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Almost 1 in 3 American men aged 18-30 are incels. Can you believe this statistic? Why is it so high?

Reddit View
April 4, 2019
228 upvotes

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2019/03/29/share-americans-not-having-sex-has-reached-record-high/?utm_term=.eb20132c1086

According to new research, 28% of men aged between 18 and 30 haven't had sex in the last year. So they're basically incels. That's almost 1 in 3 men. That's really shocking.

When you go outside and see young men walking around, 1 out of every 3 isn't having any sex at all. They have to use their hand/possibly a sex toy. Pretty frightening statistic if you ask me. I would have thought it would be 10-15%. It's double what I thought.

The article seems to believe it's because men aren't marrying as much and they're living at home longer. I feel like the issues are deeper than that.

Can you believe this statistic and why is it so high?


Post Information
Title Almost 1 in 3 American men aged 18-30 are incels. Can you believe this statistic? Why is it so high?
Author BumblingBeta
Upvotes 228
Comments 353
Date 04 April 2019 07:05 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit askTRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/224346
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/asktrp/comments/b9gx1k/almost_1_in_3_american_men_aged_1830_are_incels/
Similar Posts

Red Pill terms found in post:
incel
Comments

[–][deleted] 142 points143 points  (73 children) | Copy

This is not a shock at all.

Women have men lined up begging to fuck them, why would they choose someone in the bottom 33%?

[–]iwviw56 points57 points  (58 children) | Copy

We are turning into Japan

[–]vicious_armbar 1 points [recovered]  (42 children) | Copy

Nah, we're worse. Japan at least has defacto legalized prostitution. So men who can't get laid can just pay for sex with a beautiful woman. That's why there's not Japanese incels snapping every few months and shooting up a public venue.

[–]loloLogic24 points25 points  (40 children) | Copy

Also because they're not allowed to have guns.

[–]2000ber4 points5 points  (39 children) | Copy

This is the most accurate response so far. Look at Europe or you know most of the world

[–]sir_shitfuck23 points24 points  (35 children) | Copy

They should make murder illegal too right, that'll stop the criminals?

[–]2000ber3 points4 points  (34 children) | Copy

I don't know if you're joking, which is sad. But compare amount of shootings and people shot to death in USA and other countries from Europe. You will hopefully be shocked or maybe your desensitized and need a wall like that is going to help

I am European so I favor the EU and I also know more about Europe than South America

[–]InstarEmergence1 point2 points  (11 children) | Copy

And what do you propose we do about that? We have more guns than people in the US. Restrictions and bans would never work and would just take guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens and put them in the hands of criminals.

[–]2000ber1 point2 points  (10 children) | Copy

WTF. That is not what happens in Europe, so why should it happen in another Western nation. We are similar in culture as most Western countries are

[–]InstarEmergence-1 points0 points  (9 children) | Copy

Look man, I used to think that way about guns too until I saw a holocaust survivor speak about his story. He told us, with tears in his eyes, that if the German citizens hadn’t given up their guns to the German government, then the holocaust wouldn’t have happened on the scale that it did. If you don’t think that governments today are capable of similar things, you’re dead wrong. That’s why we love our 2nd amendment. It protects us from tyranny, as it was meant to from the start. When shit goes down, we will have our protection while you will not. Europeans don’t understand it, and I wouldn’t expect you to.

[–]Guthix4Days0 points1 point  (14 children) | Copy

I sleep safer at night with an Armalite rifle in the house. I think most people agree with that.

Edit: wow, didn't realize TRP was so anti-gun now.

[–]Garathon6 points7 points  (3 children) | Copy

It's sad that you need a semiautomatic rifle to sleep at night. In my country you sleep well unarmed.

[–]geo_gan8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

It’s well known that a lot of Americans attitudes especially to guns are FUBAR

[–]2000ber-1 points0 points  (8 children) | Copy

I don't. It could as easily be used against you

[–]Bigspartandaddy2 points3 points  (7 children) | Copy

Yeah, buddy, someone´s getting into your house, finding where´s your gun and shooting you with it lol

[–]mickymark10 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

If you take a look at history from the day the USA was formed (1776) until today, I think America is more successful on policy in regard to gun ownership. Thank you for your input though.

[–]SolarTortality0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Why are damn europoors trying to make everyone bluepilled pussies like them?

[–]2000ber0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

How is having a weapon making you alpha. Isn't it more alpha to train yourself to not even need a weapon??

Put those claws back in those paws

[–]SolarTortality0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I train jiu jitsu every week but I’m not under the delusion that any amount of training is going to help me in a situation where a gun is involved if I am not also armed.

The world is changing and the Pax Americana is coming to an end. If shit goes down I’m not going to willingly disarm myself and outsource my families protection entirely to a government that doesn’t give a shit about me. That’s called being a pussy.

Besides the US has 20x the level of gangs per capita than any country in Europe which is where most of our gun crime comes from, let them kill eachother I say. Furthermore the UK (I don’t know where you are from) has higher levels of assault, and burglary than the US even with far less criminal gangs. Why? No one is worried about getting shot. Break into my house and I’ll shoot you and your buddies.

School shootings are an issue but there are certainly ways to solve it, of course the powers at be would prefer to disarm us all so they can further centralize their power and our dependence on them.

[–]thrwy75479-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's legal in most counties in Nevada.

[–]ZeppKfw11 points12 points  (11 children) | Copy

Then when men satisfy their needs with technology and robots, it would turn a 180°

[–]Thinkingard14 points15 points  (7 children) | Copy

It's an interesting thought. I think if the men who generally seek to be married and find fulfillment in one woman, and men who are in the top 20% or top 5% if we're talking Tinder, start turning away to realistic sex dolls we will see a huge disruption in the sex market. No one cares if incels start banging bots, that won't change anything any more than all of those men using porn on a daily basis.

[–]PimlicoResident6 points7 points  (5 children) | Copy

Women hold monopoly on continuing life. When that is taken away, the world will change the next day and will never be the same ever again. Anyone not working on that tech is just giving women more power every day and screw themselves over.

[–]Jampak_50008 points9 points  (4 children) | Copy

most interesting point I've read here for a while. Actually got me thinking, what if? A robot was WAYYYYYYYYYY better than a real woman, what would women actually do if men collectively went incel. fuck that's an interesting question

[–]geo_gan11 points12 points  (2 children) | Copy

Isn’t it obvious? They are already doing it... attempting to limit or ban men’s access to non real female sex. They want to make realistic sex dolls illegal. Using every feminine trick in the book to do that.

[–]Jampak_5000-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

lets assume they fail, and men actually collectively go incel. Then what? (that's what I was saying before not what would women do to try an stop it happening, what if it actually happens on mass?)

[–]SolarTortality0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Woman would have to compete for men the way men currently compete for women is what would happen.

Also you aren’t using “incel” correctly.

[–]Greek-God-Brody 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

nah, they'll still be longing for female affection / intimacy /validation

[–]Lord_Fluffykins-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

I read that. There’s different types of sex in my experience. Relationship sex is a lot different than ye olde pump and dump. Both have their strong points. Even with the latter, there is still the validation that comes from knowing the woman selected you.

[–]ZeppKfw0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Then you haven't heard of japan yet

[–]pickyourselfupman0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Damn, so true

[–]jackandjill22-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

This has been happening people just didn't want to acknowledge it.

[–]Opioidus-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Wrong, we are turning into Sub-Saharan Africa, where women had ample choice and picked for height, big dicks, deep voices, aggression and competitiveness. And they never progressed beyond tribalism.

[–]resnine6 points7 points  (12 children) | Copy

It makes for a more chaotic society too. Because the more incels and more competition for females, the more aggressive men will get.. Amogging to extremes.

[–]PimlicoResident7 points8 points  (9 children) | Copy

Smart ones will check the fuck out of the game which is rigged by nature. There is no point - life is amazing opportunity and chasing women being beaten down every time because a bunch of Chads railed her in the last year, so her standards are now 8/10 and nothing less, is not worth it for me.

[–]filthykarmawhore69 1 points [recovered]  (4 children) | Copy

The fuck are you talking about. What world do you live in?

I have decent game but am significantly overweight, lacking most stereotypically cool/alpha traits save for height, and don't pretend to be anything other than what I am: a broke ass grad student with a few interesting stories. I've had sex with about a dozen women a year on average the last few years. This is in spite of endless hours (60+) at incredibly low paying jobs in a high cost of living city while also applying to grad school (which means studying for tests, writing essays and doing public service on top of the shit schedule). So basically I have neither time nor money and can't claim to compensate for it with amazing looks. The biggest impediment to me fucking a woman a week is lack of time/money. Even if you don't buy a girl a drink buying yourself a couple of beers here and there adds up when you're broke. The second biggest impediment is occasionally I want a relationship and keep a girl around for a while.

Funniest thing is, I'm the one who raised my standards. I started thirsty with decently high standards, dropped them as I was learning game to make up in volume, but quickly realized it wasn't worth it. My standard is I will only sleep with a woman I'd be proud of myself to wake up next to sober. So thin and cute at a minimum, preferably athletic and hot.

I fuck women in far better shape than I am 100% of the time owing to my own shit shape, and I fuck women who are "in shape" probably 90% of the time (occasional less than fit but still not fat or even chubby women included). They get so turned on they insist on public blowjobs with cum in their mouth. This wasn't a one off thing, multiple girls suggested this as their idea. I guess I know how to pick them. I constantly next women for being too annoying, not entertaining enough, not up to par in bed and other petty things given my own situation. At one point I wanted to bang a woman of every race. After that was done, I decided for every geographic region but got bored by the points chasing nature of it. Women are similar enough worldwide that it's mostly a wash (although in my experience black chicks have a good shot to fuck your brains out in a way others won't though it's not universal).

So who are these women fucking me? Did my dad take pity on me and get me a never ending stream of escorts secretly these past few years?

What business do I have, per the "only Chads need apply" model with a collegiate cheerleader, or a hot spanish chick who loves to deepthroat to the point of sucking you dry multiple times until it hurts, or a angelic foreign blonde who literally could've modeled if she started young? Why are these women jealous of me and (for the most part - occasional fuckups aside) vying for my commitment, asking for nudes, and calling me to say they masturbated thinking of me?

Maybe I'm in a coma and this is all a wonderful dream. Or maybe the standards aren't as rigorous as you think. By the way, I don't give a shit if you downvote me for this: being a bitter angry asshole is for losers. It's incredibly hard to tell emotional coloration over text - if I can read the bitter rage in your two sentence shitpost, I'm betting it comes off you in fucking vapor in real life. Nobody wants to fuck the next Elliot Rogers. Get over yourself. You're not on a Crusade - it's a game, fucking treat it with some levity.

[–]PimlicoResident0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

All you have done with this wall of text is tell me how our life experiences are way different. You live in abundance, I live in a dessert.

Let me provide you why I barely meet women: my work is a sausage fest (all men, which is amazing to work with, no drama). I work 50 hours a week. After that, I go do some exercise at least an hour a day. I also must get 8-9 hours of sleep, otherwise I will not survive at my job. 24 - 10 - 8 - 1 = 5. I also spend an hour a day preparing for tech interviews to be ready to hop jobs if opportunity arise. 4 hours. I also prepare all my meals every day, and eat them. Minus 1 more hour. Leaving me with 3.

In those 3 hours, I also go to meetups in my city to build a network of connections. I spend a minimum of 2 hours twice a week. Hence, on some days of the week I am left with 1 hour. On others with 3. This means I have weekends to work my ass off to meet women. And you would be right, but ...

Now, here is my track record at university, I went to top uni in the world. I used to go out with my friends, we went to various societies meetings, or a few parties. There, I never managed to make girl interested and take someone home. When I realised that all my work gives me 4s and below, I got really bitter. All this toil in life for a landwhale?

I then moved to a megacity. Things here are even worse. All the best men are down here and I have to compete with them. Or not. It is a choice between working my ass off for scraps when there are men who are handed it all for free after work. It got really old to experience only rejections. Imagine working your ass off for a degree, then apply everywhere and not hear back or get rejected every time. I knew people in this situation and it was horrible to see.

Life is about choices we make. It is also about cost and benefit. I dropped stuff out of my life that I enjoy (playing basketball) in favour of learning about investing because I will never play basketball in a big league. You go about your really busy life (commend you on that) and get women falling into your lap. I never had that experience. I am now in a phase of my life where I stopped actively pursuing it - if she falls into my lap, I will take that, otherwise I focus on what brings me benefits in the future and reaps me rewards instead of constant disappointment.

And no, I don't think it is me above all those girls, I think they see me as inferior, and hence no luck in this department.

Equal effort reply to your effortful post. Thanks.

[–]filthykarmawhore69 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

You're doing the right things. I didn't. I'll be honest: a few years ago (I guess almost a decade by now) I was thirsty af and though I had a steady gf and some occasional side action I was terrible at picking up women in random places. In meeting women in general. I read everything on TRP and decided to head out. Messy start. The theory was only marginally useful as I could remember maybe 10-20 things in total out of my mass of readings. I had no real base of experience (one LTR plus occasional one night stands teaches you something but not a whole lot) which I could use to screen the helpful stuff here from the trash. I fell down the wisdom tree and hit my face on every branch on the way down. A year prior, I went from excellent college shape to 10-14 hour workdays with free food, often too exhausted to work out and various other excuses which led to me gaining 60 lbs. No idea how I failed to notice it - all the weed I was smoking as an unhealthy coping mechanism definitely contributed.

You already live a better life than I did. You're healthy and committed to it. That is a great trait and, if projected, attractive on its own and something I'm trying to build.

Don't feel too bad about uni. It's full of people who don't get laid that much - or at all. I think Harvard has 27% of the student body graduate as virgins according to a survey they conduct (no idea how they decided to include that question) and 73% start as virgin - sure some of them become party animals but I imagine most get lucky occasionally in the stacks or have the occasional self loathing filled hookup with an equally lonely female. The prominence of final clubs or good frats or sports teams makes it seem like everyone is drowning in pussy, but like in real life it's an elite. Said elite, in my experience, can't comprehend how someone can't get laid and are useless for learning from. Like me, you'll need to find your own way.

Not sure which megacity but I had great luck in NY despite its cold reputation and find Chicago, where I recently moved, almost impossible to crack. Completely different culture - I'm assuming you get used to it and adapt.

For my own sake, I find that in person attraction manages to be more shallow than apps. Whether I get laid is directly proportional to how I look/feel that day, no using good pics or anything witty as an intro. Now that I'm halfway down from 60 lbs I started to get moderate female attention (mild would be women who aren't absolutely disgusting themselves check you out once in a while), which I define as random drunk sluts coming up to me to make out before being rescued by a friend or getting a good feel of my flab. I could probably take advantage of this but honestly I'm still fat enough that it's not worth it as they tend to be drunk enough that I could see myself getting in trouble. They're not slumped over or anything but I wouldn't bet on them waking up the next morning and remembering how they got to my bed. As someone who gained and lost massive weight in real time it is amazing how consistently you lose respect and attractiveness with every five pounds - it's like adjusting a sliding scale on a computer in precision. The girls I have luck in with bars are, though not unfuckable, below my level. I don't know how to rate women. 6s I guess? Minimal standard to fuck if too horny but not be ashamed the next morning, whatever that is.

I'm going out on a limb but you sound shy around women - many professionals feel unprepared for pickup and the contrast in their intense preparation for school and work only raises how self conscious they are. If I'm wrong let me know. When I say you're shy I assume that means 4s give you highly visible obvious signals that you don't act on. That's not bad - if 6s and 7s are throwing themselves at you its a pretty clear sign you're very high value as women can generally punch above their weight without being too obvious about it.

And hey I can relate to the degree thing - went to a good undergrad (not top in the world but close enough) and had a shit GPA due to drug use, laziness, illness brought on by a shit lifestyle and various other factors within my control. The main reason I went to grad school is for a second bite at the apple career wise. And as bad as that felt, not being able to score except with fat chicks actually feels worse. I know, having gone through both.

And as I put more effort into women I absolutely got worse at life overall. If I make it sound like they fall into my lap, it might be akin to that now from your perspective (from mine, I always know someone taller, buffer, more alpha and etc who does a feat like casually getting 12 girls in a week to his roommate's shock and awe. I tend to surround myself with people I respect and want to emulate hence me finding all these outliers) but it was a very slow and gradual process to get here. I humiliated myself a lot in the beginning, then less so as time went on. I can't say I stopped altogether but I no longer care.

So let's do bad news and good news.

Bad news is that nobody except said landwhales will fall in your lap. You're a man. Given your background you clearly are no fool and don't shrink in the face of competition. I, ironically, struggled with perfectionism and still do so I can see your dilemma - you see all that you have achieved and think what the fuck they want me to start from scratch with getting pussy? Yep. Very few skills translate to that. I find sales usually does - or both come from the same wellspring. I'm not a salesman and you don't strike me as one either. Being an aspiring rainmaker MD/Partner doesn't count - I mean real sales where you face rejection 400 times a day starting out.

Some good news: you are not the first to do this. I know a guy who is externally the epitome of alpha. Tall, nordic, sporty, devilishly handsome and an easy charm. He was a virgin starting college (who knows, maybe his single mom upbringing is to blame - he certainly is bitter about it) and got played hard by the most mediocre girl you can imagine. I've been there too and when I shared my story with good friends I found, once people trust you enough to drop the alpha act, basically everyone's been played in a similar way at one point. The girl fucked his mind so hard he dropped out of a top non Ivy school in econ despite a Goldman internship offer to go model in LA, personal training for cash. After being tired of getting paid to be harassed by old gay dudes, he went back to an ivy as a physics major. He completed that and went to a second ivy as a physics PhD. At some point during this time he transformed into that guy who always leaves a bar with a girl within 20 minutes, the same guy who banged 12 chicks in a week basically by accident and being constantly blackout drunk. So he's set for life right? Wrong. Poor inner game led him to fall in love with a girl he met at a scientific junket at some beach on an island in Europe. Girl was Irish and only there to be a beach slut, not a physicist. They "fell in love" which you're free to interpret however you want and he married her for the greencard. She's actually a lovely girl and has that biting Irish wit. However, on top of needing a greencard marriage she came with some more baggage: a one year old. Half arab by the look of him - a bit dark for her pale Irish skin to produce without some help. So my friend adopted the kid and lives in the burbs at his PhD program. The kid turned out to be autistic and needs expensive help. My friend, who talked down to my Wall Street bros for being pointless sellouts and working bummer jobs and was considered (don't ask how this is measured, it's an unverified rumor) to be among the top 100 prospective physicists of our generation, is now suddenly pounding the pavement looking for a sellout job so he can support his new wife and adopted kid. He calls us sometimes to be like hey how was your weekend and wistfully listens to our tales. Three years ago, he'd have any of us beat. Now he listens sadly. The lesson there is, no matter how good you are, you are one wrong move away from a fall. Another lesson is that you can cover up your internal weaknesses but you're better of fixing them lest they bubble up at a bad time. I merely lost a good fuck that way recently, he essentially lost his life.

Other alpha as fuck guys often have similar stories - more the first part than the second. Stop assuming everyone has it easy. It's defeatist.

My advice is simple: start with apps. Worked for me. It allows you to project a fixed image and to try a wide variety of approaches. Think of it as riding a bike with training wheels - except you get pussy.

If you're not outwardly handsome, go for Tinder. Lower standards these days, usually a chick's first stop if she's just out of a relationship or growing bored in hers. Most girls get nonstop notifications and turn them off for months then redipped into the pool - so don't ever expect a timely response. Sometimes you'll get one months later. Those work - means the girl was so horny she trolled her old matches and picked you.

Try different approaches. General rule: amused mastery, cocky and funny. Don't take yourself too seriously as Crimson boys often do (though you strike as more Oxbridge than ivy). Don't be afraid to fail. I found starting with apps lowers approach anxiety in real life and boosts confidence (which is often defined wrong: confidence is knowing you are up to a challenge and is usually informed by recent past successes) by succeeding. Don't do the dumb thing and swipe right on everyone, only on women you'd be genuinely proud to fuck. I mean, if that means 10s only, lower your standards and learn some humility but I assume you have average standards.

Small continuation coming up.

[–][deleted] 1 points  (1 child) | Copy

[permanently deleted]

[–]FREECRACK6-1 points0 points  (3 children) | Copy

damn you just gave up on the idea of fucking women completely? Thats insane, I would go to mars before that

[–]PimlicoResident1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I can go dumpster diving but I respect myself too much for that. If it means not fucking 4/10 landwhales then so be it. I think it helps that my horny levels decreased a lot in the last two years so I barely feel the urge anymore.

The culture and society advancement is the reason women are picky. It is like me with tech companies: I am picky because I get spammed by recruiters with juicy offers. It is how women feel nowadays, spammed by a bunch of Chads so normal men like me have zero chance.

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I don't blame you, you're actually making a rational decision given the circumstances.

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

You're going to see more of that bro. Honestly it's probably already happening you just don't see it in your immediate social circle.

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This is true. I've seen that shit as well. These things are definitely happening.

[–]deathhandmachiavelli-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Just the opposite in fact.

Men become LESS aggressive and give up.

Just look around. Look at men now and compare them to men from 1850. We have a bunch of non-aggressive, cucked, pathetic "males."

[–]RedTrenGod0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Very true

[–]beachbbqlover115 points116 points  (87 children) | Copy

Okay, so the bottom 28% of men can't get laid once a year.

The bottom 80% of men are classified as "less than a 5/10".

Suggests we're on a pretty standard exponential distribution curve for affection?

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 23 points24 points  (23 children) | Copy

Suggests we're on a pretty standard exponential distribution curve for affection?

Can you explain this for me? I'm pretty stupid.

[–]beachbbqlover69 points70 points  (19 children) | Copy

https://towardsdatascience.com/understanding-the-68-95-99-7-rule-for-a-normal-distribution-b7b7cbf760c2

50% of women are ranked as 50th percentile on a x/10 rating system by men.

Women though rank men differently. 80% of men are ranked as below 50th percentile on a x/10 rating system by women.

That means if you're 5/10, you're (roughly) in the top 20% of men.

It also means that the least attractive 1 in 4 men can't find someone willing to have sex with them even once per year.

And that's for men between 18 and 30, which should be the easiest age to get by.

It suggests that almost all of the sexual attention goes to a few men, but the same isn't true for women.

[–]whuttupfoo16 points17 points  (10 children) | Copy

So that means it’s easy as fuck to be in the top 20%.

[–]xddm265312 points13 points  (6 children) | Copy

Pretty much. Take any decent shape guy, with a decent haircut, decent clothes, purge him of blue pill thoughts and he can get laid.

[–]Henhge1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I only make 35k, don't work out, attractive face, okay (at best) clothes and I had five girls this month. That's with being lazy, and one got me into a relationship. I do have a house, a job and a car though. So maybe that helps.

Friends of mine have similar/less success, dating apps have definitely changed the game completely.

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yea, all those things help. & there are alot of other factors as well.

[–]beginner_0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

easy...purge him of blue pill thoughts

that's your contradiction

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

*facepalm* Guys like you guys are completely missing the moral of the story here. To a hammer everything looks like a nail.

[–]xddm26530 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

What's the moral, lots of guys are losers?

[–]RedHoodhandles0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

No. It is simple. Depending on your starting point, it ain't easy.

[–]pridebrah0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This is mind blowing to me an seems too easy. There's really that many bottom-tier guys around on average? The fuck?

I think I'm blind as fuck to this because the guys I work with and have in my social circle are all either married, have a girlfriend, or pick up new girls pretty easily. I figured a lot of guys are like that.

[–]jackandjill22-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

idk where everyone gets this retarded conclusion from.

[–]throwawaybpdnpd1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

18-30 really ??

I thought the easiest age to get by for a man was 30-38,

According to Rollo’s SMV chart by age it seems much more accurate:

https://www.hookingupsmart.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/smv_curve1-1024x502.jpg

[–]filthykarmawhore69 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy

I was a lot younger when I first read it as it came out and it seemed spot on but now I can't imagine wanting to fuck a 15 year old. Even 19-20 year olds are whiny, childish brats who I avoid. 23 is really the minimum to have a woman I can tolerate being around.

[–]throwawaybpdnpd0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Well when they’re 23 is their prime time for fertility...

I can’t stand immature women but there are young ones who like a man to show them real life around

[–]filthykarmawhore69 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

There's no accounting for taste. I find that my favorite women, no matter what age I was, have consistently been around 27-28. Plenty of men, no matter the age, consistently go for barely legal. Looking into average fertility by age or average attraction level is useful at a population level but not at an individual one as individuals can be outliers for any number of as of yet unresearched reasons.

[–]throwawaybpdnpd0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I agree, most chicks that did not get on my nerves were around that age; 27-28

[–]Kommanderdude 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

Those 1 in 4 men should seek to mate with someone of their own genetic level or lower.

[–]beachbbqlover0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That's the thing, the difference in scales means that a 25%ile man correlates to a <3% woman.

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That's what the majority of men do.(have to do)

[–]EvolvedVirus9 points10 points  (2 children) | Copy

The number "1 in 3 men are not having sex in last year" could even be a low number... It could be closer to 50%, because the bottom-80% of men are NOT being rated as date-able by women.

Dating apps could also have made it so that a select 20% of men in a city are getting most of the women (maybe some topmen on asktrp might shed some insight if they are already very successful; or maybe they too are having their own struggles with women despite some successes).

Other circumstantial evidence is basically: why is it that so many women have ASD, LMR, and shittesting so common? It's so common that we are constantly discussing it in asktrp. How is that possible if men and women are constantly having sex as "mainstream/bluepill culture" might try to portray (see popular movies, everyones' having sex); because popular movies are representative of attractive women and attractive men, which are NOT 80% of society.

If honesty and honor were profitable, these polls and statistics would expose a much more bleak and dark picture of society.

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

It makes you wonder, if the number is closer to 50% like you assert, how are all these guys coping without any sex? I know we talk about obesity, guys hiding away playing video games and watching porn, but are 50% of the male population really doing that? I doubt it. Among that 50%, there's probably some highly driven guys who see their friends regularly, take part in hobbies and have a career, but even they are not getting laid!

[–]EvolvedVirus0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

No they are. Every guy I know is (a) doing hobbies (b) playing video games / porn (c) just watching TV, working hard on career (d) learning, teaching, building stuff...

I mean people are definitely doing stuff outside of chasing women. Many might have also gone overboard with health/fitness etc., but haven't yet had success with women.

A lot of young guys typically may find a target girl from their workplace or school and are just trying to plot ways to date them thinking they are making slow progress.

[–]jackandjill2243 points44 points  (62 children) | Copy

Come on guys stop acting so surprised. We all know what the Fuck is going on here we just refuse to acknowledge it. We need to get over this "Incels are freaks anybody can be a Chad logic" the reality is this SMP is harsh as fuck & it doesn't require much for the majority of us to be pushed by the wayside. You can keep spouting that Redpill "Boot-straps rhetoric". but this shit isn't easy.

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (1 child) | Copy

People will never admit this , coping is a mechanism engrained in every single one of us .

By admitting that some incels are incels only because of their genetics , they’re also admitting that it’s almost impossible for them to become a top 20% male, an alpha.

They would rather believe they’re “failing” because of their game because you can always improve your game. After you get the basics down and get over the fear /anxiety part (which won’t take you fucking years of rejection like some ugly fuckers in here would have you believe) ,improving game becomes irrelevant .

Looks on the other hand are almost impossible to improve after gaining some muscle and losing bf .

Lookism is real

[–]jackandjill221 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Hm. Interesting take.

[–]loloLogic2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Have you seen what Mystery looks like? Anyone can do it.

[–]BlackPillHolocaust1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Tall as fuck with a decent face

[–]loloLogic1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You're right, my bad. I was thinking of Style.

[–]scanfan202224 points25 points  (6 children) | Copy

Apathy and poor mindset play a major role. "Why should I even try? I'm going to fail anyway."

Lots of young men are stuck.

[–]jackandjill229 points10 points  (5 children) | Copy

Who can tell them any different against the odds they face bro.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

odds are higher than playing the lottery yet people still play lottery.

[–]jackandjill224 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy

That's because it's the American mentality. The Lottery effect. "I can clearly see this game is rigged which is going to make it better when I win this."

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

but with dating it is not rigged, too many variables.

[–]jackandjill228 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

idk man. If you look at these stats similar to social mobility & class status it seems pretty rigged to me.

[–]the13thmonk55 points56 points  (6 children) | Copy

It makes sense

You’re asking trp which was essentially developed to combat this phenomenon

Hypergamy doesn’t care

[–]Aymane22118 points19 points  (0 children) | Copy

Damn that’s fucked up. Hypergamy is real

[–]BlkLeatherCouchActor 1 points [recovered]  (65 children) | Copy

Have you seen how many obese people are out there? Given that statistic, it’s hard to believe it’s not higher. Shit diet, no fitness and shit environment will cultivate incels. Once those incels get tired of being rejected, they identify as “mgtow”. It’s an incel putting purpose to being an incel.

[–]resnine35 points36 points  (5 children) | Copy

It is likely higher. Because men overestimate their sexual activity and women underestimate their sexual activity.

[–]EvolvedVirus7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yes I think if a poll says 33% of men aren't having sex. The real number could be closer to 66%.

Even guy friends lie about their sex lives sometimes to make themselves seem more awesome. Sex is too attached to peoples' pride. Many guy friends won't even share any frustrations with women, they won't even talk about it because it might expose themselves as bad with women.

[–]resnine5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

People always do this shit, they round numbers and tack on a few percentiles.. because, eh why not? The original stat was 28% not 33%. That 5% is a huge difference actually.

[–]MountainEphiphany 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

The study says 1 in 3 men havent had sex in the last year. I find this incredibly hard to believe, I dont think I've gone a year without sex for the last 10 years. The longest I went was maybe half a year by choice, and it was ended by a model who literally jumped me at a party I hosted. An unattractive dude can even get an unattractive woman. I know a woman who is not good looking, but is fwb with a guy she says has a small penis, and is also ugly.

[–]geo_gan2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Never mind the last year, many men have not had any sex for many years.

[–]null_isomers15 points16 points  (3 children) | Copy

Came to say this. 66% of AMericans are overweight... this stat is not surprising

[–]SalporinRP8 points9 points  (2 children) | Copy

Yeah but obesity is something that is a bigger problem with guys older than 30 though than younger guys. It's certainly a factor but can't be the main reason.

[–]BurnieSlander5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

Obesity is just one factor though. Another factor is social retardation. Another is the fact that 90% of dudes simply don’t approach regularly.

[–]resnine0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Technology has hindered mens social skills to the point of social retardation. And technology has made it easier for females to isolate Chads and disregard anything less. It's these too factors.

[–]Thelvl1bandit38 points39 points  (7 children) | Copy

40% of americans are clinically obese. 66% are either diabetic, or pre-diabetic (meaning their bodies have started developing resistance to insulin). 12% are on SSRIs, which are powerful anti-physcotic drugs commonly prescribed for depression. In other words, a large percentage of our population are undesirable as partners.

Also porn exists (instant gratification). I guarentee a lot of incels could get laid if they turned off the computer, and talked to real flesh and blood people. (If you reading this are an incel, i understand this is easier said than done, and escaping self-destructive behavioural cycles is difficult. I sympathize with your feelings of loneliness. But you as a human are worthwhile, and you can choose to be the person you want to be. No-one can take that away from you. No-one is bound by their past failures, and you have the freedom to choose to be your best self. The hardest part is making the choice.)

Im honestly suprised more people arent incels (statistically).

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 18 points19 points  (20 children) | Copy

Aged 18-30 though. Vast majority of guys at this age are not obese. I've walked around university campuses and not seen a single obese guy. Obesity is only a major issue among older men.

[–]Captain_Quick 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

You're seeing the fit guys walking around, not the obese and overweight guys sitting in their dorms.

[–]BlkLeatherCouchActor 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

Lol exactly. Just like you don’t see many obese people riding bikes, doing yoga...etc.

[–]EvolvedVirus6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

"I can't see them, they must not exist"... Pollsters probably can't even find them to ask the question.

I bet you the real number is 66% not 33% who can't get laid. Women are incredibly picky.

[–]resnine17 points18 points  (7 children) | Copy

It's not obsesity it's apathety and lack of social skills due to porn, video games, and social apps.

[–]BlkLeatherCouchActor 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

And shut diet. It all mixes together

[–]I_Dont_Type5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

Add on the larger interconnected world we have where female hypergamy can thrive and you know that this problem is going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

[–]resnine2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's not getting better, how possibly could it? Technology is only going to advance more.

[–]DiscipleBrown-3 points-2 points  (3 children) | Copy

I’d say I have a lack of social skills, and addictions to porn and video games, fuck social apps. But I’ve still fucked four women, two for a few months where they were plates. So it has to be the apathy.

[–]EvolvedVirus0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Then you look amazing, met them through friends and they were desperate, or you are fucking fugly whales.

A lack of social skills will get you denied sex within the first 15 minutes of conversation. It will absolutely eliminate you from future sex potential (unless as I said above, the exceptions).

[–]DiscipleBrown1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Oh I’m far from amazing looks wise, I’d say the only thing going for me social skills wise, is I tease and am playful with girls naturally. Otherwise I can barely hold a conversation, and usually avoid social contact, I can barely interact with cashiers in stores. Yes, two of those were fat but I was also fat so that was within my potential at the time, the other two, one had a great body and nice face 7/10, FWB before she went back to her boyfriend in Colorado, the other one was curvy and I’d say 6/10, ha I can tease and banter, but am shit socially otherwise. Didn’t meet any girl through friends, I don’t have anyone I would consider a friend anyway. None of them I’d say were desperate, as after our fun they got boyfriends, or as above already had a boyfriend. One of the fat ones when I was done with her and ready to move on I told her to date one of our mutual acquaintances as a fucking joke, and she went and did it and now they have a child together, I still fucking lol at the thought of that.

[–]EvolvedVirus0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Thanks for explaining details and specificity. This should be encouraged so we know what exactly you were talking about.

3 of them were fat, maybe not whales but I don't usually try to date fatter girls. I can't do it.

But yeah so when I say "It will absolutely eliminate you from future sex potential" I am referring to thin hotter girls.

So maybe when you said "apathy" it could simply be "too obstructively high standards" or "desire to date only really hot women" which many men have.

It's obstructive because I've had complete loser guy friends who have expressed their desire for even hotter women than I do... It's clear that even the shittiest men are really after trophy wives that just don't exist in much of the real world.

[–]Thelvl1bandit2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy

Lol I think your definition of obese must be different than a doctors definition.

Also personal experience is anecdotal evidence at best, and anecdotal evidence isnt evidence.

Edit: for a male between age 18-40, 25% body fat or higher is obese by medical definition.

[–]TimPartendale10 points11 points  (4 children) | Copy

Over 25% is overweight; 30% is clinically obese and then they have three categories of obesity. There’s also “metabolic syndrome” which we’re seeing a lot more of nowadays.

But agree with you that we are so conditioned to overweight people that seeing someone with a 28 BMI is normal... he’s just chubby or big-boned. He has a “dad bod.” In reality, it’s not okay.

Edit: after looking into it, it might depend on the source as some say >25%. But most of the medical world uses 30% as the cutoff.

[–]Thelvl1bandit1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

Bto ur talking about BMI. BMI is bullshit.

[–]Thelvl1bandit1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Anything over 15% for a man is fat tbh

[–]TimPartendale0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Ah this. 25% BF, 30 BMI.

Yeah any dude that lifts consistently makes BMI look stupid

[–]Thelvl1bandit-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Or just anybody who does any kind of conditioning at all

[–]OracleofFl2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Obesity is also correlated inversely to education. https://amednews.com/article/20120525/government/305259997/8/

Regarding age, "The prevalence of obesity was 35.7% among young adults aged 20 to 39 years, 42.8% among middle-aged adults aged 40 to 59 years, and 41.0% among older adults aged 60 and older."

Wan to see obese people? Go to a real crossing of all people like a cruise ship or a lower end casino in vegas or someplace like Orlando.

[–]jackandjill221 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Bro don't listen to these guys. It's about money and status it can be anyone it doesn't take an outlier to be apart of these stats.

[–]saint_pill0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

https://www.cdc.gov/obesity/data/adult.html

"The prevalence of obesity was 35.7% among young adults aged 20 to 39 years, 42.8% among middle-aged adults aged 40 to 59 years, and 41.0% among older adults aged 60 and older."

I believe you that obesity is much less of an issue in the college student demographic you hang around, though. But this study was not limited to that demographic?

[–]Monkitail1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy

What is mgtow?

[–]BlkLeatherCouchActor 1 points [recovered]  (5 children) | Copy

Men Going Their Own Way. It’s a subreddit too. Many of them are undesirable men that “choose” to go their own way without women. This makes them feel that they’re the ones choosing to not be with women. Kind of like telling an employer “you can’t fire me, I quit!”.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (2 children) | Copy

I think its just men realistic with their smv who decide the only winning move is not to play.

Thats different than"choosing not to be with women" because thats not even on the table.

Any guy can find a woman willing to take advantage of him and string him along while he persists hoping for the proverbial crumb.

Refusing to be betabux makes you a mgtow unless you have high enough smv. I made a conscious decision that I wouldn't be betabux around 2005 before I was aware of mgtow/rp etc.

Even then I knew I was an undesirable who made just enough money to find a woman who was willing to resent me, and I wanted nothing to do with that. mgtow/TRP have just provided explanations for what Ive known for a long time and provided a vocabulary to describe the situation.

[–]jackandjill221 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Wow. Bold statement.

[–]Chamel-Echagaray2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

how i understand MGTOW is more like men that give it up, is not like “you can’t fire me, I quit!”, thats mean if they can´t find a woman they are like more "well, i don´t give you any attention because i kwon whats going to happen, i quit the man game", is like how to live a solitary life witout feel like a loser.

[–]TheStumblingWolf44 points45 points  (10 children) | Copy

Society doesn't embrace and teach making something of yourself anymore. Not personal responsibility. Everyone's completely sedated by the entertainment industry so they get all their dopamine at home.

[–]resnine25 points26 points  (8 children) | Copy

^This. Porn + Video Games + Social media = men with no social skills, apathy, and depression.

[–]EvolvedVirus9 points10 points  (7 children) | Copy

Also people forget good food and snacks that never existed as much as today. People are just fatter.

If you have a fat woman and a fat man, they are less likely to date, than if they were both thin. Fat people are disgusted by: fat people.

Top it off with the fact that our society keeps getting more isolated and less social... Making friends with strangers is harder than ever in the past. But remember, it's not as hard for women to socialize: "oh those shoes you have looks fashionable, let's be friends..." A man however, will have a situation where woman will walk away, end the conversation, put on headphones (which didn't exist for most of history).

[–]resnine7 points8 points  (6 children) | Copy

It's not obesity. It's apathy from men and dating apps. And on average there are more fat women than fat men, at least that's what I've noticed.

and that whole headphones thing is you male-hamster-ing, women would just ignore men in other ways. Technology sucks for the entire race, we should have just stuck in the 80s or something.

[–]EvolvedVirus2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy

Yeah why wouldn't some men have apathy when they have to swipe through 1000s of fat and ugly women?

Headphones definitely mean that people are less likely to start conversations and meet new people.

Obesity definitely has a role here, I don't know how you can deny it.

Apathy has a role as well, but apathy is a result of not getting easy results. If there is more apathy today than in the 1980s, then it means that something changed and apathy is not the root cause.

[–]resnine0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

There are plenty of dudes getting good looking babes that are obese. I see it all the time. Ffs look at St.Patrice O'Neal if his fatass took care of himself we might still have him here, but that didn't stop him from getting a high n-count. It's male hamster-ing, men getting lazier/apathetic about the dating world. I'll give that the apathy has probably increased a lot more due to more complex dating rules, but cmon, step it up guys!

[–]filthykarmawhore69 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy

You have a more positive outlook on this than I do but I really cannot understand what happened. Are our lives too easy? Is that responsible for this plague of the attitude that everything is bullshit? It's one thing to think that at 15 while smoking weed in a parking lot, it's another to make it to adult age and not gain any maturity.

[–]EvolvedVirus0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It's really that women have become much more picky and selective (because they can due to the abundance they receive).

There's also a ton more fat/obese women, you see them all the time but sometimes you don't see invisible swaths of them because they are at home surfing the net.

It's come to a point where if a woman is thin and single and not completely ugly, she easily gains attention of a lot of guys.

4 weeks ago, I saw a phenomenally muscular and handsome man at the gym, talk up a skinny girl who was sooooo fugly, that I would never have even thought of talking to her. She was literally invisible to me, but I only remembered her from the weird way she dressed. I'm pretty sure he got her number, but I would never even try for a girl like that.

[–]resnine0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Technology has made men lazy, afraid to act, docile, and nice.

[–]toker420blaze11 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy

Can confirm, I’ve made strides to get out of the instant dopamine loop but it’s still a struggle. Deleted all my social media (except for this and Snapchat) and my Xbox broke and I haven’t fixed it. But Netflix is still a problem for me.

[–]Nov5160512 points13 points  (9 children) | Copy

Pareto 80/20 gets more and more ruthless each day .im pushin 50 and it was way easier to get laid in the time of my 18-30s than it is now for the young guns. A dude has to have his LMS ultra tight these days way harder now to get them women really wanting him

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 6 points7 points  (8 children) | Copy

Why do you think it's got harder since you were a young gun?

[–]Nov5160514 points15 points  (7 children) | Copy

Well the way that women ghost guys so hard these days is unparalleled to when I was dating in the eighties and nineties and even early 2 thousands. Most of it I think is the dating apps and social media. They get all of the validation from thirsty Simps on social media and then they can super fine tune and refine their dating choices with the apps

[–]resnine3 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy

I've been wondering what dating was like in the 80s... must have been a magical time where people actually spoke face to face. Game still applied back then of course... dating rules are much more complex it appears.

[–]Nov516055 points6 points  (5 children) | Copy

oh yeah, man it was great. game def applied, but a guy fucks up alot more now because of the immense amount of rules/conventions that women have adopted. So by fucking up MORE, we actually learn more - they are effectively are gonna be left in the dust with that bullshit, hopefully sooner than later

[–]resnine0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

From the 80s to today what have you seen as something that consistently works on women to get in the lay?

[–]Nov516055 points6 points  (3 children) | Copy

indifference !!! no validation, except in little spurts, limit contact , keeps them guessing !!etc.. the 3 day rule is old now , so after a lay - it's a week or maybe even a few days more depending. But looking great, muscle tone, dressing well, not being a pussy,e tc.. are time tested

[–]resnine0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Interesting. Is indifference the same as IDGAF mentality?

[–]Nov516052 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

yup , its more of a chapter in the book of IDGAF. you still gotta ration out the validation, but be careful - it's a tightrope. lately my fuckups are using social media/dating & text game, etc... still adjusting

[–]resnine0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Good stuff. Thanks

[–]mrpoopistan25 points26 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'm amazed it's not higher given the level of social retardation that's prevalent these days. Anymore, most people can't even figure out when someone is flirting with them.

Read some of the questions people ask in this sub, FFS.

"There was this girl standing three inches away from me, and we talked for hours, and she even laughed at my jokes and said I smell good. Do you think she likes me?"

And remember: those are the ones who know they have a problem.

As much as there are definitely other factors, I think there are lot of people finding ways to leave runners in scoring position while watching perfectly hittable pitches go straight past them.

Signals are just traveling off into space completely unreceived.

[–]Bing_Bang_Bam23 points24 points  (5 children) | Copy

Women don't really like or care about men, and society deems them disposable. Plus most they were raised by idiot single mothers so they have no clue about how things actually work.

[–]culpam0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

Virtue signaling right here, MGTOW checks out

[–]Bing_Bang_Bam0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Signaling who's virtue?

[–]culpam0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

im german, so maybe im misusing the terminology, if so, im sorry

what I meant is that you seem to put the blame entirely on the womens side without self-reflecting

[–]Bing_Bang_Bam0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Maybe you should ask Merkel, you suarekraute eating Hun.

[–]culpam0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

lol

[–][deleted] 21 points22 points  (4 children) | Copy

Not surprised at all.

the tldr is basically hypergamy. you either need to have high enough market value that it works in your favor, or to be willing to put in enough time/money/effort to fight hypergamy.

A lot of guys are just not that thirsty, but just enough are to maintain the status quo.

[–]jackandjill228 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

To opposite. Dudes are hella thirsty but the SMP is so lopsided that it's not worth it so women just get showered with free attention upping their value even more.

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

what is the status quo in this case?

[–]thrownawayisland5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

I think he means the narrative that our society, men and women, are equal. If it was say... 2 in 3 men not getting laid, society might be fucked and have to actually address this shit situation. But for now, we can pretend we are all equal.

I’ve been wrong before though.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Basically hypergamy. I dont really want to rehash all the dynamics that enable hypergamy, it just results in a giant post of shit people already know.

I'll point to the beta stampede trying to wine and dine their way to a proverbial crumb.

https://i.imgur.com/6dNCWg2.jpg

[–]its_meKnightSwolaire18 points19 points  (6 children) | Copy

Pretty sure there’s a reason Islam is so tough on women.

All of this shit has happened before... and will happen again, and again, and again

[–]jackandjill2213 points14 points  (5 children) | Copy

You know, I said something like this. Whether the Bible is truthful or not, it probably had rules in place for a reason. & I'm betting the reason it prohibited lust in precisely to avoid exactly what we're witnessing right now.

[–]resnine10 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yeah I've had this thought before. Religion was set up because shit got out of control in the way way before time.

[–]its_meKnightSwolaire0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

In the Bible those cities were known for Child sacrifices. Today’s that’s called abortion. Sluts just getting railed and then sacrificing the child 🤔

[–]its_meKnightSwolaire11 points12 points  (2 children) | Copy

That’s what I am coming to realize as well

In the Old Testament we have the stories of saddam and gamorah... two cities full of sin.. it’s basically where we are today

[–]filthykarmawhore69 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

Except back then society was far more fragile and impermanent. So leaders needed more and harsher laws to stay in power.

Law enforcement is ineffective as fuck at catching people today. Imagine how it was in the middle ages. The reason punishments back then were so brutal is because with the odds of being punished so low, they needed something to provide at least a chance of deterrence.

[–]its_meKnightSwolaire0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This is like barely relevant to what I’m saying. I’m saying that all that degeneracy led to the fall of those civs.

I did not say we need to go back to cracking the whip on people, or stoning them, or anything like that.

[–]mushroom_overlord6 points7 points  (2 children) | Copy

This is what TRP has been talking about for the past few years. I don't know why its a surprise now, if you've been reading, how lower-value men are being shoved to the wayside because they can't compete when women are given better and better selection tools while being told by the media that they deserve a Chad even if they are a fatass.

The women aren't necessarily satisfied, either. But most girls think a Chad is attainable as a long-term option for them, so they keep chasing, or waiting for Beta Bucks that show up after the men maintain and advance their careers past their twenties. Typically, they end up settling down with a 30+ year old male and giving out duty sex after banging the passable part of the young crowd.

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

While that's partially accurate there's more to this story.

[–]mushroom_overlord2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

That's fair but what more would you like to add?

[–]Endorsed ContributorFereallyRed5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy

u/redpillschool just put up a post on the main page that explains this phenomenon well.

[–]BumblingBeta[S] -1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

Thanks. Can you re-post the link to it? I can't seem to find it from your links.

[–]Endorsed ContributorFereallyRed3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Title is...

What if social media is causing permanent mental retardation for those who grow up with it?

4th article down on main trp page.

[–]Zanford4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Unsurprising. It's easier than ever for women to jump into the soft-harems of elite men (thanks to phones/apps/social media, denser urban populations, a lack of cultural mores against being a slut, the ease of contraception or abortion, and the knowledge they can just bill the guy via court ordered child support if they do want to get knocked up).

Also, American obesity widens (heh) the SMV distribution. Fat people don't even want to fuck each other, so a lot of these incels are probably super fat guys, and even fat chicks manage to hook up with less-fat guys instead (girls fuck up, guys fuck down) despite the fact that fatness craters female SMV more than male SMV.

[–]asph1005 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

tl;dr - CONCLUSION: changes in culture result in a smaller percentage of males whom women find attractive, and the internet has increased women's access to the most attractive males, resulting in less access for the less attractive males.

I think that this situation can be traced to World War II, and globalization via the internet.

PART I: Culture

Before World War II, men generally worked and women took care of the home. When America finally became involved in the war, a significant percentage of able-bodied American men were sent to Europe to fight. Because of this, women took over the jobs that the men used to fill. They learned how to be the heads of households and how to be responsible for their own destinies. They developed skills and found out that they were, in many cases, equally capable as men.

Then the war ended and the men came home. Because society changes slowly, people returned to their pre-war roles and had a lot of kids - the Baby-Boom generation. This generation was born mostly in the 1940's, and some were born in the 1950's. During this time, there was a stigma against divorced women, and they often did not have the means to support themselves, so many women stayed in unhappy marriages because they didn't have a better alternative.

After the war, not everyone was happy with the return to the pre-war status quo and cherished the freedom that they had discovered, so they taught their daughters that they did not have to be the property of a man. This generation came of age during the 1960's when the threat of a world-ending global nuclear war caused it to abandon social structure in order to celebrate their lives before it was too late. The development of easy methods for manufacturing mind-altering drugs, such as LSD and birth control, accelerated the transition to hedonism.

BIRTH CONTROL: the introduction of birth control frees women from having to choose safe, boring men.

Women are attracted to unpredictability and resources. With the risk of accidental pregnancy nearly eliminated, women no longer had to plan for consequences. Consequently, they could defer the pursuit of safe, boring, responsible men for the chase of the bad boy.

As America progressed into the 1970's, and the Cuban Missile Crisis ended, the Baby Boomers, who had been raised by women who had tasted freedom, became active participants in society. They also wanted the freedom that their mothers had tasted, and the Women's Liberation Movement was born. Thanks to their efforts, women wanting the same opportunities as men became destigmatized, and it became acceptable for women to want it all.

The Baby-Boom Generation was now having children, and this generation was being taught that women should be ambitious and able to provide for themselves. They grew up and starting having kids in the 1990's, but now, because they could get better jobs and live alone, they were not getting married or getting divorced. This new generation, Generation Y, was being raised by single mothers.

SINGLE MOTHERS: the increase in the tolerance for single motherhood leads to a decrease in the percentage of alpha males.

Women are typically less confrontational, more collaborative, and more emotional than men. Also, since boys and girls have only one role model at home, they both learn female behaviors, which are considered beta in males, so a Gen Z male is more likely to be beta than alpha.

Although society has taught women that they should be equal to men and be attracted to men who will treat them equally, their biology still craves alpha males who will lead and protect them, so they still chase alpha males, resulting in the greater percentage of beta males with fewer interested women. I would argue that, empirically, this group of males represents a significant majority. As the ratio between women and men decreases, so does the number of men having sex.

PART II: Technology

Before there was the internet and when there were fewer people on this planet, people would connect based on their physical proximity. If you couldn't see them, you couldn't meet them. Therefore, one's dating pool was at most 100-200 people. This means that, on a relative scale, people were more attractive. Why? Because the odds of the most attractive person in the world being in ones group is very low, so the difference between everyone and the most attractive person in the group is going to be smaller. Also, with less competition, there is less motivation for the most attractive to try to become more attractive.

Another effect of physically participating in ones dating pool is that everyone can see the relationships and who the competition is. Not only does this discourage polygamy, but the social consequences of polygamy further discourages it.

The internet has broken this traditional social structure. One's dating pool is no longer 100 people. It is now 100,000, 1,000,000, or more. It also means that the most attractive people are more so. Now the most attractive person of the smaller group might just be 'okay, I guess.' Someone who was tolerable or even attractive in the smaller group becomes 'what did I ever see in him?'

The internet also anonymizes people. This means that a man who, in a small group, might be limited by peer pressure no longer has this constraint. Now he is free to have sex with as many women as he wants, and those women, having access to him, no longer need to have sex with their second choices, so that growing percentage of beta males has even less opportunity, further decreasing their access to sex.

[–]PimlicoResident3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

I am one of them. I had 4/10s interested in me but I could not be bothered. I would only put in effort into 6/10 and above. But they don't care about me. So whatever.

I did TRP things for a very long time but it gave me fuck all. I am below 6', like 5/10 in the face and am not good enough for Tinder generation. So fuck them. The only remaining pestering thought left in my mind is that I still pay taxes and this enables Chads to leave women fucked, and then my money pays for their bad choices. This is really unfair since I barely use any social services.

But government would rather destroy civilisation by serving m'ladys than make it worth it for men to contribute again. I am really cynical about the future. I am in the camp of "juice not worth the squeeze". I like technology, it is what gives my life purpose, working and improving it, but it made me an unappealing prospect for majority of women. The only role I could provide is money but I don't want to be divorce raped because "I am not happy because Chad did not marry me, and I have to barely be able to look at you".

[–]jackandjill221 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yikes.

[–]PimlicoResident2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

People on TRP like to comment how men should take pussy that offers to themselves but it is they who are weak men. No fucking standards, no principles, all just for 10 minutes of friction.

I would not be able to look myself in the mirror in the morning after waking up with 4/10 woman in my bed. I better off jerk off and go about my day.

[–]empatheticapathetic8 points9 points  (13 children) | Copy

Men don’t know how to pursue women anymore. This is why the redpill exist. They’re raised to feel shame about their sexuality. What’s all this shit about video games and porn. It’s a cop out reason. Video games and porn are the result of this, not the cause.

[–]resnine10 points11 points  (9 children) | Copy

It's a feedback loop. They are incel because of other reasons first (like looks/personality)... then they start watching porn and videogames, they don't approach, get depressed. The more depressed they get the more porn and video games they play. It is a cycle people get stuck in, only gets worse and worse unless the person pulls themselves out of it.

[–]empatheticapathetic8 points9 points  (8 children) | Copy

I’m the 30 year old virgin you were replying to the other day. Can just talk about my experience. Redpill has been the only thing that has given me any sort of guidance in my life regarding more than just women. No people or persons ever steered me in the right direction and I have not been lucky with looks and the place I have grown up. It’s a combination of poor factors. I’ve never played video games but yeah porn is a vice for most men, even those with women.

There is a serious lack of male guidance in society and this is the first thing we learn when we find TRP. My lack of success is a series of successive failures that didn’t breed confidence until I was able to assess it objectively via TRP. Most men are too engrossed in propaganda to really be able to see their situation as it is.

[–]resnine2 points3 points  (7 children) | Copy

Give me your progress report.

You are a 30 year old virgin, OKAY and just now assessing yourself and seeing reality for what it actually is, not some BP fantasy land. Now what have you been doing to stop being this beta? Have you watched The Last American Virgin? Are you Gary? That movie is a RP wake-up call. When you watch that you might actually feel ashamed at how much you relate to the character. He's a beta beyond belief and makes all the silly mistakes betas do (to a comical extreme). Basically do the opposite of what he does and you'll be doing yourself a huge favor. It's sometimes good to see a fictional example of yourself and realize how bad it actually is. Realize that all this stuff that we talk about on here, at it's base-level is biological/evolutionary. You need to elevate yourself at this point. TRP helps but after closing your laptop you have internalize and implement what you read or you'll be a virgin for the rest of your life...

[–]empatheticapathetic2 points3 points  (6 children) | Copy

I’m ready to go bro, just working on a few last things. I never complained about where I am either times we’ve conversed; I stated quite the opposite in the last thread. I found TRP 4 years ago.

I just have a few issues (mostly physical, mainly ED) I’m working on but I have plenty of options available. It’s just up to me to pursue them.

[–]resnine1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy

I'm glad you are woke. At 30 you must be ready. Hell i'd imagine a gust of wind would cause you to blow a load. I'm going to say don't go to a prostitute, which is often the touted advice to guys like you. The chase is worth it. The frustration must be unimaginable at times?

TRP 4 years ago? …. I've been on for a year. What's going on here? Why still a virgin? Makes me question how powerful TRP is. Some dudes come here and thrive after a few months and others just stay stuck spinning their wheels. You must have had opportunities? What happened? You had girls and let them go, why?

[–]empatheticapathetic0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

Well I have already been to a prostitute. In the last thread I mentioned this. I went 7 times in total a few months after starting TRP, only got sort of hard/erect the first 2 visits.

Quite the opposite, I have trouble getting hard. I got two girls into bed at a music fest last year but couldn’t get hard as per usual. Still trying to work on that. I also have back problems which I believe contribute somewhat to my ED but I’ve always had ED. Otherwise I would have lost my virginity at 21.

I would have easily fucked within the first months of TRP but there were other lifestyle factors in the way and I still had a lot of mental baggage and ED issues.

For the record my testosterone levels are good.

[–]resnine1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

The ED is psychological then. Yeah I think I remember us talking about NoFap right? Keep on that and do some hardcore mediation and yoga. Id even suggest taking a break from TRP. At this point 4 years in, you have all the information you'll need to be successful. Going deeper down will just cause you to overanalyze and overthink situations. I notice most alpha guys just really don't give a fuck about a lot. I think you think about sex too much and it's causing you issues.

[–]empatheticapathetic0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

I think the last statement is the cause of all of my current issues. It’s not even the sex, it’s just the circumstances around it.

Yeah I don’t really read TRP anymore for the reasons you’ve stated, especially since the quarantine. And when I stopped is when I started attracting women a lot more (still only small fry).

Somewhat psychological for sure. Nofap doesn’t help me at all, after experimenting with it non stop for 4 years, it just kills my sex drive.

Meditation and dropping my phone is the cure but I’m just being weak.

[–]resnine0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Have you seen a doctor about the ED specifically?

[–]2johnnight2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Men don’t know how to pursue women anymore.

Men never had to know how to pursue women, because there was social pressure on BOTH genders to seal the marriage deal in their early twenties (and then they had socially approved sex). You don't have to be a master car salesman if a motivated buyer shows up at your lot.

What we have now is men wanting to 'test ride' all the time, women wanting to land the car sale deal of the year, single mother wanting to sell a beat-up car, etc. Everyone is looking up glossy ads of new cars on the internet, rejecting what is offered on the street. 30% say they didn't own a car last year.

The market is out of balance, the demand curves have shifted away from each other.

[–]Michael_Uchiha60 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Great analogy!

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

it's contributing factor, I think. And quite a lot. It's way easier to go "escapism route" if you have video games and internet full of porn. Before you had a choice of staying in your room or going outside, nowadays you can stay in your room and "experience being outside".

[–]Endorsed Contributormallardcove12 points13 points  (2 children) | Copy

Yes I believe it. Go out in public. Most men are skinny fat or outright fat non lifting slobs with low SMV.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yet I doubt those guys do not get laid

[–]resnine1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

The stats don't back you up on that.

[–]resnine8 points9 points  (22 children) | Copy

Men aren't trying and failing to see the point. I think most are just simply frustrated and feeling apathy. Like the whole "the juice aint worth the squeeze" mentality. Plus you have Porn and Video-Games, keeps all the beta men at bay, so they don't try as hard. And growing rates of autism, and people are becoming consumed by their phones so social skills are at all time lows. Social skills get you laid. I think there is a growing consensus amongst the 80% that they aren't playing at a level playing field with Chads and dating apps.

They wouldn't be incels if they had more motivation. I don't care how ugly you are, if you put in the work, with all the essence of your being, you would get laid. The 28% of men just aren't trying.

[–]jackandjill226 points7 points  (3 children) | Copy

It isn't a level playing field.

[–]filthykarmawhore69 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

Places where level playing fields exist:

  • artificially landscaped fields meant for sports
  • Zen gardens, though monks won't appreciate it
  • salt flats, distant from most players but naturally flat

Notice the absence from that list of: place of work, school, bar, courthouse, frontline trenches, bank, and your mother's womb while her and your father's DNA is being recombined.

That should clear up a key misconception about life.

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I get it you do what you have to do to win. But I'm just saying. The games seriously tilted here, like the odds are really stacked against your favor. As George Carlin once said.

"it's a big club & you ain't in it."

[–]perplexedm5 points6 points  (16 children) | Copy

Men aren't trying and failing to see the point.

What if they already saw the point and found all that jumping through loops is not worth it? What if they found that women will anyway prefer the top 20% of men are only worth as dating material aka trp is real, after few years they will be chucked out like pressed sugar cane?

What if women in tinder jig fuck and chuck environment is showing their true animal colors and men are disgusted with that?

Also, https://www.businessinsider.com/climate-change-birthstrikers-refuse-children-2019-3?r=US&IR=T

[–]Pluglord0 points1 point  (14 children) | Copy

What if they already saw the point and found that jumping through loops is not worth it?

Jumping through what loops?

You talk to a girl, build comfort, set up logistics, and go for the kill. The only loop is rejection. Guys nowadays act like you have to complete a quantum physics equation to get your dick sucked. The girl either will fuck you or not. Be honest with yourselves and just say you’re afraid of rejection.

[–]perplexedm4 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy

You talk to a girl, build comfort, set up logistics, and go for the kill.

LOL. dude pls. Don't be so hilarious.

[–]daymi3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

... it's true. If she sets up hoops, don't jump through them. It's a shit test.

Her: "I wanna get flowers, be wined and dined etcetc" Yeah, no, they really don't.

Her: "People usually don't go home with a guy the first night" The hell they don't.

I once thought I had to jump through all those hoops. It was all in my head and because men take things too literally. What she wanted to hear is the confident answer "No" to these funny ideas. Now I'm much better. Aint nobody got time for those hoops. Strangely, the women go with me. WTF?

[–]Pluglord1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

A lot of guys here still hold on to these blue pull tropes.

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Why would you build comfort before having sex? I thought comfort was the antidote to sexual attraction.

[–]Pluglord0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

When I say comfort I’m pretty much talking about getting her comfortable enough to meet up with you or go on a date.

[–]jackandjill221 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy

It's jumping through hoops. Dating has never been more complicated.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy

have you lived in those times "before"? Dating was always like this. You go up to a girl and ask her out.

[–]resnine6 points7 points  (5 children) | Copy

Dating has NEVER been like this. With dating app tools allowing them to select Chad like a bigmac at the drive-thru. MSM reinforcing land manatees to keep chasing Chad for the long-term and disregard the beta average guys. As well as feminism pedestalling all women as pure goddesses and men as complete trash/servants.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Irrelevant to the point I am trying to make. It was always the on MEN to make a first move. And a second move and the rest moves. Men must do it to get laid. Yet you bitch about apps. Women still are much more open to Chads who cold-approach, not chads who just swipe right on them. Yes, women have now much more power yet you can not control human nature through apps. Women like brave men, not men who just sit in their room and use tinder all day.

[–]Pluglord-1 points0 points  (3 children) | Copy

It doesn’t fucking matter.

1960, or 2019, you still do the same shit to get laid. Theres no secret code or magic formula. You shoot your shot, get rejected a bit, and eventually you’ll find a girl who’s down to do the deed. Rinse and repeat. And you do this until you’re not a bitter incel anymore.

[–]MoneyHungry283 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

Im living proof you can shoot 20k shots and miss them all

[–]Pluglord-2 points-1 points  (1 child) | Copy

If you’re that fucking unattractive (physically or nonphysically). Chances are you wouldn’t be getting pussy at any time in history, so I wouldn’t blame it on women or out current SMP. You have to be realistic as well.

The good news is, there’s always hope. The way to compete as a hideous guy, is to compensate in other ways that create value (if a guys not a male model, chances are he’s compensating in some way even if it’s just a teeny bit.)

One look at your profile tells me your whole existence is focused on being an incel. Whatever you put out into the universe is what manifests back to you. Put that energy into making yourself desirable in some way (whether it be through money or staus) and then talk to me.

[–]MoneyHungry280 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Sure let me just go make myself successful brb

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy

what if those men are too weak to accept the reality of the red pill and women's hypergamy and they become too scared to even try? It's not woman's fault the world is how it is. Men used to be brave and courageous and asked out women. Now they better play minecraft in their room because of fear of rejection.

[–]redpharma77899 points10 points  (11 children) | Copy

Yes.

It’s not that hard to climb up to the top 20% now.

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (10 children) | Copy

This is the wrong answer.

[–]1redhawkes-3 points-2 points  (8 children) | Copy

Go whine somewhere else or stop being a fag and implement TRP.

No one gives a fuck about woe is me bullshit here. Become Pareto's man.

[–]MoneyHungry282 points3 points  (7 children) | Copy

Nobody gives a fuck about your dickhead statements

[–]jackandjill221 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

He isn't ready for the truth.

[–]1redhawkes-3 points-2 points  (5 children) | Copy

Go circlejerk in incel subs aspie, not here.

[–]MoneyHungry280 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Whaaaa whaaaaa sounds beta you wanna be hard ass

[–]MoneyHungry280 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

What you gonna do when im up in your face barking like a drill sargeant telling you how beta you are

[–]1redhawkes-1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy

Tell you to change your tampon pussy ass incel fag. No one gives a fuck about your wet dreams here.

[–]MoneyHungry280 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Keep holding your masculine frame bro, but id be in your face like WHAT THE FUCK YOU GOING TO DO BOYYYYYY WHAAAAAT WHAAAAAT , then you start having a break down like a little girl. And id be like HOLD FRAME BOYYYYY YOU BETA CHUMP

[–]MoneyHungry28-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Lol yeah youre beta sitting there with your pussy bleeding

[–]1FixYourselfFirst7 points8 points  (2 children) | Copy

Video games and online porn allowed boys to get all the dopamine they wanted, without ever learning how to interact with the opposite sex.

[–]geo_gan4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Social media, massive amount of attention from thousands of betas for every picture they post of themselves, is the equivalent dopamine hit for most good looking girls these days too.

[–]iwviw0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Also social media, YouTube internet, Netflix, apps, iPhone iPad

[–]humzy2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

shitty parenting

[–]ProFriendZoner2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yes I can believe it is that high. It's all about single motherhood. No male around to set an example or teach. And it's only going to get worse.

[–]InsidiousCurve2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Think about it.....if they are below a 5, and factoring in that a women will only sleep with someone 1-2 places above herself on the SMV, then that leaves the guy with a 1-2 female SMV. On top of that, standard incelhas zero social or communication skills, thus he can't start or hold a conversation.

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

I think with social media these days, even the women who are 3/10 think they deserve at least a 7/10 male. If you open a Tinder account and you're bombarded with messages even when you're ugly, you're going to eventually believe you're hot. This is the case for women these days. 10-15 years ago, this wasn't the case - Facebook was barely around, Instagram didn't exist, Tinder didn't exist, online dating was in its infancy, and smartphones were primitive at best.

[–]pridebrah0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

factoring in that a women will only sleep with someone 1-2 places above herself on the SMV

Not true. I can think of 3 women I personally know that are early to mid 20's, good looking, successful and in the past 6 months have all slept with someone far below their SMV. Not only that, 2 of the 3 openly shit talked the guys they fucked talking about how much of a pussy they were and their betaness eventually became repulsive.

[–]geo_gan2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

You would have thought it was 10%?? Why would you think that? If we know all women are only really interested in the top 10-20% of men, why would you think the bottom 80% of men get it easy? Or are even interested in putting up with women’s shit given the easy alternatives of internet porn?

[–]Moldy_Gecko3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Sounds like the 80/20 rule to me. Also, most men only have average 12 lifetime partners, so highly believable. Just glad I'm in the minimum once a week club.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Because it's hard to get with girls for most people and people don't like Blaming themselves

[–]hang_all_sjws1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Lack of social skills from too many computer games. Too much pornography which distorts their perception of women and sexuality. Decline in average testosterone levels. Increasing unemployment and hence disengagement. Increase in women's employment and earnings means that they are less likely to trade sex for money like they used to a few decades ago.

[–]goomerall31 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

This can't be true...

[–]cringworthycomment3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

I blame the unkempt beards. This trend is only appealing to other men, very few women care about your stupid beard. Even if you are ripped, make money, keep it very straight and clean and shaped well, you will still be looked past. Women don't like them, so stop having them.

Next time you are out and about just look around, the beard to no-beard ratio is astounding, and the unkempt beard to well groomed beard is off the scale.

Oh and it doesn't help when you have an entire flock of feminists and companies like Gillette telling these guys afraid to swallow the red pill that even approaching a woman is perpetuating a me too situation.

[–]geo_gan1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Flock is too nice a collective term, I’d say “coven of feminists” or “herd of feminists” is more like it...

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

So they're basically incels.

no they are not. Click-bait title

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

I would class not having sex for a whole year as incel. Given that every 18-30 year old man wants sex, they are incels.

What's your definition of incel?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

My definition of an incel is a guy who have never had sex. That's common generally accepted definition and used everywhere. It's a guy who havent had sex at all, yet. So if you had sex 2 years before but haven't had it 1 year ago then you can not be an incel. Maybe you were slaying for 10 years and then went MGTOW later? That's why such definition is problematic.

So incel = virgin in this regard. No matter what the intention was of the creator of this word "incel". It's way easier to put people in boxes, those who had sex and those who haven't. But not those who maybe had 10 partners in their 20s and then zero partners in their 30s. Are they suddenly incels?

Actual incels would disagree, I'm sure.

[–]jackandjill22-2 points-1 points  (1 child) | Copy

Disagree. Your point is made but for intents and purposes it can also be used to describe someone on a dryspell for prolonged periods of time for reasons outside of their control.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

it can also be used to describe someone on a dryspell

yes and that definition would be problematic. It's disingenuous to lump those two groups of people together, I think.

[–]THEMIDLANDMAN0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

2 stats I'd be interested in
How many of these men were married ?
How many of these men who did have sex in the last year use prostitutes ?

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I'd be interested in the second one in particular. Imagine if prostitutes didn't exist. I think a far higher percentage would never be getting laid. However, my impression is that prostitutes are mainly used by older married men (aged 40+) who aren't getting sex from their wives anymore.

[–]Terdmuffin0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Without meticulously examining the study it's important to note that 28% of the men in the study are incels. Are their samples a truly representative of society as a whole?

[–]Harambe4400 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I blame easily accessible porn, the pussyfication of America, lack of men doing “men” stuff.

[–]JoMax2130 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

If women stopped being so uptight about being a hoe and we all just had the fun sex we wanted I just think we’d all be happier, we’d get daily rainbows, and the sun would smile

[–]Emperorvoid0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

BRING BACK THE PATRIARCHY! BRING BACK STRONG MEN! BRING BACK THICK SKIN!

[–]beginner_0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Looking at these young men I think 30% is actually low...And if you ever go out just observe just how many of these young men just stand around or maybe dance a little but never make a move. This implies 2/3 make a move but in my experience it's far lower...And then there are the few that absolutely rule the location.

[–]temerity180 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

The figure for femcels is probably similar.

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Absolutely no chance. Femcels don't exist. There are enough men out there who would stick their dick into anything.

[–]Luckyluke230 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

because feminism

[–]Ravenscar70 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I honestly think it's about 80% since some incels out there are still getting pussy. Desperate whale pussy but still pussy.

[–]deathhandmachiavelli0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Why is it so high?

Because American men are cowards. They have been influenced by the media and society at large and have freely given away and shunned their masculinity.

Women find cowards and non-masculine men to be sexual turn-offs (even though we are bombarded with messages that say the opposite).

Since men are less masculine than they used to be, and less manly, they are less likely to provoke female sexual attraction.

In the aggregate, females are less attractive to males in the United States in biblical proportions.

Some people blame it on increased female choice - yes, this has a lot to do with it. But the main reason are cowardly, weak, soft men.

[–]pridebrah0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Women find cowards and non-masculine men to be sexual turn-offs

Sort of. In the long term, yes. In the short term, they can get pussy too through showering a girl with validation. I just made a post in this thread about a few girls I know that have fucked beta's and then shit talked them in the past 6 months.

To quote one girl, "At first those [beta] guys turn you on but after awhile they're just...ewww"

[–]AnyDoughnut0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Common red pill knowledge, most women would rather share a higher value man than get stuck with a low value beta. Things are going better than ever for high status men. They are swimming in vagina and don't have to commit to any of them.

[–]Aggressive_Beta0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

You’re ignoring the fact that some of them are MGTOW. I went MGTOW (unknowingly) for 3 years. I actively turned down pussy that came to me. I was extremely focused on my mission and didn’t want any potential female drama whatsoever to distract me from it.

[–]thenorthhighlander 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

It sounds like you’re pushing an agenda by saying 1 in 3 when the affected group in your sample is 28%. Why not say 3 in 10 men? God damn propaganda.

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I did say almost 1 in 3, which is technically correct here.

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Why's this so triggering? Out of curiosity?

[–]SalporinRP-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

Obviously people will blame women and chalk it up to dating apps, social media, and hypergamy but I'd say possibly bigger factors are video games and porn.

Firstly they're a dopamine rush so guys are addicted. Secondly they are a massive timesink. It's pretty impossible to improve yourself and and game women when you spend 4-5+ hours a day gaming. Thirdly, in the case of porn it drives down guy's sex drives. Porn is so much "easier" so it makes guys not want to pursue women as hard. Add in the social media era making guys have a lot worse social skills these days and these are the results.

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It's the first and then some.

[–]___Lana___-1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy

Then it just means that these bottom 30% are not considered good enough for reproduction. They are too weak, too short, too stupid,... whatever. Their genes are not meant to be reproduced.

[–]jackandjill220 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

How far is this argument going to go as the stat figures keep creeping up. When 2 years from now it says 50% of men apart of the age bracket are unmarried & underfucked is our conclusion going to be, "Well half of the population just is inferior genes & shouldn't have families" this would be the first time historically that anything like that has ever happened.

[–]___Lana___0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Let’s reformulate : these 30/50% appear to be weak to the eye of women. And women don’t want to raise children with a weak man, nor take to risk to give birth to weak babies. If men are getting weaker, that’s your problem not ours.

And then if anyone says that society made men weaker, I’ll say the medias are to blame, which are mostly directed by ...men.

We are to many people on the planet anyway. Why are You even worried for that bunch of losers? As alpha men you should be happy with that statistic, it means more girls for you ;-)

Think further, these guys don’t get laid, don’t make babies, live, die. It means that the future generations of children will be hopefully be raised by the stronger men of the basket. Better for humanity.

[–]WhyNotJustEnjoyLife-1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy

Cause 1 in 3 are losers... Obvious answer. If you're barely presentable and over 18 you get laid

[–]BumblingBeta[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

If you're barely presentable and over 18 you get laid

It's not quite that simple. I guess you're new to The Red Pill. I suggest you read up on hypergamy, Tinder, the sexual marketplace etc. on here.

[–]WhyNotJustEnjoyLife0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Nope I lived it and saw it in real life over and over again. I'm not denying that there aren't a population of guys who are voluntary celibates but the involuntary ones are losers. Barely presentable means not having your fat gut stuck out of your cheeto dust ridden metalicca t shirt and not having a neckbeard which if you didn't know 1 in 3 people are actually like that and those guys make girls sick to their stomach.

You don't have to be rich to have sex with a female

[–]_Anarchon_-3 points-2 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's the increasing number of faggots being raised

[–]tkavalanche24-3 points-2 points  (0 children) | Copy

A few contributing factors I can think of:

-More devices, later nights spent using devices surfing instant gratification like porn, which leads to worse sleep, addictive habits, worsened health, lower testosterone, decreased confidence etc. They’re also looking at screens more, which means more blue, artificial light, which means less melatonin production, which means less quantity and quality sleep, which equals less drive, focus, testosterone, health, etc, all things that are attractive to women

-The availability of porn affects men more because men are more drawn the sexual imagery than women, men seem to prefer visual erotic stimuli, more so than women

-Men are also more drawn to violent video games, which in my experience, are highly addictive, more late nights ensue here. It appeals to the male psyche, war, violence, appeals to hero’s journey (Carl jung, Joseph Campbell shit) that all males have a deep desire of in my opinion

-The momentum that the feminists have right now. It’s all over mainstream media and Hollywood film, which dominates the mindset of mainstream culture. Most girls are taking pride in all this female domination shit, and it’s intimidating the bottom 28% of men, making them more submissive and “nice guy” ish around women, making them less likely to get laid. (This bulletpoint and mass psychological phenomena deserves more weight than I give it relative to my other bullet points)

-Chemicals in our environment that are endocrine disrupters, and lead to less testosterone. Soy, chemicals in plastic, parabens, phthalates, BPA, etc. even electromagnetic radiation from devices, wifi, phones, etc can disrupt sleep, this testosterone, brainwaves, reduce sperm count, etc. This shit is everywhere

-All women are affected by the chemicals and electromagnetic radiation too, therefore their sex drive and health are negatively affected too, but the fact that women are the gatekeepers of sex, even though women are less healthy and horny, they still can choose to have sex on command when they want, and that simply isn’t an option for the bottom 28% men, since females are the genetic selectors. This explains the disparity between men and women in 2019

-increased prevalence of depression and therefore libido decreasing and erectile dysfunction* inducing drugs like SSRI antidepressants. again, women are affected by this too, but they are the gatekeepers of sex, having sex when they want to with no challenge. Many guys on SSRIs simply aren’t out there trying to get laid bc they aren’t horny, and they won’t if they don’t try, unlike women.

*which btw can cause a whole other world of problems, sexual confidence and esteem issues, etc, which inhibits going out and getting laid



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