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Is this attitude appropriate on PPD?

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January 23, 2014
2 upvotes

Post Information
Title Is this attitude appropriate on PPD?
Author redpillschool
Upvotes 2
Comments 19
Date 23 January 2014 03:21 PM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit PurplePillDebate
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/286327
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1vy29z/is_this_attitude_appropriate_on_ppd/
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Comments

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (8 children) | Copy

Why are you phrasing this as "blue pillers" and "accusations"? There's no plural. One singular person commented to you.

Most of the blue pillers here won't recognize anything about your problem as a genuine problem.

Would you not consider this "assuming worst case scenario"? How can you ask people to give you the benefit of the doubt when you continually demonstrate that you're either unwilling to or incapable of doing the same for blue pillers?

You provide some interesting input and viewpoints at times, and then the next post you're making a circlejerky comment or condescendingly telling people that they don't know what they're talking about. The former is what's useful for this sub, the latter just makes people assume the worst of you when they see your username. Perhaps if you reined in your clear disdain for the people on the other side of the debate, people would be more likely to sympathise with you?

[–]redpillschoolRed Pill[S] -2 points-1 points  (7 children) | Copy

"Blue pillers", because I don't remember the last interaction I've had on here that didn't go similarly. I won't name anybody, but there's a list of people openly hostile to me.

And, frankly, this common accusation that all I do is circlejerk is unfounded. It perpetuates itself. After a string of ridiculous comments, I will leave it with a "well that's just not what red pill is about" because I have explained it a hundred times before, and a certain number of members here find it convenient to "forget" points we've established mere days before for the sake of argument. But if that's my worst crime, lock me up.

Perhaps if you reined in your clear disdain for the people on the other side of the debate, people would be more likely to sympathise with you?

I do not have disdain for them. I do, however, think it's a waste of time spending their days mocking us on a forum dedicated not to discussion but pure mockery.


Are you endorsing this member's attack by not addressing it?

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy

And, frankly, this common accusation that all I do is circlejerk is unfounded.

That is exactly not what I said, and why you can be so frustrating to speak to. Where did I say that all you do is circlejerk? I'd honestly like to know where you read that in my post.

I do, however, think it's a waste of time spending their days mocking us on a forum dedicated not to discussion but pure mockery.

So let people waste their time, what does it matter to you? That sub is not this one, if someone demonstrates here a willingness to debate you, debate them. If they're being hostile, report it.

[–]redpillschoolRed Pill[S] 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

That is exactly not what I said, and why you can be so frustrating to speak to. Where did I say that all you do is circlejerk? I'd honestly like to know where you read that in my post.

You provide some interesting input and viewpoints at times, and then the next post you're making a circlejerky comment or condescendingly telling people that they don't know what they're talking about.

This would suggest at least 50% of my posts are circle jerks.

No, this is an unfair assessment. Of course I will address the points you made, you can't now complain that makes me frustrating to deal with- that's another unfair assessment. Should I just let your assertion go unchallenged if I disagree, lest I be labeled more frustrating?

So let people waste their time, what does it matter to you? That sub is not this one, if someone demonstrates here a willingness to debate you, debate them. If they're being hostile, report it.

Where on earth did I say it matters? You suggested I had disdain, and I corrected you with my opinion.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

"all I do is circlejerk" is not the same as "sometimes you circlejerk", which is what I meant to express. Unless you believe you've never made a circlejerky or snarky comment here.

That you're frustrating to deal with is my opinion. I can't prove it as a fact, I'm sure plenty of people would disagree with me. Regardless, that's how I feel.

Okay, so you don't have disdain for blue pillers. That is not how your posts often come across, however. I believe this may be a source of the problem.

[–]redpillschoolRed Pill[S] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

I don't care for them one way or another, but I do find some very similar arugment tactics which is why I tend to lump them together.

For instance, passive-aggressive arguments, I see this a lot on here:

BP: Did you rape and kill an 18 year old woman in 1996?

Me: That's absurd.

BP: You have to explain yourself, you can't just dismiss this.

Me: It's a wild accusation, and there's no need to address it.

BP: The fact that you're unwilling to entertain our question means you're being slippery, evasive, and probably did rape and kill a girl, which we will believe until you prove otherwise.

Me: Why are you guys so obsessed with this? I've never done that and that's a wild accusation.

BP: It's not an accusation, it was a simple question. All you had to do was say no. Why do you assume it's an accusation??


See there's two arguments happening here, and I've been studying this for a while on here. There's the one of inference which is a battle of popular opinion. If somebody can make the debate take place and make somebody have to deny an accusation, you can make the accusation stick without proof or need of evidence. And when called on it, you can passive-aggressively hide behind plausibility. I never accused him of anything. I was merely asking a question.

The second argument is the very text, in which I address both the text of the argument, but the spirit of the meta debate. And this, of course, leaves me vulnerable to such attacks as "he's evasive and frustrating because he jumps around and addresses things I didn't say! For instance, I never accused him of raping and killing an 18 year old! I don't know why he's so defensive!"

Now, I don't really care one way or another, I find this battle of the debate styles to be infinitely interesting- so please don't get the idea that I'm sitting here sad that the accusations took place. But, I am curious to see if I can break through to the other side with reason.

My question remains- was the person in my screenshot being fair on PPD? For instance, he never made an accusation, he simply had questions...

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

I didn't see the question initially since you edited it into your post.

If the user had posted "Did you remove this user's post from theredpill?" I would think it was a fair question as it doesn't imply anything, except that you might have removed a post, which is not a negative thing in itself. I don't agree with the accusation of crocodile tears or false sympathy. I believe that the user was offended by your initial comment, in which you accused blue pillers of not giving a damn about the guy, and had their back up when they responded to you. I don't think the exchange was appropriate for this sub. I think it should have gone as follows:

Them: Did you remove this user's post from theredpill?

You: No, automoderator did. Why?

Them: I was wondering why you directed them to your sub if you had already removed their post there.

You: It was reported several times and removed by someone else.

Them: OK.

Conversation over, no slap fighting. Unfortunately this doesn't happen because people make sly little digs at each other and both sides get prickly and unwilling to assume good faith, and make sly little digs at everyone else, on and on.

[–]alphabetmodamused modstery1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Unfortunately this doesn't happen because people make sly little digs at each other and both sides get prickly and unwilling to assume good faith, and make sly little digs at everyone else, on and on.

You just summed up the #1 problem in this sub. By far. And because these sly little digs are so hard to moderate I don't know what to do about them. They're the initial cause of every fucking problem.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I don't know, it's difficult. You start getting into a tone argument, and it's easy for people to read into things that were not intended, or word something poorly, or whatever. I've noticed myself doing this smug, oh-really-that's-what-you-think? type comment a couple of times, though I'm hoping that identifying it allows me to prevent it. It's really common, though, from both sides, and it's so frustrating to see from the outside of a discussion, especially when you see it from the same person over and over again. Like you say though, how do you moderate it?

[–]CFRProflcopter( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)4 points5 points  (5 children) | Copy

This place has become quite hostile to myself and other red pillers.

I don't know if you realize this, but in /r/thebluepill, it's common to complain that /r/purplepilldebate is too red pill.

Maybe you need to open up your perspective a little and realize that this sub is dedicated to discussing these gender related topics, and that sometimes the conclusions reached by most will differ from your own and from those on /r/thebluepill.

Maybe it's just the nature of moderates to not be accepted by those on either side. I suppose "mulattoes" were at times rejected by the black and white communities. Just realize that fact.

[–]redpillschoolRed Pill[S] -1 points0 points  (3 children) | Copy

It wasn't a differing conclusion, it was a baseless accusation.

[–]CFRProflcopter( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

I'm not really addressing that part of the post. I was just addressing your comment about the bias of the sub.

The reason people downvote the crap out of your comments is because some of the stuff you post is abrasive and doesn't add to the discussion. People have made a judgment about your character, and it's going to be difficult to change those ideas.

In general, there are just a higher percentage of abrasive red pillers here than there are abrasive blue pillers. The abrasive red pillers are well known and downvoted. That doesn't make it right, but that's the way things stand.

[–]redpillschoolRed Pill[S] -1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

So you decline to answer whether this sort of debate attitude is appropriate, and instead you make this an opportunity to discuss pervasive attitudes towards me regardless of its veracity.

[–]CFRProflcopter( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Of course it's not appropriate. I'm just explaining why there's a bias against you. It has less to do with your viewpoint and more to do with you're debating technique.

Furthermore, I wanted to emphasize that both the blue pill and the red pill think we're biased one way or the other.

[–]myfriendscantknowAgent Orangered (BP Man)4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy

This didn't warrant a post.

[–]PenguinLovrPurple Pill Woman0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I actually wanted to post something similar. I believe TBP is a bit too defensive of their own beliefs, by constantly being on the "attack". For example you are saying "This didnt warrant a post" without explaining why. We are discussing the merits of TRP in this forum, and whats really the point if a lot of people are throwing out attacks at eachother? Or trying to spin other peoples words around? Thats not how a debate goes.

[–]redpillschoolRed Pill[S] -1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy

So is this behavior is acceptable and should be expected by red pillers as par for the course?

[–]myfriendscantknowAgent Orangered (BP Man)2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

It was deleted, so no.

[–]redpillschoolRed Pill[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Can we collectively attempt to stop this behavior?



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