How do I truly come to terms with the fact that my girlfriend is incapable of loving me?

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November 28, 2019

I'm sure you're already aware that women aren't capable of loving men, at least not in the way that men would generally like to be loved, so I won't get into the details of that just now. Suffice to say, men love idealistically, women love opportunistically - if one can even call either of those things "love".

So I've been with my current girlfriend for about 18 months now, and I've got hardly any complaints so far. Besides some minor AWALT stuff, she's a logical, reasonable and a surprisingly honest and self-aware person. Although there are some things I keep to myself (like what I'm about to go into here), I'm generally not afraid to let her into my mind. She generally lets me into her mind as well (although I'm sure there's plenty she keeps to herself), which makes her an interesting person in my eyes. She's a great woman, and I really like her as a sex partner, friend and person.

The thing is though, her love/infatuation/interest in me is clearly opportunistic. Not in a toxic way, where she's after my resources, tries to lock me down into a shitty marriage contract, tries to lay claim to my time or anything of that sort. But it's opportunistic in the sense that she "likes the way I make her feel". She says she's "hooked on me", and while I do take that as a compliment, I also know it's an expression of the emotional roller coaster ride I'm currently able to take her on. And a big part of the reason why I'm able to do that, is that I resist her in the sense that I guard my time and my space as a hawk. So I know there's this part of her that sees me as a "challenge", and that it turns her on. Alas, these are passing emotions in all probability.

I really don't want to be an inconsiderate asshole that expects everything to be on my terms, but at the same time I'm afraid that if I drop my frame (which isn't a game, it's just my values and what I want) she'll like me less, be less "hooked on me". So every know and then it happens that I put my own values aside to please her, basically I'll cave because she's being all nice and calm and rational about her needs (not entitled or anything like that). Here are some examples:

- We went from 'FWB' to 'boyfriend/girlfriend' because she wanted to. That's not really a big deal, cause I don't have any moral/philosophical issues with putting such a 'mild' label on it. Plus she satisfies me sexually, so I'm ok with monogamy. But I was basically MGTOW at the time (without calling it that), so there were some moving of goalposts there.

- I bought her a bracelet for her last birthday, because that's what she wanted. Nothing expensive, and she was very grateful for it. But I CAN'T FUCKING STAND JEWELLERY. To me, nothing says "I'm buying your affection" like jewellery. And I know all women are whores when you really go down that rabbit hole, but jewellery is just such a blatant display of exactly that. Which is why I don't like it, and would prefer not to put jewellery on her.

- Christmas is coming up, so I asked her what she wants for Christmas. I was hoping that maybe she'd like some books, or perhaps tickets for a concert or something like that. But no. Now she wants a necklace. Again, nothing expensive, but still FUCKING JEWELLERY. And she knows very well what I think of jewellery, so it's almost like she wants to break my balls, like she wants to shit test me, and see how much of a puppy dog I can be for her.

- I'm having discussions about marriage with her. Again, she isn't being entitled about it, and it isn't an 'ultimatum' (at least not outspokenly so), but it's clear that she wants to marry me at some point in the future. And marriage is 100% against my values. In this day and age, I think it's a degrading institution towards men, and I lose a bit of respect for any man who decides to wife someone up. Even so, I've sort of told her that as long as there's no legal contract, and as long as it doesn't necessarily mean we'll live together, then sure, maybe if we've been together for 4-5 years we can buy each other rings, and call each other "husband and wife". So again, I'm moving goalposts here, and letting go of my own convictions to please her.

So how do I come to terms with the fact that my girlfriend doesn't actually love me for who I am and how I think, but rather for whatever "feelings of accomplishment as a real woman" I can give to her? I'm thinking maybe we're on equal terms here, and that maybe I love her opportunistically as well. But I don't know if that's just the rationalisation hamster in my brain. I mean, I don't really "love" either, not like I used to when I was younger. I don't know if that's because I'm older now, or because I've been red pilled since then. Probably a mix of both. But I definitely do like her. A lot.

And I guess like I said, in the sense that I still "love", my love could be seen as 'opportunistic' as well. I mean, she does bring me a certain peace of mind, and she's great company. And I probably wouldn't feel the same way about her if the sex wasn't great. And she does take very good care of me in so many ways. So there's an opportunistic element to my side of the story here as well. Is that where I come to terms with this? That at the end of the day, I'm no better myself? But then again, I'm not the one looking for commitment here, I'm not the one playing the "how much do you love me?" - game. So in that sense, I guess I'm being idealistic, whereas she's not.

I would really appreciate some perspective on this from those of you who could find the time and effort to read this long-ass post.


Just wanted to thank you for all your wonderful replies (each and everyone of you). I needed some resistance, and bit of a reality check, and you've certainly given me a lot of food for thought here.

Post Information
Title How do I truly come to terms with the fact that my girlfriend is incapable of loving me?
Author L_Sebastian_D
Upvotes 73
Comments 78
Date 28 November 2019 04:50 AM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit askTRP
Original Link
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Red Pill terms found in post:
AWALTframehamstermonogamyFWBshit testgameMGTOW

[–]Iron-Spiderball90 points91 points  (2 children) | Copy

Stop buying her fucking jewelry, if you don't like it stop doing it. You're the lion, it's your kingdom.

And for your main question, I would just give it time, think about it and be the best you, you can be (true purpose of the RP) and she will follow (or if she doesn't then you can spin a couple plates and enjoy your life)

Edit: maybe read a couple parts of the sidebar again. Specifically shit tests

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Thanks for valuable input.

The reason I did buy her the bracelet, despite seeing it as a bit of a simp move, is that a part of me still thinks a present for her should be something she actually wants, not something I'm trying to push on her. Plus, she's honest about it being a status thing for her, and a source of validation, something to flaunt before her friends ("look what my boyfriend got me") and family ("he's a good guy").

I do appreciate the honesty, and I don't want to discourage her from being open about her basic female nature by being judgemental or resentful. I mean, I'd much rather be with someone who's self-aware of who they are, than someone who doesn't have a clue why they want the things they want. After all, that's a big part of the reason why she passes the "would I want to spend time with her if she was a dude" - thought experiment.

Women are women at the end of the day, and that's fine as long as they're honest about it, and not overly emotional as to my point of view - which she isn't.

I will take my time with this though. I'm not going to rush into any stupid form of commitment I can't get out of again. And if that ever turns out not to be good enough for her, then she's always welcome to leave with no resentment on my part. But I do want to balance this for as long as it's in my interest, cause so far she's a welcome addendum to the life I already live.

[–]Iron-Spiderball1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

That's perfect. I didn't want you continuously buying her jewelry if you really resented that. Some is okay, but not too much

[–]into_being53 points54 points  (3 children) | Copy

“How did you go bankrupt?" Two ways. Gradually, then suddenly.


Fuck off about coming to terms about her feelings. You need to come to terms with the fact that you’re actively surrendering your own mating strategy to hers.

Your compromising and rationalizing. Soon you’ll be at deadbedrooms, relationshits, divorce or MRP trying to salvage this trainwreck you’re actively permitting yourself to enter: against your own judgement and desire.

This is what “selling out” feels like, except without a possible upside.

[–]thechaosz1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Shitty Dog minivan and lonely nights alone watching next flix because you have 8 bucks in your checking account in 3......2...…..1....

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Thanks for valuable input.

I'm feeling fairly confident that I have the mental strength to get out of this reasonably quickly if the relationship is no longer in my interest. It hasn't been a problem with women in my past. As long as I play it safe (legally and financially), then the rest is only feelings/ego - which are only in your head. I don't want to do anything that changes the dynamic of the relationship though, as I'm enjoying it as it is right now.

[–]into_being2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Fair enough. If you’re getting what you want out of it. I wasn’t really saying to end it, just go about it within your own frame.

Be wary of the parts where you find yourself doing something that you don’t want to (buying jewelry, watching romcoms and feminazi tv shows or whatever) ... the things that you told yourself you wouldn’t do, actively dislike doing, but now you see no way to avoid for the sake of the relationship ...

It’s truly a slippery slope, and it’s paradoxical as the more you compromise, the more invested you become, and the less she does.

This is beta-ization in a nutshell.

[–]Warren_Bateman63 points64 points  (7 children) | Copy

Get a dog

[–]IbahBar26 points27 points  (4 children) | Copy

This. The only real love you will ever recieve is from a dog.

[–]Improvised030 points31 points  (3 children) | Copy

Correction: The only real love you will ever receive is from a [insert loyal dog breed here]. I have a Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever and the dude shit tests me all the time. If I ever cry for any reason, he looks at me like I’m pathetic and walks out of the room.

I just realized I need RP more for my damn dog.

[–][deleted]  (1 child) | Copy


[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]ChadTheWaiter1003 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

😭😭😭this is hilarious. I have a husky mix and even as a puppy he is more loyal than that. But then again I haven’t cried in front of him once so idk.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

I already own a cat. How do I come to terms with the fact that my cat is incapable of loving me?

[–]thechaosz2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Oh shit no no no.

Every hot girl I've ever met has told me (and I felt it in my soul before), "Single dudes with cats are a HUGE red flag."

Congrats on beating that somehow.

[–][deleted]  (5 children) | Copy


[–]VividFall715 points16 points  (3 children) | Copy

Yeah. Just enjoy your time with a girlfriend that may or may not be there in the future.

[–][deleted]  (2 children) | Copy


[–]VividFall79 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yeah I agree. My comment might have sounded ironic but it isn't.

I think some people feel utter anger and disgust when they hear that it's only their turn and she's not yours. It would be all nice if your girl was there forever for you, but since it's not the case, why not embrace her, feel the love, but know that she might not be there tomorrow? It's the only rational thing to do.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Thanks for valuable input.

I think I was overthinking it too when I wrote this post. I had just come home from beers with two married mates, and I got a sense of dread that I might slowly be heading in the direction of their lives (deadbedrooms, worked to death, the whole lot). I don't even believe in 'love' (not for myself either), so I shouldn't be spending a single calorie overthinking these things. The only thing that matters is that she treats me well, and that I have an easy way out if that were to change.

[–]Manny140071 points72 points  (10 children) | Copy

OK, sit back and prepare for the redpill

You bought her jewelry because you didn't know what else to get her. OK. I ve loved three women in my life exactly: my wife and two girlfirends. I knew *exactly* what to buy them as gifts, and these things were unusual, personal, and sweet --It wasn' a fucking necklace.

you went from FWB to something more, because there was nothing better available. FWB never turns into anything legitimate or serious.

She has put you in a placeholder relationship, and you are bitter about it. You deserve more, and need to start looking elsewhere.

[–]LethalShade4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

What's your alternative to starting a relationship if not through a fwb/plate arrangement? Seems like the only other option is to commit to her before having sex with her which doesn't seem like a great option.

[–]theyearsstartcomin5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

FWB never turns into anything legitimate or serious.

Ive observed this happen before. Quite often it doesnt but ive seen it happen.

[–]PandaLitter2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

So what gifts did you buy them?

[–]Garathon9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy


[–]Manny14001 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

depends on the girl's interests, but if she is into poetry, I will get her a rare book of verse from overseas, maybe signed by the author.

One girl I was dating graduated from a nursing program, so I got her Florence Nightingale's book "Notes on Nursing", first edition from the 19th century (very expensive now, back then it wasn't too bad). It used to be customary to give a new nurse a copy of this book.

If it is jewelry, it has to be personal. Maybe an amulet/necklace with her favorite Greek or Nordic goddess symbol on it.

[–]xxx69harambe69xxx1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

This shit is gold, thanks

[–][deleted]  (2 children) | Copy


[–]MarvelousWhale14 points15 points  (1 child) | Copy

Ignore literally everyone on this subreddit who say anything along the lines of whether a girl has self respect or not because they put out.

Girls fucking you have nothing to do with their self respect. Does she have more self respect if she sees you as a tool and uses you while promising sex on the next date, and then the next date, and then the next date until you're twelve weeks in and haven't fucked? Has no bearing on her self respect. Ignore these clowns suggesting it does.

[–]LethalShade2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Her fucking you fast just has to do with her being comfortable with her sexuality and/or you being a very attractive man who's confident in leading.

There are other way more important factors in assessing a potential serious mate. If anything, her fucking you fast can only help a future relationship.

[–]Endorsed ContributorWe_Are_Legion29 points30 points  (1 child) | Copy

I will venture out and address mostly your title and first few paragraphs. Because they contain a critical error that has infected every single point in your entire body of conclusions. Made it into superstitious paranoid presumptuous nonsense.

The error is that you think you need to "come to terms" with something someone else told you. Belief is only for people who don't know. If you Understand the bedrock causality of things, that is coming to terms with it automatically. You might have come on TRP and think you learned something new. But you cheapened and made it useless through absorbing it with the lens of seeking prescription. That lens does not lead to wisdom, as you can see in your own past experience. You are simply substituting one ideology with another (BP with "RP"). Red pill is not ideology. If it was, I would be the first to leave.

To understand why ideology is not wisdom, for instance, the Buddha described enlightenment as "the end of suffering". It is a negative description. It doesn't say what it is. But then what could be left if there is no suffering? See for yourself. In the redpill, we have people who saw for themselves. Because they saw that the evidence didn't support the lies we were told.

Don't just accept things. Don't repeat things. Try and understand how and why it can be so, or if it is so at all. Don't try to force reality to conform to the mental model.

When you learn something, see how it alters the equation for your decision making until you again are living your life in a way that you have equanimity.

It is the question that creates the journey, not the answer. The answers that you treat like scripture (that women are this way or that way) came AFTER men asked the questions and became successful. For you, they are not relevant yet.

Remember, the question creates the journey. Not the answer.

Asking "How can I get and keep the girl?" leads to one journey. When someone genuinely asks this question, they start absorbing truths in a futile effort to control your experience. They learn many things. They might get a girl out of the deal. Which doesn't last. They might then ask a new question.

Asking "Why do I want a girl in the first place?" leads to an entirely different journey. You seek answers and personal equanimity. From this, you might reach a description of yuor needs and your boundaries, which you can fulfill or which yuo find you don't need to fulfill anymore, because seeing them has made you realize how these thigns are stupid.

e.g. i NATURALLY stopped responding to women's shit-tests, not because TRP told me to. but because i viscerally understood for experience that there was opportunity and fun to be had. And that passing the shit-tests were fulfilling my need far more than getting her.

In summary, do not accept long-winded intellectual discussions on evolution as scripture. They may not be relevant for your life. I read that spiel about the necklace and I cannot help but roll my eyes. What nonsense.

What is relevant if this all isn't?

The ability to introspect. To observe. To tease out the Truth through questioning and desire to know.

When that is there, you can write asking YOURSELF and the answer will come to you far before you hit "post" on advice board.

EDIT: I recommend you to listen to the interviews of Kapil Gupta. They are really relevant to finding truth. I recommend "The greatest barrier to self-improvement", though all are good and you may choose as you wish.

[–]mickey__1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I want more of you!

[–]lush_vibes7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

I keep asking myself if you wear the pants in this relationship or does she while reading this post.

You said: 1: You drop your values for her (never do that) 2: You asked her what she wants for a present (you should know her well enough to get something meaningful even if she says jewelry) 3. Y’all used to be FWB and you wouldn’t feel the same about her if the sex wasn’t good?

Bottom line: take control. It honestly seems like y’all both are settling when there isn’t actual substance besides sex and that y’all make yourselves feel good by what the other can do for you (and not just monetarily or physically, if that makes sense)

[–]mickey__1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

both are settling when there isn’t actual substance besides sex and that y’all make yourselves feel good by what the other can do for you

Substance, how to get it?

[–]SeasonedRP4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

As you correctly perceive, she likes how you make her feel now, but that will change if you get married/cohabitate. It's a good sign that she is the one who asked for an LTR and not you. I don't see getting jewelry as a gift for an 18-month LTR as some big no no. If it makes her happy and isn't stretching your resources thin, it's not a big deal. It sounds to me like things are good now but you are aware that things will change if she is around you more often. Many women have marriage as a goal. Since you don't, at some point she'll leave and find someone who will marry her. Just enjoy your time together now and don't dwell on the future. Be prepared for a real life example of the light switch effect. One day, all of the good times you had will be out the window from her perspective. She'll rewrite history to make her entire time with you as some horrible experience. It's fairly shocking the first time you experience this. There isn't a RP answer to make marriage/cohabitation tolerable for men, which is why the sidebar advises against it.

[–]anxiousdweller7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

The problem is whether you love yourself.

[–]frognads3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's not that she can't love you, it's that she can't love you in the way you want her to.

[–]poortrait1003 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

You don’t know what you want so she tells you what to do. Be better.

[–]LordFa92 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Imagine you are a rock at the coastline

Imagine her as the waves, chipping away at you

Thats your life now

Eventually, no matter how long it takes, she'll wear you down and you'll end up a beta

Only way is to stop, set hard limits. You can enter a monogamous LTR with her, you can buy her jewellery even though you hate it because its what she wants. But dig in your heels when needed. Sometimes when not needed so she knows who's the boss

All you really need to do is to prepare for the day when she doesn't get the tingles from you anymore and it all comes crashing down. Build your fallout shelter in secret and just execute the SOP when the nuke alarm goes off

Till then enjoy the ride

[–]brinkleybuzz2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Grow up. The only woman who will ever love you unconditionally is your mother.

What you should look for in a relationship is performance, not unconditional love. Does your girl give you what you want and is she loyal to you? If the answer is yes, then you're good, for the moment. Keep enjoying the relationship until it runs its course.

Men innately get their sense of value and self esteem from accomplishing great things, not from female validation. Get a mission and make accomplishing that mission the most important thing in your life. Until you do this, you'll continue to be a hot mess.

[–]BallinPoint1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yes that last bit is the best advice here. However I do think you're also kind of right at the start. Unconditional love is rare. It's also very rare in relationships because there are A LOT of conditions to be met to even have a relationship. But it can develop into an unconditional love. Tho it always depends on the person.

[–]LethalShade2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I think our idea of love is just distorted by the media. All relationships in this life are based off the value we provide to eachother, be it family, friends or intimate partners.

Unconditional love exists but it's a whole different beast. Do you really expect her to love you if you provide no value in her life? If she loved you to death and treated you like a king if all you did is sat in the basement, played video games and jacked off, would you not lose respect for her if anything?

Red pill teaches you to build yourself up as a man and offer value to yourself, your woman and the world. That's what sets you apart from those that don't take up that path. Don't doubt her for appreciating you for that, don't you appreciate her more than a woman who adds less value to your life?

[–]RoccoPinkman7 points8 points  (2 children) | Copy

Get with a dude, he will love you like only a man can love.

[–]ElOweTea0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy


[–]z2a1-90 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy


[–]Rispy_Girl3 points4 points  (5 children) | Copy

Couple of quick things.

First don't go the no legal document and calling each other husband and wife route. In many places that will eventually make you legally husband and wife. Instead get a prenup. If she is legit into you and cares about you enough to be worth marrying she'll do it. Though honestly with what you said about marriage I don't think you should do it because it sounds like you'd resent it. Kind of like how you resent giving her the bracelet, but worse. Maybe instead talk her into being happy with the relationship you have now. Honestly I think if marriage changes your relationship, so much that it's necessary, then you're in the wrong relationship to begin with.

Good luck!

Second there is a compromise for the jewelry thing. Go find a class where you both can make jewelry and do that with her. Metal work can be fun and classes like that are fun together. Or a glass working class where a glass piece goes on a leather thong. Or beading, etc. Then you're giving her the experience and a memory that will lead to a necklace. Same could be done for other jewelery. Hopefully this will allow you to not compromise your values while still getting what she asked for. If she's not happy with that, then imo she's seeing how much power she has over you by seeing how far she can push your values.

[–]good-afternoon2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yup common law marriage happens after you live together for a certian number of years; varies by state. Prenup is the way to go.

[–]Rispy_Girl1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Btw OP did you tell her about your take on jewelry? If you didn't you should be open with her about it. If you aren't, then you have a covert contract and should correct that.

Also I got a great suggestion for a future jewelry piece. Go on a trip together and while making wonderful memories pick up a nice stone. When you get home have a nice jeweler polish it and set it in a jewelry piece for you.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah, I've told her (minus the "all women are whores" - bit). As usual, she'll hear me out and be interested in my point of view, and then she'll offer her point of view - which makes it difficult for me to just shoot her down, since she's being rational and honest about why she wants what she wants.

It's not really the jewellery per se I find so problematic, but rather the fact that I keep moving these goalposts - which again conflicts with the reasons she's hot for me in the first place.

Thanks for the suggestion. I think she'd really appreciate that, and it would be a bit more personal than just "putting jewellery on her".

[–]Rispy_Girl1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Btw OP did you tell her about your take on jewelry? If you didn't you should be open with her about it. If you aren't, then you have a covert contract and should correct that.

Also I got a great suggestion for a future jewelry piece. Go on a trip together and while making wonderful memories pick up a nice stone. When you get home have a nice jeweler polish it and set it in a jewelry piece for you.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Marriage laws are a bit different to the US in my country. If you aren't "officially married", there are no laws that can force you to be. So if, let's say, in 5-6 years we did a little private ring exchange sort of thing, I'd still be on safe ground legally/financially. I still wouldn't cohabitate though, as I see that as a major dynamics changer regardless of law.

[–]LilLoserFreny1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You accept it or leave her until you can accept reality. Or if you can’t accept it, you can also just not be in a relationship.

[–]mickenrorty1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

If she's happy to love you for you regardless of marriage or jewellery then great. Otherwise you know you're on a slippery slope.

[–]jackandjill221 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]ElOweTea1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

She's making you buy jewelry as a form of conditioning so that when it's time to buy the "ring", you'll be able to do it much easier.

[–]toxicmaleitis1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Did u see your post? How long it is?and how much garbage and energy u have wasted on this?...instead this is what i did this morning- 3 plates texted me, wished me for Thanksgiving..2 invited me for food and then later for a movie and cuddles...and i spent max 20 mins on i go to the gym and fucking lift and do things to improve and be the best version of myself...i have no unicorns, their unpredictable bullshit, whining and moaning to worry about... ( remember i am no red pill master nor am i this wanna be alpha..but i try to internalize rp shit everyday by learning from vanguards, senior and senior endorsed contributors) and become a better person everyday. Stop this bullshit and go live your best life! Happy thanksgiving

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Give her a good last fuck and gtfo you dont deserve all that shit im alone now and doing way better

[–]thechaosz1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]Infernir1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

This is easy, and i'm surprised TRP doesn't teach this. I guess it shouldn't since its more about getting laid, getting women into your life than LTRS and the end game with them.

So after you get a girlfriend you really like, she has no major red flags and nothing wrong with her, she makes you happy whenever you're her, does all these things for you and provides lots of sex, excitement, or whatever you want whenever you want it.

How do you make her actually love love you? Well we talked about love in the sense of female to male, male to female... and how females can't love men they way men can naturally & easily fall in love with females.

After a female has fallen in love with you opportunistically, you can train her to love you, bond with you, connect to you as a human being.

What this means is extremely vague but it can be done... basically never spend money on her when you want to show love & appreciation, never do things for her or buy her shit. Spend it on experiences, intimate romantic talks, bonding with her... talking about philosophy, books, whatever you need to. Having fun and enjoying life together away from all materialistic shit and stuff you "own". Bond with her as a human being, get deep with her, her entire life... and share your entire life. BUT NEVER ever mention TRP or anything about it... if you ever talk about fight club IRL in any way shape or form it should be reserved for guys you seriously trust, and in locker room scenarios away from women, close minded men who can't think for themselves & agree with some of TRP or disagree, lesser men who might get insecure or angry at the ideas, gatekeepers and people who don't want to disrupt the current flow of society or question the status quo (cough cough mods banning trp main reddit). So yeah just don't talk about it period.

So yes... you can technically get a women to love you but not as a man, that will still depend on what you are, who you are to her... what you "can" give her. Since human beings are selfish creatures. But if you bond with her in other ways? Really connect with her as just a human being like she could connect with her mother, father, sister, brother, and best female friend of all time? I'm sorry dude, but that's the closest thing to "love", unconditional and unfiltered you will get.

All the guys that want women to love them back in the way they love the women, accept her demands and buy her that fancy dinner or that flashy diamond or necklace.... they will never get these women's love. BECAUSE THEY DON'T REALIZE WOMEN ARE LITERALLY INCAPABLE OF LOVING A MAN IN THAT WAY. AND 2, 99.99%+ OF WOMEN LITERALLY ACTUALLY HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THEY WANT, stop entering their frame and doing dumb shit submitting to them... and doing all these things for her, being submissive. That's not gonna get her to fall in love with you in fact quite the opposite. There's a way to make her really enjoy being with you, have fun, be excited & want to be around you more than anything and it's the exact same way you would make a guy want all of that... by being an interesting fun human being who knows how to make people feel alive.

If you didn't have that sexy body, that charisma, charm, wit, confidence, nice car, six figure job, etc etc do you think she would still 'love you' and choose to be with you? What if she had the option of a multi billionaire playboy who had everything you had but more? When you get to this point that's when you know a women has truly bonded with you as a human being, is attached to your hopefully unique personality & would choose you over them.

This doesn't mean she won't fuck them behind your back and test if life is more enjoyable with them but in the end she would choose you.

That's the best you can hope for.

Women love their kids. As you should love your kids as well if you ever have them. Sharing that love for their kids should also be enough... for most people to be content with.

Edit : Also, maintain frame at all times. You worked hard to become a great man, she doesn't give a shit about all the work you put into it only the final product. If she loved you unconditionally and all women were like that whose to say she wouldn't love every other guy unconditionally too? Then nothing is stopping her from just fucking some hobo and cheating on you with him. You love her as much as you possibly can right? You're happy? You're enjoying everything about her? She's happy too. She enjoys being with you. She loves that she has a great man which is unbelievably difficult to find these days and won't do anything to jeopardize it. The only two things you should want from her are 1. Absolute commitment ... and 2. Absolute loyalty. These two things aren't too difficult to get, especially when women get in their 20s to early 30s, because is sucks starting over with a new LTR, deleting everything that happened with a person. Men mainly care about the women being sexy, and if you're a guy in 20s, 30s, even early forties... let's be real it's not too difficult to get a beautiful women. The guy can do the rest and give the girl some personality, humor, intelligence after she has entered his frame & gotten accustomed to his lifestyle. All in all teaching them, them being submissive to you & in your frame is the closest possible thing to "love" that a man can get from a women

[–]BallinPoint1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I don't know man. All of this seems to be a bit excessive. First of all, trying to guard your frame like a hawk even SOUNDS tiring as fuck. You probably have get some serious shit to do so you're afraid more in that area than her. Men should be afraid of the world because they are fighting put here for better life. That's what should be bothering you. Not her or how you watch your time to not be pleasing. That's actually manipulative (assuming ofc that I correctly read the meaning of what you said).

All women will love the way you make them feel. It's the same as when you love her for whatever other reason. You seem to have logical reasons for loving her - nothing wrong with that, from her perspective it might seem cold and calculated. Doesn't seem romantic either. We all chase feelings anyway. We all want to feel good.

Anyway, about jewellery. I see absolutely nothing wrong with it. Women love useless and pretty stuff. They just do. Clothes and jewellery, and shit. If you give stuff to people and it implies to you that you're buying them, the you're giving them stuff for the wrong reasons. When I give someone something I want to make them happy for a moment. I want to see their reaction and enjoy it with them. I want to give them something they really REALLY enjoy and for that you have to know the person. Jewellery is easy but expensive. Be glad to not have a girlfriend who would like you to carve out a fucking boat in a glass for her.

Anyway, giving someone something to make them happy is in a sense selfish, because seeing them happy makes me happy too. But is it really selfish if it's win-win? You seem to have a problem with jewellery. So compromise. Be an adult about it. You both have opinions. So they differ - so what? Why do you expect her to like everything that you like?

Don't read this childish bullshit like "you're the lion blahblah your kingdom" such fucking bullshit jesus christ, these aren't "men" these are kids who haven't heard of responsibility ever before and they think acting cool makes you a good person. Don't listen to these idiots. BE-A- RESPONSIBLE ADULT.

Make a pyramid and put YOUR UTMOST HADCORE LIFE GOAL on top. Make it as hard and risky as you can, invest everything in it, and everything below that will suddenly become petty. Now look at the fucking necklace. How big of a deal is it now? You can give two shits about some necklace because you have bigger things to worry about. You want necklace, fine have it, I don't care, you're a woman and you like woman things, it's normal, if it makes you happy, I'm haloy because worldd is full of crap and we can be happy to buy halpiness, here you go sweetheart let it make you happy.

Or appeal to her. Honey, you know what I think about jewellery, If you really want it, I'll buy it, but I think you should start investing your wants and needs in something more practical because I care about you and I don't think jewellery is helpful in any way. Life has way much more to offer if you give it a chance. BE HONEST ABOUT IT.

But if it's just making you feel like shit - that is your problem no wonder she's testing you for it. You're trying to control HER WISHES because you are uncomfortable with it. That just screams insecurity. Also ASKING HER WHAT SHE WANTS seems as fucking lazy as one can get.

Prepare a surprise for her. Get her what she wants as a bonus and you can both be happy and you might even see how your surprise made her feel way more excited than a fucking necklace.

[–]Lateralanouncer1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

She does love you, it is how she feels at this moment. So enjoy it while it lasts. 6 months, 20 years who knows. You sound like you may have post nut depression as you know In today’s age giving commitment to a woman is sacrificing more than she gives herself away for. (Pussy cost in 2019 is 10% body fat. Not commitment, protection babies and provisions) personally I like ltr and put up with the urge of wanting to move on for my own benefit (unless a woman slips and falls on my dick). I can focus on bettering myself. Saving money, working on my purpose and smv at the gym and etc

[–]Senior EndorsedMattyAnon1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

we can buy each other rings, and call each other "husband and wife".

Be careful - there are laws in many places that mean that if you "carry on as if married", then legally you ARE married. Varies by country.

I'm thinking maybe we're on equal terms here, and that maybe I love her opportunistically as well.

Probably less so. You're more likely to find it hard to move on, and much harder to get back "into the game" than her. It's not an equal deal. And this assumes that a breakup is an honest one, rather than eg her cheating.

I would really appreciate some perspective on this from those of you who could find the time and effort to read this long-ass post.

All I can tell you is that you get it, now live by it. You're struggling to live by what you know.

[–]Felix21501 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Sounds like the beginning of death by 1000 concessions.

[–]mabev435681 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Why you are thinking on "dropping your frame"?

Is to give some reward to her?

You can, and should reward her, only on your terms, only after she obeys your demands. That's the only way you can reward her, and make her feel validated: for pleasing you.

As a leader, you should assign works to her, be judgmental on her fails, and rewarding on her good works.

That way she knows how to feel appreciated, and she will not need to shit test his way to your approval.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

You should've kept her as a FWB and ghosted once it slowed down. You fucked up, fam. Have fun learning this lesson!

[–]Crixusgannicus2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

"We went from 'FWB' to 'boyfriend/girlfriend' because she wanted to."

You done already fucked up beyond recovering, Tex. Someone is ALWAYS in charge during the relationship. In a male-female relationship, once that isn't you, it never will be again.

" I bought her a bracelet for her last birthday, because that's what she wanted."

You do not EVER do anything for a woman UNLESS it is what YOU want to do.

"Christmas is coming up, so I asked her what she wants for Christmas."

You do not EVER seriously ASK a woman what she wants because


What she "says she wants" and what it "IS" she wants are not necessarily the same and are subject to change in an instant!

We are already at strike three but let's keep going.

"I'm having discussions about marriage with her. Again, she isn't being entitled about it, and it isn't an 'ultimatum' (at least not outspokenly so)"

Glad we kept going because this shows you do have a fucking clue.

From the moment you are deemed a good potential resource/provider, you better fucking believe in her mind she's entitled to it and is maneuvering to bring that about by any means necessary. An actual ultimatum is an endgame hail mary tactic in most cases though.

ALL relationships are opportunistic. I could elaborate but I think this enough to chew on.

[–]thesoloronin2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Thanks for this! What a relief. This is like an express revision right before the final test in campus!

[–]Crixusgannicus1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You're welcome Bro.

[–]ziadxk1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I think you're overthinking it. Honestly, if you really "love" her, you will be happy because she's happy with jewelry and you will forget about your feelings towards it. However, since we're here in the redpill you either just leave her (or consider her as a dish or whatever of that) or accept her as she is and maybe marry her. You'll pick the first mostly but the most important thing is to believe what you're doing is the right thing and accept its consequences. (Just my opinion)

[–]madfrombrad1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Get rid of that stupid slut. Destroy her reputation for not loving the most lovable man on earth. You bought her jewelry and she betrayed you. Don’t leave any evidence.

[–]hoopingblob2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

and I really like her as a sex partner, friend and person.

Every man with oneitis ever.

In your case I wouldn't bother much with her and spin some plates. She clearly wants your money to brag about it with her friends and family.

[–]z2a1-92 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Every man with oneitis ever.

haha true that

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I don't think I suffer from oneitis. I was in a good place when I got together with her, and I would still be even if she decided to move on to bigger and better things. I could meet someone new, or I could just be single (which isn't bad at all). Yeah, I think she's a way cooler person than the vast majority of women out there, but I don't think that qualifies as 'oneitis'. I'm too old for that.

She's definitely not after my money either. If that was the case, she wouldn't be ok with the "no legal contracts, no cohabitation" - rule I laid down from the first time we had a talk about the future. I'm aware that might change though, especially if I overly debase myself, but that doesn't seem to be a game she's playing. Besides, she's already doing fine on her own in that department. It's not like I picked up a single mom looking for a provider.

[–]NoVirtueSignal-1 points0 points  (4 children) | Copy

Replace with a Fleshlight I find These morn pleasurable Than real Pussy now days when they have already thrashed their vaginas out with big black Cock and cucumbers 😂

[–]TheYambag2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

Black cock is tiny. The idea that it's big is a porn myth meant to degrade other races. Stop watching porn

[–]NoVirtueSignal0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Dude don’t be so serious and insecure it’s a joke, think you need lighten up :)

[–]TheYambag1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

You're right, it's just a joke that your penis is small

[–]NoVirtueSignal0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Your right that’s why your mummy let Me give it her up Her ass :)

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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