I can absolutely assure you that if you follow the advice given on TRP you will have everything you want from women long, long before you achieve satisfaction in any other major aspect of your life. Truthfully, what TRP is asking from women as a community is incredibly small. Though you might think you're putting a greater emphasis on women since swallowing the pill, really you've reassigned them to a niche part of your life meant to fulfill biological desires and provide transient emotional connection. The asking price is low, far lower than the blue pill fantasy had you believe.
What do you actually need from women?
To understand what I mean above, you have to look at what you're actually looking for from women and then from everyone and everything else in your life. I believe I need 3 things from women.
1) Sex, when I want it.
2) Commitment, without giving it in return.
3) The ability to be left the fuck alone when I want, without worrying about future consequences.
In the TRP model of the world, that's all a man needs from women, and he can achieve it in 1-2 years of taking care of his appearance (lifting and dieting), learning game and amused mastery, and acclimating himself to the idea that all women are replaceable. Sex when you want it happens around plate #3. Getting commitment without giving it in return is a matter of learning to pick out the right type of women. Abundance mentality takes care of #3.
What do you need from everyone else?
1) Respect
2) Companionship and camaraderie
3) Loyalty
These are far higher asks. Respect is earned within a community. You can be rejected by 99% of all women and still have 3 plates by next Monday, just approach 300 girls. However, you have to earn the respect of the majority of your community to qualify as "well-respected." The blue pill world places the far greater responsibilities of companionship and loyalty on a single person: a woman. At TRP we recognize the glaring instability in that and instead pass these roles on to our friends, family, and community. Blue pill men cannot get what they want from women (or life) because they ask these things from a single woman and expect to get them consistently for the rest of their lives.
What do you need from everything else?
1) Comfort and financial freedom
2) A sense of self-fulfillment through your career and hobbies
Now we're talking about hefty demands, especially #2. Most people work their entire lives towards these things and never achieve them. TRP teaches discipline, ambition, and drive. This community encourages paths towards financial independence such as business ownership and smart investing. However, there are no shortcuts to these things. TRP can only really open your eyes to the idea that your options are more numerous than you think (e.g. you don't have to follow the prescribed path), but it cannot put in the years or more likely decades of work that it requires to become truly satisfied with what you've accomplished.
This is the true advantage of swallowing the pill. You've reassessed your priorities, you've discarded the enormously stupid idea that a single woman should be responsible for key aspects of your happiness, and you've opened your eyes to what it requires to feel independent and fulfilled.
Here’s the main takeaway:
TRP is primarily a sub devoted to sexual strategy, but understand that a direct consequence of the form of sexual strategy we preach is that women have become a tiny aspect of your life. Getting what you want from women is easy once you swallow the pill and reassess your expectations of them. Like all things, anything worth having is going to require hard work. The vast majority of your focus should be on ensuring you are able to work towards those other five pillars of success, all while keeping your dick wet enough that it's off your mind.
I have noticed this happening in my own life . I used to hunch over dating apps . Hoping / needing a woman to go out with me. Hoping to get a like back and when I did becoming so invested in the singular opportunity to make this woman my dream come true.
It's been about 10 months of reading and applying TRP concepts to my life and that need for validation and support is gone . I still fuck with the dating apps but it's different . I get matches and unlike before I get unsolicited women reaching out to me every so often , one of those becoming a nearby plate I hangout with every so often . That underlying compulsion though that overwhelming need to be told that I matter specifically from a woman I had sexual interest in is gone and I find myself more interested in being a better man today than I was yesterday much more often . It's so strange This sub became a way for me to become a womanizing whore with an infinite rotation of women and the closer I get to that reality the more I realize I don't want to invest that level of time into becoming the image I originally imagined.
My sex life is worlds better than it was when I started reading this sub but Since I like myself now and because women are a side effect of a better life I am much more interested in living my life and sometimes that's with a chick by my side but some night's it's just not . Good shit in this post.
Ditto on the dating app
I'm conventionally attractive and in a big city, so getting matches is like breathing air for me. But every step afterwards, from getting the number to getting the meet up to impressing the chick enough to get sex was so time consuming and annoying that at some point I just looked back at all the effort I put in with getting nothing in return...
There comes a time where men should realize that sex and getting sex is not something that you should view as improving your value. You owe women nothing, not even the burden of performance. Don't feel embarassed because some woman rejected you, or doesn't want to see you again. You are still growing. We all are.
The problem with big cities is the overwhelming choice women have in them. They always have 5000 guys pursuing them. As a result, they will only accept perfection. If you aren't perfect in every way, there's another 4999 who might be, so why waste their time on you?
Yes, you aren't. That's why you tell yourself "fuck that shit" and lift, sidebar, start killing it at your job/studies, improve your MAP, improve your life's mission in general.
Then suddenly there will be that one woman in your surroundings that will start pursuing you.
And you will find that you don't care about her at all.
Most women also will not go through 4999 men that are messaging them.
They'll go through like 2-4.
So in actual reality: You are browsing through 10,000s of "muted" / "closed" / "already-found-boyfriend" profiles. Profiles that will NEVER be checked by the person who is receiving the messages/likes.
Not to mention, some apps, are designed in a way, where they aren't always running. They aren't getting pushes of data. So people use the tinder app for a few weeks, then they do a few dates, then they stop, and suddenly, they don't go into the app again for 5-12 months. The app doesn't message anyone because the app hasn't been run in months.
To keep users active, what the app will do is message a significant portion of its inactive users after a looooooong long time (but this only started in late 2015/2016) and I don't even think it works usually.
So basically, you're in a deadzone, full of jellyfish and rocks... no one is really in the playground full of profiles.
50,000x more chance of you meeting girls if you just go to bars more.
This is true, i have started receiving messages on Tinder from girls 90+ miles away.
The message is ALWAYS the same.
"Just saying hi"
Yup, right on the money brother. Couple that with short attention spans, and they will essentially only accept the most perfect guys within a vicinity of a 2 minute walk. And being NYC, that's not even unreasonable.
Which only strengthens my point that whether you get laid or not is never a reflection on you.
That's a two-way street, we also have so many options in big cities, it's fantastic. And let's be honest, most guys have horrible game and constantly demonstrate low value. That's not necessarily the toughest competition.
I don't even know how to comment on this. Just, yeah, I totally agree with everything you're saying. Everyone on TRP should read this, and I have no idea how to even get the conversation started down here. You've pretty much covered it. People come to TRP and their entire life becomes women. What they don't realize is that they're systematically phasing women out of their life and reassigning them to about the same function and importance in your life as a sex bot with high quality AI.
The part that gets lost on people is that you literally open doors for yourself without making any sacrifices. Most men, especially successful men, either choose to have a girlfriend/wife or simply forego sex because they need to focus on their careers. I get laid often. I know how to plate women for a very long time. I never put in time I don't want to put in. That's pretty damn important for a medical student with little to no free time. The result is professional success without sacrifice for the sake of getting laid.
Ah, that's why it's RP-Doctor
med student here, same thinking. time becomes so important that the mentality you talk about became a bi product by default
that mentality will serve you well in residency. pgy-1 here, plate life is perfect for intern year
Meh, don't really agree, I can get along with women very well, and as long as my frame is held (either they're with me for sex or just as friends), then I can have a great time with them. Cruise through the night, go to the beach, have fun, I can do it all with women.
Sure, on average it's way more fun with great dude friends, but overall I don't see them as sex bots.
This here. Once you reach the acceptance phase and you've integrated some basic game in to your natural interactions with women, they can be a lot of fun to be around. You just learn that they aren't usually going to provide you with the in-depth, intellectual, shop-talk kind of companionship you get from your bros, but instead are good for just having fun and letting loose. After all, girls just wanna have fun. And as long as you keep in mind what women are, and keep it lighthearted and casual, women are great to be around.
Nah. Sure, there's the tactical advantage if/when you're trying to "feed" off their friend-base and/or aura but aside from that use, what other use?
I suppose you could have some "fun" while using women in that capacity, but I don't see that that makes them "fun" to be around or friends. For me, "fun" people and friends are people that I actually enjoy spending time with because I find their internal qualities interesting and interaction with them fulfilling.
Any woman with whom I would want to spend any time would have the internal qualities of kindness, thoughtfulness, and curiosity. If she has those qualities and is at all physically attractive then I'll be attracted to her, in which case friendship is out of the picture unless you want to play the game of teasing and denying the underlying dynamic or fall into orbiting. I find this true even when you're married.
You write like an aspie, or at least an INTP/J. I understand what you mean, I guess I just differ in what I enjoy in people.
Yes. I scored strongly INTP.
Women love to socialize. It's like sports to them.
Yeah, and as a human being I also love to socialize. Just have fun with no requirements, that's what I like, and some girls I go out with love that too.
If you're socializing with women with whom you're not having sex, they are having sex with someone else (chad) so you become one of their girlfriend. Not TRP behavior.
You ever try just being friends with a girl?
I don't believe in platonic friendships between a guy and a girl.
Maybe feminism subconsciously realizes that they're pretty much worthless in modern society except for sex and child rearing (which are important). It's why they're so envious of men; they know men are valuable and women aren't. So they are trying to change society in order to still be valuable. Automation is making women less valuable and men more valuable. Until we reach the matrix level of AI, we still need engineers and producers to make all the cool shit we use. Men are the ones designing/innovating as well as the the ones actually physically making it.
It's part of the progress. First you don't get women, then suddenly you get then and finally you have better things to do in life than women.
It's a good point. My interest in women in general has plummeted as I think about how much effort and focus it will take to gain the financial stability and comfort, hobbies and personal satisfaction. Women come and go along the way.
This. I've got a hb10 beside me now at my co-working space, really hot and exactly the type I go for. Before I'd be falling all over myself to impress her and help her but now I hardly notice her. Too busy building my business.
There's a happy medium where you can show interest without being a slobbering beta.
Completely agree. I swallowed the pill about 2 years ago, but I did not fully understand this fact until recently. Before I swallowed the pill I was a desperate virgin whose only goal was to get a girl. Even after swallowing the pill I did not fully understand this truth, I thought I could still have my life revolve around a girl while being red pill. After having many relationships, almost relationships, and hook ups I've realized many things: 1) Sex isn't even that incredible. I mean it's great but it doesn't come close to the fulfillment I get from achieving my goals. Sex is more like icing on a cake. 2) Relationships are freaking hard. Especially when it's with a clingy girl who just won't give you space. A relationship requires work and it makes it so you have to worry about someone else a similar amount to yourself, which is stressful. I've realized all of the freedom I forgo when I decide to commit to one girl. Which leads me to the last point. 3) I value my freedom above all else. I gain the most fulfillment from being able to do what I want, when I want it.
I'm still not sure if spinning a bunch of plates is the kind of life I want or if I still want to be with one girl, but just have little commitment (or at least the more mature, less clingy type). Regardless, the most important thing is that my life does not revolve around sex anymore. I have better things to focus on.
I couldn't agree more . I have been in a 6 year long relationship and I have been free and at this point in my life I would choose freedom every time . There's a million relationship type things I can do while free but there are very few "free" things I can still do the way I'd like in a relationship . More rules / life restrictions for more time with another warm body isn't worth it at the moment.
I've often said that a huge benefit of TRP was all the time I save.
I used to that think about and "work" on getting sex. Now that time is better spent as sex is pretty much on demand.
People like me who came here because of oneitis, i assure you that its the hardest truth to absorb. It takes time.
Yesterday i was thinking the same thing that i no longer care when i was looking at my oneitis profile. My self wasnt there into it anymore. Its changing
As others often mention, the key factor is time. When you start getting a lot of dates, you inevitably have to put some time and effort into them and without a solid quality control buffer you are going to have trouble managing it.
I kind of realized that once you subtract a womans ability to have babies and her physical attractiveness i.e sex appeal, the vast majority really are just annoying children at least in the west
I am married. I have 3 daughters. They are the most important things in my life. None of them have been cucked. It does start with the parents.
What about your life mission/purpose? Did you push it to the side or did it convert to raising daughters you can be proud of
I'd say men don't need any of your 3 asks.
Man doesn't need respect, camaraderie, or loyalty.
These are also dependent on the people who are giving you these validations.
In a way if you're proposing men to focus on these instead of loving women, then they replace being a slave to women to being a slave to men's opinions of him.
These are nice to possess buy never necessary to have value.
You receive distinction, friendship, and loyalty as a result of being high value.
But you are not high value just because you have these.
I'd ask what value is to you then, if not something dependent on your surroundings and the environment in which you live? TRP is a shift in frame. Blue pill ideology puts you in the feminist society's frame, but swallowing the pill doesn't release you from any frame at all. Unless you move to the mountains, you still exist in society's frame, but you've shifted where you receive validation, and which ideas you are susceptible to. Your shift in frame is from dependence (or "slavery") on something entirely unsustainable (women) to something akin to a diversified investment portfolio (respect from yourself and society).
You seem to be running in a bit of a logical circle here, claiming that you don't need respect, loyalty, or friendship, but then noting that being "high value" will bring you these things. I think you'll find that ultimately the end goal is happiness, and for most men happiness at the highest level requires two things:
1) An internal sense that what you've done with your life is in line with your values, and is something you're proud of
2) A wealth of other people in your life to share this feeling with, and who validate your belief that you've done something worthwhile.
Many men have died proud of what they've done, but ultimately miserable because they had no one to share it with. You need both. You will always be dependent on others, because humans are inherently social, and we judge our value by what we provide to the group. My point is that you can rely on having respect, loyalty, and camaraderie from society as long as you provide value. The same is not true of women. You can be perfect and still end up sacrificing half your salary so that she can continue driving a BMW despite being a low level secretary.
Another way to think about it is how Rollo said you aren't alpha because you have accomplishments, you have your accomplishments because you're alpha.
I think this has different implications. I'm implicitly making the argument that ultimately your objective accomplishments define your value, but you're taking "accomplishments" out of the frame I presented.
Rollo is talking much more literally than me here. Yes, you can have accomplishments in one area of life, but not all accomplishments require you to be thoroughly alpha, hence very successful betas who succeed wildly financially, but ultimately get taken for a ride by women or others in general.
I'm defining your accomplishments much more broadly than Rollo. If you earn a seven figure income but don't have the respect of your social circle, then you are not accomplished. If you've earned the respect and loyalty of others, are financially secure, and are inherently proud of what you've done, then you are accomplished by my definition, and barring extraordinary circumstances, you will be happy.
Makes sense and I see your point with definition of accomplishment
Isn't that called validation seeking behavior? Doesn't that go directly against stuff stoicism taught us?
This stuff is going over a lot of your heads. You're basically taking the concept and applying it to its absolute extreme without really breaking down the components.
To be happy most men need an internal sense of pride in what they do and a group of individuals to share their life experiences with.
Validation seeking behavior is when you don't have pride in yourself or what you do, so you try to supplement that with others, replacing your own lacking self-confidence with praise from others. What I'm describing is
1) Having a network of close people to experience life with
2) Deriving pride from your influence on the society you live in
The basic idea behind not seeking validation from others is that you don't want to be dependent on something that could easily vanish, or something that is not built on a solid foundation. Neither of those fit that description, so it's perfectly okay to derive satisfaction from them.
I value my own opinions and beliefs and experiences.
So we will differ here in that I do play within society's frame like say but my mindset is the most important thing I value in my life.
While these other things are valuable like you said, I personally do not value them as much as others and that's why I pointed out my perspective.
I do not mean, however, your points are not valid. I'm offering a different perspective.
I understand your points and agree with much of your response.
To clarify my point on high value results in respect, friendship, and loyalty but having those does not make you high value:
I mean for a man to seek these does not imply or make him high value. He is high value because he's just that, valuable in whatever environment he's participating in.
Sometimes that requires respect or friendship sure, but you don't always need respect to be high value.
Because value is what you produce, not necessarily if someone likes you.
An example is the asshole star player on a sports team. Sure some respect him others hate him. He produces. But he's value because he wins in that environment.
And because he wins he receives respect , but he's not winning because he received respect. He's winning because he's winning
We're saying the same thing from different perspectives. I would say the athlete is winning because he's got the sort of respect he's looking for from his team, the respect of his athletic ability. However, it's equally likely that he'd ultimately derive less happiness from the experience than the second string QB because he's not getting the sort of respect he'd like to get. It depends on your personality, but everyone wants validation from others. Maybe you just want to win, but ultimately the value of that win is dependent on others placing any value on it at all. If no one else cared, it would be worth nothing.
I would also say that 99% of people exist in environments where winning is literally defined by the respect you receive from others, often determining your ability to move up in whatever world you are living in.
Wow that is such a sad way of looking at life. Is that your view, really? If nobody else values it, it is therefore valueless? Fuck
He's just pointing out that we are fundamentally wired to be social animals. He's clearly and obviously correct. One of the cornerstones of TRP is the concept of the "alpha" and that concept is entirely defined by ones hierarchical position within a group.
There are an exceedingly tiny number of people who can be genuinely happy like in a cabin living off the land with no human contact. Like a few hundred people out of 6 billion. That's the exception that proves the rule, which is that we are intrinsically a social animal.
The point isn't that you need those things from people in order to be valuable, but that most people desire those things in order to be fulfilled. Sure, some people desire camaraderie more than others, it's a function of how introverted or extroverted you are. No one is saying you need camaraderie or companionship in order to feel valuable, but human beings are social creatures and most do crave some amount of connection with others. There's nothing wrong with this as long as you aren't sacrificing yourself to get it.
Any guy that doesn't learn this early in life is bound for disappointment. Women are literally the worst thing that could happen to you. Don't kid yourself that you would rather have the company of a chick than a guy. The only reason you would is to fuck them and keep them around for future fucking.
That's women utility in a nutshell. Sex and future assurances of more sex.
Make the clear separation between sex and everything else and the interaction between men and women becomes apparent. Every other activity is better spend with friends or alone. Women know this, they know their only bargaining chip is their vagina. Nothing else could possibly make her interesting to be around.
When you realize this reality you will be less dependent on women and likewise less bothered when you are without one. You instantly become non-needy and outcome independent. Women can't control you anymore.
Just want to get away from all these coon ass women.
Why do you need anything from other people in the first place? You're just putting a leash on yourself.
As I explained in another comment, you're fooling yourself if you think you can attain a sense of self-fulfillment without allies, friends, and family, and you're robbing yourself of what is likely the greatest thing we pursue as human beings: social interaction and bonding. Humans are inherently social. We derive our sense of importance from the influence we exert on other humans. When I see a comment like this, I'm not sure what you're seeing as the ideal, or who betrayed you so badly you think you would ever need to attain happiness completely on your own.
Not only is it impossible to separate yourself from the necessity of near constant social interaction in order to be even mildly successful in life, there is literally no reason to do so. Think about that. There is no reason why you'd ever have to attain happiness entirely on your own. In fact, I'd argue it's next to impossible to do so.
So why do we emphasize independence and being happy on your own so much here if it's not necessary? Because "on your own" still means we expect you have others in your life. We still expect you to have friends, family, and a network of acquaintances who respect you and treat you well. What you need to avoid is dependence on any one individual person. The easiest example of that is a significant other, particularly a wife. Why? Because it's not a safe bet. When you attain a diverse network of friends around your city and across the country or even world, that network is not going to suddenly break down, leaving you with nothing. You've also attained the skills to keep growing that network, so it is constantly evolving.
TRP does not grant you magical powers to be perfectly happy as a single 40 year old man coding from home all day and fucking random sluts at night. That's a horrible existence, even if you love both coding and sluts. Any man is going to need a significant social component to complement his life, provide him with companionship, and give him a sense that he is imparting influence on the world and respected by others.
The point of this post is that getting married is akin to keeping your life savings in cash under your mattress. Not only will it lose value with time, but all it takes is one break in to eliminate a lifetime of work. Meanwhile, following this model, as prescribed by TRP, is the equivalent of a solid investment portfolio spread across the market.
So, if I got it right, you're saying we shouldn't depend on only one person, and not get married? (feel free to correct me)
BUT, why is it wrong/bad to get married, if we dont depend only on our wife? Let's say we have multiple hobbies, a well payed job, a network of friends outside our workplace, AND a wife, excluding we would fall apart and get depressed if she leaves us, because we still have so much to do. Would that match the TRP theory?
EDIT: removed the question mark in the sentence before the last one.
A lot of the TRP vanguards and founders are married. Rollo is married. /u/archwinger is married. Ian Ironwood is married. Nothing inherently BP about marriage. The difference is in the vetting process, and the overall frame of the marriage. TRP cautions against marriage because of the legal issues, and the fact that most men just settle for marrying the first girl who's willing to touch his penis and hasn't left him yet. That's the basis of plate theory; to establish a genuine abundance with women so you can carefully vet and select for quality women if marriage is your goal. But it doesn't have to be your goal either, there's nothing wrong with living the playboy lifestyle all your life.
You hear it all the time. People say, "I don't give a fuck what other people think." But, really, you do give a fuck. You have to. I think without validation from society, something will feel missing in life. If it's true, that we are social beings, then validation from society is necessary. Additionally, being afraid to ask someone for help is an unhealthy behavior. It's wise to utilize your network of people to facilitate your success.
ewwwwwwwwwwwww validation seeking
Is this just until you fall in love with the woman who will be your wife? Or do you have no intentions of loving and marrying anyone ever?
There is no such thing as love. Its just your brain releasing chemicals.
Bingo. Same sentiments I share. Sad but true
Mate it's not women's fault you can't get laid.
Good post op. Keep them coming.
Fantastic post. Appreciate it.
Good post. I am really focused on my grind but I remember reading about our hierarchy of needs. Women are not important to me but i know I should have some in my life.
When the time comes ill start plating girls and posting FRs. I've been partying so much lately that I feel I understand the party terrain. In the coming months I plan to have something to contribute to the community. For now?
Hustle.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the explicit mission statement of the red pill 'sexual strategy for men in a world increasingly lacking a positive identify for men " or something similar? Wouldn't that mean that the sole purpose of the red pill is learning to get laid?
Getting laid is part of it but the "sexual" part refers to men as a sex not the act of sex.
So it really means strategy for men to take in a world where mens role and masculinity have been corrupted and blurred(hence the red pill reference). While many men do come here to learn how to graduate from virginity (and those who apply it do) or just how sate their thirst for sex, once they improve and can get that, they focus on or even have to find their goals in life. Which is a good thing.
This posts highlight the true basic fundamentals of TRP. Unfortunately in the past few years most people think of it as a new version of PUA, it's not.
I mean, I personally use the red pill to keep a good frame and a solid head on my shoulders while working hard, but I'm just trying to clarify the officially endorsed mission statement.
Just because someone uses a fork as a back scratcher, doesn't mean it's not meant for eating.
TRP is a grassroots philosophy, if you look at the seminal writings from 2-3 years ago, you'll see that TRP philosophy was very much inline with OP's summary. If you look at the state of this sub today you'll see that it's a split between PUA tactics and whining.
At the end of the day, it's up to you, the individual, what is that you want? Do you want to learn tricks to game women? Or do you want to become the best version of yourself that you can ever be?
The answers are out there, it's up to you to decide which questions are most important to you.
Their macho personas aren't validated by the sad women they attract and their bros are starting to tease them about it, so they come here and validate each other.
See. Men aren't even supposed to rely on others for validation (much less a woman). We at TRP advocate self validation.
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There FTFY. Yes we are male human beings who are part of a species with a sexual reproduction strategy, and we have a substantial physical, psychological, and spiritual drive to partner with women sexually.
Are you somehow different from that?
Do you see something wrong with being conscious of your existence as a male in a sexual species, understanding your needs, and acting to maximize your chances at having them met?