Why are there a lot of women who lie about not liking muscles?

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August 20, 2019

I know the saying "watch what they do, not what they say", but I even noticed that they are more likely to admit height matters or face matters, but when someone asks about muscles, it's more like "too much is too bad" or "I'm not attracted to muscles on a guy" or something along those lines, but of course, in reality, they go CRAZY over someone who possesses those attributes.

My question is that, why are they more likely to admit stuff like height mattering (I've even seen this on /r/askwomen) but when it comes to this kind of subject, they have to beat around the bush unlike other traits, when it's so obvious? Keep in mind that I'm not referring to steroid freaks who overdo it, but I'm talking about in general.

Post Information
Title Why are there a lot of women who lie about not liking muscles?
Author rafaelvicuna2
Upvotes 162
Comments 179
Date 20 August 2019 04:02 AM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit askTRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/249630
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/asktrp/comments/cssii9/why_are_there_a_lot_of_women_who_lie_about_not/
Similar Posts

[–]modSlyGradient[M] [score hidden] stickied comment (0 children) | Copy

I am just going to chime in here that there is strong evidence that some primate females, particularly humans, evolved so as to obscure signs of fertility.

You can google the scientific research if you wish. The point being that women have evolved to lie about their attraction. It is an evolutionary mating strategy. TRP is about learning to navigate that.

[–]CainPrice92 points93 points  (30 children) | Copy

Women don't like fat or skeletal or out of shape. Muscular is better than that. But they strongly prefer the lean, ripped, college athlete body over a jacked muscle-bound gym rat bodybuilder body.

The thing is, women have no idea about how building muscle works. They think that the lean, ripped college athlete build is a guy who maybe occasionally works out and eats chicken sometimes, while anybody who goes to the gym consistently is a roided up big guy. They don't recognize that the amazing, lean, ripped body is a 6 day a week at the gym commitment. They think that's just an average guy who's not fat and not huge and muscular. So they say "I don't like muscular men."

[–]Yggdrasil9322 points23 points  (6 children) | Copy

I’m really into evolutionary psychology and I wonder if there’s a reason for that. I mean I can see why if you were looking to chase down prey you’d want a guy with more lean muscle but at the same time being jacked shows access to a lot of protein (and thus a lot of hunting success).

I mean if I were to put together a hunting party to go chase down deer or mammoths or whatever I’d want a mix of lean and fast guys and slower and more jacked guys so they could specialize in different things. Maybe I’m overthinking it though and maybe the sticking point is that for most of our evolutionary history it was extremely difficult if not impossible to get enough protein to maintain large amounts of muscle so most guys were lean.


[–]CainPrice33 points34 points  (1 child) | Copy

Don't overthink it. Not long ago, fat chicks with wide birthing hips were desirable and considered healthy. Today, it's all about skinny girls in yoga pants.

[–]Yggdrasil937 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

I’d want a mix of lean and fast guys and slower and more jacked guys

You want to be a mixture of lean, fast, and jacked. All at once. Again, the college athlete. More yoked than jacked, honestly.

Big compound lifts get a lot of love around here, for good reason...but consider, a deadlift is a very natural human movement pattern. A few years back (not the more recent, pathetic example) a guy in Colorado scrapped with a mountain lion and ended the fight by pressing a large rock overhead and bashing the cat. It's hard to drag a carcass back to camp without doing something that looks a lot like a row (a dead row, pun intended).

Cardio gets some hate...endurance cardio is dumb, but base cardio is a fine idea. I'm lucky enough to have a park nearby with a 2.5 mile gravel running path, which is nearly perfect (one of these days I'll calibrate it to exactly 5k because those are fun to run). Beyond that is either diminishing returns or straight up counterproductive.

[–]Aymane2212 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

So no HIIT. You gotta be able to Sprint to get the kill

[–]Helmet_Icicle3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Population rates, nutritional availability, and social surpluses allow sexual selection to get weird.

[–]Thinkingard0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Steroids didn’t exist to create jacked people until recently so for most of human history it would be pretty rare to have thicc dudes

[–]Zech4riah6 points7 points  (6 children) | Copy

Good analysis and I've made a same observation when girls are surprised how often I work out. Like you said, it's 5-6 day per week commitment for years to get there and then to maintain it if you are doing it as natural.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (5 children) | Copy

maintain it

Still curious on that. I've been somewhat lazy this summer but 1-2 times a week seems to preserve my gains.

[–]Zech4riah4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy

Most probably you weren't in a good shape at the first place.

After going to the gym for about 13-14 years, I'm not gaining muscle mass or getting better results while I workout 5-6 times a week (well ok, I've improved like ~5% over the last 2 years). I only maintain my current condition.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

Dude, no, I'm in good shape.

[–]Zech4riah0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Well, then you have in human genes (assuming you are natural). Link a pic so we don't have to argue. We may were well be in the different page regarding the definition of "good shape".

This is me @ 89kg and ~10%BF. I define myself as being in good shape: https://www.dropbox.com/s/hm8klvvbn6oqgj5/td-cr-hd.jpg

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

You're in great shape.

back pic, don't have front pic now and I'm 47 on Sunday, and mostly concerned with not letting anything go pop. I've had a barbell for a little over a year.

Bodyfat is probably closer to 16% for me. I have a one-pack, basically....my stomach area is flat but the abs aren't defined. I don't care enough to eat exactly right. All I care about is the hallowed v-taper, and I swear about 6 months after I started lifting I got way, way more attention than I ever did, even at my old ass age.

I think it's fair to say I'm in good shape, but not great shape.

The end game of lifting is endlessly interesting to me. It's kind of like with running, you get most of the benefit from the first 7 or 8 weekly miles.

I lift for health as well as attractiveness. I've read differing opinions on this, but it really seems that one long weekly session, a full body split, would be enough to maintain gains.

A wrinkle I hadn't considered it keeping "good" shape is different from keeping "great" shape.


[–]Zech4riah1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Ok, it's my english then. Don't know all the nuances :|

The picture is'nt too great but you certainly look good for your age - actually you probably look a lot better than an average 20 year old. Get your stomach flat (BF 10%) to look and feel even better, gain more testosterone and lose extra estrogen. Fat increases aromatase activity which results more testosterone converting to estrogens. You don't want that. Also fat turns your most potent androgen DHT into less active metabolites.

The end game of lifting is endlessly interesting to me. It's kind of like with running, you get most of the benefit from the first 7 or 8 weekly miles.

I agree on this. It's the same thing with lifting. I tend to recommend that when you start, hit gym for 4 times a week for ~2 years after which you will feel and look better than 90% of the guys. Then if you want, you can fall back to maintenance phase and maintain gains working out 2-3 times a week for "rest of your life". Working out 5-6 times a week like I do isn't worth it unless you are twisted motherfucker who actually enjoys punishing ones body.

I lift for health as well as attractiveness. I've read differing opinions on this, but it really seems that one long weekly session, a full body split, would be enough to maintain gains.

At certain level it probably will (or atleast slows down losing the gains significantly) but for me not at my current condition I would look totally different if I went for 1 full body workout in a week for let say 3-4 months. I would probably lose ~3 kilos of muscle mass. Atleast would be my estimate considering that when I had to cut down lifting to 2 times a week to be able to do BJJ. I lost 3 kilos in 6 months.

You could almost apply Pareto principle on lifting as well. It's easy to get to the 70-80% of your potential. The last 20-30% is pain in the ass and you must double or triple your efforts to reach that.

[–]DiosJ3 points4 points  (15 children) | Copy

U don't need to go 6 days a week lol. I go every 2 days so 3-4 times a week only upper body (i dont care about legs but i could add it). With a 6 day split you only train every muscle group 2 times a week while i do it 3-4 times. For me this works way better.

[–]CainPrice11 points12 points  (6 children) | Copy

Never skip leg day.

But otherwise, every body is a little different. If you've figured out how to space your volume in a way that's giving you good results, you're in a good place.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

Never skip leg day.

Frighting amount of that in this thread. SMH.

[–]DiosJ-1 points0 points  (4 children) | Copy

I never show my legs except in sex so for me there is no point in training them.

[–]Wiley-canvas 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy

Ya except you know, being strong makes sex more fun. It’s difficult to lift a girl up and fuck her while holding her if you have tooth picks for legs.

[–]DiosJ0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Found out hexbar deadlift counts as leg exercise. So im training my legs😳. Also i do hyperextansions now which train your hamstrings.

[–]Wiley-canvas 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

That’s fine but you’re going to want to incorporate an entire leg day. Lifting another human and being able to actually have sex with them while holding them is difficult even if the girl is 100 pounds. But it’s masculine AF, girls love it, and it’s fun for you

Plus it’s just healthy. AKA don’t be a pussy, if you have small legs, you need to do leg day. Don’t just work out glamour muscles - girls do notice your skinny legs, especially fit/sexy girls, contrary to popular belief, it makes you look disproportionate.

[–]DiosJ0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

My problem is that my calves are non existing and i can't train them without my feets burning as hell because i have flat feets. So i have chicken legs regardless. If i would have calves i would train legs harder.

[–]fnncktbjhmkhed9 points10 points  (5 children) | Copy

Why the fuck are you skipping legs bruh train everything equally or you’ll look like Spongebob with a big upper body and sticks for legs

[–]DiosJ-2 points-1 points  (4 children) | Copy

I have poor calve genetics and i hate squads/leg press

[–]fnncktbjhmkhed5 points6 points  (3 children) | Copy

How do you think you strengthen it? Start with the lower weights and work your way up. You’ve already done it for your upper body

[–]DiosJ-3 points-2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I did it 1 year i hated it. Better focus my time on upper body.

[–]fnncktbjhmkhed5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

I can’t say I didn’t try. Please take it into consideration. You should really train the upper and lower body equally.

[–]Helmet_Icicle4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

3-4 days a week is best for most fitness goals but don't skip leg day.

[–]GGrub8276 points277 points  (50 children) | Copy

Have you ever seen a bodybuilder in a relationship with a woman who is out of shape? Me either.

Being engaged to a bodybuilder is a lifetime commitment to maintaining a healthy lifestyle and attractive figure, which is too much effort for the average woman. Why would she do that when she can still have her cake and eat it too?

[–]Helmet_Icicle64 points65 points  (19 children) | Copy


If you are constantly striving to improve yourself (especially in a fitness context), then that means she has to as well just to hit the bare minimum for a deserving partner.

And of course since it takes a lot more effort to get society's desirable body for men than women, that means she has to try twice as hard to see half the results.

[–]Non-Cookie-cutter33 points34 points  (17 children) | Copy

And of course since it takes a lot more effort to get society's desirable body for men than women, that means she has to try twice as hard to see half the results.


[–]Helmet_Icicle42 points43 points  (14 children) | Copy

The ideal male body takes a lot more work than the ideal female body.

But the ideal amount of muscle takes twice as much female work for half the male results.

[–]javascript_dev36 points37 points  (6 children) | Copy

Still quite wierdly written. twice as many men go to the gym as women and most gym bunnies are just cardio bunnies. So even accounting for women gaining at half the rate of men, they don't have to do nearly as much and can probably get to 8+ status in a few months.

[–]PinoDongus21 points22 points  (0 children) | Copy

True. Woman just need to have some lines on her stomach, curves, a tonned butt. Doesn't need to be huge as long as it's pretty. Literally I've seen out of shape females become hot in 6 months of training and dieting. A man need at least a couple of years training correctly and dieting without enhancements to look good. Unless you're one of the few genetic freaks out there. They have it 10x easier in attaining a 8/10 shape lol

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

You are forgetting diet is 80% of the shit especially for these landwhales. Their eating lifestyle cannot accomodate a healthy diet, so going to the gym will always be waste of time. Eventually they’ll give up after seeing no results.

Last month I briefly dated this fat girl, and I was pretty stupid for getting oneitis over her even though she was fat. I think I have a thing for fat girls lmao.

Anyway she ate like crazy. Especiallu those breakfast dinner places with fucking calorie loaded meals. I’ve never been to one but until I dated her but like what the fuck... and everytime I’d suggest a place to eat she would say I’m not in the mood for that. That and she had a drinking problem.

[–]Helmet_Icicle1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

Nope. It's 10% cardio, 20% weights, 70% diet. Your average cardio bunny does 15% cardio, 5% weights, and maybe 30% diet.

That process is biologically easier for men. Even if you did somehow quantify bias by gym attendance, you still have the massive amount of women who never get past the "Well I don't want to get bulky" stage of progress. That's not taking into account the requisite level of effort for management and recomp, which women still have more trouble with than men.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy

Honestly it’s mainly diet. A lot of these girls cant keep up. Even if you went to gym everyday you would have the foresight to diet properly

[–]2RedPill-BlackLotus2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

I hate defending woman but their hormone profile scientifically makes it harder for them to be lean. There are androgen receptors on your fat cells that do science shit I cant explain. Google it.

Men have higher androgen levels, that's why we are leaner on average and when we inject a shit pile of androgens this happens.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I hate defending woman but their hormone profile scientifically makes it harder for them to be lean.

I've come across an interesting idea that basically says that weight gain is part of what triggers earlier "menarche" (a woman's first period). The woman's body detects that it has enough calories to carry a child to term so they kick over into fertility.

[–]1NathanHollister6 points7 points  (6 children) | Copy

I disagree that there is an ideal amount of muscle for women. I am not attracted to muscle girls. They look nasty, like small versions of men. I like women to look something like J Law

[–]askmrcia2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

I disagree that there is an ideal amount of muscle for women. I am not attracted to muscle girls.

J Law and all those other celebs actually workout and lift. And what about the swimmers, track runners or volleyball players?

They are not muscular pursea, but they are in great shape and have toned bodies.

[–]1NathanHollister4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

They do workout but they don't have visible muscle. If a girls muscles are standing out like a bodybuilder or her muscles are so large she looks like a man it's gross.

A volleyball toned look is fine. But a woman shouldn't be benching hr body weight or have a 6 pack, etc.

[–]Helmet_Icicle7 points8 points  (2 children) | Copy

This just in: one individual's skewed personal preference destabilizes entire field of statistics!

More at eleven.

[–]1NathanHollister-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

hey man if you want women to look like men, there are plenty of them out there. Some even have a free penis included!

but ill keep my girly girls tyvm

[–]Helmet_Icicle4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

This thread is for talking about why women don't know anything about a man's workout regime, and you think that your ignorance about a woman's workout regime is relevant?

[–]GGrub80 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Bodybuilder girls are repulsive but a small amount of muscles is what separates anorexic girls from those with a model body.

If only men had it this easy...

[–]HumbleTrees-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Thank you. This makes no damn sense.

[–]PandaLitter9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

Man try to make sense before you post

[–]red__Man32 points33 points  (6 children) | Copy

I think most bodybuilders have ugly gf.. yes they are fit with nice asses but ugly af

[–]RivenHalf27 points28 points  (1 child) | Copy

As someone who trains with a lot of body builders I was about to say this lol plenty of body builders have ugly as fuck girlfriends. Plenty. Out of shape and fat ones even. Not remotely uncommon.

[–]TFWnoLTR11 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy

I have a friend who is in what I would call perfect shape for a guy (natty bodybuilder), but he's afraid to talk to women and has only gotten laid once in the past six months and she was fat.

Lifting is only half the battle. I'd slay 9s and 10s daily if I looked like him.

[–]rpasker198 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

I've read bodybuilders talking about how they look like Chad but in reality that got into bodybuilding as nerds hoping it would compensate for social anxiety. Being in the gym all the time fed into their social avoidance strategy so even as their looks improved, their skills with women declined. So I can see how a lot of them might have their pick of women if they developed social skills but in the end just end up with women who picked them.

[–]FilthyStylish1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

The dude was referring to IG bodybuilders and not really real life ones I suppose otherwise he’d be dumb af. But your point is spot on.

[–]Greaterbird1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I feel like most people go to the gym to make up for their butterface.

[–]Variatiion1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Because they are still in a beta mindset. Just because your are jacked/have money/have status etc.. doesn't mean you have an alpha mindset.

[–]youcantstopmyzed6 points7 points  (18 children) | Copy

Its not so much this. I spend the last 4 years hard core body maxing. I pushed myself to the very limit when it comes to my upper body but my legs held me a bit back. What ever, my body looks pretty good and I’m almost at my natural limit. Here comes in your theory. Yes commitment is everything. I committed so much pain, time, money on my body.

Girls notice this and they know they can’t manipulate you. I know what I want and what I wanna do and what I don’t want to do. Girls want somebody they can manipulate into the provider role. Manipulating that has a strong mind and body is a lot harder than manipulating a fat beer drinking fuck.

These same girls will cum on your dick and want to get fucked harder than ever, cause they can feel they are dependent on you. You’re the price. Watch what they do. What somebody says has no worth to me.

[–]GGrub89 points10 points  (2 children) | Copy

How does a girl manipulate a man? With her sexuality. How does a standard girl manipulate a fit, muscular guy? Again, with her sexuality. The thing is, a landwhale can manipulate the average joe because he can't get any better, while she can't do it with Mr. Fit guy because he'll simply dump her for an attractive girl, whom he's not in shortage of.

Since most girls tend to let themselves go after they locked down a guy, they know their agenda will not work so easily if he's in shape so they can:

  1. Hard mode: commit themselves to a life of healthy dieting and physical exercise to be worthy of their man.

  2. Normal mode: silently concede that they're not worthy of a fit man and pick an average joe as their mate, while at least attempting not to get too fat.

  3. Easy mode: shame men who lift to make sure there are as many available beta bucks as possible while they can be fat and lazy.

Because of Feminism, option #3 is the most popular nowadays.

[–]LLL3peat1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

more or less its shame the bodybuilders because they will only pump and dump but not actually commit because once I start playing games to shift power in our relationship dynamic, you can replace me with ease by taking off your shirt if its not bulking season.

most women I am friends and more than friends with like to exercise, eat plants and lean proteins, but also enjoy wine or a cocktail or 3 every so often. but since their frame is a lot smaller, they only have to loose 4-5 pounds from winter to summer.

add your current lean bimbo with a booty and face gains, she can ask for anything and anyone almost all the time. "omg im so pretty and this and that" but I cant lock down the bodybuilder who likes to lift weights and understands how to physically change themselves for the "gram"

conner murphy is an oldie but hilarious at the same time. look for the eyes and body language change:


[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That video shows the slut nature of this generation of females. Look how casually they talk about fucking and sucking

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

I pushed myself to the very limit when it comes to my upper body but my legs held me a bit back.

I will never understand this.

How's your back? How can you hit your back and not your legs?

I guess if you go to a gym you can hit your back with specific machines, but all I have is a barbell and pull up bar, so deadlifts and chin ups are key.

I remain befuddled. Who skips leg day these days?

[–]youcantstopmyzed1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Basically I can’t squat heavy and I can’t deadlift that well so I do really heavy rack pulls to make up for it. My back is pretty well developed. I can do weighted pull ups too, some machines, rack pulls, heavy barbell rows, heavy shrugs etc.

I can train my legs but just not heavy as Id wish to train them. It’s especially ridiculous that i bench way more than i squat but yea, I probably need my right leg to get fixed.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I probably need my right leg to get fixed.

If you can.....I mean, it doesn't get any easier as you age.

[–]Helmet_Icicle0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Get fucked in the knees and see how easy it is.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Get fucked in the knees and see how easy it is.

Yeah, if you're talking about skipping leg day in a TRP related sub, it's best to lead off with the fact that your knees are fucked.

I'm thinking of switching over to split squats or at least adding them in, just to try to bulletproof my knees as far as is possible. Knee injuries suck.

[–]rpasker190 points1 point  (9 children) | Copy

In those four years, did shit testing trend up or down? Did the types of tests you receive change?

[–]youcantstopmyzed1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy

Really difficult to answer.

Edit. Ok got some time now.

Basically guys used to shit test me during my gym journey a lot more cause the saw me improving and they were scared of their role in the friend group. That’s just natural. They shit tested me about my strength and body. It stopped now cause I am the biggest out of most my friends.

When it comes to girls it’s different. I was invisible to the model Tier girls. I only used to get shit tested by girls lower than hb8. Its cause those super good looking girls didn’t even consider me being a contender lmao. Nowadays it’s the other way around. Good looking girls shit test me during my day, during work, when I go out etc. they find interest in me. Girls lower than 8 don’t shit test me cause I feel like they know I’m their price and they are really careful when they talk to me.

Just when I look critically at some girls they start fucking up tjeir sentences. They try explaining themselves over seemingly nothing and get stressed about making mistakes (a girl even admitted that to me).

[–]rpasker191 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Thanks for taking time to answer man. I'm not just saying that out of deference to your muscles lol.

That's really interesting what you said about top chicks starting to test and 7s stopping testing altogether. I've heard this before from bodybuilders. Actually I've heard that once you're really jacked, average girls who used to be sweet stop being nice to you and start hating you because they no longer have any hope of getting you, so your presence just invalidates them automatically.

Was it hard for you to adjust to normal girls being nice and deferential? My SMV has increased and I'm not internally adjusted to it. There are some really cute girls I've encountered lately who are really apologetic around me or even shaking when I accidentally lock eyes with them. These are girls who most of my life would have been cunts to me, and my mind is still so conditioned to expect mistreatment from them, I can see but not internalize that these girls feel like chodes around me.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

Interestinng, how old are you if you dont mind me asking?

How do your interactions with low tier girls go? Are you lean?

Have you ever lost frame with a low tier girl or does your physique compensate or instill some sort of dread in them?

[–]youcantstopmyzed1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

Im 23yo.

How do you define low tier? 1-5? Everything below 8? Ugly girls are invisible to me and i feel like they know it. Same for fat girls. I hardly look at them. I’m at 15% bf right now cause I was in my home country during vacation and just ate what ever I wanted. Before that i was pretty lean.

I feel like I have a really solid frame. Almost nothing can throw me off. My last post is about me getting thrown off by an emotional scar though so there is that but this wasn’t a low tier girl and it was something else.

Lower tier girls are trying to get my attention more often but I don’t think it’s just because of my body. When they see they fail they are visibly upset. Don’t get me wrong, I also fuck lower tier girls when she’s cute or whatever, I got told once that she couldn’t believe somebody like me would be with her. I also make sure to always lead the conversations and lower tier girls are more easily pleased (during conversations AND during intercourse, they cum faster and try harder).

I don’t know about the dread thing. What I can assure you though is that I can make a girls confidence tremble by just looking weirdly at her. Things I mentioned before. This is rather a mixture of all things, body, frame, face, scars, success, clothes etc.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

How were you in terms of smv when you were 20-21? How dis you make the distinction between woman actually becoming interested in you vs before when they ignored you. Any advice fot a college 21 yr old?

[–]youcantstopmyzed1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

When it comes to my SMV at 21 I have to admit that It was way better than when I was like 16-18. More girls noticed me, I got told that I was good looking more often (even if you just work out for 1-2 years you will look better than 80% of the guys, trust me). The huge difference to now is that all these things didn't make me more confident. I was just better looking so I couldn't benefit fully off of it. Girls approached me more often and I had an easier time speaking to girls and getting their numbers or escalating on dates.

nowadays I know I'm the prize. the event starts when I arrive and I got told so multiple times which doesn't make me feel good, it makes me feel stronger and more confident.

If you feel good, be confident. Realize what your strengths are and keep working on them. Don't only focus on gaming girls but also don't just focus on college. try working on a business (idea). don't let yourself get pushed around. don't get mad about small things and don't try to understand girls fully. girls our age are literally fucking retarded which also makes them easy to game but I don't want you getting mad about things girls say or do. just know that they don't know any better.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Ok man

[–]youcantstopmyzed0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Hope that helped you lol

[–]youcantstopmyzed0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Answered now with an edit.

[–]jackandjill221 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Good point.

[–]its_meKnightSwolaire1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Well said

[–]BatsNightmares0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Good stuff.

[–]Throwaway-242424190 points191 points  (8 children) | Copy

a) Most women understand little to nothing about the male physique, and when they say they prefer dadbods to jacked dudes, they really mean they prefer guys who look like pro rugby players to guys who look ready to walk on stage at the Olympia. It's irrelevant because no natty guy is ever going to cross the line into what they consider "too jacked", let alone do so by accident.

b) Women worry that admitting to liking fit guys makes them sound slutty.

[–]sexykavu64 points65 points  (4 children) | Copy

this should be the default answer to all these questions tbh. The first point in particular. Women often conflate lifting with roided out body builders at the top of their field, and that's a primary source of confusion/contention. This isn't even relegated to women tbh, tons of guys hold this delusion as well. I cannot tell you how many times guys have said to me 'I want to start lifting but i dont wanna get TOO BIG, ya know?'. ppl ignorant lol

[–]1NathanHollister26 points27 points  (0 children) | Copy

Tl Dr women don't want Arnold but they do want Brad Pitt. Just get in shape and have a 6 pack and V taper but don't be a meathead.

Also if you are a meathead, just stop the roids and you'll look like a normal person again in 3-4 months.

[–]watchguy4513 points14 points  (0 children) | Copy

Haha so true. For Natty guys there is no such thing as TOO big. Most Hollywood types that girls go crazy for are running test/winstrol.

[–]Thinkingard1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I think people think that way bc so many fitness gurus never publish their blood tests to hide the fact their fitness is based off of steroids. So a lot of people think it’s just hard work and diet and then wonder why they have no gains or lift similar weight as the jacked dude but don’t look anything like him. I truly wonder what the diet and fitness industry would look like if steroids were legal.

In fact does anyone know what it’s like in countries where steroids are legal?

[–]celincelin1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

'I want to start lifting but i dont wanna get TOO BIG, ya know?'

“I want to get a good career but don’t want to become a billionaire, not worth it, a few millions would do.”

Some of us are just divorced from reality, what can you do.

[–]rpasker195 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's irrelevant because no natty guy is ever going to cross the line into what they consider "too jacked", let alone do so by accident.

Haha stating this obvious point made me crack up. Whoops, honey, I accidentally look like a god now, should have listened to you about laying off the gym.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's irrelevant because no natty guy is ever going to cross the line into what they consider "too jacked", let alone do so by accident.

Pin this to the top and call it a day.

Hell, I thought the "college athlete physique" was common knowledge by now.

[–]onionknightofknee0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy


[–]Endorsed ContributorFereallyRed80 points81 points  (15 children) | Copy

It's a fantastic beta filter.

Just like Tingerellas putting "No one night stands" on their profile.

[–][deleted] 48 points49 points  (11 children) | Copy

I said to this plate I was starting to go to the gym. She didn't like it and kinda discouraged me to go to the gym. She said she doesn't like muscular guys. However I think the real reason is because she'll think she'll lose plate status to a better girl....

[–]ChrimsonChin98843 points44 points  (7 children) | Copy

More likely, she's looking to pin you down. If you stop going to the gym, your SMV decreases, you're less likely to leave her cus no other girl wants you anymore (THIS IS CALLED POISON DRIP, women will say they like a little fat so they have something to cuddle with bla bla all horseshit of course, just trying to (unconsciosuly) lower your SMV so you're less likely to leave her fat ass). Also, she's a lazy bitch for not going to the gym. A woman's appearance is her greatest asset, anyone not willing to invest in their biggest asset is dumb/lazy.

You can't make your girl go to the gym. But you CAN leave her fatass at ANY TIME for a girl who DOES go to the gym. REMEMBER THIS. Also, don't fucking stop working out yourself. Lead by example.

[–]1NathanHollister21 points22 points  (2 children) | Copy

Girls don't even have to go to the gym. They just have to not eat like a slob

[–]Standgrounding1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Actually most of the heavy eater girls claim food is the only pleasurable thing they have.

[–]GGrub83 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Talk about self-fulfilling prophecy. If they stopped eating like pigs, they'd have plenty of men who would gift them with real pleasure.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I believe she sees me as betabucks. She's only 19 and got 3 more years of riding the university dick carrousel. The only thing we have been doing for the past 1.5 years is fuck. No dates, just fuck, took her home the first night I met her. She never initiated "the talk" with me, only once when very drunk. She said I would be a good father and told her friend she loves me but has never told me. Anyway, I'd never commit to her.

[–]rpasker191 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

No dates just fuck and she thinks you're betabucks? You sound like Chad.

[–]eldritchfloormop1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

More likely, she's looking to pin you down. If you stop going to the gym, your SMV decreases, you're less likely to leave her cus no other girl wants you anymore

Exactly - if a woman is with you, it usually means that you're the best she can at this point (in her opinion). She's already maxed out what she can get with her SMV. So if you increase your SMV, she'll be left behind, not able to compete with higher SMV women who'll become interested in you.

[–]kray6726 points27 points  (1 child) | Copy

Whatever you choose to do, make sure you're doing it for yourself. Fuck what she or anyone else thinks.

Also, why would she lose plate status? Do you only spin one plate at a time?

[–]Adem874 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

They think different. Also it’s our nature to spread the fluids 😁

[–]Snowaey1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Could also be a shit test

[–]readytokno1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Just like Tingerellas putting "No one night stands" on their profile

those...aren't true?

[–]Jabbermouth2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Nope. Take it from a guy who has fallen for this line way too many times.

Had a girl tell me she doesn’t hookup on the first date despite being down to come straight over to my apt and watch Netflix in my bed while “cuddling”. I listened to what she said. Didn’t make a move all night. Walked her out to her car at about 11pm. Told her text me when you get home safe. She ghosted me. I’m assuming she wanted dick that night and me failing to even kiss her pegged me as a beta in her mind. Never again.

TLDR: Watch what they do NOT what they say.

[–]El_Serpiente_Roja31 points32 points  (2 children) | Copy

Never ever ever believe this from women. They lie because they think it makes them sound shallow and "only men are shallow".

[–]OracleofFl7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

This! A woman admitting that she likes guys with muscles is equivalent to a guy publicly admitting he only likes hot chicks. We all lie and say how much personality, smarts, etc. (beta qualities) matter.

[–]GGrub81 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I actually shamelessly say that I only like hot, young chicks and their personality is just a bonus.

[–]andyturbo2000 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

There's a tipping point where a guy goes from stud to scary - that's what women mean.

Don't listen to what they say, watch what they do. Ever see a ripped guy with anything less than a 9? No, I haven't either. Those women who say they don't like ripped guy are lowering their sights and making excuses for why they can't get a man like that.

A 6 woman can't get a 9-10 guy...therefore "I don't like muscles anyway". Course you don't, love.

[–]HumbleTrees16 points17 points  (0 children) | Copy

Exactly this. It's hamstering for the purposes of ego protection.

Its like a child. If they don't get the toy they wanted then it's "well, I didn't want it anyway!".

[–]Greaterbird5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

There's a tipping point where a guy goes from stud to scary

Fortunately that point seems to require steroids. You'd have a tough time getting there naturally

[–]renaultcliodriver 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

Most of the time, women who say this shit have been pumped and dumped for 10+ years since the age of 16 by muscular dudes. They put themselves in the prize lottery fund but each time they were plated, they were also dropped in favour of someone else. This leads to them being resentful so now in her mind she rationalises it and convinces herself (lies upon lies) that she doesn't like muscular guys. They spent their best years thinking they'd finally get a high value muscular dude but each time they were dropped for a 9 or 10. All she remembers is the fact she wasn't good enough. What did that bitch have that I didn't? She's a whore yet he still chose her. The reason they feel this way about muscular guys is each one they see reminds them of that fact.

It's also why women hate when their beta male boyfriends/husbands they've settled for get into shape and she'll say shit like 'I prefer you with a dad bod'. Suddenly he's transitioning towards being that muscular guy, and guess what happens? It triggers her to feel more insecure because suddenly she thinks you're going to do what every muscular guy before did, drop her in favour of someone else. You suddenly become the thing that lays all of those insecurities out on the table and now she's worried. Her hamster is going into overdrive.

This is also why women often cheat/have affairs when in their 30s, a muscular dude comes back into the picture, often a coworker, and shows interest. She thinks she has another chance to be more than a plate to a muscular dude. If it's worth it risk/reward vs what she has at home with her husband, she'll go for it and try to branch swing. If she can't complete a branch swing, she might continue the affair primarily because the sex is better than at home. Women lie about it because it allows them to continue to play this game and idiot weak males who they settle for after years of being plated and dumped are none the wiser.

Everything a woman does regarding what she says is to cover her strategy. The reason you don't listen to women is the same reason you don't listen to poker players. They're always bluffing, double bluffing, or playing some sort of other game. Your best course of action is to read between the lines of what they actually say and do in terms of action, and look at associations between their words and actions. Everything a woman says or does is about maximising her outcomes in terms of her strategy.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

she might continue the affair primarily because the sex is better than at home.

Underrated idea here.

I have one woman in my life I was never able to get off. We actually had a threesome with a lesbian who said she only n-counts straight women, who was also frustrated about not being able to get her off.

Fast forward to current times, after a year under the barbell, and I was able to get her off with dick alone......because it's not dick, it's hip flexors and glutes.

Playboy called it years ago, hockey players are superb lovers because of how they use their hips.

[–]spungebawbswegpants0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Lmaooo youre giving them way more credit than they deserve. It all boils down to tingles. If you dont give her tingles, she will find (and fuck) someone who does.

[–]Protocol_Apollo18 points19 points  (0 children) | Copy

Few reasons why they “apparently” don’t like muscles. (Some of them have been mentioned by other commenters)

  1. Being muscular is a extremely powerful tool of PASSIVE dread. You just walking down the street with a girl will instil dread as she knows other women will find you attractive and may even APPROACH YOU.

More competition anxiety for her to stay on her A game, which most if not all girls don’t like. They don’t like knowing they can’t act bitchy, they have to avoid putting on weight and keep dressing and grooming well. Since you can replace them just like that.

  1. It’s also a form of poison dripping/betafication. Girls love comfort but they don’t know much comfort they need they just know they want it so they try to poison drip you eg telling her to stay with her to watch a movie and not go to the gym, to not meet-up with your friends etc

Girls love tigers (alpha males) but they don’t like the uptake of having one. So they leash it, get rid of it’s fur etc and make it into a household cat.

Then they will wonder why they are no longer attracted to you, but it’s obvious to us, you are no longer the tiger you once were.

  1. It’s a subconscious form of justifying leaving you. When a LTR ends, the girl wants to feel that you were the problem of the relationship. You got lazy, you stopped putting in the work, holding frame, you stopped being the male she was once attracted to.

She can’t do that if you are always on your A game and so when the LTR ends, she will have little of it to blame on you (and as we know women are children so they don’t like taking responsibility)

Women saying that they aren’t attracted to muscular men are straight up lying: if she had to have a ONS, what kind of man would she go for... a muscular one or a dad bod?

Also, those who genuinely believe that women prefer dad bods are the same ones who get cheated on by their women going for a guess what... a muscular guy.

[–]ikeurbantraut15 points16 points  (3 children) | Copy

"I don't like Tinder shirtless pics"

*Puts on Tinder shirtless pics*

"heyy whats up!"

[–]Jabbermouth5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy

PSA: If you have been lifting for 6+ months and have an attractive male body (broad shoulders, v taper, thick neck, six pack abs, big biceps, etc.) you NEED a shirtless pic in your Tinder/Bumble/Hinge profile. Instantly will get you more matches, and sets you apart from most guys (who are unfit or scared to use a shirtless photo). Make sure it’s a candid picture of course, no gym selfies or mirror pics.

[–]VaN__Darkholme2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

kek. Good luck getting that with 6 months. I would say 11-12 months minimum.

[–]Jabbermouth5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

I agree, it’s probably a a year or two for most guys. Depends on your starting point I suppose.

[–]amphix33940 points41 points  (0 children) | Copy

Bro literally all girls like muscle on a guy. Most girls don't like the steroid snorting gorilla looking dudes though and that's what they mean. Trust me nothing gets a girl soaking than when she looks at a well defined male physique

[–]mm674814 points15 points  (0 children) | Copy

Men who put in work on themselves are probably not simp material. That is the last thing a woman wants outside of a hook up

[–]nogatcord67 points68 points  (7 children) | Copy

Because it may be a sign of a guy trying too hard. Girls prefer a man whose acomplishments seem efortless.

Actually one of the Laws of Power (fantastic read)

Edit: It's Law 30: Make your accomplishments seem effortless

[–]David-Trace14 points15 points  (6 children) | Copy

So...don’t workout and build a great physique? I understand the concept but not sure how this corresponds to realistic scenarios of women going for great physiques.

I’m guessing maybe it just boils down to your attitude on whether you try to push your great physique onto a woman to attract her, or simply workout for yourself and utilize confidence as your main source of attraction?

[–]mm674850 points51 points  (1 child) | Copy

It doesn't say not to put in any effort. It says make it appear effortless. Don't talk about gym time like a vegan talks about being vegan.

[–]David-Trace6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah I just added onto my comment before reading this reply and I think I got the right idea. Thanks for clarifying.

[–]El_Serpiente_Roja31 points32 points  (3 children) | Copy

Girls hate the idea of avg guys working to become better. They want "naturals".

[–]Red_For_Me 1 points [recovered]  (2 children) | Copy

‘Just get it’

[–]Standgrounding1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy


[–]VaN__Darkholme0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy


[–]TBtgoat25 points26 points  (1 child) | Copy

Girls like the hottest guy they can manipulate. Too hot is just as bad as too ugly

[–]dani0985 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Might be some truth to that

[–]mortalcoil110 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

When women talk about what they do and do not like in a guy, they are almost always referring to characteristics they are looking for in a guy they would want to marry, not who they would want to fuck due to years of social "good girl/slut shaming" programming.

[–]furoshus2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

There it is. Truth.

[–]omega_dawg939 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

never forget... girls don't communicate to transfer relevant information; the truth doesn't matter to them.

they talk to keep social friction down (to not disturb the tribe) and to keep themselves in a positive light (so you like them).

admitting that muscles gives them the tingles is like them saying, "I'd fuck that guy simply on how he looks," and they never want to seem that easy or superficial.

but we all know that happens when no one is around and they're left alone with an opportunity...

they fuck. and they fuck way more than you think they do.

[–][deleted] 16 points17 points  (0 children) | Copy

They're not logical, and you're expecting a logic answer.

[–]Sendmeloveletters7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

They say that to make guys who aren’t shredded feel like she is attainable so he still spends attention on her. It’s the same as “it’s a good size” or “it happens to a lot of guys.”

[–]Endovelico3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Because they dont want the inflated ego that comes along admitting something like that to an already hot guy. Makes it harder to manipulate the guy.

Also, makes them sound like they dont favor brawn over brain as much.

[–]Huffnagle5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Women are very concerned about their image when anyone from their circle is around. They don’t want to be seen as slutty, so they lie. Why do you think girls go full slut on vacation? It’s not that the dick is better, it’s that they think they won’t have to face consequences for getting spit roasted in Spain.

And they most certainly do like muscle. I’ve been off and on Tinder for years. As a decent looking guy in decent shape, I’ve always been able to make Tinder work for me. (Maybe 6.5-7 face, some muscle, never real lean). I recently posted a profile, several pics of me doing active stuff, cycling, scuba, motorcycling. The front pic was a shirtless bathroom selfie just lean enough to kind of see abs when tensed. The result? Far more matches than I’ve ever gotten. I know the general wisdom here is to not do the bathroom selfie, but... Brother, if you’ve got visible abs and you’re on Tinder, you’d better get that shirt off!

[–]javascript_dev3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

To compliment a person's face is socially acceptable as we tie face to identity. Height is somewhat similar.

To compliment a person's body though is only a couple steps away from dirty compliments. The body is primal and really only about one thing

[–]_Legendairy_2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

You can’t change things like height and face.

If her bf were to start lifting, then she has to respond. Lifting is a form of dread and they know this.

[–]youcantdenythat4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Lol, they also say they like nice guys who buy them flowers and presents and do all the housework.

When they say they don't like muscles, why would that be any different.

I'm pretty sure the perfect body type women find attractive would be chipendales, magic mike, male model type of bodies. If you've seen any they are muscular with low percentage of body fat.

That said there probably is a place of diminished returns but you're talking the roided out bodybuilders that literally look like incredible hulk or something.

So shut off reddit and get your ass to the gym and stop making excuses!

[–]Adem874 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Maybe because a lot of men aren’t only muscular, they’re also fat. So the combination makes them to bulky. I see such people at the gym. They would be better of, if they stop eating junk food and loose some weight.

[–]Rick_White2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

In my experience this statement actually is true - BUT - it's the definition of "Muscles".

A guy with a body like Arnold Schwarzenegger in his Mr. Olympia competitive prime is "too much".

A guy with a body like Chris Hemsworth in "Thor RagnaroK" is "Perfect."

So women dislike competitive body-building giant super-human muscles, but they LOVE athletic, six-pack muscles.

Also, a lot of 7's some 8's and lower know they won't be able to keep a man that looks like Chris Hemsworth to themselves, so If they want to engage in a LTR, they are ok compromising a bit of muscle in their guys if it means they can keep them around; they will still oogle the pool boy and diddle themselves thinking of him anyway.

[–]Ryzasu2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Because the "muscular" guys they don't like are roided bodybuilders aka 0.01% of men. They probably think that going to the gym makes you look like that

[–]DrTedPill3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]mustache_ride_4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

They don't want you physically stronger. If you were gas-lighting your spouse for years and one day he smartened up, which would you rather him be Mr. Roger's or Attila the hun?

Dominance is the name of the game baby but they still love them 6-pack's.

[–]BatsNightmares1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Women always lie.

[–]RedSkeller1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Just like guys who admit in large groups they don't like big tits

[–]ReddJive1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Pretty simple.

Ripped or muscular bodies indicate to a woman you're a player. Or likely to leave her.

Dad Bod means beta and more apt to stay and do what she wants.

Watch what they do not what they say.

[–]umizumiz1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Because they're out of shape.

[–]Looking_4_Stacys_mom1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

They don't like what a steroid user looks like, they just look a nice and lean tall guy with broad shoulders and slightly filled arms. If you're lean, your face is more attractive and you'll have a 6 pack going (and will look good naked)

[–]Casanova-Quinn1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

There's a couple reasons:

  • Women don't want to appear shallow.
  • Women are insecure and don't want to compete with other women over an attractive man.
  • Some women are not attractive enough to get muscular men, so they cope by convincing themselves it's a turn off.
  • When they hear "muscle" they think "huge freaky bodybuilder", not "Magic Mike".

[–]throwawayred5213 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

Dont listen to what they say listen to what they do

[–]cdh10034 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

This. When was the last time a bachelorette party paid to see semi-naked guys who didn't work out?

[–]1NathanHollister1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Because women want men to be weak so they can control them. They know if a man gets swole they can't control themselves and throw their pussy at him. Women always lie about what they want. They say they want a nice guy, but they want a bad boy. Etc.

They say they want a regular wimp, but they fuck Chads

Don't listen to what women say. Actions speak louder then words

[–]warrior_up1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I think its more of the roided out, gym douche bag look where the guy can't even put his arms down. Coincidentally those guys are some of the most insecure guys out there - hence the addiction.

Chicks like healthy guys, athletic guys, guys that take care of their bodies that are in shape just not Johnny spray tan roid guy that wears smediums

[–]Slut_Slayer90001 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Women aren't necessarily lying, but the black pill version is that a pretty face > muscle. If you're skinny with a pretty face and just a little bit of muscle tone, A TON of women will choose you over some bodybuilder. Now if you're ugly it does help to go the more muscular root which will help, as some women DO prefer that look, but by in large you can attract the most amount of women by being fit (skinny) with some muscle, have a pretty face, and (VERY IMPORTANT) a good fashion sense.

[–]fatlizardinahammock 1 points [recovered]  (5 children) | Copy

It’s just preference. I don’t work out very much and I like guys who have dad bods with muscle underneath (especially in the arms) that shows when they flex. Some women like skinnier band types like emo or K-pop types. My friend who works out daily is dating a man who also works out daily and has a cut physique. My friend’s brother has a muscular and cut body and my unfit boyfriend is definitely more alpha than him based off of how he acts (...bf is also is way over 6’ tho lol). I’m sure some of you guys prefer huge tits over small tits with a fat ass, or a thinner body over a thicker one, and vice versa. Maybe your idea of alpha is washboard abs ONLY but there are always going to be plenty of women like me who disagree!

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

I’m sure some of you guys prefer huge tits over small tits with a fat ass, or a thinner body over a thicker one, and vice versa.

Universally, men prefer a specific hip/waist ratio, I think 70%?

Maybe your idea of alpha is washboard abs ONLY but there are always going to be plenty of women like me who disagree!

Universally, women prefer a specific shoulder/waist ratio, I think 90%?

I do agree that the focus on abs is kind of stupid. Focus on arms is also stupid. My forearms are as big around and harder than my upper arms, and it looks great. Strength is in your legs, back and forearms.

It’s just preference.

There's plenty of dudes here looking for an excuse to skip the Iron Church. Please don't validate them.

[–]fatlizardinahammock 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy

I mean I can go an ask 100 men to choose between big tits or fat ass, some will say both and many will choose one or the other. It seems like most have a preference. I don’t know about those stats but I personally prefer the wider shoulders, I guess. I don’t really consciously notice them though. Big arms are hot to me. People can do whatever they want. Some men get their strength from the manual labor they do at their job. That’s hotter to me than someone who spends a ton of time at the gym. You guys can spout all the stats you want but there are always people out there that won’t fall into them.

Thankfully, because life would be boring if every man/woman had the same body type and ambitions. If I had to choose between 10 guys and all but one had washboard abs and cleanly shaved faces with the same douchey haircut and preppy clothes, I definitely would choose the strong dad bod outlier with a big beard and tattoos to rail me over and over lmao 😍🤷🏼‍♀️ I have a type and so do a lot of people.

I really hate how boxed in everyone over here is with this shit! You don’t have to look one specific way to get bitches unless the type of girls you want to attract aren’t generally attracted to the type you are right now!

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

I personally prefer the wider shoulders, I guess.

Of course you do. It's a universal sign of male strength.

I definitely would choose the strong dad bod outlier with a big beard and tattoos to rail me over and over lmao

Of course you would. That dude is likely stronger than the preppy boys with washboard abs.

Some men get their strength from the manual labor they do at their job. That’s hotter to me than someone who spends a ton of time at the gym.

There's something to this. I am a fan of lifting for strength, not hypertrophy. I think that women can tell the difference. I actually skip arm day and focus on the big, compound lifts for strength. I do zero bodybuilding, it's all powerlifting.

I really hate how boxed in everyone over here is with this shit! You don’t have to look one specific way to get bitches unless the type of girls you want to attract aren’t generally attracted to the type you are right now!

Women say this all the time, and like to bang on about TRP being an "ideology" when for a lot of us, it's just guys sharing notes. I'm not the only one who developed a decent v-taper and started to get lots of attention.

[–]fatlizardinahammock 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

Fair enough, I think the truth is somewhere in the middle of what we’re both saying. Some others said women don’t want their man to be attractive to other women. That reminds me of when some of you guys talk about how dating a 7 is better than dating a 9 because the 9’s are bitchier or whatever. It’s kind of a similar thing except women aren’t as visual as you guys. I don’t have the desire to date someone with washboard abs, keep my appearance up with theirs, and worry about them going for another more fit woman. It’s all about priorities so I guess if looking very fit is a big priority for you and what you want in a partner than go for it but if it’s not then just worry about your strength and health. Also you guys seem to be focused on banging as many hot girls as possible without ever settling down and I’m more focused on finding a life partner which might make our perspectives a lot different too lol

[–]Mikejonz1110 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

AWALT it’s because of that stereotype that every girl likes a guy with muscles and no girl wants to be perceived as AWALT. They want to be seen as unique and want to be treated as if they bring something different to the table meanwhile all men bring the same things to the table

[–]Numero340 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Insecurity and thinking that they're taking a position that carries more social currency.

[–]HurricaneHugues0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

For the same reason a lot of dudes say lifting is for gays and is a waste of time. Insecurity, and the thought of something they believe is unattainable to them deep down. Girls know that if you're jacked, you have options. And if you have options, her little insecure self won't be able to control you, let alone hold your attention long enough.

[–]goomerall30 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

They don't want you to know...

[–]trpSenator0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The same reason women say their preferred dick size is that of whoever her partner is (that’s actually from a study). Women who’s dating a skinny nerdy guy, is going to say that’s what she’s into. But if all things were equal and skinny BF got into swimming and got that Brad Pitt bod, she’d be very pleased. But that’s not what she has so she publicly alters her standards as to make it seem like she’s not punching below her ideal.

[–]Greaterbird0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Reminds me of Rocky Horror Picture Show.

a short while after getting engaged to beta Brad

Janice: "I don't like men with too many muscles"

a few minutes later, after seeing Rocky

Janice: "I'm a muscle faaaaaan"

a few more minutes later

Janice: "Touch me! I want to feel dirty!"

screws most of the cast

[–]UrShadowsReflection0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

There's a big difference in who a woman will fuck, versus who she'll settle down with.

She'll obviously hookup with a meat head, but to actually settle down with one is another story.

Also, when asking a woman if she's attracted to "a guy with muscles", she automatically pictures a big neck meat head.. right off the bat.

Men who are simply physically fit do the trick for them.

[–]1XXXMersenne0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

cus they imagine a chode like yourself getting wham in the gym for the sake of poonany and strategically* answer against so they don't meet BuffBetasTM

[–]celincelin0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Because they think overroided monkey when saying that.

[–]VigilantSmartbomb0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Social conditioning so you lower smv and they subjugate

[–]yungplayz-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Well, TOO MUCH can really be freaky, but you don't get to see someone who packs too much muscle unless you attend a body building competition

[–]Double_Cake-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

They’re not lying. Height is more important than muscles to women.

They’d prefer a 6’3 slender guy than a 5’5 muscle-bound guy.

If the 6’6 guy is slightly muscley they’ll take him.

Too muscley suggests low iq, vapidity and small penis.

[–]maljo24-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy

Why do you think they're lying?

[–]kayfab-3 points-2 points  (2 children) | Copy

Funny to see all those little gym douche bags with there little selfie full of themselves, calling me a blue pill when they have zero life experience.

Attraction, do muscle attract women, well my little red pill friends i been on both side of the fence, i used to pro wrestle in the indies in Montreal having a beach body longer hair, and those where the years where i banged the most chicks, at 5 11 i was always around 180 pounds, so muscles do attract women, but not all of them......

Now i am suppose to be blue pill because a wanna be chad probably inflated with steroids full of himself says that all women are attracted to muscle, well poor you, because not all women are attracted to muscular guys, like not all women where attracted to the hockey star player in high school, so putting all your egg in one basket is a pea brain mentality thank you.

Now of course its gonna give you and edge, but your face gotta be chiseld and you gotta have the total package. Now older at 47 i still attract even if i gained weight am bigger more massive because i got into serious powerlifting but i am far from attracting like i used to when i had a beach body,

So for all you little worm that wanna do everything for women go to the gym and sell your soul to train to get women because you have no true passion for weight training then yes its gonna give you an edge. But usually intelligent smart women won't go for that over muscular guy.

I guess you can call this my blue pill moment of the day ahahah......

[–]barn3r1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I love reading these comments. 180 lbs at 5’11 “muscles” lol. I weighed 180 lbs at 5’10 when I was 17 years old and a junior in high school with abs. Go finish your plate before I spank you.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I love reading these comments. 180 lbs at 5’11 “muscles” lol. I weighed 180 lbs at 5’10 when I was 17 years old and a junior in high school with abs. Go finish your plate before I spank you.

George St. Pierre at 170lbs. 5'10.


St. Pierre is muscular, by anyone's standards, and especially by THOT standards. It's always fun rooting out the fattasses who lie, especially when they boast about 'spanking'.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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