659,329 posts

So pissed off. desperate for advice, Cant take the fights anymore.

by NONO226 | February 03, 2017 | askMRP

15 upvotes

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My question:

Should i just act totally beta (allow her to call me names and disrespect me in front of the kids) until i can build up every area of myself, build dread then flip it basically saying “fuck you, i have the power now.” how do you take this shit. how do you swallow your pride as a man and allow someone to treat you this way. should i just keep putting my foot down and deal with the hours and days of misery it incurs, or should i totally beta/bitch out in a trade for some fucking peace? seriously at a fucking loss, not sure i can become “alpha” fast enough to keep my sanity and “make it through.” legit ideas, suggestions, comments, and criticisms please! be brutal.

Still very Noob, starting to question if i can ever become ALPHA but doing my best not to Rambo anything and just defaulting to what i would assume are Beta tendencies when i get into a situation or conversations I'm not sure how to handle. I have not completed the side bar, i have not reached my lifting goals, i have not reached my diet goals, i HAVE hit my financial and work goal, and I have made good strides in all other areas, but there a lot of work to be done.

trying to keep this as brief as possible, when my wife is upset she’s completely solipsistic and emotional (duh). No one’s feelings matter but her own. She has a mother who acts the same way to this day. Nothing is off limits, especially with regards to verbal attacks. “piece of shit, asshole, pathetic, loser, simple minded idiot, dickhead.” are some of the variety of choice comments she chooses to make. When i discovered the pill i read a tactic that when wives get to this level men leave the house. I've implemented that. i told her that if she disrespects me to the level of using those insults, especially in front of the children, then she will get nothing and i leave. This drives her CRAZY. at first she didn't know how to respond but now she has said that i am not allowed to leave in a fight.

“you may not say ‘Fuck You’ like i do but when you leave it is saying the same thin.”

She said in turn i need to acknowledge that her feelings are hurt and let her know i care about her and want to speak with her. that she matters and her feelings matter. OK, fine, i use this line the next time she gets this way and her attitude doesn't change. i leave, shit totally escalates when I'm back. Reconciliations are only about me and what she wants “me to change.” i agree i can make changes (i mean thats why i am on askMRP right) and tell her i am actively working on becoming a better man, husband, father. Her response is that she will not change anything until she knows she can be “vulnerable with her feelings with me and not get hurt.”

Totally seems one sided to me. Really struggling with this bc i feel like i am totally admonishing myself and having to agree that “you’re right honey, i am a piece of shit asshole loser pathetic creep.” “I am sorry i am so mean and disrespectful to YOU.” (i do not call her names or act that way. i just shut down.) Then i do a number of acts to make her feel loved (beta bullshit buying flowers and writing her a nice card about how great she is as a mother and wife and person and that i will work on managing my life better to give her ‘the husband she deserves’.)

Her apology, maybe a day or two later, right as we are about to fall asleep, “i am sorry i said those things to you, you're not all that stuff.”

Me:” OK, thank you for apologizing.”

That’s it. no different actions, not making up for anything, i am still last priority and the second a kid starts whining or crying, it’s “Honey, what are you doing!” her fucking mental checklist of me never fulfilling her expectations is tallied.


Post Information
Title So pissed off. desperate for advice, Cant take the fights anymore.
Author NONO226
Upvotes 15
Comments 77
Date 03 February 2017 03:08 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit askMRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/206557
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/5ruelu/so_pissed_off_desperate_for_advice_cant_take_the/
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Comments

[–]zeteomegaleio24 points25 points  (3 children) | Copy

Have you ever seen Wargames? You're playing Global Thermonuclear War.

You can't win if you play the game. So stop playing the game, dipshit.

In this case, playing means becoming emotionally invested whatsoever in what she has to say right now. As soon as you get pulled into her frame, you lose. She feeds off the emotional drama you allow (and actually encourage her to do) by your reactions.

You have to detach yourself emotionally from this situation. Step outside of your own mind, emotions, etc. - and STOP "should'ing", as in "she SHOULD be a good wife to me" and "she SHOULD be respectful to me in front of the kids."

The point is to completely not give a shit when she does this. Not as in you are defeated because she is being a harpy cunt - you're still in her frame if that happens. Instead, like the same way as if some crazy, homeless idiot on the street started shouting at you that you're a fucking piece of shit.

Would you react to him? If you would, then you need to get your emotional state under control and stop allowing every single other person to dictate how you feel. If you wouldn't, and instead would internally laugh and brush it off because who gives a shit what that guy thinks, then this is exactly what you need to do to your wife.

This is exactly what frame is. Not letting someone else affect your emotional state. Stop taking this all so seriously.

How do you do that? Walk yourself through your greatest fears about this. What is the worst case scenario? That you get a divorce? Cool, now your bitch wife is only in your life to discuss the kids. Yes, that sucks for the kids, but it would be better than watching her emasculate and demonize their father in front of them.

This is a stoic tactic - visualize your worst case scenario and realize it is really not all that bad. You'd survive. In fact, you'd be better off than you are TODAY. However, there are other, possibly better scenarios as well (such as getting your fucking shit together and get control of your life and family, where your kids still have their father around daily, and maybe even get to see how a good relationship could be), so that doesn't mean go drop divorce papers on her lap today.

When you stop worrying so much about these fears and outcomes that are in the back of your mind, you're going to start building your own frame and withdrawing from hers. And when she can't affect you any longer, then you're going to sit back and just see a child throwing a tantrum. And like a 2 year old that doesn't know any better, you just watch and internally maintain your zen.

And then the 2 year old realizes that throwing hysterical fits has no effect. And instead, when it asks nicely for what it wants and receives it, it becomes trained to not throw fits and instead learns to act like it has some manners.

TLDR: You have to level up your own emotional maturity and stop dealing with the high school drama bullshit. And read the fucking sidebar already.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

playing means becoming emotionally invested whatsoever in what she has to say right now. As soon as you get pulled into her frame, you lose. She feeds off the emotional drama you allow (and actually encourage her to do) by your reactions.

This is an excellent point.

Emotions and feelings are woman's playing field. Every argument and disagreement are an attempt to pull you off the logic field (men's domain) and onto the emotions/feelings field (women's domain). Once she's successfully pulled you onto feelings field, YOU LOSE. She is MUCH better at playing on her own home turf than men are. Men who try to play on her turf look like overemotional pussy losers.

Men never win here. This is a big part of why it's often said just don't argue with a woman.

That reminds me of Solomon II from years ago who used to say "Never argue with a woman you're not banging. No ass, no sass."

[–]MuhTriggersGuise0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This is all excellent advice. I appreciate you taking the time to write it out, and while I'm not as clueless as OP, it's nice to have good RP tactics and practices reaffirmed from a different perspective.

[–]UEMcGillI am become McGill, Destroyer of Blue Pill19 points20 points  (14 children) | Copy

You my friend are a proud diligent farmer. You are a farmer of fucks. Your raise, tend and care for a giant field of fucks. Then when someone comes and asks, you say "Sure, here's a fuck. I have many fucks to give!"

Your wife begs you, "Please, please, give me more fucks! When you give me just the right amount of fucks, I may let you worship me! How many fucks is that? I don't know yet. Your fucks haven't proven worth yet.

Your problem, O prosperous farmer of fucks is you have too many fucks to give! So salt the fields of your fucks. Lay waste to thine fields so they be barren of all fucks to be given.

Your wife is a manipulative harpy cunt. She's literally set the hoop so high as to you that you don't even know what the target is! Let me get my HARPY-CUNT-TRANSLATOR2000 running for you:

“you may not say ‘Fuck You’ like i do but when you leave it is saying the same thin.”

TRANSLATION: I can be a bitch and you have to take it.

She said in turn i need to acknowledge that her feelings are hurt and let her know i care about her and want to speak with her. that she matters and her feelings matter.

TRANSLATION: I need to be a crazy bitch and it bothers me when you don't watch me act like a crazy bitch.

“piece of shit, asshole, pathetic, loser, simple minded idiot, dickhead.”

TRANSLATION words of a low quality woman who lacks boundaries

Aren't you the least bit angry she's teaching your kids that it's ok to treat a man this way? You chose a low quality woman, and now that field of fucks has grown in full and she's come to suck you like a giant energy vampire and suck all your fucks away.

You could cure this tomorrow. Easy peasy. Sit her down and ask her, "I have a need for you. Can you meet that need?"

"I don't know, unless you can meet mine or not.."

"No this is simple. Stop the name calling. No more in a fight. None."

"I don't know if I can do that.."

"It's simple. Stop, or divorce. Let me know your decision."

Then walk away. She either says she can or she can't. Her choice. No conditions. If you can live with this, your field of fucks will be barren.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (11 children) | Copy

Farmer of fucks - priceless.

Chicken or egg

Did the Farmer of Fucks create the Harpy Cunt?

or,

Did the Harpy Cunt create the Farmer of Fucks?

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (6 children) | Copy

Its a family business that Farming Fucker Farms Raising too many Fucks.

Supply and demand

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

Let me see if I understand this.....

Farming Fucker Farms raised too many fucks, flooded the market and devalued his Princess Bride. With this loss of value she morphed into Harpy the Cunt? The Fucking Farmer did it to himself.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Nah, its his Grampa McFucks-Givens fault. Letting someone hyphenate his name like that. Tooo many fucks passed on to the current generation

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Amazing ability to piss it off to the older generation. Fortunately, I don't give a McFuck.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

its not that amazing.

We learn from our parents one way or another.

[–]sh0ckley0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Gracias to you and /u/FireTempered and /u/UEMcGill for the big smile on my face right now. McFuckless.

[–]mi1a1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Looks like corn's not the only farmed product the government's subsidizing anymore.

[–]BluepillProfessorMod / Red Beret3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

The chicken created it all. The egg can't do shit without a chicken enabling and letting her get away with whatever she wants.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Agree. The Farmer of Fucks is a chicken, and, created the Harpy Cunt.

[–]UEMcGillI am become McGill, Destroyer of Blue Pill1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

There's always two fucked up people in a relationship. He chose a poor quality woman, likely because he has really poor boundaries. Women like this show their true colors early. A gent who's a lapsed alpha would likely have rejected her early.

[–]NONO226[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

this is true. Product of environment to which i (and she) was born and raised.

[–]Chinchilla_the_Hun0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Lol, unexpected chuckle of the evening award to you

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Aren't you the least bit angry she's teaching your kids that it's ok to treat a man this way?

Exactly

[–]ArchwingerRed Beret7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

The number one time my wife is most affectionate with me - receptive to touch, kisses, conversation -- is about five minutes after calling me an asshole for something I insisted on doing or not doing, often despite her request or protest.

Having boundaries and acting like a man isn't some game you're playing to win power over her or get some kind of reaction or behavior out of her. It's something you need to do for your own psychological health.

Even if you divorce your wife for being a bitch, you're still going to be pissed on by any future women (assuming you can even manage to attract any), your boss, your co-workers, your friends, random men and women in your life. People piss on loser guys who don't have boundaries or act like men.

First off, stop listening to shit your wife says. Second, stop debating or arguing or discussing bullshit with your wife. This crap should be beneath your notice. Third, continue leaving if your wife continues acting like a child. But SHUT THE FUCK UP. Don't tell her, "I'm a butt-hurt loser, and I'm walking away to send a passive-aggressive message about punishing you for saying mean things to me that hurt my feelings." Just go run an errand or something.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

People piss on loser guys who don't have boundaries or act like men.

More gold

[–]Griever1144 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

If you are truly taking care of the sidebar, you should be at the point of owning your shit enough that you should be owning up the house regarding your responsibilities. You should also be able to deflect her absolute cunty behavior with AA/AM, fogging, etc.

But you're not.

If you are truly doing all of this, you need to lock down this bullshit now. You are literally allowing this shit to happen and letting her get away with treating you like garbage with half-assed apologies.

You gave her a half assed ultimatum and she walked right through your paper thin threat. Guess what, your frame is absolute shit and she knows it.

Instead of asking us what you need to do, why dont you put on your big boy pants and TELL US what you are going to do with the reading materials presented.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (8 children) | Copy

'Become Alpha'

I need to write a post on this as it keeps being repeated.

Alpha is a mindset which leads to certain types of behaviors.

You can become an 'Alpha' man with the flip of a switch (That will be the name of the post) you just have to draw a boundary and enforce it.

You know why your girl is like this?

Because you've accepted it, created it, and allowed it.

This is your failure, she's filling the vessel you created.

Just defaulting to beta

Why, because that's the norm? Because that's what you've done up to now??

If you want different results you need a different default.

these 2 posts should help as I'm not going to rewrite them here.

Break the mold: https://thefamilyalpha.com/2016/09/20/break-the-mold/

Stop being a clown: https://thefamilyalpha.com/2016/10/25/stop-being-a-clown/

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy

You can become an 'Alpha' man with the flip of a switch (That will be the name of the post)

Are you done yet? Waiting....... Getting impatient....... Waiting........

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

Can't rush greatness lol

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

You already did. Are you even over 30 yet?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Not yet

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

You can become an 'Alpha' man with the flip of a switch

Are you done yet? Waiting..... Are you done yet?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I wrote that post, check out the blog

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Enjoyed reading it. Thanks.

[–]Chump_No_More0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Alpha is a mindset which leads to certain types of behaviors.

u/NONO226, The man here is giving you gold. Stop and let this all sink in for a bit.

Alpha = in your Frame, Beta = not in your Frame. Done!

You can become an 'Alpha' man with the flip of a switch (That will be the name of the post) you just have to draw a boundary and enforce it.

Being in your Frame naturally creates boundaries. Enforcing them is Alpha behavior.

You know why your girl is like this? Because you've accepted it, created it, and allowed it.

And your "There is no spoon" moment will be when you realize that this applies to every aspect of your life.

It's all about what you do and what you allow. Period.

If what you're doing is not forwarding your vision, passions, and goals... then you're doing it wrong and no doubt you are failing in literally all aspects of your life.

[–]BrazilRedPill2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

When she disrespects you in front of the kids, you state your sentence in a firm, short way:

You are disrespecting me in front of the kids. You either stop now or you will only see me again tomorrow!

Don't DEER, don't say anything else. STFU and hold. If she proceeds being disrespectful, you leave the house, go to a bar and then spend the night in a hotel and only go back to your house the next day.

If she is disrespectful in front of the kids again when you return, do the same: You are disrespecting me in front of the kids. You either stop now or you will only see me again tomorrow!. And do again.

If she only applies shit tests on your return, pass them with A&A.

According to lot of authors, your presence and companionship the thing that matters the most to your wife. Remove yourself from her presence when she is being this intolerable bitch in front of the kids.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

There's a good app called "hotel tonight" which had last minute heavily discounted hotels.

Perfect for going somewhere overnight when she's being a cunt

[–]vorverk2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

You dont become good at anything over night, let alone being alpha.

there a lot of work to be done

There is your answer. Results won't show over night, just keep going.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (7 children) | Copy

trying to keep this as brief as possible

Seen this too often lately. The men you are talking to here aren't stupid. You utter this sentence as some kind of charitable act to keep things short for us. You're trying (for our sake) to keep this [as] brief as possible (to do us a favor). It's clear as day. What this sentence actually means is: "I have things I want to hide. For shame or guilt or laziness I'm going to skip over this part. Please ignore my baggage behind the curtain and continue reading on."

I don't buy it. And i think a lot of your problem stems from thoughts like this. There's no ownership in that statement. You're trying to gloss over your issues rather than facing them head on. You're trying to achieve some kind of progress or value from here without us shitting on you for being worthless. You're trying to take a shortcut. There are no shortcuts. Get to work on the sidebar, it'll start helping you figure yourself and your situation out.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy

I swear to god that testosterone increases the ability to say some fucking crystal clear, insightful shit.

I don't think I would even reckognize you from your first post. I like this guy, he goes for the jugular.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

The jugular...sometimes I wonder why evolution left such an important spot so unprotected. Where's /u/iratemd, maybe we can ask him.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Theres a nice pair of holes in the brain for the squishy parts, doesn't have the same ring to it

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Hi.

Its an evolutionary trade off for having a large brain. Having eyes you can move with your neck.

If you were that worried, shrugging and arms are evolution's way to protect your jugular. You alpha predator you.

[–]470_2_700_nm0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

testosterone increases the ability to say some fucking crystal clear, insightful shit.

I think you may be onto something.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Jockos twitter feed is my new true god

[–]BluepillProfessorMod / Red Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I don't think I would even reckognize you from your first post.

Yep! It almost makes it all worthwhile.

[–]SepeanRed Beret4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Stop listening to her. Stop explaining stuff to her.

i told her that if she disrespects me to the level of using those insults, especially in front of the children, then she will get nothing and i leave.

Don't explain, just leave or do something else.

This drives her CRAZY. at first she didn't know how to respond but now she has said that i am not allowed to leave in a fight

She doesn't make the rules. Don't listen to her.

She said in turn i need to acknowledge that her feelings are hurt and let her know i care about her and want to speak with her. that she matters and her feelings matter. OK, fine, i use this line the next time she gets this way and her attitude doesn't change.

Don't. Listen. To. Her.

Her words do not show you a way towards a better relationship, they are compliance shit test. When you listen to her and does what she asks you fail and she likes you less.

i leave, shit totally escalates when I'm back.

Not a problem if you don't listen to her.

i agree i can make changes (i mean thats why i am on askMRP right) and tell her i am actively working on becoming a better man, husband, father.

Oh, and stop talking to her. Just do it, don't talk about it.

Her response is that she will not change anything until she knows she can be “vulnerable with her feelings with me and not get hurt.”

Utter bullshit. She will change when she is attracted to you, no more no less.

Totally seems one sided to me. Really struggling with this bc i feel like i am totally admonishing myself and having to agree that “you’re right honey, i am a piece of shit asshole loser pathetic creep.”

You don't have to agree to anything. You don't have talk, listen, explain, answer her questions. Just STFU and walk away and do something else. And be happy doing it.

Then i do a number of acts to make her feel loved

She doesn't give a shit. Do what you want to do instead.

her fucking mental checklist of me never fulfilling her expectations is tallied.

This mental checklist is not something that you should be interested in. It is just something she does to control her beta and what are the rewards for being a good little beta? Nothing but disdain and more work.

Stop worrying about her, stop listening to her words, stop arguing with her.

Read this https://www.reddit.com/r/marriedredpill/comments/3njyag/a_red_pill_man_is_happy/

Lift and lead, bro.

[–]bangorlol1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Brother, listen... Stop engaging. When women attack you with emotional diarrhea they're just looking for a reaction to shift the anger and blame to you, as you're the closest one available. At the end of the day, it's literally just your wife saying rude shit at you. You've allowed this to happen by not correcting it properly in the past - and that's okay because you didn't know. But now you do.

From here on our, read the sidebar and lift. Start with NMMNG and WISNIFG and move on from there. In the interim, when she starts flipping out at you, just smile/laugh to let her know through your actions that you're an immovable rock and that her little shitstorm doesn't have the gusto to budge you. Your children need to see what a functional set of parents look like, otherwise they're going to propagate the same bullshit both you and your wife leak from every orifice.

To recap:

  1. Shut the fuck up (STFU)
  2. Smile / Laugh (AM)
  3. Change the subject to logistics or food (women fucking love food) (Fogging)
  4. Move on (Lead)

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

“piece of shit, asshole, pathetic, loser, simple minded idiot, dickhead.”

Hmm.. Dickheads change bank accounts and ghost.

now she has said that i am not allowed to leave in a fight.

Mommy? Can I have a cookie?

You want to change anything?

Take the kids, and ghost her.

Leave her a note saying " Babe, Went on vacation with kids. See ya when we get back"

....

ok don't do that... but listen to the guys with kids and do something similar

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

Youre wastin everyones time, including yours.

Wait until you can get past impotent rage, then get to work

[–]renupachi-4 points-3 points  (3 children) | Copy

This is dick reply. Help the bro or fuck off.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

OK

[–]RuleZeroDADRed Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You do you, bro.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Help the bro or fuck off.

I'ma gonna fuck off.

[–]abdadaRed Beret1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy

You should read the entire damned sidebar, keep lifting, and stay on your diet cut.

[–]NONO226[S] -1 points0 points  (7 children) | Copy

you walk away from comments like that? they honestly roll off your back? if a man talks to me that way he goes home with his teeth in a bag. seriously, what mental exercise do you do not to let it get to you. Maybe it isn't verbal assaults, but it is something, there is something your wife (or someone, at work, family, parent) can or could do that sets you off right? Maybe not anymore, but when you were still BP, still learning, still in my position. What was it that worked?

[–]abdadaRed Beret11 points12 points  (1 child) | Copy

you walk away from comments like that?

I don't put myself in a position where someone makes a comment like that. If I can't say and do something positive, I STFU and go do something positive for myself. When I come back, I say and do something positive.

they honestly roll off your back?

Why wouldn't they? I'm a fucking prize. For real. If the one I'm with today doesn't see it, there's a list of others who already do see it. I'm sure some of them are just waiting and wondering why I haven't asked them out yet.

if a man talks to me that way he goes home with his teeth in a bag.

Quit the booze. Anger isn't a masculine emotion, anger is what children and women do when they don't get their way. I never GOT my way, I fucking EARNED my way. You've earned SHIT so you're acting like a bratty child.

there is something your wife (or someone, at work, family, parent) can or could do that sets you off right?

No. Never. If customers acted like entitled cunts, I let them go. I was always networking for newer better customers. My #1 customer when I worked fired me 7 times in 19 years of consulting with them. When they begged me back (they always did), I doubled my rate. By the time I retired, I was earning 650% more than I did when I started.

What was it that worked?

Sidebar material works:

  • You are the prize
  • You have abundance/options
  • People who disrespect you don't get rewarded with time with you
  • You don't get angry over challenges and you don't keep repeating the same mistakes
  • Never DEER -- every action you've done to better your life is better for your life, so don't defend it.

[–]Chump_No_More2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

People who disrespect you don't get rewarded with time with you

u/NONO226 This entire post is packed with wisdom but this is the money quote.

YOUR TIME is your most valuable resource. It is the only resource that you can NEVER recoup.

Your wife does not respect you because you do not respect your time. You give it away cheaply and to those who do not deserve it.

[–]jtzabor2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I imagine it like a garbage can is yelling at me. Would I care about that? No. Both are garbage.

[–]gettingmymojobackRed Beret2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

OP You need to finish the sidebar reading and STFU.

You're ego is still too big to realize that you aren't shit yet and you haven't earned anything yet. Kill that fucker. You haven't even internalized the concept that just as you are not responsible for her feelings, neither is she responsible for yours.

I'm still less than 6 months in, here's the main takeaway I've learned. You don't deserve shit. You keep acting like you deserve better treatment. Do the words covert contract mean anything to you?

Put your ego aside and ask yourself if you've really earned any respect from her or anyone else. Be a man worth respecting. If she still doesn't respect you, then you'll be in a position to find someone who does.

I've noticed that the concept of your wife mirroring your actions has been very true in my experience. My wife would show the same behaviors as yours with the disrespectful name calling when angry. Strange coincidence that I haven't heard that in many months. The worst I get is jerk or asshole when she's clearly feigning disapproval while being aroused at the same time.

What's changed? Did I DEERR her into respecting me? Did I negotiate it? Did I put my foot down and say "woman you may not talk to me like that!" No, I just worked on improving myself and being less shit. As I've become a better man, she's become a better woman.

Acta non verba. STFU and get to work. If she's still talking to you that way take it as a signal that you still have much work to do. Lift and read, lift and read, and then do both some more.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

There's so much to unpack from this comment.

My problem, you don't know any of it. Talk less, follow abdadas advice, you're not special, it's helped thousands of other guy.

[–]donerkebabplease0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Try this...During one of these arguments, concentrate on your breathing, you might want to look into meditation. When I started on this journey, I reacted to everything, shit I even reacted to things that didn't bother me but I knew they bothered her, like I was trying to enforce equality!!! I started meditating, during arguments. I sit, I look right at her, but I'm meditating, not focused on her words at all. I can hear them, but I'm paying more attention to my breath.

When she calls you a dickhead, your immediate thought is to validate that in your head, you're going to play a little mind game with yourself, disagree and then react...Don't play that little mind game, don't validate that sentence, focus inward.

[–]weakandsensitive0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Ha ha ha

[–]Thrice-Locked1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

It's all your fault. All of it. I know that sucks, but it's true. You're being to lazy. You're not lifting enough. You're not reading enough. Your not internalizing enough. You should always be busy. Stop watching TV. Stop playing games. Put your fucking phone down. You are the smartest, strongest and most capable person in the family. It's a fucking fact. Stop letting life happen to you and start owning your shit. mRP is about YOU. Why? Because it's the only thing you have full control over. Take your anger out on the weights. Stop being lazy and own ALL of your shit. Love your kids, tolerate your wife while you get Your shit together. Become the prize and you will have frame.

[–]gettingmymojobackRed Beret1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

I have to question OP's commitment to improvement if he can't even stick with lifting and diet. Those are by far the 2 easiest changes to commit to as they require basically no change in mindset. Only the will to return to it every day. Internalizing sidebar material requires far more effort and thought.

[–]ParadoxThatDrivesUs0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Agreed. OP, your next post should be about lifting and diet progress. Until that's under control, the rest of this is just spinning your wheels.

[–]NONO226[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

---- done.

[–]NONO226[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

i wasn't clear. "not hitting goals" does not mean "can't stick with it."

Lifting 3x per week on a 5x5 program i found and really like. Built a home gym, adding to my home gym, recent set back due to AC joint injury (not severe) and flu, but no major derailment i just have not hit the weight goals i have set for myself when i first stared this in October.

Weight, 10 lbs away from my goal. Look and feel SIGNIFICANTLY different. everyone, and i mean everyone, has noticed and i have started getting that "what are you doing man? what tips can you give me."

Reading is progressing slower than i want to admit. i am currently in graduate school which requires a lot of reading and i need to better manage my time so as to complete reading here.

i understand what you are saying, always room for improvement

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

You need to read WISNIFG to learn about dealing with criticism

[–]hypergamous0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Question: Why did you pick her and commit to marriage and children?

I understand that you are in the middle of the storm, but I often wonder what it is that makes men pick these types of situations. There must have been red flags earlier about fighting and disrespect.

[–]NONO226[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

agreed, now, after taking the pill, it is easy and obvious. I wasn't raised this way and had never been exposed to this type of thinking. I was raised with the exact opposite mentality...the more abuse and the more you but up with, becoming a martyr, and that is what means you have good character, are a good person, and are doing good things. Basically, my parents and mentors were fucking stupid and somehow never developed critical thinking skills. i will not allow that to be passed along further. hence, why i'm here.

[–]rocknrollchuck0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

How To Build Boundaries During Your Transition

Still my favorite post to address this particular problem.

Also: finish reading the sidebar, things will make much more sense when you're done.

[–]NONO226[S] 1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

How To Build Boundaries During Your Transition

When you start enforcing boundaries, your wife might be upset and act up more. This is very frustrating. Just accept that it is your own fault: you gave her this territory because you didn’t defend it. Now you want it and she had internalized it was hers. It isn’t her fault, it is yours for not defending the terrain. It sucks for you, for her and for the relationship that you weren’t consistently defending it. So now you all pay the price of your irresponsibility. Be patient with her, blame yourself. Plan ahead escalating ways to defend the boundary, such that you find out what is the minimum level that will get her to back off. There is no point in overdoing it, after all, you don’t want to be an asshole, you just want to act in ways that defend the boundary with the least cost to everyone. Of course, this will mean doing things she doesn’t like, but don’t over do it to punish her.

....And here it is. This begins to answer my question. Follow up questions: how do you plan ahead for escalating ways to defend your boundary. I my experience, once her feelings have reached a certain level, there is nothing i can say or do, or not say or not do, that helps resolve the situation. it's like once the volcano blows, its going until there's nothing left. so my only thought is STFU, and do whatever i can to make sure we just dont get to that level.

[–]NONO226[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

BTW, your link is exactly what i'm looking for, really helping things to click.

[–]rocknrollchuck0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I'm glad it helped, it's the first thing I read on here that really set me on a better path. You also need to read When I Say No I Feel Guilty if you haven't already. Fogging will be your new best friend.

[–]rocknrollchuck0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

how do you plan ahead for escalating ways to defend your boundary. I my experience, once her feelings have reached a certain level, there is nothing i can say or do, or not say or not do, that helps resolve the situation.

Defending a boundary and resolving the situation are two different things. You cannot begin to resolve the situation until you enforce the boundary repeatedly and she recognizes and respects the boundary. Period.

Planning ahead for escalating ways to defend your boundary:

It was only when I planned an action to my responses to her that I made progress. I decided that if she said this, I would say “I’m not going to continue this conversation.”

So the first step is stating that you will not tolerate this anymore. Which I'm sure you have, multiple times. The second step is telling her "I'm not going to continue this conversation."

If bad behavior continued, I would escalate level of defenses. For me, this was just leaving the room to do something productive for me,

The third step is walking away from the conversation.

or depending on the gravity of the situation, leave the house to workout, meditate, walk or get a beer.

The final step is leaving for a while and doing something for yourself. Have an idea in mind BEFORE things escalate. You will be tempted to stay around and argue at this point. DON'T. You cannot verbally defend a boundary. This took me a long time to learn, and even longer to put into practice. STFU is not sufficient at this point, you must leave and go somewhere, avoiding contact with her if she tries to call and argue with you over the phone (she will).

The first few times I did this, she went nuts. She was used to me not having this boundary, so she was trying to see if she could scare me into backing off. It was afraid, I admit. But I had planned ahead my defenses, and decided I must carry them out regardless. So I ended up leaving the house for a few hours. First few times I felt a lot of guilt. But since I had planned ahead my defenses, I knew that I wasn’t being a hot head, I had planned rationally this. With time, it got easier to defend the boundaries. Heck, most times it feels really good now. She wants to piss me off? Ha, she lost, I’m not going to engage, and I have time for myself. She lost because she wanted me to react, I win because I get good time for myself.

So actions matter, words do not. Remember that. Also

Totally seems one sided to me. Really struggling with this bc i feel like i am totally admonishing myself and having to agree that “you’re right honey, i am a piece of shit asshole loser pathetic creep.” “I am sorry i am so mean and disrespectful to YOU.” (i do not call her names or act that way. i just shut down.) Then i do a number of acts to make her feel loved (beta bullshit buying flowers and writing her a nice card about how great she is as a mother and wife and person and that i will work on managing my life better to give her ‘the husband she deserves’.)

Stop apologizing. You know you're not wrong, so own that and stand your ground. Her disrespect comes partly from the fact that you have no respect for yourself, otherwise you would not apologize for stuff that was not your fault. I get it: you just want the drama to stop. I felt the same way for a long time, and my thought was "Why do I have to go through all this just to get her to stop making my life miserable all the time? But until you firmly establish the boundary with actions, it will continue.

This drives her CRAZY. at first she didn't know how to respond but now she has said that i am not allowed to leave in a fight.

Hahaha. "Not allowed" to leave in a fight. You know what to do. Leave. For a few hours the first time. If you come back and she lays into you again, leave for the rest of the day. The next time, escalate that to leaving overnight. When she confronts you about it, here's your response "The way you were speaking to me was unacceptable, and I will no longer stay around and listen to it." If she argues about that, just Broken Record it again and again until she gets the point. If she escalates, just tell her "Do I need to leave again?"

[–]PBRistasty0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

STFU!!!!! Thats step.1

Step 2 dont engage period.

You stated a boundry, you followed through with consequences.. Then you completely fell apart. Why the Fuck would you apologize to her At all, when you returned?

All you did was fall right back.into her frame the moment you stepped through the door.

Who cares if your actions hurt her feels? Her feels are the same as childs..oh, wait, if you had actually internalized the sidebar instead of simply read it you would know your married to the oldest child in the house.

When she ramps it up again respond as you would one of your children.

[–]lvanl40 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

When you leave, don't return until you know the situation will be optimal for you to handle the way you want too (usually an apology from her)

[–]trp_dude0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

beta bullshit buying flowers and writing her a nice card about how great she is as a mother and wife and person and that i will work on managing my life better to give her ‘the husband she deserves’

You're pathetic.

STFU, leave the house, and lift. After 6 months of doing that, when you're at 10% body fat, come back here.

[–]bogeyd6Mod / Red Militia-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

I will give you the same advice I will give anyone who is stuck firmly in his wife's frame of social interactions. Remove yourself. It's that simple. You have to get out and work on you and if she is that much of a burden then she needs to be removed for awhile. I mean shit, you've been in it this long, whats the worse that can happen? Your dream of divorce comes true.



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