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Wife came home late for third time in a month so I cancelled our weekend beach house trip. Am I over reacting?

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June 30, 2017
13 upvotes

So my wife doesn't really go out much, doesn't drink much, etc.

She has one friend who is married and lately whenever they get together my wife drinks more than she should and comes home later than she says she will/is usual.

Once about a month ago she said she'd be home around midnight. I got home around 130 and she wasn't home yet. I called her and she came home.

Another time, with the same friend, she went out to dinner. Around 11 she shows up at home drunk. Last night she goes to a happy hour with her friends, says she'l staying for an hour (until 8pm). Around 9pm she calls me saying she's going to dinner. I tell her she needs to take out the dog since I didn't given that she said she'd be home. She hangs up on me and doesn't get home til close to 11.

So today, she was all excited about our trip that we've been planning for a few weeks. I flat out told her I am not going. She asked why and I said because I'm not.

Am I overreacting here? I feel bad because she was looking forward to it but at the same time I don't see how to get through to her that she can't be late all the fucking time.


Post Information
Title Wife came home late for third time in a month so I cancelled our weekend beach house trip. Am I over reacting?
Author bikemike45
Upvotes 13
Comments 66
Date 30 June 2017 08:07 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit askMRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/205921
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/6kigh5/wife_came_home_late_for_third_time_in_a_month_so/
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[–]matrixtospartanatLVRed Beret17 points18 points  (0 children) | Copy

Something I learned the hard way; if you don't date/game your wife, someone else will.

[–]ArchwingerRed Beret21 points22 points  (36 children) | Copy

A lot of this depends on the dynamic you've established with your wife already.

Lots of married women go out with their friends, drink, have fun, and come back late. It's disrespectful if your wife comes back later than she said she would and doesn't check in with you or let you know what's going on. But your wife going out with her girlfriends at night isn't something you can put a stop to without looking like an insecure jackass -- which is what you'd be.

Here's my rambo story.

It's always been completely normal for my wife to go out with other moms in the neighborhood, to a classy restaurant or bar, drink overpriced cocktails, and be home by 10 or 11. That's a normal girls' night.

But one time, one of my wife's single friends came to stay with us for a long weekend, and several nights in a row, they were out at various pick-up bars and clubs, all night long drinking, and came back in the morning. Which is totally inappropriate behavior for a married woman in my book. My wife never ended up where she initially said she was going, and never came back when she initially said she'd be back, and didn't let me know where she would be or when she would be back when her plans changed.

So I confronted her on that, and she got uppity, told me she didn't need my permission to go out and have fun, I'm not her Dad, and she didn't have to report to me her whereabouts and activities. And I agreed. I told her I don't control you. You can do whatever you want and don't need my approval for anything. But my wife doesn't behave like a single person. If she'd behaved that way when we were dating, there'd have been no marriage, and if she behaves like a single person today, she'll be one.

She proceeded to rage at me, then text and call damn near every single friend she has, telling them what a controlling asshole I am, how I'm emotionally abusive, how I isolate her and don't let her have any friends or do anything, and how she's going to divorce me. She backed herself into a corner with her friends. When she finally calmed down and didn't divorce me, things were never the same with her friends. Due to all of the terrible things she'd told them about me and our marriage, after she didn't follow through and divorce me, there was always this distance between her and her friends. They stopped inviting her out as much for fear of what her husband would do. Every time they talked to her, there were these kid gloves, like she was this poor battered woman who couldn't get away from her abusive husband.

Things were never the same with that particular group of her friends, and she blames me for that. I did a bad job enforcing that boundary. The way I went about it was way too confrontational.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (30 children) | Copy

I went about it was way too confrontational.

same time in your life, you know then what you know now, and have your current mindset. what would you do?

[–]ArchwingerRed Beret44 points45 points  (29 children) | Copy

I'd shut my damn mouth.

I truly believe in my heart of hearts that staying out all night at bars and clubs and coming back in the morning is inappropriate behavior for a married woman, hands down, just on principle. This is not some wildly oppressive, crazy, out of left field, ultra conservative Donald Trump view on women. Lots of normal people would agree with that position.

But logic doesn't matter with women. All your wife hears when you tell her not to do that shit is, "I'm an insecure loser who's petrified that you're better than I am and you've realized it and are going to cheat on me and/or leave me, so I'm trying to lock you down to prevent that." And she will respond accordingly.

If your wife really, really wants to cheat on you and really, really wants to get away with it, she's already doing it. It's not like she needs to go out suspiciously, late at night, to get fucked by someone else. If she actually wanted to get away with it, she wouldn't be doing anything so obvious anyway. And if your marriage is so shitty that it's at the tipping point, and one night of drinking is going to send your wife into a bar bathroom to suck off some stranger, you're long past being able to fix it by talking to your wife anyway.

So you can either lay awake all night wetting the bed and biting your fingernails, worried that your wife might be cheating, or you can get some sleep and go to the gym tomorrow.

[–]innominating6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

Your wife was hanging out with a single friend and putting herself in a position to fall on a dick. There are plenty of women, and men for that matter, who will not actively initiate non monogamous behavior. And, many of those same people will fuck around with the right mix of attraction, plausible deniability, alcohol, and secrecy. It was reasonable for you to tell your friend to knock it off. It was stupid of her to paint you as the bad guy.

[–]TirionTheHallowed6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'd shut my damn mouth.

I truly believe in my heart of hearts that staying out all night at bars and clubs and coming back in the morning is inappropriate behavior for a married woman, hands down, just on principle. This is not some wildly oppressive, crazy, out of left field, ultra conservative Donald Trump view on women. Lots of normal people would agree with that position.

But logic doesn't matter with women. All your wife hears when you tell her not to do that shit is, "I'm an insecure loser who's petrified that you're better than I am and you've realized it and are going to cheat on me and/or leave me, so I'm trying to lock you down to prevent that." And she will respond accordingly.

If your wife really, really wants to cheat on you and really, really wants to get away with it, she's already doing it. It's not like she needs to go out suspiciously, late at night, to get fucked by someone else. If she actually wanted to get away with it, she wouldn't be doing anything so obvious anyway. And if your marriage is so shitty that it's at the tipping point, and one night of drinking is going to send your wife into a bar bathroom to suck off some stranger, you're long past being able to fix it by talking to your wife anyway.

So you can either lay awake all night wetting the bed and biting your fingernails, worried that your wife might be cheating, or you can get some sleep and go to the gym tomorrow.

This mother fucker always tells me what i need to hear. I think /u/archwinger is a fuckin soothsayer.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (8 children) | Copy

you are approaching it from a point I had not though of for myself.

I don't care if she cheats from the point of view of If she wanted to, she would.

I expect her to ACT LIKE MY WIFE. My wife tells me where she is going, keeps me updated if plans change, and does not leave me alone to blow off steam elsewhere without telling me, or my consent.

I probably would have taken the kid and gone to visit my parents or her parents. Where is she? Dunno, she left and has been out all night.

Or, I would have honestly said if she did it again , I was out. And I would have been. But what do I know, I don't have a kid.

[–]RuleZeroDADRed Beret2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Having a kid shouldn't factor into the praxis.

The boundaries need to be communicated and know by both parties, an obvious breach of the known behavior has to take place, then it's up to the man affronted to execute a reasonable response.

I can't tell from the post how well / poor the expectation was communicated, so I have no opinion regarding him withdrawing an experience from his wife.

If it was something I wanted to do, I certainly wouldn't punish me to "show her."

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I certainly wouldn't punish me to "show her."

no you wouldn't . but arch is mad, understandably so, because he even HAD to communicate to her that this is not what a wife does.

[–]RuleZeroDADRed Beret2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

No one, not even the Mighty Arch, is exempt from Bitch Management.

After a while, a high value man becomes the norm, and testing still takes place, cuz "too comfortable." She wouldn't be a woman if she were ever completely satisfied. He could be a Billionaire with Christ's benevolence, the looks and body of Ryan Reynolds, and a foot long cock made of Jade. After a while, she still might think to herself "I deserve all he is, but a DIAMOND dick too."

[–]drty_prRed Beret0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

I probably would have taken the kid and gone to visit my parents or her parents. Where is she? Dunno, she left and bas been out all night.

This.

Show her through your actions that this is not tolerable. Last time time my wife drank way too much and caused a scene when we got home. I left in the morning with the kids for the whole day. Came home with them and pizza. Put them to bed after I gave them showers and left for the evening. She got the point.

Same would apply in this situation.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

For all the talk we do regarding social pressure being the only real means to influence female behavior extrinsically, we sure are quick to say "noo... thats going to make you look weak..."

[–]RPWolfAlpha_as_Wolf_2.00 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

OK, so this right here is where I get confused on some points. I am still learning but I always hear set your boundaries but at the same time I hear DNGAF. Yes she would get the point but at the same time didn't it seem like you were butthurt about it all and giving too many shits? I suppose it comes down to the dynamic of the relationship.

[–]drty_prRed Beret0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

She was hung over. I left before she woke up. When I returned, I talked to her as if nothing happened. Calm and cool. Then I simply left after kids were in bed. Returned home, said goodnight and went to bed. This drove her mad inside. Was very indifferent the next day as well. Best believe after the kids went to bed that night, she fucked my brains out. I acted in a manner of indifference. It was my actions that caused her to out 2 and 2 together.

Don't get me wrong, she will get too drunk again. If when she does, it's a inconvenience for me, I will do something that causes her to realize I won't tolerate it. When she can't get off the couch and I take the kids to do something really fun, it burns her bad. You need to know what it is your wife enjoys that you offer, then withdraw it; without a silent treatment. That's the butthurt.

You say DNGAF as if you shouldn't give a fuck that she crossed your boundary. The thing here is that you need to have put the work in on your frame. That way you can handle everything out of your frame, at your own pace, the way you want to. DNGAF here is that you DNGAF what she thinks about your actions.

[–]RPWolfAlpha_as_Wolf_2.00 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Excellent response. Thank you for clarifying that. Make much more sense to me now.

[–]crimson_chris2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

Archwinger - I usually love your advice, but here I don't know. If find it a bit disrespectful for a married man or woman to be out late drinking and clubbing on a regular basis.

I agree that talking to her would be a waste of time. That being said, you are actively allowing herself to be in a position that increases the probability of her slipping and falling on some dick. I guess if she is doing this, there is something amiss with the Captain.

When my wife has come home late (not that often) I point out how it is inconsiderate (as I could have been out doing other shit) - so it's more about time management and expectations.

If someone's wife is doing this on a regular basis (drinking and staying out late), there is something else wrong at home. A woman who has a high value man at home is not out hopping bars and flirting with Chad.

[–]ArchwingerRed Beret6 points7 points  (3 children) | Copy

My advice is the right advice for most guys. Because most guys are losers or recovering losers who will sacrifice every inch of ground they've gained, and more, if they start whining to their wives about how her behavior is inappropriate.

Now I think what you're getting at is that every once in awhile, even if you're a badass, your wife is going to forget how badass you are and she's going to test you by pushing the envelope and doing something inappropriate. And at that point, you use about 4-6 words to correct her. You're not mad, you're not butt-hurt. You might as well be ordering dinner at a restaurant. You just say 4-6 words to remind her of her place.

You don't "care" that she did it. You're not hurt by it. You're just briefly noting that she has disappointed you. She did not meet one of your expectations. She failed. And you're not rubbing it in her face or demanding she change. You're just noting that she failed like you might note the weather outside.

If you're really a badass, that's all it will take for her to get back in line. Honestly, that's the theoretical ideal. Not the realistic situation most guys reach. But that's what guys should be reaching for.

And 95% of the guys who read this comment shouldn't confront their wives at all.

[–]crimson_chris1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Nicely said. I agree - for that to work you have to be a high value man. We own commitment. If you are not a man that is valued, you have no leverage in the relationship (your commitment is not valued). Anything else will come across as pussy, beta victim puke.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I'm missing something in my understanding of this, and I need clarification.

Don't confront to mean don't attack her emotionally about her behavior, don't demand behavior, or issue ultimatums. However, you also mentioned to say 4-6 words to her with a certain mindset that is not desperate or butt-hurt. I'm curious what those words are. After writing this I think I see your abundance mind-set.

[–]mrpthrowa0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

"My wife doesn't go late night clubbing".

end of.

[–]maxofreddit3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

So many men need to read this.

[–]TaistoKarhu1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Amen.

[–]WesternhagenWinner0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

OK, you regard it as inappropriate. So it's a boundary for you. How do you enforce that boundary?

[–]RPAlternate42Red Beret37 points38 points  (1 child) | Copy

the thing is... you can't. He isn't setting a boundary, he's setting an expectation.

He expects his wife to act a specific way, and he makes it known that that is his expectation. She chooses to live up to his expectations, or she doesn't. Just as he can choose to remove time, attention, affection, and marital energy to her. I'm sure she has expectations on those things but she expects them to be met regardless.

So what does a married man do when his expectations aren't being met?

He can go on with his life while rallying his troops, doubling his efforts unto himself. All the time, energy, and attention he gave her can now go to himself. Gym, hobbies, friends, new adventures. They can all happen... without her. If she isn't going to meet his expectations for "wife" then he doesn't need to meet expectations of hers as "husband."

And in the middle of all this she attempts to berate and push him with phrases like, "you're only mad because..." or "you're such a baby..." or other similar phrases used to shame him for having expectations and self boundaries. Expectations of a wife and boundaries on himself regarding his actions when those expectations aren't met. He's being a healthy self-person and she is trying to bring him under her thumb.

And he simply responds with a broken record, "My wife doesn't live her night-life like a single person and air our dirty laundry among her friends."

And he turns and leaves once again... continuing his new adventures.

And maybe, along the way of those new adventures he finds newer, younger, hotter women that happen to be better suited to the role of wife and are more willing to meet those expectations.

And if after all this she stills try to play the prisoner's dilemma mean card and play the independent womyn who doesn't need her husband to tell her how to act...

Then he makes a decision along the way: he has abundance, he has a life outside of the marriage, and she doesn't meet his expectations any more... even after laying them out, so...

why is he still married?

So he decides things would be better for everyone, especially him, if they divorced. Clearly she's not on board any more, so why bother?

However, if she finally accepts her malfunction, and submits to her role of wife as he has submitted to his role of husband, instead of acting as a single woman; when she ceases her poor behavior, then he brings her back into the fold of his life and goes on as if it was in the past.

Because it was.

This is Red Pill, for me, as I see it, squeezed into a single post.

The BP world out there sees expectations as control and sees self-boundary enforcement as emotional abuse. Any marriage counselor, therapist, psychologist, and psychiatrist will tell you that having expectations made clear is a healthy form of communication.

The BP world will say, "but you should talk to her to tell you her how you feel." And to that I say, "I did. I did when I laid out the expectation."

The BP world will say, "Forcing her to do something she doesn't want to do is abuse." And to that I say, "You're right. But I'm not forcing her to do anything at all."

And the BP world will say, "But you aren't treating her like a wife anymore." And to that I say, "You're right."

And you stop reacting to the BP world because the conversation will just go in circles from there on.

Remember:

  • She owes you nothing: have no expectations that aren't laid out.
  • You owe her nothing: You are not required to live any specific, assumed way.
  • She behaves in line with how much she respects you: she will do what she wants, but she would rather do for you if she respects you. Anything else shows a lack of respect.
  • You behave in line with how much you respect yourself: When an expectation isn't met, then you need to have a consequence in place that you act upon. If you have no self-imposed boundaries and consequences in place, then you will be seen as weak-willed and will be seen as lacjking a backbone. Stating said consequence along with an expectation is an ultimatum. Ultimatums are a sign of a man who has no other recourse; ultimatums indicate lack of options. Ultimatums are combative in nature.

[–]Bulk_king110 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

So say you think she's cheating on you. You're not sure. But you think she is. You would suggest just leaving the marriage?

BecAuse it would be ridiculous to put up with that or even to sit and wonder. And to say anything about it wouldn't do you any good

[–]Bulk_king110 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

So what do you do if the behavior persists. You just shut up and deal with it?

What If she doesn't think she's doing anything out of line? How will she know if you don't establish the boundary and shut your mouth ?

I have trouble on when I should be saying something (establishing a boundary or correcting a behavior and when I shouldn't

[–]ArchwingerRed Beret5 points6 points  (4 children) | Copy

The main idea is that you don't mate-guard your wife. If she wants to cheat, she's cheating already, and you'd never have a clue.

If she wants to go out drinking with her single friends, stay out all night long, and come back in the morning, she KNOWS that is not something good wives do. It's not something she needs to be told.

If you get butt-hurt about her behavior, you demonstrate that she's the powerful one. If you don't give a flying fuck if she goes out, or when or if she comes back, or if she's cheating, because you're just fine with or without her in your life, and by the way, all of her friends and neighbors want to fuck you, then you're the powerful one.

If your wife is misbehaving and you have to tell her to stop, that illustrates your weakness.

The idea is that you're supposed to be such a badass that your wife is super careful and goes out of her way to never do anything that might piss you off. Obviously, that's the theoretical ideal, not the realistic one most guys reach, but the main thrust is that the more of a badass you are, the better your wife is going to be on her own. If you have to verbally demand that she be a good wife, you're not accomplishing anything except for demonstrating your weakness.

[–]Bulk_king110 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I agree and totally understand, because it makes sense but in the mean time of becoming such a bad ass and getting you Shit together. (Which we know doesn't happen over night). What are you to do? I think the going out example is kind of obvious bad behavior compared to other boundaries that may need to be established.

I mean no matter how badass you are you are still going to be tested by your wife. She's going to get comfortable at some point and you are going to be pushed. Is there ever a time when you should be communicating things with her. Or is your rule no matter what just shut up and live the life you live.

[–]trp_dude0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

All your wife hears when you tell her not to do that shit is, "I'm an insecure loser who's petrified that you're better than I am and you've realized it and are going to cheat on me and/or leave me, so I'm trying to lock you down to prevent that." And she will respond accordingly.

This part is correct. If you mate guard, it usually backfires. The only exception is if a guy makes a move on her right in front of you that's so disrespectful that it's a direct insult to you, in which case you have to nuke him (not her). The best thing to do is to set expectations before this happens so that she knows the consequences. In other words, in cases like this, you have to pull a Pete. (http://archive.is/Hgt4Z and http://archive.is/R13oZ)

If your wife really, really wants to cheat on you and really, really wants to get away with it, she's already doing it. It's not like she needs to go out suspiciously, late at night, to get fucked by someone else. If she actually wanted to get away with it, she wouldn't be doing anything so obvious anyway.

This is not quite correct. Women often cheat when they don't consciously plan to cheat. They're ovulating, the drinks are flowing, and boom. Sure you can't stop them if they really want to cheat, but you can lower the likelihood.

But more important than that is that she's showing lack of respect by acting like a teenager. That's the real problem, and if you tolerate it, then that's a DLV. The only thing worse is to try to stop it in a butt-hurt manner, which is even bigger DLV. If you don't think she will snap to her senses when you bring it up, then it may be better to ignore it and work on yourself.

[–]SteelToeShitKickerRed Beret0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

She proceeded to rage at me, then text and call damn near every single friend she has, telling them what a controlling asshole I am, how I'm emotionally abusive, how I isolate her and don't let her have any friends or do anything, and how she's going to divorce me. She backed herself into a corner with her friends.

That's her problem. I bet she learned her lesson though.

and she blames me for that

LOL, I hope you laugh in her face about that.

[–]Progress_Set3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy

Why laugh in her face. This isnt a competition where the one who wins is the one who inflicts the most emotional damage. You dont have to agree, just STFU.

[–]SteelToeShitKickerRed Beret0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

When you draw a line, the line must be enforced. If you don't want to enforce the line, don't draw it in the first place.

If laughing at someone when they attempt to affix blame wrongly causes "emotional damage" well, I just don't know what to do about that. I think most people are more hardy than that.

Maybe you should think better of women, they aren't as fragile as you believe.

[–]Progress_Set0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Im not saying dont draw lines, Im saying dont leave such an easy negative image for her to remember. Unless your on the way out, then I get it.

[–]SteelToeShitKickerRed Beret4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Are you afraid of being an asshole? I'm not.

Edit: You are putting the pussy on a pedestal by thinking it's your responsibility to leave her with only positive experiences. Lessons need to be learned, sometimes through negative experiences.

[–]RPJMRP4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

The whole come home and take the dog out thing was ridiculous. The behavior as a whole wouldn't have bothered me. However, that is our dynamic.

Hanging up on me? That would be unacceptable. I take the time and patience to communicate as an adult should, she should follow that lead. If she can't deal with an adult talk as a couple, she can hit the road. With that said, I'm not chastising my wife for staying out until midnight with friends. That is acceptable behavior to me, especially when she calls to update me and tell me plans.

In reference to u/archwinger's story, I don't think he handled it poorly. He gave us a general synopsis, so I can't give my take on if it was too confrontational or not. It's a boundary for him, I say enforce it. If that's the marriage he wants, I don't think there's anything wrong with setting the precedent that staying out all night isn't kosher behavior for a wife.

How do you enforce a boundary? If you are a man of value, specifically an individual viewed as bettering the lives of his wife and family, I don't think you much have to worry about enforcing boundaries. You lay them out. She will adhere to them out of respect and fear of losing you. She's following your lead and is an increasingly valuable mate, then she will absolutely do the same. And you will observe her boundaries too because she is an asset to your life.

If you aren't owning your shit? Well there's not much you can do to enforce boundaries in my mind. It's all about what you are willing to tolerate at that point.

[–]nastynickdrRed Beret4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Thats a bad sign. Your wife regularly going on GNOs AND getting wasted without you is a really bad sign, not the behaviour you should expect from a wife that respects and is attracted to you. What you did just came out as butthurt.

Read this: https://therationalmale.com/2012/08/27/girls-night-out/

[–]ParadoxThatDrivesUs5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Here's the standard you should apply: Will canceling the trip cause her to have more respect for you, or less? My guess is less, but depends on the details. Are you ripped and have your shit locked down? Or are you a disorganized fat fuck who likes to stomp his foot?

[–]anotherswingingdick3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

I don't see how to get through to her that she can't be late all the fucking time.

By having her served with legal-separation papers

innominatung > Your wife was hanging out with a single friend and putting herself in a position to fall on a dick

...and it's become a habit

Stop trying to "fix" this marriage.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (11 children) | Copy

I do not think women can be trusted drinking until late. They are children. When a guy is out drinking he does not get hit on by every HB7-10 in the bar, women do get hit on by guys, constantly. For me late night drinking is unacceptable behaviour, but I would never get into a relationship with a woman who liked to behave that way. Did she used to like girl's nights and drinking before you met her?

I do not like sulky way you dealt with it but I agree you have to deal with it. You need to give her some boundaries but you have to have her respect first.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy

LTR men are placed in a double-bind. Enforce the boundary and be seen as insecure. Don't enforce the boundary and be seen as weak. The bottom line is women are reactive creatures. Placed in an environment of alcohol and permissive sexual behavior, they will fall on a dick eventually without fail. Just like you don't trust a thief to house sit, you don't trust your woman with her friends at a meat market.

She engages in those behaviors because she doesn't fear losing you.

[–]weakandsensitive2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

don't LTR a party girl. pretty simple. if she suddenly becomes a party girl, watch out and do your due diligence.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

they are all party girls...for the right man

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

If she becomes a party girl then that is the guy's fault. A party girl is just like a fat girl, they are both sensualists, to quote from Fargo season 3:

"A fat woman is inherently untrustworthy as she is a sensualist, she sees no real difference between a pastrami sandwich and a dick in the mouth."

[–]weakandsensitive0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

If she becomes a party girl then that is the guy's fault.

exactly.

[–]All_Ads_Deceive2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

The worst way to handle a GNO or girls trip is to tell her not to go or to sit at home like a chump paranoid.

My ex LTR went on a wine weekend once so I went to vegas with the boys.

I had a blast and she ended up blowing up my phone the whole weekend sending nudes and "I miss you/can't wait to see you" texts.

The next time she got invited on a trip I said "that sounds like fun, you should go. My friend in LA has been wanting me to visit him." She then invited herself to LA with me.

Women are far more likely to do GNOs if their man is a beta loser who doesn't get pussy.

Women will mate guard you, do whatever it takes to keep your commitment if they value you.

You need to be hitting the gym hard and not be a mental mangina for this kind of dread to work.

[–]bootymaster0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

This whole thread is interesting. My last gf became a party girl, and yeah it is my fault, and I tried everything - the beta shit like getting mad and pout and wait for her to come home, to just going out and doing my own thing, and in the end I ended up breaking it off because she was making me unhappy. The thing is that she knew that I could get another girl. We had a break in the middle and I immediately got with someone else. She knows I have female friends who find me attractive. And shortly after breaking up with her this time for good, I started dating someone else -- she found out and even blew up my phone telling me "I knew you'd find someone else, you never loved me, blah blah". I told her to go away and she eventually stopped texting me.

Even though I did have beta attributes, why did this not work for me? I was never a loser who couldn't get pussy. She was very attractive and I think that affected my behavior towards her. It's been difficult to mentally move on from this.

[–]All_Ads_Deceive1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Some girls are just "party" girls who are going to live the lifestyle regardless. Those are the girls you don't LTR.

If your LTR becomes a party girls while you're dating then it's time to move on. The majority of women won't go on GNOs on a regular basis if they're dating a guy who isn't a total pussy.

[–]bala-key0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Not a bad approach. But a bit trickier to implement with kids.

[–]mistixs1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I don't think men can be trusted drinking until late... When a woman is out drinking, she does not hit on everyone in the bar. Men do, constantly.

/s

But in all seriousness, alcohol increases rates of rape and domestic violence. Preferably no one drinks, male or female.

[–]ProbablyAMonkey1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Seems you've got a lot of responses already, but here's another way of looking at it.

If you did something your wife didn't like 3 times, and so your wife decided to punish you by backing out of a family trip, and she wouldn't even tell you why she was backing out, would you learn your lesson?

No, you would think she was being a passive aggressive bitch, and you'd be right.

The moral of the story, don't be a passive aggressive bitch.

[–]atlhartRed Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You sound not fun, controlling, and butt hurt.

Extremely unattractive.

You need more sidebar and a lot more not giving a fuck.

[–]allberklee1 point2 points  (9 children) | Copy

Yes, go on the trip and make it FUN. Take her out drinking until late and then have some sloppy drunk sex with her. Do fun activities during the day. Put some effort into planning this stuff. Then, carry this over into your normal lives: plan some fun night out to dinner and drinks for the two of you every week or two, and some fun daytime activity every other weekend at least. It sounds like she is just bored with your current routine--staying at home every night--and needs to get out more and get some excitement.

If you start providing more of that, then she should stop seeking as much elsewhere. If you just sit at home a sulk, then she will turn to other people for fun and excitement by default, and of course she won't be watching the clock and counting the minutes until she can come home to your boring couch. She's trying to squeeze every bit of fun out of her nights out, so she ends up staying out late.

If you refuse to go through with adventures that you have already planned/agreed to, then you will reinforce that you are a boring dud, and that she needs to find adventure/excitement on her own, or with other people.

I'm sure that she would prefer a strong, confident man to sweep her off of her feet regularly, if that were an option. Now, however, her only option is to go commiserate with her married friend. You can fix this easily, right now, this weekend, starting with this already planned trip. Let's go!

[–]Blunter-S-Thompson2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (7 children) | Copy

this is a bad joke I hope. its the worst advice Ive ever seen

[–]RuleZeroDADRed Beret4 points5 points  (6 children) | Copy

Award GNO bad behavior with a trip filled with fun.

Fuck, logic dictates giving her a diamond encrusted Hitachi Magic Wand if she stays out late every night.

Bitch management isn't optional.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

I still cant tell if its a joke or serious. Mods help!!!

[–]RuleZeroDADRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It's serious.

Posting in relationshits is the smoke leading to the foot rubs fire.

[–]allberklee0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

It was serious. The question was: should he cancel a weekend trip to punish his wife for not checking in often enough and staying out later than planned when she was out with friends. The second-rated comment in this thread is: " . . . if you don't date/game your wife, someone else will." I agree with that, and was merely attempting to give a couple of examples of how this OP could easily date/game his wife based upon the information in the post.

Here, OP appears to be married to a party girl. Either (1) he doesn't like being married to a party girl, and he should bail; or (2) he likes the party girl, but doesn't like her partying without him so much and needs advice for how to change that.

There were (as always) plenty of posters giving sound advice for scenario (1): leave. I agree that being mentally, physically, and emotionally ready to leave any relationship at any time is the essence of frame and OI. However, if OP has done his reading, then he doesn't need this advice, does he? Therefore, either OP hasn't done his reading, or he is looking for advice as to scenario (2). At least when I posted, nobody was giving any advice related to scenario (2).

Worse, OP was proposing a terrible course of action: to effectively stay home and pout all weekend over some old shit that really didn't even sound that bad (I certainly don't check in or come home at any specific time when I am out with friends), hoping to somehow teach her a lesson. Clearly, if he does this, then nothing changes: she's back out partying without him, and he's still at home waiting in vain for his check-in calls.

So, just in case OP wanted to effect a change other than divorce, I offered advice to cover scenario (2): party with the party girl by leading and gaming (planning the nights out instead of just tagging along with her and her friend(s)).

Now, if he hasn't read the sidebar, if he has a fundamental SMV imbalance, or if he has serious frame issues, then he will crash and burn. First, however, that's on him if he posted on here without reading the sidebar and putting in all of the groundwork. Second, if he does crash and burn, then leaving is always an option. At least this way he might learn something in the process.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I get that you are serious but you are wrong.

Id tell wifey if she wants to act like a single woman than we can make that happen fast.

And thats that. She either acts the way I want, or someone else will

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

There seems to be a lot of missing information here. But to answer directly...look up the phrase: Cut off your nose to spite your face.

WRT her behavior:

Example 1: How did that conversation go. Was it (You) "Hey are you ok? You said you'd be home by 12" (Her) "Yeah I'm fine, I'll be home in a minute" Or more like (You) "What's going on here. You said you'd be home by 12 and you're out til 130. WTF?"

Example 2: Ok she went out after dinner and got drunk. So?

Last night: She is shirking her responsibility to take out the dog...but it was based on your failure to tell her in advance that she will need to take out the dog. Any time things come to a head like this ask yourself: "Did I lead? Was this failure based on me failing to lead or her failure to follow my lead?" If the former...it's your fault. Don't get mad about it. If you do, go read NMMNG again.

[–]All_Ads_Deceive0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

She's out drinking on GNOs multiple times a month while you sit at home bored and butt hurt.

Then you act passive aggressive with the trip. She doesn't respect you because you aren't acting respectable.

1)She doesn't think you have the balls to walk away. 2)She thinks no other woman would fuck you.

My advice is to 1)hit the gym 2)become a fun guy with friends and hobbies.

It's very hard for a woman to get commitment from a high value man. She wouldn't be out partying if she thought you had options.

[–]screechhaterRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Define you boundaries faggot.

She can't be late all the time ?

She can't be out late all the time ?

She had better take the fucking dog out ?

She can't hang up on you ?

Here is my take, you are BORING as fuck

This is the canary in the coal mine. Got it ? You are boring and unattractive as fuck

Ya. You over reacted. Displaying more unattractive behavior.

Read the Fucking sidebar

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Bitch Mgmt starts in the beginning and it starts with you.

Before you do or say anything, are you emotionally, financially, and physically ready to walk away?

If not, you have work to do. Start there.



You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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