~ archived since 2018 ~

Saying No

March 22, 2012

As I’ve talked about many times and in many places, outcome independence is one of the key factors in attracting women to you as well as keeping them attracted for a long time.

I had an experience a while ago that I’ll talk about in a minute.  It hit me that much of outcome independence is simply saying “no” to women.  (Of course getting into the habit of saying “no” has tremendous applications in life and business too.)

Saying no to her opinions.  Not being afraid to disagree with her, especially on the first date when you’re not “comfortable” with her yet.

Saying no to what she wants to go do.

Saying no to spending money on her.

Saying no to her demands.

Saying no to being involved her drama.

Saying no to monogamy or “being exclusive”.

Saying no when she begs for sex without birth control.

Saying no to moving in together.

Saying no to marriage (at least the traditional kind).

When you say no to a woman it subcommunicates the message “I don’t need you,” which one of the most attractive messages you can telegraph to a woman, especially if she’s very good-looking or is used to men constantly trying to fuck her (which frankly is most women, even the chubby or ugly ones).

There’s a woman in my life who I’ll call Sandra.  Mid 20’s, very hot, very smart career woman.  She’s one of those few women in that odd category where we’ve gone out two or three times over the course of a year or two, have been very sexual, but never gotten all the way to sex.  Of course, no sex = I bail.  So I hadn’t seen her in a long while.

A few months back she notified me she was going back to her ex-boyfriend, which is something she’s done before.  So I did what I always do.  I told her I thought that was great, completely cut off all contact with her, went to my spreadsheets and put her on the “Do Not Contact” and “Check Back In With Her In A Few Months” lists.

That was about six months ago.  I have not contacted her since.  A while back sent me a private “Hey how’s it going?” message on Facebook.  Allow me to translate this from woman to English.  “Hey how’s it going” sent out of the clear blue means “Hi.  My boyfriend and I just broke up and you’ve been my secondary backup all this time, so now I’m ready to proceed with dating you.”

We fluff talked for a bit and then I asked about her “boyfriend”, even though I already knew he was long gone by the time I asked the question (or she would not have contacted me).  Here’s some of our real our conversation with my comments.


How is your man? And your little one?

I added the question about her daughter to make the question more swallowable.


My little one is wonderful and stubborn and brilliant and beautiful. ð

…..and I’m not seeing him anymore. We are much better friends.

Big shock.  It’s time to proceed to nail down a meet.  As usual, I get down to this key issue as fast as possible. Otherwise I’m just wasting my time.  Only women who have a date scheduled with me on the calendar deserve my valuable time to “talk”.  Otherwise I’m outta there.  You should assume a similar attitude.

At the same time,  I’m not going to meet up with her again if we’re not going to end up having sex.  So I need to qualify my request.  Here’s how I did it.


Stubborn like mama. ð

Under normal conditions I’d say “Cool. Let’s hang out early next week.” However every time things begin to happen with you and me you have a tendency to go back to the familiar (i.e. your ex). So if you are really prepared to “see” me, then we should definitely hang out next week. If not, that’s perfectly okay and we can just be Facebook friends.

What am I SUB-communicating to her here?  A lot, actually.

1. I want to see you.

2. But I’m not going to waste my time.

3. I expect sexual and/or romantic activity if we meet up again.

4. I don’t care if I ever see you in person again.

I’m pressing her attraction button while avoiding her “turn-off” button (like not blatantly asking for sex) or her “make him wait for sex” button (like not agreeing that she’s “beautiful” like her daughter, just stubborn).  (Soon I’ll make a blog post about women’s “three buttons”.)

Her response?  It took her THREE DAYS to respond to what I said.  I must have made her think.  Or she’s just trying to play it cool.  A good sign either way.  Finally, I get her response:


Ah how messed up I am.

I REALLY enjoy your company, but at this point in my life, I am only interested in friendship. If you are okay with that, then we should do dinner. ð

Oh!  And she came so close too!  But no cigar.  We play by my rules or we don’t play.  So I send her this:


The fires of passion are too strong when I’m with you. Which is very, very good, don’t get me wrong. But if we spent time together as completely platonic friends, the result would * eventually* be frustration. For both of us. That may or may not make sense to you; if it doesn’t, chalk it up to me being an oddball. ð

In other words, I told her NO.  This hot chick, used to being slobbered over by men her whole life, had a man say NO to her.  A very nice “no”, to be sure.  I even gave her a way out so she would not feel bad.  I also used a little logic, which is dangerous, but she’s a logical corporate type and someone I already know reasonably well.

That being said, I fought my guy-logic urge to say “You won’t understand this, since you’re a woman,” (since that would just start an argument) and replaced it with some self-deprecating humor instead.  But it’s a big fat NO nonetheless.  Ohhhhhhhh shit.  She’s not used to that.  Not at all.

Her response is two things.  First, she sends me this message:


Boo ð

Then she puts a status update/wall post on her own page talking about how she “has feelings” and implied that she felt bad.  (I’m not going to post here exactly what she said to protect her anonymity.)

Ah yes.  This is one gal who is not used to being told “no” from men.

In the end,

1. I maintained my frame.

2. Didn’t waste any of my time or money on something that would not end up in sex.

3. Maintained whatever attraction she does have for me.

4. Maintained her as a strong possibility for the future.

We’ll see what happens…

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Post Information
Title Saying No
Author Blackdragon
Date March 22, 2012 6:32 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Blog Caleb Jones
Archive Link
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