695,976 posts

Course Corrections and a Word on the State of the Manosphere (Stop Being Cunts Edition)

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June 13, 2019
281 upvotes

Every so often the mod team has to post minor course corrections when the topic starts to stray into nonsense land.

Obviously, there is a lot up in the air right now because everybody in the 'sphere decided to get collectively pissed at each other. It's petty. And I've had a heck of a lot of dudes approach me telling me to "pick sides" or to "ban this" or "ban that."

It's disappointing to say the least, because it ignores the very principles of how TRP operates and why we've build such a great community while others have tried and failed.

My goal since I took over (way back when) was to facilitate the discussion of sexual strategy in a culture increasingly lacking a positive identity for men. This goal has not changed.

Inherent in this goal is making sure nobody takes over the forum and tries to subvert our purpose or co-opt it to do something devious or impure. But also implicit in this is giving the forum breathing room to hash out new ideas, to discuss both sides of arguments and to suss out new understandings and predictions.

Obviously, there is a range of discussion that's simply off-topic for our forum, and there are some disingenuous argument styles (BP trolls) that are out-of-bounds on the grounds that they do not discuss in good faith and come from such a wildly different perspective that never the two viewpoints could meet in the middle if we allowed it to play out long enough. This has always been understood.

But I think a fair number of you forgot that beyond that, TRP is a set of tools and what you decide to do with it is up to you.

I had read the essay I link in this post and I think it really articulates the mental framework I've used in the previous years, though never explicitly stated. Read that link if you haven't. But the short of it is this: There is theory, and then there are practical applications and personal goals that you can decide on knowing the underlying theory and philosophy.

I've been asked on a number of occasions why we insist on keeping the MTGOW flair, or why LTR and PUA would be discussed in the same place. I see a number of offshoot groups leave TRP because they think their prescription is better than others.

I've always taken pride in the level of intelligence and discourse that takes place here, but there's a mental block many can't get over- which is entertaining opposing ideas at the same time. I'm not a MTGOW but I see the logic in their choices and see nothing wrong with the approach. Does it fit my needs or goals? No, it doesn't. But that doesn't mean that I want them gone because I can't fathom the idea that other people have different goals and strategies than me.

Notice I said "prescription." That's because all of this talk and argument about the best lifestyle choices is simply a debate on prescription. Meanwhile the core of TRP remains descriptive and predictive, but not prescriptive as a group.

That's not to say that you shouldn't consider your choices and it certainly doesn't mean we can't or shouldn't discuss, debate, and weigh the merits of different prescriptions.

But for fucks sake people, stop asking me to endorse one prescription over another. It's not going to happen. It is your choice how you're going to live your life. Nobody else's.

Recently due to the drama I've had factions come up and ask me to ban other factions. It's childish and it's antithetical to my goals: which is to facilitate the discussion of sexual strategy.

If I ban one viewpoint because people don't like it, then the discussion never takes place and then all we've done is endorsed a viewpoint with no logical or rational basis for having done so.

Here is the problem. Some of these groups have gotten downright stupid with each other so I'm restating some rules here to help everybody understand:

Stop with ad hominem. It's annoying, it's low brow, and it doesn't belong here.

We are a discussion group with a level of decorum that doesn't resort to petty insults to get our points across. You will discuss ideas respectfully or not at all.

Stop with the antisemitism.

I don't care if it's another red pill, it's off topic for this forum and it just looks juvenile.

NO MEMES

This place isn't a place for memes. Never has been.

Stop getting your panties in a bunch because somebody disagrees with you.

This is the place for hard truths, not comfortable lies. People are going to disagree. If somebody is disagreeing in a disrespectful manner, Report the comment to the mods, don't engage.

Thank you.


Post Information
Title Course Corrections and a Word on the State of the Manosphere (Stop Being Cunts Edition)
Author redpillschool
Upvotes 281
Comments 84
Date 13 June 2019 03:27 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit TheRedPill
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/242490
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/c077i0/course_corrections_and_a_word_on_the_state_of_the/
Similar Posts

Red Pill terms found in post:
dramalong term relationshipthe red pillmanospherePUA
Comments

[–][deleted] 111 points112 points  (10 children) | Copy

TRP is made to make real men. If you participate in the drama happening you are not going the right direction.

[–]Bad_nuggets6944 points45 points  (1 child) | Copy

Drama is a tool used by those with power to entrap and distract those under them.

Falling for drama is exiting your frame. Amused mastery is looking at drama, laughing at it, and continuing on your way, unperturbed.

[–]Skyhawk_And_Skyhead9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

You have to treat drama like it's a TV show. It might be fun to watch morons air their dirty laundry in public but at the end of the day it doesn't affect you, I'll go grab a smelly t-shirt and start waving it around yourself. It might be fun to watch by the end of the day none of this involves you and when you start picking sides you just seem like a teenage girl going Team Edward

[–]Senior Endorsed ContributorRStonePT9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

"real men"

This term is more nefarious than feminism, and is used to funnel guys into someone else's corral.

TRP doesn't make you a real man, it's just tools, you build your own

[–]That_Deaf_Guy3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Glad someone said it. I remember reading one thread the other day about that summit (whatever its called) and the whole comment section looked like a "he said, she said" discussion.

Who gives a flying fuck what those guys are doing in their spare time? You have all information available to you at your fingertips, use it! Fuck a summit! (?)

[–]clavabot2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Observing the drama is quite good tho, as it is a great case study for 'children with dynamite' and therefore by extension participating is an effective tool for diagnosing Where You Are, depending on who you side with provides valuable insight into your psyche.

[–]pragmaticminimalist24 points25 points  (0 children) | Copy

Excellent Reset and Reminder for this sub- which has been somewhat of a quilting bee lately with all the drama.

TL;DR- Read the sidebar, keep it positive and hold frame, gentlemen.

[–]_-resonance-_11 points12 points  (8 children) | Copy

I’m surprised the link between MGTOW and TRP isn’t acknowledged as a bridge and a positive, like two tribes that trade with each other. PUA kind of led me to MGTOW which led me to TRP. In my mind, there is fluid connection, notably: MGTOW helps cultivate DGAF attitude, which can be used to attract women not out of need, but actually a form of abundance (not with women, but joy in life). A woman in that scenario is not a goal or a necessity, but a byproduct of self-fulfilling living.

*note: I’m banned from posting in MGTOW for citing too much TRP theory, but I still trade with the other tribes and think that TRP shows acumen by allowing these connections in one place.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

The MGTOW sub isn't too fond of us, but I welcome them any time over here.

[–]MoDuReddit0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

MGTOW

Cult with no scientific backing, a.k.a. pseudo-science.

> TRP

Red pill of the harsh reality (supported by science).

I deny association with science deniers, but that's my opinion.

EDIT: I am dumb and confuse things.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

The fuck? MGTOW doesn’t need any science, it’s just men doing their own thing what the hell kind of scientific backing does that need?

[–]MoDuReddit6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

Sorry, I shouldn't drink and post, confused MGTOW with NoFAP.

[–]EdmondDaunts2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Science deniers is an interesting term as most academic scientists actually practice it regularly. When you construct hypothetical arguments it is easy to extrapolate it to reality.

However testing and trying to break shit then finding out it still works, to paraphrase Feynman, is a better test. It also relies on action not words.

[–]MoDuReddit0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Science deniers is an interesting term

I doesn't mean what you think it means. It means "people who reject the conclusions of science because they don't align with their previous beliefs" -> see creationists, flat-earthers, anti-vaxxers, etc...

[–]Recovery098 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

This was a breath of fresh air for me and re-affirmed why I still come back here. Real truth can't be ignored and (as obvious and needless as it may sound) I'm glad to see it stated that commitment to the mission remains paramount over drama.

[–]Chargedman7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

Is it just me or do people talk too much on this sub? Just get on with it and do a field report.

[–]TRP Vanguard: "Dark Triad Expert"IllimitableMan7 points8 points  (4 children) | Copy

RPS, TRP forums and TRP.RED is the rock of stability the manosphere needs.

Everyone else is embroiled in the waves of chaos.

[–]destraht3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy

Everyone else?! Jesus LOL. trp.red feed has been abut wading through the most aggressive low brow nasty shit everyday. redpillschool doesn't want to get into censorship due to some pecker heads so he's letting it play out and is instead working on technical solutions. That much of his strategy was obvious which is why I wasn't another guy PMing him about laying down the law. I have a person messaging me once in a while because that bit is a decent conversation and he isn't interested in wading through that main filth because there are other things to do in life.

[–]TRP Vanguard: "Dark Triad Expert"IllimitableMan2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

The shit you see on there is spillover from the wider community. This community's management actually sets about imposing order - no other forum, twitter account or blog even approximates the quality of leadership that you can find here. Not saying it's perfect.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

That much of his strategy was obvious which is why I wasn't another guy PMing him about laying down the law.

One of my solutions will be a dev tribe so we can talk code once the new design is up.

[–]destraht1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I was thinking more along the lines of pushing everyone else into an everything_but_code tribe.

[–]ChadowyFigure7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

This is the first post I've ever upvoted. Stay on topic, stay open-minded, and don't be pussies. Let's figure some more shit out and come up with better techniques by breaking each others' balls in a civilized fashion.

[–]Irtotallynotrobot13 points14 points  (0 children) | Copy

A lot of people express trp as an ethic when it's really just a set of tools and instruction manuals. People want to identify with something, be a part of a whole. That makes it difficult for them to locate the individual preference between the iron rules when they're so busy trying to follow a rigid plan based on their interpretation of fluid discussion.

To some people, the thought that there are multiple interpretations is threatening and immediately deserving of conversational nuclear payloads.

[–]PaulAJK6 points7 points  (7 children) | Copy

It's like the entire manosphere coming down with a bad case of PMT at the moment. Shrill, annoying, boring for onlookers, but no doubt highly emotionally satisfying for the people squealing the loudest. No-one's coming out of it particularly well, with the possible exception of our own GLO, and even he was half an hour late for a fucking interview.

[–]good_guy_submitter2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

How to be immune to the bullshit: Lift

[–]destraht-1 points0 points  (4 children) | Copy

I thought that was a pathetic interview. Much more on the side of the bizarre guy hosting the call but overall demonstrating immaturity. Right after a GLO minion leaked a private call with an EC after taking mad shit about him right before and after the call. There is the GLO who writes good engaging posts here because he can't get away with anything less and the beyond antagonistic GLO + Fight Club minions which operate at places without moderation like trp.red. I bring it up because its night and day. At the end of the day it makes me thing that this impending Reddit axe is the only thing keeping this place on good behaviour. I predict that if keeps on this path that it devolve into GLO vs anti-GLO factions with many side-liners who are uneasy about picking winning sides of an argument. [because this quarantined channel is bound to be banned someday].

[–]Endorsed ContributorJamesSkepp4 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy

It would be a mistake to simplify this as GLO vs anti-GLO, as 2 sides and only one can win. There are things to be learned and black-white mentality will only obscure the search for truth, not help it.

[–]destraht2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I just witnessed the last fews of trp.red GLO groupies carpet bombing the main feed with their coordinated shit. That drew the battle lines. There are as many real agendas as there are people but with that kind of belligerence you have to be on one side or another. Oh so you're neutral? Lets see how long that lasts after being called a pussy faggot 500 times.

[–]PaulAJK1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yep, at the end of the day we're all trying to improve ourselves and become better men, we can learn from anyone. Some of that means imitating other people, othertimes it's doing the opposite of what they do. Even from the very same individual.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

One of the best ways to grow as a person is to be mindful of dissenting and disagreeing opinions. This allows you to question your own beliefs and further refine the principles that you hold dear to yourself. Those who whine about an opinion just because it hurts their feeling are being ignorant to information that will help them and placing themselves in a restrictive mindset. Keeping this a forum for open discussion is commendable, bravo.

[–]DeeplyDisturbed12 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Don't underestimate the lengths that some groups and people will go to in order to take subs like this down. I would not be surprised if some lurkers or even regular contributors actually hate this place and do shit like this - I have seen it in other subs where it is almost impossible to detect, but you can tell when someone is stirring up shit.

[–]Dilpil012 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I've avoided redpill for a few months now for these exact issues. This sub was at its best when it was focused on understanding female psychopogy and physical improvement. Not circlejerking repetitive awats posts and hyper aggression towards any differing ideology. Ironically, it reminds me of extreme feminists, who are quick to pick a fight with anyone that disagrees with their viewpoints.

I hope it returns to its roots.

[–]asvender2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Personally, have not seen even a single post about antisemitism and nobody cares about semitism or antisemitism, here. Why do you highlight and insist on this one, while there is no instance of it? Actually, this makes me want to be on antisemitism part, while see someone pushes this hard for it. As long as it is relevant and related to the post and subject, there is no such limitation and anybody can express his opinion and jews are not different from other religions and people.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Personally, have not seen even a single post about antisemitism

The words you're looking for are "thank you."

[–]igniortix2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Excellent post, glad that this subreddit has mods like you. Other mods from other subreddits would have just participated in the decline

[–]BillyRedRocks1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

" Inherent in this goal is making sure nobody takes over the forum and tries to subvert our purpose or co-opt it to do something devious or impure. "

You can't have that without banning certain groups. If the latter day Saints come preaching here you'd ban them outright, even if they were an EC one day (NeonReactionSafe). The problem here is you're not seeing where the insurmountable differences in approach/goals lie. The LDS don't care about the red pill and neither do the occultists.

You'll either have to ban all the gammas that come with that or let them slowly turn this place into their own garbage fire, just like the LDS would turn it into their preaching room. Or you'll have to cut at the source. For me this isn't a "hurr durr I disagree with him censor naaaO!" argument and it never has been.

PS: Riding the tiger is a stupid fucking idea and anyone who's actually lived it IRL knows that.

[–]IvyExcess0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I agree with you, but elaborate on why riding the tiger is stupid.

[–]BillyRedRocks0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Because the metaphor is wrong and inaplicable to the real world. You're not riding a tiger, people just use it as a way to shorten the distance between fantasy and reality so it's easier for them to lie to themselves.

IRL tigers win, especially if they're not tigers.

[–]Jourdanis1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

See this people? This is why I frequent this subreddit over any other, even if I disagree with a lot of people on here.

I know this should be basic, but thanks for not being like 99% of reddit, thats not porn or memes, and creating an echochamber on purpose.

[–]DarkSyde30001 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I left for a few days and civil war happened between various factions here? There's factions here? People are messaging mods telling them to take sides? Weird. I thought we were just a bunch of dudes discussing the goings on in the world and where our place should be in it.

[–]NotBlameTruth1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Good post. I've seen more and more posters--mainly "endorsed contributors" of all people--writing out bullying, self-flagellating nonsense here. I've seen people swearing one way is THE way and not even considering other ideas. The "fat ugly friend" thread was a sad case of people trying to undermine someone's success because it doesn't fit THEIR idea of success.

Not gonna engage with these folks anymore, just gonna report them. Thank you for this.

[–]LeatherBoundWisdom5 points6 points  (10 children) | Copy

Who's this specifically referring to?

[–]Omnidempotent5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy

A lot of the shit RPS is alluding to here is 10X worse on TRP.RED.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

But is being fixed in our next big update!

[–]destraht1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Its illuminating to see how people would operate if they weren't constrained by the channel rules here.

[–]ChefCremeFraiche 2 points [recovered]  (6 children) | Copy

I’ve member seem antisemitism on here. The only thing close I’ve ever seen is a few people talking about what they do to little baby boys when they’re born, and what the rabbi does with his mouth after, but no “down with the Jews!” Talk. I think OP wants to feel authoritative.

[–]1Obediah_Stane9 points10 points  (4 children) | Copy

Votes don't mean anything here. Don't let it get to you. I've seen hard truths get downvoted to hell but it doesn't change the facts.

[–]ChefCremeFraiche 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy

Im not bothered at all, it’s just puzzling how on here people would downvote facts. I actively encourage anyone to downvote me because I give zero fucks about my “karma” every few months I get a new username to rid myself of any reddit score like karma that people seem to get so addicted to. I don’t comment for reddit karma like a lot of people do.

[–]Dirkz0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

"I don't care about karma." "Every few months I get a new username."

Hamster is strong.

[–]MoDuReddit-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

Spin spin baby! Internet points are real and important!

[–]destraht1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Jews are used to flair up emotional response for the illustration of a point. It makes people not want to be a part of an argument discussing abstractions around dead Jews. Step 1) Make a point while incorporating dead Jews, Step 2) Throw out a subtle bit that you aren't endorsing it. Now you own an argument that is beyond the reproach of most people of higher sophistication because they; 1) don't want to talk about dead Jews, 2) Don't want to be perceived as literal minded dumbasses for complaining about your choice of example.

[–]MIND-JELQ5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

No ad hominem? No memes? Sounds like your boy "buy my alpha shirts and coaching" gay lube oil needs a time out.

[–]1Sir_Distic1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Why?

[–]Olongapo1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Here, here.

[–]Blackhawk24793 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

If I ban one viewpoint because people don’t like it

Then you’re no better than the liberal left, the SJWs and the feminists who go to great lengths to shutdown opposing opinion.

We’re better than that.

[–]rpsheepdog15 points16 points  (0 children) | Copy

, then the discussion never takes place and then all we've done is endorsed a viewpoint with no logical or rational basis for having done so.

Finish OP's quote

[–]bowsenira 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

So if it's not Rothschild Zionists propogating cultural marxism, multiculturalism and degeneracy in the west, then who is it?

[–]Olram_Sacul0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

this is a good question. Add capitalists to zionists and the question is even better

[–]2INNASKILLZ2K180 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Can't well aaaallll just get along???

[–]Fulp_Piction0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The development of the sub into a kind of ideological centre of thought is changing what this place is. People start turning to a forum for life advice instead of thinking for themselves.

There's no trancendence into alpha, there are only choices you repeatedly make. You reach nirvana when you realise that nirvana doesn't exist.

[–]1Obediah_Stane0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

If anything, us men have to stick together in an increasingly hostile world that will punish even the slightest deviance from social expectation with instant ostricization. Other men are not the enemy here. All men are at risk of losing any form of masculinity we have left.

[–]priapula0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yall should bring back weekly automoderator self-improvement threads. Like if you agree

[–]UnleashYourLife-12 points-11 points  (8 children) | Copy

Jews are a no-no but rest are still fair game right? That's at least what it makes it sound like when it's just Jews and not racism altogether.

[–]Modredpillschool[S,M] 20 points21 points  (7 children) | Copy

It's this shit right here that makes me go heavy on the ban hammer. No, racism in itself has always been against the rules. But the recent influx has been specifically JQ heavy.

Familiarize yourself with the rest of the rules while you're at it, in no way was this list exhaustive. (you knew that)

[–]UnleashYourLife-8 points-7 points  (6 children) | Copy

Oh I know the rules, but this issue is strange to me due to your willingness to be cryptic about everything else but Jews.

Fuck giving them attention, just say racism. You had no issue with it till you mentioned Jews. That was my issue.

[–]WarViper133711 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy

He mentions it specifically because in just about every comment section of this subreddit you have people making some kind of antisemitic reference at some point. This is not the place to debate those kinds of conspiracy theories and it needed to be addressed.

[–]Modredpillschool[S,M] 9 points10 points  (4 children) | Copy

There's nothing cryptic about this. STOP MAKING THINGS INTO A JEWISH CONSPIRACY.

I literally just got done re-iterating this rule, and here you are breaking it.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (3 children) | Copy

Blink twice if it's the Jews making you post this....

But seriously, it's hard to take anyone seriously when they start ranting about religion. Leave the gods out of discussion were here discussing sexual strategy and betterment, not different flavors of God bothering.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

Jews are a race, not a religion.

[–]MoDuReddit0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

So if I convert to Judaism, I become their race? ahahahahha

[–]Vikingcel3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Not suddenly. But over several generations your offspring will start growing big jew-y noses.



You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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