When is Reconciliation Worth it?

Tiway22 · 2016-04-10T16:50:36+00:00

Remove her from your life. Forever. NEVER be someones fallback. Have some goddamn self respect. You KNOW you can do better.

jacktenofhearts · 2016-04-10T22:58:17+00:00

This isn't a "fucked up" marriage.

"Fucked up" is you having health problems and your wife getting compassion fatigue and asking for a divorce, for example. Fucked up is your wife getting assaulted and shutting down physically/sexually. Fucked up is... You get the idea. Fucked up is even your wife just saying, "I don't feel the same way about us anymore, I want to separate."

Nothing about what your ex-wife did it fucked up. It was just shitty, because she's a shitty person. AWALT is not AWATS. Not all examples of hypergamy are ethically repugnant. But your wife basically is. There is a whole web of deception and bullshit she spun and wove in your life for months and months, apparently. What kind of fucking person is capable of doing that? Saying all women are naturally inclined to have this level of deceit is retarded. Your wife could have just as easily just asked for a divorce and let this guy fuck her brains out, instead of shutting down sex with you yet still operating under the bullshit pretense of marriage. If she was going to branch swing, why didn't she do it that way? Because she's a shitty person. A shitty person you seem more than eager to let back in your life.

Look, the human mind is capable of rationalizing amazing things. Psych 101 teachers you about cognitive dissonance, and how Nazis are still able to sleep at night by rationalizing "well I'm exterminating all these Jews but I'm just following orders, it's really Hitler that's causing these Jews to die." This is how your last few paragraphs read. For months you've wished of nothing but this scenario and now your ex-wife has appeared with a brief bout of hysterical bonding.

But can you trust her? You can't trust anyone really, but there's "Healthy levels of distrust to ensure self-reliance and independence" versus "10 foot pole" distrust. When my wife doesn't want to fuck me, I trust that it's because... She doesn't want to fuck me. I don't need to worry about some web of deception she's building in terms of branch swinging to some Chad. She may still do that, of course, but there's not much point in living my life like a paranoid freak when she's given me no indication she's capable of that level of shitty behavior.

But your wife has. You can't trust her, can you? Once this hysterical bonding period ends, what then? You'll have to constantly filter every word and action through the lens that this is someone you can't trust. And me, I hate that shit. I don't do business with unethical people for that reason. I mean, everyone is a bullshitter, but once a guy has proven to be a blatant liar, he's done. I can't fucking spend my time and energy dealing with people who fucking lie to my face and apparently have no problem doing so. I don't care if someone tries to charge me more because they get more commission. I expect that to happen. I only get pissed when I say, "Do you get a commission on this sale?" and they say NO and pretend their interest in this sale is purely out of some sense of altruism. You want to bullshit me about the Deluxe Package is better because it's better for you, fine. But when I ask, "but if I get this, it's also better for you, right?" Then just fucking say yes. Say yes, because if I have to parse every time you say "No" could actually mean "Yes," and vice versa, then fuck you. Nobody is worth that goddamn mental effort.

One last point. You mention no assets and children. Realize that however difficult it is to cast off your ex-wife now, imagine a future where those two things are in play. If you're this much of a codependent beta bitch now that you'd even consider reconciling despite the possibility of a logistically straightforward divorce with minimal fallout, then it's only going to get worse. You'll be even more desperate to rationalize your wife's behavior because the consequences of a split are so much more dire.

You need to learn how to move in and out of good and bad relationships based on what you are giving/getting out of them. It's infinitely easier when you don't have a huge legal guillotine hanging over you that will drop if you navigate those relationships wrong.

[deleted] · 2016-04-10T18:53:26+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Persaeus · 2016-04-10T17:37:39+00:00

Have some self respect OP. Once you are married for long period of time and add in the stress of kids, the shit will get much deeper. If your wife did not pass the relatively easy "travel/work test"; you have no hope for the much harder test to come. NEXT

Archwinger · 2016-04-10T23:25:56+00:00

She only came back because things with the other guy she'd been fucking for 8 months didn't work out. It had nothing to do with your progress.

You don't want to be the second choice for a cunty cheater who made you go a year without sex, do you? You can do better. No contact.

recon_or_fuckit · 2016-04-10T16:56:36+00:00

Rational male, rooting through the trash.

Iron rule 7.

Qudstions?

Big_Daddy_PDX · 2016-04-11T00:24:59+00:00

I really doubt you read anything in the sidebar that leads you to believe you can (credibly) ask this question.

She shows up for "no reason" after 8mos? You (probably) made changes to yourself, but none she could see. So why did she come back? C the other guy kicked her to the curb. You are the consolation prize. She hasn't learned anything. It's all roses today, but you'll soon slip back to the beta arrangement. There's nothing left to salvage at be precipice of divorce after her extended fuck fest w/ another man.

[deleted] · 2016-04-10T18:07:12+00:00

Stop entertaining fantasies. You already know she can't commit, not really. And there ain't no more to say.

Chump_No_More · 2016-04-11T15:14:00+00:00

You've got some great advise, follow every bit of it, but I'm going to throw out a scenario that you need to be very wary of.

What if Chad got your 'wife' pregnant and now she's 'hysterically bonding' with you to cuckold your beta chump ass.

First order of business, stop having sex with this woman. 2nd, make her take a pregnancy test. If positive, a DNA test is in order. This isn't to ascertain her trustworthiness for reconciliation, we've already established she's not... this is to protect your ass from paternity fraud.

If Chad didn't knock her up and you're too weak to stop having sex with her, for God sakes, use protection and personally dispose of it... otherwise you will be truly fucked.

Sepean · 2016-04-10T21:27:29+00:00

I'm often the one here who tells people they should consider working things out.

But this one is crystal clear. She left, was with someone else, the heart break is already over and done with, you're doing well on your own, no kids. I'm seeing red flags and no reason to take her back.

You don't have to sacrifice your life to help her, it is ok to say no. Don't be a white knight.

cj_aubrey · 2016-04-11T02:46:27+00:00

Taking her back is a terrible idea for a few reasons

You taking her back would be a display of low value, the magnitude of which neither of you have ever seen before.
She's probably alpha widowed within an inch of her life.
One of the aspects of this situations (there are few) is her throwing a sequence of huge, escalating shit tests at you (no sex for a year, leaving and wrecking you, coming back). So far you've failed every single one. I suppose you could take her back and find out what the next one is. Given the pattern, its likely to be exciting.

She went looking for alpha, got burned and is back looking for comfort in beta. Give it 6 months and she'll need more alpha, but she won't be able to get it from you because of the history. Go find a 25 year old, start fresh, do what you've learned here with a clean slate.

IASGame · 2016-04-11T14:41:53+00:00

Rooting through Garbage.

blarggggggggggg · 2016-04-10T18:41:40+00:00

She likely will try to get pregnant to trap you into provider role, then stop fucking you again.

ParadoxThatDrivesUs · 2016-04-10T21:31:52+00:00

You won't have leverage as the one who took her back. You only have leverage until you take her back. Then she has it.

IASGame · 2016-04-11T15:41:09+00:00

I have a better question. How can this guy have been spinning hot 25 yo plates and still not have developed a healthy abundance mentality?

Messed up internals I'm pretty sure.

[deleted] · 2016-04-11T16:59:42+00:00

I take responsibility for letting our marriage devolve into something so broken as the man, but also my responsibility only extends so far and the easier, more tempting option is to just keep going on this solo route I'm on. Finalize the divorce, spin plates, focus on a new career I'm working on and don't plan on remarrying for several years until my life is on track. Or I can salvage this thing and maintain the leverage I have as the one that took her back. Don't tolerate shitty behavior, be on top of my game, and truly live out the Captain/first-mate dynamic every day. Be ready to walk if she doesn't toe the line. Spin plates on the side and create an environment where she dreads the options I have. This is a fantasy I'm entertaining.

OP, your post reeks of trying to direct our answers, outlining possible outcomes and then try to show us that taking her back is the right course of action.

You are currently living your Plan A, pulling 25 yr olds, able to do what you want with your time and money. Why would you want to settle for being Plan B in someone else's life? No one with any sense of self respect wants to be Plan B.

ex_addict_bro · 2016-04-10T18:11:08+00:00

she was still in a long distance emotional affair with this guy

She is addicted. There is no such thing as "long distance relationship" or "long distance affair". There is a broken woman, sending texts or chatting on FB, waiting for reply, producing neurotransmitters in her brain, living in fucking FANTASY.

You know what it looks like? Like porn.

She is an ADDICT.

If you start to save her, you are a co-dependent person, deepening her addiction, enabling her to CONTINUE this fuckery. But you do WANT to "reconcile", right? You want to chase that high, because your mother or father hurt you and now you CRAVE for the codependency high, just like I did.

Guys, mods, u/TheFamilyAlpha, u/whinemoreplease, u/BluepillProfessor, hear me, LONG DISTANCE EMOTIONAL AFFAIR IS AN ADDICTION. This is what I found out in my life recently. Guys enabling a woman who is in a "long-distance affair" are co-dependent.

There is nothing to see here. OP, would you date morphine addict? ME NEITHER. What's the difference between morphine addiction and her LTR? For me, THERE IS NONE.

My ex-wife actually had a very low N-count and I proposed her a threesome if she wanted to try the strange dick (yes, I know, but whatever). You know, what she told me? "WHEN YOU KNOW ABOUT IT IT IS NO LONGER FUN". She DID NOT WANT SEX, she DID NOT WANT other dick. She craves the high that the cheating addiction gives her. And you can easily cheat with FB or phone. That's easy.

My ex-wife was in that "long-distance emotional relationship" before I met her. There was that guy she spoke with over phone for a year or two before she met me. This was long before Facebook and shit, they used PHONE, a frigging phone is enough to trigger this fantasy addiction. She met him ONCE but still after 8 or 10 years she craved to contact him, right after I GOT SOBER. I tried to save this marriage using TRP, MRP and whatever you call it but I failed miserably because I did not actually consider being a CODEPENDENT ENABLER. I managed her to break contact only to find her contacting next guy using the same schema after a few months. Me being sober and present at home did NOT matter. Having 3 kids did NOT matter.

SHE WANTS HER FIX.

OP, do you really want to be Captain Save-a-hoe? Are you really codependent?

There is NOTHING to salvage, she does INTRAVENOUS MORPHINE, SHE CRAVES THAT, what do you want to save her from?

I actually wish I could cry now, but I can't. This is the hand I got dealt with, back then in the childhood, then I found alcohol and sex, then I co-created that relationship with her, then I sobered up and realized all this shit. I'm looking for a flat to rent this week.

OP, if you want to hit your bottom, GO FOR HER. Maybe you need to hit it.

I hit my bottom when I fucked her bareback few days ago she fucked a random guy from internet. Bareback. After 12 years of exclusive relationship. Of course she told me they used condom. Of course I believed her.

When you're codependent, when you are addicted, when you want your fix, your thinking gets NARROWED. She wanted that fix so badly she fucked him bareback. Then I wanted my fix so badly, that I fucked her too.

There is no hope for me beyond moving OUT and starting therapy.

And you ask for reconciliation.

I might as well have HIV now.

And you want to reconcile with such woman.

What's your point? Do you want to be dead? Because this is what such women are. Death.

the_Zambony · 2016-04-11T12:21:15+00:00

maintain the leverage I have as the one that took her back.

This will not last beyond you saying you will take her back.

You will be living a constant battle of suspicion, paranoia, and regret.

What you thought you had in a marriage and wife prior to discovery, is gone, long gone. The woman who is now begging at your feet is not the same woman. She is no longer the woman you met, fell in love with, married, and started a life with.

Don't tolerate shitty behavior, be on top of my game, and truly live out the Captain/first-mate dynamic every day. Be ready to walk if she doesn't toe the line. Spin plates on the side and create an environment where she dreads the options I have. This is a fantasy I'm entertaining.

You can do this with any woman. EDIT So why do this with someone who already cannot "toe the line?" END EDIT Follow through on the divorce and if you can handle it, treat your ex as any other plate.

Check out, Talk About Marriage - Coping with Infidelity for some insight from experienced guys. Shamwow and bff are legendary posters.

[deleted] · 2016-04-11T14:04:39+00:00

I am 32 years old and have been married for 5 years. With her for 10. No kids.

I don't need to read any further. I don't need to know anything else.

End it. End it now.

There is no reason whatsoever to save a marriage like this (or any legal marriage whatsoever) when there are no children to protect or provide for.

Just put the marriage out of its misery. Get a divorce, and move on.

[deleted] · 2016-04-11T14:09:06+00:00

Can anyone relate to my fucked up situation? Has anyone ever salvaged a fucked up marriage and made it work? Or did you find that starting fresh was better long-term?

I salvaged a fucked up marriage, but only because there were kids to provide for and protect. And my wife didn't separate from me and run off with another guy.

This is different. No kids. Your wife tried and failed to branch swing. She's telling you "I couldn't get a better guy; so I'll just come back to you because this better guy wouldn't commit to me."

Fuck that. Dump her, end it now.

PurpleVeteran · 2016-04-10T21:30:59+00:00

From your description, this wasn't a spur of the moment failure because you were inattentive or unavailable, but a deliberate and long-term relationship. She wasn't feeling low and lonely, but really was looking to upgrade her life with someone she connected with. And it failed.

This doesn't sound like someone an adrenaline junkie, prone to sneaking around and one night stands, but someone looking for emotional validation and branch swinging. Or maybe she is, and this Chad was so alpha that she was pulled into his orbit.

Regardless, you're welcome to give it a shot. Draw a bright line for her: zero-tolerance and you get the passwords to all of her devices/accounts. Make her rebuild your trust, and remind her that it may take years. Enjoy your time together, but keep in mind exactly what she's capable of. Don't let her get pregnant until you are rock-solid that this was just an isolated rough patch, and not the first episode of a repeating pattern, because marriages will have ups and downs over time -- and you don't want to be a decade in, with 2 kids, when she longs for her Bridges of Madison County moment.

red-pill-man · 2016-04-10T23:54:08+00:00

You understand nothing you have learned. Be gone, troll.

ex_addict_bro · 2016-04-11T10:19:58+00:00

Hell, I actually read your post. Cut all contact now.

PBRistasty · 2016-04-11T15:03:41+00:00

She didnt come crying back to you after 8 months becuase she realized you were her true love. She did it because after 8 months of fucking the other guy, it didnt work out for some reason(s).

Finish the divorce and send her on her way. A few years from now, when your actually over your one-iteis, plate her as your bottom bitch.