Frame advice with ex wife and kids

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April 14, 2018

Took the pill a year ago. Because of a beta bucks sexless marriage.

The pill brought to the surface deep problems in the marriage. Recently divorced after a roller coaster of up and down of emotions and good and bad circumstances.

My family is important to me, so once I stabilize emotionally I plan on going into monk mode. Without doing so, there’s no chance of creating desire from my ex to fix things. I know she loves me and wants our family. I was just so emotionally invested in our family that the separation and divorce wrecked me. Brought me back to zero. And I have become undesireable. She’s got some really biting shit tests and it takes everything in me to just stay silent or hold frame for 30 minutes with her.

My guess is it’ll be a two year endeavor.

Two questions. One short term, one long term.

Short term: I can’t stop crying like a little bitch when I’m around her or the kids, particularly on the day we switch custody(we have 50/50). I hold frame decently. And don’t let my emotions come out and show anger or beta neediness. (Occasionally I’ll stoically say, I want our family back). But it’s like a body reaction that I can’t stop. I don’t blubber or look down dejectedly. I keep my posture and stoic face, but they just flow. Any thoughts or advice?

Long term: I’m not clear on how to jump start monk mode. I have passive income that allows me to not work. I want to work and invest and focus on money because I enjoy it. But when I’m alone I’m a wreck still. I enjoy writing so I’ve been finding some dopamine hits from answering younger guys on ASKTRP. Prob need to master that then find a new hobby to master. Prob need to just think one day at a time. Prob need to fake it til I make it and find positive feedback loops. Any thoughts on things to tell myself or a mindset to have?

Post Information
Title Frame advice with ex wife and kids
Author alpha-zach
Upvotes 1
Comments 112
Date 14 April 2018 07:55 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit askMRP
Original Link
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Red Pill terms found in post:
alpha fux beta buxalphabetaframemonk mode

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (2 children) | Copy

The blubbering like a little sissy isn't a good place to be. I get it, I was there too once. But spending 30+ minutes with the ex while dropping the kids off isn't good for you. If you can't handle it, cut it short. The kids don't need to see daddy whimpering either.

Your emotional state suggests that counselling or therapy for you might be useful. But my number one takeaway is that you're living in the past. You talk about being invested and not wanting to lose it, but you're viewing all this through the lens of the past, not the lens of the future. I heard a great quote the other day that memory in humans did not evolve simply for the purpose of reliving events over and over. Instead, it's there to use to extract lessons for the future to improve your actions, and once you figure out your lessons you can let the past go. The mindset you need is NOT one where you look back on what you had and try to undo the past. That ship has sailed and all you will do is create a feedback cycle of desire which will never, ever, provide you with any satisfaction. Instead, look at where things are now, accept that that's the way it it, and figure out what you can do to make your future and your kids future better, and start doing things that line up with that vision. All you have is now, circling the drain of the past over and over isn't helpful. Sunk cost fallacy and all that.

There are good reasons that you've been linked to Rollo's "garbage" article. Trying to engage in a course of action and only being satisfied with the outcome (reinstate your marriage WTF) when that outcome is contingent on the decision, free will, and desires of someone else is ultimately a recipe for frustration and failure. You're much more likely to create a satisfying and fulfilling life by planning to engage with your kids as a dad to the best of your ability and bettering yourself - by now you have obviously seen a lot of the dark corners and unattractiveness in your mind as it is today, and working on that for it's own sake will lead you to a much better place than chasing something outside your control

I'd also question what makes you think you can give effective advice on asktrp when you're in such a state as you describe. That sounds inauthentic to me, and I'm sure at some level you know it is too, and behaving inauthentically will only lead you to distrust yourself even more.

Best of luck to you.

[–]alpha-zach1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

The blubbering like a little sissy isn't a good place to be. I get it, I was there too once. But spending 30+ minutes with the ex while dropping the kids off isn't good for you. If you can't handle it, cut it short. The kids don't need to see daddy whimpering either.

-totally agree. Good actionable advice. I’ll follow that. Except I’m not blubbering. I said, I don’t blubber or look dejected. I’m standing tall and straight. Silent without emotion on my face. But liquid exits my eyes. Largely I’m not even feeling anything.

Living in past: definitely to a degree. That’s something I’ve been slowly shaking. Mostly I tell myself, “ It’s over. Done. I’m gonna work on becoming my best me, then if the opportunity presents itself in the future, consider it a brand new relationship.

On ask rp advice, I’ve yet to see marriage related questions. Marriage is the hardest game there is, given our current society. But rp advice for plate or dating game is easy. Feel free to look up my commentary and give me feedback.

[–]UEMcGillI am become McGill, Destroyer of Blue Pill1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

This is where "fake it until you make it" comes to play. Get a broomstick and shove that broomstick so far up your ass you'll walk crooked for months. Keep pretending that's your backbone and ask yourself "Hmm how would I act if I had a backbone like this?"

Eventually it'll become second nature, and one day you can rip that broomstick out of your ass and in its place a strong back will have healed around it.

You may feel like a pretender at first, but eventually it will become second nature for you to have a backbone. Go do things that will help you get that backbone. Like go fuck some strange. Nothing cures a mans woes like going balls deep in some fun side piece. Ask Chad how fun it was to go deep in you exwife (you know she's gotten laid right?). Go be with friends. Pick up a new hobby. Do all that stuff to keep you focused on pretending you have a backbone.

You're in love with the thought of your exwife. Eventually you'll have clarity enough to realize she's nothing special. You can replace her and make a great life with her co-parenting with you.

Go pretend you have that life and the rest will fill in the blanks.

[–]2ndalRed Beret3 points4 points  (7 children) | Copy

[–]alpha-zach-2 points-1 points  (6 children) | Copy

Agreed. I understand.

It’s blue pill I get it. But I don’t care. Red pill is perfect for pussy but it’s not perfect for happiness. Tomassi is not God. Pussy is not my God. If I have a oneitis it’s for my kids, not her. I’m aware that I could get a higher SMV woman but there’s only one woman in the world that has control over half of my kid’s lives.

If it’s about pussy, I’d move on easily. At this point it’s about not fucking up my kids and regaining things I have emotionally invested nearly half my life in.

[–]2ndalRed Beret1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

You're in the wrong place then. MRP is a sexual strategy, not a get-your-kids-back strategy.

[–]alpha-zach1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

Good point. But I’m not asking about how to get my kids back even if I’m coming off that way. I already have a plan for that. Learn, grow, attract, regain frame, put family back together.

I’m asking about this weird body habit and tips on monk mode.

I would also say rp has advanced beyond sexual strategy into masculine self improvement/actualization strategy.

[–]RedPillCoach2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

put family back together.

If that is your goal, you may be disappointed. Love is like trying to go to sleep and think of nothing. Some random thought always intrudes. The more you "try" to think of nothing, the more and louder the random thoughts become. In love, the more you "try" the more impossible the goal.

Your goal should be to become a strong, attractive, masculine man with options- real, hot, actual options- including the option of getting back with the woman who divorced you already. When you are in that position you can exercise that option but until you are, that option is probably not even available.

[–]alpha-zach1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

This is 100% my goal and intention. I haven’t communicated that effectively, but it is def my mindset.

[–]ex_addict_broRed Beret1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

It’s blue pill I get it. But I don’t care.

So get the fuck out of here.

Red pill is perfect for pussy but it’s not perfect for happiness. Tomassi is not God. Pussy is not my God.

You know fucking SHIT about what is "the red pill" and what Tomassi wrote, so shut the fuck up and get the fuck out of here.

If I have a oneitis it’s for my kids, not her. I’m aware that I could get a higher SMV woman but there’s only one woman in the world that has control over half of my kid’s lives.

This is the same thing.

Being a man EQUALS getting pussy EQUALS doing hard things EQUALS leading EQUALS being a good father.

You know shit. Shut the fuck up and get the fuck out of here, because you already covered what do you expect from "The red pill": GETTING YOUR EX BACK. You want to be in a good shape so she will see "the need to fix things between you two and get back together again". This is STRAIGHT FROM YOUR POST.

Guess what, this is NOT going to happen.

You're a fucking piece of shit and I actually congratulate your ex for doing what she did.

You aren't a good example for your kids. They should probably spend less time with you.

[–]alpha-zach-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Thanks addict.

[–]maxofreddit3 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy

Here’s a different way to think about it.

What if the best thing for your kids was to see you happy & thriving in life (with or without your ex).

The biggest assumption you’re making (I, and many others have done/do the same) is that you can see the best path from where you are/have been. If you’re really honest with yourself (it ain’t easy) you’ll realize that whatever rules/thoughts you’ve living by got you here. If you want a different life, you at least have to be willing to entertain and at some times, embrace, other ways to approach your life.

I’m not saying that ALL of your rules/desires are off/wrong. (Wanting to be a proper father is honorable.) I am saying that it may behoove you to “try on” some other methods/ideas and see how/if they move you forward. You cane here looking for help for a reason. Not every comment is going to be gold, or gentle in its attempt to draw, pull, cajole, shove, or throw you out of your current funk.

Personally, I don’t think you have the frame you think you do, or perhaps could have a better understanding of frame in general.

As a general rule, when you’re laughing at life most of the time (instead of getting angry, depressed, or sad), then your frame is on point. Given your OP, it doesn’t sound like that’s the case for you.

Many people think RP is just about pussy, and while for many that may be the case, it’s been my experience that healthy RP leads to having your shit together...having your shit together makes you more attractive... being more attractive leads to more sex.

What are you back squat, bench, & deadlift numbers?

[–]alpha-zach-1 points0 points  (5 children) | Copy

I’ve never 1rep maxed because I don’t have anyone to spot. So I do 3x5’s across all major body groups 2-3 exercises per group. I try to keep it simple. Bench prob 190 max(I do 3x5, 160). Deadlift 150(I have back probs so I keep it light) I haven’t effectively worked legs into my routine. I’m content with my legs so until my upper body gets better they get less attention. Squats I’m slowly working up currently at 100. My first problem was to tackle weight loss because that affected everything. Was 225 6’0. Now 170, still 6’0 with about 10 lbs extra muscle mass from the start of my process. Currently on my second cycle for those who know what that means.

I completely agree with you on the best thing for kids is seeing me happy. That’s the goal. If she was bpd or particularly disrespectful or we fought a ton, I’m not suggesting we should raise the kids together for the sake of it.

Again, my current questions are about the involuntary crying and monk mode.

The monk mode has outcome independence. It will allow me to become who I want with or without her. If I’m that person, I believe she’ll see and likely come back because I see it in her eyes. I see it in how she interacts with me. We were separated for over a year trying to work things out and right in the middle had crazy monkey sex and planned to get back together for several months. While we were working out logistics, circumstances created a problem that I couldn’t overcome(her father basically gave her an ultimatum, me or him). I fell into some beta needy actions and lost her attention. Divorce ensued within a few months. I had regained frame but lost it again. In monk mode I’ll be that person again, but recognize if there’s hope I have to double down on that strength. If a SMV ratio of 1.5:1 is what we had and that got her attention again, I need to be at 2:1 this next round. I jumped the gun a little cause I thought I was ready to sustain. But I didn’t anticipate the Father factor.

Yes, it might be over. That’s fine. But I’m keeping my options open. I’m gonna be happy me, and in that process I expect to see resolution.

[–]maxofreddit0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

One of the biggest take-aways for me is that a woman is most attracted to you when you A - Have all your shit together, and by extension B - Don't need a woman.

It sounds like you've figured out that neediness isn't attractive, which is good. For those of us fighting the nice-guy tendencies, that can be a constant battle.

The involuntary crying thing might require some Jedi mind tricks. Can you make the transfer of kids quicker (less time to get emotionally overwhelmed)? Can you make getting the kids a focus on fun, and try to keep it quick and all smiles?

For her dad to be that much "against" you... is there something that we're missing here?

Fist bump for losing the weight... that shit takes discipline. Those numbers are ok for a beginner (depending on your age and back injury). In my experience, you should be able to back squat your own bodyweight for at least 5 reps, and hopefully 10. 1.5 bw deadlift should be attainable as well. Don't neglect the legs, they are the truck of the tree, and also give you more thrusting power ;)

Edit - I rarely 1-rep max as well, the chance for injury isn't worth it to me at this point. Though I do push my 3's and 5's hard.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

It’s been a week since this post but I want to thank the people that offered valuable advice.

Your Jedi mind trick suggestion worked wonders.

I first kept the exchange short, maybe 7 minutes. But on the way to meeting her told myself over and over she was undesirable, a poor wife, not a good fit, and just the baby sitter. It wasn’t angry or volatile just meditative.

This eliminated the crying 100%.

Thank you.

[–]maxofreddit0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Your Jedi mind trick suggestion worked wonders.

Fist bump dude... well done.

That first exchange with the trick was no doubt the hardest, and now you have at least one tool to get you through those moments. Good on ya.

Meditate, lift, and get enough sleep. Do whatever you gotta do to keep your chin up. Some days will be harder than others, but stick with it and it'll get better.

Give us a Field Report when you think you've progressed, always good to get feedback. ;)

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Lift. Check. Sleep. Check(when I don’t have an all night marathon going).

Meditate? I see TRP guys recommend that occasionally. Article?

[–]maxofreddit0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Sorry late to this reply ...

Reddit Link 1

Reddit Link 2

Medium Link

YouTube "Alpha as Fuck" Meditation Link/Story

Unless you were looking for more of a how-to thing?

[–]raringvt2 points3 points  (8 children) | Copy

Do you think she'll be in monk mode sweating over you, or will she be hopping on the ol' cock carousel? You need to get busy improving yourself, for yourself. Get her off the pedestal and make yourself the prize. You lack OI, and have a serious case of oneitis... that's why you can't hold're still living in her frame.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy

She won’t be in monk mode there’s no doubt. Cock carousel? I doubt it. Her social circles wouldn’t allow for it. She’d have to go make new friends. A dating app might create those circumstances for her, but it’s not her style.

Agreed on the rest. I have frame control of everything and everyone in my life except her.

This is temporary though. It’s a product of the loss and the decade plus of heavy bp emotional investment. Time won’t fix things but I’m finding positive feedback loops to get her off the pedestal and that takes time.

[–]raringvt2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Focus on improving yourself FOR YOURSELF...without expectations that she will notice, approve, appreciate or have any interest in reconciling with you. As time passes, there's a good chance she'll get tired of the carousel and you'll be in a position to either choose her, or one of the other women that will be interested in being with you if you're strong and interesting.

[–]ex_addict_broRed Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

She won’t be in monk mode there’s no doubt. Cock carousel? I doubt it. Her social circles wouldn’t allow for it. She’d have to go make new friends. A dating app might create those circumstances for her, but it’s not her style.

She's already fucking 3 or 4 attractive men.

[–]johneyapocalypse0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Bro you have an answer for everything and that's a big part of the problem.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

You clearly haven’t read everything. I don’t blame you though, there’s a lot.

[–]CaliEd2560 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

You don’t know her style. That’s why you got your ass dumped. She’ll be on the CC, whatever version of that is hers. AWALT brother

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Smh. This was 50 days ago. I’m an entirely different person.

Outcome independent. NMMNG was a revelation. Options like I never thought possible across all fields.

She sees it and is sending IOI’s. But I can’t imagine taking her back.

[–]CaliEd2560 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It took you years of BP to get here. Not going to change in fifty days. You’re either in monk mode, or spinning plates. Neither of which is the same as a woman shaking your frame.

True test will be first new relationship. Glad to hear you’re doing good though.

[–]BostonBrakeJob2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy

Took the pill a year ago.


roller coaster of up and down of emotions and good and bad circumstances.

You mean typical female behavior? Or was it you on the roller coaster being a big ol' bitch?

once I stabilize emotionally

There it is, you big ol' bitch.

there’s no chance of creating desire from my ex.

At least you've realized one concept

I know she loves me and wants our family.


Brought me back to zero. And I have become undesireable.


hold frame for 30 minutes with her.

How many fucking times in the last year have you seen a post or comment about how your frame is not something you "hold"? I've been here a year too, and there have been plenty. And why are you listening to the shit for 30 minutes if it's really that bad? Make fun of her and/or leave when she has crossed the line ffs.

I can’t stop crying like a little bitch when I’m around her or the kids, particularly on the day we switch custody(we have 50/50). I hold frame decently. And don’t let my emotions come out and show anger or beta neediness. (Occasionally I’ll stoically say, I want our family back). But it’s like a body reaction that I can’t stop. I don’t blubber or look down dejectedly. I keep my posture and stoic face, but they just flow. Any thoughts or advice?

My advice, quit bullshitting yourself. You're still bottling your emotions and blurting shit out reactively. Hamster it all you want with all those RP terms, you're full of shit.

But when I’m alone I’m a wreck still. I enjoy writing......dopamine hits from answering younger guys on ASKTRP. Prob need to master that then find a new hobby to master.

That's a hobby?

Prob need to fake it til I make it

Sounds like you've been trying this for a year's that workin for ya?

Any thoughts on things to tell myself

"Quit being a big ol' bitch and start leading my own life."

[–]DanceMonkeeDanceRed Beret1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

This, OP.

Plus, stop emoting. And your "stoic" demeanor is the common usage. It is an affect. A mask. What you need is a real dose of stoicism.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Agreed. But I haven’t ventured into stoicism enough to experience a real dose. All I’ve got at this point in my growth is the affect. It’s a process. This might be the first piece of actionable advice yet on the crying. I’ll start reading up on stoicism.

[–]Johnny-Thunderfrost0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

You should check out Meditations by Marcus Aurelius. It’s on the top recommended books on illimitable men.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It’ll be my next book I digest after nmmng a couple times

[–]ex_addict_broRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

My nigga. Added to friend list.

[–]johneyapocalypse2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yours is the most perfectly unfixable mess I've seen in quite some time. You have all the right answers, you have all the appropriate retorts, you have a justification for everything every dude has been telling you, but you are lacking the most important thing you need right now, which is clarity. You and your wife are not together, yet you are fixated on getting back together, and that in and of itself is virtually impossible.

However, in the same manner that you consistently reply to every comment here, with a ready answer at your disposal, you think, too, that you can control this ex-marriage of yours... a marriage that is no longer in your control.

If you could step back for perhaps a few days or a week or so and then view these replies and the context in which they're given and do so unemotionally and objectively, you would see the distorted lens with which you are viewing these interactions and the dynamic with both yourself and your wife.

It is disheartening that you are so incapable of absorbing the feedback you are being given and at the same time so incapable of moving on from your wife.

Man, you have a long, long way to go.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

There’s no doubt I have a long way to go.

[–]ReddJiveRed Beret3 points4 points  (11 children) | Copy

This is a jumbled mess like your mind is.

For most of you new guys you come in here putting rules and borders you won’t cross.

I won’t cheat.

I won’t get divorced

I want to keep my family.

You’ve replaced outcomes as your objectives. Keep going the way you are. You say you’ve been doing it year but what you’ve been doing is watching life happen only having some idea as to why it’s happening.

You’re denying yourself. Denying who you are.

Take the rules off yourself. Start blank. Learn your purpose and find your mission. Stop worrying about everyone else.

[–]alpha-zach-4 points-3 points  (10 children) | Copy

Cheating and divorce are outside of my frame. I recognize that I’m denying myself some biological desires. But denying certain desires is exactly how you become what you want to become.

I deny certain foods when cutting. I deny time wasting activities in order to choose activities that add value. Etc etc etc

Following desires isn’t inherently masculine. In fact, saying no to emotional desires or some biological desires in favor of self actualizing desires is exactly how we become who we want to become and fulfill our mission.

Since you can’t see the inherent value of denying “who we are,” I would propose your mind is the one in a jumbled mess.

[–]ReddJiveRed Beret2 points3 points  (9 children) | Copy

You don’t know the first thing about what you are talking about. You don’t even know what frame is let alone whether you have it.

Get the fuck out of here. There are real men doing real work.

[–]rp_findingmyway1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy

You're a mess bud.

Read this in addition to the Rollo article.

But you're really just better off working on yourself and forgetting about reconnecting. No idea why you divorced in the first place, but surely she doesn't find you all that attractive right now and you've got to fix that first. And who knows where you'll be or what you'll want when you do.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Thank you I’ve read rollo religiously for a year, so his article was nothing new.

But this is a good perspective.

I’m not sure why I came across any other way, but this is exactly what I’m trying to do.

A thought just crossed my mind. Is everyone reading monk mode as “I’m going celebate”? Because while I used to think monk mode was going celebate, I’ve recently been reading about it and ascertained that it’s not. It’s throwing yourself completely into yourself. Reading, lifting, making money. Some play time, but only for rest in order to revitalize.

If I have the wrong terminology here or wrong understanding of monk mode please let me know.

[–]raringvt0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I took the way you contextualized monk mode as "I'm going celibate" in that you are divorced and still have oneitis. You're not going to not be celibate with that paradigm.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I can neither confirm nor deny your assessment.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

This article was really helpful. I’ve read it a few times. Just wanted to say thanks.

[–]rp_findingmyway0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

No problem bro. Mehlman's got an interesting blog. Iron balls. Even though I have many years on him, I can and am learning a thing or two from him.

[–]40mullet1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

If i understand correctly you are using steroids and "crying like a bitch " is very common side effect. Fix that first.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Bingo! I didn’t tie those two together because of my difficult circumstances. But that’s gotta be it. It makes perfect sense given what I’m feeling/thinking, and I know how to fix that. Thank you.

[–]The_LitzRed Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Fucking troll post

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (14 children) | Copy

I think you’re saying something that I can get a lot of value from, but it’s just not connecting for me. Do you have an article or term I can look up to read more in-depth?

[–]raringvt0 points1 point  (13 children) | Copy

Do you even sidebar, bro. Read 'no more mr. Nice guy (NMMNG). It seems to me that you believe that if you do things to improve, she will love you and all will be fixed. That's a "covert contract"... You essentially need to stop having any expectations of her. Live for you, do things because you want to. Otherwise, you're setting yourself up for disappointment and more resentment when she doesn't do what you want.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (12 children) | Copy

Can’t find nmmmg. The side bar has a link to a course. Is that a book?

[–]raringvt1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy

May want to spend more than a few minutes on it. The concepts are easy to understand, but you'll literally need to re-examine the way you've interacted with other people your entire life. I felt like I had been punched in the gut when I read it.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy

I’ll take your advice. I often listen to audiobooks 2-3 times.

[–]RedPillCoach0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy

Like he said you can't just listen them. You need to think because when you finally realize it was the covert contracts that destroyed your marriage you will finally take the Red Pill.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

I’m not familiar with the term covert contracts. I suspect it’s something like expectations, but I haven’t read up on covert contracts directly.

[–]RedPillCoach1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Because you have not read No More Mr. Nice Guy. Start tonight.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Already downloaded. Not in a place where I can listen but it’ll be started tomorrow.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

Expectations is pretty close. You should definitely read NMMNG. Covert contract is a term from psychology that's pretty well explained in that book. It's basically when, in your own mind, you make a "contract" like "I do A, and the other person will return the favour with B". As in "I'll be nice, so she'll love me" or "I'll try not to make her angry so she'll respect my needs", or "I'll do the dishes so she won;t be stressed and then she'll fuck me". Or even "If I don't make waves, people will be nice to me and give me what I need in life". It's a common enough behaviour but there are problems with it - you're relying on someone else doing something in order for you to feel happy, ie you construct your world with an external locus of control. So your fulfillment is ultimately not in your hands, which is problematic. And on top of it, you don't explicitly tell the other person about this (hence the "covert"), which tends to almost guarantee your unfulfillment, and then on top of that potentially builds up resentment inside you about something the other person didn't do that he or she didn't even know you expected them to do. Kinda backwards. Glover deconstructs how a lot of behaviours that lead to resentment and dissatisfaction in marital relationships can be tied back to having created covert contracts. If a man can be honest with himself and drop the ego for a while, discovering his CC's can be a fruitful way of identifying behaviours and ways of viewing relationships that should be changed.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Thank you for the clarification.

The concept isn’t totally new to me while the term is.

Expectations is close, but CC’s seem to involve a little more. To date, I’ve termed this general beta behavior, but beta seems more broad than this also.

I’m wondering if the contract is the problem or the covert. I suspect both to a degree. But mostly the covert. To me, the Captain needs to set up overt contracts. And RP rarely touches on this. The strategy I see most often is to setup a covert contract, but give punishment when it’s not followed(she says she’s tired tonight, so go cold for a week). Of course, I don’t have the legal position of captain anymore, but I’ve been setting my boundaries when she tries to get things she isn’t entitled to or when she disrespects me.

On first thought, I think I’ve eliminated a lot of CC’s except for a very critical one of general decency and politeness because I’m a human. The emotion and pain between us is too much for her to treat me even as good as a stranger. So here, I’ve recently set a boundary, give her an overt contract, and take away my attention and ignore her for a few days. It’s gained respect and she now reigns in the crazy. Let me read the book, analyze myself and get back to you on this.

I’ve been immersed in TRP but not MRP. I’m glad I’m here now.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

NMMNG is very insightful. Thank you for the suggestion.

[–]rocknrollchuck0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Thank you. I’ll find the audio book

[–]ex_addict_broRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Can’t find nmmmg. The side bar has a link to a course. Is that a book?

And this is, a gentlemen, a man who likes to answer to younger guys at AskTRP.

[–]RedPillCoach0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy

The pill brought to the surface deep problems in the marriage.

Truth does that. If you are living a lie and you discover the truth then things are going to change. That can be good for your marriage or very, very bad for your marriage. If you think there is a choice then you should have taken the blue pill.

I can’t stop crying like a little bitch when I’m around her or the kids

I am a real live Life and Relationship Coach and a big part of my Certification was learning when a client is appropriate for "Coaching" and when he needs to be in therapy. You fit that category of being right on the line. The uncontrolled tears suggest that you need therapy but your ability to 'hold it together' at other times is something a coach could build on. What you are experiencing is a common grief reaction to divorce and it often requires unpacking and deloading before you can stop the tears. That means therapy or at least a grief support group, preferably for men in divorce. Or lots of nights out with the boys, or, most commonly, finding another love interest for your oneitis.

That said, I am working with Red Pill guys and am interested in what happened in more detail. I have not seen a lot of "Red Pill" guys getting divorced after unplugging but when it does happen it is usually the guys decision, not the wife so you are an interesting case. Free initial call, etc.

once I stabilize emotionally I plan on going into monk mode.

I am not sure if that makes sense. Monk mode is one thing that could emotionally stabilize you if you wanted that route and that means now but how does Monk mode help you if you are emotionally stable?

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy

I’ll take your initial consult, but only if you’re ok with knowing I won’t be a paying customer.

I own several businesses and know that this is a calculated cost.

I don’t need paid service on your level. I’m capable of figuring this out on my own and/or through free options like reddit and blogs.

I don’t want to bait you into the belief that you’ll get a customer. But if you think that consult can help you understand your business better and other potential customers through talking to me. And we can trade value for value. I’m game.

[–]weakandsensitive4 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy

I can’t stop crying like a little bitch


I’m capable of figuring this out on my own and/or through free options like reddit and blogs.


[–]johneyapocalypse2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Yeah but do you notice how at the same time he has a fucking answer for everything everyone has to say?

[–]weakandsensitive2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Wait.. you're telling me the obsessive need to yap and yap and yap isn't only coincidental to crying like a bitch?

[–]johneyapocalypse1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

hmmm guess I am.

[–]RedPillCoach0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Hah! I like your honesty. Coaches don't do hard sells. You can't push a rope, like they say.

PM me with a number and couple times to call (Eastern Time) or contact me through the web site.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Assuming value, I’ll be glad to refer if someone wants this type of service.

[–]weakandsensitive0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Your link is broken.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy

First OP I have been through a divorce. It is always difficult. You have to rebuild yourself.

In order to do that, most of us need to:

(1) recognize our deficits and

(2) work to correct them and

(3) seek out help from others

(4) accept help from others

Looks like you are working hard on (2) and (3), you suck at (1) and (4).

Getting good at (1) will just take time and effort. Improving at (4) will take a change in attitude, that is totally under your control NOW.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

I’m totally on board with what you said here.

I recognize a handful seem to think I’m not listening to them, and honestly, I’m not. Not sure why people want to comment on decisions that I’m comfortable with, rather than answer the specific questions I asked.

Whether their assessments of the situation are correct or not, I asked questions that relate directly to two deficits I’ve recognized(1) and want to work on(2). I’m not interested in other deficits others think they see because, as you said, recognizing them will take time and those deficits aren’t on my radar. And I want advice on those deficits only (3) so I can take action on them (4).

Some have given good advice on the general situation, you included. I’ve got new articles to digest, mindsets to embrace, and a book to absorb. I have one good tip on the first question, but nothing on the second.

I think the commenters are used to half baked ideas, people that don’t understand themselves or how to succeed, and purple pillers. But I am none of those. I’m very aware of my situation. I’m very successful and very self aware.

I can forgive it all, but without a quality and rational reason, I can’t sacrifice what I’ve decided upon. If I were that way, I’d just be changed over and over by whatever intensely emotional post or person came across my path next time. There’s nothing alpha or rp about that.

[–]johneyapocalypse4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

Blah blah blah blah blah.

Dude you love listening to yourself talk almost as much as you love losing your wife and groveling about it.

Skip the ex-wife bro you're in love with yourself.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

In love with myself? Maybe, but that seems pretty healthy to me in light of rp/dark triad concepts.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

When a man comes to me asking for help with his investments and the cash flow statements show he is spending too much and will go broke, tells me I should confine my advice to the investments, since he is comfortable with his decisions to spend himself into oblivion.

I then fire the client.

You're fired.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy


[–]johneyapocalypse-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Well said.

[–]screechhaterRed Beret0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Read the sidebar

You need friends and you need to get out of the house The more involved you are in other things, the faster Oneitis goes

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Definitely good advice. I’m working on that

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

YOu need to change your screen name... (actionable advice- as it's an ego-tell). Everyone that comes in with an XXX-alpha, alphaXXX or some macho-BS is usually a troll or just horribly in denial of BP-ness. Get a screen name that reflects reality or something that is not centered on your secret BP fantasy of using RP to renew (i.e root through the garbage) your "marriage". She left you for a reason, which is obvious.

Family is built around the man- the Patriarch and then branches out to the wife and kids. The ex is no longer part of this family, so you need to focus the kids. She can't shit test you because she is not your wife anymore... she deserves no more access to you than a stranger or a business co-worker. The fact that she can provoke you to this extent is a measure of being in her frame even after divorce, which is sad. For all extensive purposes the ex-wife is just a female baby-sitter that watches your kids a few days a week. Treat the baby-sitter nice/professionally that is all you have to do.

[–]alpha-zach0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

90% of this is fantastic advice on mindset, going into monk mode. Thank you.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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