Displays of high value (DHV) vs. displays of low value (DLV) in LTR or marriage

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November 29, 2018

I'm 41, married with four kids. Wife and I both work full time careers. I'm 6'1", 225 lbs. Bench 335, squat 425, and run a 5k in under half hour.

We all have slipped up from time to time in our marriages and executed DLV's. After all, we are red pill men, but we are human. I'm interested in hearing about different DHVs and DLVs that you guys do / have done and what has worked for you / worked against you, and how you made corrections and grew past the DLVs you were making.

Here are a few of mine...

Some of my personal DHVs

  1. I promote and lead my family with healthy eating habits and exercise. I do all the cooking, but share in meal planning with my wife. I make the choices, but allow and welcome her input. Our whole family is active. We hike, run, kids play sports, and enjoy the outdoors. My wife loves that I lead in this way.

  2. I control our finances 100%. I have owned my own business for 20 years and make a good living. My wife has a great government job and provides our health insurance and she has a great retirement pension. I pay all the bills, manage the money, and save for our family. We don't and have not lived paycheck to paycheck in many years.

  3. I ALWAYS decide where to eat when we dine out. However, on those 10% of occasions my wife asks to go somewhere else or has a request, I am happy to do so.

  4. I call my wife out on bullshit whenever I see fit, even if it pisses her off. I don't care, her moods are like the weather, if it's raining today, it will be sunny another day. Hell, sometimes I think she's sexy when she's mad... besides make up sex is always fun. Women are like giant children. See them as such and you're 80% of the way there.

  5. We have a full time nanny / housekeeper. When we hired her a few years back, I made the decision to hire help, I ran the ad and I did the preliminary interviewing and screening. When I chose my top three candidates, I set up a round of second interviews and invited my wife to meet each candidate and sit in on the second interviews. When I made my final choice (with her input of course), we ended up hiring a great woman that has become a part of our family.

  6. I take care of the house maintenance. I do most of the work myself, but hire out what I can't do. I don't rely on my wife to take care of any of that.

  7. I do all the vacation planning and booking. Of course, I get her input and we talk, but I buy the plane tickets, reserve hotels, etc.

  8. I enjoy my male friends and my hobbies when I want to. I want my sons to have that same value, so sometimes I bring them if it's appropriate (i.e. baseball games, fishing trips, etc)

Here are some of my past mistakes and DLVs

  1. I desire and have a need for physical affection. Sex of course, but also just touching and holding hands with my wife. I have become grumpy and pissy at past times if she hasn't reciprocated affection or wanted to be left alone for some reason or another at selected times. I did observe that this type of behavior pushed her away and disgusted her. As I've gotten older and became more and more redpill, I've realized this and mitigated this behavior out of my life.

  2. I am forgetful and careless about certain things frequently in my life. For instance, I have lost several pair of expensive sunglasses and chosen to keep replacing them, forgotten my credit card in restaurants (this happens 3 or 4 times a year on average), lost my drivers license once and had to have it replaced, forgotten or missed doctors appointments. Most of my shit is together, but I drop the ball on selected things like the above examples. I've made several corrections to curb this behavior, but it's a part of my personality that I struggle to shake.

  3. When my wife and I have gone out, sometimes I've gotten drunk and said dumb shit. This doesn't happen often, but as I've gotten older, this has gotten way better.

  4. I used to DEER (and sometimes still do), BUT I've become more aware and am able to catch myself and STFU when needed.

  5. Sometimes I sleep in on Sundays. I like to be the first one up, but sometimes I get tired and lazy on Sunday mornings and sleep until 9 am (I usually get up before 7 am).

  6. Sometimes I'm disrespectful, rude, and mean to my wife when I am angry with her. It's very infrequent, but sometimes I act like a child in this sense. This has become less frequent and less intense over the years.

  7. My office at work tends to get paperwork clutter at times, especially on my desk.

  8. My car is usually clean, but sometimes it gets let go for a short period of time and is messy.

So, I've aired some of my strengths and weaknesses.... what about you guys? Let's learn from each other.

Let the comments and ball busting begin!

Post Information
Title Displays of high value (DHV) vs. displays of low value (DLV) in LTR or marriage
Author dll142
Upvotes 29
Comments 28
Date 29 November 2018 05:35 AM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit askMRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/203767
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/a1eiwq/displays_of_high_value_dhv_vs_displays_of_low/
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Red Pill terms found in post:
DHVDLVDEERlong term relationshipthe red pill

[–]40mullet13 points14 points  (1 child) | Copy

I'm interested in hearing about different DHVs and DLVs that you guys do / have done and what has worked for you

You mean like getting better sex/relationship?

What has helped:

got down to 10% body fat-wife starts touching when passing by

removing all my expectations regarding her body (weight) - immersion in bed is way higher

flirting with her friends/coworkers - wife starts initiating sex

No butthurt after rejection - sex frequency goes way up.

going to events when she can be better than other girls - wife is happier several weeks after.

No DEERing - she stops all direction giving in passenger seat.

AM and AA - shit tests become half jokes.

Taking care of the house like living alone (no expectations from her) - she starts cleaning and helping.

Going out with friends more - she starts being more affectionate.

Removing all negative thoughts/talks about female sexuality - she became your personal slut

Started talking dirty during sex and daytime - look last sentence.

Being 6 foot 3 - she always want more babies :-)

[–]dll142[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Great feedback! The No DEERing one is huge, so is the no butthurt over rejection. When I get rejected or the "not tonight babe, I'm tired", I always frame it as her loss and assume it will come the following day or so (and almost always does). Sometimes women just aren't in the mood and that's perfectly fine. We are all human.

Demo of preselection is an art as well and can be fun. I find it works also with waitresses and bar tenders from time to time. My wife has one female co-worker that constantly hammers her about how lucky she is and how attractive her husband is (I know this because my wife shows me the texts and she's said it in front of us several times). Her friend is a 7 at best, but you are right, that shit turns women on just for the fact that her man is wanted by other women.

[–]screechhaterRed Beret6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy

You lack abundance

The ability to own your past with AA/AM is critical

Kill all DEER ing

Go on weekend or business trips without her, using radio contact rules only

Give her some responsibility to schedule, meal plan etc and go do something fun for you.

Stop being a fucking absent minded bullshit professor type. That kind of stuff can really make you unattractive.

Body fat percentage is a huge SMV increasing tool. You can lift and you can kill the BF. Just adjust your macros. Keto with 16 hour fast will knock the shit out of it, but supply the right amount of veggie carbs as needed

Read MMSLP. Do some shit unpredictable. Mr Engineer has all his shit so planned out she needs some excitement like a pick her up at work lunch or dinner

[–]dll142[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Great feedback and advice. I find cutting carbs has help in the arena of looking better in the mirror. Was easier at 30, but past 40 requires a little more work. Never underestimate being in shape. Women notice and love that shit!

[–]Fucty_Artsy5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

I struggle with some of the DLVs you have as well. Especially physical affection and lazyness. Youre not alone dude. Doing well now though in my relationship.

Your text reads like you seem to be rather stressed by all these things. Maybe you could improve by getting calmer and practicing mindfulness. It should also help with your forgetfulness.

[–]dll142[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Agreed. Thanks for the input. I do stress over my DLVs. I do need to relax more. Work has me high strong a lot.

[–]SepeanRed Beret5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

You forgot DLV no. 9: thinking way too much about how every little thing demonstrates value or not

[–]dll142[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Good point... sometimes I over analyze and think too much.

[–]red-sfpplusHard Core Red10 points11 points  (0 children) | Copy

Dude chill the fuck out.

Wanna know when I do my cardio?

Every morning as I walk in and out of the garage getting the five things I forgot inside as I try to get myself and two kids out of the house on time 5 days a week.

Sunglasses? Drivers license?

Fuck outta here with that nonsense.


[–]RedPillAtNight2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

One thing I do when paying the restaurant bill is that when I take my credit card out of my wallet, I leave the wallet on the table in front of me. When the bill comes back with the card, the first thing I do it put the card back in the wallet, then figure the tip, etc. Never forget my card when doing it his way. And I do it every single time. Helps a lot after a few drinks, it’s easy to forget in those situations.

In general, you’re doing great, way better than most here. The biggest thing is you know what’s up. Keep improving, and don’t sweat it so much.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

He would probably forget his wallet AND his card by doing it this way

[–]coachdad81 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

For newer guys we say get your stuff done, eat right, lift heavy, STFU, kino, dont get butthurt, initiate, expand social calendar and other simple rules to abide by. But the more advanced program is more high-level and less rule-based with an emphasis on internalizing value instead of constantly attempting demonstrate with any particular action. In 12 months make another post on value and I bet it'll be all about mindset with very few specific actions mentioned - that's growth. Great lifting numbers BTW.

[–]dll142[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Good point... I'm moving in that direction. All men should value continuous self improvement and move toward a more disciplined mindset. Thanks on the lifting compliment. Once you hit 3 plates on bench it gets harder and harder. I enjoy it. Lifting is a great way to bust stress and relax.

[–]adeptintact0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

I wouldn't characterize doing all the cooking as high value. Cooking can be thought of as more a woman's chore and comes off as beta to me. Red pill theory advocates doing more manly chores.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

If I don’t cook my wife ends up making Kraft dinner for the kids every night or waits until 6pm and asks what are we eating. My family eating well is part of my mission. I try to live as if I was alone. If this is a DLV to her then fuck her.

[–]adeptintact0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

If an employee does a poor job, the boss doesn't automatically take over and do the job. The boss corrects the bad work ethic through counseling. You are effectively enabling her bad behavior and teaching her that if she does something badly, she is rewarded by you taking over the chore. It would be better as the leader to guide her and teach her to cook better. That would be the more alpha approach.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I hear what you’re saying. However my wife was never a good cook, even when I met her. And to be honest she’s lazy. The plan is to inspire her to add more value by being more valuable myself.

[–]WesternhagenWinner1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I cook because I want to determine the quantity, type, and timing of the meal. Women invariably make girly food in girly portions.

[–]3legsbetter0 points1 point  (9 children) | Copy

As a total newbie to RP thinking, I struggle to see how these things can be neatly categorized as DHV and DLV. They read well as lists of successes and failures, but I don't make the connection you do.

Surely a DHV is an action that indicates high fitness as a mate? So things like passing shit tests, conditioning availability or being preselected in front of your wife. Most of the things you've listed are just positive beta traits. Quite a few of them may well result in preselection I guess, but then that is the DHV, not the action that led to it.

DLV list is a bit more on-point, in that a bunch of the things you list are either beta tells or failing fitness tests.

Great bench numbers by the way.

[–]fruitylad1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

When you look at the OPs list you will notice the DHVs are examples of where he is being competent and leading, this is what makes them DHVs. Being able to navigate the world with ease, whether its keeping your health/fitness in order, the finances sorted, sorting out problems with family members, the house etc and calling out bullshit when you see it is all part of showing you have your shit handled and you can deal with problems in the world. This demonstrates directly you need nobody to get on well in life and be successful and happy.

The DLV list on the other hand is a bunch of examples of things where competency isn't being shown, where there is dependence on other people and where he is getting frustrated and annoyed when things arent going as he wants them too. These are DLVs because they imply a mentality of thinking you cant get your needs and wants met, you are unable to solve the problem at hand, its too difficult for you to solve and you need others to sort things for you.

Rollo talks a lot about women looking for competency in men. A very good post on here which i cant find now is one about leadership, essentially saying is you have your shit together and set an example, people will naturally follow your lead, as is the case with the OP here with his DHV list.

[–]dll142[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Thanks for the feedback. If you find that post, please link it, it would be very helpful for all of us to see and pound into our heads.

[–]3legsbetter0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I do see your point, and I guess I was half making a comment about semantics. Douche move, I know I know.

I take that in principle you can view any and all behaviour through the "display of value" lens, i.e. every action or behaviour is either signalling low value or high value. And there's certainly elegance and probably a lot of power in that perspective. In your reply, you've identified a theme of "competency" rather than "value", and I think you're arguing those are one and the same? Not necessarily disagreeing, though I would personally argue the former is a subset of the latter.

I think my real issue was that the items in the DHV list are what I would call "necessary but insufficient". I can easily imagine a guy modelling almost all of those behaviours and yet still failing to command his wife's respect. I suppose due to poor framing. You could do almost everything on that list* and still have your wife at the centre of your universe, and be perceived and treated accordingly.

[* Admittedly a bit of a stretch for #3 and #8.]

[–]fruitylad0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Your definitely right that competency and value are not the same thing, you can be a very competent video game player, but that wont help your value.

items in the DHV list are what I would call "necessary but insufficient".

This is a very good way of looking at it, and you nail it when you said you could do everything on the list and still have your wife at the centre of your universe, eg be a very supplicating beta.

My original comment was just trying to highlight that the DHV list was in general a demonstration of a guy who has his act together, sorts things out, solves problems, doesn't moan or complain about things, gets on with life, continues to develop and advance himself and does well for himself, all absolutely necessary for a high SMV.

This gives an insight into the level of effort and the direction you should be taking your life to become a well rounded developed man with the right mindset to kick ass in the world and lead you woman, this is part of the foundation of a high SMV male. But as you rightly state, has to be part of yourself being your mental point of origin as Rollo would say, part of your strong frame on what you think life should be like, not a part of living within hers.

[–]oloug0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

You're thinking much too simply or binary.

[–]3legsbetter0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Interesting -- that's sort of what I thought OP was doing. I expanded a bit in another comment.

[–]dll142[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Thanks on the bench compliment... I'm always afraid of blowing a rotator cuff at my age though. Also, thanks for the feedback.

[–]3legsbetter1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

That rotator cuff's a gym bogeyman for sure. In my case I dropped the bar on my chest about a year ago and cracked a rib. It's taken me most of this year to get back over 200lbs, and I still don't lower the bar as assertively as I used to. The psych-out is brutal.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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