Idolatry, The Marriage of the State

husky-viper · 2020-12-31T17:09:50+00:00

Women are slaves to the world regardless of their marital status. God made Eve desire to succumb to a man. Her idol is not the man as it were for her husband to her, but to the work the man performs for her.

Expand on this.

Outside of sacred marriage [...]

This entire paragraph looks like it is the beginning of something interesting, but you fail to make it relevant. I'm not a bright man, speak to me as you would a 5 year old, make this super abstract stuff relevant to my day-to-day life.

The Red Pill man does not give into the desires of his wife by giving himself to his wifes masters, but by working against his wifes masters so that she desires her husbands Holy Master.

This connects -- somehow -- to the "women are slaves to the world" bit above, but the connection isn't clear. Expand on the "slaves to the world" and then draw some kind of connection to this. Also, there might be a verse somewhere you can choke into supporting this point.

Most Christian men idolize the state.

Useless generalization is useless. MAKE. THIS. RELEVANT. TO. ME.

Most Christian men desire enslavement to the state because that is easier to limp downstream than to swim against the current.

Most men are deceived into going limp (and serving the worlds kings) and will die without knowing how to live.

Which is it? Do they desire enslavement? Or are they deceived into enslavement? If it is both, then how?! There is something palpable here, something worth saying, but you aren't saying it.

Most men do not want to be a governing authority in their house because they don't want the responsibility that it entails, but also wish to claim heavenly benefits they are not obligated to

Deceived into? Desired to not? Again, which is it?

red pill Christian man

You take your "no true Scotsman" fallacy and shove it.

This was absolute garbage post. It's a great first draft, and there are some excellent ideas buried in this dumpster fire. Somewhere. I can see them glinting through the toxic, empty, smoky rhetoric that ascends from this mess.

If you want to workshop this with me, shoot me a DM and we can turn this into something worth reading.

El0vution · 2020-12-31T17:43:34+00:00

Couldn’t really make sense of this post. It seems like you can’t decide whether marriage is good, or marriage is bad.

brainmeatjuice · 2020-12-31T19:28:57+00:00

I believe I can translate some of this.

T1: Biblical marriage was already less than ideal, because it obliged a man to compromise his mission in order to support a wife. But the risk was mitigated by the fact that the man held the authority of the head of household. But modern civil marriage is much worse, because it allows a woman to effectively enslave her husband, forcing him to spend his _entire productive life_ laying up wealth for his wife, her creditors, the government, and everybody else who hates our faith and our families. Therefore choosing civil marriage is a form of idolatry, because in taking a civil wife, a man chooses to grant that whole System power over him, and he becomes (if his wife should fancy it) a servant to it, rather than to God.

Red-Curious · 2020-12-31T18:31:40+00:00

I agree with /u/husky-viper in that I like where your head is at, but you're trying so hard to write like you're a KJV translator or philosopher that it's hard to find anything actionable in this. I can get pretty academic at times myself, so in posts where I find myself doing this, I add a "Conclusions" or "Application" section that gives the bottom-line reason the post should matter - and that, then gives the interpretive metric to go back and understand the beauty and depth in everything else that was said beforehand.

That said, I don't know that I can agree with your views on marriage. I think from a OT perspective, you're spot on. But in a post-Gospel world where we now are citizens of a spiritual kingdom rather than a physical one, the impetus toward physical marriage is gone and replaced by our spiritual union with Christ - even as the compulsion toward physical child-rearing is over and replaced by the spiritual child-rearing imperative called discipleship. In this, I agree with Paul in 1 Cor. 7 or Jesus in Matthew 19 that it's better not to marry if you can avoid it.

To be clear: marriage is still great. But the benefits of marriage that you reference are now things we have direct access to by our union with the Spirit through the cross. We don't NEED marriage to get those benefits anymore. As such, marriage is now primarily a tool for getting help toward a man's spiritual mission and legitimizing sex.

In this sense, I don't hold that "marriage is good for me because it brings me closer to God" applies to a post-Gospel people. I believe from Scripture it is a distraction from God, not a compulsion toward him. But it is one that serves a valuable function all the same, and therefore is still redeemable, especially in recognition that most men would proceed in sexual sin without it.

mumsheila · 2021-01-01T08:38:54+00:00

So then how do you.livev different OP ?

DeChef2 · 2021-01-01T21:21:54+00:00

As a married man, I am a slave to the world via my wife's desires.

Only if you allow yourself to be. Nowhere in the Bible does God tell husbands: "You must be a slave to your wife's desires," or anything coming remotely close. In fact, in Genesis, we see the direct opposite: Adam sinned by being a slave to Eve's desires.

It is this paragraph that I have the most issues with.

I therefore abide in the world for the purpose of caring for my wife.

But Paul concludes in Phil. 1:25 that the only reason he (and by extension, everyone else) is in the world is to build others up in the faith (win souls for heaven too).

I therefore abide in sin because I make myself a wilful slave of something other than Christ. But marriage as a sacred institution and ordained under God provides a grace to me for this sin.

To this I take the greatest issue. You say that to marry is sinful - and willful sin at that - yet God has ordained it. Can God Almighty ordain that which is against His own being, something sinful? Heaven forbid!

No, marriage is not sinful. It is here that you go wrong: marriage is not sinful but making yourself a slave to the amorphous desires of a woman sure is. You have conflated marriage with bowing down to a woman, going against both scripture and everything found in the red pill.

However, with that all said, I do think you are close to a good point. Getting married by the state is required nowhere in scripture, yet churchianity thinks it is some sort of a sacred requirement.

Unfortunately, you barely spoke about state-sponsored marriages when that (as far as I can tell) is the main subject of your post. You should talk more about * What it is * The benefits, and * The drawbacks.

That would help give us some context that we are sorely missing. Then you should explain why, as Christians, we shouldn't get a state-sponsored marriage/why it is sinful.

Your post has a lot of potential in this subreddit if you can communicate what you are trying to say better.

brainmeatjuice · 2020-12-31T18:21:45+00:00

Great insight here. I am not surprised that most people fail to understand it. The strength of the System comes from the fact that it operates almost invisibly, and it enfranchises anyone who would pose a serious threat to it, including self-styled "Christians." They preach the Gospel but live their whole lives in service of Mammon. They are red pill with respect to women to but blue pill with respect to everything else.

Go ahead and downvote away, guys. OP is trying to teach you something.

Rifleshoot · 2020-12-31T21:27:36+00:00

“Women are slaves to the world...”. We all are, until Christ frees us. To be honest, this reads like someone that is in the anger phase.

No, God does not will that you idolize your wife. If you are doing that, stop. Your idea of idolatry seems far too broad, to the point that simply trusting a good friend would be considered idolatry because you are “putting faith in something other than God.” Idolatry is, in my mind, putting something equal to, or above God. Your relationship with your wife is not in conflict with your relationship with God. It’s about prioritization, not exclusivity.

Title	Idolatry, The Marriage of the State
Author	where_muh_good_mens
Upvotes	8
Comments	41
Date	December 31, 2020 4:58 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RPChristians
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RPChristians/comments/kntkaz/idolatry_the_marriage_of_the_state/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RPChristians/idolatry-the-marriage-of-the-state.353572 https://theredarchive.com/post/353572