So I married a covert narcissist... now what ?

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May 5, 2017
10 upvotes

Interesting journey, this RP stuff. Takes one places you never would expect. Fixes things in your life you never realised were at play.

So I went nuclear at Easter. Wife folded her cards, wants to be married to me. Along the way I had her read First Kill All the Marriage Counsellors, which repulsed her, but I did see some behavioral changes.

Last weekend she tested me with some disrespect, which I called her on immediately. She tells me she is reading a book. Later she tells me the book is called How to Disarm Your Narcissist. This week I learned that she has been to a counsellor. She had a session yesterday.

At first I am privately put off that she thinks I'm a narcissist. With her I AA it and blow it off. Internally, I decide that she might have a point. I do a couple online quizzes and my narcissistic score is average at best and usually low. Hmmm..

I decide that there still might be something to it, so in an effort to better myself, I dig deeper. I uncover a video called "A Codependent CANNOT Be A Narcissist. https://youtu.be/QUreWOILAvk

Guess what ? Narcissists don't search the Internet for information on narcissism. I'm not a Narcissist. In fact, I'm fucking co dependent.

Guess what #2 ? Narcissists like to label other people as narcissists !

I did not see this coming. My wife is a narcissist.

But the facts didn't make a lot of sense, so I dig deeper. And I find a video entitled "Covert Narcissism: The Wolf in Sheep's Clothing" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vi6GT8TMm8

This describes my wife to a T. Very smart, extremely high achiever, super driven. Yells at home, everything is about her, always the victim. Facts are constantly mixed up, even when written on paper.

Her community thinks she is an angel. Absolutely loves big meetings and presentations because they give her an audience. Work, work, work, altruistic, always bubbly, always helping other people. Even works in the mental health field.

Now things start making sense. Now I understand our relationship, why she is hyper critical of me, super work focused, always busy, doesn't give much to the relationship.

It especially explains why my wife needs to discuss our relationship issues in detail with no less than about 6 of her friends. Narcissists need to convince the people around them that they are right.

Thankfully, all the RP stuff I have been doing has been disarming my co dependency ! I'm bettering myself, going out with friends, getting strong and fit, STFU, standing up for myself, AAing her crap, etc. I feel great.

The problem is that the better I feel and the more assertive I get in the relationship, the stronger the crap she throws my way. This explains a lot about how our relationship has changed in the last 8-12 months.

Digging deeper, I find a video entitled "When You Unmask a Covert Narcissist, RUN, But Quietly. https://youtu.be/3an9crV9feM

I think the video is spot on. In our 10 years together, I have never once "won" an argument with my wife, where I convinced her of something.

Then I come to some hard realizations.

There is no way that I will ever have a fulfilling relationship with this woman. There is no way I will ever mean as much to her as her work. There is no way I will ever be admired or complimented, because that would bring her down just a bit.

This isn't about me ! I'm a strong, handsome, intelligent, caring, hard working guy. <-- That is my self love speaking up for me. I have codependent ways, which I am gradually breaking free of. I deserve better than this.

I'm in shock. I did not see this coming, especially not the finality of it.

My codependency is probably keeping me hooked in the relationship. It is probably clouding my judgement. It is what keeps me invested in the relationship in spite of her being fat, mean, unattractive and unresponsive to my needs.

So now what ?

Is the video right that I should just pull the pin and quietly walk away ? Call her on it ? Tell some of her cohorts so that they aren't feeding her ? Try to get her help ?

What about our children ? How are they going to survive through all this ?


Post Information
Title So I married a covert narcissist... now what ?
Author ImSteveMcQueen
Upvotes 10
Comments 56
Date 05 May 2017 05:03 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit askMRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/206191
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/69fxy5/so_i_married_a_covert_narcissist_now_what/
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Red Pill terms found in post:
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Comments

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (3 children) | Copy

Til your wife loves anal, you got your head all the way up there.

Now that you know shes lucifers daughter, you ready to go all in on your map? Is it ok?

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I've been all in on my MAP for 8+ months. That is the one thing I got right in all this. Thanks, guys.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Your MAP:

  1. Figure out what's wrong with my wife

  2. Ask MRP what I should do about my wife, now that I know whats wrong with her

[–]fuckmrpRed Beret7 points8 points  (3 children) | Copy

Stop with the self diagnosis shit. This is no different then becoming a hypochondriac because your tummy hurts and the internet says its cancer.

First let me show you something:

my wife needs to discuss our relationship issues in detail with no less than about 6 of her friends. AWALT

Yells at home, everything is about her, always the victim. Facts are constantly mixed up, even when written on paper. AWALT

The problem is that the better I feel and the more assertive I get in the relationship, the stronger the crap she throws my way. AWALT

See a pattern, Solipsism can look alot like narcissism.

I have never once "won" an argument with my wife, where I convinced her of something.

This is weakness

There is no way that I will ever have a fulfilling relationship with this woman. There is no way I will ever mean as much to her as her work. There is no way I will ever be admired or complimented, because that would bring her down just a bit.

This is butt hurt. You are seeking validation.

This isn't about me !

Actually its only about you. You view your position from a point of weakness. If she is a narcissist, the game only continues while you choose to play. Fix your codependency, fix your weak frame, man the fuck up.

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

If she is a narcissist, the game only continues while you choose to play. Fix your codependency, fix your weak frame, man the fuck up.

I'm up for this, but is it being a man or a codependent ?

Or is manning up to this leaving ?

I'm out for my own happiness, right ? I'd rather a new partner in life that fight an uphill battle any more. Did you watch the covert narcissist videos ?

[–]fuckmrpRed Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'm up for this, but is it being a man or a codependent ? Or is manning up to this leaving ?

What the fuck are you trying to ask me here? Okay I'll spoon feed you...

If she is a narcissist, good chance you have co-dependency issues. If you display co-dependent behavior good chance you have childhood issue to workout. Stop worrying about her narcissism and focus on your co-dependency.

Co-dependency is guaranteed shit frame. Until you fix your shit you will continue to fuck up this marriage and anything in the future. Once you have a solid frame her games will lose power because you will not play them. Her bullshit will bounce off of you.

I'm out for my own happiness, right ? I'd rather a new partner in life that fight an uphill battle any more. Did you watch the covert narcissist videos ?

Are you going to leave your children with a narcissist?

No, fuck happiness. What makes you happy, a list of bullshit, a chocolate chip cookie? If life does not feel uphill you are not pushing yourself. You do not need a partner you need a mission and then maybe a participant. I didn't watch the videos I live this shit.

[–]Eastuss0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This is weakness

This is shallow. Some people will just never say "you're right" and "I'm sorry", EVER, no matter how weak creatures they are compared to you.

Wife never says such thing, but I don't care, I watch what she does and she does what I said was right to do.

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (1 child) | Copy

Sounds like you spend way too much time thinking about your wife. Your description of a narcissist describes most women at one point or another. Women need attention. That shouldn't be a news flash to you because you managed to find some YouTube videos at 3AM.

[–]BobbyPeru1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Exactly +1

[–]sexyshoulderdevil75% Liquid Sarcasm5 points6 points  (8 children) | Copy

I'm picturing you as a puppy in the back yard just chasing your tail like a maniac...now you're on the verge of just flopping over on your back looking up at the sky while wiggling around with a crazed look on your face.

You've just arm-chair analyzed your wife via some YouTube videos as a narcissist. Now, you may be 100% correct. BUT...there's a good chance you could diagnose just about anyone with anything if you monkey around long enough on the internet trying to fit the ever changing puzzle pieces together. Sooner or later it will start to make you go wacko.

You may have gone a little wacko, my friend.

A wife who's been married to a schlub for years is going to exhibit many of the traits of a narcissist simply to fill the void from lack of masculinity. Your lack of frame and dominance over the years created a vacuum for her "me me me" to grow exponentially. Since your emotions are all over the fucking place AFTER 6-months of MRP, I would imagine you still have a long way to go before she can start leaning on you and chilling the fuck out as she contains all the chaos and innner-me dialogue in her life.

I think you need to take some deep breaths and calm down. As the mantra goes, you need to unwrap you mind around all this and refocus on the basics OF YOU. Even if your wife is a super narcissist from the planet Narcissist, many of the tools here can put such a personality on their heals with a simple glance once you have true frame. Right now you're a poster of Justin Bieber with a single tack held to the wall being flopped around by some wind...

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 0 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy

You've just arm-chair analyzed your wife via some YouTube videos as a narcissist. Now, you may be 100% correct. BUT...there's a good chance you could diagnose just about anyone with anything if you monkey around long enough on the internet trying to fit the ever changing puzzle pieces together. Sooner or later it will start to make you go wacko.

You may have gone a little wacko, my friend.

You may have a point. Did you watch the videos ?

The thing that gets me is that she labelled me a narcissist and I felt enough shame, doubt and guilt to go look into it. And as the first video states, if you try to self help your narcissism, you aren't a narcissist. You are a co dependent that has been gaslit !

And if you follow through to the end of the 1st video he gives the example of the narcissist BF telling the GF she is a narcissist. That seems to be exactly what is happening here. And all this is consistent with my wife constantly throwing labels at me. And all the other traits of a covert narcissist are there as well.

My friend works very closely with a lady that knows her well. I'm wondering if I should approach her for a confidential second opinion. I hate to blow up the relationship if I've got it wrong, but as the video points out, bringing this up with my wife directly isn't an option ! Where do I turn ?

[–]sexyshoulderdevil75% Liquid Sarcasm3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy

Oh hells no, I'm not going to watch those videos.

You're not truly hearing the basics of the message here. That's concerning. Reboot your efforts and initialize the idea that this is about you wrapping your mind about how you want the world to exist around you.

Your wife could proclaim you a spider monkey and it should all be irrelevant. Your only thought should then be to pocket that reference away and follow up later and say..."your little spider money wants to get busy with some sex about now..."

[–]BobbyPeru2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah don't watch them. They're pretty convincing - total victim mentality

[–]The_LitzRed Beret1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

You're not truly hearing the basics of the message here. That's concerning

Steve here has been free falling since his first posts. No hope he will eventually hear what anyone here is saying.

[–]sexyshoulderdevil75% Liquid Sarcasm0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I glanced at his history long enough to see he's been here 6 months. I was surprised because this mess here shows he's internalized almost zilch. Time for the hardcore guys (if they haven't already) to dig into him instead of placating this nonsense.

[–]nastynickdrRed Beret3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Dude, have you ever read anything about projecting? About BPDs?

BPDs make you believe YOU are the crazy one. If you are weak enough, a BPD woman will destroy you and make you kill yourself. But in the end, its your fault for being a spineless weakling. The big problem here is not if the woman is BPD, narcissist, whore, or whatever, it is the man being a spineless weakling.

The thing is, she is the way she is. If she is really a strong idependent narcissist woman as you describe, thats what she is. Of course if you were a man she saw as superior to her and worth submitting to, if you were her Brad Pitt, she would be a purring kitten for you. Which seems like is not the case.

So, you either get out of your wife´s frame, start giving less shits about what she is and what she does and what she says and focus on being a man worth a shit, give it some time, and she may come around or not. If she doesnt, then you decide if you walk or not.

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Narcissists don't own their problems, they pass them on to someone else. Trying to self help on narcissism is trying to own it, do something about it. Narcissists are always right. They don't need to learn about something they already know.

At the very least my wife has gaslit me about narcissism.

[–]man_in_the_worldRed Beret5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

At the very least my wife has gaslit me about narcissism.

If she's a narcissist, she's mostly gaslit herself; that's kind of the essence of narcissism. You're just a co-dependent faggot who pays way too much attention to her frame.

[–]man_in_the_worldRed Beret4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Steve, Steve, come down from the ledge.

Take some deep breaths, STFU, and just listen to yourself:

In our 10 years together, I have never once "won" an argument with my wife

There is no way I will ever be admired or complimented

And then

This isn't about me!

Yes it is, Steve, it's all about you, and your co-dependent needs for her validation. Do you think Chad needs to win an argument with her or convince her of anything to be happy? Do you think Chad would give a shit whether she "admires" or "compliments" him?

I have codependent ways

Yes, you do, Steve, very much so

which I am gradually breaking free of

very gradually, Steve, as in maybe 2% of your journey so far.

I'm in shock.

Come down from the ledge, Steve, and don't make any decisions while in a state of medical incapacitation.

Call her on it ? Tell some of her cohorts so that they aren't feeding her ? Try to get her help ?

And FFS, Steve, resist your beta faggot urges to talk, and just STFU. Calmly and quietly go about your business of reducing your co-dependency from 98% to 96%, and focus for the next long while entirely on fixing you, not your wife.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

Narcissists don't go to therapy and try to work on the relationship. I doubt she's a true narcissist-- those people are pretty rare. Sounds like your typical type-a ball buster. I've got one of those at home too.

Yeah, protect yourself in case she's building a case to divorce your ass. But in the meantime you may as well have fun with her. Don't treat her like the enemy because that's going to make her dig in her heels even more. Kill your ego bro

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

If there is one thing I've learned in all this it is to STFU, work on me and let shit play itself out. It is fascinating, I'm getting a huge life lesson and the more I work on me the better the position I'm in when I pull the pin.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Look up post by ex-addict? I believe he was divorced from a bipolar type Narcissist. Narcissist type bitches are the most likely in a divorce to put themselves first (no surprise there) before the best interest of the kids. That means they will engage in behavior to alienate you from your kids in a divorce. Look up on Facebook or other Father Rights groups about parental alienation (i.e forcible removal of fathers from the life of their kids) to see how to protect yourself and your children.

[–]plein_old2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

In our 10 years together, I have never once "won" an argument with my wife

lol. Dude, there's nothing special about this. No man has ever won an argument with his wife! That's why wise men don't argue with their wives.

Call her on it ?

Terrible idea, I think.

Tell some of her cohorts

Another terrible idea.

So now what ?

There are actually subs on reddit devoted to this sort of question & topic (people married to narcissists). Maybe you can get some inspiration there for what to do.

There is no way that I will ever have a fulfilling relationship with this woman.

Well, if you're co-dependent, it means you are seeking for fulfillment from other people that they can't possibly give you.

No matter who they are, or how many of them you go through.

[–]screechhaterRed Beret2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

We must have married twin bitches separated @ birth

The only method to handle a narcissist is AA You have always got to the be the jester, in the house, out in public It is the only way to disarm them Yo u cannot not lose frame and show weakness, as in who needs the other most loses Staying in frame takes AA and solid fucking diligence of OI

I have laughed in my SO's face for years I got serious and became the dick when I realized I had allowed her to control the gate. Now that I am solidly @ IDGAF, she is scrambling

Yours will scramble to take control as much as possible, but IDGAF, OI and AA can disarm her fiercely and allow you to show serious attraction to a point Don't fall into her frame, even while weak this is her controlling and manipulation of flipping shit on your fast

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I've gotten seriously good at AA and STFU. My wife is scrambling. Watch the videos and you'll understand why it is not good to keep interacting with a narcissist, even if you are (or think you are) in control. If you are involved with a true narcissist and they figure out they are not in control, they just up the ante. And it will continue that way until you are dead. The treatment success rate with narcissists is extremely low. Covert narcissists even less because they've learned to hide it.

Just because i talk about my wife here doesn't mean I'm in her frame. What is the first rule of war ? KNOW THYSELF AND THYME ENEMY.

[–]screechhaterRed Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You give too many fucks. And, she knows it.

If you are at a point where you are stating she is an enemy, it's time to next.

This is not living. It is existing

I do not envy you

[–]sixdownsevenup3 points4 points  (7 children) | Copy

If she is in fact a narcissist, your assessment is spot on. But you need to educate yourself a lot more, and your planning for ejection needs to be thorough and spot-on. She is conditioning her entire social network (which substantially overlaps yours) to believe her. Be on the lookout for her gas-lighting you.

Something important to bear in mind is that narcissists can (not necessarily will) become dangerous when their lies and/or narrative is about to be exposed. This could be directed at you, or your children.

I find the following to be a good resource on dealing with this: http://www.anonymousconservative.com/blog/on-strategies-for-dealing-with-narcissists-in-family-and-social-circles/

That same author has a book out that has been very helpful to me dealing with narcissists in my life: http://www.castaliahouse.com/downloads/how-to-deal-with-narcissists/

[–]sixdownsevenup3 points4 points  (4 children) | Copy

A thought to consider is that she is using her counselor to set her up for custody in a divorce battle by convincing them that you are the narcissist.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy

Of course she is. Women build Consensus. Op thinks she worked on them, shes working on her.

He is working on them

Op, she is not on your team, stop trying to make her the bq housewife you want

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

My wife spent a good portion of Easter weekend on the phone with friends, "trying to figure things out". I know she contacted at least 4 of them and I know that last night after her counselling session she reached out to another. With the counsellor, that is 6 different people.

I haven't really discussed this with anyone. My wife told my buddy and his wife that we were divorcing while skiing with them. I was about 100 yards away at the time. So my buddy and I have discussed it lightly a few times. He is supportive of me/us/our family, which is good. But I haven't even really dissed her to him.

If I was a narcissist, I'd be out trying to convince people that I was right, she is bad, that sort of thing. Really nada on my part in this respect.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Dude, no one cares if you're a narcissist. you're defending a 'reputation' that no one cares to judge.

at this point, she is building a conensus to go after you, judging by your history, you have a habit of missing whats right in front of you.

I strongly suggest you do some prep work for the worst case scenario. Because if/when she does pull out the big guns, you want to come from a position of strength, or you can hope that she doesn't hit too hard..

If you're 'fight or flight' response isn't on full alert right now, it should be

[–]freshona0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

You're about to get slamdunked up the butt.

Your wife is a truck. You're a DEER. Keep on watching the headlights.

[–]fuckmrpRed Beret1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Be on the lookout for her gas-lighting you.

This! Gaslighting is one of the most destructive and effective tools of a narcissist. If she flat out denies shit you know to be true, making you think you're crazy, I'd say thats a sure indicator of narcissism.

And as bad as that shit is it to can be overcome with a solid frame and a healthy dose of IDGAF.

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

And as bad as that shit is it to can be overcome with a solid frame and a healthy dose of IDGAF.

^ That is gold, right there.

[–]The_LitzRed Beret1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

You are on the right track, not because you discovered you are married to Lucifers daughter, but that you are now starting to get the message that it is all about you and you need to do what you want.

About the narcissism, I know too little about psychology, but to me it just sounds like a her being a bitch. Maybe bitchiness now has an official title.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

thelastpsychologist.com has a great series of articles on it.

RP, you would use it almost interchangeably with solipsism

[–]innominating1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

She's fat? Why haven't you divorced her!

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

When you described the book ultimatum a couple weeks ago, a few guys suggested that you were seeing temporary compliance, negotiated good behaviour, not actual acceptance. And now you're here describing her bad behaviour and disrespect escalating. Huh. Go figure.

A month ago, you write that you were totally unplugged. Now you write that you're codependent. I think you're on the right track now, but this suggests all that you still don't know your own mind and your own goals very well. So knowing and diagnosing your wife's mind is probably not going to be that accurate either.

You also seem to go looking for external answers. Paradoxically, TRP while teaching self-reliance and internalization of precepts, can also be used by people who are looking for that external magic bullet, that handbook, that external whatever. I think you fall into the second camp, and now that you "diagnosed" your wife there's another external thing you can use/blame/excuse as you go through your life.

I have no opinion on the narcissism itself but I suggest that most behavioiurs and personality types are on a spectrum. Clinical narcissism may have a certain set of characteristics pegged as 10 out of 10, but a lot of people, and especially unhappy women, may have it already pegged at 5/10, and your codependent reinforcing behaviour may amp it up even more. So there's a gray area between a bitchy, unhappy woman reacting to you, and a clinical type-whatever-personality disorder. So while your "diagnosis" may provide you with a general direction or some additional ideas to manage things, it's not any kind of magic bullet to change your life.

Work on yourself first and foremost.

[–]jacksarmy1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

By your own logic your a narcissist #2 ? Narcissists like to label other people as narcissists !......Then labels wife a narcissist

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I hardly knew what a narcissist was when this started. I just thought it was someone who was vain.

The first video is 18 minutes long. It explains everything.

The first few minutes explain why 99% of the people on this board won't be narcissists - they care. Most of the coaching on this board is to get guys to care less about others and more about themselves !

The last 5 minutes of the video demonstrate a common tactic of narcissists, that being labelling their partner a narcissist. In the example provided, this even fooled someone even with relationship training. If that can happen then it can happen to most of us as well.

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

There are a couple other facts in all this.

1) The book my wife bought is "How To Disarm Your Narcissist". If I am truly a narcissist, why would my wife buy a book on how to stay with one ? Narcissists are assholes that look out for only their own needs. I should be abusive and obnoxious. Why would this intelligent, super achieving woman want to stay with me ? She had an easy opportunity to leave at Easter.

2) Narcissists can't stand being abandoned. When we were first dating my wife told me that I was to never abandon her. And when I went nuclear, what happened ? Don't leave me.

3) My wife didn't read her book and then tell me "you must fix your narcissism" or anything like that. She left the book out and said I could look at it if I wanted to.

I investigated narcissism on my own accord. There was no push on her behalf. My self help efforts were my own.

[–]sexyshoulderdevil75% Liquid Sarcasm2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

You're a wet noodle. All flippy floppy.

Most of what you're saying is noise at this point.

[–]The_LitzRed Beret2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

You are still trying to fix her. When I was a Bluepill bitch I searched the webs for causes for low libido. I am up to date with a whole batch of treatments and remedies for low libido, or as the deadbedrooms sub call it LL.

The point is, it was still me seeking to fix her, and she did not want to be fixed because she wasn't broken.

Stop fixating on her. You do not need an excuse to leave her. Leave if you want to leave, everyone will still be on her side because she is miss Sunshine.

[–]WisdomTangoFoxtrot0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

So, funny story, if you look in my post history. I had a similar "epiphany" about my wife being BPD. But, really, no...she's just a woman.

The tools for dealing with a woman/BPD/NPD are the same. Redpill.

There is no way that I will ever have a fulfilling relationship with this woman. There is no way I will ever mean as much to her as her work. There is no way I will ever be admired or complimented, because that would bring her down just a bit.

This is redpill 101. NMMNG and TRM provide the foundations for this idea. But flip it...your needs cannot be met by one woman alone. When you try to do this...shit goes sideways.

In fact, I'm fucking co dependent.

This is another way of saying you are in her frame. Redpill says to stop that. Right now.

Then I come to some hard realizations.

Maybe you just now swallowed the redpill. Whereas before...you were tongue fucking it against the roof of your mouth.

What about our children ? How are they going to survive through all this ?

What? You sound like my ex-wife.

Is the video right that I should just pull the pin and quietly walk away ? Call her on it ? Tell some of her cohorts so that they aren't feeding her ? Try to get her help ?

Have you read any part of the sidebar? Internalized any of the books? Stop asking if you should be unattractive and needy. And weird.

[–]brotherpotatos0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

This may be controversial, but I recommend trying a few more strategies. Sometimes I think all of the personality disorder stuff is very specific to our relationships, and the relationship can change when one person changes, and that person has to be you.

I recommend withdrawing participation in things she has come to expect you to participate in, and developing apathy for her preferences. Throw her off. Change expectations. Fog when she asks whats going on. Develop hobbies. Start playing rugby or taking martial arts classes. Start being happy despite her and see how she changes. Keep lifting and improving yourself. Start developing circles that she is not part of. If all of this pushes her away and she leaves then good riddance. If it helps, it means that you should have been caring for yourself first all along and you just made some more baby steps forward.

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

The more AA, IDGAF, hobbies, fitness I do, the more irate my wife gets. The "you are a narcissist" behavior was her upping the ante. When you demonstrate defiance, ie independence from the narcissist, they will do anything to get you back in their control. They are only happy if you remain obedient and dependent on them.

FYI, a lot of the MAP and RP stuff looks like the treatment program for codependents. I'm surely not the only one in this population dealing with a covert narcissist. The MAP, dead techniques proposed here will only inflame a true narcissist. AWALT may work for the mainstream population, but it isn't going to be the case for narcissists. People won't understand this until they understand how a true narcissist operates. Not just someone who is vain, but a true narcissist. It is a mental illness. They will destroy the spouse and the children. I've already seen my wife starting to do this.

[–]brotherpotatos0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Thats rough. Part of me wants to say that many conditions are symptomatic of circumstances, that they are words used to describe the sum of events - and in that sense I want you to keep using the rp tools - but legitimate disorders are beyond my experience. My wife can be very nasty but the rp tools have given me enough hope that within six months to a year i can fix things, but only if i am able to take maximum accountability.

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

The RP tools are excellent. In fact they are the first part of breaking co dependence. I'm on that journey right now. I'll share the whole story when I get caught up with things IRL. But because of RP I am well on my way to a very good life.

[–]boggy-b0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Find your happiness. What do you enjoy? What is fulfilling to you, that is totally under your control? Do you like to play music? Work out? Build tables and chairs? Play chess? Succeed at work? What is it? Focus on making yourself happy. To do that you need to find the thing that is your own that you carve out for yourself, without her. When you have that in your life, you never have to depend on her for validation and happiness. You find it within yourself and see it evinced in the things you make. You are a man; this is our nature.

[–]alone280 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This! Thanks!

[–]SpokenMemeArtist0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Get a divorce. This ship is taking on the consistency of Swiss cheese

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

"If I find the perfect label for everyone, then the Internet will tell me how to interact with them."

[–]BluepillProfessorMod / Red Beret0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Then I come to some hard realizations. There is no way that I will ever have a fulfilling relationship with this woman. There is no way I will ever mean as much to her as her work. There is no way I will ever be admired or complimented

Oh stop already. This is just a form of Red Pill rage and I doubt your wife is even BPD. There is usually NO question and it is obvious.

You expecting admiration and complements is very concerning. Have you even read "Women in Love" or The Manipulated Male? Validation seeking by men is enormously unattractive.

[–]ImSteveMcQueen[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

She probably doesn't have BPD. She is a narcissist. Different beast. I suggest you read up on it.



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