Can RPChristians use real dread?

shr3dthegnarbrah · 2017-09-04T21:52:54+00:00

You were too overt. Dread can be as simple as letting her see that you dressed nice as you're leaving in the morning or mowing the front lawn with your shirt off.

Also, the dread you used was reversed in a way. I play dread as "reasons that other women do/would want me" rather than "reasons I might leave you".

Red-Curious · 2017-09-05T03:48:12+00:00

In moderation, lower and mid-levels of dread are perfectly appropriate. Upper levels (like actually cheating) are totally prohibited.

Healthy dread is really applying preselection to your marriage. Preselection is the concept that a woman perceives a man's SMV as higher when other women are attracted to him because she assumes that these other women know something about him that she doesn't. This is usually a way for women to vet a guy before ever meeting him. But in a marriage context, if a man has been changing it can cause his wife to think, "If those girls take notice, maybe there's something more to his changes than I've realized," and she will become more attracted to her husband as a result. If the man is not substantially changing, she will only think, "Hah! Those foolish girls. If only they knew what I know about him."

If you check my comment history and scroll through a few pages doing a search for "dread" you'll find a lot more on the subject.

hurt her so much that I would look at other women like that and think those things

Were you telling her you wanted to have sex with the singer? What were "those things" and how did she know you were thinking them? Otherwise, it's an unreasonable request to assume you'll never think another girl is attractive, so shut that down right away. That's not a dread issue, it's a frame issue.

followed me into my marriage

Yeah, I had that too. Hopefully you're past that now. If not, be open and honest and deal with it. Ask this community for help (read 201 and 202 first), but also find people in real life to help you with that.

according to Jesus it was lust and therefore adultery

Possibly. It depends on what you actually thought. "I thought was really hot" is not lust in a sinful sense. The word Jesus uses for "lust" is epithumeo (coveting), which is not moicheia (adultery). It's not lust until your heart is at the point where you would act on it if you had the opportunity. Again, check out 201/202.

bouncing one's eyes away from anything sensual that is not your wife ... made my wife hotter

This does work. I tried it for a bit. But it's also unrealistic. Sometimes I have a super hot client and I can't just never look at her. Other attorneys I practice with are like that. There are countless people you have to interact with. I know there are tricks to get around this, but you also don't want people to think you're totally awkward. That's going to stunt you in other areas.

Plus, I'm a major advocate for the notion that avoiding sin is not the same as conquering it. We should run from temptation, yes. But we should not let fear of temptation control us, or else we're still giving sin the power to be a slave-driver over us again. You run from temptation you can't resist, but plow through with perseverance that which you know you can conquer. That's how you get stronger.

how can that mindset be compatible with traditional, red pill dread?

You'll note that the first 6 levels of dread are all within your marriage only. Many people have commented on MRP that a healthy marriage should hover between levels 5 and 6 and you should only have to go higher if you've got an exceptionally difficult situation. Nothing in the first 6 levels contradicts the practices you're trying to apply.

All of that said, I agree with /u/shr3dthegnarbrah - dread isn't about her believing you want other women; it's about her believing that other women want you (again, a variant of post-wedding preselection).

BluepillProfessor · 2017-09-05T17:29:29+00:00

You got me on my day off and I am on a roll so here goes:

according to Jesus it was lust and therefore adultery

Jesus picked the most outrageous, egregious example He could imagine and threw it out there to show that ALL men and women are sinful by nature. I take this with a grain of salt just as we are instructed to take the admonition to cut off your hand and pluck out your eye. Yes, He said that but no, He didn't really mean for you to start ripping out your eyeballs.

Early Church authorities acknowledge that a lustful glance is more than checking out a hot girl or appreciating beauty. Obviously looking and jerking to porn qualifies but admiring a hot singer does not.

Are there very minor versions of dread that would not be lustful

Yes! Especially if she get's butthurt if you just glance at another woman. Such a woman probably doesn't need anything more than Dread Level 4.

To review:

Dread Level 1: Start to respond to Fitness tests appropriately.

Dread Level 2: Develop a plan.

Dread Level 3: Get busy.

Dread Level 4: Begin to condition your time and availability on her (sexual) availability to you.

Dread Level 5: Dress up!

Dread Level 6: Begin to study Pickup Artistry and Seduction. Practice on your wife.

ALL of this should be fully compatible with even the most deeply blue Christian cuck- so that is your answer.

The issue for Christians is:

Dread Level 7: Begin approaching other women and practicing Number Closes.

Obviously this could be problematic for a Christian man- especially a man who is not getting the sex he needs. Paul himself wrote that the purpose of marriage was so you could avoid temptation and that at least marriage was better than Hell. Yes, he really said that! Look at 1 Corinthians 7:9- "it is better to marry than to burn" with a Red Pill lense. I know many translations add the words "with passion" to suggest Paul was not talking about Hell but THAT is not the Greek he wrote. The original Greek is CLEARLY an ambiguous double entendre. Paul is not as eloquent or nearly as good natured as the Lord but you can see the deep humor of the Holy Spirit in this piece.

Anyway, I guess the only good Christian use of Dread level 7 would be platonic??

Similarly, Dread Level 8: Demonstrations- show your wife that you can approach and flirt with pretty women is also problematic.

One could argue that Christians need to go to Levels 9 and (Soft Ultimatum) and 10 (Hard Ultimatum) followed almost assuredly by divorced.

I take the position there is more flexibility in marriages where the wife is violating her part of the marriage vows by denying sex.

After all, God would not abandon us to such legalisms. You still may be obligated to the "wife of your youth" to help her when she is in dire straights- though that is hardly the issue these days with daddy government insuring female supremacy. However there is NOTHING in Scripture (unless you are an Elder or Deacon) prohibiting you from taking ANOTHER wife.

I imagine taking another wife who is younger, hotter, more fertile, and far, far more pleasant would be about Dread Level 22.

SteelSharpensSteel · 2017-09-25T13:31:02+00:00

Take a look at dread 1-5.

Dread Level 1: Learn to recognize and start passing Fitness Tests. Begin building a strong, indefatigable frame where you are not affected by her sexual denials. Your readings will inform you about the basics of Pickup Artistry and seduction. Begin leading your wife more and begin seducing her.

Dread Level 2: Develop an action plan to improve the major areas of your life. Develop the physical, spiritual, psychological, financial and personal areas of your life. Your journey begins at the gym where you need to lift heavy weights to exhaustion 3-4 times a week, working each muscle group at least 2 times a week.

Dread Level 3: Begin to build a life apart from your wife. Join a club. Take up a cause, discipline, or calling. Get busy. You are going places, with or without her.

Dread Level 4: Begin conditioning your availability to your wife with her treatment of you. You are busy now. You don't have time for a sexually disinterested, annoying, or angry wife. Take up another cause if you need to. This is a great time to join a martial arts club.

Dread Level 5: Upgrade your clothes and start dressing ‘up’ more of the time. Top off your solid, masculine, strong, indefatigable frame. You should be acting like the Captain of your Ship and leading your relationship. You should be actively using Kino and seducing your wife.

I respect this stuff. We as men should be doing this stuff anyway. Pass Fitness tests. Seduce your wife. Have a solid frame. Create a plan. Go to the gym. Have hobbies and a life apart from the wife. Upgrading clothes. Being the captain. Kino and seducing wife. I don’t even think conditioning your availability to your wife based on treatment is all together wrong – you wouldn’t put up with Fitness from your friends or at work, you sure shouldn’t be putting up with it from your wife. Personally, I feel that you should be doing that from the Frame of a leader and captain of your family, though I can see how that would be tough to do.

I'm going to combine a bit of that with Dalrock's post on headship game - https://dalrock.wordpress.com/2014/02/03/headship-game/

"Still, as a reminder I propose the following simple test when considering if applying a Game concept is sinful or not: Is it loving, and in accordance with your role as a biblical husband? Is it otherwise sinful, or does it encourage either of you to sin?

If you can’t answer yes to question number one and no to question number two, you should avoid the action."

[deleted] · 2017-09-05T12:56:28+00:00

Looking at women is not adultery, looking at women with desire is adultery.

Title	Can RPChristians use real dread?
Author	chuckus_mangionus
Upvotes	7
Comments	24
Date	September 4, 2017 9:39 PM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RPChristians
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RPChristians/comments/6y3e79/can_rpchristians_use_real_dread/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RPChristians/can-rpchristians-use-real-dread.302158 https://theredarchive.com/post/302158