714,030 posts

Wife is approaching the wall and wants freedom to do whatever she wants with zero consequences.

Reddit View
January 30, 2020
49 upvotes

I'm looking for input from guys who have gone through a similar situation.

I'm 31 6'5" 215 17%-18% BF

Bench 205, Squat 210 (recovering from dislocated knee) BR 175, OHP 135 DL 310 (also lacking from knee injury) SMV 8

Wife is 29, turning 30 in a few months. SMV 7

3 kids - 5(f), 3(m), 1(m)

Background

Wife and I both grew up in super conservative traditional Christian households. My dad was a drunk (sober now), I was raised by my mother with essentially no father figure, textbook nice guy syndrome. Wife and I were in the same social circles growing up but never really knew each other. She had a more traditional upbringing than I did. ( no tv in the house, girls wear skirts, dresses etc.) I rebelled, hit the party scene hard in college, had my fun with drugs and sex, etc. , realized I didn't want the lifestyle long term. She never did rebel. Always followed the rules and did what she was supposed to do. We met and had the same goals, Disney happily ever after. Marriage, house, kids, dog, cat, etc. I was a Beta to the core. Everything I did was for her. After she was diagnosed with post partum depression after our 2nd and while she was pregnant with our 3rd, I couldn't keep her happy no matter what I did. And I did everything at the expense of my own happiness. I felt like a bag of shit because no matter how hard I tried I couldn't make her happy. Eventually I decided I can't live like this and something needs to change. I stumbled across Athol Kay's NMMNG. This led me down the rabbit hole to the RED PILL. I devoured Rollo Tomassi's books, MMSLP, Pook, listened to all of Jordan B Peterson's Podcasts, found my direction and mission in life and stuck too it. I started lifting heavy, gained a significant amount of muscle mass, dressed better to show my physique. People started to notice and comment on my new look. Wife followed suit, upped her SMV but not enough to encroach my SMV. Things got better. Sex improved significantly, but not where I wanted it to be. She always had issues with sex due to her traditional upbringing and how it was never talked about. Never had sex education, never masturbated etc. Sex was better than before so I was content. The biggest game changer was the development of my frame and passing shit tests. Admittedly, my frame was far from perfect. Outwardly it seemed solid. Inwardly I struggled to get my mind where it needed to be. Comfort tests were also difficult for me to recognize and led to some Ramboing. Once I did recognize them the Ramboing was under control and things improved even more. I started working towards starting a business and becoming financially independent. We changed social circles by leaving our church and joining another much more liberal church that was more aligned with our beliefs. Everything was looking great.

Present Situation

This past Sunday I was blindsided. She told me she wants to have her own life outside of our marriage. OK, I have a life outside of our marriage with friends and I am enjoying it. No reason you can't have the same. She told me she feels like her whole life she has always followed the rules and has always done what she was supposed to do. OK, totally understand. She doesn't know who she is supposed to be because her life has been dictated by someone else's arbitrary rules... the Disney lifestyle. I told her I had to go through the same process to figure out what I wanted in life and that no one else but me can make me happy but me and I make the rules for my life. She then tells me that she regrets not living her life to the fullest when she was young, with no responsibilities and experiencing life while she had the opportunity. She told me her values had changed from when she was younger. I told her to explain what had changed. She said she wants to figure out who she is by living her life to the fullest with no fear of consequences....I ask, what do you mean by that, what does that look like for you. She said she wants to live the life she should have in her early 20's and experience what I and everyone else got to experience at that age. I said OK, still haven't answered the question, what does that look like for you. She told me she wants to go out and meet new people, flirt with other guys, know that she's still "got it", see where life takes her and do whatever she wants with whoever she wants with no fear of consequences. This way she can become a better person for our relationship. I was getting nervous but holding frame well. OK, define whatever you want with whoever you want. She says she doesn't know, but wants to feel the thrill of being hit on by other men because it boosts her self esteem and she can feel more confident. OK, what else has changed for you. She said I know we have had this conversation before but I don't feel like kissing other people is really considered cheating, it's just kissing, it doesn't mean anything..... WHAT THE FUCK DID I JUST HEAR.... My heart is pounding, I'm in complete shock. But I have to keep frame no matter what. Don't fucking break frame. I said OK but I'm not ok with that. She then says that she would be ok if I were to kiss other girls or go to a strip club if that's what I wanted. (1 year earlier I went to a bachelor party and refused to go to a strip club. Not my thing, never been nor desire to. She said that if I had gone we would be over). Still in shock but holding frame I say, that's not what I want to do. She then says that even if I were to cheat on her by having sex with another woman "by mistake" she would be very upset but would be able to move past it and forgive me... Then it hit me... AWALT. For fuck's sake, I didn't ever think this would be an issue. At this point I assume she has already done something and is trying to salvage the relationship. But at the same time, she doesn't have social media, has not 1 close guy friend and she, never had an issue with me looking at her phone, and not a very active social life. Literally zero red flags before this conversation. I ask her if she has something she needs to tell me and to cut the shit. She denies and just says I'm not looking for a cheat pass, but I want to know that if I were to go out and live life to the fullest the way I should have when I was young, I don't want there to be any consequences, you will always be my number one but this is something I have to do, but I don't want it to jeopardize everything that we have together . I zero in on my frame and suppress all emotions. I told her, you are free to live your life however you choose, it's your decision to make, not mine, but to expect zero consequences for your actions is an unrealistic expectation. I then told her what I don't want in a wife. I don't want a wife that kisses other men, I don't want a wife who has sex with other men, I don't want a wife that goes on dates with other men, I don't want a wife sexting or sending nude photos to other men, I don't want a wife that let's other men put their hands all over her body. We then got into hypothetical situations which was a slight fracture in my frame. I stopped it as soon as I recognized it and said if you desire another man physically and then act on it in a physical way or allow men to act on their desire for you, I consider that cheating, crossing that line will have consequences for our relationship and I can't promise that we will be able to continue our marriage. She said she wants to keep the discussion open because there are a lot of grey areas with my "rules". She said just because we aren't on the same page about what constitutes cheating doesn't mean we can't come to a compromise and find middle ground. I didn't waiver, I told her these are my boundaries and there will be consequences if they are crossed. End of conversation. She did not agree to my boundaries.

The next day, reset, treated her as I would any other day. She seems taken back by it. gives me a hug and kiss before work. I get texts from her throughout the day...I don't feel like you are respecting what I need to do for me to improve our marriage...I respond with you know what I expect, lets talk at home...that's very degrading to me... let's talk at home...I need to figure this out now...I'm at work let's talk about it at home... my phone rings, I answer hey what's up... I need you to come home right now something's come up, I need you to switch vehicles so my mom can pick up the kids, I can't go into details. OK go home, one of her girlfriends are over and her car is in the driveway. She meets me outside and says I can't come in. OK what's going on. Beth found out her husband is cheating on her.

EDIT:

I appreciate the reply's from everyone. I can't reply to everyone's comments but they are incredibly valuable to me. I had to write an exam today to be certified in my trade to start my business. I stayed off Reddit and cleared my head to focus on the task at hand. I passed the exam. I can now make cash on the side to stash for the go plan. Reading the comments, I am delusional about my SMV. I half assed the red pill and it bit me in the ass. I'm a boring Billy Beta and my wife knows it. Tonight I had a discussion with my wife about where we stand with all of this. I told her my boundaries again and let her decide what she wanted. She told me she wants an open marriage and wants to have sex with other men and is ok with me having sex with other women. I told her that's not what I'm looking for in a wife but I can't stop her from fucking other men, but if she does, there's the door. She broke down and said she feels trapped, admitted she wants to sleep with other men but hasn't yet. No matter what she does she loses. If she stays with me, she doesn't feel loved, beautiful, wanted...aka no feelz due to severe lack of game. If she pursues other men, she loses everything she currently has and knows it. She also said she doesn't understand how I just don't give a shit about losing her. How can you be so cold hearted and emotionless. I am meeting with a lawyer next week Tuesday. She was diagnosed with severe post partum depression 2 years ago, is on anti depressants, has gone through cognitive behavioral therapy twice in 2 years and is seeing a therapist. During her 3rd pregnancy she called the midwife and told them she was afraid of hurting her kids, Family and Children's Services was called. It is all documented as well as the discussion on Monday. I feel like I have a lot of ammunition for full custody, but the lawyer will let me know if I'm delusional. Her parents have recently separated. Together 35 years, only for the sake of their kids. They all moved out, 1 year later, the marriage was over. Her mother is moving in our basement in a month and has nowhere else to go other than the street. So I'm currently building a bedroom in my basement for her. It's a fucked up situation that I never imagined myself in. But I can move forward and will move forward. The mission hasn't changed, only the situation surrounding it. I have had a date night planned for us for tomorrow night before all of this went down. I'm going out and having fun regardless of her coming or not. If she does come great, I will game her and show her a great time. If not, I'll work on gaming other women because I need practice. I also am going on the vacation I planned regardless of her attendance. I am going and will have a great time regardless of who I am with. Thank you all for the advice and the reality check.


Post Information
Title Wife is approaching the wall and wants freedom to do whatever she wants with zero consequences.
Author Diesel_Dragon
Upvotes 49
Comments 207
Date 30 January 2020 06:02 AM UTC (10 months ago)
Subreddit askMRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/316295
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/ew0svu/wife_is_approaching_the_wall_and_wants_freedom_to/
Similar Posts

Red Pill terms found in post:
Comments

[–]RPWolfAlpha_as_Wolf_2.038 points39 points  (6 children) | Copy

TL;DR - ILYBINILWYAM

FYI, I have seen this a million times. Whenever a woman says I don't care if you fuck other chicks its because she's a chick fucking other dudes. Get your shit in order and get the fuck out.

[–]hack3geRed Beret8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

100% it’s called being OI - works the same for a man - she’s getting fucked hard how she likes it somewhere else.

[–]WesternhagenWinner8 points9 points  (2 children) | Copy

"I don't care if you fuck other chicks"

(unstated subtext) "you are a fat, weak beta with zero game, and I know you couldn't do that even if you wanted to, but go for it, you have my permission."

[–]RPWolfAlpha_as_Wolf_2.010 points11 points  (0 children) | Copy

More to the point, even if he could she’s at the point where she wishes he would to justify her getting railed by Chad.

[–]chubz4you0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Or she knows youre too beta to get other chicks.

[–]thatmotoguy8080 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Spot on

[–]BlakeMortimer73 points74 points  (5 children) | Copy

She used exactly the same lines my ex-wife used right before I found out she was fucking someone else.

This doesn’t look good at all.

[–]BobbyPeruRed Beret34 points35 points  (0 children) | Copy

Would you mind expanding on this? I think some details could really help OP here

[–]ChokingDownRPRed Beret33 points34 points  (2 children) | Copy

She used exactly the same lines my ex-wife used right before I found out she was fucking someone else.

Yep, changes are she's already done something...maybe kissing, maybe more, she'll never say. I'd proceed assuming that's the case. Talking to a lawyer is a good first step, manning up and squashing her idea that this is even a possibility is a good 2nd step.

Sounds to me like your relationship is fucked - it's one thing for a woman to fuck around, but for her to straight up tell you she wants to do so, and expect you to be ok with it should tell you all you need to know about how she views you. Betabux Cuck.

[–]InChargeManRed Beret27 points28 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yep, hamster is back-dating morality.

[–]Chump_No_More12 points13 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yep, the marriage is done.

The contempt from this woman, expecting the OP to willingly foot the bill for an all-inclusive fuck fest, is all you need to know. She thinks he's weak and hates him for it... and she's not wrong.

At this juncture, the marriage is beyond setting boundaries. No point to stating "there will be consequences", she won't believe him. She's gonna do what she's gonna do. Nothing here to salvage.

The question is what's the OP gonna do? Retain a lawyer and get the ball rolling? I doubt it. When you have to go a bunch internet strangers to ask what to do for 'no brainer', you're self worth and confidence are fucked.

Reminds me of the last line in Bruce Springsteen's 'Brilliant Disguise'... "God have mercy on the man who doubts what he's sure of." No more powerful words ever spoken.

[–]second-last-mohican1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Isnt there a thing where conservative girls in their high school and college years or girls with low n counts get the c.c urge?

[–]UnbreakableFrame55 points56 points  (3 children) | Copy

Your wife is fucking bored. You aren't leading her and giving her direction. She has so little clue of what to do with her life or where she's headed that she wants to digress a decade and sleep with aimless college dudes. Her random slutty, unhappy girlfriends' pasts are more exciting than her present or prospective future.

You omitted the most important parts of this story. Your wife:

  1. Doesn't have a job.
  2. Is a SAHM.
  3. Despite #2, the house is frequently dirty.
  4. She only cooks dinner intermittently.
  5. She probably has some mild addiction rolling in the background, be it shopping or binge-watching garbage TV shows.

So let's get into the famed MRP analogies, why don't we?

The first mate stands on the deck of your ship, for the nth year. The sky is dark. The captain is missing. The waves crash into the ship over and over, churning it back and forth. She, never having learned to navigate, feels lost. She wants to right the ship, but doesn't know how. The captain, after hours of absence, appears on the deck, despite never having landed on shore, he looks to her with a new glint in his eye and says "we will soon strike land". He then retreats below deck again, to remain unseen for the rest of the evening. The first mate feels utterly helpless. The only choice she knows is the one she's been making; continuing to rely on a captain who has delivered her to nothingness. Given no orders by the captain and lost in despair, she looks over the bow of the ship into the dark waters, contemplating her choices. Low and behold, a siren emerges. The siren tells your first mate that there are islands all around her. That if only she were willing to leave the captain, only for a moment, she would be able to reach these islands. The inhabitants of these islands would rejoice to see her. She would be desired and ravished, rather than wasting away unnoticed and left without direction. Easily swayed by the siren's tales of carnal ecstasy and having no other lot in life with which to occupy her time, the first mate begins carefully planning her escape.

[–]0io-Tsundere19 points20 points  (1 child) | Copy

It was a dark and stormy night...

Jane's heart beat with anticipation of the savage natives that would ravage her on the tropical island away from her Husband, that dull, predictable plowhorse, that slightly chubby, injured, tall, but boring meal ticket.

"Imagine being alone on an island for a week, with no one to bother me, except for the Savages. Would they tie me up and rape me? Or would they worship me as a White Goddess?"

[–]Cam_Winston212 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

It was a dark and stormy night...

The sea was angry that day, my friends.

[–]Livecrazyjoe4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Love this analogy.

[–]QueenSlapFight42 points43 points  (2 children) | Copy

Just going to throw my two cents in and join the crowd. Not only is she going to cheat, how hard she is pressing for things highly highly implies she has already cheated. She is looking for retroactive permission.

I've never been married nor never will marry (older than you tho). And one of the reasons why is no matter how awesome a woman may be right now, who the fuck knows who she'll turn in to? It's out of your control. Mental illness, hormonal changes and imbalance, repressed abuse.. who the fuck knows what might rear its ugly head as the years go by? You can be alpha and super red pill and own the fuck out of your life, but all that guarantees is you'll be able to attract a top tier mate. That does not mean you'll be able to prevent a former top tier mate from devolving down some path of mental illness, obesity, or psychosis. Being high SMV may dread your mate into staying at the top of their game, but it doesn't guarantee it. All it guarantees is your ability to attract high SMV women.

I feel for you, and while you can hope for the best (fucking unlikely), you need to expect the worst. And in this case, you need to make your #1 life priority at the moment preparing as ironclad proof exit plan as you possibly can. Visit a lawyer yesterday. Figure out how to protect your finances and options as quick as possible. You have had the blessing to be given a heads up of your impending divorce, take advantage of it and position yourself as best you can to save your finances and access to your children as much as possible. This woman is going to burn you.

[–]second-last-mohican17 points18 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah she has a cock in the waiting and wants to go fuck him and a few other cocks during spring break, writing is on the wall

[–]JoeBuckYourslf10 points11 points  (0 children) | Copy

30 seconds into OP’s post and already figured out that she has already cheated.

[–]SepeanRed Beret18 points19 points  (19 children) | Copy

listened to all of Jordan B Peterson's Podcasts

Careful with that. He has some good ideas, but he is completely clueless when it comes to sexual strategy. He thinks it is all about beta game. He does not understand the first thing about dual sexual strategy or alpha.

Sex improved significantly, but not where I wanted it to be. [...] Sex was better than before so I was content.

Which is it, not what you want or content? I smell weak frame.

Everything was looking great.

Except the bad sex.

How I am at fault: Not gaming her enough, too focused on starting up a business.

Yep, beta game doesn't work.

I'm not making her feel attractive because of a lack of attention from me. She has overtly told me this and I did nothing to address it.

Dude, ffs stop. What is this beta bullshit? Stop listening to your wife. You need to bring some alpha, some frame and game, some dread.

Sex began to decline but I was too focused on work to care.

Like a good little beta.

Should I let her go or should I say no? Here's where my head is at... if she goes, I will have no proof that she has cheated on me but am confident she will cross my boundaries. If I say no I am not OK with that, then I am mate guarding and lose frame.

Dude, wtf. You're seriously considering letting her go to Resort Fuck because you're afraid of losing frame in her eyes?

Here's what you need to do:

  • seriously, get your idea of alpha and beta unfucked. You have zero understanding of what alpha is. Read this and the comments: https://www.reddit.com/r/marriedredpill/comments/5yejxu/most_mens_masculine_ideal_is_not_alpha/
  • stop fucking settling with mediocre because muh bizness.
  • start from scratch becoming alpha and developing SMV. Lifting, frame, game, dread, reevaluate all of it and get to work. You're in the baby steps phase. You think you got shit down, but bro you say sex was never good, then it declined and your wife is now asking for an open relationship. Face facts, your SMV is low, you get 24h to be sad about it then suck it uo and go do something about it.
  • keep your wife away from clubs and cruises until you get your shit together. If she goes out parading herself in front of other men, you're out. If she kisses, texts or meets with other men, you're out.

[–]mrpthrowa11 points12 points  (13 children) | Copy

keep your wife away from clubs and cruises until you get your shit together. If she goes out parading herself in front of other men, you're out. If she kisses, texts or meets with other men, you're out.

She's already done that.

[–]SepeanRed Beret1 point2 points  (11 children) | Copy

You don’t know that. She wants to, and AWALT, but that doesn’t mean she acted on it.

[–]hack3geRed Beret14 points15 points  (6 children) | Copy

I’m usually with you but you are wrong here - she’s fucked someone else and doesn’t want to feel bad about blowing her life up. She is getting permissions after the fact 100%.

The messaging and what she is saying is too strong - if she hadn’t cheated yet she would have merely been mentioning some new guy that she thinks is fun or interesting. Women aren’t like men - they aren’t just looking to fuck around they do it to branch swing.

[–]SepeanRed Beret4 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy

I'm not saying I'm sure she didn't cheat - I'm not sure either way.

I'm sure she could spin some sort of story about needing to unwind and take a vacation on her own and sell it to him easily. Instead she chose to ask for permission, openly. Which is fucking stupid from a "I just want strange dick in me" tactical POV.

So my take is that there's some strong moral/religious stuff in play here, she clearly has issues with him (or god or whatever) seeing her as a cheater, so she's asking permission instead of being tactical and stealthy about it. There's of course a chance she did cheat already and feels guilty about it and is seeking permission after the fact as a sort of forgiveness, but I figure she'd be sucking more up to him in that case, trying to sell it harder.

Religious people let their kids die because of a misinterpreted sentence in the bible that they think ban blood transfusions, this stuff can overpower our strongest instincts, so I don't think it is unreasonable that someone asks for permission first because they have issues with cheating.

Anyway, I'm not sure what she did or didn't do, and I don't see how anyone can be. One thing is sure though, OP needs to alpha up ASAP or she is going there. Her only saving grace is that maybe she asked before she acted on her desires. But I'm under no illusion she's some virtous girl who will respect his decision and honor their marriage if he says no.

[–]AlohaMaui80817 points18 points  (0 children) | Copy

She probably fucked Beth's husband

[–]hack3geRed Beret2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Man that’s a stretch - if they ask I’ve never seen it not be the case that she was looking to not feel guilty for already doing it.

[–]BostonBrakeJob3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

Women aren’t like men - they aren’t just looking to fuck around they do it to branch swing.

Some are more so than others. I'd have no problem believing a woman wanting to have her cake and eat it too. Bitches love cake.

Not saying you're wrong here either. The messaging is pretty strong from her. Whether she did or didn't isn't the issue though, really. The fact it's what she wants would be enough for me to end it. Coke doesn't keep an employee on the payroll if she's spending 8 hours a day figuring out how to make Pepsi better.

[–]hack3geRed Beret2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Coke doesn't keep an employee on the payroll if she's spending 8 hours a day figuring out how to make Pepsi better.

Fucking great analogy

[–]mrpthrowa9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

I disagree. The ferocity of her desire tells me otherwise. I've seen far too much of this sort of thing.

[–]juliusstreicher0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

So, how's he going to keep her out of clubs and cruises?

[–]SepeanRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Tell her she can’t go. If she says she’s going anyway, tell her he considers going cheating and that’s the end of their marriage.

This shit isn’t hard.

[–]SKRedPill0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Look at what happened to Jordan Peterson's daughter. He couldn't do anything about it. He probably learnt a bitter pill himself.

[–]Tyred_Biggums3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

OP needs to figure out his boundaries. It’s a simple statement “my wife will not do X”. It’s not controlling her - it’s a statement that YOU will choose to not be married if she does.

Only do it if you have the frame and balls to actually follow through.

[–]WolfofAllStreetz-3 points-2 points  (3 children) | Copy

I hate Jordan P. So overrated.

[–]SepeanRed Beret3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

He has some good points, especially for men who are weak, depressed, rudderless, etc., he's saying some stuff resonates with them and can help them.

But the guy is beta as fuck - a competent beta, but beta nonetheless. When we're talking sexual strategy he is hopeless and clueless.

[–]BostonBrakeJob0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I've learned a lot from him, as far as healthy communication and accepting others faults as I do my own.

I was also the guy that would punch a dude in the mouth 2 sentences into an arguement....so there's that.

[–]WolfofAllStreetz0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Lol at the downvotes for an opinion. Most people have never listened to his speaches. You are correct, his sexual and women advice is awful.

[–]nantucketghost15 points16 points  (0 children) | Copy

She wants to know that you will be her backup when it fails. You failed by giving her the time of day on this. Just tell her that there is the door, but if she walks through it, she will never come back. This is when you should have gone on the offense in my opinion. Should have gotten her bag and told her to pack it. Find a place to sleep. Tomorrow you were going to cancel the credit cards and close the bank accounts. If this is what she wants, she can have it. If she even remotely thinks that you'll be the beta and take her back, she will try to branch swing.

[–]RoccoPinkman13 points14 points  (0 children) | Copy

You have to actually have frame before you can have a crack in it.

Holding frame does not mean STFU and not get pissed while your wife tells you she wants to get fucked up on MDMA and fuck other dudes.

Holding frame is being true to your authentic self, knowing what you will and will not tolerate and being assertive to enforce that. Frame is different for everyone but you definitely do not have it.

[–]BobbyPeruRed Beret34 points35 points  (5 children) | Copy

This is textbook . We see this all the time. She’s either cheating or has a guy or 2 lined up. If you read any of the sidebar you’d know this. Of course, absolutely no mention of sidebar readings in your post.

You need to start mentally preparing yourself for what’s coming. Based on the fact that you are replying to her ridiculous texts, you don’t have the frame for this whole situation.

respond with you know what I expect, lets talk at home...that's very degrading to me... let's talk at home...I need to figure this out now...I'm at work let's talk about it at home...

You should have ghosted this whole thing. She holds all the power, and she knows it

You are not doing the work, so naturally you are bewildered by the shitty results you are getting.

This may be too late to salvage, but you need to lift (your numbers are weak), hit the sidebar (all of it twice), and STFU.

Then wait and see what happens.

Personally, if my wife spewed all that BS, I’d file the next week. But we are in totally different spots. You are weak and unattractive.

So, STFU for now and see what happens. See if she follows through. What she is asking is totally unreasonable, but you need to put on your big boy pants and make big boy decisions.

This isn’t a place you come for us to put a bandaid on your boo-boo. This is a place where we can provide posted signs, but you have to do the work. From what I can see, you haven’t done shit for work other than a little fuckarounditis in the gym.

Why have you not been doing weekly OYS posts? You are a lazy fuck who wants us to fix you after you get yourself in a huge jam.

[–]hack3geRed Beret20 points21 points  (4 children) | Copy

You are right just file and sort it out afterwards - on the smallest chance she hasn’t cheated yet (though we all know she has taken it in every hole and loved every minute of it) the only way to respect yourself and give her a chance to make a proper decision is file.

It’s the same damn script every fucking time - it used to make me angry now it just makes me laugh at how predictable human beings are despite being so intelligent.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

How many askmrp posts have there been like this in the last 90 days? It's comical. ILYBINILWY

[–]hack3geRed Beret16 points17 points  (0 children) | Copy

There’s only like a handful of narratives here and the funny thing is it’s the same story just at different points in the bigger narrative.

  • husband finds wife cheating
  • husband gets ilybinilwy
  • husband has harpy wife
  • husband finds sex has started to dry up

It’s a continuum - women start to withdraw sex when they lose attraction, after a while they get bitchy and disrespectful, then they find someone who peeks their interest and then she cheats.

[–]Rock_Granite3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

I'm kinda new here. It's crazy to think that this kind of situation is so common as to be a joke. But it sure sounds like you've seen it all before... over and over again

[–]hack3geRed Beret2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

That pill is a bitch to swallow - eventually it won’t even phase you.

[–]thottranslatorbot9 points10 points  (2 children) | Copy

She feels she's got you locked down. She's not respecting your stated boundaries, still trying to find a 'gray area', reframing this by saying it's to help your relationship, is trying to guilt you by claiming she needs to experience this for bla bla bla fucking bla.

You know what dude? If she actually respected you this wouldn't be an issue. If she actually feared losing you this wouldn't be an issue.

Here's what you do

Don't enage on the topic. Stop being drawn in. Repeat after me:

that's not how my wife behaves

That's all you say. She brings it up, you say that, smile, kiss her on the cheek and you go out. Maybe you go to the gym, maybe you go hang out with a friend. Honesty I'd recommend you start fucking other women yesterday because she's right in thinking you're afraid to lose what you have.

That fear is giving her the balls to treat you that way. Show her you're not afraid. Show her you're willing to lose her, and that you can get better. Be nice, stop arguing with her, be who you are but ffs STOP letting her manipulate you with fear.

She's not who you thought she was - that's OK, most people aren't - and you should never have switched to a more liberal church. But you have now, cats out of the bag.

You need to get into the mindset that you can leave her immediately. You need to actively showcase this mindset. So far you're trying to do 'soft' trp: there is no soft trp. You can't just pick and choose and hope to get the results you want.

She wants excitement, she wants the thrill of a real man. Be that man: step one is not allowing your woman to control you like this. Now get your ass to the fucking gym, then put on some of those nice clothes, turn your phone on silent and go talk to some girls.

If she wants to go on vacation, divorce her. Claim she's abandoned you and the kids, and the family property. Understand that she's choosing the nuclear option and your only response should be to ensure she doesn't destroy you as well. Make sure you have proof that you told her this in advance (ie emails texts laying out that if she chooses to leave, she chooses to leave her family). Play the hand you've been dealt.

[–]MrChad_ThundercockBig Red Machine10 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

Women don’t branch swing unless they already have an alpha already in the works. She’s already fucking someone else dude.

She wants to ride the CC because she’s bored as fuck with you.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah I'm boring as fuck. Too focused on work and not fun shit for me or her...

[–]HeckleandChide26 points27 points  (5 children) | Copy

You said you lift heavy and are an SMV 8 with a 205 bench.

Come again?

Obviously there’s a ton more shit there but I can’t get past that right now.

OP, you are delusional if you think you are an 8.

[–]Cam_Winston2112 points13 points  (0 children) | Copy

There has been a noticeable uptick in the guys who aren't strong on any other lift but can row almost as much as they can squat/DL, too. Apparently the retarded shrug is getting more & more popular.

Also, OP, the woman you married is gone.

[–]0io-Tsundere15 points16 points  (1 child) | Copy

OP is definitely delusional. If he's an 8 when he's fat, injured, and out-of-shape he must be an 11 or 12 when he's ripped, healthy, and looks like a Greek god on steroids.

[–]red-sfpplusHard Core Red2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Bald.

A bald, ripped, healthy (minus LVH and fucked up lipids) Greek God on steroids.

[–]mrpmonk1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Also, what is up with men giving themselves an SMV number. I'm newbie and I might have missed something, but I thought Men SMV is determined by women

[–]HeckleandChide2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Most of the time, it’s an idiot who is too high by 3-4.

[–]Tyred_Biggums8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

Reread this whole long thing. Yeah. She’s fucking or about to fuck a bunch of dudes. Wants to relive her 20s since she missed out on the cock carousel days

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

That's exactly my thoughts.

[–]Rifleshoot8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

If she is being this overt with it, it means she wants out. If she is saying that "it's okay if you sleep with other girls", it means she is conditioning you to be okay with her sleeping with other guys. Which most likely means she has already done so. Contact a lawyer, get some basic divorce details ironed out. It's never good for a woman to say things like that.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Made an appointment with a lawyer the day after the conversation. Pretty sure the marriage is done. Thanks for the advice

[–]part_wolf7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

Should I let her go or should I say no?

You couldn’t stop her from cheating if you tried, pal.

[–]JasonStar795 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Sounds like you have two options:

  1. Agree with her that kissing is OK and not really cheating. She'll let out a big sigh of relief and admit she's been kissing Chad; or,
  2. You disagree that kissing is OK and reaffirm that it is cheating. She'll feel let down and keep her secret to the grave, figuring out in the meantime how to continue kissing (and fucking) Chad without you knowing about it.

In short, she's already kissing and probably fucking Chad. Your question should be, what are you going to do about it.

[–]BostonBrakeJob6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

Let's be generous and say she hasn't already cheated. The whole thing was just an expression of her boredom and she's feeling you out for potential consequences to the actions she's, up to this point, only fantasized about.

Is that any more acceptable to you than if she's actually done it?

I know my answer. And to me, it seems like a complete waste of time and resources to try and figure out if she has physically crossed the line....aside from collecting evidence to use in court. You see where this is going.

But if this were my post, the central point would've been about me getting my ass into a lawyers office asap and getting papers drawn up and served. Not a recap of my hamster and what she wants.

So I know your wife has no real consequences if she already has crossed the line physically, or does so in the future. And if some dude reading your story on the internet can see that, what do you suppose she took from the conversation?

Let's be honest though....she probably already has. One thing's for sure though, she doesn't respect you.

[–]jenovajunkie4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

I just read your present situation, and freaked out; man, what the fuck is life outside of marriage?

Are you fucking delusional, you're married. You're living your life now, and you are married. Being married is part of your life. You both sound like young idiots, BRO listen to me.

When I was 18, just a month and a week after my birthday I got into a devastating car accident. I was in the hospital for just under a year, out before my 19th birthday and had private rehab for another 8 gruelling years. I missed out on a lot of "fun" like clubbing, driving and having my first car (I still don't drive), dating, sex, having a girlfriend, a career and a life.

So look at this reasonably, first of all I am disabled, I have a brain injury. That's fucked up on it's own, even if I wanted to go back and start clubbing, driving and dating wild women, it's not happening. My brain is permanently damaged.

But look at it like this, I am 33 now, even if I wanted to relive the past, when am I going to build my career and have a life, maybe a family. I meet so many girls that if I had met when I was 21 with the knowledge I had after university, I probably would have had wonderful relationships and Jons, and it eats me inside everyday. Have you seen the movie, Cast Away? What happened when Tom Hanks returned to his wife, whom thought he was dead remarried and started a new family?

Nothing. Time doesn't stop because you missed something, everyone else has a life. Those ships will keep sailing no matter what.

People were fucking in high school, I had one girl whom I had sex with before my accident. people were fucking in University, I wasn't, they were enjoying parties and travelling, I wasn't, people have work friends and they hang out together, I wasn't.

My life got fucking destroyed, and to go back (which my parents seemingly want to do) to "re-live" those moments, even when I already have a whole fucking family, is not only selfish, but fucking crazy.

This bitch needs to be put down. Where are her priorities?

[–]Imaginary_Historian5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Should I let her go or should I say no? Here's where my head is at... if she goes, I will have no proof that she has cheated on me but am confident she will cross my boundaries. If I say no I am not OK with that, then I am mate guarding and lose frame.

have no advice except to lawyer up and get the divorce wheels turning. She already told you the marriage was over. You are just making it official.

I truly want to know how it's mate-guarding to tell someone that going on a vacation to a tropical resort alone for a week is not an acceptable thing for a young married person to do. Any idiot knows that is not in any way alright. The very fact that she thinks she should be allowed to do this shows her complete lack of respect for you, your marriage and her family and the only answer is to divorce. There is no turning this around.

[–]Tea-my-hero5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

Can you just update us when you find out that she's already fucking someone else?

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

We talked. She says she wants to but hasn't. I updated my post to give more background. It's probably over

[–]throwawaybpdnpd4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

This story isn’t about frame, it’s about getting a divorce...

This is wayyyyy past saving, your turn has passed

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Fuck, hard to admit it but I know it's true...

[–]0io-Tsundere14 points15 points  (9 children) | Copy

That doesn't sound good at all!

On the bright side, your sex life has been improving, and you've been improving, but you have a long way to go.

I'd tell her no, you're not OK with her plan to go party on her own and then work my ass off to go from 17% BF to 9% BF. Maybe now she's got the idea that sex can actually be kind of fun, and imagine how much more fun it would be with someone who's actually hot.

If you're lucky maybe you can be that "hot guy" she's craving.

I'm not convinced that she's cheating yet. It just sounds like she's realizing her own SMV is higher now that it's ever going to be after she's 30 and she wants to "make up for missing out".

If you want to go nuts and roll the dice you could bring home another girl for a threesome. I'm not sure that's a wise idea.

You could also try to greatly up the kink in your bedroom and see if that holds her off while you get in better shape. Buy some whips and chains and crazy bondage outfits and clothes for her to wear for you from Discount Stripper or Ebay...

On some level she's saying, "I just found out I really love sex. Our sex life is so boring. I don't want to be an old lady on my deathbed and look back and say 'Why oh Why did I settle for a life of boring sex with my husband when I could have had it all?'"

Somehow you have to get out in front of her sexual tsunami and surf to shore without getting wiped out. You want her being the one telling her gf, "You know, you should actually try having sex with my husband... he's more than I can handle."

Probably easier said than done. Good luck! At least you have some fun times ahead if you make it work, hope you don't crash and burn!

Edit: SMV 8 and 17% BF with pathetically weak lifts no fucking way. SMV 8 and your agent is calling you up asking if you can be Mr Pitt's body double in the movie and you're asking security to help kick the girls from the music video out from your bedroom. Slightly overweight married guy with knee and back injuries and 3 kids is SMV 4 on a good day. If you fix your issues your SMV would go up a couple of points. You're not going from 8 to 10. Right now you're looking to go from 4 to 6.

Kind of delusional here, really. Fix that first. Treat it as if she's a 6 and you're a 4 trying to be a 7. That's a more realistic summary of where you are.

Edit: Title should be Wife thinks her SMV is a couple of points higher than mine and wants to take advantage of her good lucks while she still can, thinks I probably won't mind or can't do anything about it.

[–]SelectAirline5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Title should be Wife thinks her SMV is a couple of points higher than mine and wants to take advantage of her good lucks while she still can, thinks I probably won't mind or can't do anything about it.

Tbh that could have been the entire post.

[–]mrpthrowa6 points7 points  (3 children) | Copy

You keep saying you "held frame". You never really did - asking over and over "what do you mean" is not holding frame. She got you, and she knew it.

By the way, 100% she already did something - kiss somebody, or fuck somebody. It 100% happened. She got the thrill, and now wants more. Somebody has awaken her desires.

don't want there to be any consequences, you will always be my number one but this is something I have to do, but I don't want it to jeopardize everything that we have together

Beta boy please stay around while I go hop around dicks. It's ok it doesn't mean anything I wuv you.

I consider that cheating, crossing that line will have consequences for our relationship and I can't promise that we will be able to continue our marriage. She said she wants to keep the discussion open because there are a lot of grey areas with my "rules". She said just because we aren't on the same page about what constitutes cheating doesn't mean we can't come to a compromise and find middle ground. I didn't waiver, I told her these are my boundaries and there will be consequences if they are crossed. End of conversation. She did not agree to my boundaries.

That's it. Even opening this discussion means she ship has sailed. There is nothing more you can do now.

You have entered the territory of negotiating and verbalising really obvious boundaries. She is lost.

At this point I have squashed the hamster and am focusing on me

You hope.

Today she told me that she feels no emotion anymore towards anything or anyone including me and the kids, doesn't know what she wants in life

Translation: I want cocks. Lots of strange cocks. Not necessarily yours though.


I think you should consider this done and go forge your own path. I have never seen this sort of situation improve.

[–]redpillparis8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

Accurate analysis. She has definitely cheated or narrowed down a candidate to bone her and make her feel 20 again.

[–]hack3geRed Beret8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

No those words only come from a woman who has cheated - she is 100% sure of what she wants. A woman will start off conflicted about a situation and once she makes a decision her tone changes.

OP just needs to file and move on - this one is a loss and unfortunately it’s going to hurt because he hasn’t done any real work and has just been a dancing monkey.

[–]SkimTheDross5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Too many guys think “holding frame” means not flipping their lid.

[–]matrixtospartanatLVRed Beret8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

My (ex)wife, without my knowledge or consent, opened my marriage and started dating and fucking other men. When I found out, I confronted her many times about it and she never stopped. She didn't care if we were married or divorced, and if I stayed or if I left. Eventually I inherited a fuck-ton of money and divorced her. I kept the money, and she kept her boyfriend.

At the time the pain I felt rivaled that of burying my 17yo son. I felt like I was getting foot-stomped in my guts and groin every day. This went on far longer than I should have let it.

In retrospect, now nearly 3 years later. I am thankful for what she did. I have grown TREMENDOUSLY and become a man I never would have been without that catalyst for change. I have a life now I never even dreamed about. I am 'friends' with her now. We still date and fuck now and then. She was hesitant at first. but I told her that after what she did, I expect to have a lifetime, all access pass.

Your marriage is over. What you signed up for and took a vow to, is gone. Your choices are divorce, or a 2.0 marriage.

Ironically, you married the relative unicorn Disney fairy tale that so many seek, someone who never got on the cock-carousel, and your marriage STILL didn't work out.

She is going to fuck other men. Period. You can't stop her, and she has told you in every way but directly that she is going to. This HAS happened, or WILL happen very soon.

There are 3.5 BILLION women on this planet. Replacing her as a fuck toy in your life whether as a ONS, FWB, or wife, will be relatively easy to do. But there are three other people involved that are NOT replaceable; your three young children.

The choice you make now is whether you want to be a full time father who sees his children every day, or a part time father who pays their SAHM money to fuck other men in your old bed while she teaches your children to hate you.

To be sure, she has shut down emotionally because she resents her un-spent youth, and she resents you for not letting her access to some freedom now.

You have many choices available to you. Stay in a dead, resentful marriage until you find out she has cheated on you, give her half your shit on the front end, and then pay her alimony and child support because she is a SAHM. You can divorce her now, and let her do what she is going to do anyway, without your consent, and WITH your money, and have her pass that resentment on to the kids because DADDY broke up the family. You can just stay in it 'for the kids' and become a cuckold in your own marriage, miserable and unhappy and waste the best years of your life...

OR...

You can accept the fact that your wife is going to cheat on you, you want to raise your children full time, and not get divorce-raped.

HOW?

Caleb Jones at Blackdragon.com, "How to Create or Convert to an Open Marriage."

This may not be the right answer for you. But you SHOULD consider ALL the answers when you are making life decisions that affect 5 or more people at a time.

In the spirit of providing you answers, based on your mutual strong conservative Christian upbringing, I would suggest you copy/paste your OP to r/RPChristians and see what you get there.

At the end of the day, this is all about, and ONLY about, YOU.

Deal with the problems in your life from a position of strength knowing ALL your options and possibilities. Make decisions pragmatically that serve your short AND long term interests, providing for your happiness along the way.

You cannot go back to what you have. Your marriage 1.0 is dead. You will never un-learn, un-know, or forget what she did when she killed your marriage. It is up to you now, as the man, to decide what you want and where you are going to lead the marriage NEXT.

Until you read that book I recommended, you need to see a couple of attorneys, start hiding CASH, like in a small vault underneath the seat of your car or in a safety deposit box, put your wife to work in a traditional job, and start reading the sidebar.

And for the record, you don't have any frame. Women are masters of covert communication. She has been reading your eyes and facial features as secondary communication for thousands of years as part of her survival mechanism as the weaker sex.

Frame is a psychological environment which defines interactions and context. (from Practical Female Psychology)

Your internal psychological environment is a fucking disaster area. Just because you STFU doesn't mean you have frame, and don't think for an instant she can't see right through the weak, beta, useless facade of a fuck that you are.

Again, explore ALL your options, because you have MANY. That means YOU are 100% responsible for the outcome of the shit-show that your life and marriage has become.

Life is full of choices...

Make good ones.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Thanks for the advice. I'm so sorry you had to bury your 17 year old son. If I had to do that with one of my kids it would hurt way more than what I'm feeling now. I'm more angry than hurt. But holy shit... I am truly sorry for your loss.

[–]aita28993 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Get a lawyer, pay cash so if she has access to see finances it won’t pop up.

She is cheating, and you need to get stuff in-line. Take the advice here, I didn’t at first and kept trying to fix shit. I came out fantastic because she made more than me and made ton of mistakes.

For most men you will be raped, and from the sounds of it she doesn’t make what you do so it’s gonna be painful if you don’t get shit protected now.

[–]resolutions3163 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

She cheated. Or she wants to.

You’re scared because you’ve been hamstering your “SMV”.

Time to prove it, bro.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I get attention from women, but never act on it. She admitted she wants to fuck around. Going to act on the attention I get from other women.

[–]BostonBrakeJob1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Going to act on the attention I get from other women.

Not saying this is a bad thing, but...

She admitted she wants to fuck around.

....this is a pretty weak reason to do it.

Also, click on this u/red_sfpplus and read through his comments about keeping your dick dry during a divorce.

Then, make your own decisions.

[–]RStonePT3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

[–]SteelSharpensSteelMod / Red Beret1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

[–]RStonePT2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Man, I gotta read more dalrock. He's the one I'm least read up on.

Before it's too late

[–]ArborioRice3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

My ex wife offered an open marriage, said she wouldn't be mad if i fucked some other girl, etc all while becoming highly secretive with her phone and ghosting me during work travel. Started acting and sounding like your wife- wanting to live the young party life while a 30something married woman. In my case she used to party and whore around and thought she would settle down with me...she missed it. Yours never experienced it and now wants to...two sides to the same coin. Sorry dude, but I think most of us know how this will end for you; too many of these stories here and they're all the same.

She has massive FOMO or whatever the past tense is, your/her friends are shit btw. Find some better friends who don't spend all time wishing for their ol' college glory days. She's gaslighting you too with the:

I get texts from her throughout the day...I don't feel like you are respecting what I need to do for me to improve our marriage...I respond with you know what I expect, lets talk at home...that's very degrading to me... let's talk at home...I need to figure this out now...I'm at work let's talk about it at home...

The spring break thing is a complete non-starter and you know it. I second the advice from u/thottranslatorbot and broken record that's not how my wife behaves anytime it comes up. Whether it's for real or a massive shit test your reaction is the same: that's not how my wife behaves. If she does go, you know what you need to do.

Yes, you're boring, lame, unexciting, unattractive, etc. Fix that, but don't delude yourself you're fixing it for her or for the marriage; you'll just be a dancing monkey while your wife has her delayed rumspringa acting like a 22 year old thot.

[–]SBIIIRed Fucking Commando0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

FOHMO

[–]redpillparis3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Do yourself a favor and end it before she does. No begging, no negotiating. Just lay it down firm - ''It's over, my lawyers will be in touch shortly." You have no frame at the moment writing such long posts over some female who has no respect for you. Take your frame back.

[–]simbarlionRed Beret6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

Telling her the consequences of going on vacation alone is not mate guarding.

It's enforcing a boundary.

Her decision will tell you everything you need to know.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret6 points7 points  (28 children) | Copy

She is bored, which means you are boring. She has/is in the process of fucking someone else. She is weighing her dual mating options and consequences. Wants you to cheat to make it ok.

Her friend was the one who probably cheated, losing her BB (you).

File for divorce.

She's not yours it's just your turn.

[–]red-sfpplusHard Core Red13 points14 points  (27 children) | Copy

She's not yours it's just your turn

You have been around here to fucking long to say this faggot ass line.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret7 points8 points  (8 children) | Copy

You're absolutely right. But OP is a faggot and that isn't changing tomorrow. Applicable to his hamster. Will save him the effort and time.

[–]hack3geRed Beret4 points5 points  (7 children) | Copy

Don’t spoon feed faggots - they need to figure shit out on their own.

It’s part of the process - you need to learn to be a man capable of deciding for yourself because until then it’s all bullshit.

We all know how this goes - OPs wife says fine I won’t do anything and then continues to drip feed him sex and then bangs chads on the side. OP will be back here telling us how Alpha he is and how he stopped his wife and be completely oblivious.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret5 points6 points  (6 children) | Copy

I internally debate this everytime this situation comes up. Presume in all scenarios we tell him to get a divorce.

OP sidebars. Gets a divorce at the beginning. Retains time, sanity and may become less of a faggot.

OP doesn't sidebar. Gets a divorce at the beginning. Retains time, sanity and is probably still a faggot. Will repeat past.

OP doesn't sidebar, waits until Chad fucks her. Lost time, sanity and is still a faggot. Might divorce her.

OP sidebars. Divorces her anyways later, but loses time and sanity.

The only thing that matters in these scenarios is sidebar. Let's just give the dude his time back.

[–]AlohaMaui8082 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

HOA, having gone through and still going through this myself.

I think that for some faggots, a certain amount of "lost time and sanity" or what I would call suffering is necessary for us to "get it" at a deep enough level to have the needed internal mindset shift away from Oneitis and BP conditioning.

For some guys and for those further along, the "suffering" element isn't as necessary and may even seem arbitrary when viewed in others, but for those with deep Blue Pill conditioning and especially career Betas, that pain is critical to being able to force those internal changes through. We tend to be too weak to do it the right way without the "stick". The "carrot" of MRP success just isn't a strong enough motivator to fully break away from that deeply internalized BP mindset.

Before finding MRP, I was contemplating a divorce, but because I thought there was something wrong with her NOT because I knew there was something wrong with me as I was then

After finding MRP but before finding out STBX is cheating, I was committed to staying despite the Sidebar and books I had read and reread - I lied to myself that it was to have a sparring partner, it would get better if I just MRPed harder, many other rationalizations, but it was really because of Oneitis and my own weakness. I wasn't internalizing the critical parts of the material because I was covertly holding out a desperate false hope that I could get things back to "the good old days" without putting in that gruellingly hard internal rending that is required to change yourself inside. (Basically LARPing Alpha and LARPing "be attractive, don't be unattractive" while still having a goal/mission of fixing the relationship - we see a lot of that don't we?)

After finding out STBX is cheating, the feelings of betrayal, anger, loss, have all hit me deep down. It isn't possible to keep that on the surface or to ignore it. Through that pain, I have finally been able to make the switch from a weak man who was LARPing at being strong, to a weak man who accepts where he is actually at and is taking concrete steps to become strong. The difference is at least 75% in the mindset shift.

WOTSM talks about being alone in sparse conditions, to help stimulate personal growth through self imposed isolation, lack of distractions, and yes, a certain level of suffering/lack of material comfort.

I think the high level of pain involved in being forced to confront the truth about BP in such a vivid and personally impactful way has a similar stimulating effect.

If that stimulation is used productively, it can be the key to breaking through and getting started on real change.

It must be considered that even if "OP sidebars" his level of success has nothing to do with how many times he reads the sidebar and everything to do with his ability to successfully implement it in his own life and psychy. You can have it memorized word for word and still be a giant faggot. You can have such a solid understanding of the sidebar that you wrote part of the sidebar and still be a faggot deep down.

What matters is having the personal strength and conviction to actually make all the necessary changes recommended in the sidebar.

How to achieve that level of personal strength is obviously the question, and the sidebar helps with that, but can't make the full leap for a man.

But to return to my point, I don't think

just give the dude his time back.

Is necessarily a productive solution.

The last 5 months I spent in my fucked marriage would not have been more productive if I had divorced her earlier without finding out she was cheating, I would still have not internalized the necessary mindset, and would have been likely to repeat the past. By staying in it, I gained a valuable life experience (the pain) that has helped me move along the path. I wouldn't change what has happened if I could. This may end up being a key turning point in my life.

Just something for you to think about.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

Bottom line: I think time is a man's most valuable asset. I think in the cases of betrayal such as infidelity, my observations are that the male ego prevents 99/100 men from internalizing it was their fault. I don't talk about this here often: My first wife cheated on me. Lots. She was 19 when we married, you can probably write the story yourself. I read some of the sidebar back then. Still didn't work. I was one of the 99.

This is why I struggle with the advice here. I've been in OPs shoes and yours. Do I give the advice for the guy to bail now knowing he'll never get it (right now) and save him time? He'll still get the suffering and heartache. Or do I just say, "Yeah dude, sucks. Hang in there, waste your time, you still won't get it.. but hit the sidebar"

Edit: I thought it important to give at least two example of this. From prominent Manosphere figure-heads even.

  1. TFA got cucked by his wife. He used his ego and hamster to prevent from seeing it, even AFTER he was a speaker.
  2. ADJ blames "medussa" and not himself. Watch him get dismantled.

[–]Cloudy_Pirate2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Insane. ADJ's wife started escorting not too long after they got married.

It's like taking investment advice from the guy who lives in his van down by river.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Both of us have imagined ADJ is this dude.

[–]Cloudy_Pirate1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Ha. Took me a minute to notice the flair.

[–]hack3geRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The right thing to do is divorce and never look back but most new guys can’t wrap their head around it - ask me how I know.

Realistically the best thing for him to do is sidebar and wait for chads to rail his wife and catch her. Maybe that shock triggers him to finally live his life for himself - I don’t see it happening otherwise.

[–]SteelSharpensSteelMod / Red Beret2 points3 points  (17 children) | Copy

That's like saying “It’s not personal. It’s strictly business”

I'm going to leave you with the real counter though:

“Tom, don't let anybody kid you. It's all personal, every bit of business. Every piece of shit every man has to eat every day of his life is personal. They call it business. OK. But it's personal as hell. You know where I learned that from? The Don. My old man. The Godfather. If a bolt of lightning hit a friend of his the old man would take it personal. He took my going into the Marines personal. That's what makes him great. The Great Don. He takes everything personal. Like God. He knows every feather that falls from the tail of a sparrow or however the hell it goes? Right? And you know something? Accidents don't happen to people who take accidents as a personal insult.”

Of course this is personal.

[–]red-sfpplusHard Core Red1 point2 points  (16 children) | Copy

Wtf you talking about?

You respond to the wrong thread?

Cause I am lost.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret1 point2 points  (12 children) | Copy

I think I get what he's getting at.

It's a saying that people use to dissolve them of any personal responsibility. I agree. Its faggot.

I used it in this scenario because we both know OP is done for. It's over. Beta will never recover. Might as well use a faggot saying to get a faggot to do something in his own best interest.

[–]SteelSharpensSteelMod / Red Beret7 points8 points  (11 children) | Copy

Exactly. Saying shit like "She's not yours, it's just your turn." is such a cop out. I never agreed with that saying.

Because it is personal. Dude has a wife who is cheating on him or who soon will be. You mean to tell me that he got married and it was just business? For sure it's personal. The fact that he became a drunk captain is personal. Him going Rambo is personal.

Saying it's just her turn implies that you have no control over your own destiny. Well, shit happens. Yes, shit happens, but what matters is how we respond to the shit.

Saying stuff like "I'm not hers, it's just her turn", while good too (Pook, mental point of origin, putting yourself first, etc), it's damn personal.

You can't cop out of this. Well, you can, but then you become a faggot.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

You can't cop out of this. Well, you can, but then you become a faggot.

We all know that this saying has its roots in TRP logic of "next the bitch". Shitty.

I choose to use it when OP is done for and already a faggot. There is no recovery from this if it's gone where we know it has.

I never liked it either, but it has its place for faggots who waste time.

[–]InChargeManRed Beret1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy

I've also not liked the word "turn" because it implies some sort of privilege for being allowed access to her pussy. But, maybe you are spending too much time in the weeds. For the average new guy here the intricacies are probably over his head anyway. i.e. we'll worry about how to walk later, lets just get you crawling. "She's not yours, it's just your turn." is probably close enough for a first pass at having a spine.

For me it is "She IS mine, for as long as we both wish it." Parallel to this discussion we tend to debate mate-guarding a lot. I'm on the side of the fence where the "what" matters less, as it is all about the "why". For example, I will not allow my wife to meet a guy for food one on one. For me, it is 100% my frame in that I see it as disrespectful to me, nothing to do with me fearing she cheats. I wouldn't throw a fit about it to "convince" her to comply with my wishes. She can sense and understand my frame, so she wouldn't see it as me mate-guarding. If anything it increases her attraction to me in that it is a demonstration of my frame in our relationship.

In my relationship she is expected to comply 100% with my needs, and if that doesn't work for her, that is completely fine. If I can't comply with her needs, that is also completely fine. There would be simply no drama or hard feelings about it. I would wish her all the best, continue to love her as the mother of my children and my best friend for so many years, and even kindly help carry her bags to any of the seven doors in my house she prefers to leave through.

Pinging u/HornsOfApathy u/red-sfpplus u/hack3ge as this is getting buried in the thread.

[–]red-sfpplusHard Core Red1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

She IS mine, for as long as we both wish it.

She IS mine, for as long as I wish it to be.

Because lets be clear - If you are the fucking man they will do what you say.

Mandy crossed my line. Got dumped because it is what I wanted.

[–]InChargeManRed Beret1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

When you are doing it right the hardest stuff becomes the easiest. You don't control others, you control the conditions which allow others to exist within your sphere of influence.

Do you get mad that the Italian restaurant down the street doesn't serve tacos? Of course not. Why they choose what they serve is their business. All you need to worry about is which restaurants do have delicious tacos.

[–]red-sfpplusHard Core Red2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

All you need to worry about is which restaurants do have delicious tacos.

Asshole.

Now I am fucking hungry again...

[–]Tyred_Biggums0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Do you get mad that the Italian restaurant down the street doesn't serve tacos? Of course not.

There was this Mexican+Italian in one of the towns I go to in the Czech Republic. Had some kick ass fajitas.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

maybe you are spending too much time in the weeds.

Yeah, for fun. All 4 of us in this meta-discussion "get it".

For the average new guy here the intricacies are probably over his head anyway

Absolutely. To be clear - we appear to be arguing on RP sidebar/long-standing fundamentals. We're not. I think this is good. But it brings up the discussion once again of what ideologies of TRP should make it to MRP.

This thread is timely given my recent thoughts on the matter.

For me it is "She IS mine, for as long as we both wish it."

we tend to debate mate-guarding a lot.

I like this. But I know your (and my) history with the context of D/s or just general leadership/dominance so it makes sense. I think this too would probably be over the head of the average guy as he hamsters it away as mate-guarding. It's a dichotomy that confuses average guys.

I've been wrangling with how to explain things like this concept without the crutch of D/s framework for a while. We both know that's rewiring the rules (read: her hamster) and her brain using redpill and evolutionary psychology. I'll hit you up via DM if you don't mind to expand our thoughts. We can do some good here bro.

[–]InChargeManRed Beret0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Yeah, I'd be interested in collaborating on something. Interesting that you refer to D/s framework as a crutch. I see it as the legs and BP conditioning as the crutch :)

I think I get what you are saying. I guess that a big part of executing D/s is iron clad frame, so in that way I think frame is the internal locus, and D/s is the particular relationship style I prefer. I suppose if you had frame and preferred another style, even being the little s, it could still be congruent with having frame.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I suppose if you had frame and preferred another style, even being the little s, it could still be congruent with having frame.

Oooooh. Yes let's collab. I like this too. Not a traditional RP "frame".

My wife has iron clad frame as the little s, and if you asked her she'd say it's not "hard" but natural. Frame nonetheless.

But crutch I mean that with D/s it's easy to explain when using it as an example.

[–]red-sfpplusHard Core Red1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Meg Ryan said it best in "You've got Mail"

Which I fucking love to watch. Fuck off everyone. It is my #1 Chick Flick.

Fucking MASTER MANIPULATOR in that movie.

"What is that supposed to mean? I am so sick of that. All that means is that it wasn't personal to you. But it was personal to me. It's personal to a lot of people. And what's so wrong with being personal, anyway?"

[–]tom-anonymous0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

What the hell is happening? This is the 2nd time in this thread I'm nodding my head at red-sfpplus and agreeing. I guess red-sfpplus isn't such a bad guy after all when he's not talking about anal...

[–]red-sfpplusHard Core Red2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

We just had a bad first coffee date is all.

[–]InChargeManRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

To be fair, you seem very fixated on butt stuff...do you like fishsticks?

[–]gameoflibidos2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Remember, men are logical, women are emotional. Complete opposite approaches to life situations.

From a logical standpoint, what she is requesting makes no sense and is completely unreasonable and is border line IMO asking for a divorce without asking for a divorce.

From an emotional point of view, she's having poor emotions and confused and can't talk to you about why except for this ridiculous request most likely because she has almost or is already fucking someone else. This request is her inner attempt to fix the guilt and confused emotions she is having over the situation. SHE IS LITERALLY TELLING YOU THAT YOU CAN GO FUCK SOME OTHER WOMAN AND SHE'LL GET OVER IT. NO WOMAN EVER says that unless they are drowning in their own piss pool of guilt and shame.

Sorry bro.. assume it's happened, happening or going to happen. Most likely one of the 2 former ... and operate based on that assumption.

[–]Drivinga14862 points3 points  (6 children) | Copy

Read practical female physiology. Specifically chapter 4. You are being her provider/owner she is bored and she resents you dor it. You need to switch to be more her lover. She is actually asking you step the fuck up in this regard.

[–]Balls_Wellington_Main Event + Coronavirus2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

I disagree. This is the point at which she has accepted that OP can never be anything but boring and set her mind to finding someone who isn't.

[–]SepeanRed Beret0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

And if he got frame and alphaed up she'd change her opinion and set her mind to pleasing him.

Women are fickle, they don't have any permanence in their beliefs

[–]Balls_Wellington_Main Event + Coronavirus1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

No argument there. I guess my take is that it is more of a timeline issue; she is ready to find some new dick right now, not three years from now when OP has turned his shit around.

After she goes and cheats, how could OP be the exciting alpha she wants? Who can respect a guy who sits at home while she is out having sex she actually enjoys?

There's not enough time to change the ship's course.

[–]SepeanRed Beret1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yeah, probably fucked from his end too, really hard to not be disgusted with a girl who cheats.

[–]Balls_Wellington_Main Event + Coronavirus1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'd like to give OP enough credit that he won't just fetishize it and let her lock his little soldier in a cage, but I'm not confident.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This is my only saving grace... The lack of gaming her is primarily the cause of this. Probably too late but I will at least put in the effort to practice my gaming skills forvehen I'm single...

[–]SoggyTrainCucked by machines2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

So even looking at this in the best-case scenario in that she hasn't cheated, she overtly has told you she wants to fuck not just one, but numerous other men and wants you to be OK with it. That is hopeful thinking, although I'd put my money on she has already cheated, especially since she is trying to get you to cheat so she doesn't feel guilty.

Take the day off and get to the lawyer's office ASAP.

[–]KingAdo942 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

With all due respect my man, make like a basketball and bounce. Nothing good can come out of this. Being together for so long and having a family makes you want to find anyway to work through it, but deep down you know that it's time to get an exit strategy. Stay strong King.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I know what I need to do. It's been a difficult road to travel... Thanks

[–]KingAdo941 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

It will be but you've got this, keep your head up bro

[–]Over60_FireTempered3Red Beret2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

First, I have been where you are. Nuf said.

... if she goes, I will have no proof that she has cheated on me but am confident she will cross my boundaries.

In your own words, you have answered your questions.

She has told you what she wants, and why. From your experience with other people in other situations, how is this going to play out?

Knowing is not accepting. Accepting is not acting on it. Acting on something, does not guarantee your outcome. So now that you "know" you are a long way from your possible "outcomes."

If you are proactive NOW, you might have better "outcomes" later, but maybe not with her.

One more thing. I might be inclined to try distracting her with some seriously wild sex games at home. Hard for her to think about the sex you're not getting when you're getting all you can handle.

[–]wkndatbernardus2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Tell her that this "open marriage" idea is fine as long as she gets a job. Once she's employed for about a year or so, pull the trigger on the div. This trick has been brainwashed by your new liberal church and you are reaping what you've sown (living in a non or semi biblical way will lead to unhappiness). Put your "go plan" in place and GTFO before she comes up with any more bright ideas.

[–]screechhaterRed Beret2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Seriously, do you even understand frame ?

Her, she. She. She.

Ok.

[–]learning00072 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

BTW, I still remember in Tomassi's writings, is don't use red pill stuff on mentally ill women, it makes it worse. His advice is to get out as safely as you can

[–]learning00073 points4 points  (9 children) | Copy

Guy hasn't posted again, or ever posted anything redpill before, either way, not to bright. Id say go on your trip, have fun, and all you shit will be in the driveway when you get back. But my guess is this whole thing is a made up troll post

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy

Think so? It’s way too long to be a troll post.

[–]learning00070 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy

Awfully hard to be chasing cock when you have there babies at home. Not to mention, I don't think anyone is stupid enough to listen to wife's shit for more than two seconds without saying get out

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

Awfully hard to be chasing cock when you have there babies at home.

You are one naive faggot.

[–]learning00070 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Probably

[–]alleyteris2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Go check r/whereareallthegoodmen, plenty of single mothers with 2,3,4 or more kids with their "own" house.

Trust me, this subreddit will open your eyes about how ducked up dating has become

[–]tom-anonymous1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Awfully hard to be chasing cock when you have there babies at home.

Wife: Hey honey. Some friends are coming over today for a play date. Just Judy, Karen and Charles who's a stay home dad. I wouldn't worry about him, he's just like one of the girls.

Husband: Sure sweaty that sounds fine.

Wife: Here's a movie for you kids to watch. Uncle Charles and I need to go upstairs to check out the running toilet. We'll be back down in about 20 minutes...

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

20 minutes? What is he a porn star?

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Lol

[–]red-sfpplusHard Core Red4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Get an 8 ball and have some fun.

I am 40 and my gal is 44.

We still party like assholes.

You are a young boring looser.

[–]Vegasman200021 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

Do you really need MRP input on this? You know what to do you just don't want to admit it. I am not saying divorce yet, but say no, hold a boundary and tell her flat out you will not stand for it. And consult a lawyer for the inevitable. It is possible she hasn't done anything but I see it as 99% she will. And 90% she has.

Do the math and it's 1 in 1000 that you can rescue this situation, if you haven't already decided to kill the puppy.

I presume you are seeking our approval to do what needs to be done and it appears you have it, in spades. As to acting on it, good luck.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Your right, I know what has to be done. And I'm willing to do it. Just wanted to make sure I am thinking clearly and not have my actions controlled by my emotions. Thanks for the input.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Thanks for this. I intend to hold firm to my boundaries. Zero compromise. I am not looking for approval from internet strangers. Just things I maybe haven't thought of due to my judgements being clouded by emotion. It's clear what I originally thought is the right way for me to proceed.

[–]Cloudy_Pirate1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Wife is approaching the wall and wants freedom to do whatever she wants with zero consequences.

All women (and men/teens/children for that matter) would love to have the freedom to do whatever they want with zero consequences. But that is not reality.

You need to inform her what the consequences will be. And then enforce it.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

That's my plan going forward. I can't back down at this point.

[–]-Acta-Non-Verba-1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Your wife needs anti-depressants, I think. And a new social circle that does not consists of "Christians" that brag about their years of depravity.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Lol she is on antidepressants already.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Let her go to spring break, just make sure she signs the divorce and custody papers first.

[–]learning00071 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I'm so sorry about your situation, and the issue goes way beyond red pill, frame, and game. She's mentally ill, and CBT is the main treatment for borderline personality disorder. Now the most important thing in your situation is the children and yourself. Personally, I recommend going into monk mode and taking care of this shit fast, as you got a painful road ahead of you, and the kids come first. I wish you the best of luck

[–]testzxcvb2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I really like your reply. Hardly anyone else said they were sorry about this dudes situation. We can be men and still feel compassion for a fellow man whose life is circling the drain.

[–]redditguy611 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

OOPs! Looks like she fell on a cock!

[–]juliusstreicher0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Do you mind?? It was an accident! She was drunk!

[–]learning00071 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Guys, read the part were the woman is actually mentally ill. Right now, his concern should be for himself and his children.

[–]juliusstreicher1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

Update?

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I left an update on married red pill. Been gaming my wife daily since. Seems to be working. It almost feels like a giant comfort test with a sprinkling of shit tests throughout. I passed them all and held frame. She keeps saying she feels like I don't give a shit whether I leave her or not. Same comfort test over and over. Hugged her, kissed her, gamed her. Monday at 3am I woke up from her getting out of bed. I waited for a few minutes, went to see what she was up to. She was in the living room. I asked her what was up. She said she couldn't sleep. I said that sucks, neither can I, let's have sex. She giggled and said it's 3am. I said good we have lots of time before the kids get up. She giggled again and followed me to the bedroom. Rough caveman style sex with some asshole play which was new for us. She was drenched. Things have been going well since. But the stay plan is still the go plan. Lawyer says I have a good chance of full custody due to her documented diagnoses of mental illness and treatment. Scheduled vasectomy, condom till then. I don't want anymore kids but held off on the snip because she didn't know what she wanted. Booked our vacation, cutting hard to drop to 13%-15% BF for the beach. Caloric intake reduced to 1500 per day max. No booze, sugar and minimal carbs till then. Lifting 5 days a week from 3. Passed my exam for my business with flying colors. Booked my second exam for the 27th of this month. If I pass that I am giving in my 2 weeks notice and launching my business. Have intermediate job lined up already as an income buffer while I build up my business. Going to do cash jobs here and there to save up in case shit goes south with the wife. The plan is in place. Just need to be disciplined and follow through. I'll post a more detailed update when I have time. I have very little spare time at the moment. When I do, I lift.

[–]learning00070 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Keep us posted, your in the right path. I'm extremely curious how things work out in regards to the mental illness. I always hope for the best

[–]redpillparis1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I am going to assume you haven't got much going in life for you right now. A woman rarely lives a man going places and leading on all fronts. Imagine a prime Arnold getting dumped or being considered for someone else? That would never happen.

[–]go-RED-go1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

She feels like her life is boring. She feels like her sex life is boring. She feels like her husband is boring and he is with her because she is his ONLY option.

That's why she feels she's missing out on something better. Something that's "out there" in the world outside the boring repetative world she lives with you. She wants excitement and novelty.

For women grass is almost always greener on the other side, but this is expecially true if you're a boring unattractive guy with no game, not providing an array of strong feelings to her.

So she's testing the waters about boundaries and cheating with these little typical woman talks/power plays.

She wants to test 2 things: 1. What are your boundaries and how would you react if she crosses them. First talking about only flirting with guys, then only a "friendly kiss", but this is just soft entry for what she really wants and that's full animalistic dirty raw fucking and sloberry hungry cock sucking.

  1. If you are attractive enough and do you "have the balls" to hit on, seduce, attract and fuck other women, while also being ready to ditch her without looking back and restart your life. Thats why she's fantasizing about you cheating.

Yes, women can apsolutely fantasize about you cheating. They will never admit it though.

I was an onietiess blue pill beta for 15 years in each and every one of my LTR's and got this shit test in every one of them. They all cheated on me slightly before or slightly after starting this "you can find another woman or cheat on me" free pass shit test. Offcourse my blue pill ignorant self would say "no baby I would never cheat on you, you're the only one I want". So what happened? She would cheat and try to monkey branch while maintaing a "fair" relationship between 2 of us (incase if her branch breaks). Hey we're still friends, arent we? No one is a bad person here after all (when planning their actions, women always consider how bad will that make them look). So I would ghost her and find someone else. When this happened she immidiatelly wanted to get back together. Still ignorant and bluepilled, I would think this is our disney get back together love beats all reunion. We would get back together and shit would get worse in 2 weeks. That's I would go to a rage faze, ditch her for good and strip her of my oneittis, still being ignorant and blue pilled about what just happened and why "women act that way".

Today, after red pill, the first time my wife asked me about if I could ever cheat on her I framed the narrative in a cocky funny way that sends her hamster in overdrive. offcourse, talk is cheap and this is worth nothing if you dont have the real SMV to back it up. You need to demonstrate that to her - that you "could" theoretically cheat - with actions and noth with talk, the way you interact with other women infront of her. If she notices other women attraction for you, you win.

It's called dread and it's one of the most powerfull tools a man can use. But you should know that if youve read the sidebar.

Sidebar -> that way. Athol kay and Bluepill proffesors books.

Edit: You should also fuck her like the guy from Sex God Method. Christian women crave being led to dominant animalistic sex free of dogmatic inhibitions.

[–]mabden0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

>Today she told me that she feels no emotion anymore towards anything or anyone including me and the kids, doesn't know what she wants in life.

This is almost equivalent to ILYBNILWY. Translation your marriage is fucked.

>She said what she wants to do right now is plan a vacation just for herself to go to an all inclusive resort by herself during spring break to figure out what she wants. Red Pill translation: I want to go party and fuck whoever I want far enough away and with no one I know so that there is little to no risk of getting caught and risk losing what I have.

Your translation is spot on.

>Should I let her go or should I say no?

Tell her she is free do what she thinks is the right thing to do. However, so are you and if she decides to go on her fuck (or however you want to phrase this) adventure, you will have divorce papers ready for her signature when she gets back.

>Here's where my head is at... if she goes, I will have no proof that she has cheated on me but am confident she will cross my boundaries. If I say no I am not OK with that, then I am mate guarding and lose frame. What I am leaning towards is letting her go but she has to pay for the trip herself and will likely miss the spring break week, not that it matters, if she wants to cheat she will cheat regardless of what week she goes . That will also buy me some time to figure out an exit strategy. But then do I just leave her when she gets back? I have no proof she has crossed the line.

This is all hamster bullshit. She is on thin ice as is your marriage. Simple as that. Focus on your exit strategy.

>We have never been on vacation just us since the kids due to not having childcare, so 5 years. But I have been planning one at the end of February now that the kids are a bit older and no longer nursing. I just booked it. That means that 2 weeks later (assuming she gets enough money) she would be leaving to go to some resort with college kids and we all know what will happen there...

Your options, go on your vacation with her or without her or cancel altogether and use the money on lawyer fees.

Fuck dude, your wife has put you in an untenable position. Even if she backs down, you will always have this in the back of your mind and waiting for when she decides she has had enough that she is willing to walk away.

You have been maintaining frame and you need to hold the line. Your hamster is running wild (understandable) but you need to focus on your go/stay plan.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Thank you for this. It's helped a lot. I updated my post to give a bit more insight into my situation. Very much appreciated.

[–]FRedington0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Google this:
site:dalrock.wordpress.com jenny erikson

Dalrock's story of Jenny Erikson is a real eye opener. Read it to see if it looks like your life. -- If I were to speculate on what I read here, I'd say your marriage is effectively over. -- Tell your lawyer to proceed with all deliberate haste on getting you out of that marriage, complete with sole custody of your kids. You would not want your ex with your kids and a new man every weekend fucking her brains out.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Thanks for the info. I will read it as soon as I have time. I think I have a decent shot at sole custody if you read my update.

[–]InChargeManRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

If you haven't seen it, read Every unhappy woman is a rape victim

This might shed some light on this:

No matter what she does she loses. If she stays with me, she doesn't feel loved, beautiful, wanted

[–]juliusstreicher0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

If she "wants a life outside of your marriage" and "what she should have had in her early 20s" tell her to get a fucking job. It'll help you pay less alimony when she divorces you.

Eta: She's pulling this shit because she thinks you'll stand for it. And, she's right, isnt she?

[–]juliusstreicher0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

BTW: STOP BUILDING A BEDROOM FOR HER MOM.

[–]GeeTown1010 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Sounds like the thought of fucking other men has been deep rooted into mind.. Regardless of she’s done so or not..

Id say fuck her off out the door without hesitation so you can focus on your kids.. Get rid of your MIL too, unless you intend to hit that..

[–]vabab80 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Your update was removed didnt get to read it. Anything to update?

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Well things seem to be good for now. I was hamstering a bit and checked her Google time line and there was nothing suspicious. Her friend who got cheated on by her husband has been over a lot, my wife is trying to help her through it. Passed my exam, booked my final exam for the day before my wife and I leave for Florida. It's starting to seem like the whole thing was a huge comfort test. Sex has been great. She initiated 2 days in a row which I don't think has ever happened before. Tried some new kinky stuff. No starfish sex. Been hanging out with old friends we haven't seen in a while. I've been gaming her and doing a bunch of fun stuff with her. She's been in a great mood overall other than today. Hung out with some new people today and she later asked if she sounds like an idiot when she talks. She has anxiety and insecurity issues. I laughed said no and who cares what other people think. Still has some anxiety about it. Gamed her and escalated but got a hard no. Tomorrow I will reset, need to handle those interactions better. Seems like a comfort test laced with anxiety and insecurity. Starting a new week, kept it relatively clear so I can focus on studying for my upcoming exam. Then a fun vacation with my wife, turns out we booked it during spring break for a bunch of colleges so that should be fun. If I pass my exam I'm giving my 2 weeks notice. Got 2nd job lined up as a buffer so I'll still have guaranteed income while I build up my business. Hide some cash in case shit goes nuclear. That's where I'm at.

[–]Bedtimeshine0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Your rewarding youare wife for cheating on you? And guilt tripping you about not caring about her if she debt fuck other guys? You deserve this at this point.

[–]Bedtimeshine0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I’d tell her that i know in my gut there are a million things shes not telling me. And that it’s clear I’m no longer her husband in heart ( to be honest, you probably never were). That I no longer want to married to her and she free to do as she pleases. That I no longer want to discuss our marriage and that I will be filing for divorce next week and that I hope we can part amicably. And I’d wish her luck and hope that she’s found what she looking for in him. And I’d carry a voice activated recorder when in her presence for my own protection and start the 180 ( google 180 infidelity).

[–]SKRedPill0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I'll coin a term for this speech by a woman - DIDN'T LAID W ("Daddy I do not think loving another is dead wrong").

If you are married and get this message from your wife, just become dad for one second, cause well, it's true, then imagine your teenage daughter just said this, get the message and from then on don't see your wife as anything else, which by corollary means don't be her husband or lover anymore, because you already aren't. What you are hearing is retroactive hamstering.

[–]RoccoPinkman0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

If you gamed your wife daily, she wouldn’t want other men to do it for you.

If you gave her the feelz, she wouldn’t look elsewhere.

If you fucked her like a pornstar, she wouldn’t look elsewhere.

You aren’t doing any of the above, your post reads like a blue pill faggot swallowed a red pill Dictionary all the words but none of the actions, you came looking for the cheat codes, there are no cheat codes, faggot. IMO she is already cheating, sidebar, lift that’s all you can and should be doing.

[–]fannyfire2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Doesn’t matter what he does or doesn’t do. Fucking your wife good so she doesn’t leave you is a covert contract. He should fuck her like it’s his last fuck every single time for him and only him. He should do the dirtiest shit he wants because it gets him off. It doesn’t matter if she doesn’t like it.

[–]RoccoPinkman1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah, and he’s not, somebody else is.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Yup, zero gaming my wife.

It's likely too late at this point... but I'm going to do it anyway for practice.

She'll be pissed but I'll have some fun.

[–]juliusstreicher0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Make sure you wear a condom. You don't need another child with this woman; nor an STD.

[–]amalgamator0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Get that bitch in therapy.

[–]Diesel_Dragon[S] 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

She's been in therapy, on antidepressants, cognitive behavioral therapy, therapists... It's time for me to move on.

[–]learning00073 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Geez, you left that out. CBT is the main treatment for borderline personality disorder, in which case you have a huge problem, and you have my deepest sympathies. The answers to that go way beyond red pill, and now the most important thing is your kids

[–]amalgamator1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Bummer - it will all be ok someday. If she wants to blow it up, then she can. At least hold onto your self-respect.

[–]agoodcrayon-3 points-2 points  (3 children) | Copy

Raised in conservative Christian households but your post doesn’t mention your current relationship with God between you and her.

You can go to church all you want and not know God, same as her.

This is also a test or trial of Faith for each of you, not just a bad situation. You need to get to prayer QUICKLY and start attending/involved in a church that is sound in doctrine, not a prosperity gospel mega church.

The Holy Spirit and good biblical doctrine will aid in conviction and repentance.

There is only so much a man can do physically/logically where only Faith and God can change miraculously.

Grow your Faith and step up your game.

[–]learning00073 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

God helps those who help themselves

[–]Goobergus_Gubbins0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

OP, do the opposite of everything that this assclown recommends. Plent of good advice from flaired members here.

[–]agoodcrayon0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Lol I’m just adding onto what everyone else said. Just because you may not partake in Faith or believe in God doesn’t mean we shouldn’t.

The Bible is really red pilled. Everything the red pill is in regards to reality of human nature is in the Bible.

Goober

[–][deleted]  (9 children) | Copy

[deleted]

[–]SepeanRed Beret6 points7 points  (6 children) | Copy

You seem to be new here. We have standards. Read the sidebar instead of giving bad advice.

[–][deleted]  (5 children) | Copy

[deleted]

[–]SepeanRed Beret2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

You are free to stay and learn, or you can leave. But the mods here have a very low tolerance for people giving bad advice, you will get banned if you keep it up.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret[M] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

you will get banned if you keep it up.

Wish granted.

You're way too nice, u/Sepean <3

[–]SepeanRed Beret3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah, I'm in a good mood. I recently begun doing volunteer work, helping men through crisis. Had a really depressed guy who is now red, positive about the future and returning to work next week. Seeing him today being ready to get on with his life felt good.

[–]Cloudy_Pirate7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

Marriage counseling. Similar boat, fixed it for me.

Your wife also cheated on you?

And this is your dating story?

This was confusing for me for weeks since I’ve never dated an overweight person. Long story short, we fell madly in love, I no longer see fat(where before I may have had fat repulsion),

Lots of ups and downs but we did months of marriage counseling and are way stronger together for it. We’ve been married for over 3 years so far.

She’s still obese and extremely pretty, but from what I gather, any fat person that is pretty turns gorgeous when they get skinny. She is also starting college soon with the plan to be a software engineer.

I feel like in 4 years when she’s skinnier than me and has her degree, she will be way out of my league. That’s okay though, we’ll be at 7 years of marriage going strong and I imagine with continued counseling through the ups and downs, our love will be even stronger.

CLEARLY you have not read any of the books or posts on the sidebar. I'm not even sure what reality you are living in, but I promise you that it is going to come crashing down.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret[M] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

holy shit. read your history. lol... bye bye



You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

© TheRedArchive 2020. All rights reserved.

created by /u/dream-hunter