This post is the direct result of an experience I've had with my LTR. I will tell the story of what occurred, followed by a RedPill breakdown of the ebbs and flows of the situation and how to apply these same tactics to your own LTRs in the case of a fake break-up shit test.
I was with my girlfriend of about a year, at the gym, getting ready to leave. I'm busy telling her about a female friend of mine who is going through a break-up with her boyfriend. We'll call this female friend Lexi. Being a good friend of mine, I reached out to her to see how she was doing on this day as it had been a few days since her break-up.
Arriving home, we (my LTR and I) sat in bed together and discussed the occurrences of the day while I was texting Lexi. Out of nowhere, Lexi says "do you know any guys who would be interested in me?", an obvious grab for validation. My LTR sees it and quips "She just wants you to say you do." Ignoring her, I respond saying I do not, and she responds with "I would hook up with you if I could lol". My LTR goes into a complete rage.
I promptly respond to the text with my LTR watching, "I'm in a relationship right now so that's not an option". It's not enough. The insulting rhetoric keeps on pouring out. "I can't trust you!" "You can't be friends with her!" "You're egging this on!" I remind her that I've set a boundary for Lexi here and I have nothing to hide. I tell her Lexi's behavior was not okay but she is, regardless, a dear friend of mine and that I would not be ghosting her. My LTR demands that I never speak to her again and I say "I don't get to decide who you're friends with, and you don't get to decide who I befriend and remain in contact with. End of story." She persists in her infantile tantrum, so I get up and check my email. She starts demanding my attention, raising her voice and throwing more insults: "You don't listen to me! Why do you always get to decide when fights are over! You're being a child!"
After about an hour of her pouting while I'm just doing my own thing, we start talking calmly about other matters. Finally, she comes out with "Now that my head's clear, I think...we should just be done." I say "Okay. See ya." and return to what I'm doing on the computer. "That's it?" she asks. "Yes," I say, "and make sure you get all your shit out of my house before you go." Silence. Then, still standing there, she inquires, "Can I have a hug?" I decline her offer, remind her she wants to end things and remind her where the door is. Eventually, we make it downstairs with all her stuff. I go to open the door and she stops me. "Wait," she says, "don't you want some closure?" "I'm fine," I tell her. "You obviously never cared about me," she says, getting more emotional, yet, still standing there. I return with "Yeah, can't say I give a fuck that you're ending it over this. Petty. See ya." I also throw in a "by the way, the decision you make here tonight is permanent. If it's over, we're never speaking again."
After a little more of this she COMPLETELY 180s. Starts grasping desperately for validation, back to "Never mind, I decided I want to be with you. I love you. hugs". I still back away when she attempts to hug me. Still teasing the rest of it out. Bleh. Let's just get to the breakdown.
My LTR seeing that Lexi texted me saying she would hook up with me if she could was unanticipated Dread Game
And no, before you suggest it, I was not cheating and was not egging on this behavior in the background. I was fully unprepared for Lexi to come out and say that. We are friends of 6 years and we had a romantic past several years back that has been platonic ever since.
Now look at how she reacted. She was pissed, as one should be in this situation. I immediately set the boundary for Lexi and it wasn't enough for the hamster in my bitch's head. She began pouring out the shit tests, which I promptly ignored or pressure-reversed. Let me also mention at this time that I never once raised my voice or lost my frame. I remained docile the entire time and spoke calmly but firmly. These shit tests were all a POWER PLAY by her in order to gain MORE CONTROL over me in this relationship. By ignoring her and flipping the blame, I passed the shit tests. By passing the shit tests, I utterly but subtly refused to relinquish this power and control to her.
- Her decision to break-up was the ULTIMATE Shit Test!!
This was her last ditch effort to gain that control she so badly wanted. It didn't bode well with her at all that this woman was offering herself to me and it wasn't enough that I set the boundary. I had to give up this friendship in order to maintain the relationship and I was unwilling to do so. Thus, she attempted a very powerful shit test. Notice my immediate reaction: "Okay. See ya." (I must admit that the moment she said we should end it a feeling of dread washed over me. This was my Blue Pill conditioning dying to come back out. I realized it immediately after I had the feeling and I gave the appropriate response for which the situation called). By feigning disinterest and apathy and promptly returning to my business (my computer), she began to wonder "does he really care about me? I should find out". This is why she asked if I really had nothing else to say and then began with the hug attempts. I wasn't going to let her get away with her behavior that easily, however, and I kept backing away and feigning disinterest at each thing she said until she flopped. Like I said, I continued to "tease out" how she really felt and showed her desire to break-up for what it really was: a gigantic shit test. She thought she could call my bluff but instead I called hers.
- Pass shit tests with Amused Mastery
Hold frame, remain calm, don't respond directly to what they say, agree and amplify, flip the pressure/blame. They're adult children; treat them as such.
Epilogue: After she left, she sent me a very large text apologizing and attempting to rationalize her behavior just a tad - although she did finish her wall of text with a promise to work on her behavior. The fact is, she has past relationships, including a 5-year ex, with whom she still corresponds, and it's an astronomical double-standard for her to expect me to cut ties with a woman who said she would hook up with me if she could.
Furthermore, I felt angry and greatly disrespected at the enormous shit test she pulled. I seriously considered ending the relationship that night and many of you will probably encourage me to do so upon reading this. I must admit I am still Blue Pill in my inability to actually end the relationship as it is my first LTR ever. While I can practice RedPill tactics on her I still have a bit of a scarcity mentality by staying with a woman who treats me this way and by being afraid of the consequences of a break-up (loss of mutual friends, great immediate change, a period of grief). I'm still considering ending it over this rather recent event. The only lesson I have not yet learned is the one I would if I ended it.
There's a few reasons why she reacted the way she did here and by the way, so proud of you for man handling her emotions like that man. You made her look like a child here for sure haha!
She didn't see your reaction coming at all. And when women perceive something to be really serious happening such as a break up, and the other party doesn't engage in acting irrationally and emotionally like she does, it freaks her out even more. That's why I think it's always so important for us men to always maintain our calm and to not let our feelings dictate our actions in situations like that. Women will constantly attempt this, they will try to pull you down from the logical level your brain operates on, to their emotional level so it's an "even playing field". This is part of the reason why I think she said "let's be done", she wanted an emotional reaction from you (shit testing as well) when you began to ignore her and go about your business. Never let women take your ability to think logically and rationally about situations away, this as men is one of our greatest strengths.
This whole scenario could always be read in terms of "a child threatening to run away from home". Kid: You won't do A for me? Parent: No. Kid: fine I'm running away from home. Parent: Ok grab all of your shit and have fun sleeping under a bridge, and don't bother coming back. Kid: (Having second thoughts) Really? Are you serious? Parent: Yeah, go for it. And once you do this, you aren't welcome here anymore. Kid: (Breaks down crying) I'm sorry and I love you! (pouts)
You mentioned this point and I want to drive it home for men; Women do think and behave like children within the context of a relationship, especially when they let their emotions dictate their actions. Treat them accordingly.
Some more I want to share about this, but I've already went over my personal word count haha!
Well done and cheers man!
Wow it really is on par with childish behavior when you look at it like that. Well done with the running away from home analogy.
Regardless what some Machos here will try to tell you you dont have to hardnext everybody who makes a mistake once. Humans aren't perfect and you clearly aren't either.
Should she ever even attempt to use shittest rhetoric on you, you made sure she's gone. You held frame and opened her a view to her future if she's ever gonna be a bitch again, the lesson here is to become a hard but fair leader.
You either keep people around that are willing to adapt and compromise to you or you filter out the unviable, everybody gets 1 chance with me usually (unless something inexcuseable) but not more.
Just make sure to keep Frame in the future and to show signs of your abundance mentality. Keep others "around" to show you're socialable, independant (not only needing her) and clearly have other options to walk out on her should she become unbearable
The thing is, man, this behavior from her is somewhat typical. And while I tend to react the same way I have illustrated in my above post, she seems anything but malleable. I deal with this behavior of hers weekly, sometimes more often. And this was one of her biggest infractions yet.
I agree that there is no need to hard next someone who makes one mistake. But this isn't her first and certainly won't be her last. While she was quite apologetic in the aftermath, I will be putting her word to the test immediately and if she doesn't behave the way she promises to, it's gonna be game over for this relationship.
You should probably let her know this isn't something you're going to put up with again. I think she will continue to do this untill you prove to her that you don't appreciate these drama games anymore.
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.4418
Yeah but he already realized and admitted he's BP in that way
Yup. The girl is thinking, "I pull crazy shit and he still wants me, must be because I'm hot."
Whether or not she consciously thinks that... that's the validation she gets.
True doing this multiple times is a problem, but at the same time, if he uses this as a line in the sand for both of them, it's a chance for him to grow further away from his BP past.
Great defense there bud. I'm not sure how old you are but as a older RP, you dodged a huge bullet. Her attempt to initiate contact with the "Can I have a hug?" question. I say that because this something that I've seen more times than I can count and I'm even man enough to admit I fell for it... like 3 times (fuck you, don't judge me ). But anyways when they want a hug after a breakup like this, I guarantee you if you would have hugged her, she would have initiated sex. Which in turn, I would get back together with them and then inevitably we would break up a month later (I've never seen this work out, sometimes your just not right for eachother) So kudos for the defense brother.
To whom it may concern, I'm 23 years old. I appreciate the warm feedback, brother!
This is power play 101 every relationship in my BP days in which I actually was less invested than her this shit test came up. The magic bullet I guess is the answer: if you are breaking up with me over this you are not worth grief or even hassle.
Wasn't the first shit text your LTR blowing up over Lexi' text?
She's a gf not a plate. She has the right to be pissed off that his "friend" is trying to fuck him.
She should leave him if she doesn't cut her out. If the roles were reversed the obvious advice here would be for him to leave and not look back.
Why the double standard?
Seriously, he just wants the validation from his dear friend and exactly so we would give her the same shit if she was doing the same
Double standard ... consider this, by responding, you are validating her feels.
"Ha ha ha, your eyes are so green." Or simply responding to Lexi, 'what are we gonna do about LTR?' All in full view of LTR.
Agree and Amplify 101.
The rest just reads like the LTR escalating from here on.
You handled the situation here in particular though I wouldn't call it ideal, but I would bet you didn't set the tone of the relationship early enough, or have let it slip to where this kind of behavior is acceptable (as it's happening on a weekly basis) and has slowly escalated. The first sign of this kind of behavior should result in an immediate soft next. No hesitation, no exceptions. I did this with my current girl, who threw this the second night I met her. I've had zero drama for 7 months, and although I'm expecting some drama right around now it's been smooth sailing.
Manage your bitches better.
(also further reading here and here)
Thank you! I'm happy to admit I didn't handle things early in our relationship as well as I do now. I was still educating myself on Red Pill when our relationship began.
btw fucking a woman after she does this kind of shit test works well. Pass the test, she wants to be with you, fuck her, and then kick her out. On her way out the door, explain she needs to learn her lesson that you will never accept that behavior again and this night was for her to think about that. She won't know what to think and will be intoxicated by your dominance. Over the next week or two she'll probably make a lot of effort with sex and might give you some other gifts. If she does reward her good behavior extravagantly. She won't pull that ever again unless she finds another man to branch swing to.
There's also the concept of practice. FWIW, she's giving you a ton of practice in what I would rate as pretty damn hard shit tests. If you stay with her long enough that passing them is boring, you'll be an Alpha Lord.
Of course, there is the opportunity cost, all the chicks you could be banging as you sound exclusive. Sex pays off now, education pays dividends forever. Tough call, but nice place to be.
I dated my wife for seven years before we got married. She tried this once after we had been dating for a year and I did essentially what you did. Which made her back down a lot quicker than I had anticipated (still sent her home though, I prefer to sleep alone with my dogs).
If a woman keeps this sort of nonsense up, they will never stop. My wife bitches about my exes and when she catches me cheating but it's short lived and mostly her asking "are you mad at me." Your woman sounds exhausting but if it makes you happy, that's your business. The question then becomes "does she make you happy, or are you merely comfortable?"
Wait, did you say your wife bitches when she catches you cheating but it's short lived?
I have the guy tagged as "wannabe tryhard alpha" so take it with a grain of salt.
Short lived? Yes and no. The initial upset is usually short-lived like "again...really? Why this one this time?" We left for Vegas on Monday and the Sunday before I copped to another woman I had been fucking around with (the 19 turned 20 year old red head with big titties and a size four waist [wife just got down to a size size six]). I told her she could use the vacation to leave me, have her fun, and I'd draw up the divorce paperwork (we have a prenup) so we could finalize it when she got home.
About fifteen minutes of her going "well I knew what I was getting into, your mom and aunt tried to tell me about the men in your family. We'll work on it but we either need to go back to the dungeon (we do BDSM) together or I need to start meeting these women." Followed by a week later "what is so wrong with me that men always have sex with other women" which lasts about five minutes followed by me going "I'm a sex and affection addict that is also a sadist, we can get a divorce and you can go find a new guy."
We've been married a little over a year now and she's caught me with two women since we got married and the year before we got married she caught me with three. And I still email and chat with many of my exes (granted I let her read the emails because it's all grin and giggles).
When my wife and I met, I was seeing four other women as well. I never hid who I was and I'm an admitted sex addict. I just fuck really really really really really really good.
There's so much shit wrong here that I don't even know where to begin.
What compelled you to marry?
You're really terrible at cheating apparently.
Is this just your way of making her fed up so she leaves you instead of you having to bother leaving her ?
Don't get married if you want to keep fucking around.
That would be the right way to handle it. But I rarely do things the right way.
Did it for the tax cuts eh? You sly dog
Your virtues are your own breh. I forecast that she will become your plate.
When you distance yourself the way you did: stoic but respectful, they'll be open to you in the future (from my experience)
If you Chad it up, ditch her, eat pizza and fuck your other friend with her finding out. Then you can say goodbye to her being a plate.
Both aren't easy to do. Breakups in general aren't easy to deal with. I would probably do exactly as you did. Kick her out, be unfazed by her shit tests but not calling her out on her bullshit. I've dealt with the same shit you have and am hardline on my stance. I'd have her work herself back into your life but she has to cut ties with her ex. Personally, I've never understood that. If I get a gf and they wanna be serious; Facebook goes, and any communication with her ex's is cut. These ALWAYS ALWAYS are first. I support the way you are handling it, she just seems to have entered a princess bitch fit mode. Though you'll never be able to fully stop these; you can certainly mitigate them by doing exactly as you did.
Look at thay, you've already made up your mind. BP tendencies or not, you're not as insecure as you implied prior.
No need to hard next unless her worth to you is exceeded by the trouble she causes or there is just a much better offer on the table. However, this behaviour does call for a soft next, of around 5-7 days. http://www.blackdragonblog.com/2016/07/18/16297/
The older girl I'm fucking right now does this every few months. She is fun to fuck, no reason to dump a good piece of ass and an otherwise enjoyable girl over simple shit tests. Trust me, this isn't her ultimate one, just one where she wants both comfort and to a greater extent to see if you will cave to keep her.
This isn't a mistake, it's a process - to pacify her man so she can safely get side dick. Women try to pacify any dick they're on, and should they succeed they will move onto the next one. The real pussy tax is becoming beta/passive.
Contrary to popular belief, not everyone has nefarious ulterior motives. Some chicks are just jealous, some overly emotional. Not all of them are trying to cheat.
I don't disagree, alas you misunderstand - that's the best part. It's often not intentional. Itjusthappens
I'd say that's very accurate. People tend to say things like "that's just how it happened", but its funny how that's always how it seems to happen.
When women are allowed to be passive and always have a fall back defense and benefit of the doubt, it opens up a lot of doors for them to manipulate semi-consciously.
It reminds me of when I was a kid and I wanted to call out of school sick or when I wanted to manipulate my parents to buy me something, I would in a sense, become the lie. The lie for a brief period became my reality, and so I was innocent of "doing" anything. Of course once I got what I wanted I always self acknowledged the act, but before that it would be a bit buried...still there but not yet allowed to register...
Women are much the same. I'm sure any time their brains say "hey we did that!" many of them will be inclined to just butt in and say "well thats not important right now, hey lookit this!"
It just happens=intentional. Every single time.
Although I'm not sure if you agree with me and I'm missing out on some sarcasm
I am not pulling your leg. I'm not sure how you can say what is intentional and what is not when I'd bet my right nut that 99% of women don't know what they're aware of, what they're not aware of, what was intentional & what wasn't.
No, not every chick is consciously, intentionally out to screw you. Yes, every chick's biology is dialed in to get HER the best children - not YOU, and if fucking you is part of that process (as it always is), you've a high chance to get fucked.
Furthermore, intentional or not holds zero sway over getting cucked or one's LTR taking strange side dick. It happens.
This. There are a lot of critical people here who don't necessarily practice what they preach, but everyone at one point came from a place of BP vulnerability. OP was definitely modest and realizes that his BP conditioning was at play when he was passing those shit tests. Good on you OP.
yeah no need for a hard next right away, if it continued there would be, she's a hamster, can't blame her for following instincts, still needs to be trained. Maybe impossible but no need to give up yet.
The greatest thing about passing this shittest is the amount of shit he can now get away with.
Actually scratch that, ive just realised what ive written, women arent like that, they have selective memory and will continue to shittest even more.
This Happened to me recently. I was on vacation in New Zealand with my girlfriend of a year. She began acting really strange while we were walking around the city one day. Walking very fast, then getting mad at me for not 'walking with her'...Very childish stuff. Eventually I asked her what was wrong, and she said she thought we should break up. It was the beginning of the vacation on the other side of the planet. I told her "if that's what you want, then fine". She wasted probably around 500-600 dollars on a new hotel room herself, and I haven't talked to her since. I will never get in touch with her again. The most powerful position you can hold is the position of being willing to walk away and meaning it. NEXT.
I guarantee she had hookup options around that you didn't know about. NO girl is going to ditch the man she is with in a strange place without backup. That is really quite fucked though. Hopefully you enjoyed the remainder of your trip.
actually doubt it in this situation but maybe. It's easy for girls to get laid if that's what they want. Either way it's short sighted. & thanks.
Edit: also, she expected me to act beta and say that I didn't want to break up. I didn't take the bait. I said bye.
I love your example. Mine was very similar.
A lot of guys here are acting like just because you hold frame and act like you don't care when a woman threatens to break up with you, they (some redpillers) truly believe she will always come crawling back.
They won't and in my cases, like five times in the past two years the women could care less.
They will break up with me over some dumb reason, I act like I don't care and then we never talk or hear from them again. Never came crawling back.
If a woman has options she has no need to come crawling back to one guy.
Tbh I won't be surprised if she gets back in touch with me. Not one bit. But maybe not also. Either way ya gotta be able to walk at any moment. Stick to your guns.
Wtf? In the middle of a vacation?
https://598d5fcf392acad97538-395e64798090ee0a3a571e8c148d44f2.ssl.cf1.rackcdn.com/12132567_woman-gets-revenge-on-ex-boyfriend-by-sending_t565eda0f.jpg
Let me guess, vacation location was her idea?
Nah mine. she didn't know anyone there.
That's good. There's more here though. Although you may not be privy to the details.
I'd say we're making the same wrong assumption most conspiracy nuts do: she was just fucking stupid and short-sighted. No ulterior plan or motive.
^ from my (first hand) point of view, this is exactly what happened. It backfired on her.
She got upset that you wouldn't walk with her when she was walking fast? Ha! And what would have happened if you did keep up with her? 'can I get some space? Jeez!'
See, women are fantastic at spinning shit out of air. With a little practice they really could sell ice to Eskimos.
In any case, good of you for sticking to your guns. Any blue pill boy might have blamed himself for her breaking up with him, while she got fucked and screamed her blood curdling agonies of pleasure. And then that blue boy would try to fix shit.
You can't do good to your women more than what they deserve. They don't believe they deserve it. And they feel no remorse as long as a stiff one is in em.
How old was she if you don't mind me asking?
The fact your girl is still in touch with her ex is a major red flag. I was wondering why she had such an extreme reaction to the other girl texting you and now I think I know why ... projection. Women will often accuse their partner of cheating when they are thinking of doing it themselves. Watch your six bro.
Jealousy trumps anger.
I'm pretty sure her hamster went batshit the second she realized that the minute she leaves, you would fuck Lexi. THAT feeling/thought was the real game changer. You didn't even acknowledge that though.
This.
My current LTR tried this on me. She just mentioned breaking up, and I had all her shit in trash bags at my door before she realized what had happened. She even got into her car and drove off... only to turn around 5 minutes later and come back. Hasn't happened since.
However, I'm wondering if such a tactic would even work if you didn't dread. My LTR "hates" that I still talk to some of my exes (she doesn't). I'm not going to give up dreading to find out, but my guess is that if I actually cut all them off like she says she wants me to do, such a tactic wouldn't work anymore.
Solid post until this part:
OP, not going to teach you how to live, but I think deep inside you know this shit doesn't fly with you. Whatever your hamster is telling you, this ain't right.
A valid point but as the other commenter suggested it's very hypocritical. Personally I wouldn't want my LTR talking to exes but how would you even word your request and argue your point when you text your ex?
It would be hypocritical would OP be clingy emotionally unstable beta, who would forbid his GF from seeing her ex. On contrary, you set boundaries and she accepts it / refuses it. In the latter case, smirk and wish her GL.
1) We don't know what OP means by "romantic past", but "5-year ex" sounds a bit more serious than some fling.
2) Again, I don't know OP in terms of how honest he is or how he holds his word, but he told his ex "no" verbatim and showed it to his GF.
Purely anecdotal and probably a sampling bias, but: I've been reading TRP for some time now, but I've never encountered a FR where a girl shows her correspondence with her guy friends (except for messages of thirsty betas for laughs) to her BF.
3) As a fellow misogynist(/s) I must remind people of the observation that women have a totally different concept of loyalty. Not saying OP's girlfriend does or doesn't, but AWALT.
Also, I would advice to anyone reading this against telling your plate/LTR everything about women you communicate. Apply AM and brush it off. It will pay off in future, trust me.
Easily, blatantly state there will be a double standard, and she needs to tighten up. If she doesn't, that's his out. If she does, trust but verify.
Kind of hypocritical dont you think?
Yes and no, If we had a male soccer team against a female soccer team, the match would be completely unfair unless we gave the girls some handicap.
Same here, she just has to tell "come fuck me" to get sex, he has to seduce other girls for the same.
If thats all the faith you have in her shouldnt be in an LTR to begin with. and should work on being confident enough to know that she cant do better than you. Its not a problem until you lose that mindset.
Being confident, and being blindly ignorant are two completely different things. For starters, no person should simply be told to "man up" if they're concerned about their partners cheating. If you're going to go into a relationship (god forbid one does), you need to be wary of what your partner is capable of. If your partner does end up cheating, that's when you walk.
That's where you need confidence. To not lose your shit whenever your partner walks out on you. Not to be "cool" about your partner keeping in touch with her ex. That's just silly shaming tactics for something that shouldn't be tolerated.
If youre going to be close friends with your ex (like the op stated the case is) and expect her to have no contact, and that girl doesnt walk out on you right there, then you shouldnt respect her (she obviously doesnt respect herself) enough to be in a LTR.
Not arguing that it isnt a red flag, but when I was with my ex I didnt care who she hung out, because I knew I was going to hang out with girls when she wasnt there either. Our breakup had to do with me collapsing mentally when I moved to a big city by myself for 7 months, not with her hanging out with her friends that were dudes (granted it wasnt her ex or anything). But we were also dating for a long time and she is the first girl I was in a serious relationship with, because shes the only one to make it through vetting.
If she wont stand up for herself at least some, why would you respect her enough to be in an LTR? Not saying she should talk to an ex consistently, but I also wouldnt talk to my ex consistently if I was in an LTR.
EDIT: As soon as I was bitch mode enough that I lost her respect, and she lost my trust, we ended it. Granted theres a whole can of worms on the fact that someone that "loves you" cant be there to help you through shit, but thats how women operate and is an entirely different rabbit hole.
He's on training wheels and seems to be headed in the right direction. I think he'll learn a lot from this experience regardless of the outcome.
That is why her keeping in touch with exes is a red flag, she knows she should not, and my girld does not. If she does keep it, you know it's a minefield, not everyone can walk through it unscatted
Thats a fine point of view, but its unrealistic to expect that if he's close friends with ex
Soccer is about winning from the other team.
A relationship is about swapping value.
I agree on that their is a difference, but your example is bad.
Then you didn't understan the example.
Not everyone thinks like you. OP seems like he really doesn't give a shit.
This tough guy shit gets old man.
You start to realize the path of nihilism is really a disguise for cowardice or self-deceit. That's when you start giving a fuck.
Did you not read what the OP wrote? he said he still feels blue pill and felt genuine dread when actually thinking about his girl leaving. He said he was unwilling to let go because it is his first LTR. It's not a tough guy act. I do understand RP has some bullshit tough guy act written by some pussy boy who's still swallowing blue pills talking about how he slays 2 pussies before breakfast on a daily basis that can make you cringe but this is not one of those posts. Actually read the whole thing man.
Pretty insecure attitude. You're threatened by an ex from 5 years ago?
OK, I'll bite: we've been there. "Insecure", "man up" etc.
Next there's trickle truth. She just kissed the guy. They've got history after all, 5 years and all that. Oh, she probably slept over at his place. But nothing happened. They're just friends.
Keep telling yourself you're secure, open-minded and all that BS that keeps repeated on fem-oriented blogs. Just don't get taken aback when shits hits the fan.
Not threatened, but definitely not comfortable with it. Your LTR girl shouldn't be taking to any other males other than you. Period.
Show them the error of their way... by letting them have it.
Good show.
As for Lexi, she was probably banking on hearing "oh really" from you and being able to build off of that. Seen that feeler a few times too many.
To be fair, she was right, lol. Telling a girl "no" just makes her want it more :^ ^
Ya she should break up with him.
She has no agency, her guide is her emotions, and she appears to be lead by him, for now.
How many guys here would break up with a girlfriend who:
Probably 90% of the subreddit except the TBP lurkers who downvote everything.
Also, she's going to go through like 20 sexual relationships before January 1st right? That's typically the easiest way to repair her ego—or is she the type of girl to just gain 20 pounds and max out all her credit cards on shopping aka "retail therapy"
Something to be aware of OP:
This is a bitch trying very hard to figure out what buttons and levers to punch on you, with an unconscious goal of trying to bitch you up.
She wants to get inside your head, and be able to stir you the fuck up with her games like, 'Let's end it.'
Good on you for not getting emotional, and keeping it nice and righteous and cold.
When they can get you all stirred the fuck up, they feel like they've got the handle in the relationship.
I would have ended the relationship, shit tests in the future will keep pouring in most likely eventually. She might try to use this against u as well in the future, but if she pulls something like this once, she is certainly capable again....
Plus u got lexi patiently waiting haha, im not one to tolerate shit tests like these, possesive, jealous girls throw the most shit tests
In your relationships you expect to be able have ex girl "friends" in your life that still want to fuck you?
Are you cool if she has exs in her life that explicitly tell her they want to fuck her?
Yeah i mean every girl has multiple guys that say that or wish that all the time. Every girl has her beta orbiters
A beta orbiter is different from a past lover that she still communicates with and that makes his intention to fuck her again crystal clear.
Yeah thats true.... But if shes with another dude u wont just convince her to drop him. U drop her and if she doesnt come back to u then u didnt waste ur time and if she does then ur fine
And in the OP situation she should drop him for the same reasons unless they establish some sort of open relationship.
Well, next time she tries to pull shit like this, you might want to entertain that idea (unless she has a valid reason for this). Because if she repeatedly tries to exert control over you, it won't stop until she finally manages to do it.
You're on top of the world, bruh. Keep at it.
For now*
His girl is a basket case and will ruin him if he doesn't grow a pair soon and break her.
You did the right thing in my opinion but if the roles were reversed and she text her ex saying "I can't have sex with you right now because I'm in a relationship", then how would you respond? If she continued to insist on texting him as friends? Not to say you shouldn't have done what you did, I'm just curious about how it would play out in reverse.
I'm not sure how your question pertains to the scope of what the OP brought up for discussion.
EDIT: (removed: asking)
OP isn't asking anything. This is a discussion board and as such I am continuing the discussion. If you fail to see the relevance of my question to the OP then just move along.
Telling someone to "just move along" in response to a call for clarification is basically the opposite of continuing the discussion.
It was more of an accusation but nevertheless I told you specifically to move along for the very reason that you were not continuing my thread of the discussion and instead attempting to poke holes at it.
Stating "I'm not sure..." isn't typically used in an accusatory fashion, at least not without some major context clues first.
You seem defensive, bro; you still haven't addressed how your question is relevant.
I would end the relationship, personally. Kudos to you for keeping a level head in the situation - now the ball is in your court, and not hers.
Yea, had my bitch ex saying that when I told her I don't want to see her. "You don't love me, you never loved me". At start I responded and then I just told her IDGAF what she things or feels.
Months later, after blocking her on whatsapp, she still texts me, asking if I want to go back to her. Thanks for opening my eyes, ex. My balls finally dropped because you were such a nagging cunt.
End it.
It's actually better that it didn't end right then and there because it would've been on her terms, even if it was a bluff that went too far.
Now you can end it on your terms.
You should have cared more about her feelings. You should have talked this togethe... nah just kidding. Well done my man.
this is about as well as you could handle this.
If you wanted to be with lexi, you would be with lexi right now. she threw it out there and you set the rules and did it in front of your lady.
at that point, I have no idea why she would press it unless she was just trying to milk it, because what she did was too far. and once again, you handled it flawlessly.
now my only advice is that if she comes back, you have to lay down the rules. rule 1. "we're not ever going to talk about this again. whoever the child is that threw that tantrum, I am not paid to babysit them or put up with their crap." and 2. "there will not be a third time. you had once .... if it happens twice, you will not have to worry about breaking up with me."
I had something similar happen ... and I really wanted things to work out (they did and still are) but she had this melt down one time and this was all I could figure out to make it ok. just a complete forgive but by no means will I ever forget approach.
Great post bro.
I think women make shit friends but way to hold frame like a boss
I've been here before, except I actually ended it and took my friend up on her offer. The friend thing didn't last very long but at least I kept the train rolling.
Her behavior, while still a test, is much more of a behavioral problem than it is a test. It won't end here.
As a rule of thumb, I tolerate this shit test twice. The third time means it's over. If it's occuring too often obviously something is wrong in the relationship and it should end. The firsts two times are just the girl not knowing what it means to be with me and what it implies.
You should always let a girl the opportunity to learn from her mistakes but if she doesn't improve, she would have other issues coming up in the future.
You dealt with it very well in my opinion.
Excellent article. You gave more insight in the virulent nature of the woman.
When you put them in their place, women are sweet. But sometimes the devil in them comes out again. With that double nature, you need to deal with it and you put her again in her place. Like a master.
If she dares to pull such a disrespectful shit test against you and she is even getting away with it... I would not be sure I would put more effort in this relationship the next time.
Great post. But always remember. Best game is no game. You had abundance mentality and you didn't care much if she left. Playing dread in scarcity mentality is counter intuitive and it's easy to overreact, underreact or fuck up completely.
You handled things really well I thought, particularly as your GF seems to have massive double standards. I would let it slide if it does not happen again.
I would personally end it as ultimatums and myself don't work. However, watch her behavior for a little bit. If she actually does try to improve then maybe you might want to continue it, seeing as you know what needs to be done. If not, downgrade to plate status and start looking for others.
You said it yourself, you still suffer from scarcity mentality. Knowing that you can end a relationship on your terms, and knowing that you can find and spin plates will help you with overcoming that.
If you say something is permanent - you need to stick to your guns. Seriously - boundaries are important and if you are willing to back down from this one, she'll know that you'll back down on the next one too.
Moving forward, I would like to congratulate you on doing the right thing. No one can determine who you are allowed to be friends with except you. Anytime someone tries to control you - tell them to fuck off. The ability to walk away and to respect yourself is the most important thing RP philosophy can impart to a guy.
Oh in case you are afraid of not finding anyone else so soon, I can tell you that I've dropped lots of women when they no longer met my criteria (physical or emotional), and had another girl in practically no time. If you are a high value male, there are plenty of women waiting for their chance.
This was good. If you took the fact that this was a male and female situation and just looked at it as two random people, you'd expect the same outcome.
My ex tried to pull that once, telling me she didn't want me to see my friend. I told her that's not her choice and she later said she liked that I did that.
She also threatened to break up and I pointed to the door and told her she couldn't leave. She literally 180d and in the same angry tone but with surprise yelled "NOOOOOOO! "
I was completely oblivious at the time but in retrospect I can see that thise were situations I handled correctly. Same as you.
Until you experience the pain of a break up and recocery and come to the realization that while it hurts, you'll live and move on and heal, you will always have a touch of that "scarcity mentality," you don't know what you don't know.
What an annoyance. I swear to god, if these types of shit tests are what the average girl puts her man through, our society has seriously fucked up. After monk moding for a while, I come to TRP and read this shit and just shake my head. Pussy is NOT WORTH this kind of emotional manipulation and stress. Yes, OP succeeded in the shit test, but at this point, I don't even have patience for this type of shit.
You mainly hear about this on TRP. Dudes here are in their 20's dealing with younger chicks who are more immature and really insecure. The difference between a 19 year old and a 27 year old chick CAN be night and day and you'll get less of that head ache shit if you screen them out early.
I would say make it a real break-up
I stopped reading this as soon as I realised you're allowing your LTR to read your text messages. Absurd.
OP I'm going through something similar. Keep in mind this is a clusterfuck and some of you will hate me for it. I have an on+off LTR with my ex-gf (she's almost a 10/10). Also, it's a long distance. Will we end up together? Meh, probably not. I could care less. I have work to worry about. But hey, free sex every now and then. Every once in a while she texts me out of the blue all like "is there anything still between us?" I reply back "I have feelings for you but I'm seeing other girls." This drives her over the edge so she wants it give it another go. We meetup, hookup, and I'm back to doing my thing. She's borderline crazy, insecure, doesn't know what she wants, and I don't want to be her guardian. Keep in mind the sex is amazing but the relationship is unstable.
Met some girl off Tindr. Hit it off. More sex. Now I was honest and upfront with this girl - "I don't want a relationship, let's just have fun." She agreed. I told her about my ex (she's cool) and my ex about her (she apparently doesn't believe me because she's delusional, whatever). Fast forward later and I'm chilling on the couch with the new girl, watching a movie when my ex texts me and this new girl sees that in the corner of her eye (men always hide your phone). She absolutely freaks the fuck out. "WHY ARE YOU STILL TALKING TO HER? STOP." I asked her why it's a big deal. Suddenly she assumes we are in a relationship. I told her we are just friends and I'm not doing anything with my ex (I actually wasn't at that time). She doesn't believe me. Storms off. Mad. Texts me later "you need to decide between me and her." I told her I'm not doing anything with anyone and I'm not deciding between two things that don't exist. She apologizes and we go back to having "fun." She's still trying to get me to commit but she's also another crazy girl I don't have time for. Too controlling.
Moral of the story
We don't negotiate with emotional terrorists
You should have told her "Now that we are done I can text Lexi back and let her know "I'm no longer in a relationship."
Could you imagine that dread?! Especially if she would have actually left, the hamster would have went off the charts with her imagining you fucking the shit out of Lexi.
She already thought that - it was doubtless one of the first things that shot through her mind, bringing it home to her very quickly her mistake. Abundance and all that.
Exactly; that's how I interpreted her validation at the end like "Not even a hug?" She was automatically assuming you're probably going to hit up that other chick Lexi. Imagine if the girlfriend did this out of nowhere without Lexi. The OP has less leverage and him giving 2 shits about her leaving with an option of Lexi going "I wanna bang you" rather than not having Lexi in the picture at all just kind of shepherds her back in to the relationship. The uncertainty that you've given though is what drives her crazy.
That's playing her game -- you're just giving her the drama she seeks. The idea is to shut her game down entirely, and the best way to do that is to stay perfectly calm and not get baited into an emotional reaction like "well I will go screw someone else now!"
Never explicitly state dread like that.
You want it to be implicit. First thing this bitch suspected when he said 'Ok, if that's what you want,' is that he was going to be replacing her, since he wasn't chasing her.
If he'd said it-- her hamster could've spun it into him being an asshole. Explicit dread makes the self-defense kick in. Implicit dread makes them doubt, and correct their course.
Ok, you guys are correct. I misread the post:
"although she did finish her wall of text with a promise to work on her behavior. The fact is, she has past relationships, including a 5-year ex, with whom she still corresponds, and it's an astronomical double-standard for her to expect me to cut ties with a woman who said she would hook up with me if she could."
I thought she brought up her ex in her apology, and was trying to create some dread herself. He was just stating a fact.
Excellent, excellent point. People get emotional and spiteful when you directly disrespect them. Rubbing her face in another option is just going to provoke that reaction.
Thats stupid. Don't do that.
Shit we could have powered the entire US with that hamster wheel spinning.
[permanently deleted]
I had to go this far to see someone say it, goddamn this subreddit is bad sometimes!
How does OP need to grow up
Nah, he just needs higher standards for those he keeps around. She doesn't need to grow up, society has made sure of it. He just has to realize how toxic she is.
No matter what your hamster is telling you, your "friend" clearly crossed a line.
How would you react if the situation played out in reverse?
You really think men and women are just friends? There is ALWAYS a sexual dynamic in play between the sexes.
"by the way, the decision you make here tonight is permanent. If it's over, we're never speaking again."
Never, ever make threats at a girl. Men who need something make threats.
It wasn't a threat, he was giving it to her straight.
Never, ever make threats at a girl. Men who need something make threats.
Explain that.
Do you have any source, article or whatever about that specific sentence???
It's tough to explain and someonelike GLO or Vengefully could probably explain it better.
I don't recommend it. You can do it if you think its best
Meh, I don't think you would be alright with guys texting her similar stuff. But then again, maybe you would be comfortable with her associating with guys who are only try to lay her.
My cousins wife tried that by leaving with the kids to try to get him to feel bad and beg for her back. He got a good lawyer and divorced her. I hope he got full custody but we don't talk much.
He's better off away from that kind of toxic woman, don't let them try to control you. You play the mind games, not them.
You should have a nice long sober retrospective look for any red flags you may have missed. Also, take a look at your own behavior. If you're having fights like this every week someone is fucking up or just sucks in general.
Well done in getting back on track, and keeping the problem from getting any worse.
It might behoove you to demand more out of the relationship. You obviously have a good job, a house, available female friends, and probably a lot more going for you. Unless your GF is a power player as well, you can probably demand a relationship that is open sexually, but only for you.
In the end sex for most men is recreational, and most women are fundamentally OK with this. Just look to history, or modern day Central America and Japan. With a little bit of time and effort, you can probably shift the dynamic, where if Lexi texted you that, you could swing it to a 3some, rather than having your so start testing you.
Just a thought, and everyone is different. Still way to go in handling the situation strongly.
More drama than a 14 yo girl
"You're being a child, you always decide when fights are over"
That's the exact opposite of what a child is. Women lol
anyone else feel like a lot of stories like this, maybe not this one, but ones like this...are after a guy goes through the first half of the situation, and then fucks up the last half, then looks back and thinks, this is what i should have done to be alpha and impressive to my red pill bros...and then they write THAT story as what happened
Ah, this is refreshing to read. I haven't kept up with RP for awhile and it seemed like it was getting side track for while but it's surely a pleasure to read this.
My friend was in a situation like this but the girl has committed the same action several times. He took her back, some men disappoint you.
Sounds a bit like my last LTR. And I emphasize "last LTR." Spinning plates is so much easier. And better for your mental health, IME.
Here's the rub, and it's been mentioned on TRP before: don't take women seriously. Ever.
Some people will say "well relationships are serious things because marriage and children yadda yadda blah blah.." if that were the case, women wouldn't initiate 70% of divorces. Women don't take themselves seriously. They don't take most aspects of life seriously. And every time a woman senses that you're starting to take her seriously, the shit tests come out.
It's their nature to not be serious. They have to relate to children in order to rear them. Even the most "strong woman" will coo and go googily eyed in front of a baby.
Good job ignoring the shit tests. That's the way to go. I also like to crack a lighthearted, playful joke. They may act upset, they say "this is serious" but take that with a grain of salt. I've never had a relationship end because I was playful, lighthearted and didn't take the girl seriously. I have had many end because I took her and the relationship seriously.
Also, sounds like you're shaking off some old blue pill-ness/still killing the beta. Best cure for scarcity mentality is abundance. A week after my break up, I banged two separate chicks on back-to-back nights, got one plate coming over tomorrow, another Friday and one of the girls from last week on Saturday. So depending on your circumstances, the lag time between cooters could be smaller than you think.
My girl bitches when I like my females friends instagram pics saying "You don't know how girls think they'll think you want to have sex with them" which she does have a point I shouldn't be giving females attention even though they're just a friend but her logic never makes sense. I told her "If females believe if a male likes their pic it means we want to have sex, so therefore when they like my pic they want to have sex? She got quite and said "it doesn't work like that"... females
At the very minimum keep your options open for future plates.
She may have not lost respect for you, and instead gained more, but if more of this behavior continues you go the "let's just be friends" route and pretty much only booty call her (plate her).
Edit: after reading one of your replies - definitely think about plating here. Another infraction = demoted. And this is essential: women don't get promotions, after they get demotions. Ever. It is what it is.
About a week ago, my gf asked who I was voting for. I told her Trump, because Hillary scared the crap out of me. No big deal to her at the time. Fast forward to election night, Donald trump wins. 3 in the morning, I get a phone call. She's bawling her eyes out "Are you happy now? " I was completely shocked. I didn't even have words. She apologized the next day. We had a big weekend trip planned a few days later. She doesn't show up when she said she would. Instead, calls me saying "I'm wondering if I should even come down, I think maybe our values don't align". I wish I would have handled it well. I was incredibly angry. For real? You didn't care a week ago, because you thought hillary had it in the bag. But now that half America voted trump, I'm too dirty to talk to. I told her if she's willing to just write me off like that, then I don't want to be with HER. I ended the call. But I got worried she'd spread rumors about me and I'd be ostracized in this super liberal town, so I called her back super mad, like don't start talking about me. I'm not a piece of shit, I don't degrade women, I don't talk bad about minorities, so don't lump me in to your stereotype. We end up calming down and go on this trip as planned and have a really good time, but man I've lost some major give a fuck about the relationship. Should have just let it end, if such a pretty thing as my inconsequential vote was that disguising to her
Why not lie and say you forgot to vote and then flip her anger back on herself?
I guess I thought for a second I might be able to be honest and understood as human
Hahaha. Yea... Ive made that mistake. Still do sometimes
Always keep two in the kitty. At the time I said to myself: "thats's s dick move, maybe I'll ignore that one".
I promise you that you won't regret implementing it. If you can keep two on hold while in a relationship a) dread game gainz, b) abundance mentality gainz, c) you know you're still on sharp, that you haven't been blunted by a crazy bitch.
Why is there so much "double-standard" talk in this thread?
Gentleman... I posit that even simply entertaining the idea that double-standards, in the context of intimate relationships, are a worthy topic of consideration points directly to blue pill programming still lurking beneath the surface.
Awesome post. I'm relatively new to red pill. How does one determine what to identity as a test and what isn't? This is my weakest point I believe. Tips ? Signs ? How to handle it?
Check the side bar - there should be two articles on Shit Tests alone.
One should be that lucky. I dated this girl back in the day who kept threatening break ups. being borderline disordered she really went far with it. I wasn't unplugged yet and knew nothing of game so it really bruised me. Nowadays I react extremely swift whenever a girl pulls disrespect like that. If she wants to emotionally abuse me in such a way I instantly press the nuclear button.
Terminate the relationship and never talk to her again, no talk, no closure, no mercy.
Relevant to this, maybe someone can help me out with my recent LTR who does the same thing. We fight a lot because she used to be a HUGE slut and had a train ran on her, fucked black dudes at parties, and some other scummy shit. But I dont break up with her because she actually is the best GF in terms of value I've ever had. Regardless we fight about it all the time and I think about it every day, and whenever we get in to a fight about it she does this fake break up shit, and I say see ya, and she comes back an hour later. But its up to like a weekly thing now, including this morning. We got in to a fight because she was withholding sex and of course all I could think was, well shit, you could just give it up to all these fucking randos like a slut but not do it with your boyfriend who you supposedly love. And we got into a fight and she says we're broken up. I say once more, ok bye, and she she tells me to find a virgin but an hour later tells me I can fix it if I want buts my job. What the hell?
IMO it's fine if you decide not to end it here but if there is another shit test or irrational behavior on this level, remember it's not a first time offence and act accordingly.
You're not truly red-pilled if you have female friends.
Curious OP: where do you live and how tall are you?
The biggest red flag of them all: The fact is, she has past relationships, including a 5-year ex, with whom she still corresponds.
dafuq??
Shdve pushed her down and fucked her
Shdve pushed her down and fucked her
Can someone elaborate on how he/hypotheticly me would go about using this approach to the situation?
When and after what statement would have been the right way to do this?
Yeah but from the other side, how pissed would you be if she texted some guy that shit while laying next to you. You'd be fucking pissed. Maybe she'll stop acting like a child if you stop treating her like one. Alpha =/= dickhead
Hahaha. I just asked myself what my reaction would be if my wife got a text like that from a guy friend, saying he wished he could hook up with her.
I know I'd be pissed, but my reaction would be like "Ha. Tell him that we can have a bench press contest, winner gets to fuck you".
She's with me because I'm physically strong, I'm confident and I take no shit.
Interesting read. I personally would send her a text, that i m beyond pissed about, that she would end things so fast and would need time toi think about it. In this time she should do everything to do it right.
But maybe this would also be too hard. If you think about the roles reversed, guy she had sex with wrote this to her and she would have written back: Not right now, im in a relationships. I think you (and i) would have gone immidiantly. So there is a a littlebit of a doublestandart.
Sorry for my bad english
You're just a dick that doesn't respect your LTR. No dude needs a female friend that bad.
I thought this at first, but later on OP said that his LTR still corresponds with someone she was previously involved with as well. So, it's simply the standards they both set for the relationship, so you can't fault him for that.
I missed that, seems both are pretty needy people.
I'm glad someone said it. I don't think either one of you respects the long term relationship. Each one of you has a back up. You know you have a problem with her communicating with her ex. You got your revenge by having your friend express her intent of hooking up with you. Both of you are shit testing each other. Just end it. If you don't, I look forward to your next post about her fucking her ex to get revenge on you right before she breaks up with you. That would be at the point she realizes you're actually a bowl of mush that wasn't ready to break up with her when she shit tested and she is able to walk all over you. Next serious LTR you get in make sure she isn't still talking with an ex, that's an instant red flag and there is a reason a guy isn't snatching her up already. Good luck.
I have plenty of platonic female friends. I wouldn't ghost them for a ltr. You can't be a little bitch to your guy friends or they'll just think you're annoying. Platonic relationships are great for venting and shit