335,797 posts
335,797 posts
707 upvotes
by on /r/TheRedPill
14 March 2015 05:33 PM UTC
| Title | Feminists around the world are in mourning today as /r/TheRedPill fails to make "most toxic" subreddit list |
|---|---|
| Author | |
| Upvotes | 707 |
| Comments | 230 |
| Date | 14 March 2015 05:33 PM UTC (5 years ago) |
| Subreddit | TheRedPill |
| Link | https://theredarchive.com/post/30211 |
| Original Link | https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/2z1c0c/feminists_around_the_world_are_in_mourning_today/ |
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Most likely the person who used the phrase proud male chauvinist is an older establishment feminist. Young women simply dont speak like that, they prefer shitlord or asshole.
That being said its cunts like her that helped erode mariage into the single mother shit show it is today. We are the generation of men that she helped produce. So if she doesnt like Red Pill, if she is enraged flustered and annoyed great. This is only the beginning. Red Pill is just getting started.
Do people actually say shitlord in the real world?
Occasionally I hear it in the US Navy. Could hardly call that the real world though
Is it being said seriously though? Some of my buddies and I have started using it among ourselves, but only when making fun of SJW types.
nah not really, mostly just when we're screwing around or run out of ways to cuss
We made up our own terms. Not sure if it occurs in other communities, but we called people NUBs: Non-Useful Bodies. I think this term also accurately describes feminists.
I also use it when making fun of tumblrites
In academics they do but that is hardly the real world.
I've never heard it. Usually girls throw around words like misogynist, rapist, asshole, loser, virgin, etc. Sometimes 'apologist' if it's a college debate or something.
I assume it's kind of like "check your privilege". I've only heard either of those things from well-off white males who are joking around.
I like TRP. I say this because I don't want to defend what the article said about TRP.
However if we are talking about TRPs reputation its probably not helpful that you are making an ad hominem attack comment about an article about toxicity and that being the highest upvoted comment in the thread.
Then again, who cares that it is a little harsher than normal subreddits... no bullshit!
People who read the subreddit for more than 30 seconds tend to find themselves hitting 'subscribe'. TRP isn't even anywhere near as toxic as its naysayers claim it to be. The 'TRP is the big bad bogeyman of Reddit' trope has had its day. In the last few days I've seen TRP mentioned on other subreddits without being censored or deleted. People are part wising up, part getting sick of the PC brigade trying so hard to make everything inoffensive that they end up feeling the exact opposite.
We are also not a toxic community in that we hardly flame each other. It's probably one of the most accommodating subs around if you're willing to be a part of it.
edit: and of course, SRS is the most toxic sub. The irony is delicious.
I stayed away from here for the longest time because if you're going to go by what you hear about it from the rest of Reddit you'd think it was some snake's den of sexual predators swapping date rape strategies. When I finally gave this place an honest read I had a really hard time reconciling what I'd heard with the reality of what it is, which is basically just a place where men can teach other men how to be independent and sexually confident.
That's the thing, if women get their own subreddit (they have more than one) then it's empowerment and you go girl. But if we get one where we talk about OUR sexuality and OUR issues then we are bigots.
Nothing is more powerful than a group of guys gathering together. They fear that.
Why? Because unlike any other group of people we get shit done. Because by ourselves we are strong and independent but together, when we get together, we become unstoppable.
"Individually we are weak like a twig, but together we form a mighty faggot!" -Ralph Wiggum
Martin. It was Martin Prince.
i see what you did there. Using words to make a pun.
Well, now that such hate speech has been upvoted, that whole "hatesub full of vile bigots" status seems pretty cemented.
'Cause we'll all convince each other to never marry.
That ain't good.
I wonder why Fraternities are always being slandered in the media...
Eh... All the haze-murders and chants about lynching black people don't help. Let's not get ahead of ourselves.
they're trying to take over /r/niceguys which should belong to redpill as an example of what not to do.
Found this gem in there straight from a horse's mouth
TRP teachings no?
Teachings? That's TRP in a nutshell. Shit, the tl;dr is "don't be a goddamn nice guy"
Someone should make the TRP ball shaving post.
Lift, eat well, pass shit tests, shave balls, = profit?
So, basically, kowtow to some specific image of "maleness"? Fuck that. I'll be my own man, thank you very much. If women like it, that's great. If not, at least I have myself. I'd be fucking embarrassed to adopt most of the behaviors on that list.
That's the thing, feminists try to spread their mentality to anyone and they are not ashamed to force it into you and it's generaly seen as something good. But if we try to make our point outside this subreddit... oh boy, who knows what would happen?
Sounds like it needs a home in the sidebar.
[permanently deleted]
And with good fucking reason.
This is the one place - the ONE place - in the entire world - where men can speak without guile, pretense, or subtext. You don't need a secret decoder ring to understand the things we discuss here.
If we tried to be tactful about imparting Red Pill truths, we'd just be couching things in yet another pointless layer of obscurity, the way the rest of the world does.
Do you know what tact is for? Tact is for safeguarding other people's feelings so that they don't lynch you for speaking the truth.
Well, we don't lynch people here for telling the truth. We lynch them for trying to hide it. Here, we care about OUR feelings.
That's the best way to have it. Especially with the subject matter discussed here being important and relatively complex. Every fucking thing has to be sugarcoated and politically correct nowadays. More energy is spent framing information as to not offend anyone than actually developing an argument. Everyone is treated like a delicate little flower that can't control its emotions and needs someone else to do it for them. TRP is a oasis in the massive desert of PC bullshit.
We can't start trying to be more politically correct and safe. It goes in the face of every value this community holds. The only thing that can do is push TRP down the path to becoming another little "safe" haven like TwoX and Feminism where everyone is quaint and polite, and nothing ever gets accomplished.
I wish to God this were true, but the truth is that there is more pretense and subtext here than almost anywhere else I've participated online. If you do not kowtow to the groupthink here, you are labeled as a "beta" and down voted into oblivion. I hope to someday actually find an open-minded forum for men rather than a pickup artist circle jerk.
I have flat-out never felt more repressed speaking my mind on men's issues and on dating than on /r/theredpill
The difference between rational consensus and circle-jerking is the process by which the group's conclusion was reached.
Subreddits like TwoX, SRS, AskHamsters, etc. are circle-jerks because they use the emotional reaction of the collective as a metric for deciding what ideas are admissible.
By contrast, TheRedPill reaches consensus based on data (mostly in the form of research reports), and also through anecdotes which are presented as theses and later tested in the field by individual members.
The fact that some RP members oppose incorrect ideas vehemently is only incidental. The basis for disagreement is factual.
So, what exactly are you saying that's getting downvoted so strongly?
Yes, here's an open forum - speak your mind. What do you feel you aren't allowed to say here?
Women are children. We're here to speak the truth, not be nice.
The most responsible teenager in the room.
99% of the time those aren't mutually exclusive. Tell me which law of power says you should communicate your ideas in language you know many people will reject outright.
The purpose isn't to deliver the message as nicely as possible. It's to deliver the message as clearly as possible.
That's the entire point of this place: we use straight talk to describe things most people wouldn't dare to. Which is why the first rule of TRP is you don't talk about it... not even nicely and watered down.
I agree with that whole heartedly. It comes from the anger and resentment that is felt from swallowing the pill. It's a hard thing to get past and be all happy go lucky about it.
PC is a way to please the feminist imperative bro.
When I hear a subreddit is terrible or offensive it usually means its worthwhile at least seeing what its about to get such a negative reaction. Most offensive ones I can think of, if anyone is interested:
/r/coontown
/r/antiPOZi
/r/DarkEnlightenment
/r/european
/r/whiterights
/r/nationalsocialism
/r/antipozi just trolls the sjws. /r/darkenlightenment is probably more intellectual and philosophical than about 95% of other subs.
frankly, subs like /r/rage and /r/politics are more poisonous than the ones you listed because they are hiveminds that silence/censor all dissent from the conventional wisdom.
One look at antipozi and it's sidebar and you can see its racist.
/r/fatpeoplehate is pretty up there, too.
I love that sub.
Does nothing toward self-improvement (time sink), but it works toward calling out bullshit in the health/diet industry that is pro-fat, like Tumblr's own brand of broscience.
Whether it actually wakes people up isn't proven at all and is definitely up to debate. Whether you think that the attempt is good (less fat people), or bad (more competition in the sexual marketplace) is up to you.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9C4uTEEOJlM&feature=youtube_gdata_player
An interesting observation - have you noticed how often that people say something like "the red pill is awful, don't even read it" versus "the red pill is awful, go read it and see for yourself how bad it is"?
Yes, yes I have noticed. Its part of the sjw "listen and believe" strategy. If you question what they say they get worried you'll find out their statements are misleading at best.
that could be a great way to subvert their TRP-bashing in a powertalk-compatible way - find a comment that says "don't even look at /r/TheRedPill, they're all sexist rape apologists" and reply with "seriously if you want to see what we're up against go take a look around that sub". The end reader will at least check us out and come to the same realisation many of us have.
People on the fence of an issue respond to inviting kindness more than anger. Its the old catching more flies with honey than vinegar. Of course, you catch the most flies with bullshit so who knows?
obviously this is true, but if you try to stick up for TRP in SJW threads you'll just get downvoted or banned. By using power law 38 "think as you like but behave as others do" you can sneak in an encouragement for the user to find out on their own without being silenced for going against the hivemind.
Can confirm. I did this, reaped the karma instead of the ban hammer.
I don't really know for sure, but I suspect that flies are a poor proxy for humans.
I read a lot of the feminine-centric subs where they say stuff like this.. an upvote the hell out of any post that actually links to /r/theredpill, so that people are more likely to click through to it to see how "bad" it is
"We can't in good conscience not read the red pill: Extremism thrives amid ignorance and anger, intimidation and cowardice. -- Hillary Rodham Clinton"
"I have a vagina vote for me" -- Hillary Rodham Clinton
Hill Dog!! RUFF RUFF RUFF RUFF RUFF RUFF...
When Howard Stern first hit the large market (Wash. DC), he got huge ratings, but a huge part of those ratings were from people that HATED him - he's very, very polarizing. In the survey, they asked discovered how long people listened to him. Those that liked him listened for "x" minutes. Those that hated him listened for 120% of 'x' minutes. When the haters were asked why they listened for so long even though they hated him, they replied, "I wanted to hear what he would say next."
Even the OP article has it:
It's the best PR you could ask for. Notice how actual ad clickbait text is always reverse psychology. "10 Most Offensive..." "Doctors hate this one weird trick!" "MALE GAMERS ONLY" "Most disgusting celebrity..." etc.
I've had people on Reddit and in the real world ask me why I read here. Some of the things I've said / commented on have had people inquire if it had anything to with 'that Red Pill' subreddit.
I tell them "It's a place of open discussion regarding the truth of society's treatment of men and how inequality favoring women has driven to that point".
It's at this point I get the statements of "but men are treated better", "the law doesn't favor women", etc. I point out a handful of news articles, legal codes, etc that dispute those beliefs.
That is usually followed by "No way! That can't be true". I simply remind them I have no reason to lie about society and the subreddit; that if they want to prove me wrong, then come here and read.
The last five people I've gone through this exchange with (3 guys, 2 women) have come back to me and apologized for saying I was a liar and that they've started reading and learning.
I'm good with that.
There are some people that I can not / will not talk to about this sub. They simply won't understand or reconcile the truth with their beliefs. I feel for those people because they will be the ones society abuses.
One question that usually stuns them:
"Name three legal rights that men currently have that women don't."
And then reverse the question. Depending on your country you can usually come up with at least five.
Sometimes easier with blokes. They often already have it in their head that something isn't quite right with society. You can get a feel for whether they're receptive to that sort of thing.
So when you put a logical argument in front of them they'll scratch their heads for a bit and start to realise the truth.
With women it can be harder. "Truth" to them is what makes them feel good and safe inside, not what is proved to them with evidence.
Take female sports for example. Women sometimes whinge and whine about women's professional sport not getting respect. To that I respond:
"I respect women's sport, I just don't like watching it. It's a slower, less entertaining version of men's sport."
And the men around me make sounds of agreement whereas the girls mostly make silly immature noises.
That was easy
Prisons are gender matched. You don't get to choose.
Women who have sex with underage males are going to jail/prison. Maybe not as long as a guy does with an underage girl, but it's still not that far out of whack.
Women have the right to remain silent. It's just rare that anyone (regardless of gender) intelligently uses that right.
My sister is a pretty staunch feminist, hairy legs and armpits and all. I love her to death but I can't help but notice she's been living in a bit of a feminist echo chamber over the years.
What facts do you recommend I bring up during my next argument with her?
I'd recommend not engaging with someone who isn't used to having their reality challenged.
If she brings it up, just keep giving her the "nah I don't believe that" line...the first few times she will probably dismiss you as ignorant and drop the conversation. When she really wants to engage you in a thoughtful debate, you'll know it, because having her echo chamber not resonating clearly will get to her and she will act more approachable about it.
Then ask her for real life examples of the "wage gap" in her own life, and ask why those people don't sue, since that's illegal.
If she brings up rape (they always do) say that it's unfortunate that the burden of proof has to be on the victim, but the inverse will only lead to innocent people being put in jail where they are 20% more likely to be a victim of rape, and that increases if other inmates learn that you are convicted of a sexual offense.
Almost every other SJW 4th wave argument either has a reverse equivalent or is based so far outside of a functioning society that debate is hardly worth one's time. If it is something that has a reverse equivalent (such as beauty standards, slut shaming, etc.), there are plenty of examples all over the internet to back up your argument.
That's pretty brilliant actually. I'm saving that one.
When you correct them and say that the statistics actually don't take into account that men on average earn more than women (≠ being paid), they usually scream "Are you saying men work harder than women!?"
The answer is obviously a completely unapologetic "On average, yes" but asking them to bring up real examples from people they know is pretty hilarious. I want to try that. I bet they won't name a single legitimate case.
Well, my sister isn't your typical feminist. She's pretty smart and open minded, and I've gotten the impression recently that she's opened up quite since our last debate where I pointed out that many of the "liberal" things she reads are just as much propaganda as anything else. And the only time we've ever discussed things has been in the context of a thoughtful debate. She's not the type to want to argue or cause tension between anyone.
With that said, I like the idea of finding reverse equivalents, but assuming we do have another thoughtful debate in the future, got any other specific examples? Or maybe I should just google some.
/r/mensrights has stories like that all the time. They also have the 'swap genders' flair tag attached to news stories where women are given a pass for doing things that would cause outrage if men did them. The incarceration stats are important to me, because no matter what inequalities a female faces, having your rights taken away and locked in a cell, to me seems to be the ultimate inequality.
Edit: some easy examples, are like when a woman complains about the way women in comics/SciFi/fantasy are portrayed as sex objects....remind them that often fantasy men are rich...Christian Gray, Prince Charming, Batman, Iron Man...women treat men's provider status EXACTLY how men treat women's sexuality. And when they're not rich, they're both buff and dangerous (shirtless fireman fantasy? Biker fantasy? Lumberjack fantasy? HeMan?)
I'll have to find you this great video on YouTube of an argument between a butch lesbian and a preop trans "woman" about "who makes who feel unsafe" in their women's rights safe places. It bleeds with the absurdity of the progressive stack, and how even manly qualities in women can set off some of their panic buttons.
Found it. Progressive stack!: https://youtu.be/ti7k_xOomXE
Another tack you may want to try...
Don't face her beliefs. That's often an unassailable position. Instead, challenge her to prove to herself that they are true.
Disagree with her premise. Then ask who the position benefits and why.... along with telling her to follow the money back to the source and destinations.
Propaganda and lies cannot stand the test of truth when you go searching for the dirty laundry. Money nearly always leads to the dirty laundry.
I did this a long while back when it came to care for my kids. I was told that my kids would be better cared for by my wife instead of me (I was a stay-at-home Dad for a few years). I challenged the woman who made the statement to prove why. All she could come up with was "feels good" justifications.
I then asked her where she got the idea from. She told me it was some parenting magazines plus some female talk shows that said women are better caretakers.
I then pointed out that my kids weren't the slightest bit misbehaving during our conversation. She agreed they were exceptionally well-behaved. I also pointed out that media of any sort will say/do many things just to generate buzz and viewer/reader-ship. Not to mention the subtle attack of men she was proposing.
When she looked at the larger context of what I was pointing at, she realized she was being fed a line and not by me. That pissed her off. She didn't like being manipulated like that. I explained to her that advertising and media nowadays are better than brainwashing and we are inundated with ads everywhere.
I ended the conversation with "Why do those places want you to believe what they are telling you? So you'll keep coming back and keep giving them money."
That's a damn smart way to do that.
Why bother arguing with her?
NEWSFLASH: logic will not work on her
Go do something productive with your time instead.
TRP has a lot of great info that's oftentimes masked with paranoia, bitterness, and insecurity, which is understandable because many people are here only because they were hurt by women and are now waking up, but are still affected. Oftentimes good ideas are oversimplified as blanket statements, but if you can weed those things out, TRP is invaluable. I don't think it's perfect in its current state though.
You know, I'm not going to lie. At first I was like "Dam these are a bunch of angry ass dudes that cant get pussy". But that's because I chose to read the post and comments of the redditors that were still on the anger phase. But I came back the next day, and the day after that. In a moment of clarity I saw that it made me uncomfortable because the "truth hurts but the truth will set you free".
Pleaseeeeee. Do not even get me started of askhamsters. You can't even say anything without walking over 5 minefields, a carpet of spikes and 3 bathtubs full of burning napalm. Everyone is so on edge there almost anything can be seen as 'offensive'. It is like a sub for little children and irony dictates that they are actually adults. O yeah and what is really ironic is that you can't 'talk shit' to anyone there, but the women are allowed to call people assholes, which on it's own can be seen as offensive to gay (male) people. They are stretching so far that a discussion is pointless and they are basically only trying to keep each others ego up by encouraging and supporting each other.
I've fairly new here. I don't agree with EVERYTHING, but it's certainly more on point than anything I've red of feminism the last 10 years.
Somebody here should make a SRS-like sub from RP's perspective.
No.
Winners do not waste their valuable time watching losers lose. They are too busy working to win some more.
Prove SRS wrong by doing the opposite of what they say, and succeeding in life by doing that.
Most of TRP's blue pill examples have that covered.
We don't need to dignify SRS by creating a whole sub devoted to parody. Most of their shit is a parody unto itself. Just let the morons punch themselves out.
This is a very good idea. Care needs to be taken to not be seen as a parody or reactionary to SRS. Also strictly no engagement with the subs we link to (brigading)
Just a place to point out and discuss all the casual sexism against men.
Have to agree with you on that. The God-Emporer of that sub took exception to two relatively benign comments I made and struck me down with the ban hammer. Fuck that guy...
That is one of the greatest things about TRP. If we all talked like a bunch of ultra bros and insulted and belittled each other you could attempt an argument at TRP being toxic. The only time I really see anything being down voted is when it's wildly incorrect or someone is being a dickhead.
There will always be people who oppose what is discussed and promoted here. Despite that, I think a large amount of the people saying "Oh no, stay away from there" haven't spent more than a minute reading an average day's content. It only takes a quick glance to see that almost all of the discussion here is thoughtful and intelligent. If you still don't like the content, you're out of luck, but the notion that TRP is evil, toxic, etc. is fucking ridiculous.
Not only is the discussion on TRP itself not toxic, but I feel like everyone makes a point to keep it out of the mainstream of reddit. The majority of first time viewers probably come from the people talking shit about TRP constantly bringing it up. I still spend time on other subreddits (albeit not many defaults) and TRP is practically never endorsed in a positive light or advertised by a subscriber. TRP is the most isolationist sub on this entire website.
I enjoy the quality content on this subreddit. However quite a few people here are quite toxic in my experience, with very extreme points of view that are as bad as extreme misandric feminists. I also ended up getting banned just by saying to these people " you are the ones giving TRP a bad name".
Of course in the end, the toxic few does not represent the entire TRP community and its core philosophies.
Weak-minded people would consider this place toxic because it presents a harsher reality than today's society equips them for. There's raw information here that they are unwilling to even consider being possibly accurate, and that's what causes the fear and reaction; opinion can be argued, scientific and anecdotal evidence is harder to squiggle away from.
It is essentially a framework for assimilating all information on its own merits rather than automatically accepting precepts and practices from institutions or people that appear to be legitimate.
It forces you to be critical of your every move as well as those of every single person you interact with (whether its their words you're hearing or reading, the actions you see them make, or the relationships they try to build with you).
In short, it forces accountability. People aren't comfortable with that. At this point, the current generations that are the majority of our population (Boomers, Gen-X, and Millennials) are so accustomed to sucking on the teat of big government and operating under the shadow of its all-seeing eye as a supposedly benevolent father-figure.
Women obviously reject it because it exposes all the flaws of their ideology and behavior: solipsism, favored legal status, favored employment policies, and a guaranteed floor put in place by the government and funded by the garnished wages, alimony, and child support payments taken from the pockets of men. It's to their disadvantage to acknowledge it, so they fight it tooth and nail and do their best to associate it with terminology or imagery that both men and women view as unfavorable ("creepy," "rapey," misogynistic, abusive, and the like).
This place encourages men to be independent individuals. The interests at large have learned from history that such a culture is dangerous for those at the top, so today you see the judicial branch, mass media system, legislative branch, and major multinational corporations whose very livelihood depends on you remaining an ignorant participant in their system collude to push things farther in this direction.
The bigotry is in people who automatically label anything said by anyone who's ever posted here or in similar subs as invalid, simply by association.
The earnest response from many people outside this community would be that thread is bigoted, because Not All Women Are Like That. "Bigotry" in this case is shorthand for "socially unacceptable pattern recognition".
AKA "Men aren't willing to be cattle in the slaughter chute anymore! Time to shame them back into their designated role!"
Well, that's the best thing I've read today. Chapeau.
I like chauvinism better than misogyny. Chauvinism sounds so elegant.
Originally, chauvinism referred to militant nationalism, named after a french soldier. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicolas_Chauvin
So really the only Chauvinists I ever see these days are actually women who will take the side of team WOMAN no matter what the issue.
It does, but "asshole" and "shitlord" sounds so god damned sexy.
When a girl calls a guy an asshole/douchebag that means you're doing it right. If she wasn't attracted to you, you'd be a creep or she wouldn't know you exist.
Such a bigoted statement. Here, have an upvote.
I can't take the word ''bigot'' seriously 'cus in spanish, ''bigote'' means moustache. So every time I hear ''bigotry'' or ''bigoted'' I think ''moustachioed'' and ''moustachery'', which is hilarious to say and imagine.
I'll never be the same. Great post.
that muthafuckin' Mario
Women have nothing but hatred for anyone who blows the whistle on female sociosexual strategy, and they'll feign the existence of as much moral turpitude on our part as necessary to stop the truth getting out.
Remember Rollo's cardinal rule: sociosexual strategy is a zero-sum game, and women will stop at nothing to make sure they win, ie. men lose. Accusations of moral turpitude are just one more tactic in their toolbox.
If male sexual strategy is not being attacked by women, you're doing something wrong.
Note the dichotomy of red pill sexual strategy being attacked in public but simultaneously being effective.
Exactly... that's why they have to attack it :)
The love of the alpha undermines their need of the beta.
I could say "hey, the way to get girls is to paint your face purple and wear a tinfoil hat!" and I'd be laughed at (although I might try it one day, just to check). But basically no threat. But if I say "look hot, don't take any shit from women, be strong, don't commit, and take what you like from this world" I'll get attacked by insecure women demanding that I just be a nice guy and settle down and "man up".
/r/TheRedPill is about:
looking good
feeling good
not letting others walk all over you
How is this considered toxic? Because The Red Pill is also about not treating women/girls who are raging party girls like their vag is made of solid gold (point #3).
These women live as if there are no consequences. And, they do get away with it. The Red Pill comes along and says no to their life style, or more like no to having to put up with the aftermath of being rode hard and put away wet.
It's pure classic spin - it's not that I am toxic, it's that YOU are toxic for not accepting my toxicity. It's nicely summed up with the classic battle cry; Don't judge!
I suppose if you view women as inherently weak and men as inherently strong, anything that will tip this imagined balance further to the side thats already the most powerful, could be seen as toxic and oppressive.
I think you hit the nail on the head, and it goes to support a lot of other issues as well. It's this simple-minded way of thinking and creates the clusterfuck of modern politics.
I'm a woman that subscribed to this sub to see other people's points of view, but I often find myself scrolling by the posts because they have undertones about women being evil and slutty and manipulative and how it's the males turn to manipulate them by ignoring them, heavy negging, etc. Even in just this sub, "the reality of women", "vagina of gold". I hardly ever see any posts about how a good woman (there are plenty) have helped you to look good, feel good, find success, support you through stressful times, which the sub is supposed to be about, right? It's toxic in the sense that many subscribers have these implicit negative views of women.
,.. when playing the game.
Most of these guys weren't born this way, they were awakened (like myself). Most seem to have fallen for the game being played on them by women in the bar/party/social scene. And now, they are using these same tactics against women, specific women, who are looking for one thing - and it is not to help a man look good, feel good, find success, support him through stressful times.
Also, this sub has been pretty clear, it's about men. You won't see positive posts about women on here - because it's an island in a vast sea of overwhelming, unapologetic and male bashing pro-female messages.
The media portrays men as buffoons.
There is a global movement that is out to vilify men; feminism. And, it has "won". Here is the reward; http://cnsnews.com/news/article/barbara-hollingsworth/bachelor-nation-70-men-aged-20-34-are-not-married
Our judicial system is overly protective of females.
There is an institution that treats men as money mules (beta buck is frankly too nice of a term...); marriage.
And now this sub needs to 'fall in line' with the above? No.
There is enough positive reinforcement out there for women - so much so that it's resulted in negative results (the comment by Janice Shaw Crouse above).
[permanently deleted]
It's really interesting how women are attracted to the end result of a man who puts himself through the process of becoming more masculine and confident, but hate seeing the process of how it happens.
Specifically they reject the idea that it can be taught, or even discussed.
Because if it can be taught then any beta could become an alpha, almost. Women would rather have the natural alpha because genes. They don't want to be 'tricked'. Funny, because it's usually their hamsters that are tricking them, not guys.
But if the guy can learn to be an alpha, doesn't that mean his genes support him being an alpha male?
I've never quite understood the idea that females hate betas learning to be alpha. What about the natural alpha that was taught to be beta from day 1?
Every alpha out there had to learn it, apply it, and prove he was indeed an alpha. It's one part genes and one part knowledge.
Half-assing it won't get you there.
Most women are going to react to that the same way that most men are going to react to learning that their girlfriend was born with a penis, but now thanks to hormones and surgeries, looks like a hot woman.
The things that women are attracted to, the physical being heavy brow, deep voice, high muscle/fat ratio, the behavioral being primarily outcome independence and low agreeableness are all indicia of high testosterone. Her preferences evolved over tens of thousands of generations, and guys like Ross Jeffries and Tyler Durden are teaching guys how to hack all that.
Of COURSE their hamster is pissed.
EDIT: This is why women tell you to "Just Be Yourself". That way, they can adjust their behavior and strategy accordingly, and slot you into either AF or BB with minimal investigation and trouble.
Would a woman want to buy authentic diamond's or industrial made diamond's?
To me theyre both the same. To women they're a world apart
I see your point but I am coming from the perspective that a guy can only be alpha if he meets two criteria...
...a. skip learning how to be an alpha
...b. learn to be beta
I also come from a different angle as my wife (yes, I'm married) would happily take an 'artificial' diamond because no diamond looks good until it's polished and made pretty. The fact that I bought it for her is enough.
I agree with you.
If a man is able to become powerful and masculine of his own volition after being submissive and weak, then he is a great example of a man.
Especially since the 'naturals' wouldn't have had to battle (or at least not to the same extent) with their own being.
Lets not forget environments also have an effect on the development of people. A boy with strong genetics on paper could grow up to be 'beta' after being subjected to certain circumstances in his development, does this then nullify his genes in the eyes of a woman?
Edit: Grammar.
I would say genetics are the bottom line here. Learned behaviors can be changed.
All the while they will employ every trick at their disposal to convince men that they are a more attractive mate than they really are(makeup, boobjobs, etc). The hypocrisy is astounding.
Then they say they aren't wearing makeup/boobjobs/uncomfortable slutty clothes for male attention but rather for themselves (it makes me feeeeeel good/sexy/attractive). I'm just glad I'm not a woman, for multiple reasons.
And listen to the hamster wheel scream when you ask "attractive to whom?"
No more hypocritical than men learning PUA and at the same time despising MySpace angles on dating profiles. Everyone wants the naturally hottest mate, not the fake hottest mate.
There is a difference between a man hitting the gym, learning new skills, and all around bettering himself, and a woman getting surgical procedures to enhance her breasts or taking the 10 minutes it takes to do her makeup. One requires a bit more soul searching.
It's like bro code but for vaginas
They hate the idea that a man can improve their SMV by becoming successful and confident because women's SMV are entirely determined by their appearance and time has a way of kicking their SMV in the face and they can never get it back.
I'd state it slightly differently - bashing women is irrelevant to TRP. Woman bashing is a side effect of certain things such as the anger that comes from realizing that you've been lied to for much of your life, and TRP doesn't discourage that. But ultimately it's irrelevant to sexual strategy. Internet feminists aren't going to be lining up to thank me for that revelation but that's fine - I don't care what they think or say or feel.
Truly, bitches ain't shit but hoes and tricks.
They've been brainwashed by the lesbian Feminists into hating men.
It's kinda like how the education system in the USSR had kids informing on their parents who were then executed.
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/r/beatingwoman has been banned. /r/beatingmen still exists.
women is still up vs. woman being banned
Tbh I think communities like AskWomen, to some extent AskMen and TwoXChromosomes are the toxic ones.
TRP makes you honest with yourself: "I'm Indian and I can't get white chicks... why do they only go for XYZ?" "No, you're just hamstering yourself out of trying to improve what actually holds you back".
Whereas those other forums...:
"I'm Indian and I can't get white chicks... why do they only go for XYZ?" "Cultural stuff and it should be like <insert SJW rant>".
If RP being toxic means you can't hamster your way out of shit and have a look at the things which really hold you back. Even if it makes you uncomfortable to see it and forces you to work on it. As opposed to say being coddled and having my pre-existing delusions fueled.
Then hell, mayn, I rather have this toxic sub lulz
I remember asking a very SJW-ish girl about how a nice guy like me doesn't get much female attention. The reaction was a bunch of "You are not entitled to sex" and "You're more husband material, wait until they are done dating around".
TRP gave me zero bullshit. I didn't receive any attention because I was fucking pathetic. I didn't even lift! Now I have a new job with a lot of travel, I'm working out, and my finances are in great shape. Life is much better than waiting for a girl to "settle" for me if I had listened to SJW chick.
Women are generally bad when giving this sort of advice. SJW-type girls are even worse than them.
Oh no! We're biggots! Someone on the internet said so, so that precious SJW beta Captain Save-a-Ho's who tried starting shit with me on AskReddit last week must be right. I must truly make amends and see the error of my evil, evil ways.
Or I could carry on not giving two squirts of piss and carving out a life I enjoy for myself instead.
I wonder if this will lead to another wave of new subs. I myself discovered this sub when someone called me a "terper" as an insult.
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I got banned from SRS before I even knew what it was. They preemptively ban anyone who posts "problematic" opinions.
Everytime TRP is mentioned on another sub, particularly one that's a default sub... we get a huge influx of new subscribers...
Hell I joined this sub when TRP was around maybe 5000 subscribers. That was maybe a year ago.
He even had to give us a dedicated footnote that none of the other bad subreddits get.
You can almost hear the sound of curious clicks since he just couldn't leave us without special mention.
Fellas, it's now illegal in most western countries to be proud to be a man. Or haven't you been keeping up?
Depends on the cultural background, I'm Hispanic and being a proud masculine man is expected of me.
lmao what a douchebag this guy is, was literally a business analyst until 1.5 years ago with no theoretical background in data science. then he has the audacity to suggest he can quantify bigotry lololol
Posers gonna pose.
Dude probably can't even do a linear regression.
I like how his example of ad hominem is actually an ad hominem fallacy.
http://laurencetennant.com/bonds/adhominem.html
it's kind of ridiculous how much hate this sub gets, like even have seen people say we approve of physically abusing women as though that is somehow "alpha"
It's pathetic really, women are scared of men seeing through their games and manipulation that some of them play so will say anything to try and shut TRP down by depicting us as a bunch of women beaters
best part of the article. i found out there was a subreddit dedicated to making fun of tumblr! YAY!
Ha at the bottom its basically an honorable mention from the very biased author. Who cares though. This sub and /r/4chan is where I go to get away from the rest of the politically correct denziens of reddit.
gotta get that daily dose of tendies
from my POV, this "race" was a win-win situation for this sub:
if it was voted to be the most toxic: hate is one of the biggest compliments - winning
this case: whiners whining - winning
but then again, the wolf doesn't care about the sheep's opinion.
edit: just realized this footnote next to the mention of TRP:
ignorance is bliss, I guess.
lol, since when was reddit ever "the darkest recesses of the interwebs"?
Since people forgot about 4chan...
Since people forgot about the onion network.
I can't stand this article. It has obvious bias. And it's why I don't care that "oh, it's just a vocal minority"--that doesn't fucking matter, the vocal minority of feminists are the ones whose viewpoint is in MSM. TiA is not even remotely homophobic.
Haven't you heard? If you ever use the word "fag" or "gay", or you don't vehemently denounce someone who uses those words, then you're a bigoted homophobe who is against any kind of rights for homosexuals (other than the right to free stones received at a high velocity).
The post title is flat-out wrong. Google search for "Here are the results for subreddits plotted by Toxicity and Supportiveness:" to find the original post with the charts that actually load.
In the first chart, TRP is found in the upper-right corner, meaning it's both toxic and non-supportive. On the second chart, TRP is listed as the single most bigoted subreddit they found.
Whether these conclusions are accurate or not is immaterial. The point is that we most definitely made the list.
I can't stand the word "toxic" anymore. It got catapulted from near-nonexistence to ubiquity in the span of about a year.
Maybe it's just a metric for how unhealthy society is becoming, meaning that more people use the word if they feel that the people around them are becoming worse.
I hope this subreddit gets seen as a rational and oftentimes scientific forum. What draws me here is the empirical nature of investigating theories on behavior for both men and women. The material is seen as conspiratorial, but because the nature of the beast is hidden in decades enforced assumption. Great job. Keep up the high quality posts and keep the arguments strong and well-founded.
The contrasts of acceptance between what a woman can say and a man can say is really strange and shows the delusion in some minds. Women can bash men and how stupid they are all day, but hell if you judge a woman to be lacking intelligence.
I once was watching a movie with some friends. In it, guys were getting the shit beat out of them all day long, but when a woman was shoved and slapped... you know how they reacted. Violence is acceptable against men.
even if we were truly as bad as they say at the very fucking least we teach men how to get over shit
great apes on the other hand...
Proof is often in the results. I know a lot of guys who are doing their best to agree with all things feminist and theyre not getting laid nor are they happy. If someone thought i was always right i wouldnt respect them very much, especially if they supposed to lead and be assertive.
Strange, a 'feminist sub' that shall remain nameless got 2309 votes for being toxic but wasn't mentioned anywhere in the article. But they did for some reason go out of their way to mention us, even though we didn't score in the poll.
They say we have bigoted comments; well, opening a dictionary:
I couldn't get their graph to work and I couldn't find any actual data to support their claim. But I don't think that really fits what trp is about. Sure we have some pretty good definitions of what red pill is about. But if people want to drift aimlessly through life we're perfectly 'tolerant' of that behaviour, it's just not what we want to do.
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my only complaint for you guys is you don't unify enough to get your posts to reach front page enough.
SSJWs are the embodiment of hippocracy. They believe trp is a bunch of rapists and generally evil people. They express these feelings by spewing the uneducated hatespeech they so adamantly blame us for (usually without knowing or even doing the bare minimum research for themselves in order to know what TRP is really about). Curiously enough, given the two groups, SJWs started out as such and found people who share their views. TRP is populated mostly by people who had SJW views, had enough open mindedness to actually check out what TRP is about, and stuck around.
What does that tell you about the two?
SJW are mental cases. Pay them no attention and let them speak for themselves
My personal favorite TRP moment was when a friend showed me this several years after being endorsed. He thought he was doing me a favor by letting me know about it.
Haha holy shit SRS is the most toxic and least supportive subreddit, more so than we are. That legitimately made me smile to see it pointed out in a scientific way. Although I would think SRS would show more bigotry, seeing as it's defined as "intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself."
Are you kidding me? This sub is up there with r/trees for me. And that's a good thing.
"male chauvinism" - The first rule to The Red Pill and the best thing that I learned here is Respect yourself. After that then you don't put up with her shit tests , you are willing to dump the gold digger,the whiner, you are not willing to put up with her shit and can walk away , because you are the most important person and my self respect is not worth a bit of pussy , nor is calling me names like male chauvinist going to put my head down and go back to being a good little doggy and beg and roll over.
It is not bigoted to dislike dislikable people . Hamsters and betas, gold-diggers and social climbers , manipulators and liars , shitty human beings one and all and if we dislike that sort and say mean things about them , well tough shit .
This is how modern liberal anti-intellectualism works. They demonize things in the hopes that it will keep them obscure but in the end actually end up Spreading awareness.
The way they treat Atlas Shrugged and Ayn Rand is a good example that's been going on for awhile.
Of course the fact that Atlas shows exactly how and why liberalism is evil is why they demonize Rand.
Just like white pride is considered jail worthy and black pride is to be praised, soon male pride will be similarly tainted.
The irony is that it was SRS that was declared most toxic, and that is a militant feminist sub.
I can't believe we didn't make the cut. We are clearly not collectively alpha enough, and must redouble our woman-hating efforts to succeed.
I feel like the people who called Redpill folks bigots don't really know what a bigot is. I am not sure the word means what they think it means.
There are some really dumb subs that make TRP look like a bible camp. For example, /coontown.
It's precisely because those subs are dumb that they aren't worth mentioning. It reads like a white nationalist version of ShitRedditSays - loud, uncouth, trashy, ghetto. The irony is exquisite. Nobody's going to be paying attention to them any time soon.
The problem for the critics of TRP is that even though it's offensive to them, it doesn't have that same idiotic tone. Worse, TRP provides actionable advice. Most people are highly instrumental in their lives, and TRP plays right into that. Shit works, yo. That's really the problem with TRP - it works, more or less, and it certainly works better than what AFCs were doing before they started reading and applying red pill ideas.
It's like what Robert Greene says; people have their opinion (that they read on other subs without actually going on TRP) and will stick by it despite fact or logic.
Think about it this way - the people that you describe aren't going to produce very much insight for you and your life. That's why I'm not worried about evangelism regarding manosphere ideas. Them's as want to figure it out will, them's as won't, won't.
I'm looking for better ideas, not more cheerleaders.
Could I ask for your rebuttal to this graphic?
http://i.imgur.com/0nxdTnS.jpg
Genuinely curious..
It's highly probable that there are differences in human intelligence that can be linked to visible traits - AKA race and such. Of course it's career suicide to undertake a scientific study of such.
However I see nothing in that graphic that refutes the point that coontown is loud, uncouth, trashy, and ghetto.
Fair enough.
You realize people think the same thing about the trp though, right? That it's loud, uncouth, trashy, etc..
I personally love both subreddits, but that's just me.
The difference is, as I said upthread, that TRP produces useful content. That's why TRP is seen as a boogeyman and the various racist subreddits are ignored. If y'all were giving actionable advice on how individuals could implement white separatism or whatever, you could be assured you'd get the same treatment TRP gets.
I can separate argument from invective easily enough. Problem is that the vast majority of internet racists have no argument, just revulsion for those brown other people.
I don't know, both have been useful for me. 90% of succeeding in life is just avoiding bad surprises / fuck-ups. The thing that fucks someone could be marriage. Or the thing that fucks someone up could be moving to a urban neighborhood for cheap rent and getting a TBI from being punched by a stranger. It could be thinking it's fun to spin black girls as plates without realizing 48% of them have genital herpes.
Actionable? It's mostly avoidance. Same as here in many ways, TRP will make you want to avoid 90% of women and limit your interactions with the other 10% to well-defined boundaries.
I don't want to harp on about it though, thanks for the reasonable replies.
The blue pill seems really toxic. I am willing to accept their perspective as long as they lay it out articulately. But they don't. They have no stance. Their only reason for existence is to make us look like arseholes.
I honestly still don't know what TBP is supposed to be...
Are they redpillers that are attempting to parody the delusion and irrationality of a bluepiller? It would explain the incredible hamstering that goes on and the use of hamsters across the top, but it doesn't explain the irrational hate-mongering; If they are serious, their rampant use of blatant logical fallacies and willful ignorance is a perfect example of the redpillers definition of the bluepillers in itself... So are they an unintentional self-satire, ironically producing nothing of value while simultaneously hating/parodying those that do?
When I try reading that sub for over an hour I literally get a headache trying to understand them. Two posters will post conflicting views, and then will agree with one another while circlejerking for being so much more rational than those meany RPers, so I have to go back and try to figure out if one person was trying to be ironic or if 2+2 actually does equal 5; Generally it's the latter of the two and just serves to make my head hurt a little bit more.
I'm surprised TRP didn't score higher on Supportiveness. I guess tough love doesn't count as being supportive these days?
I urinate into a bowl of feminist tears.
Never considered that feminazis would consider TRP toxic.. But hey... I don't understand why they considers us bigots. I don't dislike women, not at all!.. If i didn't crave female affection i wouldn't be here. Women aren't perfect butterflies. Saying they aren't isn't "irrational hatred".
You sum up the failure of TRP perfectly:
This entire subreddit is about ceding power to women. This entire subreddit paints a picture that a man's life needs to revolve around attracting women, which cedes even more power to them. Feminists ought to fucking love this place.
Why would you spend effort attracting women if you didn't crave their affection? I'm not pretending that i don't... Finding a girl to fuck is easy. Having a stable relationship is nightmarish. Many a bro have been locked down by their women.. If you don't have frame / lose it to please your girl, that is when you're going to go through hell. At least that's how I understand it.
Holy Christ, you sound like a mindless TRP automaton. What the hell are you even talking about? I'm going to try to parse your meme-speak here.
First of all, if a "bro" has been "locked down" by a woman, there's a personality disconnect and a lack of communication going on there. If a "bro" feels "locked down," then that's his fault, not the woman's fault. You can't blame women for men being spineless.
Second, "having frame" is about the dumbest crock of shit I have ever read in my entire time on the internet and I'm a 4chan regular. If your entire focus when interacting with someone is to "hold frame" over them, that means you see that person as having absolutely zero value, and if you're wasting your time hanging out with people that you perceive as having no value to you, there's something fucking wrong with you. The only time I ever feel like "holding frame" over someone is necessary is when I'm making an employee do a work task or I'm making a child behave, and those are situations I have to be in as a employer or a guardian. I don't want to waste my time with people that hold so little value to me that I have to "hold frame" over them to manipulate them into doing what I want. That would fucking suck as a life. I'd rather be a fucking hermit than have to spend my time "holding frame" around people in a situation that I'm choosing to be in.
Third, the moment you "crave" someone's "affection," you're ceding all power to them. Affection is the natural outcome of a healthy relationship with someone. If you're trying to milk it out of someone by "holding frame" and so on, you're basically a sociopath. I can't imagine something less appealing than supposed "affection" coming from someone that I've manipulated into offering up that supposed "affection."
What was the most toxic website then?
Shit reddit says, a militant sjw/feminist sub.
Good for them they finally won something. I also heard that sjw/feminists attract bears
im just surprised that /r/atheism wasnt in there....although the page wouldnt load the graphs for me.
This picture is asking to modified for TRP. http://imgur.com/PZx61ct
I see the man on the floor as Maculinity. The one with the hammer is a Feminazi, the figure with the hammer on his shoulder is a SJW, and the figure in the back is Blue Pill. Someone, please, who has better photoshop skills, make this happen.
nah dude, the red pill is way tougher than any of those.
feminazis, social justice warriors and blue pillers don't even slow me down. Let alone destroy me like your vision would suggest.
We need to up our game, if we're not getting doxxed, blacklisted and having bounties put on our heads, we're really not doing it right
Actually, it's a sign of how completely ineffective TRP is that we're not getting doxxed.
A sub-reddit where everyone agrees can hardly be toxic
The PC MASTER RACE of the real world.
On mobile. Did /r/FatPeopleHate make the list? Id be surprised if it didnt
Of course not, /r/Fatpeoplehate is dominated heavily by women.
I'm shocked, honestly. The reddit community uses similar terminology to describe that sub like they do with us. "disgusting, "vile", "I wish they all die a horrible death", "oppressors", "muh patriarchy, cundishuns, and feelz"