Why do y’all ask for women’s opinions/experiences and then not believe us?

red__aaron · 2018-12-27T22:10:24+00:00

Why ask us at all if you don’t believe our answers?

Have you considered that the people asking arent the same ones as the latter group?

Orange_Paisley · 2018-12-27T22:07:37+00:00

They aren't really questions; they are accusations.

RadChadswell · 2018-12-27T21:45:36+00:00

So they can either

use it to confirm their biases, proof ARALT
accuse you of lying because it doesn't fit their ideology

Don't you know that words are either evidence of their ideology or lies?

couldbemage · 2018-12-27T22:49:21+00:00

I didn't see a lot of not believing in that thread. Drawing negative conclusions from your answers is something else entirely.

Calling women children was based on believing the answers.

TheBookOfSeil · 2018-12-27T23:19:56+00:00

Why do y’all ask for women’s opinions/experiences and then not believe us?

I think the reason people do it is because what women say sometimes do not line up with what they do.

In another thread about consent, someone asked why women sometimes don’t say “no” when they mean no and rather freeze up or just don’t react.

Per my previous comment, someone might see this as an incongruency.

If someone says "no" to something and then shows it through their actions by resisting, it would be believed that the person meant "no." If someone says "no" and does not follow with any action that shows they meant "no," then it wouldn't appear to be as believable.

MGTOWtoday · 2018-12-28T06:17:09+00:00

Let me see if I’m understanding this. You invite a man over to your home, or you go to his home. You engage in a romantic back and forth, and it leads to sex. But you don’t say no, because reasons. Yeh, I’m calling bullshit. If you didn’t want to have sex, then you shouldn’t have 1) gone to his place, 2) engaged in a romantic evening together, and then 3) say you’re afraid to put the brakes on at the last second.

You know the Get Out If Jail Free card in Monopoly? You gals want the opposite. You want the power to point at any man at random and have him put behind bars on your say so without a trial, lawyer or jury.

Screw that. If you’re too incompetent to say no, then you’re too incompetent to vote. Either you’re an adult or a child with tits. Pick one.

_Neon_Shadow_ · 2018-12-27T22:00:22+00:00

Because some of you -- not all -- just want to disagree with everything red pill because its red pill.

Red Pill: Women like financially stable men. Climb the career ladder and become successful.

PPD Women: My husband is unemployed, I make more than him, and I still love him. That's not true.

Red Pill: Women like attractive men.

PPD Women: My husband is 500lbs, not conventionally attractive, that's not true.

Etc ...

Edit: I didn't read the body when I wrote this. Just the title. My bad.

red__aaron · 2018-12-27T22:34:44+00:00

I also want to tell you that with respect to the post you're talking about:

The response to this

Several women responded explaining men sometimes react poorly/violently to an outright rejection, women are socialized to be “nice” at the expense of their own comfort, and that freezing is a natural response to scary situations.

was not "i don't believe you" or "you're lying about this."

The response was "your reactions are not consistent with the claims that you are equal to us or that you want equal treatment or that you are able to handle treatment equivalent to that which is given to men."

The response was "if you react in these ways, then you are not mature enough/ready to be in public unchaperoned."

On the contrary: I assumed the representations were true and responded accordingly.

cxj · 2018-12-27T22:26:21+00:00

It’s different commenters asking vs replying and you’re deliberately conflating the two for a sick GOTCHA

Another shit ppd post

flyawaylittlebirdie · 2018-12-28T02:25:32+00:00

Lol, don't you love it when they ask for our opinions, then when you give vague general responses they begin to attack you, personally, as though you must do it yourself to explain behavior?

bitter_samsara · 2018-12-28T03:21:16+00:00

I run into this problem a lot, and really I think it comes down to miscommunication. I sometimes ask about "women" but I don't care about one individual woman's experience. This is basically trying to have a discussion of ideas with a person who makes everything about themselves.

For example, if someone asks me why men place so much emphasis on a woman's looks, I won't just reflexively say "well I'm a man and I dont do that!!!". It literally feels like talking to someone with the mind of a 5 year old.

I've found a way around this pattern by saying "I can believe that you don't X, but what's your point?" and almost ALL times so far they admit they don't really have one.

BiggerDthanYou · 2018-12-28T03:30:12+00:00

Why do y’all ask for women’s opinions/experiences and then not believe us?

Because people are not really good saying what they really believe and some may be mistaken on the reasons for some things. The case of people not believing lack of consent is,,, bad. But I kind of understand them. being paralyzed by fear is possible. But to not be able to say "no" when there is a need is a serious psychological condition which should be treated and by no means a normal occurrence.

Why ask us at all if you don’t believe our answers?

Because we have no way to know the truth. And want to know your view of it. But are skeptic. All we have is behavior. Anything else is but speculation. You said yourself, women do not show their true self, so we use behavior as it is all we are sure. We are not mind-readers, so we ask. And believe it until we have proof that it is not the case, that is.

-------------------------------------

I will admit, I do not believe blue pills most of the time in this sub because of their past record, and because of experimentation. I like to test out some people's claims like "women do not like douchebags" or "TRP only works in women with low self esteem" and... they almost never hold water.

You can only scream "wolf" so much. But I still put those claims to the test. My idea of knowledge is to have experimentation being the knowledge with the foremost solidity, followed by past observed behavior. These people's opinions or ideas are the least of the priority, because we are never sure how things in the future or present are. But we can be sure about the past. Thus, experimentarion and post facto observation to me are the king.

SAC-Lawn_Gnome · 2018-12-27T21:35:06+00:00

Because women on this sub are almost all trolls. Literally none of them claim to be currently dating, and this sub is almost entirely about discussing dating related issues. Furthermore people portray themselves and their gender in excessively positive lights, making you realize they literally are all full of shit.

BiggerDthanYou · 2018-12-27T21:56:25+00:00

You've got to consider that the average TRPer is more autistic than the average autists. They require an extremely oversimplified worldview like TRP, because uncertainty, ambiguity and nuance scares them.

The men here tend to be extremely dogmatic about their beliefs and also can't even understand that women aren't all the same person.

It would take them too much mental effort to treat women as individuals so they reduce them to a simple flowchart: is it a woman? Then AWALT

They do care about women's opinions, but only as long as those are sockpuppet accounts that tell them that all their delusions and hurt feelings are objective facts.

If you say something that's not in line with their feelings it's proof enough for them to conclude that you must be lying, because they literally can't even imagine that you are not AWALT.

And in turn they feel like AWALT has been proven once again, because by simply telling themselves that you must be lying they have proven that you are AWALT after all.

Just don't take them too seriously and don't start believing that they are reflective of normal men.

passepar2t · 2018-12-27T21:44:36+00:00

Sometimes it's illuminating to watch what people say even when you know they aren't telling you the whole truth.

And sometimes an OP will make a thread just to shout down anyone who responds and prove how clever he is.

IRunYourRiver · 2018-12-27T23:13:56+00:00

Look, if you are hanging out on this sub and calling yourself redpilled, probably what that means is you are on the path or a work in progress. Unplugging is a long process and there is a lot of up-is-downism when you're first starting. So, you aren't sure what to believe and probably lean a little hard on the dismissive side. I think as you progress, your perspective changes a little.

the_calibre_cat · 2018-12-28T00:48:36+00:00

I mix both my own observations with the answers I get from women to formulate my understanding of the world. Some of your answers are straight and right on, others are less clear.

jenovajunkie · 2018-12-28T01:20:28+00:00

It takes few people to ruin it for many.

Zaorish9 · 2018-12-28T03:27:14+00:00

Red pill people fundamentally are not curious people. they fundamentally do not want to learn, only to confirm preconcieved notions.

donkeydodo · 2018-12-28T07:08:14+00:00

To be honest, because there are cases where women seem to give consent, yet there are rape accussations the day after / a while after; the man thought he had her consent, because she responds to his flirtiness, yet he is still a rapist - this is why we think it’s retarded of you to not just say no.

Drippyskippy · 2018-12-28T20:14:41+00:00

Because women care a lot about their reputation and therefore are more likely to stretch the truth. Women also want natural alphas, they don't want to tell betas the truth. I'm always amused by female responses in Q4W topics.

[deleted] · 2018-12-29T00:46:07+00:00

Simple answer:

Because women will often misinterpret the things they're asked. Even subconsciously.

Example: If a woman claims that she's never had guys interested in her, 99% of the time, she's (unconsciously) ignoring the guys she finds "unattractive". She will 100% honestly say that she's genuinely never had any guy interested in her, even if it's not true.

Example 2: A woman will say she was sexually harassed. She defines "sexually harassed" as "unwanted interaction". She's asked out by an unattractive guy, making the interaction unwanted. The guy in this situation didnt do anything wrong, but can still be accused of sexual harassment.

(Note: These are just two general examples.)

That's why people ask women for extensive details, to make sure they're not accidentally saying an untruth. It may seem rude, but it's necessary if you absolutely want the truth.

And before I get jumped, let me make it clear that I apply the exact same standard to men.

Eartherry · 2018-12-27T21:42:45+00:00

Because:

--women lie. About everything. All the time.

--this is a debate site and implicit in debate is picking apart people's positions

--women call men liars all the time here

--we are exploring the hypocrisy of your positions. You say you want to be treated equally, then complain and bitch when we treat you equally. Because "equal treatment" includes the bad as well as the good.

If you want equal treatment you don't get to complain that you're being treated like men. That's what you wanted; that's what you get.

--what you say doesn't line up with what you do.

EDIT: Ooooh, the downvoting. Someone's triggered.

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TallSwaggOVO · 2018-12-28T02:55:18+00:00

Cause you have men that refuse to believe anything but their preconceived notion of ideologies. You also have women that lie for the sole purpose of disagreeing with red pill to prove that they aren’t like that.

bonusfruit · 2018-12-28T05:34:00+00:00

Its important to observe which things you lie about, the various false responses, and the reasons for the lies

Raikichu · 2018-12-28T09:54:07+00:00

I was in that thread. I just joined jn because i thought the answers were stupid. I didnt ask any questions. Here was my final comment that i didnt get replies to.

"I dont understand why someone would keep going when the other is silent either. I also dont get why someone would be silent and alone with someone they fear so much they daren't to speak to them. Maybe the average woman and man on this sub is weird compared to the average person outside. "

So i admit that it could happen that women freeze up. But i also state that its not normal to be in a situation where you let yourself literally get fucked by someone that scares you into silence by just touching you. Which i suppose isnt strange occurence for the women here due to the nature of the average woman here. Being a high inhib autistic failure isnt a rare occurrence of a man here. You read men stating stupid shit as if it is normal to be like that. So why would the women here not be weird.

[deleted] · 2018-12-28T14:36:34+00:00

1) Up to some point, out of politeness

2) Because we see discrepancies between what's told to us and what we see, or the pattern we see emerge out thereof

prostate-apostate · 2018-12-28T18:38:38+00:00

Because often what you say doesn't reflect the reality i see on the ground . The idea that a woman would put with a man bs when she doesn't want to doesn't seem plausible based on the woman i deal with .

shonenhikada · 2018-12-29T20:37:22+00:00

Because women words that come out of her mouth most of the time contradict her action. Men have seen this pattern and seeing human society has evolved to look at trends and form theories have come to the conclusion that it's best to look at a woman's actions than what she says.

Also a lot of you women are too self absorb in thinking that if you don't do that then it does not hold true. What many of ya'll fail to realize is that exceptions do not make the rule. Minorities do not invalidate the majority.

Xemnas81 · 2019-01-26T16:38:32+00:00

I already know the vast majority of feminist reasoning and explanations for gender politics. I am, like many redpillers and MRA-MGTOW, an ex male feminist.

LeJacquelope · 2018-12-27T21:33:07+00:00

LOL this right here. This is exactly why I made a Q4W post and said I wasn't gonna say shit but rather listen to women's responses. Then the mods said I was shit stirring. You can't win.

abaxeron · 2018-12-28T01:15:03+00:00

men sometimes react poorly/violently to an outright rejection

How the Hell did you end up in bed with this person while not wanting to fuck them and knowing (or at least suspecting) that they have anger issues? And how can you blame people whose response to this question is "by being crazy" and "by acting like a child".

women are socialized to be “nice” at the expense of their own comfort

Women dump their healthy, loyal, hard-working, loving husbands because they get bored; this is not a behavior of someone who got "socialized to be 'nice' at the expense of their own comfort"; this is the behavior of someone who values their own comfort above almost everything else.

freezing is a natural response to scary situations.

Defending yourself is a natural response to scary situations. Freezing response indeed happens and is indeed natural, but usually lasts less than even the shortest of intercourses, let alone sexual situations where consent is ambiguous, that can last several times longer than average intercourse, not the smallest one. "Freezing is a natural response" is mostly a political talking point that was brought into criminal justice to throw men in prison for sexual assault without corroborating evidence of struggle, i.e. to make it impossible for men to bring up absence of evidence of struggle as support of their innocence in court. Can we get real for a second?

Why do y’all ask for women’s opinions/experiences and then not believe us?... Why ask us at all if you don’t believe our answers?

We don't need retelling of shitlib talking points; we know them by heart and we know that they're false. And when we ask for opinions, experiences, and answers, we don't ask for shitlib talking points.

Title	Why do y’all ask for women’s opinions/experiences and then not believe us?
Author	red__aaron
Upvotes	64
Comments	358
Date	December 27, 2018 9:26 PM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/aa3eom/why_do_yall_ask_for_womens_opinionsexperiences/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/why-do-yall-ask-for-womens-opinionsexperiences-and.258330 https://theredarchive.com/post/258330