I don't generally post here but I saw a comment from a female user on another site and it was so perfect that I had to share it. To set the scene: a girl made a post complaining that one of her male friends was simply using his fat girlfriend for sex; waiting around until he found someone better. In response to this, one of the top female users on the site gave the following response:
This doesn't seem real.
When women see a guy with an obese girlfriend, that guy basically becomes a non-entity to them -- even if he's hot.
like, basically he has just disqualified himself for every woman who's seen him with that girlfriend (and all those women's friends, too).
Harsh reality, but, reality nonetheless. Women don't want themselves basically put in the same league as the girlfriend.
So... on the off-chance that this is actually real... this guy is totally fucking up his own plan. lol.
I feel like I should say something more but I honestly have nothing to add. She summed it up so perfectly.
EDIT: Some of you guys are getting pissed off and saying that the post is wrong because you shouldn't give a shit about what anyone else thinks. The latter is absolutely correct. If you happen to find a decent woman (overweight or otherwise) who you care about and want to be with, then you should be with her regardless of what anyone else thinks.
However, this particular story specifically pertains to being with an overweight woman in a temporary fashion (e.g. FWB). The point being: if you care about her then you should be with her, but if this is a temporary thing and you're planning to move on at some point, then you should be aware that it will possibly lower your SMV.
This is competition anxiety in action.
If you have a hot girl on your arm then other women perceive you as a catch and high SMV.
And the main reason for slut shaming. Think of women like massage parlors. If they want to get business from males and social status and a good rapport they have to give a good service for a good price. How mad would you be if a dirt cheap parlor opened up across the street that gave the exact same experience without having to set up a fucking direct debit, fees and insurances.
It's also the reason prostitution would never get legalized. Your average 20 something who was born with big tits wouldn't earn shit in this life.
Fucked a girl off tinder the other night. She's 31, good body, but has all the hallmarks of a serial CC rider and so anal, swallowing, rough sex on the first date. In between rounds we get to talking about porn and she says she's a regular consumer but is against "all that teen stuff" which makes her uncomfortable. Yeah, letting a strange man plow your ass and choke you and call you a whore doesn't make you uncomfortable, but that teen porn...
Amused mastery, disregard, and keep smashin'. You keep telling yourself that hun.
Given the deceptive nature of women, what are the odds she was hinting it's something she's actually into, but doesn't want to be judged for it?
Luvbeer how strong is your game generally, and how strong is your tinder game? Are you over/under 30yo?
Pushing 40. Street game is ok, tinder game is on fleek lol.
Oh crap, are you in the phx area? We could be sharing the same girl.
You are underestimating the number of women this can and does apply to.
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I don't understand what this means? How can legalized prostitution NOT change a thing??
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I am from an Asian country where prostitution is legal. Why it does not make much of a difference:
Wow thanks for that, I guess changing the legality ONLY changes whether or not you can get arrested -- the other negative baggage still remains!
I think prostitution has always been legal in NZ, before that prostitutes weren't allowed to solicit clients.
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Australia has some if the hottest bitches around? LOL
The sun in Australia fries their skin and ages them 3x faster than the west
I'm actually not sure if Australian women edge out other western women for being the worst in the world.
White people just aren't adapted to live in that part of the world... Australia has 3 times the rate of skin cancer vs the US and Candada, largely due to Australia having a mostly white population that's getting some of the world's highest amounts of UV Radiation. Say hello to 30 year old women having the skin of a 50 year old. They're not quite as fat as American women, but still suffer from a very high rate of obesity. So they're not lookers, by any means, on average they're fat with bad skin... and Australia is one of the top 3 most feminist countries in the world. The only place I can think of that's as bad, is Sweden... They're easily worse than Canada or the United States in that regard, which is really saying something, considering the US is likely to elect HRC as president after the DNC just violated their own charter to fix things in her favor.
Do people get in trouble with law enforcement for anti-feminist tweets in Australia as easily as in Cuckanada?
What are you talking about? At least they're pretty against migrants moving in.
that's a shame really. I'd like to see how the world would turn out ( go to feminist hell) and see what happens
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It blew my mind how different things were when I dated an extremely attractive girl.
All people treated me differently, guys and girls, and all treated me better. But I actually found a lot of girls just backing off. Like girls that were trying to get with me before actually just kind of disappeared when I started dating the hotter girl. Maybe they knew they couldn't compete and felt shitty about it and tried to just avoid the situation?
But then girls that never looked at me before looked at me differently and I got more attention from hotter girls.
Happens to me a lot too. Used to never be an issue. Now, when females I work with see me hitting it off with a fox, they seem to back down. Feels like an ego boost because at that point theyre observing how much confidence comes out of a largely quiet guy. It flips their misconceptions. there're times it can be jarring though.
Please elaborate on the jarring effect
I guess by jarring, you mean the women get silent but with a confused mood?
Jarring because it's often a chick I'm most into that backs out. someone who exhibits the traits of a woman I'm most interested in other than looks. they fizzle out so easy when they see I can pull a 10. I don't know what it is, but it's seemingly easier with hotter girls...they give and take in a conversation and their confidence doesn't just suddenly wane when competition shows up or when the ball isn't in their court. You can stay in a groove. And that's really important.
I laugh pretty hard when women say men don't like confident women, I'm definitely one who does. Women who say that are often confusing confident with snippy and judgmental
The trophy wife doesn't exist for nothing..
it blew my mind how often women look at women and not men. i thought because women like men they would look at them but noo...
Can someone seriously explain how much the Halo-effect dictates social/romantic success?
Women are social creatures.
So, as women go; so does society.
sigh
And as fathers go, so too do women.
Growing up, the first time I ever got attention was from a 5 and a 6 who both "randomly" got super interested in me.
In retrospect it was because I was hanging out and having fun with my oneitis 9 who I never got with. But I would still make her laugh, she was comfortable around me...etc.
The 5 was the queen bee of her little club, and expressed to them all how hot I was. Even though I didn't know them at all. The 6 who looks up to the queen bee recognized that I had a lot of value.
I've just seen shit like that happen too much. And likewise, if I were hanging out with an obese 3/10 or 2/10, the other girls would have never sparked interest in me.
If you can't see it, you're probably not looking.
What if you think fat girls are hot and you couldn't give a shit about what those ugly under fed, skinnies think about you?
you probably have a mental disorder. that'd be what then.
If you think fat girls are hot, you are probably getting laid more than most of us.
Then you have missed the point of Redpill and if you think that then Bluepill has moulders you to believe this
Upvoted you not because I'm pro-fatty, but fuck what other people think if it really makes you genuinely happy. Some guys out there just plain love bigger girls. There is not a fucking thing wrong with that. Don't be meek or apologetic about it if that's what really floats your boat.
Going after skinny women because you care what your buddies or the world at large might think, is the very definition of insecurity and certainly not RP. That's some of the most bullshit backwards thinking and I'm saddened that some of the guys here on this sub and the comments below fail to realize. I used to work with a guy that would point out big girls that most guys wouldn't be caught dead being seen with, and say things like 'thats a real woman right there' as if he were looking at Jessica Alba. We'd just laugh and shake our heads but that's what he was into.
To the topic at hand - yes, you are judged by men and other women on your choice of mate and her SMV. Sad but true. I've actually had a 8+ female acquaintance one time chastise me about a hookup with a ~6.5 from months earlier... skinny girl, nice body, but not one of the 'pretty' girls or the type who cares about getting dolled up and all that shit. The type most guys could be friends with. Also an almost zero effort and fantastic notch.
It was definitely only casual, it's not like I dated her, but her words to me were, "I heard about you and (girl'sname)... you know, you can do way better."
The subtext I picked up on was that 8+ girl would have probably been(or still is, to some extent) interested in me but that my standing in her eyes was diminished by her knowing that I was 'slumming it' with a lesser girl.
Right. It's all about perception...
I was working in an office and was a fairly popular guy. Then a "plump" girl I was FB's with started telling everyone. I could feel the change in status.
The strange thing is, I think she did that on purpose. Like she knew, just telling other women about us would give me less options and eventually leave me with no options.
She staked her claim. Of course she did this on purpose.
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Not subconscious. Self-conscious. She was aware of her status and that made her aware how far out of her zone she may have been playing. She just tried to even the competition. If the two of them had a FB agreement then she's banking on OP being weak enough to just go with her changing their relationship status without his consent. She's basically forcing him into it via social blackmail.
I'd say dump her ass in public and roll with the consequences.
Overt dumping may make women feel vicarious fear that he will shame them ib public. He needs to fade his attention and then she will act needy to him and all the women will be able to tell he is the high value one.
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why did you say that iq stuff?
Because he has a small penis.
some guys are tall, high iq, and are well endowed.
https://youtu.be/UXvnS0xXx9M?t=158
(but if it makes ya feel better my hair's thinning and I always skip leg-day, but leave my johnson alone!)
I was trying to add emphasis to the conclusion I reached because I was too drunk to provide a reasoned explanation to why I disagreed with a popular opinion here on trp. I still find it absurd that people don't realize the root cause of women's awalt-behavior. :-/
This has to be a troll. Nobody actually talks like this guy, right?
sorry was drunk last night, but it's true that I think a slim majority of TRP misunderstands the fact women don't consciously plan behavior which puts them in AWALT category. The reason it's awalt is because we're observing an ingrained behavior.
I'm saying I don't think that distinction matters. The response should be the same, right?
It's funny because this deliberate maneuver requires conscious acknowledgement that she's of lower tier SMV.
Easy, throw in one of the"this one time, he forced himself on me" in passing
Maybe it was because people assumed you were a couple? I wouldn't make a move on a guy whom I knew was sleeping with another girl; I'd assume he already had a girlfriend and was off-limits.
In my experience, when women find out you have a girlfriend, they try even harder to win you over. Having a girlfriend, especially a hot girlfriend, means you have a high SMV, and are worthy of being pursued.
Geez, you guys make me feel old! In my day, it was considered bad form to poach on some other woman's preserve. :-(
I don't know what your day was.
I am 45 and have seen this my whole life from about 14 (1985). If I am with someone, I suddenly have other girls who start floating around, start flirting more, start wanting to go to the pool more, start noticing I might need a shoulder rub.
Heck when I got married, I hate jewelry, so I never wore a ring. my wife had a fit. I told her that the ring is a double edge sword of the same nature. about HALF the girls are going to just back off out of respect. the other half, that ring is like a triple dog dare and heroin combined. I ended up getting a tattoo on my finger as a ring, and it has still rung true that some women approach you because that ring.
Some say it is the challenge. some say it is so they can get the milk after someone else has paid for it and they know the cow is never going to talk. Some say it is because the ring is made of gold and is shiny and as such, women are unable to string rational thoughts together.
somewhere in there is the truth. but unfortunately regardless of the reason, it is the reality.
that being said, go to places that cater to ho's needs ..... and you will see ho's there. and by that I mean the frequency of this ho behavior is directly proportional to my location to a ho watering hole.
That may be the difference ... even when I was younger, I never hung out in bars very much; hell I probably haven't been in one in 25 years! So I have no idea how bar girls act, lol.
Bullshit. Women have always been attracted to taken men. Number of studies have shown this.
There is a difference between finding someone attractive and acting on it! I've never messed around with a married man (at least knowingly, lol) and I can't recall any of my friends ever doing anything like that either. It's just a seriously uncool thing to do!
My current boyfriend was actually in a LTR when we met IRL (we had known each other online for years; we both participated in a chat forum based on a mutual interest). Was I attracted to him? YOU BET! I wanted him bad, lol. But I never let on, because as far as I was concerned, he was taken, and I was involved with someone else too. (Eventually both of our relationships ended for other reasons and we wound up together.) But I would have never made a move on him while he had a girlfriend, even if I had been single. There are some things you just don't do!
I don't think the math was the way it is now back in your day.
Nowadays, women outnumber men something like 1.5 to 1 in America. Now take out all the men who are unemployed, drug addicts, in prison, deadbeats, etc, and that number is cut down to roughly 3 women to every 1 eligible male.
And I guarantee you 1 of those 3 women is a whore who will do whatever she has to in order to beat out the other 2.
Hmm, I don't think so. Census Bureau says as of 2014 there were 162 million women and 157 million men in the U.S. That's a gap of only 5 million, and I'd guess there are plenty of undesirable women, just as there are undesirable men.
Interestingly, once you hit age 85, there really ARE two girls for every guy! But I doubt too many people are gettin' down at that age, lol.
Given that I've heard that STD rates are rising in retirement and nursing homes, it is apparent the elderly are gettin' down at that age.
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Yep.
Beyond not wanting to be in the same league, they assume something is "wrong with this guy" if that is the best he can do.
Starts them wondering what kind of huge problems this guy has that made him settle for a fatty
Reminds me of the scene in Moneyball where the scouts are all talking and one of them says no to a prospect because he has an ugly girlfriend. Other scouts ask what that has to do with anything and he says it means he lacks confidence.
As a huge moneyball fan, i never connected this to TRP. My minds blown right now. Great shit
As a Sales Manager, this is an easy way to identify a good salesman. Put me in a room with 20 sales guys to interview in 5 minutes, and I can do it with only two criteria:
- how long were you at each of your last two jobs
- show me a picture of your wife or girlfriend
The differential between how attractive the sales guy is, and how attractive his wife/gf is, tells me a lot about how good he is.
Is length of job a positive or a negative?
I like to see two years at each of the previous two jobs. Someone who leaves jobs quickly will leave me just as quickly. Obviously, there are exceptions (I've had some myself), but in general I'd rather invest time in training someone that will be around long enough for the investment to pay off.
Same thing applies to girlfriends. If you are looking for an LTR, and you're going out with a girl who's had four boyfriends in the last year, she's already told you what she is going to do... invest accordingly.
how about a dude who's ugly and fat with an attractive girl?
Probably one hell of a salesman.
Have you heard Penn State football coach James Franklin talk about hiring assistant coaches? He got in some hot water a few years ago at Vanderbilt because he said he could tell how good of a recruiter a coach is just by looking at their wife or girlfriend. If she's hot, it means he's a helluva salesman, and worthy of hiring.
The feminists freaked out over this comment, of course.
no just rich or a drug dealer
As a regional manager, I would never gauge ones negotiating ability based on a picture of their girlfriend, because attraction cannot be negotiated. Furthermore, looking at a picture will never provide you with the insight of why the person is currently with that person. Your whole theory is based on an ignorant assumption. Have you ever considered that a person may choose a less physically attractive person because they are overall better than a person who is just physically attractive but perhaps also has many other negative qualities? Moreover, perhaps the good salesman just doesn't give a shit about changing an attractive womans naturally shitty personality.
My perspective is just based on 20+ years in sales and sales management, but you may have a different perspective. If your perspective is that attractive women have shitty personalities, you're hanging out with the wrong women.
An interesting twist on this:
Our salesman is an ugly mofo, and even his 6'4" height (or something like that) can't cover up the fact that he's skinny, has bad posture and is, well, an ugly mofo (balding, wears glasses, big nose etc.).
His wife is average looking - she possibly was reasonably good-looking when she was around 20, but currently I would place her as average-looking for her age (45ish). Also, she's almost a decade older than him and snagged him when he was in his early 20s (and she in her late 20s accordingly). What does this tell you?
Tough one. Doesn't fall in the standard formula so I would be guessing. Sounds like he's probably punching up, but hard to tell, especially 15 years later. Generally, a guy going for an older woman has confidence issues, as with the Moneyball example.
Well the saying goes every hot chick out there, there is somebody who's tired of their bullshit.
Yeah, I've heard the saying but I don't know.
Struck me as sour grapes
Hot chicks have super easy lives, everyone is so nice to them, it tends to make them pleasant people.
The nastiest ones are the 0/10 SJW fat pigs, they are so bitter and just toxic people
Of course someone will respond with 'Nuh uh there was this really hot girl that was a bitch' or 'I know a fat girl that is nice' but I'm talking generalties here.
You are right. The bitchiest girls to me are always the least attractive.
I actually did a 200 person tally on this a few years back. Attractive women--by large margin--responded best to (confident) greetings/niceties etc than other ones. Many of them have enough social grace to know to either accept the gesture and move on. Or, if you give off enough smv, they'll carry on with you.
An truly attractive woman, a 9/10, knows how to simply dodge a lame person instead of use all that energy being angry towards them...like a 6 or 7. We all know bad 7s are. They're like Jack Russells
Hmmm...I reckon that the ones in the middle express the bitterness most. The true bottom of barrel women generally have shit self esteem and are very withdrawn and quiet. The hotties don't have as many reasons to be bitter, at least till their looks fade.
Regarding Women like these: They don't just eventually hit the wall, the wall hits them
True bottom of barrel women or men don't engage people sexually period, so they are pretty much out of this discussion.
Until they get older and stop being hot chicks, then suddenly everyone stops treating them like royalty...
Then you see the one who actually invest in themselves have their graceful sunsets, and the basic bitches rained down like meteor shower.
Yeah and then they write their column about "Where have all the good men gone?"...
"Hot chicks have super easy lives, everyone is so nice to them, it tends to make them pleasant people."
So true, they literally live in a different world when you think about it.
They are nasty to the ugly guys and the nerds, because they don't to waste their time with them though. Thats where the stigma comes from, nerds bitching.
Well...
The worst thing you can do to a woman is to see her as an ungly man without dick.
Seriously, that will expalin 90% of SJW who end up doing the "If you can't join them, beat them"
However, reality is harsh for fat men without dicks, especially when they stay in denial and refuse to improve themselves. Rekt feminist videos on Youtube pretty much sum up the result.
That's why you leave the hot chick, then go find another hot chick. You never downgrade.
No matter how hot she is, some guy somewhere is already tired of putting up with her shit.
Thanks, man. You just explained the experience I had with my date last night.
If a man cannot respect himself, who will?
Fuck it with this shit. This is like cars in the BP world. You become slaves to others. I do not give a flying fuck if the super-bitchy cunts HB 8-10 think less of me as a result, if I get a boner for a 5 heck I go for it.
Conversely, when I see a potentially high smv dude hanging around with mid to low hb's, I assume there's something wrong with him (low confidence, beta, etc)
Or he could just be not into an effort-night today, or an effort-relationship.
I mean, if i was financially monking, i wouldn't try it with the vicious hb8, i'd rather try my luck with the disposable hb4.
Re-posting and editing my comment below to the main branch for visibility since the comment to which I replied is being downvoted.
I'd be keen to have more people here sharing what they think of OP's post bolstered with their own experience of dating objectively ugly girls.
Because what I see in OP's post for now is a woman saying something about relationships dynamics, and instead of replying the now-classic "don't believe what she says, watch what she does", everyone here is just agreeing with her because it somehow fits their pre-existing beliefs.
Personally, I don't think I've read anything in red pill theory on the topic of what women think of a man with an ugly girlfriend (and for good cause, since that's a case we don't really promote).
If you have relevant anecdotes, please share them. If you have thoughts on how this confirm/contradict red pill theory, please develop them.
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I was trying to be neutral in my post because I have thoughts both for and against so I'm looking for evidence to decide which way to go.
I understand you thinking it is "reasonable to think", but my Blue Pill past was full of such assumptions that I now realize were false. So now, I base my thinking of whether it fits red pill theory or not.
Red pill theory says "pre-selection" is very attractive. If you have women after you, other women will want you. Now the theory never said anything about the hotness of said girls. It is "reasonable to think" that the hotter the girls, the better the impression but perhaps that assumption is just me projecting my male prejudice of esteeming more a man with a hot girl? But hey let's accept that assumption. Now, it does not automatically follow that if she is ugly, the impression becomes so bad that it automatically negates the pre-selection switch in women.
Hence why I'm reading with great interest the experience that people here are sharing. I want proof.
Oh and your bit about an unattractive man with a beautiful woman, I understand (and react the same) but doesn't apply here. Sexual dynamics are not symmetrical across sexes.
I would argue that the quality factors into this. "Winning" against a fugly isn't very rewarding, it's like winning at the paralympics. Winning against a woman who isn't supposed to be totally desperate on the other hand (i.e. any at least average woman) should at least be moderately impressive.
Several weeks late but whatever. My personal experience says pre selection work as long as the girl used for pre selection is in range of negative 2 of said girl. Pre red pill I was with a girl hb7 who would always ask or joke around me always hanging with this chick I used to smoke with a lot. She was hb5 at best. I never understood why she did but now I do. In this context, it was dread. But pre selection would mean the same
good comments always appreciated
JEALOUSY AND CONTEMPT.
When a beautiful woman sees an obese girl with an attractive guy, it's all jealousy, especially if she's single or her guy is less attractive.
From my personal experience and observation, if a handsome/rich guy is with an obese girl, the beautiful girls will try their best to catch the attention of the guy and will always treat the obese girl with contempt, especially if they are in the same social circle.
They reason, ''if this obese girl can score such a hot guy, I can get him as well''
''my boyfriend is less handsome than that of an obese girl, no way! I deserve better.''
Some of them will try to sleep with the hot guy, just to boost their ego that they are hotter than his obese girlfriend.
Remember, in a social circle, women are always comparing among themselves. They higher the value of their SO, the higher their rank in the group.
Thanks for sharing. So instead of judging the man as lower value for being with an ugly girl, the girls would judge themselves of being more worthy of him than the ugly girl. That does fit the red pill idea of constant sexual competition and women's solipsism.
My cousin's wife had that kind of reaction to my new car. She felt jealousy and contempt at me (college prof) for having a nicer car than my cousin, albeit him being more successful financially (financial advisor). To paraphrase your take on it:
OK, I'll bite. My main GF for many years was very smart with a pretty face, but she was big, especially next to my tall thin ectomorph frame. Family and friends recognized she was a good person and liked her, and us as a couple. Acquaintances (like staff at our regular restaurants) liked us provided they were not "thirsty."
I remember one better looking but catty and nasty-attitude waitress who was obviously jealous. She'd pointedly ignore our table completely, yet be seen scowling at us between potted plants and stacked dishes. One time I went there with a different woman and sat in a different section. She spotted me from across the restaurant and went way out of her section to fuss with the condiments on someone else's empty table nearby, then one by one the staff from that section of the restaurant came to fuss with the same empty table.
Another time we were strolling through a park holding her hand one sunny summer day. A group of really hot cheerleader types passed the other way, and their Mean Girls leader made a scoffing noise. I spoke up, "She has something you may never have." She took the bait and said, "What?" in a snotty voice. I intoned quietly, "The certainty that she's loved for who she is on the inside." and kept strolling. The leader made some nasty snarl in response, but the looks on all of the other faces were an interesting register of surprise at the unexpected turnabout.
If you have an IDGAF attitude and happy relationship, it doesn't seem to harm average people's opinion of you. It really DOES freak out insecure women, and depending on your mood and inclination at the moment, you can use this to play them like a cat toy, tweaking their insecurity or demonstrating the existence of values in the world besides them and their narcissism.
Secure or noncompetitive women OTOH tend to see it as benevolently fulfilling their tropes of choice, usually improving their opinion of me and us as a couple.
Once i was dating the hottest girl I'd ever seen. We were on the verge of breaking up, so i hit up tinder and posted a picture with me and my gf to go out with a bang. Worked like s charm. One girl even asked if we were down for a threesome. Can't imagine the same results with an ugly gf.
Again, I don't doubt a second that having a hot girl boosts your status. What I want to know is if having an ugly girl tanks your status. The former does not imply the later. I am calling for proof in the form of personal anecdotes. Not "I imagine..", not "It's reasonable to think..". Is my point so hard to understand?
Calm down tiger. I think cases of the opposite lend some evidence.
The reason why I think dating an ugly girl does not tank your SMV is because that's still better than dating no girl at all. Pre-selection is the #1 attraction switch. A woman sees a man without a girl and thinks:
But when she sees a man with a girl, she thinks:
Now if the girl is ugly, maybe the woman think "he must be desperate", or "he has such low status that the only woman willing to suck his dick is an ugly girl".
Or maybe she doesn't think that. Maybe she thinks:
That's right. Maybe she doesn't even care a second about the guy's status at all. Maybe on the contrary she'll actively try to get with that guy, just to prove herself she's better than the uggo.
But I am not entirely sure of my analysis. Because although it fits red pill theory, I need evidence. And from those who provided anecdotes of going out with ugly girls, I think it's still 50/50.
But you know what? I don't really care about the truth. I don't intend to date an ugly girl so I couldn't care less where the truth lies.
Why I insist on this is that I have an issue with the lack of logic that people display here. OP's post is just about what a girl said and it got upvoted to near 600 points. I repeat: it's a girl saying something about relationships. And people are like "yep. Straight out of the horse's mouth..". Why? Because it fits what they think happen, NOT because it fits red pill theory. Just their "common sense" talking. Just like when they were bluepills commenting on the relationships subreddit "Yep. Couple therapy is the solution to every relationship issue..". Common sense.
What differentiate us from others is that we don't rely on "common sense" anymore. We rely on red pill theory. I like this and that's why I am here. We claim that men are the "rational" ones, basing our analysis on "logic". We have great theoretical framework and amazing data to support it. It's like the science of relationships. And then sometimes, "common sense" creeps back in and get massively upvoted and I tell myself "If it's not evidence-based, how can I really know that it's not unverified dogma, just like the blue pill lies". Hence why I'm passionate about this and just wrote an entire essay on it. Red pill is evidence-based and I'll fight to keep it that way.
So apparently I dated an ugly girl. I always thought she was cute, I was super attracted to her, she had a very nice body.
I only really realized that she was ugly because of a few snide comments on my skype, which had a photo of her and I kissing (I play 07scape and add people from the game regularly).
No one ever said anything about her being ugly to my face IRL, (Wisely....) rather, some of the people I added would make comments like 'Ur gf looks like my butt m8' 'I thought you were kissing a man and I was like nah homie' 'You're so good looking why are you dating her date me instead' (From a man, lol).
I am a very attractive man (sorry for brag but it's relevant) and I would often get bad treatment from servers and waitstaff when I was with her, and she would get rude service from them too.
At the time, I thought to myself 'They're just jealous she has such a handsome boyfriend'.
In retrospect, I think they were bitter that a girl that a girl they thought was unattractive was with a man that they wish they could be with, that she had gamed the system, etc.
I was wondering for a while why women had gotten so nasty to me since I was with her, when I was with her.
EDIT: Just remembered the worst incident of all.
I was at a liquor store and they had a sale on my favorite beer, and I was in NH where alcohol is really cheap.
I had this girl with me, my ex, and I stroll up the counter, and I'm told that 'Every member of the party needs to have an ID'.
Are you kidding me? I was pissed. The fact that I had come there FROM MY JOB in a SUIT pissed me off so much more, the implication that I was supplying alcohol to minors... girl didn't drink and she was wearing a sundress.
I had never, ever, heard that before when I was buying beer with male friends with me. Never. It was so blatant and the bitch was smug it really got to me. My girlfriend was not 21, and my girlfriend was a good girl, not the kind of skank to have a fake ID, so I was BTFO and had to leave empty handed.
Another incident: At a restaurant, holding hands, just talking to her. Didn't kiss her. Didn't do anything lewd. Waitress informs me that 'This is a family restaurant and we are going to need you to knock that off'.
Once again, I couldn't believe it.
My observation is because they are comparing themselves constantly.
If you, i.e. a HG9 or HG8 or whatever are with a girl see sees as a 4, it opens up questions she doesn't want to face
If she has him ( i.e. you) and she believes she is better than your GF, why doesn't she have someone like you
As Chris Rock says, if a man sees his buddy with a great woman, he says, I should get a woman like that, in reverse, with a woman to her female 'friend', she says " I want that guy right there!"
She thinks you are stupid ( No, I don't think you are stupid but hear out my logic ) If there is a flaw she cannot rationalize, the problem must be you. I.E. when single mothers say " This guy and these men MUST be intimidated by me, because I'm a strong independent woman!" ) Usually the construction includes 1 positive for her while also, at the same time, working in a negative for you. It's like two people in the water, and when she feels like shes drowning, will drag you down into the water, while trying to pull herself out of the drink
Sadly, it's never about you, only how you make her feel about herself.
My take? If you find someone you like and get a long with, fuck whatever else does or thinks or says. I'm not saying you have or did react negatively to it, I just think you have to hold "frame" I personally don't like to be judged. I realize people do it for perception reasons and to save time and it's all about them, but I don't enjoy it. I doubt most guys here do. In return, I feel the best response to that isn't trying to change other people's behavior, but adopt the behavior you find ideal for yourself.
Are there unicorns? No, I don't believe it personally
But are there great people out there? Absolutely. Even the angriest guy here on this subreddit, even the guys MGTOW, there is that trace of hope within them that no one wants to really talk about ( What is the point of life without hope?)
To me, if you find great people in your life, not just to date, but anyone, who brings you joy, you learn from, who enriches your life, fuck what they look like, what they earn, whether they raise or lower your social status, fuck all that. Living a good life to me means being around good people, of good character, who value you for you, in so much as is possible in this life. If you happen to find one that you are attracted to, great, if not, that's ok too.
Great post man. Yeah, to be honest, I never really cared what they think, especially seeing as how I had a gf that I liked and was happy with, so why do I care what some random sluts think ya know?
There was one or two instances where it was just like 'really?'
I forgot to post it in my main post, but I was at a liquor store and they had a sale on my favorite beer, and I was in NH where alcohol is really cheap.
I had this girl with me, my ex, and I stroll up the counter, and I'm told that 'Every member of the party needs to have an ID'.
Are you kidding me? I was pissed.
I had never, ever, heard that before when I was buying beer with male friends with me. Never. It was so blatant and the bitch was smug it really got to me.
... what. fuck off, what if 'you' suck, the only people who value 'you for you' besides famililial-esque relations probably suck or are using you too
This is genuinely one of the best posts I have ever read, anywhere on the internet. I never comment on Reddit, maybe once or twice ever, but had to comment on this. Completely agree with your perspective on life. Most people in the western world exist for somewhere between 60 and 100 years, both of those numbers are small so why live your live to conform to other peoples expectations of you. Do what makes you happy with those that make you happy, rich or poor, strong or weak, hot or ugly, it shouldn't matter at all. If someones content of character enriches your life, they are worth spending time with, regardless of what other peoples opinions of you will be for doing so
Types are real. There are some women that people think are super hot that I think are horrendously ugly. Conversely I've been attracted to women that others have found ugly.
What you're describing is more of a types thing. That's different than you dating someone that was ugly that you also weren't attracted to. Some guys will date an ugly girl consciously because they're worried about getting cheated on if she was hotter or she has some other attribute they really like.
I call this bullshit. I get that taste differ, but beauty and attractiveness is backed by science. Face symetry, body shape, evolution, social consensus in a certain environment. You can see a 10 when someone else will see a 7, but no one will look at the same girl and see a 2. Not even if the people judging are from completely different cultures. Maybe you're confusing ugly with 'meh'.
Right, but the issue is that the ex is lower on the scale, not her exact position on it. If a 10 waitress sees the guy with a less attractive ex, the ex could be 1-9 and it wouldn't matter in this case. OP is hot and 10 waitress wants him.
I didn't use those numbers. I probably went over the top by saying "horrendously ugly", but the point stands. He thought his girlfriend was hot. He never thought otherwise until other people pointed out to him that she wasn't hot according to them.
What I'm saying is also backed by science. If what I was saying wasn't true you'd have everyone of a particular group after 1 member of the opposite gender. If attraction worked that way and only that way, the human race would've died out long ago. If you're trying to say you've never found someone unattractive that a friend said was hot, or had a friend say they weren't attracted to someone you found hot, you're either lying or a complete anomaly.
'super hot' - 9 or 10
'horrendously ugly' - 1 to 3
No, he didn't. He thought she was 'cute', with a very nice body.
'hot' - 8 or 9
'cute' - 6-7
'very nice' - 7
What I'm trying to say is exactly what I said. People have different taste, and a 10 for one can be a 7 for another, but never a 2. Take Kattie Perry, some may say she's a 10, others, like me, will say she's an 8 after the boob job, but annoying as fuck so an overall 7. But if someone comes up and says she looks like a turd after mixing tacos with prunes and yogurt and watermelon, or says she's 'horrendously ugly', I call bullshit. Numbers are relative, but not that relative.
And yes, I am associating numbers with words out of my ass because my ass applies logic.
I still think you're being persnickety and this is beside the point, but I also don't care enough to argue. Fine. Not "horrendously ugly", I just wasn't personally attracted to them.
Places commonly do that man its bizarre you equated it to this situation. You're supposed to card a whole party.
Really? It's common? Then how come every time I buy liquor with male friends, including one guy who is 19, I'm never asked? How come I see people buying liquor with a 5 year old and he's never asked?
Maybe I've been lucky with not getting called on that but man it sure felt that way, especially the way the old crone smiled with glee
Which translates into 'They're just jealous she has such a handsome boyfriend'.
The idea of a "mismatch" would definitely rustle some
jimmiestitties in the Female Social Matrix so women would love to take down the impudent woman (just like they take down the sluts) and the man that went with it. But do you think it negatively hit your SMV? Were girls more flirty with you (SMV+) or on the contrary acting like you didn't exist (SMV-)?I'd say less flirty SMV-, but not by as much as you'd think.
It might even have been no change and this is conformation bias.
I would expect you know, to have been invisible to women as per this thread but maybe because she was just ugly and not fat I got a pass
Be honest man, was there a difference in race? This sounds like just some bitter white/black girls getting at you for dating out of your race.
Both of us were white, beyond that both of us were slavs
Uh, I don't know what to say other than people can be really petty.
This one time in college, I was maybe a little drunk and trying to sneak a chubby 5 into my dorm room and I got busted by my roommate. He wasn't in the room per our standard your-night/my-night agreement but he was in the lobby, spotted me, and called me out (the bastard). There were several other people there and I guess the word spread.
Anyway, I don't have any solid evidence or anything, but I can tell you that two other (7-8) ladies that I was working on at the time frosted right up on me after that. Never did close the deal with them.
I have been in an LTR with an Asian girl in Asia that would objectively be a 5 or so as we had a lot in common and had similar lifestyles.
Some girl that was working at a cafe I was going to regularly that seemed into me but was super shy started to treat me like a beta by giving me shit tests like asking me to pick up my own coffee when it was ready after seeing us together for example. (needless to say I stopped going there)
My theory: Women will presume you have a low self esteem / nothing to offer financially / are beta.
Dude, you seriously have problem with one cafe girl giving you shit tests, you were bothered so much that you chose to retreat.
She is no wrong in her beta assessment.
What happen if a barista started giving your attitude in the west, are you just gonna stop going to that Starbucks?!!! What happen to your right as a customer?!!!
This was in Thailand not in the west. The girls working in that cafe were from millionaire families who did barista "work" as their hipster past time until they found some beta bucks from an equally rich family and probably got their families to fund the guy who was running the cafe.
This means there is nobody to complain to and amused mastery doesn't fly well with the locals who rightfully suspect that any foreigner who doesn't look like white trash looks down on them as unsophisticated 3rd world people.
You basically have no rights in the country and local men look at you with a mix of suspicion, jealously and anger, especially if you're with an Asian girl who is not a hooker.
It's interesting that you're saying that, when I was in Bangkok for a few days, my impression was that the most attractive women there weren't ethnic Thais, but fair-skinned and lithe (i.e. I guess most of them were of Chinese ethnicity).
In fact, the only place where I've seen Thai women who were reliably attractive was in one of the red light districts. Other than that, they were quite underwhelming.
The attractive ones are indeed mostly of Chinese descent or mixed. The ethnic Chinese run virtually all of the economy and thus can obtain the best looking women.
Isaan girls tend to be the ugliest (very dark skinned) while most others are short and stubby. It's mainly blue collar British men who have to deal with inbred obese foul mouthed women back home that see them as desirable.
HAHAHAHAHA~~~~ I don't even know where to begin.
Thailand sounds super terrible!!!
It's 3rd world for a reason. People are unprofessional as fuck and tend to be super moody in service sector jobs. If you make a fuss about it you're just the rich asshole foreigner by default who is always in the wrong.
There was a 7-11 (convenience store) next to my condo that I always went to for minor shopping and some entitled girl who was the head cashier there or w/e laid claim on me after she noticed I was living in Thailand and I stopped going there as well because it was just too awkward.
sounds like jealousy to me, but if you feel that it tanked her interest in you, I can believe you
Her interest didn't change, but I think before she saw me with my LTR she felt like she was out of my league and afterwards she felt like she could shit test me like a bossy bitch.
Most women are super judgemental and always judging guys they deem attractive.
What why. Were you still BP?
Yes, however I'm fairly flexible towards looks if I feel some connection, which is super rare to me as a most women tend to be devoid of a real personality. She was kind of a unicorn in some aspects but AWALT applied. We had some good times together.
What do you personally think when you see a kind of normal looking guy with a fatty on his arm? Are you think about how successful he must be or are you thinking "WTF is wrong with this guy that he needs to date that fatty?".
Also as a former beta loser, I have experience with this. I was dating a fatty and then we broke up. The girl I was interested in specifically said to me "I don't think I want to date someone who dated X". It's rare that a woman would actually tell you the real reason for not wanting to date, but I think it was at least a bit honest.
I exactly think this. But then I am a man, not a woman. Given that what I think and what women think are always so different, particularly in matters of judging the other sex, does what I think really reflect what women think? Get my drift? That's why I am asking for personal anecdotes.
Yours is such anecdote so thank you. Except that I put zero value to what rejection excuses women say. I've heard my shares of "we have a great friendship going, let's not ruin it" or "You're a great guy but I'm not looking into dating at the moment" back in my days.
It's better to pay a hot escort to go out and be seen with.
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do you think that is normal?
This sounds like some bizarre combination of redpill advice and 4chan autism.
Lol! Be sure to post your findings
Enjoy your beta life jerking it to porn
It's not my taste ... but I kind of admire a high-quality guy happily with a fat girl. It epitomizes DGAF and nothing to prove ... that's a guy who wants what he wants and doesn't let something superficial stand in the way of it. (I sympathize of course with a guy who started off with a skinny girlfriend and ends up unhappily with a fat wife).
I'm reminded of the joke that says marrying a woman is like pulling the ripcord on an inflatable raft!
Cholesterol and triglyceride counts are literally not superficial.
That's pretty disheartening tbh. I like to think I'm not a shallow guy. I'd genuinely be happy with a nice quiet girl, whos company is enjoyable and I can go places with. My standards for looks are pretty much : don't be obese or deformed, have good teeth, skin and personal hygiene. All pretty much things you can control (minus the deformity). Now I'm very picky about these things. After that though, it's largely down to personality. Don't annoy me, don't be retarded, don't be too much of a slut (I know AWALT but if I'm going to be seen in public with her she better know how to act with some class, even if it's just an act)
I've had to turn down good looking girls because they were just too fucking annoying. Talking too much, shit testing constantly, sharing their retarded opinions about things they know nothing about. They were exhausting to be around.
On the other hand, I've had shy girls who might not be bombshells, who are too shy to show any interest because they think I'm out of their league. Which means I have to try extra hard to show I'm interested, which I don't like doing because it puts me in a position of weakness.
I can't help but feel having sex with sluts whos personalities you hate is very empty and the kind of thing that crushes your humanity.
TRP shows you how to do that, if you're attractive it makes it easy, but personally TRP showed me how to make myself more attractive to the opposite sex by getting a better understanding of social dynamics and knowing what alpha and beta traits are, and acting accordingly when the situation calls for it.
As a woman, I think the flip side of that is the chick who has sex with guys because of their money or status.
That's pure RedPill right there. No BS, just the truth.
And it makes perfect sense. Conversely, an average man with a smoking hot GF is going to have a high SMV.
TBH I think the same way about these guys.
I knew a guy who was reasonably attractive. Not a huge catch, but decent enough. I'd peg him roughly a 5 or a 6 on the scale. He was with a woman who was a 2 or less, depending on if you qualify the ones who are retarded or deformed as a 1 or a 0. She was one step above that. Fat, needy, lazy, boring, hairy, stupid. Nobody who knew him got why he was with her. I recall even asking one of his much closer friends "why is he with her? I don't understand, is something wrong with him? There's a way more attractive interesting girl who's single in your group of friends, why not get with her instead?" Nobody had an answer, they were all wondering the same thing and these were guys who'd known him for years.
She is just jealous of the fat chick. Women despise other women, not men. She 's thinking "if her, why not me? let me say something bad about the guy who is not choosing me, me me meeeee"
deleted What is this?
Amen. God forbid a hot girl working on her personality. And at least for me, when you're out of her league the sex is way better. The pure dominance doesn't have to be forced at all, and she goes out of her way to treat me like a king. I haven't commited to one yet, but my experiences are really starting to make me question whether smoking hot chicks are worth all the trouble.
Since we're on the topic of average/fat girls, I thought I'd share this video. Mack hit the nail right on the head with it.
Total aside, but I damn near pissed myself at "more cocks than John Wayne's rifle". Best line I've heard in weeks.
Worth A Buy is 50% game review, 50% story-telling masterpiece
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Bigger women just lack the self-control to become smaller, an important personality trait. I've never seen being bigger make a person nicer. The only situation where that might be the case is when you compare a big girl to another girl currently in the process of losing weight (restrictive diets lead to crankiness)
We do this to white women who date black guys.
I don't think this applies in the case of marriage, though - if you're married and she's fat everybody assumes she got fat after you married her.
I've only seen this work in the opposite direction. Had a friend take a big girl out and he was suddenly getting attention because the girls thought he wasn't shallow.
The hamstering on some of these comments is unreal.
A fat woman is low value. I'm not talking about just looks. It's a visual cue on how little self control she has. It's a signifier of an addictive personality. Little regard for taking care of one's self. A low-self-esteem red flag. None of these are good qualities in the slightest.
Yes, I admit some ladies can still be hot with a little bit of extra meat on those hips, however if you're going beyond a short-term plate, I guarantee in 10 years she's going to look like a shapeless cow. 20 years, god knows what kind of health ailments will pop up because of her inability to take care of herself.
Have some self respect and go for women who at least have some self esteem. YOU can do better!
So? All that proves is that you spend too much time on the internet.
I can promise you, from a lifetime of experience, if you are a "hot" guy then you are never going to be a "non-entity" to women. There are many other factors that will hurt you worse than being seen with a fat girlfriend, in any case.
I think "non-entity" is a bit of an overstatement. Probably more fair to say that being a hot guy with an ugly girl "hurts" your social standing to some extent.
Indeed.
I don't get why this post is so much upvoted.
On this sub, people talking about HB4 to HB9 all assume the ranking is subjective and everybody agrees with this (ofcourse, because it is). Isn't "ugly" or "beautiful" the most subjective thing to consider!?
The same with some post on asktrp I just read: literally everybody answered "no fat chicks" on some question from a user who apparently wanted to fuck a fat chick... Stupid people giving dumb answers.
I hate the 1-10 scale. You can't even quantify the difference between a 7 and an 8. I've always suggested a -1, 0, +1 scale. -1 ,would not fuck. 0, would fuck but not brag about, or tell people about it. +1, would fuck, and okay with others knowing or telling others.
That helps in not pedestalizing them as well.
I see it from two sides.. one is that girls that see a hot guy with a fatty get jealous that a girl with lower smv than them is fucking a hot guy so they talk shit... two, they think like the girl in op post. I think there are two camps and both are real.
i used to date a beautiful Turkish girl, at one time she worked as a hostess at a high end restaurant. I was sitting at the bar waiting for her to get out and I was observing people at the place. there was a group of dolled up russian girls leaving the place (I'm russian btw, but don't date russian hoes categorically), they weren't really hot at all just "good from far, far from good" looking type. so they started a convo on the way out with my ex. I watched the whole thing, they were friendly at first, but then abruptly changed attitude and left.
after my ex got out I asked her wtf was that all about. she said that once she told them that she's dating a russian guy, their demeanor changed and they quickly bounced. I knew exactly what was up, my ex was way hotter than all those bitches combined and when she pointed to me at the bar, they saw I'm good looking and I'm not with a russian girl so they hated on my ex. a lot of russian dudes won't date russian girls for many many reasons, one of which is they're selfish gold digging egotistical cunts, and also the guys want something else when they come to the states and see all the diversity in women as opposed to just your regular Russian white chick. Even me as a guy was treated differently as soon as I told some Russian girl that I'm dating a girl of another race. They hate that shit.
I know that this is kind of the opposite of what op's post is about, but it goes both ways as far as jealousy goes. hot bitches will get jealous of a fat chick if they see her with a hot guy.
Doesn't the same thing happen with black men and women?
Yeah in America a lot of black men who get with white women face shit from black women for not keeping it in the race or whatever, the issue however, is a lot of African American women show a lot of masculine personality traits and are not very attractive to people because of it. Some are straight up wonderful however the ones that complain about black men dating white women are usually the tsa agent type. Loud. Fat. And hyper aggressive.
that is out of my expertise range
Why are you taking advice from a woman?
I've made many many attractive woman interested in me by openly flirting with women less attractive than they in person
Different tactic; that's forcing the hot girl to compete for attention on the spot. You're not actively dating those less attractive women you're flirting with.
In marketing the goal is to sell at the best prices possible to make the most income in a given market. In some markets a salesman can overvalue their product, and others it's better to undercharge. If they sell food at an upscale farmer's market and they're undercharging everyone there people are going to wonder what's wrong with their produce.
If I'm selling myself at an upscale dating market, and they see I've undersold myself for an overweight girl, they're going to wonder what's wrong with me.
That is why he is doing, just like women claiming they like nice guys who are not assholes. Women's advice is always self serving.
First thing though that occurs in her head, why is he with fatty instead of me ? If she asks the guy, he can say well fatty sucks better cock then you do and takes it up the ass. That will give her a complex then.
Again OP is vague in his terms.
Haha it is so true! Skinny girls are horrible at sucking dick! The prettier the girl, the less enjoyable the blowjob cause 9's and 10's don't have to add that to their offering. I can't say I have enjoyed 99% of blowjobs received, the only time oral only was enough was from this fatty that begged me to let her blow me and I have to say... it was worth it.
There is a difference between curvy and fat. Curvy is your 1940s pinup girl or Anna Nichole Smith. Many stick girls might call curvy obese. My theory is curvy girls lime sticking things in their mouths.
My experience anyway.
Because women have a herd mentality and preselection is absolutely the strongest aspect of "game".
Hence status/fame being king. Status and fame boil down to preselection. A high status or famous man is simply a man who has been preselected on a macro scale.
Any man who has approached women on the dancefloor who will look at you to size you up after you start grinding on them only to get permission from her friends before continuing.
Based on what her friends say about you she will continue or reject you, often regardless of her own opinion.
A man's SMV is directly related to how he makes the woman appear to her social group.
What if I like fat girls? I would say the sex I liked the most both times was with girls people would say are fat. By far physically I just want a pretty face and fucking metric tons of tits and hair lol.
Holy shit. You're right. I got this super cute girls number at the county fair this fall. Hooters girl. Anyways, she saw me dancing with a somewhat chubby girl later on that evening and I never got a text back from her. Makes sense. I dropped my SMV to zero just like that.
A woman's world is primarily made up of other women.
So true. If you're an average man, and go out with a hot girl, all the other hot girls suddenly want you. Same if you're wearing a wedding ring.
Its like a pre-qualification. Mentality is that if you've got something that other hot girl wants/ locked you into marriage for, you must be worth pursuing.
A man see a hot woman and instantly want to fuck her or even make her girlfriend. Looks in a woman are the most important pre-requisite.
A woman see a handsome guy and normally she feels a spark of attraction but she doesn't necessary want to fuck him. If this was true every good looking male was having lots of sex (with hot women), and believe me they aren't. For women to fuck a man they must spark her emotions and this can be done with his game, social savyness, non-neediness, masculinity and most important of all of them...social status.
Men who fuck, or even worse, date fat/ugly women are broadcasting their low social status. Pre-selection is fucking huge. Even if you are average looks if a lot a women is interesting in you other women will be.
I have a friend who is below average height, above average facialy and normal body, however he is very popular and it's insane the options he has. Women approach him, they want to date him, they want to fuck him....it's insane.
Don't get me wrong. Looks are important! Try your best to be above average in looks then work hard on your social skills, game and carreer.
How tall does he look exactly?
I think 5'6. But the average where I live is 5'8. He does have the cute boy look. Anyway he is almost always the shortest of the group. Status beat looks every day.
the slave mentality is strong tho
When women see a guy with an hot girlfriend, that guy automatically becomes a super-Chad to them -- even if he's ugly.
like, instantly he has just qualified himself for every woman who's seen him with that girlfriend (and all those women's friends, too)
I guess the reverse is also true, right?
Completely disagree on this post. I know a guy, he's average and uses a girl who is a legit 0 (fat, ugly, bad skin, not intelligent) for sex. They are basically known as FWB.
The guys not good looking nor fit, but he is charming, holds conversation, and fun to be around.
He has since stopped banging the 0 and is dating a 7 who is in the same year (she knows all about them). She's not exactly pretty, but a clear upgrade. If she had 'disqualified' him she would not date him. She has friends who know about the two as well, if they disqualified him they would not have approved them getting together.
"7... not pretty..." What does your fucking scale go up to?
Intangibles like personality, habits, intelligence are factors
Not sure if this was said yet but we can't rule out the fact that she's simply hamstering up an excuse for the OP.
The fact that she even posted it in the first place means she's jealous of the girl on some level. It doesn't matter how unattractive the girl is..in fact that probably makes the jealousy stronger. She needs to find an excuse as to why she's not as desirable as the fat chick so she posted this in hopes of getting the exact hamster response we're discussing. You can't always take what women say at face value, even on the internet.
Just playing devil's advocate here, thoughts?
Poor dudes with fat fetishes, lol.
Pretty obvious if you ask me, this is basic human behavior. Also tons of betas end up with overweight girlfriends for obvious reasons.
This is stupid. First of all its offensive to guys who enjoy fat girls, and for fat girls. Sure maybe Shallow girls would be turned off, but who wants to be with a shallow person anyways?
As a guy who likes them bigger, first of all bringing a larger girl who you find to be incredibly sexy into public is a fucking power move. By accepting her, and letting her know that yeah I fuck with you and I don't care what anybody thinks, makes you 10 times more attractive to her. It's also intimating to other people who are single to see that level of authentic intimacy between two people. I've brought bigger girls out in public, and yeah if you're a fucking pussy that doesn't make eye contact with people, and look unsure of it sure people are going to judge you. But if you're out in public with your fat gf with a look of confidence on your face, giving off that "I don't give a fuck what anybody else thinks, I enjoy this girl and I'm fucking cool with it and that's all that matters." People are going to notice. People are going to be upset that they don't have somebody willing to show them off like that. So yea maybe intimidated shallow uninteresting girls who only care about Instagram likes won't fuck with you. But it's not about getting with those girls anyways.
Having a fat girlfriend doesn't make you undatable, being a pussy about it is what'll make you undatable. I've had beautiful girls approach me after I left my first real gf who her self was nice and thick. It's all a mind set. If you're the type of social beast that is required to be the top 20% of males who get the most girls then you're not going to have any trouble.
I say fuck worrying about what other people are going to think about you. That's counterproductive. You limit your options when you do that, and when you're limiting your self you're actually getting less girls.
This post is ignorant and wrong, these people don't have any idea what they're talking about. As a real guy who does real nigga shit and actually gets girls and has actually gone through all this, I'm here to say, it's That type of mind set is what is limiting you. This post isn't helping anybody get more girls, it's doing the exact opposite. You should educate your self on topics before speaking on something you don't know. Own your shit, be proud of who you are and the right people are going to come your way. The rest of people who don't fuck with it are nothing but distractions.
Rule #1. No fat chicks.
Don't date livestock.
I'm going to have to go ahead and disagree here. I've dated an objective 2 chubster. Her friends ranged from 3's to 6's and I got with all of them.
Those are bargain basement numbers (I respect your honesty). I don't think it applies when you go 6+
still, the theory should work out for 2s with 4s-friends the same as with 6s with 8s friends.
The marketplace dynamics are way different in fluid markets (like the stock market) versus less fluid markets (like selling collectible cars).
Marketplace reality is very evident, and you have multiple "buy and sell" options every day when you're hot. 8s, 9s, 10s have qualified "buyers" making offers every single day.
2s and 4s will go MONTHS without any guys offering them relationships. Sure, a fat chick can get dick, but few from men she is attracted to and out of the attractive ones, it's likely almost none of them offer more than an ONS.
You can get really good deals in irrational markets. It's not hard for a dealer to get in on a car at $1500 and out at $3500. Cars are somewhat liquid, but not THAT liquid.
Compare that with trying to get into an exchange-traded stock at $15 and out at $35. It's doable, but it takes way more work to pull off, otherwise everyone would day trade all day long.
Same thing with fucking your fat girlfriend's slightly less fat hambeast buddies. You're not convincing them to break up with a fit guy with a degree from Harvard Law, you're convincing them to spend a night away from their cats and take their first dick in 2 months.
Thanks for sharing. I'd be keen to have more people here sharing what they think of OP's post bolstered with their own experience.
Because what I see in OP's post for now is a woman saying something about relationships dynamics, and everyone here agreeing without verifying because that somehow fits their pre-existing beliefs.
I've read nothing in red pill theory that comments on what women think of a man with an ugly girlfriend. If you have relevant anecdotes, please share. If you have thoughts, please develop them.
The guy above is right, at a certain threshold this plan isn't gonna work. If you're committed to only fucking the upper threshold of women "dating down" isn't the way to go. If your goal is more to just get laid it's an excellent strategy; I did it before finding TRP and had the same experience as above.
I might not have been getting with the best looking girls, but I was getting laid consistently and 6+'s were not gonna give me the time of day back then anyway. Having changed social groups a couple times since then, it doesn't seem like that negative stigma followed me for too long.
I find women's accounts of their own attraction to be far more accurate when they are saying unflattering things about women. That way you know she isn't lying or sugarcoating the truth to avoid making team woman look bad.
With a $20 bill in your pocket you can buy a lot of shit at the dollar store. Doesn't mean you're rich.
Hugh Jackman has a wife who many have said is beneath him and is quite older than him. From what I've seen of him with her, he looks plenty happy.
He gets side ass guaranteed.
You can't make assumptions that male actors in Hollywood are heterosexual. Many, many of them are gay men who use women as beards.
And there are lots of rumors about Hugh Jackman's sexuality, which, by the way, proves the OP's point. He has an ugly wife - so the first thing people think when looking at them as a couple is that the more attractive man has to be gay to be dating such an ugly chick.
Then again - he does really love musicals...
And they were married before he was famous...
I've seen pictures of his wife back in the day. She was actually okay. It's the age difference made more obvious by the fact that he's a man most women find desirable.
If a gay man wanted a beard, surely he'd chose a fuck-off, hot-as-hell woman? That said, maybe it would be smart to subvert expectations by going out with a woman who's beneath him lookswise.
How do you know it's a female and not another red piller?
It is far better to be seen with a hot female friend you are not fucking, than with a fat girl you are fucking.
I am older than most of you, so this is going back about 15 years :
College, I was hooking up with a suite mate of a female friend from HS. I visited them all one weekend, we were in their dorm's lounge, sitting and talking. My fuck-friend got up to get me something from her room. I kept talking to my HS friend ( who was a LARGE girl).
There were plenty of girls around who noted me talking to my friend. A couple came up to say hi and were visibly dismissing my presence. The minute my "gf" came back and sat on my lap, many of other attractive girls that were present started speaking to me, seeing if maybe they could catch my attention.
MY attention wasn't the point. The point was to divert it from the attractive girl I was ( in their view) fucking.
No shit. Fat girls are for Netflix and chill only. Never be seen with one in public lol I thought every guy knew this.
having friends who are female is ok,. and this was like 15 + years ago... you know, right after the matrix even came out.
No shit. Thought we were talking about women we're fucking. If someone is my FRIEND why the hell would I care who sees me with them? Is this high school?
I think some women just assume the ugly girl gives great head.
Maybe he will be disqualified for the short term.
Nothing wrong with lowering your standards to higher your average during a dry spell.
If you can keep it a secret.
preselection gone wrong? I definitely know preselection is real. but do we really know how common this anecdote is? Has anyone else observed the phenomenon of girls ignore hot guys because he is seen with an ugly chick?
It seems like the girl will see the fat chick as less of a threat/competition and ignore her existence and pursue the hot guy like she didn't exist. Or would she unconsciously think there is something wrong with that guy for being with a fat chick?
Of course the hotness of the women that the man attracts matters when it comes to preselection.
However what's puzzling is that the reverse is not true. I genuinely could not give two fucks if the girl I'm into has dated 5's her whole life and upgrades to me. I legit have no idea what it would feel like to see a woman with a high status man and desire her more for that reason.
I can analyze a woman's value in a vacuum and come to my own conclusions. It's weird that women cannot.
No its weird that we dont. In the same way that you can watch someone touch a hot stove and not need to touch it yourself to realize its hot, you should be able to tell that if a really hot chick is with some fucked up dude she probably has some serious issues going on. Its called social learning.
This doesn't seem real. I get to an extent that a man's value is raised when he is seen interacting with attractive women (preselection), but "her" statement implies that a woman somehow loses her physical attraction for a man based on the attractiveness of another woman.
Roissy discusses the problem of mismatched couples, but I highly doubt a man who's talking to a fatty somehow "becomes a non-entity" if he looks like this, this, or this.
Correct. This also happens when really attractive idiots open their mouth. The physical attraction flys away immediately
Whatever happened to seeing a man with a girl (fat or not) and assuming he's already taken and thus off-limits?
the fatty bashing is all over the assumption that hes just using her in some strategy to get other girls or get easier sex.
maybe he just likes her and wants to date her. i support any guy's personal woman-conquest.
99 percent of all relationships end.
Hes not suggesting these guys are using her as a step stool. Just wants them to be aware that dating a fat girl is a dangerous gamble. Inevitably when this relationship goes sour, all the other fish in the sea swam away long ago
I do a stand up bit about Demi Lavato being all about body positivity and all bodies are beautiful, except Taylor Swift and all her skinny model friends. Credibility goes out the window.
*am i currently getting my dick wet with fatty, if yes... continue
*am i currently getting my dick wet with hypothetical chick who may or may not get my dick wet, if no... go back to one.
So is to better to be alone then?
Its better to be alone no matter what
OP is correct. Never let any woman see you romantic with any girl who isnt at least on the fuckable scale.
They write you off like THAT
Pretty much, even I would think "what the hell is wrong with you?"
I'd say that applies to post-wall women as well. Being with one lowers your SMV, even with OTHER post-wall women.
(how I know: firsthand experience)
Let's remember the first law of thermodynamics; The first law of thermodynamics is a version of the law of conservation of energy, adapted for thermodynamic systems. The law of conservation of energy states that the total energy of an isolated system is constant; energy can be transformed from one form to another, but cannot be created or destroyed.
in this context, his coolness has been transferred to this fat bitch ass and now she can enjoy higher level of CC, while he descends down to lesser qaulity asses.
I know this isn't a popular opinion, but it will be one day... Maybe he doesn't give a shit and she treats him better. Maybe this is what the American female population wrought for itself. Going for a lower "SMV"(seriously how the hell do we even quantify this anymore...have you turned on a television, it's all screwed up) I'm not in an LTR but I can understand his motivations and they hardly seem like what OP has quoted, at least to me.
Who tf said this? this has got to be the cuckiest, most disturbing thought in all of TRP.
If she is overweight, youre a cuck for committing to such woman who doesn't even love herself enough to be sexy i.e. healthy.
What a redpill nuclear bomb!
C'mon now, nobody wants to be with a fat bitch, no matter how great her personality is.
This is false af. I fuck a lot of chubby girls and I fuck a lot of average and slim girls as well. Women don't care, they just think they do.
I disagree.
Around three years ago I was in an LTR of about two years with a considerably short and also chubby girl.
I exhibited some red pill traits without any knowledge at that stage and was running game all the time without even realising.
I had no problem getting sexual attention and favors from girls around me who knew my girlfriend was over weight.
Currently in High School, this doesn't seem to apply. I think this has more to do with SMV than fatness.
Women don't want themselves basically
putdemoted into the same league as the girlfriendI consider myself I high SMV man, but honestly i'm into chubby chicks (under the age of 25 only); the reason I don't date/fuck them more is because it makes me look like a loser.
Nothing is quite like fucking a fat bitch from behind =D