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(Xpost from asktrp) My wife is depressed, and I would appreciate some insight so I can help her

Reddit View
July 2, 2019

We have been married for almost 17 years. Financially and professionally life could not be better. My career is at a point where the comfort I can provide for both of us is more than I ever could do before. And this is after we moved for my job which as an added benefit brought her closer to her family. No kids yet but we seriously are discussing it. On the surface things looks great. We both go to the same gym, and lifting has had obvious benefits beyond the physical ones.

But while my star is rising, my wife is in an absolute rut. She laments that I would be better off without her, that she holds me back in life. She despairs about her body image, and has no drive to advance herself into a real career while also feeling inadequate about being a house wife. We signed her up for real estate courses so at least she could become an agent but she dropped out of that.

Is her depression unwarranted? No. I admit that I helped light this shit on fire. Five+ years ago before our move I was the one who filed for divorce back when I couldn't deal with her depression and generally being a belittling bitch to me. I even had an affair after filing (short one, regretted it as we were trying to patch things up and confessed everything). At the time when she threatened a revenge affair I told her I would leave her instantly and resume the divorce if she did that, as sex as an act of revenge was something I considered too evil to allow in a life partner. We tried going to therapy and things did improve, but I'd say it was more that she improved enough to convince me to stay.

Now back to the present.

Sex happens but it's not good or frequent. I get her off but frankly she does not do the same for me. So I stopped caring about pursuing sex with her. It happens when she is horny and I solve that for her. That sums up our entire sex life.

I bring home the money and do about 30% of the chores. She has a massive amount of luxurious time each day to pursue hobbies, to find work, or to read or play games, or even go out and socialize. She seems to prefer to sit in a corner and read. We watch shows together and play video games together, but for a lot of our time recently it feels like we're roommates with occasional benefits. And she is socially isolating herself. She seems to wallow in self remorse and pity. She clearly has suicidal thoughts but I don't believe she will follow through on it.

Long story short I am working diligently to improve myself. My workout goals are aggressive and the results are pretty good for my age. My career is one of unbridled ambition. She even complimented me that she likes that I am a tyrant in the workplace. But I am stumped on how to lead her in a way that helps her feel whole again. She isn't going to seek help on her own. I asked her to see a therapist even if it meant going without me but she refuses, stating that she doesn't trust them or indeed anyone (including me), that there isn't anyone who won't hurt her or betray her.

(New info since original asktrp post)

I have read the Married Red Pill post about Depressed Wives and other common posts and the mantra of "it's your fault" however while I acknowledge my own responsibility that post doesn't provide me with insight or a roadmap. I need either some insight into the sidebar material that I've either misunderstood or a different interpretation of RP that helps highlight this situation. Multiple posters on asktrp urged divorce, and I appreciate the cold hard candor. I have been down that road before, and while this isn't oneitis I am very reluctant to go down it again. I was a significantly lower value male early in our relationship and dealt with depression and confidence issues of my own and she stuck by me back then. I was shitty in how I repaid that, and I want to exhaust efforts in helping her before just calling it quits.

Post Information
Title (Xpost from asktrp) My wife is depressed, and I would appreciate some insight so I can help her
Author darklogic420
Upvotes 17
Comments 51
Date 02 July 2019 04:10 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit askMRP
Original Link
Similar Posts

Red Pill terms found in post:
liftthe red pill

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

You are a tyrant at work & get shit done. Do you turn off that energy when you get home? Cant remember which book it was, but you need to treat your life the same way you conquer work. Don't 'punch out' at 5PM and veg out until the next 'GO' time.

Sex God Method talks about emotion... I found verbalizing the physical traits i like about my wife, during and outside of sex, have really increased her self confidence. She eats it up.

Last piece of advice. Turn off the TV (video games or watching shows together.) If you are choosing to spend time with your wife, go do something fun AND physical. Dont go somewhere that results in you sitting down and turning off your brain (restaurant or movie, etc..) - go do something that moves your bodies. Increase the physical energy between you. Examples; Bowling, Rock Climbing, Axe Throwing, Golf Range. Give her a high-five, or get one yourself, if one of you does well... Just try to be more fun. Even going to a 'board game bar' resulted in far more positive experiences then binge watching netflix with my wife.

[–]darklogic420[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Will reread Sex God Method. Thank you for the advice about physical fun. I'm definitely implementing screen free date nights for us.

[–]helaughsinhidden8 points9 points  (8 children) | Copy

"it's your fault"

It is... your fault.

She clearly isn't a helper on your mission or a first mate on your boat. You took off and forgot to bring her along. Without kids for her to take care of, a business to run, or some kind of goal to contribute to, then she feels useless. And no wonder too.

So, what is she? A tourist? Aging eye-candy? I don't know if having kids is a great idea at the moment, but late 30s, early 40s is ADVANCED AGE for having kids and considered high risk by that fact alone. She's got only a couple years left for this to happen naturally. She's like an aging athlete past their prime with zero championships who either wants to get released to sign with a playoff team that has a shot or for team ownership to make some changes that give her some hope. Without one of those options, they are unhappy AF no matter the money.

Having kids to save a marriage is a horrible idea. Period. Full Stop. That said, I think you waited way too long to still be "considering" having them. Indecision is weakness. If she wants kids and you don't, she's depressed knowing she spent her beauty, youth, and child bearing years with you and time is running out.

Shit or get off the pot!?

[–]darklogic420[S] 0 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy

Just to clarify: the kids aren't to save the marriage. Whether she and I are together or not children are a goal of mine. It's just a question of whether my kids are with her or not. If with her then we are running short on time, true.

[–]helaughsinhidden5 points6 points  (5 children) | Copy

Whether she and I are together or not children are a goal of mine. It's just a question of whether my kids are with her or not.

So....more indecision. If it's not her, cut her loose.

[–]darklogic420[S] 0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

I wouldn't have posted to askMRP if I knew what to do already. That is kinda obvious.

[–]weakandsensitive0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

asking people on the internet to make your decisions for you is fucking retarded beyond belief. people like you absolutely deserve everything they get.

[–]darklogic420[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

And yet here you are posting a reply on a board on the internet. That makes you trash just like me, but at least I admit what I am you filth.

[–]weakandsensitive-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

It's cute you think we're the same. But tell yourself whatever you need to. You'll do you.

[–]darklogic420[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Of course it's cute. I'm fucking adorable.

[–]krystyin5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

You just made your decision, "whether she and I are together" - you want to leave, "children are a goal of mine" - you want to have kids. Sunk ship fallacy is that by investing more time it will improve - it won't. Why are you trying to solve what is the job of a professional therapist? I am not advocating leaving, but rather being honest with yourself and ultimately where you will end up in 20 years - please - don't put kids through a relationship that isn't showing love by both the husband / wife - they don't deserve that.

[–]UnbreakableFrame8 points9 points  (7 children) | Copy

I disagree with the general sentiment that we are solely responsible for the depression of our wife. There are many more factors that cause depression than relationships. A post-wall woman with no children and nothing to distract her is almost guaranteed to be depressed. She is neglecting her most important, time-sensitive biological imperative. In some cases, women have careers or other things to distract them from this feeling of dread, but some women have nothing. Your wife is one of those women with nothing. Introverted women who don't know how to distract themselves are going to feel this existential dread so much more than other women.

That's not to say that you aren't doing anything wrong, but I believe the above statement is likely true. I also think that you are unbelievably indecisive about some really important issues.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret5 points6 points  (6 children) | Copy

I'll challenge you that he IS responsible for this shit.

He's been married 17 years to this woman. And indecisive as fuck. They still don't have kids, but they both want them. She's unhappy, yes, because of the reasons you mention above. But why is she like that?

Because OP here didn't lead. He was a shit leader who didn't bring his wife along for the journey, and instead treated her entirely as an annoying deckhand that ocassional comes up from the depths of the ship to get laid.

Now you're telling me that OP here didn't cause all this? He did.

So, it's his fucking fault.

That's not to say that you aren't doing anything wrong

I think you got this right here.

He's been fucking up a long time. Now his wife is really depressed. The only time he was able to get her out of this shit he created was by fucking another woman and filing for divorce where her dread levels went to imaginary heights. But guess what? He was still the same lazy motherfucker afterwards with the only thing to show for it was another N count.

OP made this bed. He is responsible.

[–]UnbreakableFrame1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy

I could have phrased my response much better. Rather than saying that her depression isn't fully his fault, I should have said that her depression is rooted more in a persistent circumstance that he's created in their lives than some set of actions that he does or doesn't do.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret5 points6 points  (4 children) | Copy

That's some good clarification. But I still disagree, but in an esoteric way. I'll get off topic here for a bit.

I'm working on a theory about the exchange of energy between female/male relationships. I am starting to believe based on my own experiences that women are naturally the negative force within relationships because it presents the masculine with challenge. The masculine thrives on challenge. The feminine thrives on praise.

Given OPs words here, he probably very rarely praises his wife for the actions that she does that he enjoys. He even said that sex is blah. If it's blah, it's his fucking fault. We all know why.

some set of actions that he does or doesn't do

This is where we diverge. I believe that he had all the opportunity earlier in his relationship to smash these challenges she presented, so he WOULD have to do something - or nothing at all (such as STFU). He's been failing tests for 17 years. That's alot of fucking failure, and clearly she's still with him because he's beta-bux and fucks during her ovulation.

If OP would just do SOMETHING rather than complacency at least he'd get results one way or the other.

So yeah, it is all about what he does or doesn't do.

Fight the negative with the positive. Accept the challenge of AWALT and he might have a chance.

[–]UnbreakableFrame1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Damn, that's some awesome insight. Thanks for sharing.

[–]darklogic420[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

There's a definite Yang (Male) vs Yin (Female) to your theoretical framework. I don't like the way you say (or deliver) some of it regarding me and my situation, but I definitely appreciate the content.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

You dont like it because it's true, or because it hurts your fee fees?

This is called Own Your Shit for a reason.

Toughen up, Captain.

[–]darklogic420[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

The truth hurts. Thanks.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret13 points14 points  (4 children) | Copy

I have read the Married Red Pill post about Depressed Wives and other common posts and the mantra of "it's your fault" however while I acknowledge my own responsibility that post doesn't provide me with insight or a roadmap.

I'm the author of that post here.

You're not fun.

You're enervating.

Your wife is sitting around just begging and hoping that you'll lead her to a fun place, but you don't provide that for her. She looks to you to provide her everything in her life because.... AWALT.

So yes, this is all your fault.

I will say this which is unique to the historically and chronically depressed woman that I married: her frame is shit. My frame is not. It's a place of abundance and great joy. Which one do you think she prefers to live in? Mine. It's an escape.

There is a part #2 to the post that is advanced, but you might give it a read now that you are trying to formulate a plan of action to steer the ship to where you want it to go.

Long story short: work on yourself, for yourself. Use dread. She will become crazy. It will get worse before it gets better. Her bullshit will never stop. You must have the strongest frame out of anyone here at MRP.

Are you up for the challenge?

[–]darklogic420[S] 2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

This is the sobering reply that I needed. If there is any other material you can point me to (other than direct sidebar links) I would appreciate it.

And no, I'm not fun. I may be a bedrock in a storm but I'm not fun. I'll work on that, among the many other things I need to work on.

[–]stoicstephen6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

Read the Book of Pook.

And if the reason you're not fun is because you are afraid of being fun, then read No More Mr. Nice Guy.

[–]rocknrollchuck2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

[–]FoxShitNasty831 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Good reads

[–]man_in_the_worldRed Beret3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

Nothing is more stressful and demotivating than being left in a vacuum in which you know you're not meeting expectations, but nobody will tell you what the rules and expectations are. When you ask you only get polite but empty reassurance and "Participation Trophies," but no specific information or feedback. When you try to push boundaries the walls are padded and rubbery; your whole life is wandering through the fog waiting for the axe to fall.

Try giving your wife very clear and important tasks, your true expectations and boundaries, which are with real effort achievable by her but nonetheless challenging. Give her frequent, specific, and above all honest feedback both negative and positive, including honesty about the consequences to her of failure.

Clear out the fog and free her from this Twilight Zone you have trapped her in, which would drive anyone insane.

[–]darklogic420[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

She definitely believes that I'm going to give up on her, and my lack of positive or negative feedback probably leads her to that conclusion. I want to encourage her and be honest with her without being brutal about it to help her improve. I've been operating under the assumption that I have to deal with her depression first then guide her to improve, but I'm learning here that guiding her to improve in itself will help her depression.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yes, this is the key. Praise her for the things she does that please you, even if she doesnt deserve it.

Start there.

As she tries to improve just praise. You dont lead a woman by telling her she is fat - you do so by telling her that ass looks great on those workout pants. Use this example as a litmus test.

[–]ReddJiveRed Beret3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Depression is a serious issue and leads to worse things. you are thinking of having kids? Post partum is a dangerous mindset, and I believe all women get it but most come out of it quickly. The chemical wash their brains go through during pregnancy and childbirth is pretty intense. If she is already in a depressive state it can get worse. You do you but my first step would be to lead her to counseling. Not ask, not beg. I would make the appointment and tell her this is the day and time. then take her there.

From what I have read here I am going to venture a guess that her depression is a habit. It's how she has kept you around and you bought it. I say this because you haven't given us any idea into what may have truly triggered her depressive state, or meds she may be on. You may not think this important but a couple of the flared men have medical training (I am a paramedic), so these details would help shed some light.

My career is one of unbridled ambition. She even complimented me that she likes that I am a tyrant in the workplace. But I am stumped on how to lead her in a way that helps her feel whole again.

This sums up your entire mindset. At work you get shit done. you give no fucks and take no prisoners.

At home you are afraid of your wife. Don't deny it. You have internalized everything as your fault so act meekly. What would you do if a project at work, that you lead, was failing? would you walk around at your employees asking them to get to work? Begging them to attend meetings, or make the deadlines they were supposed to?

At some point it stops being your problem. Depressed people want help. they just don't know how to find it and most times they don't even know there is an issue. Once lead there they normally buy into it unless the situation is that bad then it becomes more of a deep psychological issue. I am guessing your wife has lived this way to keep you and now it's the way she lives. To lead her be that tyrant at home.

[–]Albertxcoffee2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Im not saying be a jerk, just take the lead, and see if she follows. If shes looking for a place in life then give her one is all.

[–]Albertxcoffee2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Of course, if you want a way to connect with her, find a book she's already read. Read it and after your done, talk about it with her. After that, take her to a bookstore and buy 2 copies of the same book. Then you'll have at least something to talk about

[–]Cam_Winston212 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Barely read past the title, but in my own marriage I had a wife that was so apathetic and lethargic (read: worthless) that we were both worried about either early-onset dementia or leukemia.

Turns out after a blood test that she was severely deficient in Vitamin D. A few weeks after supplementation & she was rounding back into the woman that I married.

For what it's worth....

[–]RStonePT1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Captain saveaho, reporting for duty sir

[–]FoxShitNasty830 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Just seen his recent update, it does confirm.

[–]Albertxcoffee1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Im just looking in as an outsider, but try playing the stereotypical husband and see if she plays as the stereotypical trophy wife. Maybe is the lack of a sence of purpose. Lead her into a position where she can fulfill that desire. Ask her to do the smallest lady-like and house-hold tasks. Im not saying you have to be a jerk like others will say, just be the bold, demanding man, but also be respectful. take command and let her follow you. Play house. While she's doing house chores, you cut the grass and do your other outside chores(take out trash every morning, make mop water, move furniture so it can be cleaned underneath.)
If your religious, go to church, without waking her. Wait for her to ask her where you've been after she wakes up. After a few weeks, if she asks to go with, let her. But trick her into choosing to set an alarm for herself. (Everytime you go, leave her asleep and tell her you didnt have the heart to wake her. One day, she'll get her clothes together and set her alarm the night before. Until then, learn about the church, the people, and how that church works.

When you tell her to do something, do something yourself. Tell her to wash the dishes after dinner while you write down all the money you spent today. Get up early and tell her to sweep and mop the entire house while you cut the grass. Work her hard,but with bold respect. Not brown nosing respect. Act like a strict mentor. And indulge yourself. If you like treating her like this, and she's entertaining it, then enjoy it. If she is enjoying it, then let her make you happy

[–]UnbreakableFrame1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

If your interpretation of the advice that other men offer here is them "being jerks", you have a lot to learn. Nobody here is advocating for being a jerk, just for knowing your value and acting as such.

[–]SorcererKingMod / Red Beret3 points4 points  (9 children) | Copy

You dumbfuck.

She literally brings no value to you. You bring in all the cash. You do 1/3 of the chores. You give her duty sex. She begs you to kill the puppy and instead you go the internet to ask us to tell you what to read to magically fix it. Amazing.

Here is why you are making this hard:

I was a significantly lower value male early in our relationship and dealt with depression and confidence issues of my own and she stuck by me back then.

You are still that low value guy in your head. That you even entertain this thought proves it. That's a Blue Pill/Nice Guy/altruistic self-effacing thing to do. "I was shit and she put up with it, so now I'll hang out and put up with it." That's seriously fucked up.

You two got married very young obviously if you can say married for 17 years and you're still able to have kids. Have you considered that neither of you were ready and you're different people now?

Each second that ticks off is one you don't get back. Don't waste them, retard.

[–]darklogic420[S] 0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy

On some level you're right that I still have that low level guy stuck to me and holding me back. But no matter how many red pills I swallow I don't abandon honor and hurt people just because I can, especially when they have done nothing wrong to me. Women are often weak, and even when they aren't moments of weakness still come round the bend. I can choose to climb the pinnacle of the world by myself and spin plates, or I can be married to a weak person otherwise known as a woman. If I'm staying with a weak person, I want to arm myself with strength and wisdom on how to best lead her. If the desire to be strong and lead makes me a dumb fuck, then frankly I pity you. You think moronic insults will somehow work to goad me to a specific decision you endorse. Get back in frame, just like all of us need to every now and then.

[–]Over60_FireTempered3Red Beret1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

Hey Mr. Dark Logic. Save this paragraph you just wrote.

Reread it when you are miserable at times. Every single thing you need to change is in it. Every bit of backwards logic that you let ruin your life is cleanly stated here.

[–]SorcererKingMod / Red Beret0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

He's too busy running the projector to self-reflect.

[–]Over60_FireTempered3Red Beret0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Great visual. Never heard that one before! Yours?

[–]SorcererKingMod / Red Beret0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

An SK original.

[–]Over60_FireTempered3Red Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Memorable. I'm amazed how often the 1000 foot rope is still used.

[–]SorcererKingMod / Red Beret1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I don't abandon honor

I'm trying to show you the causes here, but you keep identifying them as virtues. Get the pat on the back you were looking for?

Good luck, hamsterboy.

[–]darklogic420[S] -1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

Once again you resort to insulting strangers on the internet instead of relying on logic. Do you believe you matter? You don't. My life is my own project. I solicited advice with a limited set of aims in mind, with admitted indecision. My goals and yours don't align, probably because we are at different stages of life. Me having a frame that I'm in need of repairing isn't a reason to break your own frame. Don't get so emotionally invested in a stranger's life that you need to insult them, you're just demeaning yourself young man.

[–]SorcererKingMod / Red Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]sidepiecebandit0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I have read the Married Red Pill post about Depressed Wives and other common posts and the mantra of "it's your fault" however while I acknowledge my own responsibility that post doesn't provide me with insight or a roadmap

Lies. You haven't read shit, or should have read harder. The accepted knowledge is not that "it's your fault" but that it's not your responsibility to manage your wife's feelings. It's your fault if she treats you like shit. It's her fault if she does it to herself. Don't set yourself on fire to keep others warm, especially if they aren't cold. You're not that important. You will fail. You will become bitter. That's MRP 101.

Leadership is owning your shit, and if you do it well the roadmap will organically materialize. Either your wife follows or doesnt care to. Which means one of two things: 1) you aren't owning your shit 2) your wife doesnt give a fuck about you and is manipulating you into feeling guilty.

I have a feeling it's both. It's a tough pill to swallow, which you recognize and are too pussy to imbibe because of some arcane tenets of virtue signaling chivalry. Fuck off. You won't get a pat on the back, just a foot up your ass.

What your post basically says is that you've ignored two of the most important books of this group, NMMNG & WISNIFG, tried to get an answer from proponents of said books, and then acted like a bitch when you didn't get answers that reinforced your purple pill delusions.

[–]darklogic420[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I've not read WISNIFG. I'll get that next. I didn't lie about reading the specific posts I mentioned, but I did not state which books I had read.

Can you read those posts, specifically the Depressed Wives posts (the author commented here with a great follow up which provides clarity) and explain away the "it's your fault" part? Because it seems you're cutting me too much slack here and going easy on me. You cover it with rude insults, but really you're letting me off the hook in your reply by narrowing the definition of leadership to simple self maturity.

Look. I already have a foot up my ass. I got married way before finding the red pill. But now I'm 17 years into this shit. I'm not ever going to marry anyone else. So either I do this right or I go single the rest of my life because fuck getting married again. And divorce because she's depressed? I'd have to be prepared to burn far more than one bridge to go down that road. Honor is a code work for civil behavior that is built into social expectations we all place on each other. The "pat on the back" comes in the form of people trusting me and being willing to make deals with me. If I get a social stigma on my record my business is basically done. So you can keep your fuck off to yourself. I'll take the productive parts of your reply though, so thanks for that.

[–]screechhaterRed Beret0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

So who in the fuck stated that you stop living because you are married ?

Who is to blame that she and you “both” are bored ?

Read a little deeper in the sidebar. She hoped on a train that is finally getting some steam, but you have forgotten to “order her on board”. You’re fault

[–]darklogic420[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Ok it's my fault. This topic has been done by others and better. We've already moved past this point to work on a plan of action. Can you please add your two cents to the plan?

[–]screechhaterRed Beret3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

Essentially, step back and take stock.

What have you done for you lately ? What do you do that raises your SMV ? What is it that you can do that you can invite her to join ?

Tango ? Kayaking ? Biking ? Hill climbing ? Art museum trips ?

Do you trudge home and kick up your feet, taking about how tired you are ? Are you listening to her comments if being a tyrant at work ? How could she know this ? If you aren’t busy talking about and perusing interests and ambitions outside of work ?

Do you plan out your meals ? Do you prep ? Do you include her ?

Is your home something to be proud of ? Do you take stock and plan flower beds ? Tulip arrangements ?

Take 100% ownership in everything you do, include her, if she jumps on board, great if not, you have your answer

Whatever you do, walk in the house, wake up, come home from a trip smiling and pursue your life and don’t let others derail you. This is called living and operating in your frame. Nothing beats a confident man, with a mission and not letting anyone distract you.

[–]darklogic420[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Do you trudge home and kick up your feet, taking about how tired you are ? Are you listening to her comments if being a tyrant at work ? How could she know this ? If you aren’t busy talking about and perusing interests and ambitions outside of work ?

This hits the nail on the head for me. I definitely have a work mode and a home mode (possibly several other modes if I'm honest with myself). Work mode is high energy, intense, and aggressive yet intellectual. Home mode is relaxed with a desire to unwind: low energy, low intensity, passive yet still cerebral. I can see better now how I'm contributing to making things the way they've been for this long.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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