"There is nothing I can say to you that will magically make you not a bitch" -GayLubeOil

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July 7, 2016

"Betas like to be babysat. They love personalized attention and they fear rapid progress."

I discovered TRP about a year and a half ago - it took me six months to get a gym membership, and only recently did I manage to squat 225 for 3 sets of 5 with shitty form. It's not even impressive, and it took me almost a year.

I've harassed the hell out of most of the Senior Endorsed/RP Vanguards, to the point that both Archwinger and GLO literally stopped answering me, justified considering they had taken the time to respond numerous times and I just wasn't getting the message because of my ego.

The crux of the issue - my whole life I thought I was special. I thought I was smarter and better than most people, that I needed special attention.

Most of the messages I sent were along the lines of "I'm a special snowflake and I'm super smart, here are my credentials, help me, give me some personalized advice." The reason why this was a shitty thing to do is because there is plenty of advice in the thousands of archived posts. To their credit, every single one of the people I messaged did offer me advice, and most of it was pretty good. But it was all redundant advice, all things that have been said before.

My point is not that you shouldn't reach out to ask for advice - by all means, it's encouraged. But before you hit the post button in askTRP you need to be honest with yourself about whether you really need advice, or if you're just looking for a pussy plan because you don't want to put in the work.

About a month ago I asked GLO about starting my first cycle - his response (not in these words) was essentially "why the fuck are you going to take steroids when you don't even feed yourself properly. You don't gain weight. You can't even commit to a lifting plan and stick to it for eight weeks. Stop trying to cheat, you aren't smarter or better than decades of bodybuilding research. We know what works, you just aren't listening."

Being a social dynamo with your shit together, making good money, feeding yourself properly, having masculine hobbies, holding frame - none of it is easy. When you tear the skin of your palm because it's your first time deadlifting and it hurts like hell, you can either throw some tape on it and finish your sets, or you can be like most people and leave the gym early, run the pharmacy to get the lotion that smells the nicest and take a week off lifting to preserve your soft baby hands.

What no one in TRP really likes to upvote is that becoming great is hard. It sucks. It's a grind. We talk about being a top 20% man, but it's lost its meaning. Think about what that means - in a room with 100 people, you are objectively better than 80 of them. Sitting on your ass and reading an online forum isn't going to do that for you.

The solution isn't to find a motivational video or the best workout playlist, it's about developing the discipline to do what you have to do, regardless of your current state of mind. Even when you don't feel like cooking a healthy dinner after a hard workout, you do it because it has to get done, ordering a pizza won't give your body the nutrients it needs to recover. If you've been on TRP for a month then you pretty much get what it's all about, reading more of the posts here to get motivated isn't going to tell you anything you don't know. It'll just make you feel like you're progressing while you're the same little bitch that you always were. I know because I've been doing it for almost a year.

Ultimately there is nothing anyone can say to you that will magically make you not a bitch.

Post Information
Title "There is nothing I can say to you that will magically make you not a bitch" -GayLubeOil
Author FieldLine
Upvotes 751
Comments 166
Date 07 July 2016 07:31 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit TheRedPill
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/39460
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/4rqg37/there_is_nothing_i_can_say_to_you_that_will/
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betaframeliftthe red pillsnowflake

[–]1falling_tiger381 points382 points  (43 children) | Copy

There's the activity you should be doing, and many proxies for that activity which don't involve doing it.

You can lift, suck badly and yet still you lift. Or you can dick around, watch motivational videos, study proper form etc. Nothing achieved.

You can talk to everyone, approach girls or sit at home watch rsd videos.

You can fuck hot women or watch other people fucking (porn).

If you sense your mind struggling between two choices (and this takes ninja reflexes when you first start), immediately choose the harder one. You only considered the other out of laziness.

I constantly struggled with this when I first started lifting. The hamster whirred away: "you're tired"; "it's cold outside"; "you're hungry"; "you're still sore from martial arts"; "no drive because you fucked last night"; etc etc. That's why I created a system for myself. If I feel the hamster revving up I immediately say "fuck you" under my breath and get the barbell out. And I have never regretted the decision afterwards.

Mastery of women is nothing. The real challenge is mastery of self.

[–]ZorbaTHut46 points47 points  (11 children) | Copy

You can lift, suck badly and yet still you lift. Or you can dick around, watch motivational videos, study proper form etc. Nothing achieved.


I knew someone who wanted to learn programming.

I've been coding for well over two decades, I'm good at it, so he asked me what books he should buy and what language he should use. I gave him a few suggestions and sent him on his way.

About a month later he came back and asked if maybe he should be using a different language instead. I said, sure, I hear that's reasonable, I haven't used it myself, but go for it, I've heard good things about it.

A month later he came back and said he'd decided to start with the first language instead. Cool. Rock on. Get going.

A month later he asked if there were better books he should use that had been released in the last few months, or if the old suggestion was still the best option. I said it didn't really matter that much, he just needed to, you know, start.

A month later . . .

. . .

. . . several years of excuses later, he still hadn't started.

Starting from a good position is definitely a good idea. I wouldn't suggest that anyone go out there and try to learn programming without a guide; I also wouldn't recommend that anyone go out there and start lifting weights without a book to get them started and learn some reasonable form.

And there might be books that are better than other books, and maybe it's worth a day or two to find a good book. Maybe.

But at some point you gotta buckle down and start, or you're never going to get anywhere.

[–]--Visionary--24 points25 points  (5 children) | Copy

A month later . . . . . . . . . several years of excuses later, he still hadn't started.

As a physician who majored in economics and computer science (so I'm fairly financially savvy and have a fairly in depth experience to what you're speaking), I know far far far too many of these people.

It's somewhat amusing as I'm dealing three orthogonal subjects that people often wish to know about (medicine, finance, coding) and altogether the sheer volume of motivated non-actors that approach me for help to begin their tested inaction plan could stop oxen in their tracks.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

Upvote purely for describing them as orthogonal.

[–]ChiefBigLeaf1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Perhaps one of my favorite adjectives

[–]sxycol1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I'm curious how are you a physician that majored in economics and CS . As in high school major?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Major doesn't matter for medical school, in the US anyways, you have core prerequisite courses that you need to take. If anything, econ/cs is a leg up on the competition.

[–]--Visionary--0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

No, in college. Pre-med isn't a major.

Edit: In other words, a double major in Econ and Computer Science is very possible (mathematical overlap for classes), while pre-med can often be efficiently squared away with the use of some college credit from AP classes.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Could you recommend me those books on programming? I've been learning some basic java off of youtube videos but I'd like something better.

[–]ZorbaTHut0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I'm afraid most of my information is now a decade out of date, and focused on C++ anyway, which is increasingly a niche language. Can't link directly due to subreddit rules, but check out the subreddit "learnprogramming" - from what I understand, they have a great link resource.

[–]RPFlame0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It's as if you're talking about me. I was that bad. "Maybe the programming language is wrong", "maybe this", "maybe that", always jumping from learning the basic syntax of one language to another, procrastinated for years, feels almost forever.

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew32 points33 points  (0 children) | Copy

These words are extremely wise and invaluable:

"The greatest challenge you'll ever face is yourself"

[–]Trumpanoly11 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy

90% of life is just showing up. Repeat your actions with rational changes until desired results are achieved. Experiment often. Gain knowledge. Experience pain.

[–]NexusReflexX15 points16 points  (2 children) | Copy

great comment, it's hard so notice the male hamster sometimes when you've grown up listening to it your whole life

[–]BluestBlackBalls0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Have you seen the movie Revolver with Jason Statham

[–]Senior Contributordr_warlock9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

The second one I've given out today.

[–]MEpicLevelCheater[M] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]--Visionary--8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

Extremely key point, and likely salient for those new to the red pill, as they've self-selected themselves to be proxy activity hunters, since they're here for a reason. These proxy activities are almost crack and the newbie TRP'er's hamster is almost primed to respond to it.

To wit, using your examples:

"You're tired" is expanded to "You're tired, but if you read eleventy bajillion threads on reddit fitness, then you actually DID something, while in the meantime your abdominal pannus slowly starts to form crevasses that will soon hide lint the way your belly button does" by the male hamster.

Or "Don't approach that girl" turns into "Don't approach that girl, but instead go on your phone and read another 65 game articles at the bar while drinking your rum and coke to feel good so that when you go home you can think you progressed, and subsequently pass out in mid-masturbation mode on the floor of your house with cheetos of ambiguous age by your face" by the male hamster.

Basically a rule of thumb is if you're debating "action" or "inaction and going and reading about said action and then feeling as though you did action", it's probably best to try action in the first place.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Fuck, this is my entire life. I'm such a passive bitch.

[–]retired_destro6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

A messy success is always better than a perfect failure.

[–]trippinallday3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

"If your mind is struggling between two choices, immediately pick the harder one"

I used to have really bad anxiety and developed a system like this which helped tremendously. I'd always get caught up on stuff and worry about what would happen if I chose which choice, and eventually I decided if I had 2 choices and I was thinking about it for more than 5 seconds I'd just do what was most challenging/beneficial long term. This helped me so so much, both in worrying about stuff and doing more.

[–]1aguy011 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

At the same time, recognize how your body actually works and take the appropriate rest, deliberately , because you need it and it's the right thing to do. Don't overtrain yourself by trying to adhere to an unrealistic routine. Always remember most fitness and nutrition advice is coming from someone who is athletically inclined enough to make a career out of it, and your body may not respond appropriately. The clueless thing is to stay the wrong course or give up. The successful man is focused on the results and doing whatever it takes to get there, by recognizing others advice and using his own intelligence to create his own opinion about it. Trainers know generalizations. Only you know you.

[–]BluestBlackBalls0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Overtraining is Hamstering. If a novice feels 'over training' then they simply have failed to recover adequately. Eat and sleep more.

[–]1aguy010 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

No doubt calories and sleep go a long way. Have you ever done a cut?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

Spending lots of energy and time trying to fuck hot women is nothing but a man who is trying to band-aid a low self-esteem issue. It won't ultimately give you the satisfaction you're looking for.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

You should try keeping that male hamster of yours in check.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy

You should try analyzing my statement more closely.

"Spending lots of energy and time..." is referring to men who put 90% of their focus into the sole idea of chasing pussy. Focus on self, and the pussy comes automatically.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Aight, thought you were hamstering there. While I do agree, the only way to get real, high level HB10s is to devote your whole life to it. I wouldn't want to do that, I'll settle for 7-8s if it means I can focus on myself more than do everything I do just so I have a higher quality hole to stick my dick in.

I don't necessarily think men who live the lifestyle of chasing the best pussy in the world have low self-esteem, they just prefer to live that way and me and you obviously don't.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Well, I suppose HB 10s may perhaps be a different story. You're talking about A-list, celebrity women. But, if you're a male celebrity, wanting the celebrity model wife is an understandable thing. Nevertheless, it's probably mostly being done to show off to others, at least in my opinion, rather than having a quality mate at your side who will be there through thick and thin.

[–]Jaymilineal2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I am coming to have to choose two options a lot. I am going to try taking the harder route. Thanks for something to try.

[–]Stythe0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It's funny to hear this. I started doing the same thing years ago and it works. It gives you confidence. You know you're going to do something you don't want to do because "fuck it" it has to be done. That brings some real confidence.

[–]Sdom1-2 points-1 points  (2 children) | Copy

You can lift, suck badly and yet still you lift.

Yeah, and either you'll injure yourself and give up, or be one of those idiots who spends years in the gym with little to show for it.

Results in any field of endeavor are due to the same process - Intelligent effort consistently applied in a feedback loop. That's it, that sentence is rock fucking solid. Try to poke holes in it.

[–]1falling_tiger2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

The people I'm talking about are already fantastic at doing everything except the action itself. If they can start lifting (and that's the hard bit), they're more than capable of grabbing a copy of Rippetoe's Starting Strength and finding a qualified person to spot them until they've got form down.

[–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil169 points170 points  (17 children) | Copy

Iv talked to a lot of senior Red Pillers. I've read pretty much read everything they have written. What I can tell you is yes we really do want to help. However we are all deeply cynical that you won't help yourself.

People feel good when they receive advice. Some people even feel good when they get called out. But that feel good feeling is often used as an excuse to procrastinate.

The reason I push lifting so hard is at the end of the day I need you to become not a bitch. I have no interest in ball coddling a bunch of soft pussy faggots, like MGTOW does or the way PUA Gurus do. I have no interest in writing 29 different types of Alphas, find out which one you are or Why women are responsible for all your problems. I have no interest in stroking your tiny penis so you can give me an upvote.

I need you to lift hard And heavy because at the end of the day it's one of the few things that can rewire your brain into nonbitch mode. I need this because actually changing lives validates this whole Red Pill Endeavor. Also feminists hate beefy bros so I'm trying to make as many as possible.

[–][deleted] 56 points57 points  (8 children) | Copy

Also feminists hate beefy bros so I'm trying to make as many as possible.

I can't wait untill we start seeing articles written about how "large Men are problematic"

[–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (7 children) | Copy

[–]DoubleTappp8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

You've got to be fist fucking me.

[–]GuruDev10006 points7 points  (2 children) | Copy

Reading the article, I don't find it to be a gender issue. He was sentenced to 21 months for 'drug possession' which I think they are talking about steroids. Interestingly, the woman who shared his apartment was sentenced to 18 months for the same case even though she denied knowledge. Good enough.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

In Sweden jail aint shit, you get out long before your sentence if you don't stir up too much trouble, you can study and you get better food served than any school. But I'm totally surprised the woman was sentenced. That's some crazy shit in Sweden, especially since she denied it.

[–]IDefyAxioms4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Agreed. It's still fucking ridiculous, but for a different reason altogether.

As for the woman's sentencing, again I doubt it's a gender issue (though it's Sweden, so you never know). Being complicit in committing a crime is still illegal, but unless she was dealing as well it's not going to be as strong of a sentence.

[–]chostax-4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Meh, he was a drug dealer and they had their suspicions. Got a warrant, and arrested him. Title is sensationalistic.

[–]HeadingRed1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

So from "DWB" (driving while black) we now have "WWF" (walking while fit).

Come to think of it I do fit the profile of a guy who might do stuff or have a car.

That being said the guy did have a ton of drugs. I don't care that much what kind of drugs you do but perhaps if you are selling steroids it's time to think about a low profile.

It's like driving the cheech n chong van with Grateful Dead blaring out the windows as you pull up to your tie-dyed home.

[–]chances_are_ur_a_fag4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

and if you need any further proof of what he's saying, do some reading about Arnold, read his book, he literally became the man he is through lifting. it gives you everything you need.. health, confidence, ambition, dedication, discipline. the results of which is personal growth, success, good life, pussy. don't be a bitch, be like Arnold

[–]NaughtyFred2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Still looking for that ab exercise advice from you bro.

[–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil14 points15 points  (0 children) | Copy

[–]aanarchist5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

i would love it if you stroked my tiny penis. can it be my reward for deadlifting 3x bw for reps?

[–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil14 points15 points  (0 children) | Copy

yes. call me and ill bring my tweeters

[–]Sdom14 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Also feminists flick their beans to beefy bros so I'm trying to make as many as possible.

You know that's what they're thinking of.

[–]Freiling0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

29 different types of Alphas, find out which one you

Oh god, this is Men's Cosmo, isn't it?

[–][deleted] 25 points26 points  (4 children) | Copy

When most people get advice, they don't apply it to make their lives any better. Subconsciously, they're just looking for someone to tell them a "happily ever after" bedtime story.

The average beta when first unplugging does not truly understand the concept of trying. As in trying your hardest. Most people think they can just say "I did my best" and that qualifies as them doing their best.

In reality, said person put in a half-ass effort and the results show for it. Think about a subject like calculus. Most people view calculus as something abstract, confusing, and difficult to comprehend. However, there are COUNTLESS amounts of people who receive a B or greater in their calculus courses.

The people who get an F and say "I did my best" simply just didn't fucking do their best. They half assed the whole course and didn't put in the required time for study. Sure, there are people who can just naturally understand the material faster and more efficiently than others just as there are guys who are naturally strong and will have bigger arms than you even if they never went to the gym in their life and you've been lifting for a year. It's not a fucking excuse.

YOU put in the time and effort that is required for YOU to excel.

Going to the mall and half-heartedly approaching 5 girls you didn't even make eye contact with, slumped shoulders, and looking at your feet is not practicing pickup. That's the equivalent of picking daisies in the outfield at your little league baseball game when you should be looking alive and be ready for that fly ball coming out to center field.

When you want to set a new PR for your daily run, you don't just say "maybe I'll make a better time today".. You fucking push yourself to the brink of passing out from exhaustion to get 1 second faster.

What it all comes down to is discipline and applied knowledge. When you fundamentally understand these concepts and DO NOT BULLSHIT YOURSELF you will learn how to win, and it gets addictive.

A victory a day keeps the beta mindset at bay.

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew6 points7 points  (2 children) | Copy

You make some excellent points.

Regarding this:

"Think about a subject like calculus. Most people view calculus as something abstract, confusing, and difficult to comprehend. However, there are THOUSANDS of people who receive a B or greater in their calculus courses"

Great analogy! I almost failed high school, and was poor with math.

When I (after really trying hard) went to college, I got motivated and accepted I'd have to work hard if I wanted it. I gave 100%, I didn't make excuses, I put in the extra work, and it paid off. I did well and learned to appreciate trig., calculus, and more required for a STEM degree from a good school.

Those who really want something, will do what it takes. The rest are all talk and will never rise above average.

[–]hawkeaglejesus2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

"If it matters, you'll find a way. If not, you'll find an excuse."

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I kind of like how you wrote that. Good line.

[–]hunteeer0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Well put. But to struggle needs will to struggle and therefore a goal (that feels achievable) or any kind of motivation to get going. I think for most guys it's the same as it's for me, everything seems to be out of reach.

[–]Senior Contributordeepthrill17 points18 points  (0 children) | Copy

This idea of being smarter or better than most people is important to touch on.

If you read the book Peak, you'll realize even the "naturals" we take for granted as geniuses such as Einstein or Mozart or Steve Jobs, worked their fucking asses off the get there.

You may have a decent baseline, but that just gives you a leg up on the initial spurt. For example, IQ is correlated with chess ability. But only for the early stages of life and only up to a certain mediocre level. After a certain point (both in terms of age and chess skill) the IQ correlation disappears.

If you read The Way of the SEAL you'll realize that physical genetic ability might get your foot in the door, but nothing substitutes for the extremely grueling grind to achieve greatness.

I can go on and on with other citations but the point is the elites work their asses off. Sitting around reading trp or learning proper form or being genetically "gifted" gets your foot in the door to start working your asses off. Literally nobody in all of human history achieved greatness without hard (and smart) work.

[–]Rebikhan31 points32 points  (0 children) | Copy

"Ultimately there is nothing anyone can say to you that will magically make you not a bitch."

No, but having red pill tell you that no one cares about you if you're a little bitch is a damn good first step.

Excellent post man.

[–]ModeratorPaperStreetVilla52 points53 points  (1 child) | Copy

Don't say that people can't get it. This man gets it.

[–] points points | Copy

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[–]bornredd89 points90 points  (6 children) | Copy

Yes, but the things it does to your body are nothing short of miraculous.

My wife has started taking videos of me doing deadlifts because she watches them when she masturbates.

[–] points points | Copy

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[–]TryDoingSomethingNew9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

LOL if that's true about your wife, that's awesome. Good for you, dog.

[–]bornredd20 points21 points  (0 children) | Copy

She is a horny woman and it has gotten so much better since I am back into lifting. Workouts now double as foreplay in the bornredd household.

[–]natman2939[🍰] 7 points8 points  (12 children) | Copy

What's harder? a rigorous deadlifting routine or a rigorous cardio routine?

As much as I'd love to be jacked for all the obvious reasons , the thing that would make me the happiest athletically would be having triathlon level lungs

[–]TheDialecticParadox12 points13 points  (0 children) | Copy

Why do things because they're harder? Sometimes that's not always the best option. Although it's the main reason, lifting has more benifits than just improving your character, it gives you the physique that women sexually desire.

Cardio will not give you a better physique than lifting weights, in terms of attractiveness to the opposite sex.

And don't bullshit me and say you're not concerned about what chicks think about your aesthetic appearance.

[–] points points | Copy

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[–]natman2939[🍰] 4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy

I respectfully don't think that's the best way to gain the kinda cardio I'm talking about.

If you did that and only that and tried to run a marathon you'd be in trouble

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

yeah lol how is that an answer....not even close to the cardio you're talking about. With that said, i'd say a rigorous cardio routine is harder

[–]FistFullOfBitches 4 points4 points [recovered] | Copy

I know my cardio - trained in martial arts for 25 years. All I'm saying is, don't knock the cardio you get from long, heavy sets of deads. Or squats.

[–]el_superbeastooo0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Fucking this! I run a decent amount on the weekend (about 15km) and still get pretty winded doing 5x10 deadlifts as per the Wendler 531 BBB program. I find that kind of volume really improves your posture too.

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I'm short on cardio, but honestly doing a "heavy" weights day including deadlifts is amazingly exhausting. I'm incredibly sore today (2 days after lifting) all down my back and legs because of it too.

Definitely understand needing cardio longetivity, though. That got exposed quickly when training for fighting...poor cardio = bad fighter.

[–]natman2939[🍰] 8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah I'm reminded of Jon Jones who started deadlifting before his last fight and talked about how he was stronger than ever but his cardio looked like crap And his coach (The famous Greg Jackson) blamed it on the deadlifting before Jones had even stepped out of the cage

Same sort of with Conor McGregor packing on all that muscle in his last fight.

That's why I've always been more interested in a Nick/Nate Diaz style of training. I want to be able to play a game of tag with my niece and actually have her tire out before me

With my weird heart conditions I don't know how realistic it is but I want to try

[–]JimmyJiangh0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Cardio isn't going to give you the masculine and attractive appearance that lifting does. If you're doing super sets and lifting, it's going to be decent cardio but obviously nothing close to purely cardio workouts.

[–]purplecabbage5 points6 points  (8 children) | Copy

Would you be gracious enough to point me to resources for dead lifting for guys with problem lower backs? I've pulled lower back muscles doing seated row (among other less glamorous ways).

[–]westhewolf9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

The real key: deadlifts should be a push up from your legs, hips, and ass. Your back should be pulling only minimally. If anything, the pull in your upper body should be coming from your core up through your chest, and from your shoulder down to the middle of your back.

Practice very light reps while focusing on getting the push from your ass and hips, while keeping your back stable. Once you feel like you can stand up without pulling from the lower back, try increasing weight.

It's really a full body workout, and if your lower back is more sore than your ass, shoulders, and core, then you are either really weak in those other areas or have low body awareness/flexibility and are unable to pull those muscle groups together to stabilize your lower back and total body balance.

[–]lilbro19841 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Improve your mobility. Look into Becoming a Supple Leopard by Kelly Starrett, the holy grail if you have problem muscles .

[–]thetotalpackage71 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I'm 40 and have had my share of back issues. I am running starting strength and I deadlift 3 times a week with a slight modification using the trap bar. Google it to see what it is. Basically you can stand inside it so it takes some leverage off of your spine. My back has never felt better in my entire life.

[–]purplecabbage0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Good idea, we have one at my gym. I'm 43! Dont want to injure myself at this stage of the game. It's amazing how your body changes at this age. Lifting is a way to hold on to youth as much as possible.

[–]DisgruntledWolverine1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

weighted back extensions and stretching as well

[–]Project_Thor1 point2 points  (10 children) | Copy

Lifting and not deadlifting isn't lifting. You need to do the big 4 Bench being the worst of em.

[–]artibonite2 points3 points  (9 children) | Copy

id say OHP is the worst of em IMO (if that is in your big 4). Could easily be replaced with chin-ups/rows for greater overall gains.

[–]Project_Thor5 points6 points  (7 children) | Copy

You are vastly confused about lifting.

[–]artibonite3 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy

What I am trying to say is that for overall strength/mass gains, OHP is the weakest of the four. Chin-ups are more effective than both OHP and Bench at building mass, as you are moving a lot more weight and using more/larger muscle groups (Lats buddy). It's the same reason deadlifts and squats are more effective at building mass than bench and ohp (go figure). Larger/more muscle groups + more weight = better anabolic response.

You can claim I'm confused about lifting, yet my lifts are all considerably better than yours, and i'm taller (6'3) and the same weight (170lbs). Yea i took a look at your recent post history :)

Read this; http://strengtheory.com/a-deadlift-pr-and-some-thoughts-on-overhead-pressing/ he knows a lot more than both of us, and doesn't do any overhead work.

Please do explain how i'm confused about lifting though. Give it some thought this time

Edit: here's a lat spread for ya http://imgur.com/ZqeCyQ7 just so you know im not bullshitting you

[–]thetotalpackage70 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

You're lats look great, but your shoulders would look a lot better if you OHP'd. Mark Rippetoe is probably the most widely known and followed strength coach and he has OHP listed as one of his main lifts.

[–]artibonite1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

well aware of my lack of shoulder development (I am 6'3 after all). You can follow 60 year old rippetoe's advice all you want, I lift for strength/gainz. And honestly, even for aesthetics i prefer big lats (V-taper) over shoulder development anyway. Ask the ladies what they think :P

if I had to choose between more lat development and more shoulder development, id go with lats everyday. Chin-ups have lots of carryover for the deadlift as well. OHP arguably has little to no carryover for bench (once again, read the greg nuckols post on strength theory)


[–]fingerthemoon0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

I do both on the same day starting with OHP. My gym doesn't have a belt for weighted chin-ups so I'll be buying my own soon. I'm up to 3x10 so I'll need to add weight soon. I like chin-ups over pull-ups for the bicep work but thinking of doing pull-ups maybe every third time just for the variation.

I've been following SL 5x5 for 3 1/2 months now but I'm not a total beginner because I did crossfit for a couple years. I just decided on Friday to start doing power cleans in place of squats every other time because of my bad knee. So in this order, workout A - squat, bench, row, dips, dragonflies, pushups. Workout B - cleans, OHP, deadlift, pull-ups, toes-to-bar, bicep curls.

I like to do cleans. The explosiveness really gets my heart pumping. And for me personally doing squats 3 times a week is a little stressful on my knee that I had surgery on many years ago.

I've also been mountain biking after lifting 3-4 times a week but now that my lifts are getting heavier I've decided to cut back and just go once or twice a week.

I don't know why I'm telling you all this, guess I just want to feel a part of the conversation... and maybe you have some advice about my routine. I'm not trying to compete, my goals are just health and happiness. I like being strong and enjoy working out.

[–]artibonite0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Crazy about the knee problems, did you damage your ACL? I fully ruptured mine and never got the surgery, can squat without discomfort nowadays luckily. I usually squat 3x a week, dl 2x a week. Bench 5x, Chins 5x. I cut back on the intensity slightly in favor of more overall volume. Don't really focus too much on accessory movements, just whatever weakness I need to work on at the time, right now its OHP 2-3 times a week.

As for chinup variations, I usually do all three - pronated, supinated, and neutral grip - in the same workout. I start with a 45lb plate @ 8-10 reps. Usually pyramid up to a heavy set of 3-5, around 60-80 lbs.

I used to love doing some of the olympic lifts, especially power cleans. I haven't messed around with it so much lately, I find the explosive movements have the biggest risk of injury, so I just avoid.

I do pause work now with all major lifts. Especially bench, I highly recommend only doing pause work. My bench has been progressing like crazy since I made the switch.

Sorry it took me a while to get back, had a crazy RP weekend xD

Yeah I just keep it simple man, and it keeps me coming back to the gym every day. I don't waste my time with lifts that dont offer a ton of value.

[–]fingerthemoon0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I tore my meniscus and had part of it removed when I was a teenager. Then I injured my knee a few years ago doing front squats and was unable to do much for a few weeks, so now I'm very careful and if I feel any pain or even stiffness I take it easy until it's gone. I deloaded 10 lbs and squatted slowly yesterday and feel fine today. I think rotating squats and cleans is good for me. My bench has surpassed my squat because of this but I don't care that much. I've seen guys hurt themselves by pushing too hard. My buddy had the same issue and he blew out his knee and had to get surgery and stop for six months.

I hadn't done cleans in awhile and my traps and forearms were sore the next day, so this tells me I'm pushing harder there, which is good. Like I said before, cleans got my heart rate up and sweating good. It's more explosive than the other lifts and feels like a good addition to my routine, especially since I'm not doing as much cardio these days. It's technical, but all the OL are once you get heavy. The only problem I have is hitting my pelvic bone sometimes, but practice makes perfect.

Right now I have 2 workouts that I rotate and go every other day. Rest is when the magic happens and when I come back I can hit it harder. I also take sleep seriously and nap when I feel like it on rest days. Stan Efferding says you shouldn't lift more than 3 times a week and only for about an hour. I already spend close to two hours and go every other day, but sometimes I'll take the whole weekend off or go mountain biking and not lift. I listen to my body and sometimes push really hard and other times take it easy. Slow and steady wins the race, and more importantly you don't get injured.

I've also been ketogenic for about 10 months and still getting stronger while slowly losing body fat.

[–]DisgruntledWolverine0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I fucking love deadlifting...

I weigh between 155 and 160 on a typical day and I am up to 245 and working my way to 315 doing 5x5.

I love pulling hard as fuck on that bar and grunting as I make it do what I want.

That is power

[–]LaRedPill0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy

I haven't found it that HARD actually, I'm doing SL5x5 and even if I just started getting serious, I can raise 70kg with not much effort, even if I am just squatting 65kgs and benching 45k

I'm probably doing something bad but I had the gym owner watch me and apparently Im doing it fine...

[–][deleted] 15 points15 points | Copy

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[–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil17 points18 points  (0 children) | Copy

My 49 Kilo girlfriend can easily deadlift 70. Actually I think her 5rm is 90. If my petite girlfriend can out deadlift you and you are a healthy man of military age, then you arnt pushing yourself.

[–]Marr0w12 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

Agreed. While most exercises benefit from a combination of strength and hypertrophy, (working anywhere between 5 and 12 reps) deadlift is about fucking your cns for max strength and testosterone production, so i usually recommend working up to 90% of your 1rm and doing sets of 1-3. (I weigh 80kg and dl 195)

[–]artibonite0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

76kg here, im usually doing 275x8x3, or 315x5x3 and that seems to work fine for me >.<

mix it up a bit, dl is an excellent exercise for many rep ranges.

Edit: I find that romanian deadlifts are great for enhancing mobility and strengthening the posterior-chain, which is usually lagging behind for most having trouble with the DL

Edit2: I am 6'3 btw, not a manlet

[–]StoicBeard0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

6'3 and 76kg? that's really skinny

[–]omega_fat-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Should have learned the form and only lifted 1x5 for the lowest weight possible (40kg or whatever it is in lb). You injured your back badly because of your own stupidity unfortunately.

[–]zedsdedforever8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

I think another point to add is men are afraid to find out if they don't have "it". In spec ops indoc, so many people try out and most of them fail due to not being able mentally to accept the grind. I have a strong belief that a strong framed man can fight, push, and fuck a problem to death before he has to ask for help. The ultimate beta test is he willing to die to get to where he wants to be in the face of failure?

[–]MetalZeroSix15 points16 points  (1 child) | Copy

Great post; I respect your introspection. A lot of this stuff isn't particularly complicated, but that doesn't mean its easy. I imagine it can be frustrating for the senior endorsed guys as they repeat the same things time after time to guys who want to hear something different.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy


One of my biggest "ah-hah" moments with TRP is that.. no it's not really that confusing or complex. But it is definitely really fucking hard.

[–][deleted] 16 points17 points  (5 children) | Copy

Welp was about to skip the gym for a beer but am walking in as we speak. Thanks for the daily kick in the ass.

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew-3 points-2 points  (4 children) | Copy

I think you should still have ONE beer tonight, but as a reward to yourself after you hit the gym and honestly work hard.

I prefer the feeling when I feel like I "earn" my simple pleasures.

Tip 'o the hat to you for staying motivated and going to workout, too.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (2 children) | Copy

One beer per workout is like a hamster on its wheel

[–]Enjoyitbeforeitsover0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I'm confused by your comment. Are you saying drinking a beer after a strong workout will impede results?

[–]probpoopin6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'm so happy you wrote this. I've said it, and I'll say it again. TRP is not a magic bullet to your problems. To fix your problems and truly better yourself, you will have to work. It will be uncomfortable, it will hurt. You will have to sacrifice things, like your time because you are now going to the gym at least three times per week. I have started to see so many people coming here and asking for some magical sage advice to fix their relationship, or to get better results in the gym, make more money, whatever. The answer is hard work, and then more hard work. Once you spend a year at the gym, get your career and finances in order, make time for yourself to find true happiness/meaning, the rest is easy as pie. You will see the world and people for what it is. You won't if you don't do the work.

People take the fat short billionaire archetype and say, look, he got the girl, and apply that logic to them. They will skip the "hard" stuff, and try to make up for it in another area. Take the red pill fat guy as an example. They will come here and specifically look at something like passing a shit test, how to use dread game better, or being fun and funny, and try to do that more so because it comes easy to them. Completely skipping all the stuff that says, lift weights and get in shape. That stuff, after all, is really hard. That stuff is also exactly what will forge you into a man once you accomplish them, and it will carry over into every part of your life for the better.

[–]Beegsi_6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

Self-discipline is thrown around , but often misunderstood by the masses. It's a cultivated skill, no different than cooking, writing, etc. -Axel Page

[–]10xdada5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

This was pretty close:

"You need to recognize and admit that you've been a total bitch this whole time, and when you can accept that this is true, it will be almost impossible for you to go back and be like that again."

There is no magic, just acceptance and then work.

[–]cockatricejr4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Don't forget that motivation, as most things in life, is something you can buy with money.

Creating a new habit is hard, but there are shortcuts if you've got money. I've been paying a personal trainer in the past 4 months and I finally got the body that I always wanted. I feel like I created the habit already and could keep going without him, but I'm so happy with the results that I wanna see where he can take me.

Just yesterday, I went on a second date, and I was making out with that girl, she would caress my chest from underneath my shirt and say "wow, you're so manly". This may be an universal truth.. chicks like muscles. And I even consider myself a leather-jacket-rock n roll guy who doesn't really fit the strong type..

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Fuck, i'm doing same shit for 5 years

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (4 children) | Copy

I have legitamitely lifted 80% of the days in the past decade. Tonsils removed? Lifted the next day. Flu? Keep a hoodies on and bang it out. Crippling depression? Fuck you, it is the only thing keeping you from killing yourself.

Lifting is the purest form of the struggle, mind over matter. If you can't make yourself go to the gym when you don't feel like it, then you are fucked as a man.

[–]TRPrinny18 points19 points  (2 children) | Copy

Agree, but please don't go to the gym if you have the flu. I can't stand people in the gym, office or elsewhere who are "toughing it out" while contagious. Unless your plan is to weaken the competition...

[–]steven250210 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

..and you can kill yourself when training while having the flu.. this is just really stupid.

[–]_TheRP-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

I had my appendix taken out and lifted chest 7 days later with the bandages still on under my shirt. Couldn't wait any longer.

Two things kill my gym motivation - already having a significant number (>4) of good looking women ready to fuck me whenever I want, and getting high. Probably why I haven't smoked since college.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

You're officially the friend I talked to for ten years who had an arrogant, whiny excuse for every piece of advice he requested. And for that, FUCK YOU.

Now that that's over with, my apologies, and thank you for admitting the real issue. It feels like people are more prone to have an excuse nowadays. In prior generations, it seemed that men would just admit they weren't going to pursue such feats and would admit shortcomings. Now that everyone is special, cognitive dissonance prevents anyone from admitting any faults.

[–]reddumpling2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Ikr. My friend needed money for expenses and such, but refused to 'lower himself to their level' by waitering. At that point of time he was tutoring but got flaked often by the parents.

After suggesting one too many times I gave up when I realise that he does not want the money enough to change his ways.

[–]MeiFriend2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Really. I stopped paying an expensive gym far from home, stopped carrying headphones to the gym, haven't even thought of buying protein powder or new workout clothing. Not that these are bad things, the protein is specially helpful, but none of these luxuries give me more muscle than getting off my ass.

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I have found in life that we need to worry about the fundamental things first, then the details.

So few do the first!

[–]MeiFriend2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yes, you see the cool GP moto racers and we tend to worry first about getting the gear, the sportsbike and the sponsor before learning how to drive one.

[–][deleted] 2 points2 points | Copy

[permanently deleted]

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

I bought shin guards after getting abrasions on my shin(s). Helps a lot, and can still wear shorts.

Pants can still transfer abrasions unfortunately.

[–]srlbambam0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

You should have someone check your form. Everyone I've seen knocks their shins up a little, but you don't drag the bar up your shins.

[–]1Original_Dankster2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

I've permanently worn the hair off my legs in two strips up the fronts of my shins.

I should probably ask for some criticism of my DL form some time...

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yes, normally I don't but it only takes one little mistake to leave marks on your legs. Once was enough for me.

Also, heavy weight is harder to handle, too.

[–]bourbonhipster0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

bars with a sharp toothy grip will tear skin at higher weight.

[–]RPFlame1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's crazy how the ones who grew up being told that they are special snowflakes and that they can achieve so much more are the ones that they get overwhelmed and end up failing because they struggle with two things instead of one - the natural difficulty of tackling a new task AND their deeply ingrained belief that they shouldn't.

[–]TheUnknownMe1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Great advice. What we should do is turn off our brains more often, it's just noise that will try to turn you around from your goals: "I'm not inspired" "I'm tired today" "I'm... [INSERT GENERIC EXCUSE]".

Fuck that noise, we're better than that.

[–]1nzgs1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Often when people ask for advice they're really just looking for validation for what they already want to do.

[–]SH3RL0CK30 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Great post. This is especially useful for someone new to TRP like me. Thanks @GayLubeOil

[–]Doc_redpill0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This is a great fucking post.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

If you've been on TRP for a month then you pretty much get what it's all about, reading more of the posts here to get motivated isn't going to tell you anything you don't know.

Needed more than a month to get out of the anger phase. It came down to actually internalizing the lessons, rather than superficially reading the posts and getting angry at my past behaviors. Took awhile.

[–]claptilley0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Well said. I'm about 1.5 years into reading and have only started eating clean and exercise since February. I have to meditate often that the goals I seek are coming in time. This is the beginning. Never stop getting better. The last sentence of your post is now saved and will be my meditative focus if I begin to sway or drop the ball.

[–]worktillyouburk0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy


Have started going back to the gym for the past 8 weeks. have lost 15 pounds, gone from an XL to a L.

Best part morning wood is back everyday, harder than ever.

[–]idontwanttostart0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I kind of like my baby hands soft lol

[–]RPFlame0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Think about what that means - in a room with 100 people, you are objectively better than 80 of them.

You reminded me of an observation I made years ago, when I contemplated on why average-to-cute girls hang out with literal trash girls. Because why put down the work to improve when all you can do is pick friends that make you look good in comparison?

It takes balls to dare being the "worse" in the room, because there it's either letting your self-esteem realize how shit you are or swim and see things competitively. Which is why in the programming world the common saying goes "try to be surrounded by better people".

[–]arena_say_what0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

wait, red pill endorses steroids?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

It took me about 3 months after discovering TRP before I decided to start doing something about my Dad-Bod. I cut for about 5 months and lost 15 lbs, then started lifting about six months ago. It's amazing what a year of moderate effort with diet & gym can do to your appearance and self-confidence.

[–]hunteeer0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

A year of struggle and hard dieting, losing 50kg+ and gaining strength on every exercise, but I still look like shit. Either most of the guys on TRP are just slightly out of shape or I have serious body dismorphia

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

What's your BMI and body fat percentage?

[–]hunteeer0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

BMI is 33 with 20% bf according to 3 fold method

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The solution isn't to find a motivational video or the best workout playlist, it's about developing the discipline to do what you have to do, regardless of your current state of mind. Even when you don't feel like cooking a healthy dinner after a hard workout, you do it because it has to get done, ordering a pizza won't give your body the nutrients it needs to recover

Solid advice. Many times I find myself walking into the gym, thinking about how I really don't feel like being there for 2+ hours lifting and doing cardio. But then I always convince myself that I have no choice, and always thank myself after I finish.

[–]Govedo130 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

My father today said to me: You seems thay you don't care any more for others. Something bad happened to you.

In fact currently my one year progress- I am in best shape of my life. I trimmed the fat, landed a new better paid job, while working on 2 side projects. Got 2 nice plates, fucked women that would not even never look upon me in the past.

I am currently harassed by my family because of my progress-you eat too much meat, you doesn't even drink, you spend too much time in the gym.... etc....

[–]666Evo0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Fuck. I'm a couple of days late to this post but it has hit me like a tonne of bricks.

I've been here a year. My lifting progress has hit a plateau because "it's cold outside". I have no real hobbies outside of video games because "I don't have time".

I'm a bitch...

My friends were impressed with a 157kg dead lift so I felt good enough about myself to slack off. My friends are fat and weak. Eddie Hall lifting 500kg is the type of man I should be aiming to impress...

[–]ADW830 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

"Sitting on your ass and reading an online forum isn't going to do that for you."

Oh fuck.

[–]6482620 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy

Good post!

Just a thing on steroids, and specifically testosterone:

You'd make more gains taking a testosterone cycle while sitting on your ass compared to the gains you are making now without testosterone. GLOs point, I assume, is that the gains of a dedicated person compared to a lazy one is YUGE! And also that half the point of the lifting thing is to developing your discipline.

The numbers speak for themselves:

  • Group 1 (no exercise, natural) experienced no significant changes. No surprise there.

  • Group 2 (no exercise, drug use) was able to build about 7 pounds of muscle. That’s not a typo. The group receiving testosterone injections and NOT working out at all gained 7 pounds of muscle.

  • Group 3 (exercise, natural) was able to build about 4 pounds of muscle.

  • Group 4 (exercise, drug use) was able to build about 13 pounds of muscle.

Edit: Something about discipline. Is importanter yo.

Edit 2: Comparing shit.

[–]natman2939[🍰] 7 points8 points  (5 children) | Copy

We all know roids do what they do

But no one should encourage anyone to use them if they're not already actually working

It's a bitch move. Maybe you'll gain 7 pounds of muscle but you'll still be weak in all the ways that matter

[–]6482620 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

It's a bitch move. Maybe you'll gain 7 pounds of muscle but you'll still be weak in all the ways that matter

People should make their own decisions, but we can explain to people how steroids work and what they will do. The muscle is there and it will give the added esthetical benefit some people are looking for. If that's all he is looking for then good for him - he found and efficient way to reach his goals.

People telling me what to do without telling me why I should follow their advice other than "I've been around", often isn't helpful. I demand more.

[–]natman2939[🍰] 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

All I'm saying is a lot of what we were talking about in this thread and in TRP in general is becoming disciplined and learning to work hard to be one of those "top 20%" men

And the whole idea of self-improvement is learning how to put in the work and choosing the harder path when faced with constant opportunity to take days off and be soft

And just taking some roids to get a quick 7lbs but not learning to work may help you if all you want is that 7lbs but your lifestyle and overall self has not improved. You're not stopping your beta ways if you still want to just sit there and do nothing

[–]hunteeer0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Believe me or not, there are guys out there that want to do nothing and just look for a way to get along. Some guys just want to live an acceptable life and don't have to be the best all the time.

[–]TiredUnicorn0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

We encourage efficiency just about everywhere. But using steroids is considered "cheating" despite the fact that it is just one of many tools that can be used to reach your goals.

[–]TheDialecticParadox0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Not just that, but people who aren't experienced with gym diet, routine and lifestyle will lose pretty much all their gains once they come off.

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

"becoming great is hard. It sucks. It's a grind"


[–]PawnToKing0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

ordering a pizza won't give your body the nutrients it needs to recover.

Recovery isn't really about nutrients and they're much easier to get anyway. It's about calories and protein and even it's not thaaat hard. You should eat healthy because it's good for your longevity, hair, skin, and sleep.

[–]1PantsonFire12340 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Why are you telling people what to do if you can't even Lift properly yourself? It still boggles my mind how far off some guys are.

The very fact that you tried to sucker up to some of the endorsed guys speaks volumes. It's female bitchy behavior where you try to fish for endless validation from someone with 'special status' in order to feed the ego. Instead of actually getting good at something. Even this post is just another attempt to get your energy levels rocking so you may finish that one lousy set at the gym.

I'm hammering on you because you haven't woken up yet. You think you have but it's still very much ingrained in your psyche. In the end it's only keeping you down. Let it go man.

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I wouldn't say he is telling people what to do as much as reflecting on his own mistakes and passing his observations along to contribute.

[–]1PantsonFire12340 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yes and no, the subtext of this post reflects his personality and stance in life. He's admitting his mistakes only as a partially subconscious ruse to garner more validation. The post is all about 'me' 'listen you' 'cause me'.

I'm pointing this out because self awareness would be the greatest thing that could happen for OP right now. And he's already halfway there gleaning from this post. I've been there myself and still struggle with it sometimes.

[–]aanarchist-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy

you underestimate the power of a great playlist.

[–]THE_StrongBoy -1 points-1 points [recovered] | Copy

That all being said, I think everyone who has the money needs to vet a GOOD personal trainer, work with him for 6 months work by yourself for 6 months, then hit a cycle of test + HGH.

I have lifted natural my whole life, about 8 years total now and to this day never taken hormones. The reality is though, that everyone has a natural genetic limit to the amount of mass they can put on and maintain without the Yung Testosterone. This way you could hit that limit in about 1.5 years. Starting from 100% noob. This is technically speculation but I think I could coach a newb to it so it seems reasonable

If I went back to the beginning it's what I would do. It's one of life's only cheat codes and if you have money and your primary care physician on board you can do it with minimal side effects.

[–]TheDialecticParadox1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

Agree. Spent one yeat at the gym and made great gains. Injured myself. Lost all my gains. Started a testosterone cycle and went back to the gym. Made about two years worth of gains in 3 months.

[–]bourbonhipster1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

This shit right here is what cheapens natural effort and remarkably natural feats of strength. but hey lever up buttercups

[–]TheDialecticParadox1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

How does it cheapen natural effort? Everyone seems to think because you're injecting hormones into your body you just stop trying. I put in 100% in every session just as a natty lifter would, but I make much better gains.

[–]aazav-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy

"There is nothing I can say to you that will magically make you not a bitch" -GayLubeOil

"Be like GayLubeOil" - me

Problem solved.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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