When do the lines begin to blur in Christianity?

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April 2, 2020
1 upvotes

I see many comments stating “I’m a practicing Catholic” or “I got baptized and pray 4 times a day” amongst other things.

This bothers me. Not because I think they’re wrong in doing those things. But because I think many people do those things based on how they were raised or possibly out of fear to be casted out of their social group or relationship.

Biblically, Christians are not to follow God using Mosaic law or the old covenant since it is not 100% a work based Faith. And that was the whole point of of Jesus dying for our sins.

We all have our journey and how God reaches us is up to Him.

It worries me because some people are not truly saved. They do not know the difference between Religion/Churchianity/Denominations.

To have a relationship with God versus a check mark showing up to Church or Communion and then returning to their regular lives the next day.

I am not saying these things with an elitist mindset. I would actually like to see people know God and make Him known and see this sub be a light in this world.

I’ve noticed an influx with newcomers on /RPChristians and the quality has definitely gotten lower, which is to be expected. Hopefully, people will wake up and receive God unto their hearts and the quality posts keep on coming.

Besides the RP posts on becoming a man, I believe, it’s more important to become a true Man of God and to know Him.


Post Information
Title When do the lines begin to blur in Christianity?
Author agoodcrayon
Upvotes 1
Comments 19
Date 02 April 2020 12:44 AM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit askRPC
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/359584
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/askRPC/comments/ftcgci/when_do_the_lines_begin_to_blur_in_christianity/
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Comments

[–]Deep_Strength6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy

It worries me because some people are not truly saved. They do not know the difference between Religion/Churchianity/Denominations.

If you notice it, speak up about it. Chuck is usually pretty good at presenting the gospel when these come up, but even he can miss some.

I’ve noticed an influx with newcomers on /RPChristians and the quality has definitely gotten lower, which is to be expected. Hopefully, people will wake up and receive God unto their hearts and the quality posts keep on coming.

Agreed, which is why we have the flair system (mods and endorsed I think?) so that people know who may have a more experienced or mature Christian opinion.

If you see some things that are off, which can often be the case as many come over with only the secular RP mindset then make sure to comment with what the Bible says about that topic.

[–]Red-Curious1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I endorse this.

[–]UpTanks3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

Besides the RP posts on becoming a man, I believe, it’s more important to become a true Man of God and to know Him.

These two things are not separate from each other, and this is exactly the type of thinking that has gotten me and so many other Christian men bogged down for years!!

The "RP" posts on 'being a man' are merely an explanation in application of what it looks like to be a 'Man of God'. The problem is that the Churches really fudged discipleship, which is where most application teaching is supposed to take place: man to man, father to son.

Many churches have compartmentalized what they think being a man of God looks like, and then they use that image to bash men who are sticking to what God told them to be! Its ironic, churches obsessed with following the word being no more followers of their imagination than humanists. They are not following God, they are following their unbiblical frame.

And we see the consequences of this through shrinking Church attendance, increasing divorce, increasing porn use, increasing crime, fatherless homes etc etc etc.

[–]agoodcrayon[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Good word. The average Christian man is being fed incorrectly. But also, it is their own fault if they do not seek Gods face.

I believe God definitely reveals to those that ask and does not spare wisdom when one asks for such a thing.

[–]Red-Curious0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

/u/UpTanks is spot on. His second paragraph is pure gold. That's a great summation of my thoughts on these issues.

[–]Continuous-Metanoia3 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy

Biblically, Christians are not to follow God using Mosaic law or the old covenant since it is not 100% a work based Faith.

I think you might be viewing the purpose of the Mosaic law incorrectly. The law was never meant to be used as a "work based faith" in the Old Covenant Scriptures. -- Incidentally, that's exactly how the Pharisees viewed the law, ergo Jesus corrected their thinking.

The law is a tool that can be used to point us towards Messiah. A measuring stick if you will.

"How am I doing on the 1st commandment?...Wow really not a good week. I can see plenty of idols I've been worshipping before God. Thank God there is no condemnation for me because I am in Christ. But God is calling me to obey this 'Mosaic law' so that I might become more like his His Son."

We don't use the Mosaic law as a means of Justification(through faith), but rather Sanctification(through following God and his commands).

[–]rocknrollchuck2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

This is a good word.

[–]Red-Curious1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

I would argue that Mosaic law isn't meant for sanctification either. But I get and agree with your underlying point about the way it was never intended to be used.

[–]Continuous-Metanoia0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Perhaps I should take my foot off the gas pedal a little. I can see where you're coming from and I think the argument for the use of the Mosaic law is a bit more nuanced than what I wrote.

To clarify, when I say that we use the Mosaic law for sanctification, I mean that it is the Spirit who sanctifies us and the moral principles embodied in the Mosaic law is the goal of a Spirit-directed life.

Hence why 9 of the 10 commandments have been carried over and are part of the law of the Spirit of life in Christ. (Rom. 8:2). Some new commands and guidelines are added. (Eph. 4:11; 1 Tim. 3:1; 4:4), and others have been revised, as in the case of capital punishment. (Rom. 13:4).

[–]Red-Curious1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

So what would be your take on this post a buddy of mine wrote on r/TrueChristian? https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueChristian/comments/f8vuke/is_this_a_sin_is_that_a_sin_not_the_right/

I'm 100% on board with what he said there.

[–]Continuous-Metanoia1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

That's a solid resource, especially on the divisions of the law. Never seen an argument against that. Thank you for the link.

From my understanding, this was the basic premise of that post -- "Do all things through faith. Anything not done is faith is sin" <--I agree! "Therefore, we don't need the law, all we need is faith" <-- a bit tougher to swallow.

I guess my only question is what do we do with the law? Do we just let it sit in Deuteronomy, and skip over it in our reading plans? It seems to me that the writers of the Tanakh had a love for God's law, not only because it was a reflection of God's eternal, perfect nature and therefore revealed His character, but it also stirred them on to become more like Him. (i.e. Sanctified/Christ-like).

Joshua 1:8 -- This Book of the Law shall not depart from your mouth, but you shall meditate on it day and night

Psalm 119:15 -- I will meditate on your precepts and fix my eyes on your ways.

Psalm 1:2 -- But his delight is in the law of the Lord, and on his law he meditates day and night.

Psalm 119:48 -- I will lift up my hands toward your commandments, which I love, and I will meditate on your statutes.

I can't speak for you, but at least in my own experience, when I am being led by the Spirit through faith, it is corroborated in his word. Actually, reflecting back, He speaks to me through his word. And I can hear Him most clearly when He is speaking His commands to me. ("Go therefore and make disciples" has been very poignant recently.) Suffice it to say, following His commands produces Christ-likeness in me because Christ is the embodiment of Torah. ("The word became flesh").

The pendulum has the potential to swing very hard either way on this one: judaizers vs. lawlessness. A healthy middle is one where we meditate upon the law and follow the Spirit who speaks to us through it.

As Jesus said, "If you love me, keep my commands" - John 14.

[–]Red-Curious1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

"Therefore, we don't need the law, all we need is faith"

Yeah, I don't take that conclusion. As I understand it, he's just saying that you don't follow the law for the law's own sake, as if it creates black and white lines. Rather, the law is there to reveal the character of God, as you noted, and to tell us the operative principles of our faith. That's why Jesus was able to "work" on the Sabbath - because he read the law, understood the operative principles, but also recognized that (1) his picking food on the sabbath was from a right, unburdened conscience, and (2) that it served a purpose to advance his ministry with his disciples (i.e. from faith). In this sense, he wasn't compelled to obey the sabbath for the sabbath's own sake ("man was not made for the sabbath's [sake]"), but rather recognized the fact that the sabbath was given for man's benefit - a benefit mankind would not have received early on if it wasn't commanded to do so ("but the sabbath was made for man").

I wrote more about this in (what admittedly has the worst word-choices of any post in the sidebar series) 112.

The pendulum has the potential to swing very hard either way on this one: judaizers vs. lawlessness

Right. I find that most Christians are one or the other, more commonly known as legalists and antinomians. The reality is that young believers need legalism to get a firm foothold in the faith, just as children need hard rules. But when a child becomes a mature adult, they are free from their parents' rules and instead get to operate on love, making use of the spirit of their parents instilled in them since childhood by the way they were raised. Unfortunately, too many people never actually mature this way in the faith - to a point that they personalize a relationship with a spouse and start reproducing (biblically, an expectation of men and women throughout most of Israel's history, per the "be fruitful and multiply" command). We just now understand this to be a spiritual reproduction and multiplication ("make disciples," as you referenced) and not merely a physical one.

[–]coachdad80 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

American Gospel documentary addresses this topic and does it extremely well.

[–]ENTPunisher-1 points0 points  (5 children) | Copy

I'm not sure I follow your thesis. Are you rebuking the works-based-salvation crowd, the lukewarm wishy-washy crowd, or both?

[–]agoodcrayon[S] 0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

Not necessarily rebuking but I would say both crowds are in the wrong. I was more-so saying RPC should have more posts pertaining becoming a real Christian man. I know I’ve seen many in the past but maybe they should be reposted for the newcomers as I have noticed many Redditors here believe their denomination/church/works are their saving grace.

The lack of basic biblical truth or knowledge is astounding from some that claim to be Christian for X amount of months/years.

Where some may be great at building their body, their spiritual man is a thin stick.

[–]Red-Curious1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

Right. So why don't you be the one to make one of those posts? I usually try to avoid recycling old content. But from a fresh source - that can have value.

[–]agoodcrayon[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I could and maybe will. Although, many posts of mine have received negative or confused responses. I need to use the proper words to relay the message in my head.

I guarantee you, I’ll ruffle some feathers if I make a post “attacking” Churchinations.

[–]Red-Curious1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

That's understandable. This can be a tough crowd at times. I will say, there's a reason I included the 300 and 400 series, but you'll also note they get referenced the least in comments and other threads.

I'll also note that my original intent was to make the 300 series the 100 series, as that is truly more foundational than the other stuff. But then I had to remember the target audience and realize that if you want people to get to the things that actually matter, you have to start with the things that matter to them.

[–]ENTPunisher0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Good then, we're on the same page.



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