Intimidating characters, fights & how to deal with them?

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September 18, 2019

I was at the bar last night with my girl and a friend when a large (6’6?) and extremely overweight but somewhat built fellow approached our table. He did so under the guise of grabbing us a few drinks but it quickly became clear he was either drugged up or looking to start something.

(Security and staff gave him the pass as apparently the owner knows him)

Noticing the situation, I simply smiled and chatted as if we were old pals, but in between chuckles I caught him cussing at me under his breath and shortly after he wanted ‘to see which of us was the better fighter’.

Laughed it off, changed the subject, and then excused myself and my girl.

In the event that he was slightly less stable and either swung or backed me into a corner, what’s the best way to deal with a big fucker like that? One wrong move, a clean hit, and I’d be done.

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Title Intimidating characters, fights & how to deal with them?
Author Startlivingfornow
Upvotes 119
Comments 137
Date 18 September 2019 03:28 AM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit askTRP
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[–]Senior ContributorMentORPHEUS183 points184 points  (33 children) | Copy

When you spend a substantial amount of time practicing a martial art, the main thing it gives you is what people call strong frame . It makes you unresponsive to microaggressions and subtle testing moves, causing bully types to sense your are not a "victim" type and move on to an easier target. All of this usually happens without a word, often subconsciously for both parties.

Until you've spent time sparring in a dojo or gym, don't even think of getting in actual fights.

[–]ManLikeMandingo26 points27 points  (23 children) | Copy

Any recommendations on martial arts? I want to start boxing

[–]slay_them_all 1 points [recovered]  (3 children) | Copy

Boxing, wrestling, kickboxing/muay thai, BJJ, or combine them all and do MMA. Those 4 arts (plus MMA which is just all of them combined) are easily the most practical and effective, as proven by the fact that all MMA fighters practice them all.

[–]ManLikeMandingo3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]ChadTheWaiter1001 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Jack of all trades and a master of none. Solid advice.

[–]cptkong20 points21 points  (16 children) | Copy

MMA or jiu-jitsu would work better in actual fights, but anything is better than nothing.

[–]demonite1015 points16 points  (8 children) | Copy

Except for junk like Tae Kwon Do...or Hap Ki Do...or any of the Korean Martial Arts really.(I say this as a half-Korean who has practiced both of those arts, as well as some boxing/kickboxing).

[–]TheH1dd3nFear5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Family friendly McDojos

[–]RaidenDark2 points3 points  (6 children) | Copy

Korean marital arts are mostly competitive performance art, not fighting styles. Like fencing. Fencing is a game that only bears passing resemblance to swordfighting.

[–]throwing8smokes2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy

HEMA for real sword fighting (obv depends on the seriousness of your local group/club. tendency to attract neckbeards is RIPE.

[–]RaidenDark1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

Yeah, I really want to try HEMA but I've got to drive an hour to go a place that looks like my kind of crowd, and I can't stand driving in my state.

[–]throwing8smokes0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

there's always excuses. only thing seperating you from your ideal self is the tilling of the soil

[–]RaidenDark0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Tbh my idea self isn't one that can best my my fellow man in a longsword duel. I'm just compulsive hobby collector. If anything, the laziness preventing me from going is only contributing to more time spent on things I should be doing more of anyway.

[–]demonite100 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

You could also try Kendo. The vehicle for practical use is there, but like most things in life you gotta make sure the instructor is worth a shit.

[–]RaidenDark1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

If I get back into martial arts again, BJJ is top priority. I know enough stand-up already.

[–]sniper19051 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

How would BJJ help in a fight? Yeah get him to the ground and if someone curb stomps, sucker punch / kicks you, you're knocked out.

I understand this sub is very for Martial Arts, especially with BJJ as that's what Joe Rogan, Jocko Willink preach about (since we as a community respect them so much) but that shit is only great in a controlled 1v1 fight. Streets don't have any rules friend.

[–]MisterMarbles19880 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

How would BJJ help in a fight? Yeah get him to the ground and if someone curb stomps, sucker punch / kicks you, you're knocked out.

BJJ allows you to control where the fight goes, to a degree. So if the guy tries to take you down, your understanding of takedown defense will allow you to either keep it standing, or maybe choke him while he tries to take you down.

Also, if you are UNWILLINGLY put on your back, your BJJ experience will be invaluable in either A) getting back to your feet or B) submitting/surviving from the bottom position.

Additionally, your knowledge of BJJ will allow you to intelligently clinch/standing grapple with him and maybe get behind him for a standing choke, or throw him on the ground.

To be perfectly frank, there is no really effective martial art for 1v3 or 1v5 or whatever you're imagining.

Source: Me (10 years BJJ, 1 pankration fight, around 10-15 "street fights")

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That's why Greco-Roman Wrestling (like Khabib) is best. Most street fights a guy tries to bum rush or punch you. Flipping him on the ground doesn't take long and if you make him land hard, the fight is over. You can also make sure he doesn't hit his head on the ground, but a hard landing can wind you. And if you end up fighting multiple opponents its far more practical than BJJ.

[–]Splucer2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Isn’t wrestling better than jiu jitsu in a fight?

[–]i-am-the-prize4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

I rassseled as a lad, and doing BJJ now as an old fart. I would say I'd rather know BJJ. The reason for most wrestling moves is to pin the opponent, get points for back near mat and takdowns and reversals.

Sure BJJ has points system, but the main difference is submissions. They fucking hurt if you don't tap. And a drunk asshole who pushes you to get physical may not tap, but he will:

1) tire himself out (non grapplers have no idea how 'spent' they will be in 1-2 mins of exertion)

2) feel the pain of the lock or choke and realize, holy shit, that hurts/WTF is happening, and will relent (or not then they pass out/get choked out)

it's the submission through passing out or hurting a joint that makes the difference to me as far as functinoality. A lot of the non bjj possitions assume you're not getting punched, so you'd need to modify some if it was a real street fight/bar fight, but the mantra of: stay 2 punch lengths away from the aggressory or if they close the gap, get on them and so close they can't generate any power when rabbit punching you. Staying at arm/fist length is the danger zone.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I think wrestling works better than jiu-jitsu. Taking a while to grapple a guy in an actual fight can be dangerous. Flipping him and having him land hard on the ground is enough to end a fight most times.

[–]TheH1dd3nFear2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Boxing bro, go hard.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Wrestling then boxing. If you watched the Connor vs Khabib fight, you'd notice that despite Connor's good boxing he was taken down by Khabib's Greco-Roman wrestling.

In a street fight they're either gonna bum rush you and if they do they're unstable and throwing them on the ground is enough to end the fight. And if they don't then you rush them and grab their legs and flip them. Same outcome.

Boxing only after to fill in the gaps in knowledge, just in case.

[–]CypherMX10 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

The strong frame concept won't always work, good example is the situation OP was in. 6'6 drugged guy won't give a shit about your strong frame. In fact, I don't think any 6'6 300 lbs guy will. These guys will challenge you anyway because their physical advantage gives them confidence to do so. He did the right thing by de-escalating the situation and walking away. In case there is no way to avoid the fight, I don't see any reason not to use a valid self defense weapon like pepper spray.

[–]Senior ContributorMentORPHEUS11 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy

I don't mean fake it till you make it frame, I mean knows 150 ways to take down a 6'6 300#er frame. Years of martial arts training gives you that, too.

[–]Maarko6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

Exactly. Also growing up in a difficult city full of bullies and criminals can teach you that :)

[–]Aymane2211 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

What’s the point in people doing micro aggressions feeling like people that train fighting don’t even do that shit. However some looser tried doing it to someone at the bar that I saw when the other guy was built and the dude doing the micro aggressions looked decently built but he was clearly intimidated by this guy who was more built yet he was punching the guy

[–]Senior ContributorMentORPHEUS1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

yet he was punching the guy

That would be macroaggression.

[–]Aymane2210 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It was soft punches like fake as hell but why would he do this a more built guy? What is the point in people doing macro aggressions?

[–]hjkl4life0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy


[–]VigilantSmartbomb0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Heard! Thank you! I need to get into the gym lol

[–]jackandjill22-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]AscensionExperiments61 points62 points  (18 children) | Copy

Every experienced fighter or martial artist says the same thing about fighting: Only do it when you actually HAVE to. Handling it the way you did is fine.

However- if you do find yourself in a sticky situation against a big motherfucker, knowing judo or jiujutsu can really help.

[–]moltenw16 points17 points  (17 children) | Copy

Joe Rogan said he trained jiu jitsu for 20 years and he got his ass kicked by an MMA boxer who was like 1-2 years in.

Jiu Jitsu is cool, but when it comes to real world fighting, I'd have to guess there are better fighting styles.

[–]AppleCirocMajorKey[🍰] 9 points10 points  (10 children) | Copy

Source for that? Rogan only recently got his black belt in 10th Planet BJJ and thereafter a black belt from Machado, so if he had been doing it for 20 years at the point he was still sparring in gyms... the timeline just doesn't add up. Maybe he was talking about taekwondo which he also used to do as his main sport. Not calling you a liar at all but I'd like to see how he explains it.

(I do think you are thinking of taekwondo, I remember something similar from Joe about him joining a gym after doing TKD for a while and getting his ass whooped)

BJJ can absolutely be used in real world fighting, especially against just a single aggressor. Using technique, leverage, and timing along with your own athletic abilities that you'll develop with it can be very useful. Even when people are fighting "dirty" like trying to gouge your eyes or hit your groin. Obviously a lot of the techniques are bunk in certain RL situations but knowing how to actually put someone to sleep in 100 different ways will have it's benefits.

Now, we're talking about a guy that is much larger. So you want to avoid that at all costs. But BJJ can definitely still be useful if you absolutely have to fight. Buuuuut, I would much rather have a mean left hook in that particular situation. Against a reasonably close opponent in terms of body type, dumping them on their head and choking them out (all while they basically have no idea what to do) would be much safer than trying to throw hands.

[–]handsome_phantom1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

There’s no time to submit someone in a street fight unless you’re alone with your aggressor. They’re fast, dirty and rarely one on one. If you spend a fraction of a second on the ground trying to grapple, choke or submit someone experience, belt colour or whatever all goes out the window once their friends start boot fucking your skull. If you can’t defuse or escape the situation, the safest option is a knockout and a fast 100 yard dash

[–]AppleCirocMajorKey[🍰] 2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy


Also I would argue that self defense scenarios more commonly have one aggressor and one victim, not many aggressors on one victim. But I have no stats for that.

[–]handsome_phantom2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Me neither. But from what I’ve seen, bullies who want to feel tough at the bars and clubs usually have other assholes with them. I just don’t think it’s worth it to risk the assumption that one asshole’s alone, and that their buddy won’t come flatline you while you’re busy fighting. Better to get the fuck away as fast as possible.

[–]AppleCirocMajorKey[🍰] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Definitely don't fight if you don't absolutely have to, I agree. Not worth all the trouble that comes with it "win" or "lose". Regardless of the outcome, you're losing.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Guy comes at you, throw him hard on cement and the fights over. The other assholes won't bother you either. Also, the advantage of wrestling is you can make sure they don't land on their head and die and you don't end up in prison.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

Clearly you've never been in a street fight. I have. I've been in a fight with multiple opponents once. It was terrifying. I got lucky. What I'll tell you is BJJ is worthless. If you're on your back in a streetfight, you lost. The opponent/opponents will kick you. In a streetfight you ALWAYS want to stay standing. That means you have two options for a proper street fight - boxing or wrestling.

The problem with boxing is it requires room to maneuver and if you miss a punch, you're done. Best way to negate a punch is to bum rush the guy (especially if you know a fights happening).

That is why Greco-Roman Wrestling is best. Flipping a guy on his back on cement can wind him and is usually enough to end the fight. It also has the advantage of keeping you standing because even if guys go for your legs you know how to handle it. Also, if you practice wrestling, most moves take seconds to execute and its very hard to miss.

BJJ is good as a competitive sport in a controlled fight. Terrible on the street. You'll get your head kicked in if you use it.

[–]AppleCirocMajorKey[🍰] 1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

So BJJ = Laying on your back? Lmao, you know nothing. I've always been a proponent of using wrestling to dump people on their head to end the fight right there. Any good BJJ gym is going to teach you how to shoot takedowns or use greco-roman techniques like bodylock slams/trips. You're acting like people that do BJJ are going to pull guard in a streetfight, which is just hilariously ignorant.

Like I said the majority of self defense/street fight situations don't involve this mythical group of people trying to kick your ass. It's usually 1 on 1. If you have moderate experience in BJJ and the other guy has no training, barring a huge size advantage, you're going to win, end of story. Obviously if you're some bum trying to use your non-existent BJJ in a streetfight you'll get pummeled.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Like I said before, its always best to be on your feet. Not on the ground. Doesn't matter if you're in guard, if you're on the ground and he has backup you don't know about you can get kicked in the head or be attacked from behind. Obviously, in most fights that won't happen, but if it does then you're fucked.

Also, not all BJJ gyms teach wrestling takedowns (mine didn't - but I did wrestling since I was a kid). And most BJJ gyms aren't very serious - the "just keep it fun" gyms.

That's why I think being proficient in Wrestling is enough. Dump them on the ground, make sure they have a hard landing to wind them and run.

[–]AppleCirocMajorKey[🍰] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I won't disagree with you on any of your points if you're worried about them having backup, because yeah you would probably be screwed. I would definitely not say that most BJJ gyms are like that though. All of the ones I have been in are there to build serious competitors as well as hobbyists. If they're not, then they might as well be a McDojo.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I won't disagree with you on any of your points if you're worried about them having backup, because yeah you would probably be screwed.

Yeah I've been in a street fight with multiple opponents once. Its terrifying. I got lucky.

I prefer to end the fight fast and get out of there while I still can.

I'd have fought though if I was cornered with my girl, but in that case its best to end the fight fast too. Taking out a few guys fast can help them back off and give you breathing room.

I would definitely not say that most BJJ gyms are like that though. All of the ones I have been in are there to build serious competitors as well as hobbyists. If they're not, then they might as well be a McDojo.

I think it depends on the area. My area has all 'McDojo' type BJJ gyms - judging by all the kids that come there.

[–]zmizzy1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Please find a source for this.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Joe Rogan said he trained jiu jitsu for 20 years and he got his ass kicked by an MMA boxer who was like 1-2 years in.

There is not a chance in hell of this. At all

[–]l1ght-3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy

Pick a martial arts that the armed forces use, such as Krav Maga. These arts are trained for real life or death situations, and so better than a sporty art.

[–]Earthonaturtle1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

The problem with Krav Maga is a lack of sparring to hone your skills

[–]sniper19051 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Find a gym that has the component of sparring. I know this gym in my area where they have to spar as it is protocol and part of the training.

[–]Earthonaturtle0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Shit I guess I shouldn’t have generalized

[–]i-am-the-prize54 points55 points  (0 children) | Copy

you can only prepare long before the conflict actually happens. in the meantime, stay out of punching range, and leave the situation as you did. if he was really 6'6" and big, he can be very very strong. an elbow from a big guy can crack open your face and break facial bones and lose teeth. even if he was small, not worth the fight.

[–]thebadguy8929 points30 points  (3 children) | Copy

You did the right thing.

Ignore the need to AMOG yourself in 100% of situations. There will always be a guy bigger and stronger than you and it's those moments where the intelligent thing to do is to back down. Any girl who's not a total piece of shit (e.g. that MMA bitch who looked down on her man after losing a fight) won't give you a hard time about it and should be wet for you after you give her a good hard fucking to remind her who wears the pants.

[–]Sove1315 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

lol I remember her

[–]Jaganshi933 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

Any girl who's not a total piece of shit (e.g. that MMA bitch who looked down on her man after losing a fight)

Who is she?

[–]ahackercalled4chan0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Conor McGregor's ex

[–]Sajarab21 points22 points  (0 children) | Copy

Some of these points are solid. Some are just theory craft from online key board jockeys.

The easiest way to deal with them is let them be the big man. Personal confidence will trump the try hards.

During the verbal pre confrontation set up, you can nip it in the bud by just saying he's the badass.

Ive had smaller guys than me come up and talk fight trash and instead of measuring my dick, a simple

" no way man, I cant compete with you, youre a beast"

Buy a drink or simply say you were on your way out will settle the matter. If the situation is continually escalating, leave. Big guys, small guys, it doesnt matter. A sucker punch can knock out anyone. Unless you plan to bottle the guy before hes decided it's fight time. Just leave.

[–]johnnydanconia4515 points16 points  (0 children) | Copy

It’s not worth 3-5 years in the state pen, and having a record (which shows up when HR looks you up).

Always walk away.

Additionally, you don’t know what angles the security cameras actually catch. It might be the angle that makes you look like the aggressor.

[–]ForzentoRafe23 points24 points  (4 children) | Copy

I've joined the fightporn subreddit and often see people knocked out with a single punch.

It's not worth it to fight. I'm not saying "cower and hide" but rather, "plan to run"

It doesnt have to be either surrender or fight till one submit.

Just do something to distract/stun him, tell your girl "let's go" and go somewhere else.

[–]RunawayGrain3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

"plan to run"

Almost all of the martial arts classes and even the firearms self defense classes I've taken explicitly tell you to incapacitate the aggressor by whatever means necessary then leave the area as quickly as possible.

[–]i-am-the-prize4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

I carry a pistol nearly daily, concealed. I have been to several hundred hours of firearm-self-defense, shot on the move, pistol, carbine, 3gun and LD rifle courses, for fun. This statement ("... explicitly tell you to incapacitate the aggressor by whatever means necessary ...") is incomplete. It is the last resort, that's the missing nugget.

You need to try and de-escalate and withdraw calmly. Do not retreat into a place that makes it worse for you (ie: a back alley where there are fewer witnesses/help) but do try to leave and calm the situation.

"... then leave the area as quickly as possible." Um no. If it did go to blows/using a weapon, you did so only when life/safety required it. You don't put 2 into someones' chest and another in his cranium and leave. You wait for cops, you call the lawyer you have on retainer.

If you take firearms classes and plan to use a weapon at home in self defense or if you carry, I highly recommend you check out the USCCA CCW/CHS Response Team. You pay a small yearly fee to have legal representation on demand, among their other benefits.

Step 0: you do what you had to do

Step 1: you call 911, and say: "I was attacked and feared for my life and had to defend myself and send both plice and an ambulance to this location"

Step 2: call (their 800 number) to engage the legal defense team

Step 3: follow all police instructions explain how you were attacked and feared for your life and had to defend yourself, and state: "I will cooperate 100% but first I need to speak to my attorney" then STFU. Your mind/nerves/perceptions will be all kinds of fucked up. STFU and wait for the lawyer.

[–]RunawayGrain0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Thanks for the more concise explanation.

"... then leave the area as quickly as possible." Um no. If it did go to blows/using a weapon, you did so only when life/safety required it. You don't put 2 into someones' chest and another in his cranium and leave. You wait for cops, you call the lawyer you have on retainer.

Yeah, I should have said 'remove yourself from the immediate vicinity of the aggressor.' The specific advice I was given in the self defense classes I took was "If this happens in your house, shoot them then go to your neighbors house and call the cops. If It's in public move to a safe place to call the cops."

The rational is that if they happen to revive themselves or have some buddies nearby they may continue to be aggressive or the buddies may jump you.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I'm not saying "cower and hide" but rather, "plan to run"

Yeah that's good advice. I was taught back in the day that when things look to be escalating verbally and you can't leave, always stand in boxer/wrestling stance with your hands down (so as not to provoke the opponent but at the same time hint that you're trained) so that if you're hit, you'll stay standing. Most dangerous in a street fight is falling down, then you'll get your head kicked in.

[–]Endorsed ContributorFereallyRed18 points19 points  (0 children) | Copy

Any idiot dumb enough or drunk enough to consider getting into a fight is likewise dumb and/or drunk enough to be talked out of it, or at least distracted long enough to alter the dynamic.

Look into de-escalation tactics.

There are no winners in a bar fight.

[–]youcancallmedada93 points94 points  (3 children) | Copy

Use the bitch as a living shield. There’s millions of her, there’s only one of you.

[–]mustache_ride_33 points34 points  (0 children) | Copy

Nice, stay classy Reddit.

[–]ur8moms8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

This :P

[–]i-am-the-prize0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

dark, funny, but dark.

[–]Crixusgannicus5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

If you are going to be any of the one or combination of TRP, MGTOW, PUA or just plain not part of the herd you absolutely must have some personal combat skills, armed and unarmed and armed includes ANYTHING handy, not just the usual stuff. You must also learn tactics because skills without tactics is as useless as tactics without skills.

The reason why is just because of existing you WILL piss "normal" people off to one extent or another.

You must also learn various skills because you don't know what you will be up against, in terms of art and skill level. For instance suppose you a very good boxer, but you come up against a grappler who somehow..either from his skills or you make a bad step and fall(real fights don't happen in dojos and boxing rings!) and he now has you on the ground. Your boxing skills are now mostly useless..what do you do?


" what’s the best way to deal with a big fucker like that? One wrong move, a clean hit, and I’d be done. "

This is a mistake. 3000!

NEVER approach ANY combat situation with preconceived notions as to what to do because all it takes is one change in the situation and your best laid plans and possibly YOU are FUCKED!

You want to have a variety of options trained into muscle memory. In times of stress:

“We don't rise to the level of our expectations, we fall to the level of our training.”. Although frequently credited to an anonymous Navy Seal, this quote is originally attributed to the Greek lyrical poet, Archilochus.

Archie was RIGHT!

[–]FiveStarTendieDinner10 points11 points  (5 children) | Copy

Learn the way of the gun. A firearm can disable anyone with ease and a well placed shot.

[–]flying-backflip8 points9 points  (4 children) | Copy

Even under a system where the maximum freedom is allowed, such as open carry states with no permit, I doubt bars would allow firearms inside. Maybe in the back country saloons, but certainly not in big cities.

[–]RipoffLeperDig 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

Major southwestern city here.

Concealed is concealed: I don't give two fucks about the bar's policy; it's completely legal (here, uniquely, not in many states) if you're not intoxicated.

[–]FiveStarTendieDinner0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Nobody should give a fuck about bar rules. I don't. Nobody needs to know I'm armed unless I have a reason to let that be known.

[–]Kink31 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Not to mention possibly shooting bystanders with a not so well placed shot.

[–]i-am-the-prize0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Incorrect. I have chl/cwp from 2 states which give me reciprocity in dozens of others. this law (guns in bars/restaurants) is state specific. in my home state, you can concealed carry in restaurant or bar, but you cannot drink alcohol while the firearm is on your person.

I am in a car club, we meet monthly at a place for food/drinks and talk cars. you can always tell who's carrying that night because they're ordering cokes/diet-cokes vs. beer. simple as that.

and before you say: "that's stupid to even allow a gun in a bar even if you're not drinking" in our state, retired / active LEO's can carry concealed AND DRINK in a bar or restaurant, now that is stooopid.

[–]seducter5 points6 points  (8 children) | Copy

Can't find the actual Gracie Combatives video (a certain bay of pirates may know where to look) but this rear takedown is really effective. BJJ, look into it.

[–]i-am-the-prize13 points14 points  (2 children) | Copy

I was sparing with a guy over 6'6" and over 300 pounds the other day in BJJ. I'm a 5'11" noob white belt, but we were doing rear naked chokes from rear position/guard and seatbelt hold. Even from this position, this big fucker was so 'tall' compared to me, I had trouble getting my arms up over his shoulders to get my arm around his neck and 'in deep', so I had to fall to the non-wrap side and shrimp up his back a bit to get the 'height'. unless OP knows what he's doing and is close in height, it's a tall order (bad pun) in my limited experience.

Avoid the battle and life to walk another day.

[–]Senior ContributorMentORPHEUS9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

In a real fight, the guy's not going to give a long pause for you to jump way the fuck off balance, and from there try to brute-force him off of a strong stance.

People scoff at arts like Aikido, but when you learn to control your opponent's balance, it's amazing how little force is necessary to take them down even with a huge weight and size difference.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That's why Greco-Roman Wrestling is best for any street fight. Its got a proven combat effectiveness and guys like Khabib primarily train wrestling and beast opponents like McGregor.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I've grappled with fuckers that are like 220lbs, 10% bodyfat. Have fun grappling when you can't even get into side control when he just benches you off of him. Lol. Have fun doing an armbar when he can curl your body weight.

[–]seducter0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Theres lots of options for bigger guys. Watch Royce Grace vs Kimo and you’ll see technique can overcome size differences. Also I am 210 now after bulking from 150 and guys said I felt heavier at 150 because I was using subtle techniques to make me heavier and gas em, as opposed to lately where Ive just relied on my extra weight.

[–]WeRAllOnThisBlessedD2 points3 points  (10 children) | Copy

You did the right thing. Even if he was smaller than you, you still would’ve been right in just getting out of there. Somebody calls the cops, and at the very least you spend the night in jail. Worst case, either you get your ass kicked/killed, or you somehow fuck the other dude up and now you’re the one with criminal charges against you. Only fight if it’s the last resort.

All these retards on here talking about MMA training and all that - yeah, I guess it could help, but if a dude is twice your size it probably won’t matter. Watch this video of Conor McGregor vs The Mountain from Game of Thrones. McGregor might be a piece of shit, but he could probably beat the hell out of most people he comes across. The Mountain is a giant, but he’s not a trained fighter like McGregor. Still, had they really been fighting, The Mountain would easily kill McGregor; all he would need to do is get his hands on him. So what chance would you, someone with nowhere near the training McGregor has, have against a guy twice your size?

[–]c_h_94-4 points-3 points  (9 children) | Copy

Your wrong. Conor is very proficient in bjj. The mountain wouldn't know what to do even if he got his hands on him and he would gas quickly and conor would take his back and strangle him. Big guys come to jujitsu all the time and try to use their strength. They get handled by blue belts. Let alone a world champ mma fighter.

[–]Burton9696962 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

A lot of people are talking in terms of absolutes here. The thing is that we wouldn’t know how that encounter would go if it was real because who knows, someone could get lucky. However based on obvious advantages that Thor has, there is a disadvantage on Conor’s end. Even if he did gas out, he could do a lot of damage in that time and it wouldn’t matter. Most “Big guys” aren’t one of the biggest, strongest men on the planet.

[–]i-am-the-prize2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Big guys come to jujitsu all the time and try to use their strength

yup. Folks need need to search the r / bjj forums for the post titled:

" It finally happened. Acquaintance that smugly said he could beat me at wrestling actually came to the gym."


I think most people that have been training a while have had at least one person be oddly confrontational once they find out that you train jiu jitsu. I've had a few guys, usually older, outright say they'd beat me up if we fought, but obviously the situation never comes up so it's just this awkward thing in the air and as the guy who trains it's incredibly frustrating on multiple levels. One, you didn't provoke the reaction, you just say you train jiu jitsu and obviously two, you'd whoop that person up but you never get to.

Hop forward to a few months ago. A younger person that's super into working out randomly approaches me when they learn that I train Bjj. He's athletic and young, big guy, but he's never so much as wrestled a sibling. He asks 'hey man, at what point does brute strength overcome technique? Because I feel that even though I don't train I'd still be able to beat you in a wrestling match'. I don't take kindly to this to be honest, and am pretty blunt about the fact that I'm probably much stronger than he expects me to be, and that I'd submit him within 1 minute. He is like 'nah, I don't think so bro', so I invite him to the gym to try a class.

About 3 months later, he actually shows up. We roll. I submit him 4 times in 3 minutes, before he declares himself exhausted and leaves. Says he's going to sign up, haven't seen him since.

I've been bullied for years as a kid, and I'll be honest, that may have been the highlight of my 5 years of training. I still suck ass at jiu jitsu, but whenever I feel like I'm not making progress I'm going to reflect on this moment to keep me going.

I almost didn't share this, but I had to."

[–]c_h_940 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah, the classic story of the overconfident big guy with the fragile ego. People dont realise the insane gap between pro bjj players and the ordinary person. Conor could simply hold him down in full guard and nullify all his attempts at escape for a few minutes where the mountain would surely gas, then submit him with ease. If he got top position he would absolutely punish him. Smother him in knee ride, side control, north south so he cant breathe and bait him into turning his back, then its game over. Either that or just heel hook him and break his knee.

The people who doubt this have never rolled with a blackbelt or even brown belt.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex-1 points0 points  (4 children) | Copy

Have you ever done BJJ with a guy with a huge weight difference? Try doing side control on a guy who is 220 lbs at 10% body fat. He will just bench you off of him. He doesn't particularly need technique.

[–]c_h_940 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Yes i have. No he won't. Yes he does.

Benching someone off you is a quick way to get armbared.

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Except the time when he can curl your bodyweight, so he just curls you lol.

[–]c_h_940 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

It doesn't work like that in the real world

[–]Chaddeus_Rex0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I wouldn't know. Never done BJJ in a real street fight. Don't intend to.

All I know from personal experience is that Greco-Roman wrestling works and can save your life. So if you want the most effective technique do that.

[–]Noctis_Cloud2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Concealed carry. /endthread

[–]NextForever5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Slam him in the nuts if you don’t know martial arts and NEED to return a blow ; there’s no chivalry when being attacked.

[–]AceMav211 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Get a snub nose .357 mag for big belligerent drunk dudes. That’s natural selection.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Westinghouse M-27 phased plasma rifle in the 40 watt range

[–]Obnoxiousjimmyjames1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Gymkata. Take the whole fucking bar down.

[–]ZeppKfw2 points3 points  (12 children) | Copy

Definitely always anticipate a swing. If you're proficient in martial arts (MMA/BJJ not karate or some useless martial arts) you can easily deal with anyone who isn't.

[–][deleted] 17 points18 points  (11 children) | Copy

True, but it's important to also note that weight and height can often trump even martial arts. If a guy is much taller and heavier than you he still has a massive advantage even if you know martial arts.

[–]flying-backflip2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Case in point:

Despite McGregor's training and experience, Bjornsson just throws him around with ease.

[–]ZeppKfw-3 points-2 points  (9 children) | Copy

That's why I said "if youre proficient". But yes, you'll have a big advantage if you're bigger.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (8 children) | Copy

Even proficient users can get trumped by weight and height. It's a sad truth.

[–]ZeppKfw-4 points-3 points  (7 children) | Copy

Idk about anyone not famous that's 7 feet tall and 250lbs. I've seen short guys fuck up 6 ft guys with average build because they know how to throw a punch.

[–]nonpornaccountii5 points6 points  (6 children) | Copy

As someone who’s been grappling his whole life, I can tell you, avoid the fight if you can. Anyone can have a blade on them, and I don’t care how well you can strike or grapple. The blade wins every time.

[–]ZeppKfw-2 points-1 points  (4 children) | Copy

Yeah, except we weren't talking about weapons. Stop strawmanning. The subreddit fightporn gives one good lesson. The average joe sucks at throwing punches.

[–]nonpornaccountii5 points6 points  (3 children) | Copy

It sounds like you haven’t really considered what can happen in a bar fight. Have you ever been in a fight ?

[–]ZeppKfw-4 points-3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Dude, what? I know that street fights ain't got rules. You can get seriously fucked up I know that. However, our discussion is about wether a small guy can still contend with big guys. You're strawmanning.

[–]nonpornaccountii6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy

Were having two conversations at the same time, why, idk.

  1. A smaller opponent can knockout a bigger opponent. See it all the time, I’ve seen some 120lbs female black belts that can strangle most men.

  2. It sounds like you learned about the straw man concept, 5mins ago and are very excited to use the word.

[–]lukakzinho1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Train MMA, Bjj is not good for street fights becouse you dont want to go on the ground. You never know if he has backup thats why keep the fight standing. If you can learn, Muay Thai or Kickboxing, if not then just kick in the groin and then elbow to the head or knee to the body.

[–]Ant1matter80 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I deal with a big person the way i deal with anyone else.

My fear response in such situations is fucked, so intimidation on an emotional level will not work but i am not an idiot.

If a 5'5 wants to have a go at me, then it will happen, what can i do about that, same goes if he is 6'6, it is what it is. Fighting is not done for fun, it is done because it is the last resort

[–]warburgio0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Just go to security stuff and say this guy is threatening ur girl with violence and u feel unsafe. Use the system. Also dont sit down. SOme ppl could argue that standing up from the table could aggrevate the situation, but id rather risk that then to be entirely dependent on whether the aggressor is crazy and attacks or not. If he attack and ure sitting down its a game over, huge disadvantage. Use anything thats in ur reach then- pint glass, chair, pate etc. The easiest solution would be to stand up and go to the security ppl.

[–]l1ght-0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

You handled it very well, good job man.

I was literally looking into this yesterday, and all the advice said the same thing - ignore it, laugh it off, and move to another area.

Most importantly, do not engage in conflict. The woman could assume you’re both fighting for her, depending on the situation, and then you lose your stance as the alpha male.

If you cannot laugh it off with the guy, just leave.

[–]flatox0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I can recommend Krav Maga, but Jiu Jitsu should also be great i have heard, however that does not really account for being outnumbered most of the time.

[–]Sylvester_Sterone0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Not worth it unless it is a life or death situation; but you never know.

I live in a college town in the midwest where I noticed where all parties involved in a fight get arrested. Next your name is printed in the local paper with details of your arrest. Ridiculous.

" Simple Assault Intentionally Cause Bodily Injury; Dismissed-Motion By Prosecutor. Intentional Causing Contact W/Bodily Fluids/Human Waste; Dismissed-Motion By Prosecutor."

[–]Mojorisin51500 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I kinda had the same situation except they wanted to use something I had. Told the guy no and he started giving me shit. Telling me he was gonna send me to hell. I just stood my ground, smiled, and said fine send me to hell. In the end, he walked away pissed and I laughed. Granted, I was a little taller and heavier than him, not by much tho.

I think i would have handled the situation differently if he was that much bigger than me tho. Probably would have walked away too.

[–]Slut_Slayer90000 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The best thing to do is socially disarm the guy. Be his friend, ask him questions, get his mind off of "fighting." Most bullies just want attention. Eventually remove yourself from the situation once he is defused and distracted.

You can still maintain frame and LEAD your group to safety by NOT fighting. Be smart and pick your battles.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

You leave ASAP and don't get involved. My gosh...

[–]RPthrowaway1230 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

My dad always had good advice on these sorts of things. He would always say: "don't get in a fight if you don't have to, but if you know a fight is unavoidable then hit him first, hit him hard, and don't let him get up." It's served me pretty well in my life so far.

One note, fights are never like in the movies. I've been in two in 27 years, and thinking back I've noticed a few things. First, nobody hits as hard as they think they do and punching someone hurts your hand as badly as it hurts what you hit. This is because of the forces involved, if you watch MMA fighters they have a specific fist made when they hit someone to reduce this. Second, the fight usually ends when someone goes to the ground which generally happens pretty fast . Most guys that go looking to start fights have no idea how to actually fight, I think, and they'll most likely get off balance and fall over pretty quickly.

I'm not an expert fighter, martial artist, or tough guy trying to grandstand here. This are just what I've seen from the two idiots that have taken a swing at me.

[–]BradyBrosef330 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

as a fairly tall built young guy I always get people being wide at bars and clubs, they're almost always an inch or two taller and really skinny, I've found its usually skinny guys my height or taller that want to beef with me, maybe its a "this guys buffer than me so i need to assert my dominance" but honestly I dont want to fight anyone because its not who I am but if I was smaller than I am now I would defo never pick a fight

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

This is why whenever I go out I carry a M-29 recoilless gun (smoothbore) disassembled in a backpack with a couple of M-388 rounds

[–]Startlivingfornow[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Lmao. You’re absolutely fucked if you do this

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

its alpha

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Don't think this is a problem one can ever really solve 100%, short of becoming really good at fighting. There's always the chance that some guy will find an issue with you and want to fight. The possibility of violence is always there, as is the possibility that you'll get your ass kicked.

I would guess the best thing to do is try laugh it off and get away. If they lay hands on you in any way the fight is basically certain by that point and they're testing you: just start punching without warning, aim to back away after you've thrown a few, and hope for the best. None of this "get your fucking hands off me or I'ma flatten you fucko", just start swinging. This is the surest way to end the situation because nobody is expecting it and bullies don't like someone who fights back. You'll also have the upper hand because they won't be expecting it because there's usually more escalation before the punches start flying. So long as you're just basically trying to punch him away from you and not pushing forward while fighting as he comes at you then most places justify this if the guy has put his hands on you and is acting in an aggressive manner.

If he puts his hands on you and you don't do anything he's realised you're a soft target and will only double down on the bullying, possibly escalating to full on assault. Best choice at this point is to start swinging. They'll be taken by surprise and realise they chose the wrong guy. Bullies don't like victims who fight back.

Never throw the first punch if he hasn't touched you. This will count as you assaulting him and could come with severe legal penalties, and it will work against you if the cops show up or it goes to court or anything like that. It may seem like a good idea if you're sure the fight is about to start, but it's not worth being the one who initiates physical contact.

You can look up training videos to recognise body language of someone who is pumping themself up to initiate an assault. Bouncers have to do this training to get licensed: recognising the signs that someone is about to enact violence.

Never be afraid of running if things get bad. A bit of shame in front of a girl is way better than hospitalisation, and a lot of guys get scars and permanent injuries from fights (especially if the assaulter is drunk or high and is lacking the common sense of when to stop).

I've a friend who just last month had one of his front teeth knocked out by a drunk who took a disliking to him. I fully believe if my friend had seen the signs and started swinging when the drunk started touching him then he'd still have that tooth.

[–]inittowinit7772 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Have you ever even been in a fight?

[–]lampshade28180 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

What kind of place were hanging out where a giant man sits down, buys you drinks, then just randomly wants to fight? Were you talking shit? Was he trying to get with your girl? Sounds weird AF.

[–]mustache_ride_-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Kick his knee in. Kick the wide side of your foot side-ways right at the patella. Bonus points if his knee is locked in as it would make disassembling those tendons much easier.

Only do this in a life or death situation though. You did right in this case to excuse yourself, don't fight with idiots, they'll just drag you down to their level.

[–]berkales-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Last time this happened to me although the guy was about 6ft and 190lbs (I'm 6ft 2 and 240lbs).

Story goes I was speaking to an Old friend and he pushed me (on purpose although slyly) from behind when he brushed past me.

I turned around and asked him politely to buy my friend another drink because my pint went all over her.

He then refused (he was with two male friends) and then said to me if I would like to take it outside, I of course said yes I would.

Luckily we were in a sort of narrow corridor with tables for 2 or 3 people max, as soon as he turned around I kicked the back of his knee (automatically causes knee flexion) then proceeded to put him in a chokehold (like YG) and started dragging him backwards to negate his attempts to resist, his face started turning red, I could hear him struggling for air, I whispered into his ear whether he would like to die that night and got nothing in response but gargles.

His friends were trying to get to me through him but I said if they try more I'll outright kill him, so they stopped.

Long story short : back attacks and chokeholds.

[–]rubydachurro 1 points [recovered]  (1 child) | Copy

No weight classes on the street so a quick kick in the nuts would be okay.

[–]moderateVegan_AMA0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

A kick in the nuts can take up to 20 seconds to really kick in. Plenty of time for a few more punches, and one punch can kill.

[–]scorpionkinggg-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

There’s two options, walk away or fight. Now if you are going to fight then you need to have the relevant skill. And you also need to make the first move. That way you can take your clean shots. I learned that off my mate when we were teenagers and he was a martial arts instructor

[–]HoedownInBrownTown-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Liver punch!

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

At one time,mainly in the past, warlords hacked apart peasants with their swords, for practice. The peasants not having weapons and the time to gain muscles, as they were busy with other aspects of life, started using their mind.

They looked at every move made by the warlord with their swords, predictable since their armour and swords restricted their movements. They practised striking the warlords at their weak points while moving into an optimal position for the next attack. With incentive to save their life, martial arts was invented by the peasant. They had incentive.

Statistically, A person hurting you for no apparent reason is very low. Thus the incentive is reduced to learn to defend yourself. Obviously there is a gradient. People learn martial arts for multiple reasons. It is a useful skill after all.

With language at our disposal, might I suggest learning the art of language to defeat your opponent. Would something like this even exist?

Good luck with your endeavours.


[–]Snowaey-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

In terms of 1 on 1 combat, BJJ is the most effective, you just take them down and choke their asses out, but if there are multiple attackers, going to the ground would be the last thing you would wanna do since the others would just stomp your head as you're trying to submit one of them.

But only a couple months of regularly practicing BJJ would make you proficient enough to be able to submit anyone without much effort since they wouldn't know how to defend against submissions (which is literally 50% of bjj) unless they are BJJ-practicioners themselves.

I think boxing would be optimal for self defence since you focus strictly on your hands, which is good if you want the fight to be over quickly, one well placed punch and the fight is over, and you have a better chance of fighting off multiple attackers.

[–]VigilantSmartbomb-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

It doesn’t matter how big you are, a bear is not going to fuck with a cheetah. You feel me tho?

It doesn’t matter how strong you are, if you have the eye of a more Ferocious beast, one that can’t be reasoned with and would likely play with its kill before offing them completely? People won’t fuck with you.

Practice this by eying up and telling other men to move out of your way through body language. Move through them. They do not exist, you are the only force. Should be the mentality anyways.

Leave nothing unchecked.

It’s also the bar, man not everybody is your friend.

And “being nice” isn’t real, it’s “being fake” think about it. You’re not being your true self and now you’re mad coming to the sub. Real talk tho! Think about it! If you’d have handled it how you wanted to then you wouldn’t be asking us.

Kill him through body language.

Lol idk maybe I’m crazy, but I don’t get fucked with at the bar and people respect me and the girls are bout me so idk! 😂😂 that’s what I do tho lol

I mean it’s all love and fair game but if someone doesn’t respect the pecking order its off with their head in my book, no you can’t hang. 😂

[–]Domebeers-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

If you can, you kick him hard in the side of the knee, try to collapse it. If you get him down I'd suggest running, or you'll be forced to kill him if he is that much bigger, because if he gets up he will kill you.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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