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[+][deleted] 3 years ago* (13 children) | Copy Link
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[–]WkndwhorechataFDS Apprentice128 points129 points130 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I should have never asked
This is what stood out to me too. So you can still live in your delusion? For what? It's about qualifying (vetting) a man and getting the real, hard answers. The truth shall set you free.
[–]royaldetourFDS Newbie30 points31 points32 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I read your "for what?" In Eartha Kitts voice 👑
[–]ZookeepergameMost10088 points89 points90 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
Not to use a mysoginistic phrase, but "why buy the cow when the milk is free?" Why marry a woman if she's already playing the role of wifey in your life? He's gotten the value of a wife without any of the work or costs of marriage. It's a win win from his perspective (as long as he's the type of man who doesn't value her happinesses).
If getting married is something you want to do eventually, then there needs to be boundaries that are saved for marriage. Idk what those marriages will be cause it certainly doesn't have to be sex, but there needs to be some concrete differentiation between dating and married.
He doesn't want to get married because he's gotten very comfortable with having the best of both worlds for the past 11 years, and of course.hes not going to want to change such a sweet dynamic now.
[+][deleted] 3 years ago* (7 children) | Copy Link
[–]okcool_12FDS Newbie41 points42 points43 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I would also add financial boundaries like keep your savings and checking accounts separate until marriage, do not co-sign for each other on any loans until marriage, do not invest in cars, houses, etc together until marriage. Say you break up. In some cases, depending on how the paperwork was done, you might not be entitled to anything in the case of a break-up. But on the flip side, if you co-signed on a loan and he defaults on it 2 years after yall split, you're now financially liable for that. It's essentially a lose-lose situation.
[+][deleted] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
[removed]
[–]monch-bredFDS Newbie9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
In fairness “don’t move in before marriage” is part of the fds handbook, and there’s a bit in there about how you can still analyze the things you mentioned without moving in first
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You do you. However the FDS handbook strongly advises against cohabitation.
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple36 points37 points38 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
If getting married is something you want to do eventually, then there needs to be boundaries that are saved for marriage. Idk what those boundaries will be cause it certainly doesn't have to be sex, but there needs to be some concrete differentiation between dating and married.
I just keep quoting you, you put in words exactly how I feel! There need to be boundaries. For me, those boundaries included: No buying property together until we were married. No giving his kids (we'd both been married before) or his other relatives my contact information until we were engaged. And no more long-distance visiting his family until we were engaged, because it felt weird for me to be there just as a girlfriend. These boundaries will be different for everyone. The one I highly, highly recommend to all women of all ages is: No living together before engagement. Also don't get too lovey-dovey with his family before engagement, that's just giving your heart away too much.
[–]fireforestfairyFDS Newbie6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
This. The post is sad to read. It's sad to see women becoming victims of LVM and ending up aa forever girlfriends.
[–]just-peepin-at-uFDS Newbie84 points85 points86 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Be wary of dudes who want kids before marriage.
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple38 points39 points40 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Right? I get that accidental pregnancies happen, heck that's how mine happened! But what kind of man, if he claims to love this woman and wants her to have the baby, wouldn't immediately offer marriage?
[–]cantsextihavebillsPickmeisha™️138 points139 points140 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
It's almost like you shouldn't commit to and have kids with someone before they make you feel valued and seal their obligations to you and any offspring with a legally binding document. I feel sorry for the kids. The best thing she can do now is leave him and start collecting child support. Whatever she wanted he ain't it, sis.
[–]ZookeepergameMost10045 points46 points47 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Well, technically his obligation to his kids is legally binding regardless. A marriage certificate definitely doesn't protect you from scrubs either.
I think a better way to frame it isn't that the not marrying him was a mistake, it's that being clearer on her boundaries of marriage and having higher expectations would have revealed him to be an unworthy partner a lot sooner. If you're not ready to get married, you're not ready to coparent. And if you are ready to coparent, then you should get married. And if you don't want to get married, then you should break up and be a single mom.
I just feel like an accidental pregnancy is a very decisive moment of choosing your future, and I don't understand how she just fell into this mess. The culture around prolife and casual impregnation is so toxic. There are so many women who flat out shouldn't be having kids and you mention is to them and they act like you suggested putting puppies into a blender. And it leads to so much reproductive coercion (which honestly is the vibe I get here. He asked her to get married, she said no, and coincidentally he locks her down with a few kids and no longer has interest in marriage? Sounds like an abuser who no longer needs marriage as a tool of controlling her)
[–]cantsextihavebillsPickmeisha™️17 points18 points19 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I may have phrased that in a weird way, but I meant basically what you said- if he isn't ready to sign a document saying that he is legally responsible for taking care of you and any kids yall have then you shouldn't be with him & you definitely shouldn't procreate with him.
Not that marriage is some magical establishment that protects you from all ills of the world, and not that people can't change after the wedding is over- it just says a lot about how committed a man really is to you. And if the woman doesn't want to get married that's fine, but she probably isn't ready to have children either. One is reversible, one is not.
I agree with your assessment regarding the reproductive coercion. Sounds 100% right.
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple16 points17 points18 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
And if the woman doesn't want to get married that's fine, but she probably isn't ready to have children either.
I would add to this, she isn't ready to cohabitate either. She should have kept this to a strictly dating relationship until she was ready to commit; or else broken up with him.
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple13 points14 points15 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Well, technically his obligation to his kids is legally binding regardless.
Thank you for this. I see this misinformation on FDS quite regularly, this notion that children born "in wedlock" somehow have more rights than children born "out of wedlock." That's not the case anymore in most of the Anglosphere. I'm sure there are exceptions around the world but for most people writing into Reddit, their children will get the same Child Support whether or not their deadbeat father married their mother or not.
If you're not ready to get married, you're not ready to coparent. And if you are ready to coparent, then you should get married. And if you don't want to get married, then you should break up and be a single mom.
This, exactly. This should be in the Handbook actually.
[–][deleted] 63 points64 points65 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
He is not committed and wants to have the ability to walk away at any moment despite having children with her. That's all she needs to know. I feel bad fir kids because they are growing up knowing that their dad sees them as a temporary family and their mom is a temporary woman not worthy of a marriage certificate.
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple-4 points-3 points-2 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Honestly, having known many, many families like this, it's entirely possible that this guy is no more and no less committed to this woman and his kids, than the average married guy is. He may very well think of this OP as his life partner, he's got no plans to leave, he can't imagine life without her. He probably loves his kids as much as he would if he was married (which, for many LV men, is not that much). Many, many married men treat their wives and children as "temporary families." I agree that it's much more high-value to be married, to have been willing to make those arrangements and stand up in public and make public vows. But I kind of doubt that the reason this guy hasn't married her is because he's been planning for years to walk away. The more likely reason is just sheer inertia.
[–][deleted] 27 points28 points29 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You can't blame it on inertia when she had actually ask him and he said NO. This is not inertia, this is him not wanting to be officially committed so he can have an easy out.
[–]SarcasmSlideFDS Disciple5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
No. Just no on all of that.
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple-2 points-1 points0 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Ok
[–]thinktwiceorelseFDS Newbie72 points73 points74 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Now she knows what a POS she's been dating for 11 years.
[–]ChocolateBiscuit96FDS Newbie27 points28 points29 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Ain’t no man and I mean NO MAN will ever be knocking me up unless I have a ring 💍 on my finger. And I will get the ring appraised bc I am not playing. I will never be a gf of more than 3-3.5 years, which is being generous imo
[–]dollymyfollyFDS Newbie47 points48 points49 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
He probably asked her early knowing she wasn’t ready and knowing she’d say no so he didn’t have to marry her and didn’t have to be the bad guy
[–]aellopeFDS Newbie44 points45 points46 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Alternate explanation: he's still butthurt about her rejecting his proposal and wants to make her "pay" for it by never marrying her.
[–]ZookeepergameMost10030 points31 points32 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Alternate alternate explanation: he wanted to lock her down with marriage, but when she said no he decided to just get her pregnant instead. Now that he already has something to tie them together that makes it harder for her to leave him, he really doesn't have a need for marriage.
Both marriage and reproductive abuse are common tools abusers like to have to control a person. Just saying
[–]dollymyfollyFDS Newbie12 points13 points14 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Ugh, both gross. Why are trash men so predictable?
[–]hotmailnerdFDS Newbie4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
That's exactly what I thought too.
[–]-badmadAMFDS Apprentice8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
If anyone acts that petty they should be kicked out right now. There is no reason for a grown- ass man to act so childish, if he hasn't got some huge ego- issues, in which case he should fuck off and best go to therapy and not enter any relationship until he has his sht together. Unfortunately there are too many LVM like that out in the world.
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yikes. It's good she knows where she stands though. I hope she sees what she needs to do now.
[–][deleted] 12 points13 points14 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Why do guys look shocked when you tell them you’d abandon the kids if they tried making you a single mom. CF.
[–]daisy_0720FDS Disciple4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Why would he marry her? She's already given him wife benefits without him needing to make any commitment.
[–]Magnolia_MirageFDS Newbie4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
😬
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[+][deleted] (13 children) | Copy Link
[deleted]
[–]WkndwhorechataFDS Apprentice128 points129 points130 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]royaldetourFDS Newbie30 points31 points32 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]ZookeepergameMost10088 points89 points90 points (9 children) | Copy Link
[+][deleted] (7 children) | Copy Link
[deleted]
[–]okcool_12FDS Newbie41 points42 points43 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[+][deleted] (4 children) | Copy Link
[removed]
[–]monch-bredFDS Newbie9 points10 points11 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple5 points6 points7 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple36 points37 points38 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]fireforestfairyFDS Newbie6 points7 points8 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]just-peepin-at-uFDS Newbie84 points85 points86 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple38 points39 points40 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]cantsextihavebillsPickmeisha™️138 points139 points140 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]ZookeepergameMost10045 points46 points47 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]cantsextihavebillsPickmeisha™️17 points18 points19 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple16 points17 points18 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple13 points14 points15 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 63 points64 points65 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple-4 points-3 points-2 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 27 points28 points29 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]SarcasmSlideFDS Disciple5 points6 points7 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple-2 points-1 points0 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]thinktwiceorelseFDS Newbie72 points73 points74 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]ChocolateBiscuit96FDS Newbie27 points28 points29 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]dollymyfollyFDS Newbie47 points48 points49 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]aellopeFDS Newbie44 points45 points46 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]ZookeepergameMost10030 points31 points32 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]dollymyfollyFDS Newbie12 points13 points14 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]hotmailnerdFDS Newbie4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]-badmadAMFDS Apprentice8 points9 points10 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Summerisle7FDS Disciple7 points8 points9 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 12 points13 points14 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]daisy_0720FDS Disciple4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Magnolia_MirageFDS Newbie4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link