"Women don't give a fuck about your feelings [...] only how you make her feel." Is the Red Pill damaging to men's mental and emotional health?

Villaintine · 2016-02-15T12:47:48+00:00

I lean quite red, but I need to keep tabs on how much I swallow a day for the sake of my wellbeing. So, women don't want to fuck men with feelings, they want to mother them. But, this article goes on to say, there is absolutely NO reason to share yourself with ANY WOMAN whatsoever in any capacity.

This seems like a stretch, even if you take these TRP posts at face value.

The suggestion seems to me to be that expressing emotional weakness is unattractive, because, well, weakness in general is unattractive. That means, if there is a woman whom you intend to attract, the last thing you should do is "share yourself" emotionally with her.

It does not mean, as you suggest, that no woman in any capacity will listen to you. A female therapist will care about you as much as a male therapist (which is to say, not very much beyond their professional duty), and a female friend might care about you much in the same way a male friend might. Depending on the kind of person they are they might offer support here or there. Man or woman, there are all sorts of personalities out there.

I think when reading TRP it is important to keep in mind that its general orientation is sexual strategy. It is not a life manual, or an exhaustive description of human behaviour. TRP's treatment of women narrowly focuses and talks about women in their capacities as sexual creatures. The claim seems to me to boil down to: if you want sex, don't be weak.

This is still depressing, if it's true. It means that the person you're attracted to and care about more than other women is, ironically, one that you can't share things about yourself with, which you can share with other women. My Disney love-conception shudders at the thought, but I can certainly see the logic.

monkeybeast55 · 2016-02-15T07:49:08+00:00

I think the sooner one realizes that there are precious few people generally who give two shits about his/her feelings the better. Of course that post veers into infantilization territory as RP posts are wont to do but there's a core of wisdom there. People are way too wrapped up in their own lives to consider your feelings unless it somehow benefits them, so conduct yourself with that in mind.

But if/when you do meet someone who genuinely cares keep them around!

you_done_messed_up · 2016-02-15T09:04:22+00:00

How could an MRP man ever bring himself to get married?

I think most MRP men find the red pill after they got married, ended up in a dead bedroom and started looking for solutions.

There might be guys who decide to get married after becoming RP aware, but I've yet to see posts about that.

tinytiger4321 · 2016-02-15T07:32:53+00:00

Replace "do not give a shit" with "has no obligation to" and you have a very useful piece of information.

The idea is, women, and lots of people, are guided by their desires to fulfill themselves. If people are drawn to you, and your presence fulfills some desires for them, then that's great. But the deal is women have no obligation to help you in spite of not having any of their desires fulfilled by you.

princepeanutbutter · 2016-02-15T08:42:32+00:00

Good question.

But know that Red Pill seeks to optimize a man's ability to sleep with women by generating attraction. This is a very pragmatic goal, such that EVEN IF, say, it turned a man into an avoidant-dismissive with a cynical attitude towards intimacy and relationships, it wouldn't matter unless it harmed his ability to attract women. I'd argue that being an avoidant-dismissive with sociopathic tendencies does wonders for your sex life, and thus I'm not surprised to see threads promoting Machiavellianism, etc. As a pragmatist, you do what works.

Also, to a Red Pill man, women ARE NOT dangerous, and sex is incredible and, when you're focused on practical outcomes above all else, easy to get. That's why you don't MGTOW. And even the quotes above do not consider women to be dangerous, just callous, ruthless, and ... pragmatic.

For women in helpful professions, that's a good point. But remember, if you're there to receive help, you're not there to generate attraction.

[deleted] · 2016-02-15T14:49:01+00:00

Don't kill the messenger. All we do is tell men about the mistreatment they're likely to face so that they can take proper precautions.

cxj · 2016-02-15T15:36:14+00:00

Why is men learning to be stoic rocks bad again?

despisedlove2 · 2016-02-15T15:53:36+00:00

I skimmed through your post, but the quoted part of your subject line is obviously true. Well known in marketing as a method used to target potential female customers. I recall watching a long Discovery channel episode about how marketing is gender dependent.

The example they showed was that of a woman out jogging and drinking vitamin water.

Maybe if your didn't pay so much attention to the outlandish parts of RP (pickup culture, etc), you would realize that it is largely common sense of the sort that men used to teach their boys.

Women only care about how something or someone makes them feel. This is well known.

You don't have to be RP to know that.

InformalCriticism · 2016-02-15T14:09:22+00:00

You missed a step here:

It basically says that women are callous harpies who are incapable of empathising with men.

It actually says that women just don't care; it said nothing about their capacity to. Women are capable of quite a bit, it's what they do (or rather don't do, with their abilities) that makes reality so far from the fiction we've been force-fed by society. And Here:

there is absolutely NO reason to share yourself with ANY WOMAN whatsoever in any capacity.

Yes with one caveat: you're pulling this from red pill. They're not talking about your mom, your wife, your daughter, they're talking about the skank at the bar you want to spin. It has been said repeatedly, but moreso recently, BP functions are absolutely necessary for LTRs.

Whisper · 2016-02-15T20:07:06+00:00

https://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/3dwokl/and_dont_listen_to_me_like_a_sperg_either/

redmachines · 2016-02-15T13:36:53+00:00

How is that damaging? That isn't red pill. This is common sense. The world doesn't care about you so you need to do your part and stop caring about them. What is damaging is when you set up a false world where people are nice, responds positively to moral behavior/actions and always help those in need. The longer that bullshit is in your mind, the more fragile your mind becomes when you swallow the inevitable truth.

Svarthofthi · 2016-02-15T11:28:49+00:00

It sort of depends. You have to realize that TRP makes many broad strokes in its message to reinforce a proper mindset. That mindset being essentially a strong independent man. Traits of dominance, self-sustained emotional stability, and, to some extent, a SMV approach to women. Moreover, the broad strokes are intended to be accepted for what they are, there is always circumstance, and you'll find it. At the beginning, though, they're arming you with a mindset, not a truth necessarily.

I don't necessarily buy into it having a profoundly negative impact on men's emotional health than really any of the other myriad societal influences that don't give a shit about men. You can find many stories about just these sorts of things, perhaps its just the internet age, or perhaps that was largely the trend. The world has largely seemed to revolve around a sink or swim mentality, only close friends and family being able to really be a reliable bedrock.

In the current day, families tend to deteriorate, or generally remain a loose connection. Those of you who still have that support should count yourselves lucky.

I'm mostly arguing from a viewpoint that there are many more pressing societal concerns that could cause the things you worry about, TRP, is a lot like trial by fire, some are eaten alive by the flames. However, some come out of it tempered and reliant only upon themselves. The TRPers I know in real life that I consider a success are fun, intelligent, dominant, but extremely distant in regards to closeness. This might be because I'm somewhat 'in the know'.

I think in the end, though, it is what you make of it, I doubt the knowledge that people, generally, could give a shit about you is actually a rather widespread belief, and not exclusive to TRP, that there are larger societal concerns about men, (our declining health, happiness, and growing suicide rate.) TRP is, I'd say, largely either innocent because every other male dominated sphere scripts the same language, or they're as guilty. In either case, it's rather irrelevant.

TRP is a reactionary movement toward western countries continuation of alienating and, in my opinion, harming men.

I suppose as an aside, while I think the things I mentioned in here were innocent of the damage of young men as a concept. It does allow for these men to form a brotherhood with likeminded men which is beneficial. The only damage that might be incurred is what happens afterward as the TRP sub, while heavily moderated, doesn't tend to filter out a lot of the general anger and misanthropy. They should probably aim to be a more positively minded subreddit IMO to be a genuinely positive influence on men.

[deleted] · 2016-02-15T22:26:20+00:00

Damaging? What's damaging is the fiction that a woman will give a shit about you. The instant they sense weakness of any kind, they begin the search for the replacement. The truth is not damaging at all, probably helpful actually so that you don't mistakenly show a woman you care about any weakness and then she will actively work to make it worse to punish you for failing to be her perfectly stoic rock

tinytiger4321 · 2016-02-15T14:07:30+00:00

http://therationalmale.com/2013/11/13/empathy/

boom

energyvolley · 2016-02-15T07:33:16+00:00

deleted ^{^{^What}} ^{^{^is}} ^{^{^this?}}

LUClEN · 2016-02-15T15:15:30+00:00

If women are plain dangerous and good for nothing but sex, why not MGTOW?

Because then no sex.

there is absolutely NO reason to share yourself with ANY WOMAN whatsoever in any capacity.

Traditional masculinity 101

[deleted] · 2016-02-15T18:45:07+00:00

Is the Red Pill damaging to men's mental and emotional health?

All truth is in general

Papa_Rymski · 2016-02-15T08:44:29+00:00

Guys, if you truly believe that women are biologically destined to regard men as nothing but walking ATMs and tingle machines, why would you ever bother to associate with them outside of sex?

I think that’s the point you’re missing.

They’re looking for “tingles” - emptying their sacks into a hot woman - and “attention” and “validation” - getting recognised as an Alpha male instead of a Beta orbiter because the fastest way to get more tingles is to be seen as an Alpha.

This is not about marriage or LTR so it isn’t damaging their mental health because they’re achieving what they set out to achieve.

How could an MRP man ever bring himself to get married?

Only as a business-like transaction e.g. I want children, two of them, a clean house and a cooked dinner and … and … and …

If they want to get married at all, they want a return on investment for all that cash they spew out of the ATM.

This is a wife as something like a cross between an employee, a surrogate and the domestic help.

The amount of projection is literally too funny for words.

tallwheel · 2016-02-16T08:24:42+00:00

Why even bother asking BPers about this? Whether it's true or not, from BPers you're just gonna get a bunch of NAWALT and 'Nuh-uh. Cause I know a woman/am a woman and blah blah blah...'

wzil · 2016-02-16T12:35:09+00:00

TRP is as much as fault for pointing it out as the poison label on bleach is as fault for the damage done if you drink it. This is but a warning, the real damage is what is caused by the effect that generates the warning.

kick6 · 2016-02-16T20:24:40+00:00

Nobody gives a fuck about men's feelings. Well, except, maybe your mother. So it's not damaging to men's emotional health insofar as the truth is not damaging to men's emotional health.

winndixie · 2016-02-22T06:04:21+00:00

Are female therapists a bad call too? Female doctors? Female anyone in a position where you're dependent on them?

Reaching. They would be a professional their job obligates them to help.

In a personal relationship where there is no obligation? Absolutely true, in my experience. Women don't want a human being with flaws and emotions. They want to watch a TV show. What's in a TV show? A hunky guy who always wins. Give them that TV show.

[deleted] · 2016-02-15T17:14:17+00:00

Absolutely. But not just men's mental and emotional health. Women's too, because spreading their hateful and divisive messages about the supposed differences between the genders is nothing but toxic to all parties who come in contact with it. We can see so many examples of this when we read the post you are referring to here.

and more arrogantly, that their beta outbursts from that point onwards constitute red pill behaviour

Already they are promoting this "betas and alphas" view of the world which splits men up into two categories and promotes aggressive or dominant behavior, as this is the "alpha" group these men are referring to, of which they are of course a member. And let's not easily forget the provocative title, "Women do not give a fuck about your feelings." Already, we see a pattern. It is an ideology based on divisiveness, mistrust and anger.

When it comes to feelings start by remembering this - woman discuss their feelings (mostly for the same reasons that they do anything else, for validation and attention), men simply act on them.

Anybody who actually interacts with women knows that just like men, they can be of course be self-centered. But to say that that is the only motivation of any woman on earth is a grossly offensive generalization to say the least. As I read almost everything this person has to say, all I can think is "Who hurt you?"

There is no reason, at all, ever, to discuss your feelings with a woman. Firstly it's a waste of your time because they don't care (they get no validation or attention from it after all), and secondly it does irreparable harm to your frame and SMV, and is a sure fire way to render any vagina as dry as the sahara in minutes.

It's as if this person has no idea that strong relationships are built on trust and communication, the vast majority of which are between straight couples because most people are straight. Discussing your feelings with your partner is the first step towards fixing any problem, and to act as if this is exclusively or disproportionately due to women is baseless, sexist bullshit that is meant to appeal to men of the lowest common denominator who feel wronged by the women in their lives. These men are furious because they can't make their own relationships work, so they blame it all on women.

Why? Because women don't care about how YOU feel, they only care about how YOU make THEM feel. They care about the tingles you give them when you maintain your alpha frame and the SMV you have in public, they care about the protection they feel when they are out in public with you, they care about the direction and purpose you bring to the relationship and in turn their lives, they care about the financial security and social status you bring, they care about the orgasm you give them when you let your testosterone take over and give them the rough fucking they so desperately crave.

As a woman, this is not even close to how I feel about my boyfriend or any of the boyfriends I've ever had. This guy couldn't be more insulting. I care VERY much about my boyfriend's feelings and I know a ton of women who feel exactly the same as I do. These men look at only the most shallow of women and say that those women are the majority. Most women I know don't see men as being either "alpha" or "beta." You know what I see in a man? Kindness, intelligence, passion. That's what I look for. I didn't pick my boyfriend for money or social status.

I could go on and on here, but I think it is abundantly clear that Red Pill ideology is written by men who are pissed off at women, that it is hateful and divisive, and it's not based on an ounce of evidence, but only based on what shallow people have to say about the shitty, shallow people that they are attracted to. End of story.

wtknight · 2016-02-15T14:37:49+00:00

I'm not sure why this is so controversial. One could easily turn this around and say "Men don't give a fuck about your feelings, only about how about how you look and how you perform in bed." If this were not the case, a sub like /r/DeadBedrooms wouldn't exist. Most people, men and women, are pretty self-centered in general, and I don't think that this is some sort of gender-specific thing to women.

kathydurst · 2016-02-15T15:40:01+00:00

Here's my assumption about you're average Redpiller: they're not getting any affection from women anyway. Whether the redpill existed or not, they'd still be lonely, angry people. But the redpill explains their suffering, and how to escape it.

The reasons that the redpill appeals to them is because it gives them an answer: "You're a loser, you don't have what women want, but there are answers."

The last part of that clause is what makes the redpill dangerous.

ProbablyBelievesIt · 2016-02-15T16:45:27+00:00

I LOVE when the main redpill subreddit uses this idea to hamster away their WWE style self-parody of masculinity.

So, where's the science to prove women don't ever share your emotions? Because this would change everything we know about how empathy works.

And I can't wait to hear the explanation for why tragic backstories feature so prominently in smut made for women.

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Title	"Women don't give a fuck about your feelings [...] only how you make her feel." Is the Red Pill damaging to men's mental and emotional health?
Author	tinytiger4321
Upvotes	13
Comments	162
Date	February 15, 2016 7:22 AM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/45vcyn/women_dont_give_a_fuck_about_your_feelings_only/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/women-dont-give-a-fuck-about-your-feelings-only.276236 https://theredarchive.com/post/276236