success rate with these women.

[–]HeadingRed0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Your thirties will be amazing- don't waste any of it.

[–]Knight_of_autumn 47 points47 points [recovered] | Copy

Does any guy look back on their life as a teenager and think "man, that time really sucked! The lack of responsibility, the ability to stay up all night and not be exhausted the next day, the weekend parties at friends' houses, and parents taking care of us just SUCKED!"?

I am enjoying my life and ability to do and buy whatever I want, but I hardly think poorly of my adolescense, so I fail to see how this is insulting.

I see this whole "peter pan complex" talk going around like someone saying "stop being so young and carefree! Stop having fun! Why aren't you boring and miserable? Man up and hate your life already!"

[–][deleted] 19 points20 points  (8 children) | Copy

While I'm married and therefore immune to most of those silly comments about peter pan complex, I completely agree with your assessment. I think a lot of people make these sorts of comments from a place of resentment.

If you're a single, fun-loving and fun-having man, you are thumbing your nose at their life decisions. Your life looks like a lot more fun than theirs, so they have to either accept that it's possible they fucked up or they have to find a way to undermine your lifestyle. Chiding you for not growing up is really a form of self-talk; they are convincing themselves that they possess some form of moral superiority for choosing the wife, kids, and minivan.

[–]CornyHoosier6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy

If you're a single, fun-loving and fun-having man, you are thumbing your nose at their life decisions. Your life looks like a lot more fun than theirs, so they have to either accept that it's possible they fucked up or they have to find a way to undermine your lifestyle.

Thank you! I've never understood this mentality. Why can't we both be happy that we made good decisions for ourselves? I have a couple friends who are my age and are constantly giving me shit for traveling and living the "bachelor life".

Honestly, they look miserable to me. As if they are acting out a part in a play that they never really wanted.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

As if they are acting out a part in a play that they never really wanted.

Sadly, for a lot of men, that's because they are.

[–]GhostOfAladdin 2 points2 points [recovered] | Copy

My experiences confirm this form of self talk. Interesting, I hadnt verbalized this way, though.

I have a flexible job, own place, workout and have fun almost every night. Sometimes while out, girls call me a "loser." Didn't realize they were referring to themselves. Ha!

[–]CornyHoosier2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

It's a shit test. Call them on it (you may already).

"Yea, I'm a loser all right! A loser with a nice place, good career & a fun life. Woe is me! Whatever shall I do?"

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Never say that.

"Oh, you have a good career?" - BETA BUCK

Rather, agree and amplify.

[–]destraht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

If you're a single, fun-loving and fun-having man, you are thumbing your nose at their life decisions.

I'm building a software business while living on probably long-term just about $1000-1200 a month. I've been in three continents in the last three months and will soon complete my first circumnavigation of the planet by plane. In Shanghai my girl shit on me for not making much and in Ukraine I'll be a hero (plus much better educated and sexier women IMO). I'm like meh, whatever because its the same me. So back at home how do you figure that my married friends wives feel about me? I don't know 100% because I never get to see their faces and I only get to see those friends as it turns out when their wives are busy doing something else or out of town. Basically that Bill Maher skit.

[–]1DRMMR762 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Spot on. And I totally agree with the reply that it's based on resentment that you're not fitting into the useful idiot role society expects you to play. From the guys, it's resentment that you made better decisions and they realize that you're living a life they wish they still had. They look back on their college years or mid 20's with fondness, but know that in the midst of working 50 hours a week, dealing with kids and a shrew wife, they will never feel that enjoyment again. From women it's the idea that you've wised up to the scheme and you're not going to be that provider Beta they put all that time into training you to be.

Being called a man-child is not an insult if you know what it means. You get the best of both worlds. You can play and enjoy yourself like a child, but with the power and freedom an adult has. You're not playing army with fake guns or camping in your backyard now. You can actually go hunting, shooting or camping in the wilderness. You're not playing with your big-wheel, you're out riding a real motorcycle. You're not playing with Legos, you're actually building a computer or restoring a classic car, maybe building your own furniture. You're enjoying yourself like a child, but with real things in real life on your terms. And you can devote 100% of your time and resources to that pursuit.

You don't need to work a job you hate just to pay for your wife's student loans and her kid's dentist appointment, soccer camp, or college fund. You don't need to worry about a kid breaking your 60" TV or hearing your wife tell you "you can't buy that with 'our' money". You can work a job you actually find rewarding, and use that time and money on other things you enjoy, all while spinning plates when and if you feel like it.

And the funny thing is, it's the women of this age that enable it. You can't spin plates without women who are willing to be plates. Their own hyper-sexual lifestyles are the very thing that lets us have sex when we want without all the drama and stress of the legal contract. I think they resent that it's fun for us too. They want to ride the CC because they enjoy it, but hate the fact that the cock they're riding with no commitment is also enjoying it. And when they find out that when they're ready to chain some poor guy down when they're 30 that no guy wants to be chained down, they get bitter. Solipsism 101. They see the world through their own lens and believe that's all there is. If they had fun in their 20s but want to be married when they're 30, you damn well better be willing to do that too. The knowledge that our Wall is a good couple of decades further down the road than theirs is an eternal thorn in their side.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Life is so precious and unlikely, the opinions of others shouldn't even enter your discussion. And by that I mean the macro scale opinions that dictate what being grown up means--when you should reach this milestone, when you should commit to this socially constructed thing. That type of shit has just never crossed my mind.

[–]through_a_ways0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It's basically a gender-neutral shit test.

"You should be as miserable as I am"

[–]Evolved_Red5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Or a paedophile who can't handle a 'real' woman when you've got an 18/19 year old woman hanging off your arm.

[–]Kharn01 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

As joining Tinder has taught me, the majority of women are barely identifiable as women, through all the fat. Not to mention all the "I want to be your princess" tag lines. Meanwhile I'm trying to get my six pack on so I gave up drinking and eat less so I'm never satisfied, hit the gym 4+ days a week and save money.

[–]pennypuptech28 points29 points  (1 child) | Copy

Completely agree. No where in there is there any mention of women adapting to 'new marriage.' This is what I find the most hilarious:

And their prospects, if they are not sexually promiscuous, are really low because the guys, if they can sleep around, they’re not interested in going with the girls who don’t put out.

HAH! You're right article owner, marrying promiscuous girls is at the top of my list.

The women who do get married to the right man, are the ones who have got things going on themselves. Good jobs & passionate about their career, well-mannered, and you know... all the other things that go in to it.

[–]vakerr0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

And their prospects, if they are not sexually promiscuous, are really low because the guys, if they can sleep around, they’re not interested in going with the girls who don’t put out.

There are plenty of betas they could lock down without sleeping with too many of them. But then they miss out on all those alphas.

[–]TRP Vanguardss_camaro5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

[–]TypicalBetaNeckbeard27 points28 points  (51 children) | Copy

And the abundance of worthy women in Asia, Europe or South America.

[–]Sfwonlynow44 points45 points  (48 children) | Copy

I would not recommend western or northern Europe. Can't comment on the eastern parts of it though.

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[–]Endorsed ContributorUrsusG62 points63 points  (46 children) | Copy

Find a village girl (preferably farmer) in eastern europe and thats as close to a Unicorn as you'll get in this world.

You're deluded (edit: and posting jpgs from a museum).

So deluded I cba to even start explaining why.

Source: Eastern European guy.

[–][deleted] 60 points61 points  (24 children) | Copy

They're deluded about asian and south american girls too.

[–]LuvBeer34 points35 points  (21 children) | Copy

Western-style values are globalized now. I've had plates from Viet Nam, Africa, and South America who were just as neo-feminist as any American.

[–]cynwrig23 points24 points  (11 children) | Copy

I've been to shantytowns in third world countries. Once I heard something unsettlingly familiar and peeked in. What did I see? Little girls gathered around a TV with a satellite feed watching iCarly on Disney Channel.

So forget it guys. The poison has been cropdusted everywhere.

[–]Truebluehere15 points16 points  (10 children) | Copy

Shit, so this is what the Muslims were trying to prevent.

[–]through_a_ways4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

I've repeatedly praised Muslims on here, and always gotten shit for it.

Most people just can't understand until it's too late.

[–]through_a_ways6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy

Western-style values are globalized now.

Pretty much. This is how the (human) world ends.

Oh well, at least Chimps (non-bonobo ones) are still pretty RP

[–]LuvBeer0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Lol, absolutely. And you know the few lone SJWs will be defending them from "old ass racist white guys" til the very end.

[–]JovianTrainWreck5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Western-style values are globalized now. I've had plates from Viet Nam, Africa, and South America who were just as neo-feminist as any American.

This is the shit I was afraid of. I've wanted a stab at a non-westernized woman for as long as I've been to TRP, but as time goes by, the number of them fade. I suspect it's not difficult to find this type of woman outside the US for now, but by the time I'm financially capable it might be a different story. I hope I'm wrong.

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[–]through_a_ways0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Western values.

Slumchildren in Africa aren't devouring U.S. media because they're economically prosperous. They're doing so because it's popular, and it's popular by virtue of the U.S. being prosperous.

Nation-level social proof

[–]vakerr0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Correlated, that's correct. But western societies may work just fine without feminism, cultural Marxism and similar 'values'.

[–]TheRedThrowAwayPill-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

Islam & Orthodox Jews.

But of course you have to already be part of those sub communities.

[–]LuvBeer0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I'm with you buddy. Islam all the way. Don't necessarily have to be part of it.

[–]TRP VanguardCyralea10 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

A lot of first-gen Asian immigrants still have strong cultural values. They're nowhere near as bad as Western women.

[–]through_a_ways0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That's because you're still seeing a lot of FOB Asians.

Give it a few years and the initiation cycle will be over.

[–]bustanutmeow3 points4 points  (14 children) | Copy

Come one, Id be interested in knowing. I thought eastern euro would have been a good choice.

[–]Endorsed ContributorUrsusG43 points44 points  (8 children) | Copy

Internet, social media, TV and AWALT. Think about it.

Seriously, if you want an 'unspoiled' woman, you need to go tribal somewhere deep in the Amazon jungle, because 'Eastern Europe' is not what you imagine it to be.

And your tribal jungle woman will be a branch-swinging gold digger too, because it's in their programming.

[–]RedPillScare9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

Eddie Murphy did a hilarious bit on marrying a jungle woman.

[–]bustanutmeow1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy

Yeah, Fair point. I didnt think the Internet and western social programming would have gone that far yet.

[–]1grendalor30 points31 points  (4 children) | Copy

It's everywhere people have phones that access the internet -- which is almost everywhere in 2015.

Guys need to stop trying to find the place where "women are not like that" -- they are all like that. All of them. And they all know what opportunities exist for women in the West due to the internet. They all envy this, because they all want to ride alpha cock -- all of them. You're not going to find the golden unicorn -- accept that women are like that, and be the cock that they want to ride, and not the guy looking in vain for a unicorn girl who doesn't exist. Accept how women are, adapt accordingly, and profit.

[–]busyalterego0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

AWALT. Of course. But not all laws are like that. You can still go places where the culture and legal system doesn't exist to destroy the family unit and bleed men dry...


[–]frenchthowaway25 points26 points  (3 children) | Copy


I am an immigrant from Easter europe (Ukraine)

I actually grew up on a farm, and I watched our village evolve.

As times passed many people started working ilegally in the EU (mostly construction work) and come back with euros (even if underpaid exchange rate made them earn more)

Most teenagers nowadays even in a farm/classic village (with pigs, goats etc) will have mobile phones and internet access.

You'd literally see teenagers gathering in a group with their phones and stuff while waiting for the cows to take them back to their parents. (pastor brings all cows at edge of village, kids usually escort them to their house)

Times are changing brother.

[–]bustanutmeow6 points7 points  (2 children) | Copy

That is really cool, And also really crazy. I got a mental picture of that and it really blows my mind.

[–]CornyHoosier1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Sounds like growing up in small town Indiana.

I left that hole in the wall, went and made a career, life and money for myself. Whenever I go back people just look at what I have with their mouths agape.

In bigger cities I'm just another tiny fish.

[–]TempusRerumImperator-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy

Look they're still around you just gotta find someone that REALLY knows the girl to introduce you first. You wont find these women at nightclubs and you'll be trolling street pickups for weeks to look for them. You gotta wade through a lot of bullshit, but they do exist. In EE you can find a 22 y.o girl that finished a law or medical degree that's still a virgin, comes from a good family, and has a good head on her shoulders. Shit, you can even put up an Ad at a local university, or go there and speak with the dean of students to look for a good potential match. I'm not even kidding. Only problem is you gotta marry these broads eventually. You can't just pump and dump.

Now, this is not to say that they won't turn into their mothers, or get fat, or get old or get bitchy. They all do eventually, but if you're gonna get married, better go in with the cards in your favor.

Source: Im EE. and i found mine already back home through a mutual contact (I'm friends with her boss, also female). I will eventually have to marry this one, and that's fine with me, she's a great girl.

[–]itsmehobnob0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

If you can't back it up it isn't worth saying.

[–]GarandTheftAvto0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

While generally I agree, on TRP it is worth it to spark discussion where other posters can independently verify or disprove your point.

Our subreddit is better than the comments section of most places on the web, let's get invested.

[–]Hitlers_Boss0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Wait so polish girls are a no go? What about ukrainian ones? Russian ones? (God forbid) latvian girls?

[–]apachemd0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Having lived in Hungary for 5 years in the past, I wholeheartedly agree with this statement. Lots of pure, sweet, beautiful girls there between the ages of 16-19.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

When the fuck will those guy realize there is NO unicorn and there is NO right woman for marriage.

Do not marry, period.

[–]alltoovisceral0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

What, prey tell, do you think makes a woman worthy of marriage?

[–]TRP VanguardJP_Whoregan8 points9 points  (2 children) | Copy

  1. Don't be fat. Sorry ladies, men are visual creatures.
  2. Don't have another man's kids. I'm not raising some other man's fuck trophy. Single moms are the worst people on the planet.
  3. Don't be bitchy and confrontational and call it "strong and independent".
  4. Be humble. Humility does not mean you are a slave to your husband. It means you respect him.
  5. Be pleasant. I don't want a wife who "challenges me". I get enough challenges at work and at the gym.

That's it. Five things.

Whether women know it or not, I don't give two shits about her job, her education, or her women's studies degree. I don't care how well versed she is in world politics. Just because women find those things attractive in men doesn't mean men find those things attractive in women.

Thin and pretty trumps fat and educated every. damn. time.

[–]vakerr4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

I don't care how well versed she is in world politics.

They don't even get that with their degree. All they're getting is cultural Marxist indoctrination. If anything a girl is better without such a degree.

[–]Locastor197 points198 points  (25 children) | Copy

The entitlement and shaming language apparent in the quotes is just hilariously off-base (as usual):

“It’s very, very depressing,” Crouse told CNSNews.com. “They’re not understanding how important it is for the culture, for society, for the strength of the nation to have strong families.”

Interesting how this could easily be applied to the hamsters who are literally eating shit for $20k/weekend, but Janice Shaw Crouse knows where the blame lies:

“And that means the girls have to live by the guys’ demands. And that means less romance. They don’t date. The girls, I have talked to numerous young women, lament the fact that they don’t have the opportunity to dress up and go out for an event.”

Literal BP lies in that last line, too. I know I'm not alone in this sub when I say I was taught that flowers and dinner and being respectful was the appropriate way to date women, and it led to years of frustration before the manosphere taught me it was actually coffee and cheeky banter and fucking her like a worthless whore that women actually find exciting in a man.

[–][deleted] 27 points28 points  (1 child) | Copy

Well healthy marriages are good for society. The problem is, most current marriages aren't healthy because women are not holding up their end of the deal.

[–]destraht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I live out of the country but I was back for a month over the holidays and got some new divorce stories. One guy got fucked but then said that the judge suddenly started going his way and because reasonable. Funny thing is that he took in his ex-wife because she couldn't pay for shit and he didn't want to see his kids go through craziness and she couldn't +1 with a new cock-wallet. So now he lives in the same house with his ex-wife and it sounds like he is banging her. Whats a little psychotic break.

[–]loddfavne37 points38 points  (9 children) | Copy


Women can shame men, but I've seen more and more men just being able to do what they want without being ashamed for who they are.

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[–]ITravelin_Man 36 points36 points [recovered] | Copy

I see plenty of girls that don't care for their appearance. In public in their pajamas. Really girls.

[–]no_respond_to_stupid11 points12 points  (3 children) | Copy

I am seeing this pajama wearing nonsense in the young too (both men and women). It's bizarre.

[–]Iramohs0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I stopped doing that shit when I was 15. Are the people you're seeing in their 20s?

[–]no_respond_to_stupid0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The young man was anywhere from 18-25. The young lady was probably 25-30.

[–]weirdnamedindian25 points26 points  (5 children) | Copy

I always knew coffee and a cheeky banter got the girlies wet for me. This was me naturally.

What I didn't know was that I had to fuck them like a whore. Thanks to the Manosphere, I now know

[–]AlphaJesus16 points17 points  (2 children) | Copy

You should do rp infomercials brah

[–]weirdnamedindian1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I used to work in media. I just might one day haha

[–]Smooovies1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Hire me when you do! Not even kidding.

[–]TheRedThrowAwayPill2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

"And knowing is 1/2 the battle!"

"G. I. JOEEEE!!"

[–]MGHOW_ATL15 points16 points  (2 children) | Copy

“And that means the girls have to live by the guys’ demands. And that means less romance. They don’t date. The girls, I have talked to numerous young women, lament the fact that they don’t have the opportunity to dress up and go out for an event.”

Last 4 women I asked out said "Yes" to my face but went ghost when I tried to call or text. Doesn't seem like women are pining for opportunities to go out, other than with the predictable top 20% men......

[–]blandboringusername 13 points13 points [recovered] | Copy

the hamsters who are literally eating shit for $20k/weekend[1] ,

Jesus, this made me laugh. $25K, but they have to "receive". Oh boy. Those are some sporty girls.

[–]TRP VanguardJP_Whoregan31 points32 points  (0 children) | Copy

Reminds me of the old joke:

Man: Will you fuck me for $1-million?

Woman: Sure!

Man: OK, will you fuck me for $10?

Woman: No! What do you think I am?!?!

Man: We've already established what you are, darling, now we're just haggling over the price.

[–]Smooovies1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yo, that link has me in tears.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

“It’s very, very depressing,” Crouse told CNSNews.com. “They’re not understanding how important it is for the culture, for society, for the strength of the nation to have strong families.”

FUCK this is hilarious!

They are able to say that kind of things about men and not about women. It's like the video of this woman being harrassed in NY. A few months after there was a video of a man, a jew walking in Paris who was insulted and spit on. Huffington post called BS on the video because we don't see the spit and the video last only 1 and a half minute and we only see a few of the supposed insults BUT they weren't able to draw the same conclusion when it was a woman, hah!

“And that means the girls have to live by the guys’ demands. And that means less romance."

We don't have the power anymore boohoo that MUST CHANGE. i won't even comment on how a relationship when a woman is in control is everything but romantic.

[–][deleted] 120 points121 points  (12 children) | Copy

You could be running a hundred orphanages, schools and businesses, but you'd still be considered "immature" and "adolescent" because you refuse to entertain the idea of rings and diapers.

Immature = whatever women don't like.

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[–]GREF_33 points34 points  (1 child) | Copy

You should have pointed out that 70-80% of divorces are initiated by women, so actually it's the women who are cowardly and lack commitment.

[–]an0n4btc1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

She'd hamster it away into being something wrong with the men.

With exception to on the internet (or for the benefit of an audience) go ahead, otherwise don't waste the effort. Smile, nod and move onto doing, if not currently finding, better things with your time.

[–]2johnnight28 points29 points  (4 children) | Copy

Guys, it's just shaming marketing. It's the same thing as "get a college degree or else you're certified stupid".

I know this propaganda can be annoying, but these people can not do you real harm. They are desperately trying to sell. You just have to say "sorry, I'm not buying it" and be stoic about it.

BTW, I have always wondered, why is it the men, who are traditionally proposing? Marriage is a cost to us and a benefit to women. Why aren't they the active side? Or maybe they are, but covertly.

[–]Tqbfjotlds 22 points22 points [recovered] | Copy

BTW, I have always wondered, why is it the men, who are traditionally proposing? Marriage is a cost to us and a benefit to women. Why aren't they the active side? Or maybe they are, but covertly.

The reason women break down is tears when a man proposes, is because she has been covertly trying to convince him to marry her. When he proposes, it is the successful culmination of her efforts. She feels relieved that her effort has paid off and now she can relax.

[–]BrunoOh15 points16 points  (1 child) | Copy

Why do women smile when they get married? Because they no longer have to give you blowjobs.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

And because they have just won the lottery, gained a new tool. Men are like accessories for women. I swear I know a girl in college who entered a relationship with the alpha of college and she has a picture on facebook where they are together, the guy creepily holding her waist and she has a big smile which says "see girls? I'm the one who posseses him".

We are like fancy cars to them.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

But what she doesnt realize is that she did nothing and her covert mission only worked because of complete luck.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Running from a battle you can't win isn't cowardice, this woman should read the art of war.

Oh wait, she is too busy browsing nexflix.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's true. Men never call other men immature. Now that I think about it. I've only heard that from upset women. Figures

[–]1DRMMR760 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Upvote for correct definition of "immature". Decoding womanspeak becomes a lot easier when you know what definitions they use. Just as the definition of "creepy"=Something a low SMV man does that would be charming, witty, funny, or exciting when a high SMV man does the exact same thing.

[–]NevrEndr57 points58 points  (13 children) | Copy

Its hilarious to me that one of the main reasons for getting married is financial stability. Stability for who? The woman of course.

Financial stability is the reason men should NOT get married.

Source: am married

[–]GREF_10 points11 points  (8 children) | Copy

Yeah pretty much all your money goes out the window and you sink into debt with marriage and especially kids right?

-debt from wedding

-debt from buying your wife the house she wanted

-debt from spending money on vacations and dinners for her

-then huge amounts of debt when the kids come into the picture.

[–]NevrEndr0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

I've managed to stay relatively debt free if you don't count the mortgage. Thing is I could be driving a Mercedes instead of a 10 year old Nissan if I didn't have to plunk down almost 2k a month in childcare expenses. Shit is ridiculous

[–]GREF_0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

plunk down almost 2k a month in childcare expenses

damn, tell me about it. Wife doesn't make any $$ and help out?

[–]NevrEndr0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

To be fair she works full time but makes half of what I do

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'm just playing devils advocate here but does your wife make less than 2000 a month after taxes? Because then the solution seems pretty clear.

[–]GREF_0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

So, that doesn't mean she shouldn't be helping out. She's just as much a part of the team as you are and she should be helping out. Keep her invested in the situation.

[–]1Dark-Ulfberht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Dude, if you're doing all that shit while being married, you're not leading the relationship properly.

I'm married and we have no debt, other than a mortgage I could pay off if I needed to do so.

For a wedding, we just bolted down to the Carribean and got married on the beach. No one was there; it was just us. We then went right into a honeymoon that was a great vacation.

My wife doesn't spend money on stupid shit, ever. She spends less money on food than I do, and cooks most of the time.

We have a kid, and what do you know, the only thing that costs money is part-time daycare so my wife can work. She doesn't need to work; my income is more than sufficient to support us. No, she works because it's a bad habit for anyone to spend their time sitting on the couch and watching Lifetime. 50 years ago, keeping up a house was hard. Modern technology and logistics changed that. It's bad for the psyche to be idle. I know this and so does she.

Look, marriage is a risky proposition. Society has now built in lots of disincentives. However, if you want a family (and I do), then it's still viable. You just have to be damn selective. More importantly, and this is lost on men, marriage doesn't mean you can now be weak. No, it's the exact opposite. A woman will never have respect for a weak man; it is not their nature. If you are married, you must maintain frame even more. Once the cracks begin to show, your marriage is doomed.

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[–]1independentmale5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Financial stability is the reason men should NOT get married.

Ain't that the fucking truth.

When I divorced, the courts gave her a significant portion of my income in child support. About the same as my house payment. Sucks, right? I was pissed until I sat down, did the math and realized it was a good thousand bucks less than she was consistently spending out of the joint account every month. The joke here is when you're divorced she only has access to half your paycheck.

Wives are so insanely fucking expensive, triply so if you have kids with them. Men who haven't been there can't even imagine.

[–]saruin0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I don't think I've ever seen this pointed out but if you're married and decide to get a mortgage on a house, your mortgage rate will be based on whoever has the worse credit score. This makes a world of difference from someone with decent credit opposed to someone with no credit.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This man's still on the plantation! We've gotta get him off!

[–]Fryguy480 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I was raised old fashion, the reason it was called financial stability was: the man worked, the woman paid the bills, did the penny pinching, and did what ever she could to save money (sow, knit, sales at the super market, cook) and of course take care of the kids. That's where it came from , at least to my knowledge.

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[–]Silas_Caliburn38 points39 points  (4 children) | Copy

And 2015 isn't even three months old yet, wait until spring fever kicks in and even more will crumble.

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[–]1DRMMR761 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I have an Army buddy who is in the process of divorcing his cheating shitbag wife (also in the Army*). They're both Guard, but she makes more than he does since she has an active duty job and he's only drilling while working a civilian job on the side. I've known both of them for quite a while and she really played up the whole "I'm the cool chick who's fun to hang out with" game hard, and he as a not-yet Red Piller, fell for it just as hard. Over the past few months I've been introducing him to more and more RP ideas and he's been working hard to improve himself. Got a better job, working out, stopped being a pushover. She freaked out and fought back, trying to threaten him with kicking him out of the expensive high-rise apartment she pays for, thinking he would sit down and shut up. Unbeknownst to her, he's been eating up RP ideas like a starving kid in Africa, and responded with "Ok, cool. I'm moving out". Got his own much less expensive but just as nice apartment, has more time to work, workout, and do his own thing. The first thing he said when we hung out at his new place was "I don't know why I ever gave this up". He's seeing a lawyer this week to go over the divorce. She doesn't know he's divorcing her yet. She still thinks he's his old Beta self who will come crawling back begging for forgiveness. Once the divorce his finalized he's already got a security contracting gig lined up to go back to Afghanistan as a civilian, making about 100k in a year over there. Meanwhile she's going to be a divorced 27 year old with only a few years left of looks she can use to seduce another Beta into being her doormat.

Thankfully they've only been married a little over a year, no significant joint property, and no kids. He also has been scheduling marriage counseling and showing up himself while she blows it off. The counselor has already written a letter stating that he's been trying to save the marriage while she's putting in no effort, so hopefully that will make the divorce even more seamless.

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[–]SgtBrutalisk0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Jews have a daily prayer: "Thank you God for not making me a woman". Couldn't find a confirmation of this in Thorah. SJWs can't touch Jews for this because they are ultimate victims (holocaust).

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Could you share them with us?

[–]GREF_10 points11 points  (5 children) | Copy

Do you have any children?

Are you not worried about being lonely in your 60's?

Would love to hear everything you have to say about your life because I am currently going down the same path (currently 23 yrs/old). I plan on being single and childless forever and I would like more insight on this decision.

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[–]GREF_1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah that's done by shitty people or because they were shitty parents who made their children hate them, so sad.

I am fully aware of that happening. Getting married is no guarantee you'll have company in your old age considering divorces, and how children may need to move away from you.

[–]ElKod0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Honestly, I see myself in a stable position around my 40's, 50's and if I feel the need for more than women, either adopting someone from another country, cloning myself (if it's possible in 20 years..) or simply fostering kids for a few years.

To really be alone, you have to want to be.

[–][deleted] 92 points93 points  (14 children) | Copy

many live in a state of “perpetual adolescence”

Funny how it's alway a female writer that make these kind of conclusion. There is absolutely no self questioning and that's a childish behavior.

up to 60 percent of the student bodies are female. “And that means the girls have to live by the guys’ demands.

That's a situation feminist created themselves. It's a bit easy to blame men for something you've been striking for.

I find that men in the comments are more and more redpilled when it come to this kind of stuff. That's a good evolution. What's worrisome is that the law is evolving to deal with this lack of marriage. There are cases in some countries (Read that about Canada some time ago if anyone can confirm or contest) where living with a woman for a certain amount of time will be assimilated as a marriage. So once you get separated she can ask for alimony and a part of your assets.

[–]2Overkillengine41 points42 points  (0 children) | Copy

That's why you don't cohabitate with them. Leave them no claim of dependency available.

Hell, probably cheaper for most men to live alone than to get suckered into paying the bills for two anyways.

[–]demoneyes90527 points28 points  (0 children) | Copy

These common law marriage laws have been abolished in most states.

The laws were not developed as a way to force men to marry as you state. It has been there since the ancient Greeks. It was setup as an easy way to marry two people without getting official witnesses and having the government to go through all the paperwork and such. This is a time for when government didn't care for who married who as the status of marriage didn't greatly affect how they were seen by the law. Now with tax benefits and the intricate tax laws benefiting marriage, this is no longer the case.

I just want to clarify before people immediately blame "the system" for something that has no malicious cause.

[–]grewapair2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

In the US, most states abolished common law marriage. In most of those that still have it, you have to tell people you're married for it to apply. Living together is usually, but not always required.

[–]1grendalor1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy

It depends on the province in Canada. Some US states also have similar laws, but not all of them -- it's all over the map, really. You have to be informed about what the law is where you are, but really the best choice is never to cohabit with a woman.

[–]TRP VanguardCyralea0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

As far as I'm aware, common-law is the norm all across Canada. The specifics about the number of years is the only variance.

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[–]redzorp1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

A high ranking minister in Quebec recently stated publicly that they will likely change the law soon to make common law the same as marriage, after a supreme court ruling that an unmarried Quebec woman was not eligible for alimony from her common law partner. If you google a bit you could probably find the case.

Bottom line, never marry or live with a chick. Plate 'em well into your 40s and 50s, then slowly ween yourself off of that and find other interests, hobbies and spiritual quests.

[–]like_a_ghost1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I was happy to see the types of responses in the comments as well. Many of them are on point, whether they know about TRP or not.

[–]stealer05171 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'm pretty sure that 90% of the time an adult says that another adult is acting childish it's because they are doing something that they don't like.

Oh your playing video games? Quit being a child. Oh your racing your (motor vehicle)? Why don't you quit being such a child and do something an adult would.

[–]omgimbackagain1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

The absurdity of claiming victim status from 60% of student bodies being female. Even when woman get what they claim to want they are complaining.

[–][deleted] 105 points106 points  (1 child) | Copy

I love how the article blames men for not taking responsibility and self sufficiency. She also assumes that this means marriage. Lol. We are doing just fine lady, without your Bullshit

[–]vakerr10 points11 points  (0 children) | Copy

Men are perfectly self-sufficient without women. It's the women who aren't.

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[–]Shooter-Mcgavinn51 points52 points  (4 children) | Copy

Favorite comment from the comment section:

here's a piece of advice for the guys. No hymen no diamond.

[–]through_a_ways5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

This comment is a real gem.

[–]TempusRerumImperator2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

If she can't give you a traditional wedding night, then why does she want a traditional wedding?

[–]GREF_1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

LOL, I'm gonna tell that to the next girl who gives me a marriage ultimatum.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I know a very conservative girl here in college that wants to wait until she is married to fuck. Hint : half the guys I know have already fucked her in the ass.

So yeah, she still has her hymen. In a way.

No diamond at all would be a far better advice.

[–][deleted] 23 points24 points  (1 child) | Copy

Seventy percent of American females between the ages of 20 and 34 are not in looksmatched long-term relationships, and many live in a state of “perpetual sluttery” with ominous consequences for the nation’s future, says Janet Shawl Krauss, author of “Modesty Matters.”

“Far too many young women have failed to make a normal progression into adult roles of responsibility and self-sufficiency, roles generally associated with marriage and motherhood,” Krauss, the former executive director of the Beverly LaGaye Institute, wrote in a recent Washington Times oped.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

This doesnt have enough upvotes

[–]Imrockbottom16 points17 points  (3 children) | Copy

If men won't sign up for the suicide mission, the state will conscript them. Don't celebrate yet gentlemen. It's a cold world, bring a bomber jacket.

[–]CornyHoosier6 points7 points  (2 children) | Copy

I've tried to tell people this before. Rome used to do it to it's single men as well. I have zero faith that the United States government won't do something similar and target men like that.

[–]lemonparty1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

The authoritarian left will propose the bachelor tax, and religious right will be on board. This will happen by 2030.

[–]SgtBrutalisk1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Or drafting men for marriage. Once selected, he gets the privilege of having his money given to the chosen woman so she can support her lifestyle. You go girl!

[–]slashd15 points16 points  (1 child) | Copy

her beta husband who she never truly loved

Kinda reminds me of Titanic where Alpha Widow Rose dies and joins Jack on the Titanic instead of her husband who she has children and grandchildren with.

[–]Skank_of_America0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That's fucking funny. Thanks for pointing that out.

[–]rockumsockumrobots62 points63 points  (69 children) | Copy

I saw a comment on one of these articles saying:

"It doesn't matter whether you marry or not. Women can still have kids out of wedlock and you will pay for them through taxes and state programs."

This raises an interesting point. It's far less damaging and expensive than marriage, but it can still cause insane taxes like Canada (50% of your income), at the very least, and at worst bankrupt a country leading to massive unemployment and dragging down your quality of life/investments/real estate value. etc.

I think I will travel and make connections in other countries. If things get bad enough, I will just divorce the state.

[–]1oldredder20 points21 points  (58 children) | Copy

Canada taxes are not insane: we get a shit-ton more services for tax-dollars than the USA does, like actual real healthcare instead of health "insurance". My tax rate is under 11% federally and all provincial & federal combined is around 17%. Sure it can be higher if I earn more but same is in the USA or UK. I could get a much lower tax rate in Russia but I doubt I want Russian citizenship.

[–]BlaiseDB22 points23 points  (12 children) | Copy

If you are in Ontario and make $50k then income taxes will be about 17% but CPP is about 5% and EI is another 2%. The thing is, your employer kicks in the same again and then some so arguably, your take home pay is less than 70% of what your boss is paying for you to do the job. Then there is a 13% consumption tax (HST) plus property taxes, gas taxes, sin taxes, and such. One way or another the government is sucking up half your earnings.

[–]AnotherLostCause5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

PST GST property taxes EI premiums fees for gov services. All in it is close to 50% if you make decent money.

[–]AlphaAccountant0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Actually, most taxes are regressive. Meaning that 13% HST is the same on a car for everyone. Except that for someone making 50k$ compared to someone making 150k$, buying the same car, it represents a lot more percentage wise for the first buyer.

All this to say, people have a problem thinking that since the marginal tax rate is near 50% and adding in indirect taxes, everyone half well off is paying nearly 50%. It simply isn't true. And if it is, you need to be talking to a financial advisor or if you're even more well off, to a tax accountant, so that you can plan your finances accordingly.

[–]TempusRerumImperator3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Dont forget protectionist rackets on the local industries and the fact that food is almost twice as expensive in Canada. You could literally make a killing smuggling milk into Canada.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I was speaking with a small business owner, and he was saying he kicks in 10%, on top of what he gives me, in mandatory WSIB insurance...so theres even more than all that

[–]BlaiseDB1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

WSIB actually functions as insurance so it isn't as egregious. And 10% sounds really high unless you are doing construction work or something dangerous.

[–]1oldredder0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

Thankfully I never directly pay property tax, gas tax, insurance, that kind of thing. Ditched the vehicle completely years ago. They aren't able to suck up half my earnings.

[–]ISODAK3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

"directly"... as if that's a meaningful distinction.

Thankfully, dear leader never directly throws me in prison. He sends his goons to do that.

[–]1oldredder-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

property tax: paid by rent to someone else who pays it. Gas/insurance: rolled into the cost of cabs & bus which I pay to use.

None of this really connects to your comment but I get what you're trying to say.

[–]ElKod0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

When the gov decides to give petrol companies tax subsidies and incentives, that comes from our taxes..

[–]1oldredder0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Good point. I had forgotten all about that. The list of corruption and items of theft could fill shelves of encyclopedias in small print.

[–]mdadm-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

One way or another the government is sucking up half your earnings.

Well thats why you sign up a LLC and get a good lawyer and tax accountant. Then everything becomes tax deductable. Internet/phone bills, property taxes, new smartphone, new computer, car lease, fuel, everything is written off against income tax.

[–]football10100 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

How does one go about doing this. Any suggestions for a good lawyer and tax accountant. You could also pm me the response.

[–]2rp_valiant5 points6 points  (11 children) | Copy

we get a similar deal in the UK in that our tax and NHS contributions add up to around 30-40%. It's a bit higher though because we have an epidemic of asylum seeking and benefits claiming, along with a rapidly growing elderly population all demanding state pensions.

[–]1oldredder2 points3 points  (6 children) | Copy

As economies collapse that happens, benefits-claiming on the rise, like disability, etc. America's already seeing many on "disability" magically matching the number who lost employment "insurance" ... more is coming, to where I live too, I'm sure.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

As an amateur student of psychology, with some conviction I can say all the people affected by the new social order that doesn't include nuclear family are susceptible to greater vulnerabilities to mental health and physical ailments. We are not at our best living alone. Which record high number of people are doing. And simultaneously record high numbers of people are self reporting bi-polar(can't self regulate...no duh sherlock) depression(not enough hugs?) Etcetc. While I dont draw causation, I do suggest correlation.

[–]GREF_3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

The problem is that cohabitation/marriage is very dangerous with common law marriage and divorce rape culture and laws. Also note that the rate of suicide & depression for divorced men is very high.

It's a lose/lose situation man, but being alone is a smaller loss.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Furthermore, women place such high demands and high value on even their friendliness that its inaccessible to 90% of men. Meanwhile white knights, betas and pussywhipped, aka most men, are divided and conquered by their pedestalization and competition and adversariality amongst each other. The safe haven of noncompetitive friendly and helpful masculine space and relationship, as well as positive women who altruistically give platonic or sexual friendliness is the holy grail that men must rely on for their social psychosocial development. Its no good to point fingers at men and label them as antisocial and detached from the relational marketplace when the dominant ideology intentionally marginalizes and excludes those same men. Hidden dependencies and false presuppositions invalidate the feminist blame, shame and obligation game. Truly no man is an island, and people only learn what they are shown.

[–]1oldredder-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

None of this makes sense to me. I'm the most stable and happiest I've ever been living alone.

This is probably why I regard psychology as a fake science.

[–]2rp_valiant0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

any country infected with the disease of extreme socialism will have the same issues and I think Canada and the UK are similar in this regard. Not to say that basic socialist concepts like a basic welfare safety net are bad, but the extent that it's gone to in recent times is disgusting. I'm just glad I don't live in Sweden.

[–]Elodrian0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

The pension thing is a genuine entitlement. Elderly people "demand" a pension because they "paid into" a pension fund all the years they were working. I currently pay $315 per month to Canada Pension Plan. When I turn 60 or 65 or whatever, CPP is one government service to which I will feel entitled.
Yes, it's a ponzi scheme, and we may well have to re-examine when people should become eligible for old age pensions if people are going to insist on living to 95.

[–]2rp_valiant2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

the idea of a state pension horrifies me - the UK gov have used it as a slush fund for paying into other projects and it's a prime candidate for mismanagement. Let the private market manage pensions.

[–]Elodrian1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Horrifying or not, I'm compelled to pay into it so I am entitled to a stipend on the other end.

[–]2rp_valiant0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

exactly - you're being forced to pay into something that you will be paid back. I know it's to stop people from being irresponsible, not planning for their futures and then claiming benefits when they hit retirement age, but it's essentially a mandated savings account and that's just prime for corruption.

[–]yummyluckycharms9 points10 points  (17 children) | Copy

A couple of things.....

minimum federal tax rate is 15% and thats for anyone who makes 45k or less. If you make more than that, you pay more. For most middle class families, when you add, federal, provincial, and municipal,your tax rates are indeed over 50%, which is insane.

As a comparison, if I wanted to declare my taxes based on american sourced income, I would pay substatially less taxes, and could use the savings to buy superior healthcare. The more you travel and see the world, the more you see how canadian taxes aren't well spent and are just going to buy more shitty f-35s or pay for gender inclusion programs

[–]1oldredder-1 points0 points  (13 children) | Copy

Thankfully I found a way out of a lot of municipal rates: just pay rent in cash inclusive. Sure, it can change, but otherwise it's pass-thru and may stay lower in change/year than the actual tax/year changes. But 50% is insane only if value is not returned. With healthcare we actually have & other services, it's not insane at all. An American will pay more and receive less. They won't call it taxes because it goes to HMOs, except now for Obamacare which is a bailout to the insurance companies written directly by them & rubber-stamped by US Congress...

Americans do not get superior healthcare. They get expensive healthcare. Not the same thing. That's why so many come to Canada to pretend to be Canadian, or just switch citizenship for good, to get healthcare.

[–]yummyluckycharms-4 points-3 points  (12 children) | Copy

An American will pay more and receive less

Have to disagree mate. While it is true that americans pay many ancilliary fees, when you add those up, its far less and better than what Canadians pay

For example,

Roads in the GTA are absolutely horrible, pit holed monsters that will destroy your BMW/Merc in no time. Ontario drivers pay tax in their gas to ensure that doesnt happen, but the money goes directly to the general coffers instead. American roads, by contrast, are paid for road tolls, and I rarely see a municipal road that would be the equivalent to a GTA/Ottawa/Hamilon one.

Another example - HMO's get a bad rap - and you know what - many are bad for americans who barely make anything. But if you make anything above minimum wage, you can find some pretty decent HMOs. Yes, some americans come to canada for healthcare - but thats because its free, not because its better.

The biggest problem with America is that its a banana republic with massive social inequality caused by a population boom. Since 2000, the US has essentially added 12% to its population (282 mill vs 318). Throw in jobless recovery and a plutocracy, its a bad place for many people. The point of red pill though is to aim for the top 20, not the lower 80%

[–]alpha_n3rd2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

Live the USA, have to swerve around huge potholes everywhere I go. Drove to Boston recently, thought my wheels would get ripped off. Our roads suck balls.

[–]yummyluckycharms0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Fair enough. I go to usually NY, Los Angeles and other cities for work, and if not them, the small middle of no where towns.

[–]alpha_n3rd1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Haven't you ever driven the BQE? Ugh. I also remember some pretty nasty potholes around the triborough bridge, the FDR, plenty of shitty roads in NY

Northeast roads all tend to be shitty due to the winters, plowing, frost heaves, salt, tire chains, etc.

Southwest roads are beautiful by comparison. Long, straight, wide, 75-80mph speed limits, beautiful.

[–]yummyluckycharms0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

New York roads are amazing to be honest. I"ve driven all over the state, and yes, you might find some nasty pot holes, there are far, far more up in the GTA.

And that is with the GTA having less people than the NY area

[–]rabblerabble81 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

LA roads are god awful. America's infrastructure in many parts of the country is crumbling, with no fix in site due to no one wanting to increase spending.

[–]TempusRerumImperator2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy

Exactly, having lived in both countries for long enough, i have to agree with mr. lucky charms here. Canada is a kleptocracy. It has some of the largest natural resource supplies in the world, while having a population the size of 10% of the US. There is NO reason to be paying taxes or to be UNEMPLOYED in Canada right now. They should be paying the citizens to live there with all the exports Canada could have if they bothered to develop properly.

[–]1oldredder0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

Can't argue with your math there. With Canada's natural resources our taxes could be incredibly low and our people incredibly rich. There is some trouble with accessibility to some of those resources, including land to live off of due to terrain & climate but it's been done. City-scale may be a problem, though, in many regions.

Still, just imagine if people actually made safe & efficient nuclear reactors and used waste-heat from that not only to heat roads (no more plowing!) but also bitumen (no more nat-gas burning to melt tarsands for processing!).

The ludicrous things we do and don't do that you just noticed literally is night & day of what Canada's economy is vs what it could be.

[–]TempusRerumImperator1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

Right exactly, im not necessarily opposed to a more social system that Canada seems to enjoy. In contrast to the US, it seems like it is working very well. However, it is very obvious to me that in Canada, it is especially heinous that the government seems to award contracts to these businesses that are raping the environment and stealing the natural wealth of the land, without actually benefiting the average citizen much. Look at the enormous profits oil companies are making out west. None of that is making much of a difference. The difference is going into the pockets of our politicians, some of which seem to be immune to prosecution. I recall faintly our ex prime minister being caught with a load of illegal narcotics on board one of his shipping vessels and he was not charged at all.

[–]1oldredder1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

So true. The Mining Act actually denies you any land rights but the surface - you could have oil or gold under you and NO ownership to it. None. Someone else can claim ownership and destroy everything you have and make all the money plus ruin the environment there for a long time.

I recall faintly our ex prime minister being caught with a load of illegal narcotics on board one of his shipping vessels and he was not charged at all.

Damn. I never even heard of this

[–]1oldredder-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'll have to agree with you on misdirection of the gas tax. And pot-holes.

But if you make anything above minimum wage, you can find some pretty decent HMOs

Really? The story I'm getting is you pay then you get denied care. They invent a reason you're not eligible and now you get nothing but you always have to pay. See in Canada there is no such thing. By all means if you don't have a diagnosis of x you don't get treated for x but you can't be denied care for pre-existing conditions, etc., as it's healthCARE not health INSURANCE.

Throw in jobless recovery and a plutocracy, its a bad place for many people

well that's the origin-reason for everything else including the immigration of a particular group of people, especially those holding positions of high influence and dual-citizenship.

[–]zlex0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

minimum federal tax rate is 15% and thats for anyone who makes 45k or less. If you make more than that, you pay more.

And? In the United States the the lowest tax bracket bumps to 15% at $8.5k and to 25% at $35k. The Canadian bracket stays at 15% until $45k. The US also taxes top earners at 35%, whereas it is only 29% in Canada.

Canada also has a substantially lower Corporate tax rate, 26.3% vs almost 40% in the US.

As an American living in Canada I have not found my total taxation to be insanely different. Of course, any individuals total tax burden depends heavily on where they live in each country and what they earn. The only insane thing associated with my taxes is that the United States forces me to pay them on my Canadian income.

[–]yummyluckycharms0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I dont want to drag this out longer than it should be. The purpose of my post was to correct the inaccuracies in the Op's post, but your post brings out another wrinkle in the discussion

The difference between the states and canada isnt just federal tax rates, but also the difference between provincial / state and what constitutes your income (salary, dividends, etc) as these are all taxes differently. In general and overall, the us taxes individuals lower, and its no coincidence that many millionaires live in florida which has no state tax. Lastly, corporate tax rate doesnt apply to you because you aren't a corporation, and thus is a quite irrevalent to the convo

But you are right about the insanity of usa taxing people based on citizenship.

[–]destraht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I don't mind living in shitty places (with smart and sexy girls who have only ever lived in shitty little places) and I pretty much just like to click on the Internet, work out, drink beer, talk about interesting stuff and have sex so EE is really good for that. I don't think that I can look at the same concrete walls 365 days a year so I plan to own a few different shitty little places and then with hosteling and that sort of thing its easy to change it up after a 12 hour train ride. Also I don't care at all about cars anymore so that is a big relief. To each their own.

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[–]1oldredder1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I look at the net values, not the brackets. I never cared about brackets, just the values that sum up when it's all done. What was deducted came out every pay rather than me holding it off and paying it in a lump sum. If I don't count EI and CPP as tax then it's not 15% - but if I admit I'll never fucking see that money then it is, really, then we're over 15%.

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[–]1oldredder-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's a habit. Like what the cost of investing in shares or options are, there's a lot of variability based on trading activity and number of shares or options but over-all you can figure out a break-even and even with currency exchange work out roughly the real cost-in per share/option and real break-even later.

Which I do all in spread-sheets so I largely forget the "nominal price" I paid before exchange & fees because... that's not the real price. I work it out before buying, I estimate slippage with time vs what I'm willing to put in for a limit-order, work out my real cost basis, real profit target's price and send it off to execute and check the numbers vs my sheets and time elapsed.

[–]AnotherLostCause3 points4 points  (5 children) | Copy

That is impossible when the US prints the reserve currency. Canada has to produce to spend America just creates a few trillion out of thin air. It is tragic to think about how prosperous Canadian men would be if governments didnt steal half of the fruits of their labour and squander that wealth to buy votes.

[–]1oldredder7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

reserve currency is only a temporary protection. Once upon a time the UK Sterling pound was the reserve but now it isn't. America can collapse because of abusing the reserve currency.

Canadian votes aren't bought nearly as much as Americans... don't kid yourself.

[–]AnotherLostCause1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yes they will lose the reserve currency status but I was speaking about the here and now. I dont think I suggested that Canada had more or less vote buying. I just expessed my disgust at slimy politicians robbing hard working men. Oh and I forgot sin taxes gas taxes inflated prices for government electricity fees for old tires anyway. God im giving myself a hwadache.

[–]1DRMMR760 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

It can't last. The US is just doing the same thing a financially inept person does when they take out a dozen credit cards to pay for shit without having a job to pay the eventual credit card bills, just on a much larger scale. The bills will have to be paid sooner or later. It's just the next few generations that are going to do the paying. And it's going to be very difficult. You cannot create something out of nothing forever and expect it not to fall apart eventually.

[–]AnotherLostCause1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I dont think it is generations away. I doubt it is 14 years away.

[–]1DRMMR760 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Agreed. I'm 31 and I will be absolutely shocked if the world and life I live in when I'm 60 looks anything like now.

Gain skills. Learn to rely on yourself. Save your money and resources, preferably in something like gold or silver that has always been worth something for all of human history. The safety nets and safe society we all take for granted are all on their last legs. People alive right now will be alive when it falls apart. Make sure you're one of the ones who stays alive.

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[–]1oldredder-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

So what you're saying is you're sore you actually get nothing for your taxes by not being Canadian. Being an American sucks but world-empire mafia-military requires a lot of slaves to keep it operating.

[–]ExBABYYy0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

As a Dutch, im in the 49% tax scale and I make 40k Eur a year

[–]1oldredder-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

and what do you get for the services that are a part of that?

Let's keep in mind this is the government that for a very, very long time has taken on the sea itself to keep itself some dry land and that's not a cheap/free endeavour.

[–]Redpillc0re6 points7 points  (5 children) | Copy

How is it not worse to pay taxes? At least with a family you get something back. These taxes will be absolutely 0 benefit to you

[–]Elodrian1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

These taxes will be absolutely 0 benefit to you

All right, but apart from sanitation, medecine, education, public order, irrigation, roads, the fresh water system and public health, what has paying taxes ever done for us?

[–]Kill_Your_Ego7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

Medication and public health for obesity and single mothers, education for the children of all the single mothers, twice as much sanitation, irrigation, roads, and fresh water because men aren't husbands anymore so there are two homes. One with the single mother and one with the man who, in a properly functioning MMP, would be a father and husband.

I don't want to pay taxes to support single mothers and their bastard children.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Do you understand what cuckolding is?

[–]2johnnight0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

It won't happen on a wide scale. The taxes needed for this would be absolutely oppressive and create a strong incentive to leave the country.

In a sense those taxes and the income redistribution happens inside the family, where the husband earns money and transfers his buying power to the wife and the kids. What was it, 80% of family spending is controlled by women? You can't have 80% taxes for everyone.

Right now every western government has two roles: social security and crowd control. The kind of enforced wealth transfer already happens, on a smaller scale, but you get the carrot of hoping that when you are old, it will be your turn to benefit from it.

Also, there is the divorce/alimony/CS industry, which keeps on growing. It kind of already does what we are describing here, but it is based strongly on the moral claim, that men have a responsibility for their own children, which responsibility they themselves mostly accept.

An institutionalized transfer towards strangers' children would would require more taxation than anyone can accept. We bear those costs right now, but only because they are "our" costs, we made the decision to have those children and the costs are a part of our personal budget. It's like paying taxes to ride free buses or buying tickets on private-operated buses. The second case makes us feel richer, even though the cost might be the same. Communism makes people feel worse.

[–]rockumsockumrobots0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

you can't have 80% taxes for everyone.

Good point. Even if you factor inflation, state tax and municipal tax, it could never get anywhere near 80% or there would be a mass exodus.

So, who knows, mgtow might just be the "marriage strike" we need to swing back the pendulum.

[–]bloodshot_eyes14 points15 points  (1 child) | Copy

“And it’s doubly terrible because the colleges now are predominantly female. So you have some – up to 60 percent of the student bodies are female. And almost all of them are more than 50 percent female. And so the ratio [of] male/female is out of sync.

“And that means the girls have to live by the guys’ demands. And that means less romance. They don’t date. The girls, I have talked to numerous young women, lament the fact that they don’t have the opportunity to dress up and go out for an event.”

These two paragraphs are really telling. First, it is clear that the author believes that only college-educated men are worthwhile. In other words, a prerequisite for any social interaction with a woman should be a college degree. Hypergamy in action.

Also, despite the overwhelming evidence to the contrary, these "numerous young women" still believe that it is the duty of men to provide them with "events". Once again, the passive female, expecting a strong yet loyal male to be bewitched by her beauty and engage in an outrageous campaign of extravagant gestures to "win her love". Life is not a rom-com, ladies.

Slut culture demonstrates the complete lack of imagination of women. When placed into an environment where she must win his affections, her only notion is to open her legs.

[–]TheWorldToCome0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah u can see it all the time on online dating sites "Must have a college degree."

Ok, guess that means I'm un dateable, even tho I make over 100K cause I skipped college and started my own business.

Honestly college degrees don't mean that much anymore. It really angers me that people put so much emphasis on them, I would think ur income matters more than some degree on a piece of paper.

[–]1raceAround126[🍰] 14 points15 points  (0 children) | Copy

When articles like this come up, it sends chills down my spine. I was locked in to a 10 year relationship, 8 years sexless. Utterly sexless. The biggest case of dead bedroom you ever saw. Any time I complained I was shamed from all angles even, finally, by my own Mother whom I haven't spoken to since January '14.

If I'd had given in and married her, I have no idea what hellish mess I would be in now. I think I probably would have ended up diving off a tall building and shaking Death's hand on the way down!

I reacted like a firework at the end, escaped with most of my finances (we were not married) and have lived the successful single bachelors existence ever since.

While I can accept that my relationship was utterly toxic and possibly unusually so, there is just no way I could trust another woman at all. Not even slightly. Even at the prospect of cohabiting I would move the fuck on.

Women just are not worth it. Fuck any girl that's up for it and leave it at that. Women wanted their big fancy successful careers? Then bravo, you now get paid more than men. You don't need men to make you happy? Don't worry, we're not coming back!

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[–]lemonparty9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

And traditionally marriage was a religious thing, not a thirty thousand dollar leaving-the-carousel-party for for an ex-slut. Marriage actually existed as a construct to build a better society by countering what we know as AFBB. Marriage gave the bottom 80% of men access to a chaste bride whose values dictated being a nurturing mother to your kids, and a supportive wife who respected you as head of household.

We've devolved back to our baser human nature. Red Pill isn't a philosophy to me. Red Pill is just making sure young men know the rules of the new game, so they don't get suckered.

[–]bearmorgan14 points15 points  (0 children) | Copy

That is actually pretty true. Feminists believe that religion supports the patriarchy.

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[–]Iramohs1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Most religion clearly define gender roles and how each sex plays into them. Most people look at Mormons and wonder how girls can drop out of college to raise their kids at age 19, but their divorce rates are much lower.

[–]VeryEuropean10 points11 points  (7 children) | Copy

Alright I have a question. I'm still a bit of a red pill novice so please don't be to hard on me but then again I have taken the pill so be as hard as you can.

Anyway, most people here are against marriage and I can see why but what should the modern men do if he wants to have children someday?

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

That's what surrogates are for.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Dude, having children, and getting married have nothing to do with one another. Its not like after the wedding the magical kid doors open up and babies now become possible. Look at all the rachet hoes out there with 15 kids. A baby is simple Biology.

[–]GREF_11 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy

Adopt as a single parent or pay for a surrogate mother. This way you have sole custody over the child, and you're not vulnerable to being divorce raped or having the courts take your child away.

Or you can use your RP knowledge and Vet the fuck out of your future wife so hopefully your marriage doesn't fail. This is still really dangerous though.

[–]dntdxxmbr2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

You don't have to sign a government contract in order to live together and have kids... but beware of common law marriage.

[–]2johnnight1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I have two friends who have children without marriage, cohabitation only.

Case 1: he makes a lot of money and she stayed with him past her 30s. She knew that jumping ship at that point was the worse alternative for her, so she accepted the situation. Now that they have kids, she became less subservient.

Case 2: he makes a lot of money, she was his previous gf, she hooked up with him for sex and gave him a baby accident ("whops, my birth control must have failed!"). He refused to marry on principle, but wanted to be the father.

So the strategy is as follows: get a gf, string her along as long as possible, use her in her 20s, push the decision to marry into the future, claim that you are financially and career wise not ready. The longer you wait in this situation, the stronger your power grows and the more she loses the power of her youthfulness and beauty and loses alternatives.

At some point she will either: jump ship to a guy who offers marriage, get pregnant from you or she will agree to having kids without marriage.

Having a good career is necessary for this strategy: you have to be the better option than whatever the alternative for her is: have status and money. If you are poor, she will abort your baby.

It's Machiavellian and deceitful, but I see no better solution. If anyone wants to attack my morality here, I'd like to point out that in case 2 the girl was the deceitful spermjacker, but she bluffed against a more strong willed player.

[–]DogePerformance16 points17 points  (34 children) | Copy

50% never married seems high

[–][deleted] 38 points38 points | Copy

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[–]HAMMURABl28 points29 points  (4 children) | Copy

25% is a very very optimistic number that will never marry.

keep in mind that these researchers have no clue what is currently going on in the minds of the 18-30 y/o. a large segment of this group has already decided to not marry, yet researchers will simply assume the age of first marriage simply went up a bit.

2005-2015 has been a massive change in the mating market, which due to its inertia of choices takes a while to be reflected in statistics. the 25 y/o not deciding to marry will first be noticed in the statistics when he is 35.

[–]i2amahandmodel1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

All of my good male friends except for one will never marry or have kids. The one is a SJW but a good guy. He makes a ton of money but has a stage 1 clinger latched to him. They are all 30.

[–]archaeopter0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

When I was in college, none of the guys I knew were ever going to marry. Now I'm in the 35-54 bracket. Take from that what you'd like.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Times have changed, though. When I was young (I'm in that bracket too, toward the higher end) there was still enough cultural inertia people got married. Because that's what you did. You might decide not to propose to a particular girl, but the expectation was you'd eventually get married unless there was something wrong with you.

I don't think that's true any more. Women are delaying marriage to the point they're no longer a net positive as a wife, and that cultural inertia is gone, so men are more likely to think things through and realize they're getting a raw deal.

[–]BlaiseDB8 points9 points  (5 children) | Copy

I'm 48, never married with no kids. My one sister is divorced, the other is on her third marriage, my mother is on her third marriage and my brother is tying the not in a few months.

My present girlfriend is 26, a college graduate, Chinese, good family, low notch count: that's about as low risk as it gets if this moves forward like I want it to.

[–]GREF_0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Sounds nice, so at 48 are late twenties girls easy to come by?

Are there any plans for kids this late or no?

[–]BlaiseDB1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I am in an odd situation as I live in China. The best before date on women here is 27. My colleagues know I am never married and without kids and they set me up with friends of friends, generally women between 28 and 33. One younger friend - 23 - said she would introduce me to her single friends if the river runs dry.

I am getting back into shape and paying more attention to my looks so I can usually pass for 10 or so years younger. Meanwhile, although their best before date is 27, by Western standards Chinese women do not hit the wall until several years later. I have dated 35 and 40 year olds who had better bodies than most American teenagers.

When I lived near Shanghai I could have a new date every weekend from OKCupid if I wanted to, again late 20s to early 30s, but I am in a different city and online women (who speak English) are few and far between, although that is how I met my present girlfriend.

I am no Chad AsianSlayer bedding dozens of women year or anything. Chinese girls do not tend to be easy. There isn't much of a cock carousel here. You have to invest time in wooing them. For me, the investment is worth it.

I haven't discussed kids with my girlfriend as we are early in the relationship. For me it is an issue because of my age. I will be in my 60s before the kid is a teenager and dead about the time they crest 30. My father died relatively young, when I was 43 and that was no fun.

But in the meantime, I will just enjoy myself.

[–]GREF_0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Thank you for such a great response, also cute picture she looks lovely.

[–]BlaiseDB0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I think so, which is why I want to hold onto her. Of course, she has issues which may be why some Chinese guy didn't snap her up in college or thereafter. Then again, part of that might be because she is 5'9" (I'm 5'10") putting her in the top 1% of Chinese girls and taller than about 3/4s of Chinese guys.

[–]1dongpal0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

it's weird to see people marry after one divorce. my mother divorced once and never wants to marry again, I thought everyone see's it the same ..

[–]no_respond_to_stupid0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Those are shitty statistics for getting a good idea of what is happening, IMO. I'd rather see a graph of marriage % by age rather than these arbitrary made up age brackets. The change could be mostly in a delay in marriage beyond 25 years of age as opposed to truly fewer men ever getting married.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

This is a better presentation of the data.

[–]Makes_U_Mad0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Read the footnotes. The first one states "after 1999 single includes divorced."

[–]1oldredder6 points7 points  (2 children) | Copy

Is it? 38 & single here but more importantly not a parent either. Some guys are single but actually tied down in time & finances with a child with some past woman.

[–]GREF_0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

How are you enjoying being single and no kids?

Also, are you worried about being lonely in your elderly years (60+)? or no?

[–]LugerDog6 points7 points  (11 children) | Copy

Kinda does but maybe he's right and men are getting smarter.

[–]DogePerformance16 points17 points  (9 children) | Copy

27 and single here. Go us

[–]LugerDog20 points21 points  (8 children) | Copy

30 single and no kids here. I went for an education over a divorce and a kid or two.

[–]RosewoodPill9 points10 points  (4 children) | Copy

31, single, no kids. The world is mine, boys.

Edit: Currently talking to "18" women at the same time. Being very picky about who I will stick my dick into as well.

[–]fuck_da_haes7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

30, no kids, few plates ... I can't be more happy. And its fun when people around me try to shame me to marry & have kids, no way jose :)

[–]GREF_0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

That sounds awesome, what are their ages?

[–]RosewoodPill1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I couldnt tell you. One is 18 and one is 22 and I'm fucking the 22 year old. Most are from online dating and that's how to get your #'s up quick.

[–]Kill_Your_Ego0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

That's the way to do it. I mean I would love to be a father and spent a great deal of my life preparing myself for that role. Unfortunately men can't be fathers anymore. My ex wife is still a mother but I am now just a paycheck. And if I don't pay they will put my in jail. So more like a slave.

I have saved up the money for my son to get a vasectomy when he is old enough though. And prepared an entire plan for teaching him red pill truths about life.

[–]bama79rolltide0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Good luck with the vasectomy. A lot of doctors wont do it on young men though. I'd really like to see how this pans out.

[–]Kill_Your_Ego0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I will doctor shop for him. No reason for him to be a victim of paternity fraud or have some slut stop taking her birth control to turn him into a slave. I've seen that happen and those guys are miserable in their marriages.

[–]GREF_0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

As someone who is 23 and about to graduate college and plan on remaining single, I'm loving these comments I have a bright future. =D

[–]HeinousFu_kery7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

They'll be left helpless as they watch their looks fade, the attention they used to receive dwindle to trickle, as they pop anti-anxiety and antidepressants down their pelican gullets while reminiscing about their golden days and finally coming to terms that they are nothing more than a shell of their former self.

The solution seems simple. Find women who don't depend on their looks and who are responsible for their own lives and their own states of mind. Hint: they won't be the hootchie chicks you're looking at in bars; they'll be the ones who are out kicking ass at something else. They're worth finding.

[–]1KissTheBridesmaid7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

The article touches on the real issue several times, almost accidentally, but still does not show a true understanding why men are opting out not just of marriage but out of education and the general lifestyle required for matrimony. Still, these are the first signs that the Misandry bubble is floating dangerously close to a sharp object.

Edit: And yet, auto-correct is still underlining the word misandry...

[–]Upvote_To_The_Left8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

it seems to me that the biggest thing stopping guys from marrying women is the fact that women in their 20s are just no longer interested in marrying guys. with feminism and the "you go girl!" mentality women see men as just toys and distractions instead of possible husbands. I think a ton of men like myself simply find it EXTREMELY frustrating to meet and talk to women today. I live in New York. the dating mecca of western society in a lot of ways. and I will say this.

Unless you have a heart as cold as winter, as black as tar, and as hard as stone, you will get fucking destroyed by women. seriously, i have seen so many "nice" well mannered, good normal guys get emotionally fucked by women who would otherwise be in their league. I am talking about the rejections, the games, the flakes, the cheating, the disrespect, etc etc

the traditional ways of courtship simply dont work for guys anymore, chivalry is disgusting to women today, so is honer and honest. they fucking loath it. Probably because these traits allow one to show weakness, and women are disgusted by weakness.

That's not to say guys are good and women are bad. But the traditional lessons that guys have learned about courting women are blowing up in their faces, and in tern it's creating a ton of guys who are simply fed up and would rather fuck a few random chicks then try to chase a potential wife. and thats not even going into how the judicial system will fuck a guy over in case of divorce.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

"Feminism was supposed to bring women happiness,” Crouse said. “But the research shows that women today are much more unhappy then they have been in the past."


[–]fadetoblack100426 points27 points  (56 children) | Copy

I'm 28, married. Of my core group of about 15 guy friends I hang out with on a regular basis, all within 2 years of me age-wise, one other guy is married. The rest are either single or in long term relationships, split about 75/25 towards single. None are engaged. I think guys are certainly being far more careful about who they marry in this day and age, but I'm expecting most of them to settle down over the next 5-7 years and get married. There's a few who won't, but most will. I think the 25% number mentioned in the article is about right.

American society, as a whole, is moving more towards less formal relationships and parenthood options. It's interesting, the current generation of twenty-somethings seems less oriented towards serious relationships than other generations, and I don't think it's because of external societal pressures, but more so a result of financial prudence.

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[–]fadetoblack10047 points8 points  (54 children) | Copy

Learning what? Divorce isn't the inevitable end point of marriage. Marry a college-educated, 25 or older woman, and your odds of divorce in the first 20 years of marriage are somewhere around 25%-30%. Not college educated? That jumps to 50%. If it's not her first marriage, I believe it's 60% of second marriages that end in divorce, with similar numbers for third, fourth etc.

You can further break down these numbers by race. 30% of Asian, 47% of Hispanic, 48% of white, and 60% of Black women experience an "interruption" (defined as divorce, separation or death) in the first 20 years of marriage, regardless of education level. However, these numbers are undoubtedly skewed a bit due to education levels (25% of women with a bachelor's degree who marry for the first time over the age of 25 end up being divorced, regardless of race) varying so widely between races, so you can stack the table in your odds if you are very selective with the women you get serious with.

Long story short, being selective and picking a smart, educated and financially independent woman after a long vetting period (I dated my wife for 6.5 years, lived with her for 2 years) usually leads to a happier marriage with increased financial and emotional stability. If you want to have the best odds of success, marry an asian woman, 25 or older, with a bachelors degree and a good job. Odds of divorce appear to be lower than any other set of circumstances.

I know marriage isn't for everybody, but you guys go a little overboard with the criticisms of marriage. I control the finances in our relationship, and while she doesn't make as much as I do, she contributes even amounts to our bills, straight across the board. She does her part and makes sacrifices where they are necessary to carry her weight. You find a smart, sexy lady like that, you'd be crazy to not at least consider marriage if things are stable for an extended period of time.

TLDR; Minimize risk, marry at 25 or older, make sure it's her first marriage, and marry a college educated, intelligent woman with a good job. Treat it like a business decision and odds are that you will be fine.

[–][deleted] 24 points25 points  (22 children) | Copy

You control the finances now, but if she wants out she gets half.

As a business decision what attracted you to it? Saving a few thousand dollars while gambling your life savings at a 30% risk of losing half? What about being married makes it worth the risk? Not attacking, I'm genuinely curious.

[–]fadetoblack10043 points4 points  (17 children) | Copy

You control the finances now, but if she wants out she gets half.

As a business decision what attracted you to it? Saving a few thousand dollars while gambling your life savings at a 30% risk of losing half? What about being married makes it worth the risk? Not attacking, I'm genuinely curious.

The reality is that if she leaves (and I really, really doubt that) she won't get half because a lot of my assets (40-50%) are tied up in... ah, non-traditional investments and it's very easy to obfuscate the value of them or just flat-out get rid of them for cash and hide said cash. She has no idea what my hobby makes me in terms of additional income and assets acquired at little to no cost. What she knows probably accounts for 1/10th of the actual value of what I have. At any rate, I doubt she will leave me, she's not that stupid and is aware of the repercussions of divorce, financially.

I also forced a prenuptial agreement since I live in a community property state and at the time of our marriage, made about 2x what she did. It took a lot of work for me to get her to agree to it, but once I laid out how it works (basically short-term protection against either party teabagging the other) she agreed to sign it.

Honestly, looking at it from a business perspective, it's not quite that bad. She makes less than me... for now. About 75% of what I make. She's got her own business that's beginning to flourish, and if that takes off, she could easily be making 6 digits in 5-6 years. Additionally, she's far more frugal than I am. I like nice clothes, a luxury car, eating out, drinking... she doesn't give a shit about any of that. She had no major debts besides $3k in CC debt (gone now) and I was carrying $30k in student loan debt and another $5k from running my side business/hobby deal.

She also comes from a fairly wealthy family, so when her parents pass on, there's a multi-million dollar estate being split three ways. Her parents love me, too, they bring me on their awesome vacations (Italy, Turks and Caicos, Belize, Germany this year) free of charge... I just pick up a few dinner tabs and they're happy. It's really a great situation to be in if you can find a great woman with a great family. Of course your odds of finding an attractive, down-to-earth and intelligent woman from a wealthy family are slim to none, but if you do...

The way I see it is there is maybe a 30% chance I lose a good chunk of my wealth (say, 35%) and there's a 70% chance I lose nothing, get the benefits of marrying into a great family, and a really nice inheritance down the road, which should enable us both to retire young (our goal is 55) and travel.

I also get the benefits of her fantastic cooking skills. I'm not a bad cook, but she blows me out of the water. She gets me to the gym, keeps me in shape. She pushes me to better myself, to work harder, supports my dreams and ventures. When it comes to looks, she's at least a solid 8/8.5, and I'm probably a 6.5-7 (It's all about confidence!) so the table is tilted in my favor there as well. Of course there's tradeoffs (she hates cleaning, likes animals a bit too much, and is kind of a hoarder, just to pick a few things out) but if the benefits outweigh the negatives, and you want to make it work, you can.

So, ya know, marriage can work... be picky, find a great woman with a great situation who really loves you... Work hard to ensure your relationship continues to flourish, and the benefits are excellent.

Of course none of that is easy to find or hold onto, but if you can, go for it. Just use your head and make sure you have the risk tolerance to handle it. And of course, take things slow... vet the shit out of your candidate. Know everything about them before you agree to tie your financial future to them.

EDIT: Just wanted to add that if she divorces me, I doubt I'd get remarried. No way I could do any better than this.

[–]RosewoodPill8 points9 points  (7 children) | Copy

What SHE knows about your finances don't matter. You will have a court order to provide all of your financial income or you will get even further fucked.

[–]fadetoblack10044 points5 points  (6 children) | Copy

That's the great thing about cash. Its not easily traced.

[–]RosewoodPill2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Sounds like you're a smart guy, and being here you're already ahead of most.

[–]SunshineBlotters7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

But the fact that he has to do all these acrobatics just in case, only proves our point about marriage.

[–]destraht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

People who trust their government are preprogrammed to be screwed by their wife and then the government gets a taste.

[–]Kill_Your_Ego-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Cash is the only way to hide this stuff. Cash or gold or silver. And never let her know about it. It's crazy how much more successful your marriage can be if you lie to your wife. Or cheat on her. Or hey go dark triad and gaslight her. If I ever get into an LTR again I'm going to gaslight the fuck out of my woman.

[–]bustanutmeow3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

You need to elaborate on that hobby of yours. Im interested.

[–]GREF_1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Growing and selling pot I bet lol.

[–]RosewoodPill4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

she's at least a solid 8/8.5, and I'm probably a 6.5-7 (It's all about confidence!)

so.. what you're saying is, you won her? This has disaster written all over it.

[–]1oldredder3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

Picky is right. So far never had a woman cook for me. I question which of them ex's actually even know how.

[–]fadetoblack10049 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

Terribly underrated skill amongst women these days. It's unfortunate that such skills have kind of fallen by the wayside in a society where women work full-time. Especially given how easy it is to learn the basics of being a decent cook.

[–]Tman56912 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

If you can't cook, you can't look after yourself. I consider it a basic life skill.

[–]Risky_Clicks_NSFW0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

So she is the red pill person in your marriage interesting. Thanks for the insight.

[–]destraht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The reality is that if she leaves (and I really, really doubt that) she won't get half because a lot of my assets (40-50%) are tied up in... ah, non-traditional investments and it's very easy to obfuscate the value of them or just flat-out get rid of them for cash and hide said cash.

I love this. Hiding shit from government is the same as hiding it from your wife. Hell, I wouldn't mind paying 15-20% flat tax and then being able to keep my money and to be extremey secure in it but certainly not paying 50% (after all of the dings) and then having zero security in the piddlings that I get to keep.

[–]TheRedThrowAwayPill-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy


That's not a unicorn! You married a tranny!


[–]archaeopter-1 points0 points  (3 children) | Copy

You control the finances now, but if she wants out she gets half.

This is the point of a prenupital agreement. Just agree to divide assets based on division of reasonably expected income. If a woman won't sign it, leave.

[–]1grendalor2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

It's worth a try, but if the judge doesn't like the result, they will throw it out. Family courts are courts of equity.

The most likely case of an enforceable pre-nup relates to pre-marital assets that are fully disclosed pre-marriage and are kept segregated from marital assets. That will get enforced most of the time. But agreements about how to divide marital assets which work to screw the woman are much tougher to enforce -- the judge will often not enforce them for equitable reasons.

[–]archaeopter-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

[–]1grendalor0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Not sure what you're asking -- those were all court orders where the court ordered the higher earning spouse to pay a lot in the settlement. I only saw one mention of a pre-nup (the first case), and it looks like the ex-husband was able to contest it and set aside some of it due to the payment she made. So I'm not sure what you're asking.

In any case, if both individuals are very high net worth, a court is more likely to enforce a pre-nup as a business deal, because no-one is really "getting screwed" -- everyone is wealthy, and it's a business deal. If you're a celebrity marrying another very wealthy person, then I guess you should approach it that way. If you're more garden variety (which includes ordinary donks earning 6 figures), the courts are stricter in terms of enforcing a pre-nup that would leave the lower earning spouse in a much worse financial situation after the divorce. It has to do with the facts and circumstances, because a court of equity looks at the circumstances and the result of enforcement and decides if it is fair to enforce. That's more often going to be the case where everyone's rich anyway, than it is in the more typical case where enforcement would create real financial hardship for the spouse who waived her rights to marital distribution in a pre-nup.

As always, you need to know the laws of your state. I'm a lawyer, but I'm not an expert in family law in all 50 states, and certainly not for any place outside the US. It's best to speak with a family lawyer in your own place of residence to understand how the courts in your state generally handle and enforce pre-nups in order to get a better sense of what is feasible for you personally and what is not.

[–]RosewoodPill10 points11 points  (5 children) | Copy

Talk to us when you're 48, buddy. You have a 50% chance of having your wife divorce rape you, you are not a special snowflake. You can write rebuttals till you're blue in the face, doesn't change reality. Maybe out of your 15 friends, you are one who jumped the gun.

[–]Lipophobicity4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Flipping a coin to see if you'll end in financial ruin is a bad bet. Also, how many of the 50% that do not end in divorce have a miserable man living with regret?

[–]CockBruises3 points4 points  (12 children) | Copy

All of these things are just correlations with the one thing that matters. Optimize everything and you still lose 25% of the time.

[–]1oldredder2 points3 points  (10 children) | Copy

wrong: http://www.avvo.com/legal-guides/ugc/marriage-divorce-statistics

none of these correlate to partner count and now we can prove it.

Long story short: if a woman wants to cheat or mis-spend my money one of us is going to choose the divorce button. That, known in advance, shows me all I need to know to not get married.

Her past partner count isn't the factor: her desire to fuck another man while wearing a wedding ring I paid for is, and to spend us into bankruptcy just to get fancy shoes and purses.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy

I see nothing there that talks about partner count?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

was going to say the same thing. Im not sure why oldredder thinks that article proves anything regarding sexual partners.

There is clearly a correlation between the two.

[–]CockBruises-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

I stand corrected. I'd always thought that past promiscuity was a predictor of future promiscuity.

[–]wuy32 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Great stats/information and good advice here folks. For the non-supermen amongst us, just focus on what traits are important to you in a girl. Those that go chasing 10/10s at all costs will find the girl probably lacking everything else (especially loyalty). I made big sacrifices in the looks department, but you can bet I got a good deal in the rest of the package. Once you grow up, you'll realize looks aren't even that important. And I agree definitely about the vetting, minimum 3 yrs living together before marriage. If somehow both of you still love being around eachother post-3-years, then it'll probably work out well from then on out.

[–]1independentmale-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

If you wanna be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.


[–]mdadm1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Treat it like a business decision and odds are that you will be fine.

Fantastic advice.

Not just marriage though. Everything. Every time you make a decision take a step back and evaluate what sort of returns your investment of time/money will bring you.

[–]1independentmale1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Lots of people piling on to you, but I wanted to thank you for your post. It absolutely is possible to keep a marriage together forever. Yes, your odds are shit and it's a lot of hard fucking work, but for those who succeed the rewards are often immeasurable. Mad respect for the couples who can pull it off.

[–]Kill_Your_Ego2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

This is just retarded advice.

Do you think everyone can get the statistically best option? Hell why don't we all just marry highly religious virgins who are ten years younger then us, and who have a college degree. Whose own family is not broken and who has no friends nor friends of friends who have or will get divorced. Oh and they are asian as well.

Then there is only a 25% chance of being totally ass raped by a "court" of family equity and turned into a child support slave on an imputed income by threat of life in debtor's prison!

Hey guys only a one in four chance of having your life destroyed because you were lucky enough to find the perfect statistical match! Sign up here!

[–]a_scourge1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Marry a college-educated, 25 or older woman, and your odds of divorce in the first 20 years of marriage

Ahhh so you get 20 years before getting divorce raped. Sounds like a good deal to me! 20 years is an eternity isn't it.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

You are blind to reality. People who marry today will have close to 100% divorce rate.

[–]FaustoRMD18 points19 points  (7 children) | Copy

The elites are destroying the family: they are winning. You thing the marriage laws, the feminist movement and the almost no revelance of paternity has for the judges is casuality?

They are winning. The elites known the nature of women. They want us divided, dependents of the state. Marriage is the foundation of a strong society. Family is everything, and they want to destroy it.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Don't say marriage, say LTR based on the conditions defined by the man and accepted by the woman, which has nothing to do with marriage 2.0

[–]Kill_Your_Ego6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy

It's not marriage it's a patriarchy that creates paternal kin selection. This allows men to be fathers and patriarchs which causes them to invest into the future. Modern men, us, don't have the safeguards in place to create paternal kin selection. So we can't really be fathers/husbands. We can be boyfriends though. Even if we get married we are really just boyfriends because the woman can kick us out at any time for any or no reason. And if you get married you really just signed a contract to give away your shit. You don't actually get anything you don't have anyway.

So we have no paternal kin selection right now because the patriarchy has been destroyed. Without paternal kin selection men have great incentive to maximize their boyfriend skills, like getting ripped and learning game, and not their father skills, like making tons of money and buying a big house.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Far too many young men have failed to make a normal progression into adult roles of responsibility and self-sufficiency

On the contrary, I think. Many men have their own jobs and pay their own bills, they just don't feel like throwing it all away to get balls deep in a relationship which is rigged against them.

They’re not understanding how important it is for the culture, for society, for the strength of the nation

Men are considered disposable. Cannon fodder. If a man is having a dire moment in his life, maybe even homeless, living off welfare and food stamps, people say all kinds of shit about and to him. Why would he give two shits about culture, society and the strength of the nation, when all of those things are ready to crucify him the moment he slips up?

Personally, I've never had any sense of community in any group I was part of IRL. I knew that if things got rough, nobody would care, they would pretend to feel sorry and not lift a finger to help me, like everyone does towards the less fortunate. I feel pretty much the same towards society. Aside from family (parents and brother, in my case), hardly a handful of people will come to my aid if I need.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

70% of them are smarter than i was =(

[–]ivebeencaught5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Here is the summary of AWALT that you will need, from the comments. I wish every beta orbiter could hear this.

One female friend offered me this advice: "All you have to offer a woman is love, and she can get that from her dog without having to date a man who is so repulsive."

Repulsive, that is what they see you as.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

I love this.

I know there are a ton of reasons why the marriage rate is low. Some of it is a fair amount of guys that are just plain not up to snuff. They tend to be sloppy, under-employed, home bound, and and frankly not really men.

Then you have the career woman who either 1)wont go on dates or 2) has such a high standard that they will never find any man because none exist. Or they know deep down they really want a man that will get them those tingles- make them feel sexy and awesome. Instead, they find men that will bend over backwards to please them and come out weak.

A single female I know, late 20s. She said that she will go out with any guy that will ask her on a date. But she rarely goes on a second date. No tingles. These are employed well educated men she goes out with. She just can't see herself falling in love with these dudes. My guess is she will find some beta guy in the next few years and convince herself it works.

I look back (15 years or so now) to some high school friends. Guys that are not exactly cream of the crop when it comes to education and employment. BUT they have jobs, a real strong work ethic, they are at least quasi alpha- and they get married to 6/7's who will work hard as a housewife. These are they guys you see driving a big truck, working hard everyday, and always seem to have a decent chick sitting on their lap. These are the guys that will continue to populate the US.

Then there are the guys who smarten up. They see their buddies get married, get fat, keep the same shit job, take no risks, have no money, and live in a perpetual state of unhappiness. While they are banging hot chicks, making money, and living a fulfilling life.

My guess is a fair amount of guys will hit their mid 40's/early 50's and find a younger chick to settle down with. You will see a lot more silver foxes driving their kids to school in their real nice car. Their wives wearing workout gear everyday and keeping it real. So this stat just shows a delay in marriage that is a cultural fix to the shit way men feel about LTR's. It will right itself.

Meanwhile, women, especially lower income women, will continue to get knocked up early and live miserably until they learn about condoms and effective delayed gratification.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (2 children) | Copy

As much as I hate shutting you guys down, there is already a thread above this one referencing the same article. Contribute there, we aren't concerned with fake internet points.

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[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy


I'll let this fly because the convo exploded since I last logged in, but there was already a discussion.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

The comments are awesome. Good job guys!

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

This makes me happy inside.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

If 50% of men will never get married, It would imply that 50% of women will also never get married, right?

[–]kevkos5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Right. But the big difference is women want marriage while many/most men don't.

[–]masturbator90001 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I remember back a year or two when I was still fantasizing about what it would be like to finally find 'the one', get married, settle down, have kids and all that stuff. Bluepill times, obviously.

Now I honestly can't even imagine living with a woman because of all the stuff I notice about them now that I were seemingly invisible to me before. How easy it is to get screwed over for half your shit, completely without fault even. In a society in which a woman can cheat on her husband and still walk away with ridiculously high amounts of alimony and possibly even child support, I see not a single reason to get married in today's day and age. I don't hate women, but I can't put everything I've worked for on the line, hoping that nothing goes wrong along the way.

My only regret is that I won't get to have my own kids, but I guess I was never entitled to 'my' kids anyway. At least not with the reproductive rights we men currently have.

[–]SgtBrutalisk0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

"Your" kids are obliged by law to attend schools, where they will enjoy the feminist propaganda.You, me and 99% of men are seen by the elite as breeders. We create another generation of obedient slaves for our masters.

[–]1kick61 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Far too many young men have failed to make a normal progression into adult roles of responsibility and self-sufficiency

Self-sufficiency...typified by taking care of yourself which is, you know, inherit in the name.

roles generally associated with marriage and fatherhood

Oh, nope. Self-sufficiency is actually about financing a woman and her "have it all" aspirations of progeny.

The high percentage of bachelors means bleak prospects for millions of young women who dream about a wedding day that may never come. “It’s very, very depressing,” Crouse told CNSNews.com. “They’re not understanding how important it is for the culture, for society, for the strength of the nation to have strong families.”

No, they fully understand that the world wants them to sacrifice for women, and that the legal climate is staunchly opposed to "strong families."

These "experts" are so fucking wide of the mark, it's almost impressive.

[–]shifty43211 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Did anyone else notice that she effectively blamed MEN for all the woes.. and for being the cause of the "hook-up" culture?

She just simply ignores 2nd and 3rd wave feminism in their entirety.

[–]1DRMMR761 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

The author spoke a very real truth, probably without even realizing it. Women want a wedding day not a marriage. An entire day devoted to just them, where they can wear a princess dress and have all of their friends and family tell them how beautiful and amazing they are, with the weeks and months building up to it where they can spend someone else's money on catering, flowers, and other meaningless adornments purely in the pursuit of their own narcissism.

All women love the idea of getting married. Most hate the idea of being married, at least until that's all they have left after their looks have faded.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Repost. Redirect convo to the thread above this one referencing same article.

[–]New_Horiz0ns1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah don't get married. But enough with the bitter speech. Quit fueling the negative emotions towards women. It is what it is.

[–]Shadoscuro0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That second part hit a little close to home. I always said my mom was trying to live through my sister and that she seemed like the favorite. No divorce or bastard children as far as my parents marriage goes just interesting to see that put into words.

[–]throwawayaljlkj209820 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

My plan is working, keep giving up on women people. Makes my chances of finding a unicorn that much easier.

[–]kevkos2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Ha. It's not women we are giving up on it's state-sponsored marriage.

[–]throwawayaljlkj209820 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

yeah I wasn't being serious. Unicorns don't exist.

[–]TheRedPillMan10 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

According to “projections based on census data, when today’s young adults reach their mid-40s to mid-50s, a record high share (25%) is likely to have never been married,”

Where did you get the number that 50% will never get married? It's a scary stat for those who want to a ring on their finger but a true alpha will know how to spin plates and have branches to swing.

[–]-Awake-0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I know most of us have already read it, but I think the best counterargument to these attempts to shame us is Roosh's article "I'm ready to man up"


[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I wouldn't discount how men see the women they marry as they both get older. I've heard old-timers and fiction say "When I look at her I see that same girl I met when we were 20." I think man's visual bent imprints strongly as he sees her when she's fertile, young and full of energy. If you meet her when she's 33 and tired from over a decade of disappointments she doesn't have that gleam. You get the sense you're not in this for the thrill of her feminine energy but for a social contract and a ride to the airport when you need one. Maybe it's naïveté dying as you get older or maybe it's just built in you to know a raw deal when it is in front of you.

[–]lemonparty0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Young women who adhere to a moral code and refuse to participate in the “hook up” culture are now considered social misfits

That's how the media wants them to feel. We agree there.

Even researchers from the left are coming out very strongly for the family and for marriage,

Because they fucked it all up, and now they know it.

[–]Fryguy480 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The fall shall start with the last free standing country and it will end with the world.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I'm not surprised. There's less and less motivation as a man to get married more than ever nowadays.

[–]destraht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I see offshore accounting with trusts, IBC, foundations, etc as a good way to protect oneself. Probably unless you are super careful like some James Bond villain the wife will end up knowing a lot about these setups and could go about dismantling them. I guess the goal for me would be making her only liable to get 50% of say 40%. How is a woman going to feel about knowing that she is getting even a penny less than half if she leaves? For myself I have long term goals of getting all assets (I don't have hardly anything identifiable and a-lienatable ATM) into foreign places to protect myself against a basically bankrupt government - in other words. That same government is what a hopeful divorcee would use against me all of the same. I say that its not about avoiding or dodging taxes but being able to take those winnings off of the table so that you and only you control it and that nobody a POS IRS agent or now suddenly nasty wife can deprive you of it. That is becoming sovereign and is very RP from my viewpoint. I always try to remember that ownership is liability and control is power. Ultra rich people control a lot but own very little and in real hard times they pretend to save the world with their benevolent trusts that they setup just in the nick of time.

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[–]tedcase7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

I can assure you, The government is very real.

[–]Lt_Muffintoes0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Witty response, but the government is not real.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

When I grow up I'd like to have kids, heck as much as 4 if I can, but I'm not sure I'm going to find a woman like that in Sweden, marriage is scary. I know I got many years ahead of me since I'm only 16 but any advice on what I should do when I do get old?

[–]2johnnight0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

If you want 4 kids the only option is to marry an Orthodox or Catholic devout woman. Why? Because using birth control is a sin and that is how large families are made.

That is my experience from comparing secular and religious families. The seculars are all about personal convenience and the religious accept hardship as fate from God and let's be honest: kids are annoying and expensive.

[–]chillmonkey880 points1 point  (9 children) | Copy

EDIT: Tldr in last two paragraphs I didn't think I wrote so much %)

First paragraphs just quote and respond to her points

I actually liked this article because I would love to argue this debate with her a more and reveal the manosphere online and see what she spins out of that. There's good and bad in thi.s mostly bad because it comes from a blue pill pop news watered down standpoint. However I liked that her words indicated something that they weren't saying - women have got the changes in society and knocked men down a peg to be equals and are less happy, what gives?

Few things - the first two paragraphs blame men... what's new - same old "man up" and "men need to take responsibility yada yada" but then some of that inner working idea I mentioned above. "Women are getting really upset and it's not cool" it's almost like a half hamstring. She knows this but rationalized it to be men's (as a whole) fault.

Then went on to say "women used to set up the morays and intimate parameters" then added on "now women are 60% of collegiate student body so they now have to live by guys demands" more blaming guys and half hamster dance... she's starting to see the problem and connect the dots but still can't get away from the hamster like a moth and a bug zapper.

"The ones that get married early and hurt the rest of us because we're left with slim pickings when we're 25" blaming younger women OK... so 40% or more of your student body is male if 60 is female and you can't find one guy? Hmm 80/20 rule anyone? Maybe not enough Chad thundercocks aren't going to bury themselves in student debt and those slim pickings are NOT the beta guys you marry in 6 years to divorce rape them... AWALT I guess.

"The left are now strongly advocating for 2 parent families" mrm is probably chomping at the bit along with myself for this. Some political power to help defeat the likes of NOW and maybe get young boys and father's the legislative help we so desperately need because we as men have no traction in this matter. Probably shows why people don't take mrm serious right now.

"Feminism is a spent force/lost revelence" another smart older woman that see the poison she and her sisters are being force fed.

I think she still lives under the "unaccountable for anything" veil however I liked reading this and would like to see her talk/debate with a manosphere figure. I think she has no idea something like that exists and it would probably blow her fucking mind.

I also think even though her hamster was off and running... deep down she sees what marriage is today for guys through her words... almost as if for job safety sake she had to hold back on writing a more genuine article so had to follow the pop culture cookie cutter excuse "blame men" and "they're just getting married later see the 35-50 yo on the graph" then just meh words... anyone else get that sort of vibe from this?

[–]fadetoblack10044 points5 points  (8 children) | Copy

(who btw when married at a younger age have a better chance to make it last)


"The younger a person marries, the more likely it is they will get divorced. As it turns out, age plays a big role in determining a marriage's fate. Those who marry under the age of 20 have the highest rate of divorce. These couples are nearly 1.5 times as likely to get divorced as those who get married between the ages of 20 to 24 years old. Those who marry after the age of 25 are even less likely to get divorced."

That's just one link but there is a lot more data on that all over the place to support this. Just wanted to point that out, the rest of your post is mostly opinion, which I can't fault. I'm not sure if you're buying into the article, in which the bitch states that, or not, but it's bullshit either way.

[–]chillmonkey882 points3 points  (7 children) | Copy

Well I stand corrected... I thought it was the other way around on the spectrum - the older/post wall spectrum had a higher divorce rate. Thanks for clearing that up and the link!

[–]fadetoblack10043 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy

Yeah, no problem. It has to do with education as well... No college education leads to an average married age of 22.5 or something, whereas college educated averages 24.9. Women with a bachelors degree get divorced at half the rate of women with no degree. There's so many intermingled factors when looking at divorce rates that you really have to dig in and understand all the variables fairly well before you can come up with a decent picture of what you're looking at.

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[–]fadetoblack10040 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Yep, there is a tremendous correlation between education and divorce rates, and I'd expect that correlation to only accelerate as time goes on and the wealth disparity between those with a college degree and those without accelerates.

[–]1oldredder0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yup. Money problems cause divorces. Rocket-science, right?

I can only imagine how debt will tally in the end for college+debt vs college+no-debt

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[–]DrinksCrystalKush0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

nah man, keep them bitches on a short leash, just like master Snoop Dogg taught me, never love a hoe.

[–]ejpusa0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Financially women no longer need a man. Just ain't worth the effort, that's what the numbers are pointing out.

[–]H42 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

Here are where the Unicorns may live:


It would be interesting to see if those females are also AWALT.

"Uncontacted peoples, also referred to as isolated peoples or lost tribes, are communities who live, or have lived, either by choice (peoples living in voluntary isolation) or by circumstance, without significant contact with globalized civilization. Few peoples have remained totally uncontacted by global civilization."

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[–]symko1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You play those odds in Vegas and tell me how it goes. No thanks, even for redpill women, it will be "Wham bam, thank you ma'am."

[–]Panda_Love_23-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Just commenting on OP comment...Well that just sounds sad :( then everyone ends up alone

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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