What nobody tells you about marriage, from a married man

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August 31, 2018

So hear me out... you may think, because I am married, I do not understand what goes on in this sub. What motivates you. What drives you. That I am against your beliefs. But I am very much in favor of a great many of the things you say.

Long story short... I started dating this cute girl when she was 18 and I was 20. She's this cute, perky, small thing... curly black hair, big brown eyes. Sexy body, sexy breasts, everything about her was fine... fast forward two years, she's 20 and I'm 22, and we find out she's pregnant (before anyone asks: yes the kids are mine, tested and all). Anyway... she get's pregnant. And we keep it. We even get married. We have gorgeous daughter. So far, so good.

Sex continues to be regular, believe it or not. We have our ups and downs and periods when it's less, but remains pretty solid. Over the next years we have two more kids. But things start to deteriorate. First thing to go was her body. This is a big deal to a lot of men, myself included, and I'll share these things because I think too many men are NOT aware of what pregnancy and motherhood does to a woman's body. It completely fucks it up. Ruins it.

The first baby we had did not yet deal the killing blow to my wife's body. In fact she got hotter in some ways; her perky and small breasts got a little fuller, slightly less perky. Her nipples grew to be very large, which to me was a major turn-on. She gained some weight, which mostly went to her hips and ass and didn't bother me. Her pussy was less tight, but this, too, did not bother me as I am not lacking in size. She gained some stretch marks, again, it's okay with me. I mean, I loved her! I didn't mind.

But the next baby came. And her stretch marks got worse. Her breasts got bigger, and more saggy. Her belly no longer went back to being as flat as it used to be, right after baby number one. She didn't 'bounce back' anymore it seems. She still looked good in clothes, but less good out of them. When she started breastfeeding baby number two while dieting, at the same time, this completely fucked up her breasts. Not only did they become saggy like those African women on an old National Geographic Magazine, they also shrank down a lot. Like tiny little veiny bags, eached topped with a gigantic plum-like nipple that no longer belonged to me, but to that baby.

She got skinnier. Her ass shrank. She barely had any breasts to speak of, and only looked good in special pants and in a bra that suited her figure and pushed up her boobs. With make up she still looked good. Even in her late twenties, now she looks good to the naked eye. Her face is cute. Her slender body, while clothed, looks fine. Few men realise how ugly, stretched out, bloated, scarred and saggy even a young woman can be after countless fucks and a few babies. How completely and utterly ruined their bodies become.

Behavior-wise, she got fucking mean. Called me useless. Called me all sorts of names. Did not appreciate me even as I am trying my hardest always to be the best father to our three children. I've been with a few girls prior to our relationship. I wonder if age, marriage, and in some cases motherhood, has treated these girls any kinder. But I doubt it, honestly. I think the biggest and harshest Red Pill I had to swallow is that women age disgustingly. Milk, rather than fine wine. At thirty I look better than I ever did. I'm fitter, more in shape, more muscular and overall more attractive than I was when I first married. But my wife is but a shell of her former self.

Now for the rest of my life, provided we do not divorce or whatever (which, in some ways, would even feel like a release), I will have to wake up to this woman. Stretch marks. Saggy tits. Enormous wrinkly nipples covering most of her chest. Flabby, toneless belly. Negative attitude towards me, and caring only about looking good *on the surface* for others... meanwhile, I get to see the real picture every day. And it ain't pretty. Yes we still fuck. Very regularly. It's only really good anymore when it's a hate fuck really. I am simply not attracted to her anymore and haven't been for a long time. I realize this now. I freely admit it. It's like I am a married man, faithful to a fault, dutiful. And yet I was cucked, not by any other man, but by Mother Nature itself. And by society's unrealistic expectations.

TL;DR: I married a cute girl, she turned into a harpy. Her once sexy body quickly deteriorated and now I will have to live the rest of my life with a woman I detest and who detests me, while pretending to the outside world and to our children that we love each other deeply. And fuck a pussy I am disgusted by for the rest of my earthly days while those of my bro's who were smart enough not to get locked down continue to fuck hot twenty-something pussy and discarding it when necessary.

Post Information
Title What nobody tells you about marriage, from a married man
Author MasculineHapa
Upvotes 890
Comments 485
Date 31 August 2018 11:14 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit TheRedPill
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/52193
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/9bye5f/what_nobody_tells_you_about_marriage_from_a/
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[–]Yourmamasmama188 points189 points  (15 children) | Copy

Hmm OP, it seems like you just don't like interacting with your wife. When most people marry, they marry for the personality so that they won't have to be old alone.

You fucked up by marrying the pretty girl for the sex.

[–][deleted] 92 points93 points  (3 children) | Copy

OP is gonna fuck around and his wife is gonna cheat on him and leave him. Keep being a miserable asshole of an entitled husband. She’s gonna seek out acceptance and validation somewhere. And best believe she’s gonna find it. Even if she’s as bad as you say she can still pull triple the ass you can on her worst day. That’s a fact. How would you feel if your daughters bf or husband talked about her the way you have? Me? I’d knock his fucking teeth out.

My wife had amazing tits and a rocking body. We didn’t have kids until our mid 30s. Her tits got wrecked and she gained a little weight. We both did. She got a boob job and tummy tuck and has lost most of the rest. Her self confidence has gone back up and that benefits me. She’s still sexy AF and honestly I feel like our sex life is better now than before we had kids. More sex, new stuff for us because we communicate more (throating, anal, etc). You need to be supportive of her and both talk about what you want to get out of this thing. Otherwise your marriage is on a countdown clock to d day. Then you’ll be paying out the ass in child support and only seeing your kids every now and then. Is that what you want?

[–]Viking_RnP499 points500 points  (120 children) | Copy

Is her company valuable to you at all?

[–]jackandjill2295 points96 points  (0 children) | Copy

Good lord this post scares the fuck out of me.

[–]simplisticallysimple164 points165 points  (0 children) | Copy

This is actually an excellent question.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 203 points204 points  (113 children) | Copy

Fair question...

I think it is. I think I still value her company, as she has a quick mind and is pretty witty. She's also a funny person. Just very mean-spirited at times. The main issue is, I am no longer sexually attracted to her at all. And I don't see this changing any time soon. Possibly never. Sex is a big part of why I liked her at first. She was hot as hell and so horny. Now she disgusts me. And I disgust myself for sticking around, but would probably be even more disgusted with myself for bailing on her now that we have kids.

[–]chesterburger84 points85 points  (11 children) | Copy

If she’s mean and nasty you have a fair point, that’s her fault and something she can change and work on. Her stretch marks and deterioration of her body is a sacrifice she had to make for your kids. If she’s exercising and not overweight it’s not really her fault. I’d say work on her attitude but accept her body, what is she supposed to do, go crawl in a hole and die while you find a younger and hotter girl?

[–]deville05194 points195 points  (22 children) | Copy

I think a part of her meanness comes from her utter disgust at her own body. She probably blames you since you jizzed in her and she had to carry your second child and ruin her body while nothing happened your body.

So forgive her since nature fucked her more than it fucked you. The disgust you feel for her is probably less than what she feels for herself.

I am not a feminist so I hope nobody thinks that i am one because I empathize with the female.

At the end of the day.. it's a problem ..And like all problems, there is a solution somewhere. Maybe take care of the children's while she focuses on diet and working out. Then later gift her some plastic surgery package..

[–]m3G4-M4N 1 points [recovered]  (9 children) | Copy

Yep. I’m a chick and I am not a feminist at all but I can tell you that a lot of what she is verbalising towards you will be self hatred.

She can also feel that she disgusts you because you can’t exactly hide that, it’s way worse than hate, plus you’ve mentioned it in your post.

I don’t know your wife but I know that if my partner was disgusted by me, it would be traumatic to have sex with him regularly knowing that and still agreeing to fuck him.

This is such a sucky scenario- But thanks for being such a good dad, that’s so important.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 45 points46 points  (3 children) | Copy

I realise that it is a bad situation for everyone involved. And I also realise there are certain aspects of the whole situation that she simply has zero control over. And that me, making a big deal or even some sort of breaking point out of those, makes me a bit of an asshole. That said? It's important that I was able to freely write down my feelings here for younger men to read, so that they can think of these things that few people think of when they get married with the intention of sticking together forever and raising a family. Often times, both partners let themselves go and turn unattractive. It happens and it sucks and people should be aware.

[–]deville0533 points34 points  (0 children) | Copy

Well thanks for writing. I didn't think you were being an asshole. You were letting your pov out and that's ok. People don't always write about the other person simit may seem like you are being self centered. But so what.. if you can't make your anonymous post about your anonymous self, then where else can you? Look you do come across as though you haven't tried to fix the situation.. or maybe the truth is you haven't written it or you just don't know how to. Either way truth is that I don't know your life and who knows what you are in like in life. Maybe you are worse or maybe you are much better.

Anyways.. maybe you need to start including her in your body fixing regimen and see where that takes you both. Either way..She popped out two of your seed and ruined herself for the both of you. Maybe this is your test as a man. See if you can be the captain and steer your ship and your first mate away from the depths of hell, bucko.

[–]TheStoicCrane5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Is it all possible for you to lead her into a gym? Take the role of her personal trainer and find a way to incentivize her into getting back in shape? I see guys allthe time with their girlfriends in the gym leading them by the reigns. Maybe that's the solution here.

[–]dDiegoDLV1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I wonder if you'd see her with different eyes if she wasnt a bitch

[–]Shjeeshjees0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

Treat her better I think. Take the kids and do some fucking chores

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Um... no

[–]Senior Endorsed Contributormax_peenor1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

How many times does he have to sweep the floor and take the kids to the park to get an enthusiastic blowjob? What's the number? Get that to me and we will issue a press release.

[–]Shjeeshjees5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

Perhaps she's better off without him

[–]evoblade0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

All of what you say could be true, but she could still get therapy and learn to not be such a harpy.

[–]the-dan-man 1 points [recovered]  (41 children) | Copy

Your dilemma sounds like every fathers dilemma. The one my father had before he bailed on my mom and probably a lot of guys on this subreddit.

Your purpose has been fulfilled. You got attracted to a young cute girl, had a lot of sex, fell in love, got her pregnant. She lost her initial attraction and changed from the process. All natural. Why do you want more? What were you expecting?

As men we cant have it all. We get older. Wiser. Pine for the younger days when we had better sex and more fun. But it cant always be like that. You can either strive to be a good father through self-sacrifice of your own personal interests, ego and desires. You only want more because of the hyper sexualised world we live in. And that is normal, especially on this subreddit. But keep in mind that you can take a different path. What is more meaningful, abandoning your family in the pursuit of hotter women or reigning control of your desires to raise a family?

[–]Fyrjefe37 points38 points  (1 child) | Copy

you only want more because of the hyper sexualised world we live in

This is one of the key realisations involved in one's unplugging. We are taught to let our desires rule us because it is a useful marketing lever, among other things. Anyway, good response. Lots to think about in your words.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

We are taught to let our desires rule us because it is a useful marketing lever

It's not taught, it's innate. The entire reason desires exist is to make you act on them.

[–]IClogToilets166 points167 points  (23 children) | Copy

Wow, well said. The bottom line is the OP has a choice. He can go after the younger hotter ass. But then another man will marry his wife and raise his daughters.

Or he can grow the fuck up.

[–]Brickles0929 points30 points  (18 children) | Copy

“Another man” = a beta cuck raising his daughters

[–]omega_dawg93111 points112 points  (7 children) | Copy

calling him a cuck is easy.

paying for the house that mr cuck is fucking your wife in is hard... along with knowing he'll be raising his daughters and being the male example that will influence them for life.

weigh that against fucking young girls and buying the tylenol that is needed to deal with them.

op needs to realize that he made choices as a young man... before realizing his prime years were ahead of him. that's what he's really whining about.

[–]FOODYUMONION9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yea i never get the cuck assumption. I see even "cucks" get a hot single mum out of their league and eventually have their own kids together. At the end of the day this "cuck" still acquires this hot mums genes to procreate with as opposed to sitting at his keyboard yelling cuck at everyone while masturbating furiously to porn and not being able to reproduce with anyone let alone a hot woman

[–]omega_dawg935 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

agreed. guys here are always told to "read the sidebar," but someone needs to tell them to, "go out and try to fuck something."

all the RP knowledge in the world means nothing if all you do is type on a keyboard btw furious masturbation sessions.

[–]cdogg7541 points42 points  (3 children) | Copy

...and there are tons of men lined up to play that role

[–]italian_mobking26 points27 points  (2 children) | Copy

Plus, some wouldn’t mind checking out their step-daughters once they’re of age. So the replacement cock could theoretically even eventually be fucking his daughters too.

[–]An_Actual_Politician7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

Crime statistics 100% confirm this. The greatest threat, by far, to an underage girl is her step-father.

And more controversially - the mother who puts her daughters into that situation by prioritizing finding a "provider" ahead of the safety of her children.

[–]IClogToilets15 points16 points  (2 children) | Copy

Losing your kids to another man is the definition of a Beta. Alphas get the women and the kids. Betas sit on the sides and watch.

[–]1319Skew18 points19 points  (1 child) | Copy

Get the fuck outta here with this bullshit. I don't care how rich, socially savvy, handsome, masculine man you are, if your woman gets a wild hair up her ass, she will cheat or leave your ass. She may do it out of boredom, she may do it because of an over inflated ego, or to branch swing to something else in a moment where you displayed weakness. It doesn't matter. When it happens, guess what side of the fence the court goes for when it comes to custody? Hint: it's usually not the man.

The betas are the guys that see a woman with another man's kids and decide that out of all the available women out there, they can't do better than having another man's left overs.

[–]TheStoicCrane4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

The irony is that for men staying single is infinitely better than being an ATM for some dude's leftovers. So the betas are in essence leaping from a luxury ship of singleness into shark infested waters because of thirst.

[–]gulag_disco3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

When a man reaches the apex of the social order his sexual imperative is unleashed, and that oftentimes means sex and offspring with a procession of wives, oftentimes young. Kings lived this accordingly.

So, OP is faced with a dilemma of his appreciating value and a shit-talking wives’ depreciating value. An imbalance that will compound over time and maybe it will get bad enough that he’ll draft a new deal for himself.

The “growing up” message rhymes a lot with traditionalist moralizing. My takeaway is that procreating young is always a mistake, and if you are going to marry, it would ideally be with someone 10-15 years younger than you.

[–]new_alpha2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

“Grow the fuck up” Hahaha really ?!

[–][deleted] 82 points83 points  (4 children) | Copy

I think OP is just discussing an issue with marriage that mostly goes undiscussed on trp. We harp about divorce rape, fucked up family courts, and custody an awful lot, but no one really talks about the "shelf life" of women.

With that said, it's a pretty well-known phenomenon by most of us that childbirth is hell on women's bodies. OP is just helping to educate the guys who don't know.

[–]Didiathon33 points34 points  (1 child) | Copy

Ugliness is something you can get a decent women to work against. Women don’t like being ugly. They just tend to be bad at putting in the work needed to get in shape. They’re more likely to get overwhelmed by emotions/fear when thinking about all the work they need to do and not push themselves enough.

If you are demonstrably physically stronger than her and lead/act as a personal trainer/show that you want her to look good, she will fucking love pushing herself for you. You will be the law; she won’t need to worry about her fragile self motivation or emotional hamstering anymore. She’ll have you to lean on.

This will not make her 20 again, but it will make her a lot hotter than she would be otherwise.

[–]Lontar4715 points16 points  (0 children) | Copy

I agree with this. My wife got smacked around by chemotherapy rather than a pregnancy, but left to her own devices I'm pretty sure she would've just given up ever trying to get back in shape. She allowed herself to become very overwhelmed thinking about the years of work, rather than seeing that it's just a little bit of work done every day.

[–]askmrcia3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

With that said, it's a pretty well-known phenomenon by most of us that childbirth is hell on women's bodies. OP is just helping to educate the guys who don't know.

Can't that be fixed by the woman simply going to the gym or working out? Serious question

[–]Majorapat5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Some of the effects yes, some no. Elasticity of the skin gets worse as you age, and that means that you get more stretch marks etc as the elasticity of the skin gets worse. Some of the damage from child birth can be undone via surgery, but you're talking $$$ or long wait lists if you're an NHS patient.

[–]FirstLastMan 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

This is why I feel like my ex did me a huge favour in initiating the divorce. I had felt it building for a few years prior, but I didn't even entertain the idea because of pride and the idea that I was building something with her.

Now, two years later, she's still begging to be back with me, I have the sympathy of my family because she's the one that bailed, and I have my freedom. It could have been a lot worse.

[–]OmegaMan21 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You did everything right. It will be a bitter pill for your ex to swallow, but perhaps it will be an object lesson to other young ladies that once they ditch a guy for Chad, then there is no going back if things don't work out.
The lesson then for women is to chose carefully, but once that choice is made then it is made for life. Throwing away a treasure of a man for the Fool's Gold glitter of a Chad is a stupidity personified and will only lead to a lifetime of heartbreak and regret.

[–]alecesne1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

You’re missing the references to his wife’s deteriorating attitude. A good personality is way more desirable than a tight body in a long term relationship context.

[–]girlboss933 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

If OP is bad at hiding his disgust that might explain her attitude change. When my husband is in a bad mood and takes it out on me or our son it makes me grumpy too

[–]JJ33141 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

No one leaves this life having fulfilled every last desire. Once you have achieved one desire, it’s human nature to come up with more desires and things to pursue. I’m not saying this to be defeatist, but to point out that it’s a reality of life. Single redpilled men can often boast about all the pussy they’re smashing, and imagine that there isn’t a fundamental limit to what you can have.

Tying yourself to ongoing responsibilities such as marriage and childrearing has a way of bringing you back to reality—the act of making a commitment necessitates choosing to forego other avenues and this can grate on us, because we know we can choose otherwise. But if you were to chase women all day you would still never attain everything your heart desire WRT women, and you would burn down some of your most important relationships in the process.

[–]maantrade2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Would gild this comment if I knew how.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

Leave her and be friends, dont be scared of the change. You both deserve to be happy.

Your kids know, you dumb fuck dont let them believe what you are doing is right.

[–]yukinara41 points42 points  (0 children) | Copy

Well, I'm more disgusted with you to be honest. You were the one who pumped 3 kids into her to begin with. Honestly, if you didn't see the damage the first one did on her and you still decided to have 2 more, you are too fucking stupid to breed. If course any woman would turn grumpy as hell for taking care of 3 kids while you are busy out there "improving" yourself. Do you seriously think any woman on Earth would have time to maintain their own body while having 3 little gremlins hanging by her side 24/7? Fuck no dipshit. Now that she is used, old, ugly, you are tired of her? Let's reverse the situation. If any women did that to a guy, this sub would try to get her head on a stake.


Suck it up and deal with it. Or get divorce raped.

[–]slackersdelight39 points40 points  (1 child) | Copy

Time to invest in some refurbishment bro. Not so much that she starts thinking about challenging your frame, but enough to let her know that you appreciate her delivering and caring for your offspring, if you have the funds that is. Maybe that will lessen her insecurities and attention seeking behavior (at least from what you are describing at the moment, I mean it will never go away completely), and you’ll probably get what you are lacking as well. All in all it’s cheaper than trading in for a new model.

Try tro bring it up to her and make it seem like you think she deserves it for all the work she put in. I mean from the way you describe it she’s probably going to enjoy a new set of tits.

[–]Endorsed ContributorWe_Are_Legion5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Make your woman behave. You are what is lacking in this picture.

You describe a wife without qualities, but this tells much about her husband as well. Let me ask you, why is that you cannot control her tongue? Why is it that she does not care to attract you?

And most importantly (because somehow in my mind, all dysfunction is due to dysfunction of the ego), why is it that you suffer due to this?

Look, rethink. Your knowledge right now is limited. You have failed because you only know what you know. Try a new mindset: Take responsibility for all the things going wrong. How? Well, first, expand your knowledge. I'm very sure once you start diving into resources you will find that there was much that you could have done. That said, do remember that what matters most is not the shit-show your life has become, but what you choose to do now. Let me know if you're willing to work and I'll find good resources for your problem.

[–]freshona14 points15 points  (0 children) | Copy

So let her know that.

What's she going to do, get mad? Oh no! I'm sure your kids will appreciate mom and dad being visibly disgusted by each other.

[–]Breguet_7727 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

Yeah, people will always be unhappy with their state in dating, single or married or in relationship in a number of ways because of a number of factors, which is why single with imaginary GF is the way to go.

[–]ethreax3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Damn i feel like this after just 2 yeara

[–]TiberZurg21 points22 points  (10 children) | Copy

My parents stayed together 'for my sake' and they didn't like each other. I can tell you now that this had a very detrimental effect on me. I wish they would've divorced when I was 10. For your childrens sake, please divorce your wife.

[–]Lightning1414 points15 points  (1 child) | Copy

Corollary: My parents didn't separate until I was 24 when my Dad decided to bail. I am very grateful for the time I had to spend together with them as a family. All the baseball games, holidays, camping trips, road trips, ski trips that my Dad organized for us all despite my mom's constant complaints. Their relationship sounds simlar to OP. My brother who is 12 years younger than me was not so fortunate and it was very telling in his fucked up relationship with my Dad.

[–]StrawberryBlondeHaze1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Same. They are still together 25+ years later and he cheats on her regularly. Then Mom calls me to cry.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 3 points4 points  (4 children) | Copy

Thank you for that. This is the sort of comment I need to hear much more of to be confident in taking the next steps. I think it would be better for my kids to have a strong, happy father than a miserable depressed one feeling perpetually stuck.

[–]ConfidentConifer55 points56 points  (2 children) | Copy

That is utter hamstering, you really think the best thing for your daughters is to see their faithful mom get abandoned? Hello daddy issues for life. If you choose to do that, you better fucking own it, don't you dare try to hamster it as something you're doing for your kids.

[–]TiberZurg4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Fair point. I think it depends on the situation and on how OP handles things. My parents got divorced now that I left home, and my dad still visits my mom often to help out with tasks around the house. If she got into any kind of trouble she can always call him. There is no way she can frame that as being abandoned, and she doesn't. My parents are both better off now and much happier, and they would've been a lot more happy if they had divorced 15 years ago. If OP thinks about what he is doing and handles things the right way I think it will always be best for him to go for his own happiness, for the sake of his whole family.

[–]kittyclaw2003 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

I think the only question at this point you have to consider is if your children's lives will be better long term with you guys together or apart. I might be sexist, but for daughters I think you really need to sway towards trying to make things work. Women treat men like shit most of the time so your daughters seeing that is not a huge deal.
If you leave, do you think your wife will ride the carousel hard and bring many strange men into their lives? This would be much worse for them than seeing you get mistreated. I had boys so I was a little less concerned about the above. Also when I was choosing potential women for marriage I was screening for mother material above all else so I got lucky doing that. I went through many steps to try to rescue the marriage before pulling the plug. My ex wanted to stay together. She would never thank me for doing what I did, but we both know it ultimately was the right thing for everyone.
There were many days within the 1st few years of me pulling the plug where I wondered whether I did the right thing? If I hadn't taken the steps to at least try to salvage things with her with marriage counseling among other things, I think I'd be in a much worse place now mentally than I am now after almost a decade being divorced.

[–]Junkis0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Same. Not only does listening and enduring fights btwn them set a horrible example the anger almost inevitably gets directed at the kids too. Sometimes physically... Shit can mess you up.

[–]KBeer015 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy

The main issue is, I am no longer sexually attracted to her at all. And I don't see this changing any time soon. Possibly never.

This was exactly how I felt and I got a divorce at 32. That was almost exactly a year ago. I have banged 5 women since then with the momentum picking up like crazy the past couple of months. Two of these women I consider hotter than any I've been with before. It's not selfish. It's nature. A man can still have a healthy sex drive way into his 60's and beyond and when I realized that, I simply wasn't prepared to cuck myself for the rest of my life. And despite how painful the divorce was, today I just thank my past self for stepping up and finally chosing something for myself again.

[–]MankindMF2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I have banged 5 women since then with the momentum picking up like crazy the past couple of months. Two of these women I consider hotter than any I've been with before. It's not selfish. It's nature.

Nature would be impregnating these women. Banging women without making babies? You might as well jerk off...

[–]recursoinominado1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Wow, thanks for your brutal honest, this seems to be a real problem to account for. I am only 26yo, had a GF for almost 2 years, she is like you described your wife to be in her youth, but after some time, i kind of lost interest in having sex with her, i don't know exactly why but i wasn't as attracted to her as before and the relationship derailed pretty fast from there even though i liked her company, i learned that what hold our relationship together was my desire to fuck her lol i can't even imagine how it would be if we were married, with kids, and her body getting worse each day with a less then optimal attitude from her

[–]josh4-4015 points16 points  (0 children) | Copy

At a certain point, I would imagine the relationship would become some sort of dependency that could be misinterpreted as value.

[–]Boeijen6660 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Probably when shes not man-shaming the hell out of him.

[–]dartandabeer37 points38 points  (3 children) | Copy

You sound like you married for looks and didn't even bother getting to really know her personality

You're also both young. She'll be immature and so are you.

You either piss her off now or wait it out and see if you guys sort it out.

[–]murt988 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

I agree on the marrying for stupid reason

[–]AmigoDelDiabla4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

"Look, I married a 20 year old. There's photographic evidence. You're no longer 20. You're clearly not holding up your end of the deal." What world does this guy live in where chicks' bodies don't change as they age and have kids?!?

[–]murt9833 points34 points  (0 children) | Copy

I feel sorry for her and not you.

[–]notamouse41876 points77 points  (0 children) | Copy

you sound like an asshole, and it's gross as hell that you can only value the woman you married by how fuckable her body is to you. You should get a divorce, because no one deserves to live their life with someone who hates them the way you seem to hate your wife.

[–]cigar197576 points77 points  (11 children) | Copy

I don't want to come across as a troll, or rude. I just don't understand what the fuck you think YOU deserve. This woman gave you a couple of kids, and all the while you can only think of your goddamn self.
Perhaps you can sort your goddamn issues out, talk to the mother of your kids and try to work past what seems like your petty goddamn issues. You said she had a quick mind and is funny, but her body is getting older. Her pussy is stretched out, what the fuck do you expect after she popped out a couple of kids..

Do you know how many people get fucked over, left by their wives and saddled with child support for kids that may not even be theirs? You come across like a fucking self centered egotistical cunt.

I don't mean to come across like a dick, and I know I do. You had kids too early, you should have waited a few years, but that shit happens. Try to ease into talking to her about the issues you have with one another, i'm pretty sure she might have some issues with you that are leading her to feel the way she does. Try to find the spark that lead you to marrying her, and both of you try to fall back into love with one another. I do have sympathy for you, but I have more for her from the way you come across. Communication is a beautiful thing, when you stop having it with each other, that's when issues pop up. That's when the cheating starts, and I hope she doesn't turn to someone for a connect you two appear to have lost.

I do wish you the absolute best, and I hope you remember why and what you fell in love with. Try to grow a bit as a man, and as a husband. Good luck!

[–]redd_reality377 points378 points  (42 children) | Copy

You know, op, I read all about how your wife got worse with age in every way and how that is a detriment to you. But, what I did not read was how you progressed down your life's path during these years.

Your wife fulfilled her evolutionary, biological life's purpose. Did you remain on track in your growth and development. Did you continue to learn who you are and never stop striving to be better?

Maybe your wife had kids, lost her youthful body and became a bitch. But maybe her nagging, bitch attitude was brought on because, while she turned into a human baby making machine, you remained the same person in every way. Maybe she unknowingly resents you for not being all you could be in your role as her husband, in your role as a man?

Do you think, maybe, if you were continually developing yourself and discovering new, meaningful ways to be, live and love, she would inevitably continue down the hag path?

I don't know, but there is always two sides to every story.

[–]morganKxoxo29 points30 points  (1 child) | Copy

THIS. You sound really immature and definitely had unrealistic expectations. You chose to have kids with her, it’s no surprise that changes a woman’s body. But what are YOU doing to be a good husband? How are you taking care of yourself and leading? You sound like you have no interest or care for her outside of her body and I’m sure she can sense that. It probably makes her resent you and treat you poorly if she senses you have no respect for her outside of her looks. If you only care about how hot a woman looks while she’s naked you never should have gotten married. You didn’t list ANY qualities about her that you fell in love with outside of her physical appearance. I honestly feel sorry that she’s married to a man who sees her the way you do.

[–]iamnotfromtexas90 1 points [recovered]  (9 children) | Copy

Very fair. If you're a shit leader, you can't blame the crew for mutiny.

If op is a loser slob than it's all on him.

If he's running the best he can be, at red line on all cylinders, no matter if he's just an inline-4 or beast W-12, then she's a bitch and he's fucked (in the bad way).

[–]redd_reality17 points18 points  (7 children) | Copy

If she is a bitch, it means she is not being her true self. She is probably depending on him to show her life, love, experience and happiness and he isn't living up to her expectation.

If this is true, he needs to be come his best self and be her role model so she can become her best self, or if she is unwilling to take her own personal responsibility for herself after he has become or is becoming his best self, then he needs to cut her loose. Throw her back into the pond of her own life suffering so she can hit a newer low and inevitably find what she is looking for, within herself; the only place she is truly going to find it.

[–]ArchetypicalDegen54 points55 points  (7 children) | Copy

So true. We don't see how OP has been. For all we know, he's out of shape, and just generally unambitious as fuck. I truly believe that ambition is the thing women desire in a man most. If OP is complacent and phoning in his average 9-5 and just sitting on the couch all day, it makes sense she hates him too. He judges her body, but I'd love to hear about his.

Honestly, a lot of men who think they've taken the red pill are actually still blue pilled and completely one-sided. The real red pill is that women have particular tastes in men, and will either want to find someone who fulfills that, or become bitter and hateful.

[–]odaklanan_insan7 points8 points  (6 children) | Copy

Did you guys even read the post?

OP clearly says he's in good shape and he's doing his best for the kids. His wife, on the other hand fucked up.

[–]triavatar31 points32 points  (4 children) | Copy

Also, "doing best for his kids" in his eyes may be a completely different level of expectations than what his wife has.

[–]meat-slinger1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

leave it for your woman to decide what your best is and you will die on the 'hedonic treadmill'

[–]BettyPages7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

I don't know, but there is always two sides to every story.

He posted a while ago on another subreddit about having an affair with a high school girl and asking for advice on how to keep if from ruining his life. When the overwhelming response was to end it, he insisted he wanted to "have his cake and eat it, too" and that he wanted to keep up the facade while still having an affair. He outright admitted to always avoiding conflict and being a coward. He paints himself here as a real good guy and devoted family man, but there is definitely more to this story.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 23 points24 points  (10 children) | Copy

That's not an unfair question to ask. I do suppose I am not as sharp as I used to be, I am not on top of my game if that's what you are wondering. But I am hard working anda very capable provider. I am a good and committed father. And I still blow her back out when I get the chance. I just don't feel good about being with her anymore, the way I used to. And the relationship in general has deteroriated to the point of me being quite depressed over it.

[–]redd_reality19 points20 points  (2 children) | Copy

The relationship isn't the issue.

This issue is, and you know this to be true on a certain level, is that you are not happy as you are.

You both have emotional baggage you're not aware of that you brought it into the relationship and sooner or later, or now, it is getting to the point where you can no longer distract yourself from it. You love yourself too much to continue living a life that isn't true to who you truly are. What's more troubling, is that you don't really know who that is. Neither does she.

A relationship is a thing where two people walk side by side each other. They grow, change, become better, hurt, strive, release and love THEMSELVES while encouraging their partner to do the same.

If you tell me the relationship is the reason you're not happy, I'd tell you it's not the job of the relationship to make you happy; it's job, or her job to you is to be honest. She reflects what she sees - you - back to you. She sees you in every way you cannot see yourself. And vice versa, you do this for her, as well.

It makes perfect sense someone would say their partner isn't jiving with their life anymore. That's because their partner is aware of, and demanding they release certain shitty parts of themselves (ego levels) and no mother fucker on the planet wants to hear that. But that is love because love is only honesty.

But besides all that spiritual shit, what I'm trying to say is your happiness is your own personal responsibility, not hers. And the same goes for her.

You walk side by side while you each find that on your own and don't ever lean on the other person for it indefinitely, because they can't ever give you what you are looking for. Only you can.

First I would share with her thay you're unhappy. Tell her the fucking truth despite what might befall. But do it calmly, carefully and sincerely. This is real love. Next, tell her you want to be better and you want her to be better and love herself more too.

You both need to take a step back. Insert some distance between you and the relationship so you can find passion, interest and meaning in yourself first. You then bring that passion, love and excitement for being who you are to the relationship! You bring it so that in times of need, when she is not her best, she can borrow from you. And when you are not your best, you can borrow from her.

This is loving yourself first, so that you can then love others. This is the only way a relationship can or will ever work properly. GL op.

[–]IveRedditAllNight4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Well, got damn it! We got ourselves a Dr. love here! Impressive and highly articulate.

[–]recursoinominado10 points11 points  (5 children) | Copy

Hey, nobody is perfect, right? You seems like a good guy, husband and father, i can only imagine the weights you carry on your shoulders to keep your family running smooth. Even if she is kind of bitchy (she has her own insecurities, i am sure that she also noticed her "change" and it's scared about it), you have to be on top of your game as a captain to not succumb to the resentment and other lower sentiments.

[–]Endorsed ContributorSKRedPill2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Look OP, only you can bring in some positive thinking or emotion into your life. You talk of provider, provider, provider, but you never say attractive, attractive, attractive. Being a provider and being an attractive man are two very different things.

What have you done to make yourself attractive and more abundant? Are you happy and uplifted just as a way of being, rather than letting the world dictate it?

You're the man, the sun, shining on its own light, the problem can only be solved by you. Your wife isn't gonna just bring in the abundance on her own, she isn't strong enough for that. The moon has no light of its own. It reflects the sun.

[–]JW_22 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

Obviously we only have 1 side of the story, but he said he's in the best shape of his life and is a committed father. What else can he do?

[–]redd_reality1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

The thing about women is that they tend to be much more in touch and expressive with their emotions than we are.

This leads them to expressing emotions when they arise, which usually leads to the resolving of trauma (which we all have to some degree). Once the trauma is resolved, we can reach our full potential, with our emotional health in check right next to our physical and mental.

When women complain about their man it is almost always because they are more in touch with their emotional selves and can see clearly that their man is not. They can see all the potential in him, but he can't see it in himself, because of his trauma blocking his emotional self.

So she naggs, whines, flirts with other men, and ultimately jumps ship because, even though he is doing all of things he thinks "women want" ie-job, gym rat, nice car, assertive etc, he isn't doing what is true to his best, holistic self. She can sense that about him and he can't. So there is friction.

If op knows in his heart that he is living his best life, he has resolved all of his trauma, he feels fully with his emotions, can see the beauty in everything, especially the stillness in the present moment and still is able to confidently say she is her own problem and can absolve himself of his responsibility, then sure, it is her issue. But, I can almost say with certainty, if he did all of those things I just mentioned and became that best version of himself on all his layers, she would worship him night and day in this life and the next.

[–]CaptJohnLukeDiscard283 points284 points  (44 children) | Copy

The only chance a woman has to have a decent body post baby is if she lifts weights, as in real lifting with programmed complexes. Cardio bunnies become flat asses and flappy arms.

Maintain frame, set the example, point your woman to the squat rack, and thank yourself later. Or send her to Crossfit. Those bitches are hnnnggggg.

Source: dude with a lot of kids and a wife with a soft 6 pack

[–]kappakai47 points48 points  (3 children) | Copy

This. I dated a woman, late 30s, mother of three. Her body was amazing. Small perky breasts. Tight everything. Georgia peach of an ass. Sculpted arms, ripples in her back. Beyond toned, but not weightlifter physique either.

She worked out religiously. At least two classes per day. She started working out when her and her ex-husband started to distance, and working out was her way of avoiding him. Which was great for me for about two years.

[–]ohyasurewhatever 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

This is the rare exception to the rule. Most women with numerous children have blown out bodies like OP described.

[–]Casanova-Quinn19 points20 points  (1 child) | Copy

Most women are "blown out" because they don't have a diet/exercise regimen. Most of them could look a lot better if they actually tried. Some may need a little plastic surgery for loose skin or breasts, but proper diet/exercise will fix the majority of body issues.

[–]Youngyoda8942 points43 points  (14 children) | Copy

Incred! How do you sculpt your wife a big bootie?

[–]CaptJohnLukeDiscard167 points168 points  (12 children) | Copy

Start with a woman that’s willing to workout hard and train smart.....

Now that you have eliminated 99.9999% of women, tell her to do squats, split squats, deads, and lunges.

[–]Morphs_49 points50 points  (6 children) | Copy

Yeah this is the problem. Most women immediately feel offended when you even consider her body to be a problem. An ex of mine was too lazy to work out. Only when I would coach her 1on1, and even then it was always an uphill battle, as if I was the only one who wanted her to work out. But meanwhile I still had to listen to the nagging about her weight and I was expected to compliment her looks so she would feel good about her lazy self.

Oh and my SMV was too high, which made her self conscious in bed and thus reserved in her actions. So basically things would be even better for her if I were to get a bit more out of shape. Like that's going to happen..

That stuff puts you in a very hard position as a man. The woman tries to make a man overstep his own personal boundaries, effectively lie to himself and her about what he wants and likes. Needless to say, things didn't work out between her and me.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy

But meanwhile I still had to listen to the nagging about her weight and I was expected to compliment her looks so she would feel good about her lazy self.

Dude this. I had an ex like this. She gained weight during our 2.5 year relationship but had never really been happy with her body the whole time. I'm like if you are disgusted with yourself every time you look in the mirror, why don't you just fix the fucking problem? Oh that's right, because she was too tired from her stupid fucking white collar career that no man gives a shit about. God this society is so backwards.

[–]askmrcia0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Oh that's right, because she was too tired from her stupid fucking white collar career that no man gives a shit about. God this society is so backwards.

Yea and that's still a bad excuse because I'm sure most people here that lifts also works a demanding job.

[–]killking7217 points18 points  (0 children) | Copy

Make your woman train hard because she wants to look hot for the juiced up 20 year old gym chads, but train harder so you get the attentions of more attractive women than she is men.

[–]IsaGuz1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Don't forget the good mornings. Those babes NUKE visible cellulite, even more than weighted lunges. You have to be very conservative with the weights so as not to hurt your back, but damn! I have a better ass at 40 than I had at 18. I only wish I had been told at 18 that women belong on the rack.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy

>Source: dude with a lot of kids and a wife with a soft 6 pack

How many kids are we talking about, and how old is your wife exactly? Has she breastfed the kids and how have you managed to keep her breasts perky, or has that been the one thing exercise couldn't fix? Genuinely curious. It's helpful to know these things for other young men so they can avoid being in my boat and the boat of many other men (and women) with similar issues to deal with.

[–]CaptJohnLukeDiscard16 points17 points  (7 children) | Copy

5 breastfed kids. Mid 30s. Exercise can’t fix boobies... money does.

[–]thr0w4w4yaway 1 points [recovered]  (6 children) | Copy

Why would you make 5 children? Honest question.

[–]TryhardPantiesON1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You wouldn't if you had the money and time to help them grow?

[–]LuckyMost 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

Not only. My STBX in her mid30, after 2 kids, and her body is still like she's 20. No excercises whatsoever. Her face though... Not anymore. And her mind... Well that's for another story. Anyways... Genetics I guess, her mother is slim at 55.

[–][deleted] 67 points68 points  (17 children) | Copy

Beauty for a women with age depends on genetics mostly, but also how well she takes care of herself. I have a friend who is 50 and still looks like she’s mid 20’s. She exercises, eats healthy, and is always in a good mood. She told me after her fifth kid that women at church would belittle her and tell her “why do you keep trying, just stop worrying about looks, you’re a mother now.” That’s the kind of mentality that is disgusting, when lazy people drag you down out of jealously.

[–]1scissor_me_timbers0058 points59 points  (10 children) | Copy

There’s no way in hell that a 50 year old women who’s had 5 kids looks mid 20s. Jesus dude cmon. At least tell a believable lie.

[–]Atheist_Utopia12 points13 points  (1 child) | Copy

It's true. The extremely rare outliers exist, as I've seen in my neighbourhood.

[–]destraht0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah but when she was actually 20 she looked a hell of a lot more 20.

[–]Casanova-Quinn2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'm sure your friend looks good for 50, but stand her next to an actual 25 year old and the difference will be obvious.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 9 points10 points  (3 children) | Copy

I doubt she looks like she is in her mid-twenties, but I am willing to give you the benefit of the doubt. The more important question is: have you ever seen this friend naked? Because my wife also looks cute still... at first glance. That fifty year old, once naked, likely would not arouse you. Certainly wouldn't arouse me as I don't have a thing for grannies. No offense bro.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I don’t disagree with you about the naked part. Only so much you can do after 5 kids.

[–]karmicillusion262 points263 points  (36 children) | Copy

I think there’s something to be said for marrying a less attractive or slightly plump girl if you’re going to get married. Of my friends wives, the most pleasant and beautiful now are the ones that weren’t as hot to begin with. They still appreciate you more and feel like they’re lucky to have you, because they know what looks like to be staring loneliness in the face. They also don’t feel like they cashed in their chips for you because they’re not accustomed to the feeling of unlimited spending potential that copious amounts of male attention from all directions can create.

[–]SuperCrazy07189 points190 points  (12 children) | Copy

I think there’s something to be said for marrying a less attractive or slightly plump girl

My buddy's grandfather said it best. "If you're gonna marry, marry the least attractive woman you don't mind waking up next to."

[–]Selexus61 points62 points  (5 children) | Copy

In theory....yeah,but... Having done just that it was a fucking disaster. My fault..... but a train wreck of a relationship. Going in I had zero RP knowledge and therefore totally missed the blatant red flags. I failed to manage her in any (RP) recognised way. As soon as the kids arrived, her personality disordered mind painted me as the enemy in her home. No sex for 6 years, all my money spent, whilst hers was saved to a secret account. Finally bailed after my doctor diagnosed clinical depression. It was literally life or death for me. I chose life. Still fighting her in court 3 years later. I chose her because I thought she'd make a great mother.....I was partially correct. But my ignorance cost me everything, including my health. The red pill is a wonderful gift kids. Use it or you're playing Russian roulette with a full loaded gun.

[–]recursoinominado19 points20 points  (0 children) | Copy

Tough story, hope you are strong again.

[–]Atheist_Utopia38 points39 points  (0 children) | Copy

Damn. Wise words from the old man.

[–]alucidexit90 points91 points  (12 children) | Copy

🎶if you wanna be happy for the rest of your life

Never make a pretty woman your wife

So from my personal point of view

Get an ugly girl to marry you🎶

[–]MarinTaranu50 points51 points  (4 children) | Copy

An ugly RICH girl to marry you.

[–]hewieRD8 points9 points  (3 children) | Copy

I’d imagine wealth has its complications as well

[–]MarinTaranu16 points17 points  (0 children) | Copy

But far fewer than poverty.

[–]Shaney965 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Cheers - that song made my day.

[–]meme_poacher3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

but want if I want to have beautiful babies

[–]delemental5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

I've seen two fugly people have beautiful kids. It will work out, I'm sure

[–]IrakNbakNbak0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

[–]m4rkm4n4 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy

Also beauty fades. If her hot body is the only thing that makes you like/love her, don't bother. Look for a woman you want to fuck but is also fun to be around. An actual friend.

[–]delemental0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

And doesn't throw up red flags. I had what you described with my ex wife, but I ignored all the red flags.

Had to fight off a terrible case of one-itis for a long time.

[–]IClogToilets2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I disagre. In general women that take care of themselves always take care of themselves. The O-natural plain Jane may look on in her 20’s but goes downhill in her 40’s.

[–]Senior Endorsed Contributormax_peenor0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

So put a 9mm through your head instead of a 10mm because it'll make a smaller hole?

[–]jitsbay0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This is also age-old wisdom from our brothers in the military. My friends there say that the big and/or homely wife will not cheat while you’re away for months on assignment, while a hottie wife’s vag will become a regular pit stop for many when left unattended.

[–]zephixleer81 points82 points  (1 child) | Copy

TRP has become this dumping-ground for absolute trash. Crying about how your wife doesn't look the same as she did when she was 18. No shit?! And she calls you names? Sounds to me like she hurt your feelings and you got on here to talk shit about her.

TRP should be telling you to man the fuck up and take control of your marriage. Either do that or divorce her with a good lawyer. Stop being a child and crying about her on the internet.

TRP mentality about marriage, assuming you're in one that you filtered through red-pill theory, should be to be a damn man and control the marriage. Apply what you've learned, your status of being awake to the ways of women, your mental fortitude and your fitness; apply those to keeping her in line. If she's bitching at you about being lazy, there's something wrong and it's absolutely your fault. Either you've been a lazy ass and she's calling you on your bullshit, or she's being a bitch for some reason. Either she has a mental disorder or she has some legitimate issue that you, as her husband, can fix. And if you cant, again, get a good lawyer and move on. No, it's not easy but it's better than devolving to some trash-person who belittles her on the fucking internet.

[–]Azevse19 points20 points  (0 children) | Copy

This x1000. You don't like it ? Recognize if it's something you can do something about, and then either change it or move the fuck on.

[–]ImportantWords262 points263 points  (31 children) | Copy

I am married currently. And I have to say, never again. Complete 180 once she got that ring. Relationships should have a shelf life.

[–]grewapair335 points336 points  (14 children) | Copy

I noticed that 180 before the wedding and noped the fuck out ten days before the blessed event. She figured she no longer had to put on the act, because I was fully committed. Boy was she wrong.

[–]Aurazai 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy

One of the golden rules for relationships, for business negotiations, for anything. Always be willing to walk away. And in the case of relationships, it's the only leverage you have.

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (1 child) | Copy

I agree with that. If you're willing to walk away you don't have to put up with the bs. I told my gf we will never get married by the government or have a wedding. We can get married in a church alone (no documents) and I will buy you a $50 ring but I'm never putting up with bs, I don't mind being single.

[–]SJWOPFOR2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Wow that's a genius line, if she's more excited by the legal leverage she can hit the curb

[–]1scissor_me_timbers00121 points122 points  (0 children) | Copy

Holy fuck, username checks out. Nice save.

[–]Pastelitomaracucho16 points17 points  (1 child) | Copy

I saw it too. Still went ahead, but divorced a year after. Clean divorce with no damages, but still.

[–]shardikprime0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Holy shit. The struggle is real

[–]KrustyKrabReject1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

That should be a post in itself.

[–]trollreign1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You should write a post about that story, I'd love to read it.

[–]Boovs4life1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Would love a story of how that happened!

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon116 points117 points  (7 children) | Copy

Relationships should have a shelf life.

They do. Marriage doesn't. That's the shit deal of it.

[–]Politikr40 points41 points  (6 children) | Copy

Because it's a contractual agreement, the terms of which are not known to either party. Prenuptial kind of softens the blow, but it's much easier going in, than out.

[–]Interceox6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

It’s mostly the legal repercussions of divorce. Marriage is a legal responsibility. No more, no less.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon6 points7 points  (4 children) | Copy

the terms of which are not known to either party

Women are very clear on the upsides of marriage. They see the happily married women and they see the profitably divorced women. At some level that are happy/satisfied with all the outcomes they see, and in all situations the deal "looks right".

I've heard women say things like "well of course she deserves half his income, after all she made him what he was and she can't be expected to go to work". As if women somehow support men or help their careers.

It's only men who view marriage as any sort of risk. It's men who romantically believe "this one is different". It's men who have no idea how much they'll be paying.

Women are crystal clear on the no-lose benefits of marriage to themselves.

[–]destraht2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

The ones that aren't deluded about what getting old means know that they are paying with their very limited best years and that guy gets about 4x as many. Women are furious if they exit a relationship looking much worse than when they entered and they insist on being compensated for that deterioration.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Women are furious if they exit a relationship looking much worse than when they entered and they insist on being compensated for that deterioration.

Yup.. women expect to be paid every which way. Either for her looks, or for her losing them.

[–]RatMan2940 points41 points  (1 child) | Copy

Relationships are like jobs. You don't necessarily need to keep them short, but you do need to keep your options open and check out the market regularly. It's amazing how well this keeps your existing gf (or boss) from taking you for granted.

[–]macalpinerules10 points11 points  (0 children) | Copy

IDK man, everything you've described sounds like a standard marriage: wife loses shape after bearing multiple children, sex drives goes down, she becomes annoying etc. A responsible man has to know this will happen and make a tough decision on whether or not the difficulty of marriage is worth the prize of having your own family.

[–]IRunYourRiver51 points52 points  (26 children) | Copy

How old is your youngest? My wife bounced back big time when our youngest turned about 5. A lot of other fucked up shit happened simultaneously, but her body found its full woman form. The sex is getting better, but lots of other things aren't as good. Which is why I'm on TRP, lol.

Given that we haven't completely destroyed marriage yet, I think it's wise to be realistic about the advice on this sub. The RP'd ones have a huge advantage, but more than likely they will experience the messed up things about long-term companionship too. The difference is how they may be able to respond and keep their expectations in check.

[–]Gobraves445 points6 points  (23 children) | Copy

What’s an acceptable n count for a married woman? Did you marry young?

[–]DTreatz9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

They won't answer you so I will, the best N count is 0, always has been.

​There is also data that supports this.

[–]TV_PartyTonight3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Rational people don't give a fuck about things like that.

[–]Youngyoda891 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Incredible brother! How did you ge her to do thin? Is she genetically predetermined go have a nice body? Did she work her ass off? Did you get her surgery? Is it a combo of all of the above? Very interested in hearin bradrin

[–]IClogToilets2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Divorce her and she will magically turn hot again

[–]EumenesOfEfa 1 points [recovered]  (48 children) | Copy

I don't know what to say really, other than thank you for the warning. I will have my fun before getting married.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 62 points63 points  (6 children) | Copy

You really should. Because for women aging well is a dangerous illusion. They don't. In Hollywood they praise these women who maintain their looks until middle age and beyond, but they never mention the amount of make up artiststry, photoshopping skills and plastic surgery that goes along with this defiance of age. The vast majority of women will age badly. Even that hot, amazing, wonderful soulmate you may one day encounter... hers, too, will fade. People underestimate how much impact this has all the time.

[–]the99percent111 points12 points  (5 children) | Copy

The word is youthful exuberance.

You cant be 30 years old and youthful the same way an 18 year old can. Law of physics and mother nature just doesn't compute.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 10 points11 points  (4 children) | Copy

True. But it's tragic how misguided many young (and not-so-young) men are regarding these facts. Women past the age of 25 really shouldn't be put on any pedestals anymore.

[–]Pastelitomaracucho48 points49 points  (3 children) | Copy

No woman deserves a pedestal.

[–]SwagnumMagnum11 points12 points  (1 child) | Copy

This is probably the best redpill concept one can take from this board.

[–]sleepyweaselisawake0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That and abundance mentality.

[–][deleted] 40 points41 points  (17 children) | Copy

How about not getting married? I’m 39, and I’ve decided not to. Why bother? It adds nothing. Improves nothing. It’s just an illusionary status that costs tens of thousands and makes you no less secure in your relationship.

Why do people feel obligated?!

[–]IClogToilets15 points16 points  (6 children) | Copy

Because most people want to have kids and kids do better in a two person married household.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy

Kids do better with a two person household. How does the people being married make a difference to their wellbeing?

[–]askmrcia5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy

Good luck finding a woman that is going to want to live you with, have kids with you, be in a long term monogamous relationship with you while you still refuse to marry or acknowledge that woman as your wife.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Btw, I have a woman who is living with me, who doesn’t want kids, doesn’t want marriage and wants a long term relationship.

I made this clear with her from the beginning.

I find it interesting this sub is a lot to do with alpha-males, taking charge of sexual strategy, getting what YOU as a man want and need and not being manipulated in life...

...and so many people here just seem to forget all that when it comes to the most import part of the whole game.

If you want kids? Great. Be that guy.

If you don’t? There are women out there who share your life goals.

Don’t settle.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Lol. I thought this was TRP.

[–][deleted] 34 points35 points  (6 children) | Copy

Society does not currently have a palatable alternative to a monogamous lifestyle in your midlife to elder years. Being a 50 year old bachelor is a lonely lifestyle regardless of how much pussy youre getting and that's Snapple facts

[–]DTreatz26 points27 points  (0 children) | Copy

Being alone and being lonely are two different things. If you can't enjoy solitude, you can't enjoy freedom.

[–]yomo863 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Bachelor lifestyle implies living as society imagenes to be a bachelor ie. empty party lifestyle not the life you want may it be reading, motorcycling, learning a new language, gaming other women, having time with family and friends. I assume, this is why DiCaprio is always talking about "finding love" as it soothes the envy of other men and women as he is not entrapped in the constant hamster wheel of trivial male/female relationships.

To be honest, I have had the pleasure of having a plate around 24/7 last week. And, quite frankly, I longed for an excuse, any excuse, to be solitary. The mindless rambling about girlfriends of hers, the constant shit tests, which rather annoy then contest me, the ugly picture of a women in the morning without make up.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Thank you. TRP refuses to acknowledge this fact. Marriage sucks. So what exactly are we replacing it with? No one here has a good answer other than spinning plates into your 40s, 50s, and 60s (really??).

[–]keepitreal511 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Pretty pathetic when you look at it that way

[–]triavatar7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

It absolutely adds to the potential of the human race when powerful people choose to have powerful children.

[–]KrustyKrabReject1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Do you have kids? Are you going to have kids?

[–]kylerosa2119 points20 points  (6 children) | Copy

Aim to settle down in mid to late 30s. Be careful with marriage though - it’s more of an institution than a union. Take appropriate precautions if you choose to get married because it becomes a mess if you divorce.

Also. Don’t marry a Western woman. Do yourself that favor at least

[–]SomeoneBehindThePC6 points7 points  (3 children) | Copy

I hate seeing this advice thrown around here. Men above 30 have a significantly greater risk of producing autistic offspring than younger fathers, which is nothing any of us want to be doing.

[–]marian55678 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

Getting married????? You missed the WHOLE point dude.

[–]furcryingoutloud25 points26 points  (13 children) | Copy

After reading this, you think you still should get married???

Wow man, just wow. OP, WTF are you doing in a fucked up relationship like that? You don't value yourself at all? You think your kids are going to turn around one day and thank you for staying married to a woman you hate? Wake the fuck up, they will not give a shit.

you may think, because I am married, I do not understand what goes on in this sub

I can't speak for anyone else in this sub, but I KNOW you have no fucking clue what goes on in this sub if you can remain in a relationship that is a dead end and a dead life and still feel satisfied for any reason whatsoever. Your post screams surrender. Your life is a daily grind against every fiber this sub stands for.

I will have to wake up to this woman. Stretch marks. Saggy tits. Flabby belly. Negative towards me, and caring only about looking good on the surface for others

If you wonder why I speak to you with disrespect, and I realize I am letting some hate out here. It's because you have no respect for yourself. How dare you decide to stay with a woman and then degrade her for everyone to read? You've got some balls mac. But you're using them for the wrong thing. If you are beside a woman, you respect her. You do not admit to the world that you made a mistake but are helpless to change it. If you have to suck it up, you suck it in too. Keep your mouth shut about your children's mother. There are many other ways to post an educational report here without denigrating your kid's mother, and subsequently looking like a shitbag yourself.

TLDR; Disrespecting your SO because you're to weak to make her an ex, makes you a shitbag. In my book at least.

EDIT: smoe wrods

[–]natedogg9686 points87 points  (4 children) | Copy

nd I realize I am letting some hate out here. It's because you have no respect for yourself. How dare you decide to stay with a woman and then degrade her for everyone to read? You've got some balls mac. But you're using them for the wrong thing. If you are beside a woman, you respect her. You do not admit to the world that you made a mistake but ar

bro your being a bit harsh on him, its different when there is kids invovled. have some empathy. you sound like you have alot of anger built up inside of you , you need to relax bro.

[–]lll_lll_lll30 points31 points  (3 children) | Copy

Eh, it’s meant to be a cautionary tale to possibly keep others from the same fate. It’s an anonymous forum. It’s not really breaking with propriety to denigrate her when no one even knows who she is. OP is just confronting his inner thoughts about the matter, but for our benefit.

Now if he went around in public saying those things in the real world, that would be different.

[–]1scissor_me_timbers007 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

You’re obviously correct here. I don’t know why that guy was going on...

[–]Znin5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

You're failing to see the value in his post and the insanely valuable lesson he teaches.

Re-read this and ten years from now you'll thank OP for writing about the ugly truth

[–]the99percent11 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

To be fair to OP, he does know what he's doing by posting here. He straight up admits he is a weak man.

But if you look at most marriages, the guy grows complacent all the fucking time.

[–]recursoinominado1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I am not married nor do i have kids but from all that i learned, having married parents seems to be the best option for raising kids, even though they won't appreciate, it is your job as a parent (since you brought them without consent into this world) to do the best you can for them. Only exception is if the marriage is toxic, abusive/violent which do not seems to be the case even though she is mean-spirited.

[–]Rian_Stone38 points39 points  (4 children) | Copy

Usually in MRP we give guys one victim puke.

That would have been yours. Question to ask yourself. Why does she treat you like shit?

Either you are, or because you put up with it. You can work on both fronts.

[–]3LiveAFTSOV8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

good summary there ol chap

[–]ChadTheWaiter1003 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

Hey Rye,

I looked through your history. I’ve noticed you’re a chunkier Indian man. Can I make the request of you, as a less attractive male, game bitches and navigate through the world to ultimate alpha status? I know you’re senior endorsed so you’ve earned the respect of many men.



[–]Rian_Stone6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]n124up25 points26 points  (2 children) | Copy

This post made me realize how disgusting humans are.

[–]1clon3man1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I think that humans react to the situations there are put in. Society itself has a lot of flaws today and it brings out the worst in people.

People don't co-operate anymore in large communities - many people live and work in these little urban silos with terrible sedentary (or overly physical) jobs and bad commutes. Everyone has chronic health problems and the medical system bends people over and in their early-to-mid 30s people begin to see their opportunities to really live the life they want start to dwindle.

I think that these unbalanced lives we all live robs us of the strength we need to deal with biological asymmetries like the one the OP describes. It's a fucking hard problem to solve; women in their 20s are so coveted that they don't need to pay their own bills. Then when the tables turn and women become on an even playing field with men, men feel cheated because all of their work to be in the top 30% of successful men have left them with a lot of debt and responsibility with very little benefits once the excitement in their relationship is gone.

It'd be interesting to live 200 years from now. The way I see it most of the (urban-desk-job) world is unhappy because very few people get to fuck who they want and do the things they really want as they get older. It's almost as if we're due to change all the rules.

btw I'm not talking about communism, this isn't a political post, I'm talking about a change of values and stigmas in the way we accumulate wealth, co-operate, live, and fuck

[–]Theguygotgame77798 points99 points  (13 children) | Copy

In Japan, they used to let a man have one wife, but as many consorts as he could afford. The wife to have his heirs and keep his home, and his consorts to actually please him. They fucking knew about all this, but they just discarded it.

[–]radixaf32 points33 points  (11 children) | Copy

Not just Japan but many cultures through time have done this. Still the case in parts of europe and Australia (see prosititution). The only difference is its been commercialized there

[–]uniqueeleni25 points26 points  (8 children) | Copy

As a European, prostitution is legal in some countries yes, and several married men visit brothers, but most of the times the wife doesn't know about that. It is not socially acceptable.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (7 children) | Copy

Its not talked about, but if you find yourself talking in the boys club in the office. Its extremely common both in white collar and blue collar professions...

As I reach 32 years of age I've come to the conclusion that a strong long term marriage may be ultimately as a result of both partner cheating or at least living polyamory lifestyles... And the marriage really does become more of a partnership for fulfilling certain lifestyle goals... children... shared dinner table... stability financially... The monogamous sex component is almost impossible to balance alongside the other goals.

[–]zuixihuan0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

As someone who is not very knowledgable about history, or at least wants to know more, why did this change?

[–]OPTIMUSL1ME29 points30 points  (1 child) | Copy

You are a fucking retard for one. Good on you for getting married and not ditching, raising your kids and the like, but this entire story - you're telling it like you were a passenger and not a driver. Did you want any of these kids or are you just pounding away mindlessly and then going "welp there's another one." I'm over here literally squinting my eyes and shaking my head because I am absolutely baffled at how you didn't realize that having kids is bad for women's aesthetics and then decided to have 3 of them. Then again it sounds like you didn't decide at all, she did. This whole post reeks of a need to reel in your woman, especially the part about her personality going south. Though, you clearly only care about this girl's looks and did from the start, so why did you do something to deplete that?

"I know what goes on here" do you? The entirety of TRP is more or less manipulation. If you are of the belief that you're a victim of circumstance, that you were cucked by an act of god, by mother nature, I give you the pity you were seeking when you wrote this post.

[–]crazyfoxxx8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

I don't know. My parents have been married for 25 years now. Clearly both have aged but my Mom has aged quite gracefully. She doesnt drink. She does intermittent fasting regularly, and looks at least ten to fifteen years younger than women of her same age. She's not a person with a 20 year olds body but clearly better than most women her age. She did go under the knife for my Dad though and came out looking even better.

I would say their marriage is pretty good. They do fight, but I actually like having married parents in a reasonably happy relationship. Honestly if somebody told me that my life could be like my parents after marriage, I would consider it a good bargain even if my wife didn't look like a Playboy model when she was forty

Having said that, I can't see finding a girl like my Mom today though. My Dad clearly runs the show in our house. My mom cooks well and despite being well educated decided to put her career second when it came to raising me and my sibling. She lets my Dad do the manly stuff, run the home finances and consults him on all major decisions. I can't see today's girls doing anything she does for her man

When i think about that, it makes me a little sad. I see what could have been for me, but don't see it happening. Also I don't know if it is because of my family situation but I have slightly right of center political views. Maybe being brought up in what would be called a patriarchal family influenced my views?

As a kid, I am glad my Dad didn't just run from one pretty woman to the other and stuck with my Mom. I think he would have been a very sad man today if he had run after sex only. I also appreciate that my Mom kept herself beautiful within the boundaries set by nature and was a good wife to him

They have built a good life together and have raised us well.

[–]RPDunkleBomb 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

Lessons Learned:

-The wall exists and it's brutal.

-Having children accelerates the speed at which a woman collides with the wall.

-Marriage is a no-win contract and human relationships have a shelf life of 4-6 years.

-There are no unicorns.

[–]LeadVitamin132 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

-Having children accelerates the speed at which a woman collides with the wall.

That's why women should have kids when they are about to hit the wall.

[–]climaxingplatypus15 points16 points  (3 children) | Copy

If your daughter was never in the picture would you still remain with your wife?

[–]recursoinominado1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I think he answered this one.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon112 points113 points  (28 children) | Copy

I think too many men are NOT aware of what pregnancy and motherhood does to a woman's body. It completelt fucks it up. Ruins it.

She didn't 'bounce back' anymore it seems

Especially if she packs on a few pounds of lard too. Alternating fat with dieting isn't gonna be too great for a body.

Behavior-wise, she got fucking mean

Yeah. Happens when women have security, options and control.

At thirty I look better than I ever did. I'm fitter, more in shape, more muscular and overall more attractive than I was when I first married. But my wife is but a shell of her former self.

And yet she's the one being abusive to you.

She does it because she can. You're loyal. You have restricted your own options with your loyalty - and she has lost all respect for you because of it. Not that you have any choice if you want to keep your children.

[–]saladon 1 points [recovered]  (8 children) | Copy

Not only that. I suspect that OP's wife notices his disdain for her, and misses the days when he was the romantic beta filling her with comforting emotions.

Now, the fake platitudes he uses to get his supply of sex from her only makes things worse about how she views him. At best, OP is a newly awakened alpha whom she views as fulfilling none of her needs, not even the comforting provider part.

[–]recursoinominado12 points13 points  (1 child) | Copy

It's a ego defense mechanism. OP started to show signs of "wanting to GTFO" and she is trying to do it first so she feels that the power is on her hands. "He is giving up on me? NO, I am giving up on HIM! Who he thinks he is? I can't possibly be flawed". I had a chance to see it first hand on my last LTR, i started to act distant and lack sexual desires for my ex (who was crazy about me until then) and she quickly got distant herself and bailed out of the relationship. Women can't take rejection.

[–]DeontologicalSanders1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon5 points6 points  (5 children) | Copy

and misses the days when he was the romantic beta filling her with comforting emotions.

I think she misses being able to respect him because he could walk away. Now he has shown deep commitment, and this kills respect.

I still don't think it's too late for OP if he really wants to stop living a life of regrets, though

Most men prioritise their children over their sex life

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

On your last point, I'd say that's a good thing, yeah?

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's good for children and it's good for women. It kinds sucks for men.

But yes, it's good that we care about our children. I wish our women and our laws rewarded men for this rather than punishing them for it.

[–]destraht1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I plan to make babies in either South America or Eastern Europe (probably EE). I won't do it if I can't just once in a while give her cash for bills and food for the next whenever and just head out. I feel like it is enough to be around 97% 96% of the time, lick her pussy, pay for all of the shit and change a few diapers. Fuck that if I can't just leave for several days or more when I don't feel anything enjoyable about being there.

[–]chogbonna0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Damn that's so backwards. Respect based on your ability to walk away sounds like marriage is flawed to begin with. In this country at least.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

sounds like marriage is flawed to begin with

It really is completely and utterly flawed. Or at least not what men think it is. As a mechanism for tricking men into signing a legally binding contract to support women it's perfect.

In this country at least

Same in most of the West, and the rest of the world is heading the same way.

The whole "respect based on your ability to walk away" is a fundamental truth about the world. Commitment is rewarded with disdain, the hungry don't get fed, the rich get offered bank loans and the poor are told to work harder.

Get used to it, this is how the world operates while telling you it doesn't.

[–]letter_of_resignatio2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

And maybe she was/is shallow person too, and now that she's not that attractive she became bitter and angry.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yeah. Happens when women have security, options and control.

I think this is big. Whatever women's natural faults, we now have a society that magnifies them and lets them run free. If you tell a person from the time that they are able to talk that they are strong and powerful and wonderful and can do whatever they want, and you never hold them accountable for their actions, is it any surprise that they grow up to be raging narcissists? Similarly, if you give someone complete power over another human, is it any surprise when they abuse that power and act shitty? This is pretty simple stuff.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

and powerful and wonderful and can do whatever they want, and you never hold them accountable for their actions, is it any surprise that they grow up to be raging narcissists?

Right: privilege breeds entitlement.

The whole "male privilege" thing is to distract us from THEIR excessive privilege.

Similarly, if you give someone complete power over another human, is it any surprise when they abuse that power and act shitty? This is pretty simple stuff.

It is, and I really feel for fathers who are completely fucking stuck with the whole deal.

[–]drty_pr0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy

And yet she's the one being abusive to you.

She does it because she can.....

....he fuckin lets her. Ive said it before and I'll say it again: People can only treat you like shit if you let them

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy

the alternative is losing his children

[–]drty_pr0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy

If he is doing his share of the workload at home, being financially responsible and being a good father, he will get spilt custody of his children; or at least split care.

While there are isolated cases where guys lose their children for no reason, they are far from the norm (most men lose custody by not fighting hard enough) and shouldn't be the reason for accepting a women treating you like shit.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

If he is doing his share of the workload at home, being financially responsible and being a good father, he will get spilt custody of his children; or at least split care.

Unlikely.... if she says "I'm scared in my own home, he terrifies me", she'll get the kids, alimony and child support. She may even make a few false police calls to improve her case. This happens a LOT.

While there are isolated cases where guys lose their children for no reason,

These cases are not isolated. Women have the upper hand in "family" court from start to finish.

, they are far from the norm (most men lose custody by not fighting hard enough

  1. Men should not have to fight for custody at all

  2. Men who give up do so because they are advised they will lose anyway, and fighting for custody will anger the mother who is going to have control over them in the future.

[–]drty_pr0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

Not my experience in my observable surroundings. Most women want the father to have the kids half the time so they can have a life, but the guys were deadbeats that don't want anything to do with the kids or are in/out of jail.

I'm also Canadian too though. So our child custody cases go a lot differently.

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

the guys were deadbeats that don't want anything to do with the kids or are in/out of jail

This is the myth: that men are deadbeat dads. It's used to universally remove paternal rights from fathers.

[–]drty_pr0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

While I often agree with what you say on this forum, this is wrong way more often than its right. A lot of dudes are deadbeats.

[–]diffines11 points12 points  (1 child) | Copy

Ok, that’s your marriage. But let’s look at this another way. You guys stay together despite her skinny ass and low hanging fruit. You get a little older, you get fuckin cancer. Your wife takes you to your doctors, she cleans up your piss and vomit, she puts you to bed, feeds you, your kids help you up and visit you, they sit with you cause you’re so fuckin sick you just wanna die. They’re company. Versus- you divorce her skinny ass, you have a stroke, you end up alone, nobody gives a shit, no kids around, you fall and break your leg, you lie there for days and die there alone, but at least you didn’t need to see a bitch around that got a little saggy. You ain’t gonna be 28 forever. Maybe make it work. I know someone here is gonna say divorce and get a hotter younger bitch. I say- more baggage or just different baggage and the potential for worse shit down the road. Make it work. You can’t change reality all the time, or even most of the time.

[–]Somnus961 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

This sub has changed so much

5 years ago you would have been downvoted into oblivion

[–]grandmazboy39 points40 points  (1 child) | Copy

Thank you for your honesty brave man. Hang in there.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

He should nope the fuck out. Imagine just resigning yourself to being miserable. Fuck that.

[–]anticultured30 points31 points  (1 child) | Copy

Man, I got married at 50 for the first time. I’m 51 now. My wife was in the best shape of her life. Six pack abs and all. Has two grown girls, 18, and 21. Nice as can be. I really think it’s okay to get married at this age, I’m rounding third base and headed for home plate. At 20, way too young... I banged hundreds of chics in my 20s and 30s. Many tried to lock me down, but I always saw that trap, long before this website and sub existed. I have no kids, but I’m okay with that. I wish you luck. I say, separate if it’s what will make you happy. You only got one life.

[–]1atticusfinch19733 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

There's nothing wrong with getting married older and waiting, it's just that society (and most women) see marriage as the ideal vision for life, which I know now is BS. I fell into it myself.

At 50 you want a compatible partner to do things other than raising kids. Hopefully you still have a great libido and sex life and then you also have security of knowing if anything happens due to health you'll be taken care of. It's the best scenario.

[–]ShimaRoosman16 points17 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'm surprised this has so many upvotes. Sounds like you're pissed at the world because your wife isn't as attractive anymore. What sort of a shallow asshat are you? Will you be mad at her if she doesn't like your receding hair line in a few years time?

Be a man, and get on with it. If you don't want to be with her, then get a divorce, but you can't bag on at her just because her body has changed after having 3 children. All of which by the way, you played a part in creating, you didn't have to keep sticking it in her and busting your load.

[–]NormalAndy 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

My missus is a mean bitch who threatens divorce at the drop of a hat and has a body nobody is interested in anymore- including me. Great fucking cook though and she earns her own money.

It’s hilarious. I tell her she is free to go whenever she likes but she stays and does what I want instead. I am also free to pick up dates if I choose but, truth be told I don’t have the time these days and I’m not all that bothered either. Women are a pain in the ass a lot of the time from what I see of them. I enjoy the attention though.

As long as you are strong enough to take the abuse, marriage is a fucking joy! Still, when it is all over, that will be fun too.

[–]sh1ftyswar11 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy

this fucking excellent mate

[–]flyalpha5635 points36 points  (3 children) | Copy

Thanks for the warning cuzzo. Just focus on giving your kids the best life possible, don’t worry about the whiny bitch.

Some optimism for you... maybe when she hits 35-40 she will hit a milf stage and her body will come back a little bit.

The tits prob won’t get better without going under the knife tho... I fucked a 38 year old (i was 23) on a business trip last summer in San Diego and her tits were saggy as fuck. Nipples all wrinkled and shit... it was weird considering I had just recently graduated and went from fucking 19-22 year olds to that haha.

[–]logicalthinker10 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I think if you told her about your concerns, she might change. But you have to do it in the context of "hunny, you're getting uglier and so am I. Let's both get better for each other's sake." That way, it won't feel like you're scolding her. She'll get the message but will receive it instead of lashing out.

[–]Gobraves446 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy

So what happened between kid 1 and 2/3? After kid 1 it sounded ok. Was it just age?

[–]Not_Reddit0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

hormones change in women with births

[–]c_megalodon257 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

I believe women have an identity crisis after kids that men will never truly understand. We are always up for sex. We are always wanting to work, and we are always interested in doing fun things. Being a father is simply another part of who we are just like taking up guitar (although definitely more important and permanent!!) With women, they fight with the identity of being a sexy and desirable woman and being a mommy. It completely stresses them out and they take it out on us even if it isn't justified. They hate their new body that is leaking milk, and has stretch marks. While we men will always like the perfect supermodel, we did knock up our wives and should be accepting of at least some changes...not gaining 150 pounds, but the normal shit.

They also seem to have resentments toward us about our different parenting style. They can't see that ours works too. They resent us for not being perfect parents even though many of us are pretty fucking good dads. Sucks, I know.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

You're honestly pathetic.

Married man with children obsessing over pussy like a teenager. Jesus christ man.

Maybe if you weren't such a simp your wife wouldn't treat you like shit.

Here you are, whining about how much you hate your wife's body on the internet. Then you blame her for treating you like shit.

Act your age. You aren't single. You aren't 20 years old. Be a man.

And if anyone wants to say "blah blah TRP is about focusing on yourself!!!"

If you put your own WANTS ahead of your children's needs you are human garbage. End of story.

[–]conflagratorX20 points21 points  (4 children) | Copy

At least you banged her through her prime years. Many men wife up post wall slut which gives her first birth during her 30. Which has even more disastrous effect on women looks.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy

At least you banged her through her prime years. Many men wife up post wall slut which gives her first birth during her 30. Which has even more disastrous effect on women looks.

Yes, that's my only consolation at this point. That at least I got her when she was still somewhat fresh. I got to enjoy her that way for about three years and after that, it went downhill.

[–]triavatar23 points24 points  (3 children) | Copy

She hates you because she WAS hot, and your baby fucked that over completely. Do you blame her?

Do you think she doesn't realize that you think she's disgusting now? If she were to find your account and read this post. I bet you she wouldn't be in the least bit surprised.

YOU decided to have multiple babies with her. That's what cucked you, not the marriage.

edit: multiple babies, not just one. Jesus man.

[–]sh1ftyswar-1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy

women are always going to go down hill, hit the wall whatever but those fucking kids if raised correctly make it almost worth the bullshit. my oldest son is my fucking pride and joy and I do everything I can to keep him as close to red pill as is realistic. his mother is long gone out of the picture and thank god but that kid...

[–]triavatar4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

We will all inevitably run into a wall of some kind. However, a child that is raised to respect and understand both their parents (not necessarily equally) will undoubtedly have an easier time with life later on. The child must also learn early that society will encourage them to act in certain ways to preserve harmony, however we are not meant to be sheep, but shepherds.

[–]MaximumSeven3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

The wall takes no prisoners

[–]SeeminglyBlue4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

“love looks not with the eyes, but with the mind; and therefore is winged cupid painted blind.”

your situation is a result of falling in love with her body, not her head. trust me when i say that while her body changes, she does not. i doubt this will get better. your best solution right now would be counseling to see if you can sort this knot out, and if you cannot, then divorce. you will save yourself and her a lot of trouble later in the line. you are still young, as is she; there is an entire flock of birds waiting outside your nest. all it takes is a little push.

[–]Bestoftherest22247 points48 points  (2 children) | Copy

As a female loses her assets she lashes out. This is a common theme. She gets more and more miserable losing her only asset, and she gets mad at everyone else.

99% of women have no personality and only identify themselves on how they look. Losing looks is like us men losing our penis, money, and future all at once.

[–]tailblock4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

99% of women have no personality and only identify themselves on how they look. Losing looks is like us men losing our penis, money, and future all at once.


[–]Luftiwaffe6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy

one question: do you totally regret it?

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Surprisingly enough... no. I do not regret the children. I love the children. They're cute, clever and brighten my day. I just regret the harpy their mother turned into. And the way nature ruined her once pretty, perky body leaving me with something that turns me off constantly and forces me to lie about it.

[–]ApostateAZ7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

People shouldn’t get married until they are in their late 20s to early 30s. People change too much before that age.

My wife had her body destroyed after our first and only child, but she is an amazing wife and pretty much has sex whenever I want. We have been together for over 10 years.

Getting her a tummy tuck next year, at her request, to fix what my son did.

[–]Tannedmonkey10 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

If you want I can fuck her for you.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

And why would you even want that, after reading my description?

[–]kjlh99 points10 points  (3 children) | Copy

Does she go to the gym? If she puts no effort in i'd ask to open the relationship or bite the bullet and divorce. You're in your prime and as a great man once said, yolo

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

I am hesitant to open the relationship up, I'm not comfortable with the idea of her boning other men, as much as I would like to fuck better, prime pussy... and I know she would get it, she's cute at first glance and guys are thirsty as fuck nowadays.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

Uh what did you expect? Did you think she was going to gain 70lbs, shit out a 5lb baby two or three times and then go back to the original state? Lol.

[–]Samatic3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

You state, "And yet I was cucked, not by any other man, but by Mother Nature itself." I can honestly say I'd never thought of it like this and thanks for mentioning it. I just hope that the first child was yours since you didn't get a paternity test then you would of been cucked by nature and your wife!

[–]DonkeyD13K2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

5 love languages, this turned my marriage around after very, very similar circumstances.

[–]newbornredditor3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Hello OP. I'm very curious to hear what were the circumstances of the 2nd and 3rd pregnancy. Did you plan them or were they the "oops! It just happened" type of situation. Did you want to have more than just one child with that woman?

[–]EnzoGold2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Does she even go to the gym? Cause that's clearly a factor too

[–]tiny10boy4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

A woman will only look as good and be as kind as is required by her environment.

[–]JimmyJoeJr23 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Gotta say fairplay for telling it like it is and not holding back or sugar-coating.

[–]bastardstepchild9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yeah - and the older and fatter they get, the LESS they appreciate that you keep putting up with their shit.

[–]Seasnek2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

If I understand correctly: value women as how attractive they are > they do everything to be attractive to you > win the jackpot and marry you > natural aging happens > you no longer value the woman > woman no longer knows what to do as everything was to be attractive to you > no one is happy. Should have valued women for their personality and mind instead of solely looks...

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (3 children) | Copy

I think we should discuss the whole having kids thing wrecking a woman’s body more. You said it yourself, your first one wasn’t planned, what was the point of having the second?

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

The second one was us both believing that it's not good growing up as an only child. And, frankly, we both wanted a large-ish family. She was unplanned, definitely, but not unwelcome. The timing was just off. And I discovered some very uncomfortable realities of life shortly after.

[–]Endorsed ContributorUrsusG3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

She was unplanned, definitely

Did your birth control fail?

[–]187oddfuture43 points44 points  (21 children) | Copy

Wtf is this, the blue pill subreddit? Why are any of you retards in the comments saying: “Oh, great reminder oh wise 30-something. I’ll have my fun BEFORE I GET MARRIED.”? Fuck that noise. Don’t get married, period. Zero benefits. Zero. If you value kids more than you value your freedom and your livelihood, then I’ll show you your chains. Marriage is the worst deal you could ever take, and learn from OP. Don’t get married, fucking bloops.

[–]lll_lll_lll33 points34 points  (11 children) | Copy

I would say there is definitely potential benefit to marriage, but it doesn’t really kick in until you become elderly. Who really wants to be alone with no family when they are 70? Who will care about you then?

We will not all stay in our 30s and 40s forever. Do you want to be the old guy still going out to clubs and bars? Or just keep to yourself in solitude at that point?

I have no desire to get married or have kids, but I will wish when I am old to have a little granddaughter to take to the park. It will probably be a very lonely stage of life without it.

[–]RPDunkleBomb 1 points [recovered]  (4 children) | Copy

Who really wants to be alone with no family when they are 70

News flash, even 70 year olds with families are alone the majority of the time. Meet a few people that work in hospice and get back to me.

You come into the world alone; you'll leave it alone. What you do in between is what matters.

[–]the99percent118 points19 points  (1 child) | Copy

Well, i think raising a kid is one of life greatest joy and experience.

[–]InvariantD8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

Don Draper: The reason you haven't felt it is because it doesn't exist. What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons. You're born alone and you die alone and this world just drops a bunch of rules on top of you to make you forget those facts. But Inever forget.

[–]SilkTouchm2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

[–]lll_lll_lll0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Interesting points, thanks for the link.

[–]187oddfuture13 points14 points  (0 children) | Copy

What happens when your wife divorce rapes you right before you retire and leaves you with nothing? It’s just not worth it dude.

[–]simplisticallysimple1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

"Make no mistake, we all die alone." -- George Clooney

[–]3LiveAFTSOV15 points16 points  (6 children) | Copy

Dont forget all the "Vanguards" of this Sub, GayLubeOil... Rollo Tomassi... other EC's.

Dont forget the majority of them are married / have been in monogamous LTRs for many years.

[–]Atheist_Utopia3 points4 points  (4 children) | Copy

Are you propagating marriage? Because it is objectively still a very bad idea, no matter how many "Vanguards" participate.

[–]DJTrapMatic13 points14 points  (4 children) | Copy

OP you need to stop having sex with a woman you’ve become unattracted to, Grows some balls and tell her no. If she asks tell her you can no longer become aroused when you see her naked. Sorry

[–]CavityX29 points30 points  (1 child) | Copy

Bruh you're fucking retarded if that's your strat.

I know this is the internet and you don't have to actually have any bearing on what you advise; but, you're fucking retarded.

Approaching OP's situation like this will only result in meltdown. Wife's feelings aside, OP has to consider how his actions affect his family and kids, that's what being a man is. Not trying to be hard on Reddit.

To OP, be a man and talk to her about lifting/fitness. If you are fit like you say it should be easy peasy. Don't beat around the bush about her looks, But at the same time don't let that be your only reason. Make it about being healthy for the kids, being sexy for eachother, instilling good habits etc.

Your gal knows she isn't as sexy as she once was, but if you make that the linchpin of your talk, she's going to hamster it back around on you. She needs to know that you want to be attracted to her again (assuming you want to continue the relationship)

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

I can still get hard for her. Sort of. And I still get horny and find the need to have a sexual release. She's my wife after all... there are just certain things that come with marriage. But I hate this feeling that she is getting the better end of the stick her, as even when I am at times less than enthousiastic to enter her, the total package of me is still more desirable to her, than she is to me. Unless part of her senses already that fucking her is little more than a duty to me. Or mutual masturbation minus hands.

[–]rebelde_sin_causa13 points14 points  (4 children) | Copy

I recently dated a gal in her late 30s with 3 kids who has the body of a playboy model. She's a triathlete with fake boobs. Works out constantly. Great tan. So they do exist. But she's not fit to be anything better than a plate. Same old story. "My ex husband abused me." I have it on good authority some of the bruises she showed to the police related to that were put there by her.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

She's a triathlete with fake boobs.

Some men are into that, me, it's a major turn-off. I love the naturally perky tits of a young girl or woman. Past a certain age it's all down hill, kids or no kids. Plastic does little for me.

[–]SlimeyJusticeWarrior1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

That's how it is. Standards of men towards women are much lower than the other way. If she's >30 and working out she deserves a chad. If you're >30 and working out you deserve a harpy with saggy tits.

[–]Radkin0075 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Attraction is paramount my man. If you or she is not attracted to the other, it is destined to fail. It’s not rocket surgery, it’s a pretty obvious thing. Most women actually don’t want marriage now a days as they have been masculinized by the female-social economic imperative. The best thing, psychologically for you would be to divorce before the pressure surmounts to a breaking point. The best thing financially would be to divorce when the kids are out of the house. Women can’t love the way a man sees love. They love in a weird pseudo-twisted way, relying on emotion in the moment, rather then past experience and memories as men do.

I have not fully deciphered this concept and I fear I may never, as I am not a woman and can not fathom how their cranium organ works to a fault, this is not to say they all work an exact way but rather a generalization.

[–]alphatom632 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

How old is she after the babies?

[–]1scissor_me_timbers000 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

She’s 28 if you do the math in the post

[–]volvostupidshit2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

At least you did not marry a woman with BPD, OP. Lmao. You could have tripled your misery.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

looks-wise you made a deal. you trade her good looks for your children. this seems a honest deal.

what is totally avoidable is her behaviour, this i cannot explain.

[–]TruthSeekaaaaa2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

For me, the scariest part is not the decaying woman but the thought of living a life along with a person you don't like anymore.

[–]Hyper_Sonik2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Sounds like my baby mamma to a T. But now she wants to be a "dancer" because nobody "pays attention" to her. Has a nasty attitude and high expectations. Thinks her shit don't stink. We're not together. Once in a while we fuck and last time I made her dripping wet. It was weird. It's cinfusing.
I think she thinks some "prince charming" is going to sweep her up and take on our 2 children. Or that her ticket to salvation and riches is becoming a stripper. Crazy because I've known her since we were 15. I'm 31 and she was always a "good girl"....I am reminded of rollos article "making up for missing out".

[–]TryhardPantiesON2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Hey OP, have you ever suggested she exercise or have a cosmetic surgery to repair her body? Like, a breast lift, breast enlargment, fix the saggy belly, etc. Maybe the reason she is mean to you is because she no longer feels attractive and she notices your lack of attraction to her.

Think about it, it's like investing some money on an old car that you want to keep for your whole life, to make it look nice.

Not white knighting, but you seem to have a solid relationship, just lacking lust for each other, so I think it would be worth trying to repair the relationship on that regard.

[–]dobbekz2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I think this happens in most marriages and it's not just the wife looking worse a lot of time the guy will look like shit to, once people have a partner and they get married they just get complacent and no longer put in the effort.

[–]etherealembryo2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I needed this. Good luck soldier the fight never ends.

[–]casual_redditor_012 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Best read thread in awhile...

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Thanks for posting. My mom once told me if you want to know how a woman ages, look at her mom.

[–]JustinDell9902 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Marriage/children is the biggest trap there is. You're a fool for falling for the hype.

[–]Starfuckingman2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Why don't you get her to workout and keep it as a lifestyle so she maintains at least half of her former self and not end up like this.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I suspect OP doesn't work out himself.. If you know what I mean

[–]goldaxis2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Why do you think she has become mean?

Raising kids really is tough. Losing your attractiveness takes a big mental toll on anyone too. You're never getting your perky little 20yo minx back, but you can have a better relationship if you can manage to cooperate and build each other up instead of showing such open disgust for each other. Get her in on your fitness time. Buy a really good home gym if you have to. TRP rules don't really matter after you have three kids.

[–]makethemflaunt2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Hey dude. I want to give you some personal feedback after going through a similar situation.

This really worked for me. Try it out and see how you feel.

I was also going through a phase of "oh fuck, what have I done?" I was no longer physically attracted to my SO at a level that I determined to be acceptable. So I developed a new goal. My aim was to build sexual tension in the relationship, even though I was no longer finding my SO to be that attractive. I rationalized that I needed that sexual tension in order to *want* to get better, to improve myself, and to look forward to sex, rather than to just do it because it was there.

I instituted a regimen of looking at soft porn (no penetration; no sex; just beautiful female models, a la FemAngels or FemJoy) for no more than 10 minutes each morning, and then not masturbating or having sex.

Within about a week, I was really amped up and starting to look at my SO differently, and starting to feel differently too. I could feel tension rise up within me. I used that tension within me to build sexual tension between the two of us. After about a week, I allowed sex again.

I kept up the soft porn viewing habit for several weeks and then naturally stopped. That was several months ago.

As I elevated the tension between us, she got more attractive both objectively (because she started to get more fit and more submissive, responding to the increased tension), and subjectively, from my own point of view (because I was hornier). The results seem to have lasted.

At last check in, there was a very pretty girl, about 10 years younger, who was presenting the opportunity for a one-time cheating. And I did not consider it for more than a couple minutes :-) My rel with my girl is too valuable to give up on at this point, when I weigh the balance of my particular situation.

However, all of that said, if you don't find your girl to be enjoyable to be with, because she's mean and you can't find your way to getting her back in line, then you're in trouble and you may need to get out. All the tools in this sub, however, should be able to help you get that under control, driving her to be both less mean and also take better care of her body.

But again, if the work isn't worth the effort, if you feel like you will get more meaning and satisfaction out of life not being in the relationship, like the world will be a better place for it, then god speed.

In either case, best of luck.

[–]dDiegoDLV2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

You're with a gf that is both not attractive to you and a bitch? GTFO

Sounds like you're a good dad. Maybe you can get 1/2 custody. (Maybe there are social media posts form her talking about what a great dad you are? if so save them)

All the divorce stuff TRP warns about is real. If you are as unhappy as you sound in this post it is going to end within a few years anyway when you are so miserable you cant take it any more. Might as well plan your exit. Good Luck.

[–]Lateralanouncer2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Look bro. I went through This worked my but off and wanted to take a brake after slaving my ass off for a decade. She divorced me 3 months after. Woman do not give a shit about us men. She doesn’t value you, your time what you provide, anything you have to offer. She will drop you in a heart beat and be supported by everyone, while you are the bad guy. loose your job, what ever, your done, out the door sleeping in your car. My good friend broke both his legs and had to spend 4 months in hospital, his wife hired a baby sitter went clubbing and jumped on a few cocks while he was in hospital she didn’t care they had kids she didn’t work.

Other comments on this sub have advised u to suck it up u made the decision. I believe that is a double standard. You need to use your time wisely, be prepared for divorce and test if she will stay through a hard financial situation, assuming you are the man of the house and have your shit together.

Your life is your life.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Do not buy the entire Wal-Mart corporation because you like Wal-Mart brand cereal.

Do not marry because you want the sex.

[–]TheCreatorOfCritical2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

So do you not like what's beneath her surface enough to justify her body being destroyed by children as expected? Seems like you just married a trophy wife with about as much personality as yourself if all you have to complain about is her looks? What about her? Is she a bitch or is she kind and loving? That's where the magic is. Every dime turns into a nickel man.

[–]waverlyposter2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Hint: Choosing the right women is THE most important decision you make in your life. Fuck it up and you will be in hell for a long time.

[–]posyjosie2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Imagine hating the person who helped give you your kids this much? Maybe that's why she's mean to you dude, she can tell you think she's disgusting.

[–]StimulisRK2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I can't imagine being this conceited and shallow lol. A small part of me feels bad for you - but most of me feels like you're a pussy who needs to grow tf up. I feel bad for your kids more than anything.

[–]lucajones889 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

Also 30 and have never looked better, I honestly can’t remember the last time I met a woman my age who was attractive.

They are out there, but their SMV is now so high because so many guys get shamed into dating women over 25 by hags that they are too much effort.

I’ll probably date <25yo until I’m unable to hook that shit up any more.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 11 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy

Also 30 and have never looked better, I honestly can’t remember the last time I met a woman my age who was attractive.

A lot of them DO look attractive, though. Their bra keeps their breasts looking good when you first meet them. Their make up covers the lines on their face. Their tummies look good, covered up or shown only partially, strategically... But get that 34-year old mother of 2 or even that 29 year old-divorced mother of none naked, and I bet she's nowhere near as hot as she was at 20. Just sad facts of life.

[–]Jbug311 1 points [recovered]  (11 children) | Copy

Her body got wrecked having your kids. Do you love your kids? Or do you love yourself so much you simply don’t have anymore left for anyone else?You’re an asshole for talking shit about her to random internet strangers. Grow a pair and tell her exactly how you feel. Better yet, let her read your post. If you’re that miserable and she’s that awful to be around quit being a pussy and do something about it. You’re a great looking dude with a big dick right? You shouldn’t have any trouble finding some tail.

[–]-all-one-word-4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

Her body may have gotten wrecked by baring his children, but that doesn't mean that she needs to stay this way. Calories in and calories out, all of that extra weight that OP is talking about could be lost if she wanted to put in the effort. I know that she has to take care of the kids and maybe even work a 9-5, but she could stop eating. I'm just trying to play devils advocate because it seems like he's genuinely unhappy and wants to warn fellow RP's about what COULD happen.

As for him loving himself too much and talking shit in a message board is concerned- there's nothing wrong with loving yourself more than others as long as it's not an extreme case. With the internet being what it is I think that this is a good medium or outlet for him to express his feelings without feeling and face to face judgment.

With that being said I do agree with you in the sense that he's being a bit of a pissy by not confronting her or at the vary least refusing sex.

Just my 2 cents.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Agreed. CICO is basic. Tits will be wrecked no matter what. She can’t help that. My wife’s were bad. So what did we do? Boob job. It improved her self confidence and I benefited as well. If he talks to her anywhere close to the way he slammed her here it’s no wonder she’s miserable and non receptive.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] -1 points0 points  (8 children) | Copy

I have told her, to some degree. I have told her to work out more, to not let herself go as much as she does. To watch her diet. She started exercizing, briefly, and it improved her attitude somewhat. Energized her. But she quickly drops it again each and every time. She tells me she does not have time, but she has plenty; she's a stay-at-home mother.

[–]MRAGGGAN1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Stay at home mothers do not have as much time as you wrongly assume they do.

Unless your house is constantly trashed and your children constantly starving, I’d imagine your wife is actually doing a lot that you don’t know about.

No wonder she’s “mean” to you. You think so little of her, and very clearly always have. Two affairs and an illegitimate child?

[–]simplisticallysimple10 points11 points  (0 children) | Copy

Of course women want to get married by hook or by crook. It's her only way of still retaining her man once her beauty fades; you think she'd keep you with her charming personality? No. She'd use the power of the state and hold your wealth and income ransom, so you can't leave her even after she has nothing to offer you, not even her looks.

How many women are really confident of retaining a man's commitment just based on merit alone? This is exactly why so many women do a 180-degree face turn the moment you put a wedding ring on them. At that point, they've already achieved their goal, you're locked in legally with nowhere to run to, and they can now be as fat and bitchy as they want and be financially rewarded handsomely if you dare complain.

This is why I don't understand men who voluntarily submit to marriage. You're born free, yet you choose to sign up for lifelong slavery and work on the plantation, putting your signature on an agreement that protects another person's interests at the expense of your own. Not only are you financially boxed in, but you can't even date other women while you're at it, so no matter how rich or successful you become, you can never upgrade without seriously jeopardizing that very newfound success. In other words, whatever financial success you obtain once you're married belongs to her.

What kind of stupid man would work hard to succeed if they knew that whatever success that resulted from their blood and sweat can and will be taken away by another person? Why would he have the motivation to excel financially? So that his parasitic so-called "stay-at-home" wife can buy the latest Hermes bag just to compete with her girl pals who've all snagged professional (but romantically-inexperienced) spouses who're worked to death as it is?

This is one of those mysteries of the universe that I'll never understand. Rational human beings all strive to lower their income tax rates as much as possible, yet here we have a whole class of men who choose to work like a dog only to have the majority of his earnings be spent on anyone other than himself. We're talking easily a de facto 70-80% income tax rate. Might as well be communism at that point.

Tell me, how much of a married man's hard-earned dollar actually goes to himself? What's his REAL take-home pay? I think married men reading these don't even dare to think about these questions. It's mind-boggling.

You lot should be ashamed of how thirsty you are. You have no self-respect, no masculine qualities whatsoever, and no common sense. Happy living an entire lifetime of self-abasement and indentured servitude. You all deserve it.

[–]VillagersUnite4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

Good shit on keeping in shape. You would've had a hell of a worse time than you are now if you didn't.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

It’s really obvious that you don’t frequent married red pill. If you do then shame on you because your wife being negative is all on you. All of the readings teach it and with enough attention to detail you’ll see that your wife behaves however you let her. If your wife is negative to you it’s because she doesn’t respect you and that’s your fault for not being respectable. This wasn’t post a RP lesson. This was a glorified victim puke and nothing more.

[–]ElloGovna_6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

“My wife is ugly” that’s about all I got from this

[–]Bojack1014 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Does anybody actually believe this larp shit lmao

[–]DTreatz5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy


" his is a big deal to a lot of men, myself included, and I'll share these things because I think too many men are NOT aware of what pregnancy and motherhood does to a woman's body. It completelt fucks it up. Ruins it. "

I want some scientific data if anyone has any because I'm not buying it, is there any data that says the weight women gain from pregnancy is any different than weight gained from overeating? I understand the hormones affect their biology throughout pregnancy and post-pregnancy for some time, but permanently after? I'm unconvinced, especially because I see women with kids who still look good post pregnancy, which convinces me it's more work effort, also stretch marks can be prevented if you maintain skin health throughout pregnancy

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

Thank you for your honest representation of what many of us go through. This forum is great for many things, and it’s sucks at a lot. But honesty for men is one of its great attributes. A lot of us didn’t choose the married life: the married life chose us. Fair to say that women and men have totally different goals for life, lots of times. It shows as we age, and if we marry her early in lives, as I did too, you and she will change, and often in different and conflicting ways.

However, the penalty for wanting to allow change and maintain a happy personality is court-decided, and punitive for men.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Honesty is important, yes. That's why I kind of resent a lot of the middle aged members of this sub who keep insisting they had this FWB or this fuckbuddy or whatever who was 42 years old and totally NOT like those other girls and looked like she was 18... like, yeah, right... drop the act and stop putting unrealistic expectations in young men's heads. Especially to those who read this sub who are barely teenagers.

[–]jinglebells893 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

I think guys could get past the physcial if it wasn't for the f*cking attitude that usually accompanies it. Think about it. How many women have you looked at and thought "this woman is ruining such a good thing by acting like a cunt".

[–]Rian_Stone2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's called wife goggles, or why Men are aspirational lovers

[–]WhatRemainsAfter4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

If you think divorce is the way, you're wrong . You will be fucked for the rest of your life. Scars never heal properly. Forget about pleasures, you will long for a laugh a day 10 years down the line.

Stop thinking with your dick. You think like my rabbit who just wants to fuck. Be the captain. Take control. You can change her behaviour. Go on adventures together, try new things - esp in bed. If sex is not great then it is because you are boring. Not her. Stop playing the blame game. Your life is miserable because you are the cause. You change, life changes.

Good luck. Be wise. Don't let animal instincts lead you. Be human. We have the smartest brain in the whole universe. Use it for once. (;

[–]Endorsed Contributorex_addict_bro8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

Can confirm about the body. Make pregnant while they’re young.

Can confirm about light switch effect and betaization. This is a built in mechanism, she leaves you and has children with someone else for bigger genetic variability.

Treat all relationships as temporary. Time or nature or another man, doesn’t matter. Everything comes and goes. Use the marriage and pregnancy example to gain perspective.

I’ve seen a meme yesterday that seems to be more true the more I think about it. “There’s only one gender. Women are property”. Perspective, aight

[–]Youngyoda892 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

This is something I’ve actually spent a lot of time thinking about. This is one reason why I’d be slightly worried about having kids. For me, I want to be with a woman for the rest of my life. Once I pump, maybe 3, babies into her; I’d like for her to still be attractive. I’ve been with her for 6 years and we have no kids.

Her perfect body has already slipped. She’s up 20 lbs if pure fat and on top of that lost all of her muscle tone and, I repeat, we have no kids yet. I can’t see her getting any better, but honestly I don’t want to leave her for that reason alone. I’m certainly not as attracted to her as I once was but I don’t have the heart to overtly tell her that. I’ve encouraged her to eat healthy and workout but it seems nothing works; so far.

My only thought is that after I get done using her body to bear my children that I pay for her to have some cosmetic surgeries. To me- it would absolutely be worth it.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I would not advice anyone ever to completely disregard marriage or family altogether. It's a personal choice. There are just effects, side effects, that are always there. And always will be. I cannot deny it and it's just the way it is bro. If you have children it will come at a price. But even if you never have them, age itself will also ravage your girl.

[–]Youngyoda891 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yea I understand. I plan on pumping 2-3 kids into and then sucking out the fat she gains in her stomach from those kids and injecting it into her ass. A fat ass can get my dick hard af.. a fat stomach- not so much.

[–]xcrazytx2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Ya I'm teetering between this one. I love the freedom of being single but having a life partner, if it worked out and she didn't turn into a cunt, would be cool. Just the depth of that kinda relationship

[–]Luckyluke235 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy

I married a cute girl, she turned into a harpy. Her once sexy body quickly deteriorated

I was thinking, maybe it's due to the fact she knows she won't be able to get alphas anymore and YOU ( not be a fault) ruined her?

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Perhaps it's a factor, yes. But at the same time, she could still easily get a beta provider I'm sure. Even with three kids. One that out-earns me, too, I bet. Her face is still cute, and she didn't get fat. She just looks completely ravaged once naked. But a well-off blue-pilled man of the milquetoast variety might still eat up her stories of her "abusive ex husband" and pity-marry her, providing for my kids. Essentially locking me out. She has that power. They always do.

[–]Luckyluke231 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

thanks for your reply man it's interesting.

[–]coffeecreamer064 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy

I don't think i want kids anymore... Fuck... 😅

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I'm not advocating anyone never to have one. Or to have one, for that matter. But I am just trying to make a point that women, even objectively hot ones, are still often disgusting underneath their clothes. Whether it's due to aging or childbirth or both. Usually a combination.

[–]coffeecreamer061 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

:/ well.... Fuck what do you mean? I've been the ugly duckling my whole life . I just became decent. Lmao no kids for me. Nope.

[–]Xornor3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Ok. I am now even more happy that we did not produce any kids. That was the best decision in my life. Women are behaving nicely and are quite good looking even around age of 50 if they do not make kids.

My advice for younger men is that never marry and never make kids - you will be much much happier. Your SO will be good looking and kind whole your life. Your life will be better when woman thinks that you can leave any time.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

So what do you suggest? That we don’t have kids? That we don’t stay married to the mothers of our children?

[–]RedSkeller1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Long time ago I met a chick off tinder who was 21 (about 6 years younger at the time) who looked pretty damn cute. I had just begun my RP days at the time, only to find out on the first date she had a couple kids and gave them up for adoption. I really didn't care because I was thirstier than a cactus in summer after an extended bout of travel and isolation - I was ready to beat the breaks off some puss.

Then she got undressed - tits pretty destroyed, not horrible, just stretch marks. Had some decent amount of stretch marks around flanks, the usual collateral damage from pregnancy. Hemorrhoids from pushing those monsters out, you get the idea. I ended up looking it up later on Reddit and there were quite a few stories where the first baby absolutely ruined some beautiful women. Some women are just one and done - no amount of exercise will save them, and the only option is surgery so then you come out looking like a patchwork skin doll.

Needless to say, we didn't last long as she was a total headcase and when she started rolling her eyes at things I was saying I knew it was time to dip. Last time I checked she was posting on facebook about a guy who allegedly 'raped' her so I think I did well.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

You dodged a bullet there. It's tragic, really, but this is the sad reality for women after about age thirty. Or women have have a child or multiple children, regardless of how young they may be. Their tits gets stretched out, they increase in size dramatically, suddenly go back to their original size when milk production halts... Nipples go from large to regular size to humongous size, and shrink a little again when milk stops, making them stretched out and wrinkly. It's altogether not a pretty sight and cannot really be fixed.

[–]thatbrofoshow 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy

I suggest having her see a hormone doctor to check up on things. HRT is just as important for women as men.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Can confirm this is exactly what happens to them they have a few kids lose the attractiveness they once had then moan and groan, I dumped mine and never looked back. moved in with my dad who by luck had just thrown my mother out.

[–]xeroshogun3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

Dude just buy her new tits. Problem solved

[–]safa619472 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Thank you for writing this post. You're right, most people don't talk about marriage this way. They usually tell how good is their life, and I, single, on my 30s, keep suspecting "wtf my life is a mess and they guys living this fairy tale?"

You stressed some negative aspects, I thank you deeply to put this so objectively, but maybe you were a bit dry with your own story and your wife.

I'm just a lurker here and I want to talk to the human here. I don't buy this TRP wholesome philosophy because I'm a free mind and I take what I want from packed ideologies.

Anyway, I know you didn't ask for advice, but I thought of stating the obvious and give some back since you're helping us single guys.

Just quick tips: stop having sex with her if you're not into her anymore. This will be a wake up call for both of you. I once read a real story of a guy who saved his marriage by asking his wife every day: "what can I do to make your day better?" He did it for a few months. The first day she asked him to clear the garage, and no matter how hard it was, he at least tried to make what she asked him.

I'm sure it's not all that dreadful, there's a bitter resentment in your post, you have kids and they're probably worth, you have a family after all. You said you were doing great but I'm sure you can improve in some ways. Girls do not care much about exterior appearance, maybe you can be nicer to your girlfriend-now-wife.

Not trying to teach you back anything, just giving some positive feedback. I think your post is really valuable for single men like myself.

[–]alanpartridge693 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

Sexy breasts I stopped reading.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Your loss bro. There's sexy breasts and there's not-so-sexy breasts. I'm not here to share a chapter of my new novel, so I don't really need any literary criticism when it comes to sharing my personal story and writing it down however the hell I write it down.

[–]red_matrix3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

OP most women I've met over 30 have cunty, overly entitled attitudes. Some of them keep heir bodies in check and exercise regularly and have those tight little yoga bodies - but their entitlement is off the charts.

[–]Constatine73 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'm quite an expert in physiology. I'm not going to prove it, take my advice or don't. Getting pregnant multiple times will put some stress on the body, but by no means will it fuck it up by itself. My guess is that her diet is a terrible fad diet, her lifestyle is terrible (doesn't workout enough, doesn't get enough sun exposure, which increases progesterone and benefits the mitochondria), and she is becoming hypothyroid which reduces all of the youth hormones such as progesterone, dhea and dhea-s, and pregnenolone. She is also probably consuming a lot of polyunsaturated fats (PUFA) which again leads to hypothyroidism, hormonal problems, and stress on the antioxidants system due to higher lipid peroxidation. Cook with coconut oil, olive oil, or butter and nothing else (coconut oil benefits the thyroid and has high antioxidant value so it's probably the best). Do not cook with veg oil. Eat a fair amount if carbs, if your wife is on a no carb fad that can be a reason for her deteoration. Make sure she doesn't under-eat either. Undereating is very common for older women as they try to keep their bodies but it just further worsens the problem. And have her get a good natural tan, sun exposure is very important for hormonal and mitochondrial health which prevents aging and improves body composition.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

This is why I don't want to get married for a longgggg time and want to marry a much younger girl.

[–]1scissor_me_timbers006 points7 points  (6 children) | Copy

I think the question here is how well you’re doing in your job/career? Because if you suck out there, then from her perspective she gave up her beauty and sexiness and therefore power and potential for a loser or semi loser who has now proven to only be able to provide a mediocre life.

She’s well aware of her destroyed body and knows that her options are basically over in life now. If you are sucking, that explains her shiftiness.

However, if you’re doing well out there and providing a decent living for your family, then she is just taking out her shitty feelings about herself on you. Fuck her if that’s the case.

I know that for a man to go out and make a good living for his family is difficult to do, and is majorly taken for granted by women. So I’m not saying your responsibility to be some daddy warbucks. But the street does go both ways. Women can have some serious expectations on their men if they’re going to destroy their bodies to bear their children. It’s not just us having expectations on them.

[–]John92494 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy

Damn I got lucky I guess. 3 kids including twins and my wife barely has stretch marks! Wieghs 95lbs breast are still perky but nips are a bit bigger. Has six pack, ab veins, and a great ass. 30 years old now barely works out and eats chocolate daily. She's just lucky. I on the other hand drive by McDonald's and gain 5lbs.

It all comes down to genetics and you can really never know (her mom was destroyed after kids) what they will look like after a few humans come out of them I guess.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Does your wife maintain a good diet and hygiene? Or do you think it’s all genetic, my girls mom was fine after the first 3-4 it wasn’t till kid 6-7 she got a lil “mom shaped”

But I worry my girls lack of a diet and exercise will cause her to be just like the dudes wife, my chicks tiny she’s skinny but not in good shape so I’m worried

[–]Foobyx1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Damn, thanks for your words man.

[–]Chris90151 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Talk to your wife and work things out!

[–]hihidolly1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

brutal. but damn... thanks for the honest post.

[–]EdmondDaunts1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I’ve been watching some videos about low carb and eating saturated fat. Low carb is good on your rest days and it’s a good change to try it. I’ve been doing it for a while now.

From the videos, the effect of women eating saturated fat is nuts. It actually restores lots of hormone imbalances and if done properly gets them to lose weight by having better satiety.

Get her lifting and eating right. You may see some changes. Why not?

[–]gixxerthouguy1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Bro check out Married Red Pill sub if you haven't already. I went there first, then here. Divorced twice, will never do it again.

[–]menial_optimist1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Lol my friends wife was the same way, but because of baby + junk food eating. I mean when they met she was healthy weight, cute little butt etc but let herself go once marriage happened (she pressured him for quite awhile) and gained and gained. The pregnancy only fattened her up even more. She must be 180-190 at 5"3. My buddy spent decades hating on fat chicks and how gross they are but now that his wife is one he still says in confidence he "finds her sexy naked" and that she turns him on. I think he's just trying to convince himself everythings a-ok and he's satisfied but he isn't.

[–]konfettiboy1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

So you stay with her for the kids? Don't you think your kids will notice that you hate your wife and yourself?

Being a divorced but happy dad sounds like a better alternative to me.

[–]ohyasurewhatever 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

If your wife read this what would happen?

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

She would freak the fuck out.

[–]NutmegPluto 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

Good goy, stop having children

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

A little too late now at this point. I already fucked up. Got three, her body's ruined, and even if we'd have a fourth it wouldn't get any better or worse I reckon.

[–]Endorsed ContributorSKRedPill1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Question : Did you even TRY to get her to start lifting and yoga? Hint : She's not going to do it on her own because she'll be enjoying the rush of worrying about the process, kids, diapers, laundry, shopping, bills, what she imagines you think about her, disgusted that she's no longer pretty, fear of losing everything, overwhelmed by the thought that it might take years of working out to get her body back, and worried that all this worrying is going to ruin her day (yes worried about being worried) -- and yet she would rather feel the rush of emotion than actually recognizing that she can do something about it and better should.

TL : DR - the everything box.

Dude, you need to bring in some more masculinity to put her back in order. Negative thinking and emotions are a poison that becomes addictive nevertheless. What you eat to gain muscles is only one part of diet, the mental diet is just as important.

And what about your own body? Did you take a look in the mirror? You might be getting fat, having a receding hairline, you might have forgotten the whole art of attraction (of how you started escalating from a date and led it up to sex, whereas after marriage it's probably just do it like masturbating before sleep). By the way, how much do you sleep? Sleep deprivation and low energy levels is usually a big factor in all this.

What about your mind? Most people think 20000 thoughts in a day, much of which is negative BS and the same as yesterday. By that I also mean emotion, because feelings are just juicier forms of the same force - your mind.

Most relationships improve only when the man improves himself first and then expects his wife to step up rather than just letting her seethe in her emotions and make a lot of noise, but nothing else.

When your wife is too busy swimming in her pain and worry instead of doing something about it, there's no more room for Mr. Nice Guy. You need to become the drill sergeant that takes her shit and makes her turn it into manure for a better garden. She'll work out if she realizes there's no other choice. She'll be forced to think positive for a change if you insist on a mental workout every morning. She'll give you an epic resentment shit test. She will, like a truant child, say that you're oppressive and what not. When her body and her mood get back into shape, she'll one day tell her kids how strong you are that you won't take any shit and you should be respected. Sorry, masculine love has never been Mr. Nice Guy. It's always Mr. Leader who knows what's good for you. You've got to ramp up the strictness and take no shit. You don't ask her for how she feels about it, you order her to do it. And if she's worried about something, you will tell her what you're gonna do about that, but she's working out now, no excuses.

Women...they're just like kids. Without a strong masculine, they'll just sink.

[–]JJ33141 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You’re making a decent case for (limited) polygamy in society. Not arab king style, where women are hoarded, but to help men who’s wives have hit the wall hard and early, but still want to maintain a home for the kids.

It sounds like elements to her personality don’t help—not that being a sweet, kind woman, suddenly makes a post-wall woman sexy, but a lousy attitude on a post-wall woman can make things worse.

Have sex with the lights off, so you don’t see her flaws so much. Don’t jerk off to porn—if you’re a bit more sex-starved by not getting release so regularly, marginally attractive women start to look better by the sheer power of male hormones.

Encourage her to lift, which can help work against gravity. This part is hard though, because she has to be motivated herself. You might have to bite the bullet and workout with her, and make it seem like a couples thing, as demoralizing as that sounds.

[–]TryDoingSomethingNew1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

> And fuck a pussy I am disgusted by for the rest of my earthly days while those of my bro's who were smart enough not to get locked down continue to fuck hot twenty-something pussy and discarding it when necessary.

Sorry, my friend. Thank you for sharing.

Just curious, how bad is her cooch after 2 kids? Stretched out and very loose? I don't have a frame of reference so I'd love to know.

Tough situation, man. I hope you can maybe get her some cosmetic surgery or something.

[–]adeptintact1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Divorce her. Life is too short to be miserable.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Should have stopped after the first kid. Why have bunch of kids in a first place? One is more than enough. Kids do not happen in accident either. There's contraception and other stuff for males to make them sterile.

You got into this situation yourself and everybody knows that women deteriorate after pregnancy much faster. It is public knowledge. Just like divorce rape. Nowadays all men are aware of it more or less just that many men seem to not give a fuck until they get burned.

Sure she can work out and have nicier body but did she? She didn't. Reap what you sow. Your tale isn't a warning but seems like a blog post of how you fucked up. Good luck.

[–]maeveko1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Post like this makes me want to go child free and WGTOW

[–]plascra1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You clearly do not understand sexual polarity.

Your wife mirrors you. Container and water.

[–]CulinaryKings1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Interesting read...

If you stay in something like that then you're choosing to be a cuck honestly.

Not cause she's not attractive enough. Not cause she's mean.

But because he doesn't seem to respect the person he is if he's staying in that relationship.

Yes society might judge you. Something might go wrong with a divorce. Same if you try and tell her you want something different from the relationship. But there's nothing worse that becoming someone you can no longer respect.

And so there's nothing more important in life than managing your own actions and the ones of those around you to ensure you don't become bitter and resentful towards the world.

He's not helping the kid either. The kid needs to see that his father respects himself and doesn't let agonizing resentment chip away at his soul until the day he dies.

The kid doesn't need to see two people who hate each other stay together. And neither does society.

Back in the days it would benefit to society, and yeah a stable family life is very fucking useful for a kid.

But this sounds nothing like stability or a loving home for the kids to grow up in.

If you want to be of value to the world; your workplace, your friends, your partner(s), society then you can't be encumbered by this kind of toxicity.

It doesn't matter the reason, it matters how you feel.

It doesn't matter the consequences, only that you act with dignity and respect towards yourself and others.

Break the fuck up with her if it's messing with your head that much. Or negotiate an open relationship.

Anything but becoming a bitter and resentful old man.

[–]MAGA_IowaPede1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

My wife is currently prego with out 2nd. Shit gets tough especially with her being moody and tired but that's what I signed up for. We were fighting a good deal a while ago so she pushed us to go to marriage counseling and it's really helped. The female therapist we have basically just listened and told us ways to fix shit day to day. Changed things 180 degrees and we've been doing great. Didn't take sides at all and just dealt with our points of conflict. Honestly 3 years ago I would call me a pussy for suggesting it but maybe invest a little time with a therapist. Couldn't hurt and could make things 100x better after a few sessions. I think the biggest benefit is my wife gets to feel like she's heard and the ratchets down the drama to try and get attention. Good luck

[–]cconcha1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Sad to hear my man. Do what truely makes you happy and talk to your wife because it seems their are a lot of underlying issues. Make the most while you're young fellas.

[–]Anonymous-O1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

When you say you still have sex regularly, is it you or her initiating it? I ask because I want to know if despite her shitty attitude she still desires you.

[–]brethrenelementary2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

Have you thought about divorcing her? It's not too late. You sound miserable and even though you'll lose a lot of money, it might be worth it for the freedom and happiness. I don't think things will get any better with your wife.

[–]Constrictorboa3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

She's likely a harpy because she feels the same way about her body that you do. No woman wants to look in the mirror and see a crone. She's mean to you because she knows how you feel about her body.

[–]Shaman66244 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Huh but why did her behaviour also become bad? She should do anything for you cause the SMV gap has increased so much and you're on top..

[–]RedditForFreeSpeech1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

Only marry a woman of similar ethnic and cultural background. Make sure she’s under 25 and her parents are still married and her dad provided decent leadership for the family. Never marry a single mother. Make sure she’s healthy and can have children. See how her mother looks because that will be a sign of how she’s going to age. Marriage is first and foremost for having children and keeping a woman from becoming a childless feminist like Angela Merkel.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I married a woman of a similar ethnic background - we are both mixed race and from similar backgrounds. Mother-in-law looks remarkably good for her age, but as I said before, that tells you absolutely NOTHING because a lot of women look good on the surface, and look horrible once naked. My wife still looks good when you run into her on the street. But her breasts are something out of a weird online fetish video.

[–]voomer532 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's up to her to stay attractive. That's her end of the deal. You've got to keep paying, she needs to stay attractive.. to keep you satisfied and motivated. Contract broken. No entitled female free lunches allowed.

[–]Karlore4730 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

stretch marks fade retard. and she was never hot if shes ugly at 30. but i guess strange things can happen to a woman in your head

[–]1319Skew3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

The state of mind bothers me. A woman that has given up on her looks knows that her man isn't going anywhere and her being a bitch to you is just reinforcing that statement.

Apply dread and start to flirt, tease other women. Be prepared to walk away from it all though and once gone, you'll be shunned but at least you'll be free.

However, if she notices that you're the masculine red pilled guy, you'll see that she'll come around and start to take care of herself. Don't negotiate attraction and never tell her what you want her to do but make it apparent that you still have options.

But know this, if/when she decides to test your mantle and you fail, you'll lose that chance and the balls on her court for taking the kids and half your shit. So weight that choice heavily when making your play and make no mistake it's up to you to take ownership and act on this debacle you're in.

Best of luck.

[–]JazzonBH4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

This may be an unpopular opinion (hell, I don't even know if I fully stand behind it), but the way that woman age way worse than men seems to actually justify why the divorce system works so heavily in their favor (with them keeping the kids and the money and all).

It's almost like it's expected of a man to go seek out a more suitable partner for himself once his first wife starts getting saggy, while he remains fit.

Even as red pilled, it's important to see both sides of a story.

[–]SasquatchMcKraken2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

As bad as this is, if and when she starts getting physically desirable again you can guarantee she's got someone in the wings. Don't just assume it's Christmas in July and she's finally come around to you. In fact I'd craft a divorce plan right now with the primary trigger in mind being infidelity.

[–]SwagnumMagnum2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy

Just cheat and keep in on the DL.

[–]MRAGGGAN1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

He already did. And he knocked someone else up too.

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

I'm... sorta at that point right now. I feel less guilty about considering it with each passing day, as I sit here working my ass off for someone ungrateful an pissing away what should be my golden years. Why not have my cake and eat it too? Kinda scared too, tho. Won't deny.

[–]htowntrav[🍰] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Is that worth the consequences. The possible subsequent divorce/child support/alimony. Get some input from the senior contributors of this sub. Go through the side bar or look into the other RP subs. Nothing is worth your peace of mind and happiness though.

[–]SwagnumMagnum3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Exactly. Don't let her control your happiness. Or your sex drive. Spin a few plates.

[–]Nashboy451 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Would you consider cheating less if she was grateful and loving like before? I know she isn’t nearly as attractive but I wonder if the real problem here is that she is being a harpy on top of the attraction problem.

I’m also trying to figure out if we, specifically on this issue, are thinking too Machiavellian. How would you rate the SMV of your wife now to you when you were younger? It’s kind of hard to figure out what’s fair in this for that reason specifically. You have SMV for different reasons that you did before, if you did have a lot. On top of that she put all her “Golden Years” into you and working with you to this point. If you use yours to cheat how different are you and really anyone on this sub from the women we see doing the alpha fucks beta bucks thing? Trading in your worn down woman after she invested time and commitment into you for the hotter better thing. Maybe we are far more similar to women in that domain, just that we peak in SMV at different times.

I don’t think you would be getting nothing from your golden years buy not fucking other girls. It would probably be the same things she got while she was with you. Attention from women would be a nice bonus to your day to day. Being able to talk women into getting what you want easier maybe. All the little perks that women used to have when they were young, might be more available to you. You’re wife didn’t use them to fuck people she could have been fucking, or getting the guys she could have gotten.

So if we look at it from that perspective for you I think you might be fine having a “beta wife” but bc she isn’t the sexy slender girl she used to be, you want her to make it worth your while at least in “female beta ways” like gratefulness and love and appreciation. If a guy was a complaining sack AND a beta a woman would ditch him or feel no remorse about cheating. Some still cheat with an Alpha guy anyway. And I wouldn’t judge if you decided to do the same. It is just nature at the end of the day. But some stick it out. Now I don’t know if you guys got together while you were low SMV or if you were always high but I think you and most men would probably feel the same desire to cheat or end the relationship with a woman that’s not the best you can get if she was being a bitch too (no disrespect to your wife btw).

If she was at least loving while you stuck around maybe it would be better. You got her golden years and got the kids that pushed this decline for her. I would at the very least, before going to cheating, see if you could better enforce and maintain respect and appreciation in some way. Maybe, like a lot of beta guys, she’s trying to manage an insecurity and it is coming out in shitty unattractive behavior (I think the unattractive beta behavior for a man would probably be different from unattractive behavior for a woman) which as to her disgust for you which makes her more insecure and so on. I’m not quite sure how to break such a cycle, given that the “Im leaving” card is a bit of a nuke for the both of you. But maybe some people on this sub can better explain what to do than I can in how to provoke someone to change for the better in their personality and physicality. I don’t quite know the answer but my guess would honestly be telling her or maybe that she needs a greater purpose than her family. Like something that gives her life more meaning.

[–]whitesocks20004 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Mommy make over 12 k maybe less, and everything looks good as new maybe better, and you should get a vasectomy. Poor person problem, if anything you young bloods should learn to either earn enough to get married and have kids the proper way. Or be evolutionarily erased and let the alphas breed.

[–]victor_knight1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Now for the rest of my life, provided we do not divorce or whatever (which, in some ways, would even feel like a release)

Divorced guy here (two boys). Yes, it's an unbelievable release. There's no going back, seriously. Marriage is off the table (for life). Even under the "best" circumstances with the "perfect" woman. Off the table. Amen.

[–]Kizzou1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy

Can you get her to start taking care of her body/health? A women can do this even after a few kids. Sounds like an excuse to me

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy

OP, I understand where you're coming from, although I question your concern about the sex life. I know its probably frowned upon to say, but have you considered using an escort for her time every now and then to get your needs met?

Also, consider being the one to organise the counselling sessions, message (so you have it in writing) in a nice amicable way that you'd like to arrange for 3 counselling sessions. Say we'll do one session as a trial, and decide if we want to do 2 more. Ask her if she's OK with this?

The sessions will either help or not do much... but even if they don't help you will have in writing... written proof that you were proactively looking to help the marriage right up to the end... which will be useful for anything to do with the divorce.

But yea, its often frowned upon, but if you need some tight pussy for an hour, just pay for it, while you try to sort out your marriage... it will help keep you level.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

In the same boat. Enjoy your freedom my dudes.

[–]iamnotfromtexas90 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy

Jesus, this red pill has to be one of the harshest yet.


I'm still choking...

[–]MasculineHapa[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

NOW I get why they go to such length, even to get SURGERY, just 'to look better' after 25+. They know the truth.

They do. They're aware. And those few that aren't aware, when they lash out in anger once the realization hits them, damn. Those are the worst. Surgery to me is disgusting fake tits turn me off to no end.

[–]AmeljoO_O1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

She may just need a boob lift not actually implants ..Also i look after my body/boobs as i do my face . Moisturize/serums etc I love my titts .. so does my SO And i have 3 children ..

[–]AmeljoO_O1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Also ..Lingerie..so she isn't completely naked ..There's hot stuff out there that no doubt will completely turn u on and the not so good bits are covered or enhanced ..she'll feel sexier which will turn u both on more

[–]3chazthundergut1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Dude go get some side pussy. It is probably the best thing you can do for your marriage at this point.

And start saving up so your wife can get some minor work done. Youd be surprised how nice some of these fake boobs are now.

[–]Ereuel 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

So attraction and love is purely physical to you? Really? This woman carries and feeds your children and all you care about is how hot she looks. Well, divorce her so she won't have to be with the immature idiot you are.

[–]Senior Contributoradam-l0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

faithful to a fault, dutiful

That's probably your worst mistake. It's not that you are faithful in practice, but that you are faithful in your mind. That way she becomes your only emotional outlet. And that's a suffocating feeling for a woman.

It doesn't matter how hot you become. She will always detest the feeling that she has to be your emotional anchor - and be a harpy in order to relieve herself of it.

Open up to the possibility of meeting your emotional (and sexual) needs elsewhere. Don't outright cheat, if you don't feel like it (do if you do), but at any rate start light flirting with other women. See how this goes with you.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Who says you have to be single? You can have a fulfilling relationship, just not be married?

[–]whoareyou310 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Man I have such marriage phobia now thanks to this sub and others. I was gonna get married in the next 2 years but now idk wtf to do. Yeah yeah i know what yall gonna say: dont get married. Probably wont now.

[–]shadowq80 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I thought you get married to raise a good family.

[–]SigmaBusiness0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Why did you not work on yourself in 20s and grind?

Why did you have kids in 20s? Don't get me wrong, kids can give you a lot of happiness, but it also comes with a lot of responsiblity.
The best investment is always investing on yourself.

The life expectancy is increasing every year and who knows, we will probably live almost till 100.

Life is a marathon and the you are only in the first quarter.

I am 25, but I am not having any kids until 40 when I am fully financially stable and in the highest SMV as possible. Marriage is out of the door anyways, kids are questionable.

[–]MakeMenGreatAgain440 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Bro thanks for the very fucking useful insight into marriage. This is unfortunately a reality. One thing I want to mention is that women nag you and are mean to you when they are insecure. If she's getting fat and realises she has very few options but you and she's not getting much attention from men then she will be mean to you. That's why older women are generally very bitter and nasty. Also she's afraid you will leave her so all this toxicity is meant to make you beta. The more shit you feel the more emotional and the less clearly you think. It actually decreases your testosterone.

So maybe you can withstand this. Maybe for the sake if the kids. Maybe you feel like you have had enough. Why not separate with her and wait for her to file for divorce. You'll be legally married but you live freely as you want.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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