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A real shitty situation - on being magnanimous in victory

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February 29, 2020

I have been separated from my ex and the mother of my kids for 3 years

The separation wasn’t friendly. For a while prior to it, there has been violence from her including breaking stuff and physical violence, the beginning of some branch swinging, all be it over-hopeful and nothing really concrete. I have been a drunk captain for a while before all this and missed obvious shitty comfort and shit tests and just wasn’t a high value male. I worked on myself for 2 years and forged way ahead in life and she never really caught up and age was showing on her whilst I was getting easy young interest.

In the end, she drunk the feminist cool aid wholesale and truly believed she can get divorce, get the house, maintenance, money, keep the kids and get me out of their life. And I got sick of her.

And so she set about implementing the whole pretty much feminist playbook: I started sleeping with plates, often overnight, and after a few weeks I was blind sided with accusations of truly vile stuff, police was involved, and I was truly staring into the abyss: lost it all, possible charges, investigations, and all the shit. Restraining orders and the whole nine yards. Dark times.

Enter stoicism and a poker face. For a while I was homeless sleeping with various plates who were very happy to have me. I sat down set about my plan for the next 2 years. Was super careful with communication and left no room for doubt whatsoever. No direct communication at all. Everything recorded. I had an iron frame, understood what I could and stuck to my goals like my life depended on them (and it literally did, sink or swim). Pressed for the financial settlement which wasn’t so bad - some asset swaps in her favour (70%/30%). No spouse maintenance, child maintenance very manageable and less than half what she was hoping for, although still quite generous. All the investigations and charges fell through - the courts saw through it all and had some real harsh words for her behaviour. Regular generous contact with the kids - we have some truly wonderful time and they won’t get enough of me.

Got a new place, I have elevated one of the plates to live with me - a wonderful feminine 8/10 who helps me in my mission, 100% in my frame, and is wonderful to the children and they love her, proved herself well and beyond for over a year and doesn’t inquire too much about my other plates (don’t ask don’t tell) and I made it clear to her if she is good with me I’ll take care of her.

It’s truly amazing what three years can bring about. Coming back from the very bottom I’ve seen all the shit and nothing fazes me any more. A strong frame carries everywhere. I rebuilt my life, my net worth is recovered and is nearly twice as much (although this past week I lost over 40k thanks corona virus). I earn two times as much, I spend every other weekend travelling around, regular gym goer with an excellent physique.

Throughout all this I know that she’s been miserable. We all know the feminist lie - life has been truly unkind to her. She’s ageing fast, nobody of any real value wants to stick with a post wall with kids, she has now discovered what it means to have to take care of bills, and a mortgage, and job security, and all that shit. She’s not been able to get anybody since. She can barely hold herself above water.

Recently, I went back to court because I wanted to take the kids overseas for holidays and she refused. I put my case, she put hers.

She got so destroyed in court it wasn’t funny. I felt embarrassed for her at times. Queue really silly arguments like “he wants to replace me as a mother with the other woman!”, “he was too much of a party boy 20 years ago and therefore he’s unreliable!”, and, “his family are all evil because they don’t like me”… and other shit.

At some point she made the mistake of saying she is about to move for this partner she supposedly got and was talking about for a few weeks. After being pressed, turns out said partner has never been met in real life - some online thing, the judge told her to not talk about hypothetical situations and to not treat such moves lightly because they may affect the kids. She basically got told don’t be too hopeful. It was ugly embarrassing. In court she asked whether I care for her and whether I would object to her getting a partner. I truthfully told the court that “It would be wonderful for to find someone she loves, I think it’s a good thing and everyone should have this feeling in their life”. Seemed to have killed her.

The judge verbally slapped the shit out of her. I got what I wanted, and got more! She now needs to send me regular updates about the state of the kids. She now needs to bring the kids to me for visitation rather than me having to do the trips. The judge saw my commitment, all the steps I’ve been doing to try and reconcile and engage with her reasonably, her unreasonable behaviour that is fuelled by all the feminist “you can take it all” shit, saw through it all and handed down the judgement.

She broke down in court, it was ugly. Hysterics, crying, “this is not justice”. Literally telling the judge she won’t comply. “I have so much stress in my life I can’t have more, please no, blablabla”. She got told to be careful what she says next or else she’ll be having it far worse. She followed me outside and hurled a wave of verbal abuse at me, how I must be enjoying fucking ‘those sluts’ every day, and how she has friends she will rely on them to get at me (a clear threat) blablabla. Textbook female hamster. A good reminder why I fucking couldn’t stand her all those years.

I felt sorry for her. I’m way beyond anger and resentment. I don’t want to give her the wrong idea that what what she’s doing or what she was doing was right, but…

This is a woman who needs help, who needs direction in life. I wouldn’t give two shits if it wasn’t for the kids. And while at first I was indifferent to her demise, and dare I say at times gleeful, shit is not funny anymore - I don’t want the mother of my children to be like this - because she affects them. They are with her more than they are with me, and while they learnt how to deal with (guys - kids have amazing frame, honestly), her stress and demeanour it will continue to be a drag on them.

Granted, I’ve been more on the side of asshole than not to her. I want to course correct. I want to find ways to help, be comforting even. She so hates me and she sees as the ultimate asshole. She has never been able to emotionally open up to anyone. She alienated all of her friends, her mother even with whom she has a really shitty relationship.

Her comfort tests are so shitty, I only realise them a few months after the fact. A few months ago she sent me this note saying that “I am such as an asshole with so much money, and she’s such a good mother she has decided to start working reduced hoursm look at my sacrifice!”. It was really a shitty cry for help.

She sent an email after this court ordeal that could be interpreted as wanting to move forward. I want to show some comfort and show I can help without being beta. Perhaps being lenient with the trips. Offering an olive branch perhaps.

A come home to Jesus of sorts. Don’t get me wrong I don’t want to open the chequebook. I want to do this without giving false hope, without appearing weak. Historically, I burnt her so badly she doesn’t want to open up or appear weak in anyway. She’s allergic to looking like I gave her something. She would take any concession from me as a great feminist “strong woman” victory and rub it in my face.

Some advice here is welcome from you guys. I want to see how you would handle this situation. How you are handling these situations - where you are permanently the evil guy because all the feminist promises fell through, but you’re hooked by having shared kids that you both need to take care of.

EDIT: update posted in response to the top comment

Post Information
Title A real shitty situation - on being magnanimous in victory
Author brattykids123
Upvotes 24
Comments 50
Date 29 February 2020 03:37 PM UTC (9 months ago)
Subreddit askMRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/341591
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/fbe6i4/a_real_shitty_situation_on_being_magnanimous_in/
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betabranch swingingframehamsterplateshit testcomfort testfeminist

[–]screechhaterRed Beret33 points34 points  (2 children) | Copy

Apparently an entitled, elitist, feminist that would have you paying maint if she could, while you eat Alpo in a studio apt.

Don’t kid yourself she would crush you, and she tried for her own gain.

You owe her nothing. She is doing this shit to herself.

What you write and ask opinionated advice is admirable, but don’t kid yourself, she would stab you in the front in a moment, and not think twice, and yes that was your cock in her that got her pregnant twice.

Not everyone gets a second chance, so dong fucking blow it especially on this cunt.

You need a fucking reality check, if you are really not taking in what a judge in a court of law told her.

[–]brattykids123[S] 3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

I sat on the fence since posting this thread, and kept zero communication still.

There seems to be two camps in the responses. There certainly seems to be a lot of anger and I often wonder sometimes whether some of the members of this board are stuck in there

In any case, this morning she called 10 times or so, I did not respond. Then I received a long diatribe from the bitch, once again insulting me and my ‘sluts’, a long nonsensical rant, and threatening once again to use the the courts (who just slapped the shit out of her)

Well I’m in self defence mode now, so fuck the bitch, I’m going to obtain video of her verbally assaulting me and following me outside court, the email, and throwing some more money on the lawyer to do some magic

Once a shitstain always a shitstain

[–]FFDGTDS3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

FYI, she consented to having her voice recorded on your answering machine (she knew she was being recorded). Any threats, or whatever incoherent ramblings that are left on your machine are, in most jurisdictions, admissible in court.

[–]Tyred_Biggums12 points13 points  (2 children) | Copy

There are a ton of she and her statements in this write-up. That's a red flag for us. You're thinking too much about this woman. You cannot fix her. You cannot help her.

I recommend you read 48 laws of power. You need to put your ego aside and play the long game.

Anyhow, your situation has A LOT of parallels with mine. Some questions you need to consider:

  • Why do you feel the need to help this woman?
  • Does helping her serve your mission or goals? How?
  • How is she affecting your kids? Is this worth attempting for greater custody?
  • Is she actually a bad mother or are you projecting?
  • Are the kids at any risk?
  • Are your kids in therapy? Do they need to be?

where you are permanently the evil guy

Who the fuck cares if she thinks you're the evil guy?

but you’re hooked by having shared kids that you both need to take care of.

The burden falls on you - so what? You're a man and you can take it. Be the best father you can possibly be to your kids. Show them what stable, healthy mental models look like. You cannot get into the thinking of "what is going on when the kids are at the ex's". UNLESS they're at a legitimate risk. It sucks to see - but that's reality for you.

[–]brattykids123[S] 5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

All good points.

The reality is, short of being a drugged whore the courts won’t change custody. And between that and a normal life is a whole spectrum of badness. If the behaviour and the mental state I have seen in court is any indication it explains a lot how the kids behave when I get them - moody, down, it takes us a good few hours to cheer them up.

I have been in that situation - being at the mercy of a moody emotional volatile mother and I don’t want that for my kids. That’s not too much to ask for.

It also makes my life difficult - the animosity means less flexibility with contact, with trips, etc. I would value that flexibility, particularly for my mission. Right now we have a contact calendar that I can’t deviate from, as generous as it is.

I don’t know I have to reflect about all the she’s and hers. It’s a valid point - I think I have to recognise when it is coming from a loss of frame, or a well placed concern for my kids. Perhaps I’m dangerously close to the boundaries. I don’t know.

[–]Tyred_Biggums6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

I know you love your kids. I do too. But the best thing for them is for you to lead by example.

You can’t change your ex - so stop worrying about it. And you can’t influence what she does when the kids are around them.

Stop trying to “cheer up” the kids. Emphasize with them - give them the opportunity to open up. They may or may not. But that’s your gift to them - being available for when they want to.

“Hey, I noticed you’re a bit quiet today, everything ok?”

On the animosity front - you’re angry at her. I can feel it in your writing. Figure out why... and let that go. I’m a little over two months separation - and yeah there’s a lot of crap. But that’s on you to deal with yourself - why are you concerned by things out of your control is the question you MUST ask yourself.

[–]resolutions31613 points14 points  (0 children) | Copy

What she needs is to develop her own resourcefulness.

You’d ant ever do that for her, and helping hurts her chances.

Stay neutral. Live your life and lead your kids by example.

The end.

[–]BobbyPeruRed Beret9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

She ... blah blah blah

Her blah blah blah

Damn, you need to move on form caring so much about her... even your victory comments sound like you are stuck on her.

[–]Balls_Wellington_Main Event + Coronavirus5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Kids really do complicate everything.

I've not been through a separation, but I've had to work projects with people that absolutely hated me. My go-to in that situation is to force us into situations where we have to cooperate. I'll make it so we have to give a project pitch or summary together. Cooperation kills bitterness, as long as the other party doesnt feel their autonomy is being taken from them.

The trick is to force interactions on equal footing. If you let them take the lead, obviously that is counterproductive; if you are in control it just breeds more bitterness.

Obviously your situation has much deeper emotions involved, but I wonder if teaming up for sports or school events could have a similar effect.

[–]khalabrakis5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Stop complaining about winning super hard. If she didn't want to be in her position she would've done something to win.

[–]SelectAirline5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

She would take any concession from me as a great feminist “strong woman” victory and rub it in my face.

Who cares? If your motivation was actually about the kids, then why do you give a fuck how your shitty ex reacts to it?

It sounds like you've come a long way in rebuilding your life, but at least on this issue you're still lying to yourself.

[–]NeoTheJuanDJ2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

She is making you out to be the bad man because her game plan did not work. She’s reaching for footholds as she falls. Anything that sticks. For women, reputation is everything. In her solipsism, she thinks that since reputation is everything to her, it must be for everyone too. So she tries to go for the real gut-shot, and attacks your reputation. This will only effect you if you let it. Its a woman’s game. It’s all ego. Doesn’t matter.

Continue on, chase your mission, develop your relationship with and protect the kids, and unless there is a risk to the kids, let the courts handle it. They are already giving her less than she expected/ planned to receive in almost every category possible (custody, financial incentives, etc). And if you can handle the fallout right now, in a few months when you really get some momentum in multiple areas of your life and self improve, this whole thing will be a thing of the past. Her game plan is not working, and she’s processing her frustration in live time, which comes out in verbal and emotional diarrhea and reputation attacks. Also, her behaviour indicates her level of stability. Minimal at best. Continue on, she lost where she could have truly won (in court and with the kids). The rest is yours to gain (healthy relationship with kids, cutting this bitch out, get finances and career in check, lift, spin plates and develop abundance, move on, etc). With time you’ll laugh at this whole thing, pain in the ass? Sure, but only temporary.

[–]tspitsatgp1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I get the desire to help the ex (because the kids spend substantial time with her) who is clearly struggling with what she hath wrought but it’s a fools errand.

And magnanimous victory? You don’t actually think there’s a finish line do you? I mean there is, but it’s when you are dead.

[–]Big_Daddy_PDX1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Careful of the covert contracts here - “if I’m nice to her, she’ll be nice and give me what I want”

You need to start living your life and making plans within the boundaries of your current parenting arrangement.

[–]hack3geRed Beret4 points5 points  (31 children) | Copy

Holy shit faggot - 3 years and you still are balls deep in her frame.

All your “changes” are bullshit - you have no frame and have been LARPing this whole time.

Getting a plate to act right and think you are alpha is easy mode - you are gonna wife her up and she’s going to do the exact same as your ex.

You haven’t done any real work in 3 years - fuck.

[–]Maximus_Valerius5 points6 points  (20 children) | Copy

Let’s see, if we take his post at face value, in the past three years, he’s gone from being zeroed out to becoming a playa with game, money and muscle. Plus he’s been killing it in the courtroom. Sounds like he’s done some real work to set himself up for success.

Yeah, he’s got a flawed “captain save-an-ex” mental model, but that’s something he can fix with a little introspection and work.

[–]IWantToHelpSometimes2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

"captain save-an-ex'

This is the hardest obstacle to overcome by losers that have little to no self respect for themselves.

[–]hack3geRed Beret1 point2 points  (18 children) | Copy

You are only looking at the surface - you see a guy who appears to have his shit together and made progress but his actions and words betray this.

Money and muscle and game are all well and good but if you still live in everyone else’s frame you are still a giant faggot.

He’s dancing like a good little monkey for everyone else - my guess is the fact that you don’t recognize this means you are too.

[–]Chump_No_More0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Spot on.

He’s dancing like a good little monkey for everyone else

Classic Nice Guy Syndrome. "As long as I'm perfect, everybody will love me."

This will continue to hold the OP back and ultimately end him if he doesn't address it.

[–]Maximus_Valerius0 points1 point  (16 children) | Copy

my guess is the fact that you don’t recognize this means you are too.

That’s an ad hominem argument.

Why not add value and describe how he’s done no “real work”?

He’s done some real work, but he has a few blind spots:

—faulty captain save-an-ex mental model

—blames feminism for problems with his ex and work relationships

—posts on askMRP and askTRP instead of OYS

—insecure about his frame

—ignores advice about his underlying issues, and instead focuses on getting an answer to his explicit question

A few good things:

—he is not easily triggered by insults or perceived slights, so he has some measure of frame

—he went from being zeroed out to some level of success in three years

—shows an ability to focus on problems and and solve them to get what he wants (e.g., divorce court victories)

—he’s got abundance mentality (due to money, muscles and game)

—based on his comment history (as opposed to his post history), he has added value, so he’s not a value leach.

He’s not perfect but he has done some real work.

[–]hack3geRed Beret3 points4 points  (10 children) | Copy

Literally none of that shit means anything when not done in your own frame.

The fact you don’t see the issue shows how little you understand and how much work you still have to do. It’s a giant neon sign that says “I’m a giant faggot living in everyone else’s frame.”

You may actually be more of a faggot than OP.

[–]Maximus_Valerius-1 points0 points  (9 children) | Copy

I might be. I’m not spinning multiple plates, so he’s got that on me.

Men with no frame and the things they do. There’s a great post about that on the main sub. Have you read it?

[–]hack3geRed Beret1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy

Perhaps you should read it - I live my life in my own frame I don’t need someone to explain frame to me.

[–]brattykids123[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Cool it, kids

[–]hack3geRed Beret1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Look it’s the second member of the faggot brigade joining in - you two having some sort of circle jerk about how much progress you guys have made?

[–]brattykids123[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy


[–]Maximus_Valerius-1 points0 points  (4 children) | Copy

Perhaps you should read it - I live my life in my own frame I don’t need someone to explain frame to me.

u/hack3ge, you know what this means, don’t you?

It means you are insecure.

Men that have frame don’t need to say it. Just like the bodybuilder at the gym doesn’t need to tell you he’s yoked.

When a guy has to tell you about a thing, he’s insecure about that thing.

I’ve already read WNS’s post about men with no frame. It describes how you acted in this thread.

You followed his script line by line. I made a statement that jarred your butthurt. If you had frame and disagreed with me, you would have ignored me. Or found it amusing.

But you didn’t do that. Instead, you went straight for the jugular, and attempted to insult my progress and understanding. (Which is another insecurity you have, but I digress.)

When I described exactly how you were wrong, instead of responding with facts, you dismissed them and doubled down on your attempted insult.

Then I asked whether you had read WNS’s post (which I’m sure you have); your come back was a failed pressure flip.

I live my life in my own frame

You’re bullshitting yourself.

All your insults are thinly veiled attempts to cover up your weak frame. For as long as you’ve been here, you should be ashamed of yourself for pulling this ego protection bullshit.

[–]hack3geRed Beret1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

Where exactly was I butthurt?

I could care less what you say about me but it’s cute you think you upset me.

Zero fucks given nice try.

[–]Maximus_Valerius-1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy

Take it as a sober second opinion. I could be wrong and you have a rock solid frame. If that’s the case, good on you.

[–]Chump_No_More0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

That’s an ad hominem argument.

I don't think it means what you think it means.

The fact that you're not recognizing in the OP's behavior what many do, most notably, Nice Guy Syndrome, it's a fair inference that you're lacking in understanding and self awareness.

Have you read the book?

[–]hack3geRed Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

It’s his autobiography...

[–]Maximus_Valerius1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I don't think it means what you think it means.

I think it’s Latin for “ego protection caused by insecurity about one’s own frame.” What do you think it means?

BTW, what is “self awareness”? Asking for a friend.

[–]Chump_No_More0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Thanks for proving my point.

[–]Maximus_Valerius0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

No problem.

Although I’m glad to have validated you by proving your point, you might want to consider working on self-validation. You know, not looking to others to validate your points, views, self-worth, etc.

There’s a book on the sidebar called No More Mr. Nice Guy by Dr. Robert Glover. You may want to read it.

And when you find out what “self awareness” means, please come back and give us a field report.

[–]tspitsatgp-1 points0 points  (9 children) | Copy

...and later he’s going to post something about how the feminists got to his upgraded plate/future wife and rah rah rah rinse repeat, just so he can blame something external for this inability to see the way things work.

[–]redirectedfs1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy

I’m curious why people downvoted you and /u/hack3ge. Are the majority of readers on askmrp still plugged in? Can they not see through this guy?

[–]tspitsatgp2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

Meh, I suspect most readers are larping. OP has certainly improved his situation and kudos to him for that, but his post and save a ho ex question indicate that he’s just playing a role using a script he found online rather than being his own man (i.e one that can work out the fucking answer himself).

[–]hack3geRed Beret1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I don’t give kudos to faggots who actually haven’t done any real work.

Making money is a joke, lifting is easy and gaming chicks is probably the easiest of the three.

The only real work done in RP is around frame and mental point of origin - the rest of it is just things we tell guys to do to help with that transition because frame can’t be taught it is earned.

[–]tspitsatgp0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

All true, but I don’t give two fucks if guys fail to make that final leap of realisation - my save a bro complex only extends so far. Sink or swim.

[–]Chump_No_More0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The only real work done in RP is around frame and mental point of origin - the rest of it is just things we tell guys to do to help with that transition because frame can’t be taught it is earned.

Preach it, brother.

[–]HornsOfApathyMod / Red Beret2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

They generally downvote because they read it - see truth in it against their own ego and situations - dont want to admit it - and flick it away with a mouse click like a faggot.

[–]hack3geRed Beret2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

Almost everyone here is LARPing - there’s only a handful that have actually made real changes. That’s the dirty little secret no one wants to talk about here - most guys stop half way and think they made it because their wife drips them duty sex a few more times a week.

You have to be willing to burn everything to the ground and rebuild and most men can’t handle the discomfort that comes with that.

The question always comes down to how far are you willing to go to get the life you want - your answer will tell you all you need to know.

[–]redirectedfs0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

You have to be willing to burn everything to the ground and rebuild and most men can’t handle the discomfort that comes with that.

Why can some men burn it down and others can't? Is it ego? Can a mans ego be strong enough to keep him in the matrix after he gets a glimpse of the code?

[–]hack3geRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

100% ego is one of the biggest things but it comes down to how well you deal with discomfort.

Everything I’ve done has been extremely uncomfortable - started MMA/BJJ, liquidated my savings to start a real estate business, dealt with a women who slung accusations, assaulted me and threatened to kidnap my kids.

None of that shit mattered because I knew what I wanted and was willing to do anything it took to get it.

[–]youngscott180 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

It sounds like your ego is feasting on the high of your success and her life having gone to shit. You didn't just state the facts of the situation here - you revel in her misery. She still has power over you. That's the issue I see.

If her fortunes were better - she was in incredible shape, had remarried a tall, handsome man with a big dick who your kids called dad and liked more than you - I think you'd be a jealous, insecure mess.

Beyond the practicalities of raising your kids, she doesn't matter. Ask yourself why you allow her to occupy your thoughts and affect your mood. That's your next opportunity for growth.

[–]brattykids123[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yes... there is truth in that her misery has provided a sense of validation and triumphism, whilst I've been boned by the process and revelled in overcoming the injustice that's been laid upon me, it's time to truly let go.

[–]friendandadvisor0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Let sleeping dogs lie.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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