Hacking discipline: a neurochemical approach to getting off your lazy ass

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May 10, 2017

If you could take a magic pill that made you disciplined, would you?

1 in 3 college kids say "fuck yes". That's the proportion of university students who admit to using stimulants to help study (warning: PDF). Chief among those stimulants is, of course, Adderall.

For the few who've never heard of it, Adderall is an amphetamine-based prescription drug officially used in the treatment of ADHD and narcolepsy, widely employed off-label to aid with concentration and focus. Adderall works by stimulating the release of dopamine and related neurotransmitters. Their effect is to activate the brain's reward system, which is the mechanism responsible for making you want to keep doing whatever it is that you're doing. The reward system is normally activated by actions which we have evolved to instinctual recognize as advantageous: eating, drinking, fucking, taking care of your kids.

Adderall (and amphetamines in general) forces the reward system to activate on command, making you interested in any arbitrary activity. In other words, it hacks your brain chemistry to make you want to perform any arbitrary task, giving you artificial discipline. The effect is potent and general: the task doesn't have to be actually useful or sensible for you to want to do it, on Adderall; amphetamine users could be put to digging a trench and they'd work away at it as if that were the most interesting project they've ever worked at.

Unfortunately, taking amphetamines is not a sustainable alternative to developing real discipline. They have a host of side effects, tend to be addictive and are heavily restricted in most jurisdictions. I do not recommend using them, and avoid them myself. But they do provide us with key insight into how humans operate: on a base, animal level, we act because our neurochemistry tells us to.

The question then becomes: can we hack our neurochemistry to facilitate discipline, without resorting to dangerous drugs? the answer, as is obvious from the title of this thread, is yes, yes we can.

The method is completely outrageous, flying right in the face of TRP orthodoxy, because it's based on your fee-fees: we're going to work with your emotional response to make you hack your own brain chemistry and make you disciplined. It's not that hard, it's not stoic, it doesn't take heroic willpower. Ready? let's go. If you just want the method and don't care about the background, skip the next two sections.

Once in a while, any undisciplined person has a good day. On that day, the undisciplined person manages, by some fortunate alignment of the planets, to not be a lazy asshole and actually do what he should have. At the end of that day, the undisciplined person goes to bed with a smile on his face, an incredible feeling of relief washing over him, and the sad thought in his mind: "if only I could do this every day".

Undisciplined people often fantasize about what their life would be like if they were disciplined. It goes a little like this: they would wake up at an early hour and immediately get out of bed to start their morning. They would do some stretching or workout, take a shower (washing all the nooks and crannies, even the soles of their feet), shave to perfection, make a good breakfast, get dressed in their best, and stroll out with a smile on their face. They would dedicate themselves to their craft with attention and precision, taking opportunities throughout their day to network and socialize with colleagues, especially over lunch when they would eat a nutritious, healthy meal. On leaving work, they would promptly attend to whichever activity the evening calls for, be that buying groceries, going to the gym or engaging in a hobby, before enjoying the social pastime of the day, be that with friends or a woman. They would go to bed (which they had neatly made in the morning, forgot to mention that) early, guaranteeing them enough sleep to wake up refreshed the next day.

The funny thing is that you can have all of this and it's neither hard nor complicated, provided you know how. I myself have sought after this elusive trick all my life, resorting to draconian time-management and self-motivation measures to deal with my chronic procrastination: pomodoro timers, app lockouts, habit trackers, even a commitment system where I would give money to a trusted person and ask them to forfeit it if I didn't complete an assigned task by a certain time. Every day was a constant struggle against myself to do what I needed to do. So how did I get out?

The answer came to me after a particularly bad day, when I had failed across the board to be a functional human being. I had gotten to bed too late the night before, woken up terribly tired, eaten like shit, been an asocial time waster on the job, and bailed on a social engagement to stay home and read reddit. I had even failed to brush my teeth, and felt in no mood to do anything except wallow in self-pity at my continued struggles with discipline. I had tried every method in the book(s) and I still failed.

A serendipitous thought struck me, a thought so simple as to sound simplistic: "just do it because it makes you feel better". Brush your teeth? go do that, you'll enjoy the freshness and won't feel like a disgusting slob. Make your bed? do it, you'll thank yourself later tonight when you're not fighting with the covers and getting cold because half of them have inexplicably fallen off. Do your evening stretches (I had at least managed to work out, and had long since tried to do regular evening stretches to cut down on next-day soreness), you'll feel much better sleeping and waking up tomorrow. You get the idea.

Surprisingly, this simplistic method worked. I got off my ass, brushed my teeth, made my bed, did my stretches and went to sleep. Of course, all of the advantages that I had foreseen materialized, and I slept far better than I would have otherwise. In the morning, still grasping some tendrils of the idea from the night before, I encouraged myself to go through my proper morning routine (which I typically skipped through in laziness), thinking each time about how much better I would feel for having gone through each step. At work, I dispensed with my array of timers and concentrated how much better I would feel if I didn't have to work through lunch break because I had lazed off during the morning. I found myself finishing my allotted tasks and even completing some leftovers from the previous day, all well before mid-day. And so on during the day... you get the idea.

Awestruck with how such a simple system apparently could work better than the plethora of devices I had previously used, I kept experimenting with it, at the same time doing research on whether anything like this had been tried before. It had indeed, in a sense, been tried in certain psychological studies, where people were induced to visualize their rewards to stimulate them into completing a non-rewarding task; but those results were left there as ink on a page, never developing into a proper method (at least not to my knowledge). So I did my best, refining my observations and experiences into what I'm presenting to you now.

How to hack your reward system

The key to this method is hacking your reward system to trigger whenever you need it to. On its own, it would only activate at the moment you actually get the reward: not when you're dieting but weeks later when you look at yourself in the mirror, not when you're working but when you've finished and realize you now have guilt-free free time, not when you're crashing doing sets but when you're plowing that tight pussy thanks to all the experience you've accumulated.

We need to back-shift your reward response to the moment when you need to act. How? by consciously evoking the feelings of relief, pride, pleasure, self-respect, satisfaction etc of completing the task. Remember earlier, when I talked about how every undisciplined person has a good day once in a while? use that feeling as a reference point. Tell yourself: "do this because you'll feel X" and summon clearly, in your mind and in your body, the specific feeling of reward for that activity.

In my experimentation, there are two main groups of reward-feelings you can use:

  • practical rewards: the pleasant results of completing an activity, such as the pleasure of company for social activities, the enjoyment of good food for spending time cooking, the freshness of waking up after a good night's sleep, the increased attractiveness and well-being of a healthy body etc

  • inner rewards: self-respect, relief from not having the task hanging over your head, not feeling like a disgusting fat fuck, pride in having been disciplined, pride in a job well-done etc

My experience suggests that the first category is easier to think of (anyone can immediately see the practical reward of a sensible activity), but harder to concretely evoke and less potent; the second type occurs to you with more difficulty (undisciplined people are rarely used to taking pride in their actions), but once it does it's far more potent in actually stimulating you to action.

That sounds too good to be true

I agree, but that doesn't erase the fact that it works. It's the system I've been living on for the past few months, and it has not only made it much easier psychologically to manage myself, it has led to practical improvements in various areas of my life where I had lagged behind due to low discipline. The theoretical foundation is also sound.

But it's feel-good bullshit

No, it isn't. I know why you think it is: it works by manipulating positive feelings. But the key difference is that feel-good bullshit manipulates completely unwarranted positive feelings to make you forget about your shitty situation and convince you everything's fine. Here we do the complete opposite: we start by acknowledging that everything is not fine, that there's a specific course of action that you should take to fix it, and use the knowledge that fixing it will make you feel better to spur you into action. We cut through all the sophistication and high-minded thinking and go straight to your most primitive hindbrain.

This psychological trickery is simply a reinforcement of the natural mechanisms that are the basis of delayed gratification behavior. The beaver doesn't build the dam because it knows through rationality and planning that it will create a useful refuge, but because instinct has programmed it to feel good while building a dam. When a dog performs a difficult series of tricks for you, it's not because he has a complex rational understanding of your psychology and knows you'll reward him, it's because you've conditioned him to feel anticipation and eagerness while he's performing the tricks, which is why he performs them even when there isn't an actual food reward.

We are not so far from these animals, and our problem with discipline stems, in my opinion, largely from the fact that we need to engage in so much more delayed-gratification behavior than we evolved for, in situations we definitely didn't evolve for, with rewards shifted forward in time much further out than we evolved for. But the mechanism is still there, it can still be exploited, and I believe that is precisely what disciplinarian systems do: by dispensing prizes (praise, rewards) and punishments (push-ups, pain, shame), they condition people to associate positive feelings (pride, relief, ambition) with necessary activities, enabling them to perform them in a disciplined manner. What we do here, in the evident absence of disciplinarians doing it for us, is to condition ourselves manually.

There is much more that I would like to say about this topic, but this post is already long enough that I know many people will have skimmed even the parts containing the practical advice. That's not something I know how to fix at this stage; if you're one of those people and have skipped to these lines, then at least go back and read the "How to hack your reward system" paragraph. I suggest you read it all regardless, but if that's not happening then get at least the gist of the method and give it a try; I have strong reason to suspect you'll be surprised at how well it works.

Post Information
Title Hacking discipline: a neurochemical approach to getting off your lazy ass
Author G_Petronius
Upvotes 1005
Comments 132
Date 10 May 2017 05:15 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit TheRedPill
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/43136
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/6ae5v3/hacking_discipline_a_neurochemical_approach_to/
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[–]RedDeadCred90 points91 points  (11 children) | Copy

When you understand that everything you do changes your brain the answer becomes obvious.

You can shift your brain from introvert to extrovert by filling your time with people, or when they aren't around, podcasts and recorded conversations. You can also shift your brain from extrovert to introvert by avoiding people and spending all your time focusing on solitary activities.

When you remove video games, porn, TV, weed, music, reddit, and all the other high dopamine media from your life - most of which didn't exist 100 years ago -, the dopamine your brain produces will plummet. It will look for any outlet to release that feeling of pleasure, and as it normalizes and those neural patterns decrease, there will naturally occur a corresponding reinforcement of the kinds of activities that bring lasting happiness and contentment. You will want to talk to everybody. You will want to cook. You will want to work out. Everything that you find difficult is a predictable consequence of the irresponsible wiring you have done to your brain.

Realize that you are here because you poisoned your brain. We are all dopamine addicts, living in this modern world. You are here because your brain has been wired to seek high reward, low risk activities. These do not bring lasting happiness; that is why you are seeking help.

[–]thecarryone9 points10 points  (2 children) | Copy

Do you think i will eventually get that feeling from studying?

[–]RedDeadCred15 points16 points  (1 child) | Copy

Yes. Mindfulness meditation, where you force yourself to focus on the present moment without thinking, has been shown to increase grey matter in the brain. The different states of your brain work like muscles. The more each state is used, the more ingrained those patterns become and the stronger it gets. The thing is, though, that they compete for space and they overwrite each other.

The more you use your brain for other activities, like video games and Internet browsing, the more adept your brain becomes at those things, but they decrease the patterns that help you for us on real life stuff.

This is why a fully committed monk mode is exponentially more effective than a half asset monk mode where you still allow other bullshit. You don't even have to cut everything cold turkey. Just reducing the bad stuff and increasing the positive stuff will have a corresponding response in your brain. It is like water, and it will take the form of its surroundings.

[–]What_The_Nuts1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Can you recommend any resources for further reading on this idea?

[–]uishax4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

I highly doubt that extroversion/introversion is a spectrum purely influenced by the environment.

Just think of ancient natural history, there are people who survive mostly alone in the mountains, hunting for survival, where the need for socialisation would be detrimental to productivity. Conversely, there are people in densely populated farms where day-to-day socialisation is a requirement, and where deriving enjoyment from such activities would be beneficial. With evolutionary pressures benefiting one trait and discouraging another, there must be a genetic factor to introversion-extroversion.

Using myself as an example, I can present myself pretty well when required to in business functions or interviews, I've even became the center of discussion once at a very high level occasion between executives and students (i'm obviously the student).

But after those slick presentations, I feel exhausted, thoroughly tired, and not willing to ever go through them again. Because I'm an introvert, because I genetically do not feel enjoyment from social events even if I perform well.

Moreover, I can go through many months without talking to anyone, and not feel a single bit of loneliness. In fact, I feel alienated when people talk about 'being lonely' and needing companionship, because it is simply a concept I've never personally experienced from the day I was born. Even in primary school summer camps, where many students cried at being away from their parents for the first time, I was wondering why others felt such sadness, when I didn't feel anything at all. This level of introversion, I think, cannot be due to the environment.

You mentioned modern entertainment stimulating introversion, but I do not need modern stuff to entertain myself. I can simply plan out my personal crime-novel in my head as a very enjoyable activity. I don't think natural extroverts would like that.

[–]RedDeadCred1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Of course it's part genetic. It's like being muscular and lean. Some people don't have to try, other's need to work out systematically and diet consistently to look like another guys 'before' picture. The point is the end result isn't set in stone.

[–]wjin03522 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

holy crap that makes an enormous amount of sense. Do you have any books or articles that you recommend that gets a bit deeper into this?? I am just realizing why I am the way I am. I mean I am doing well, but I've always been curious about why I function the way I do (what really motivates me) and if I can hack my mind the way I want, as this post has suggested.

Really cool stuff, exciting!

[–]RedDeadCred3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

I've heard of a book called the Dopamine Rollercoaster but never read it. This is just what I've stitched together from my experiences as well as various snippets of research on brain plasticity, the effects of dopamine intensive activities like drugs, video games, and porn, some psychology, and a fascination with the paleolithic man and the ways in which our lives have changed.

[–]Radinax0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Wow thanks for the explanation!

[–]Hiddenaccount1423 points points [recovered] | Copy

Is there a full list of the bad types of dopamine? I know video games, porn, tv, music, internet browsing, junk food, and drugs are included but is there anything else? And I can imagine life without most of those things, but life without music seems insane. No music in the car or anything? No music festivals or concerts?

[–]RedDeadCred0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It's like diet. Occasional indulgences are fine as long as you get back to the diet and don't fall off the wagon.

[–]SlippinJimmii102 points103 points  (51 children) | Copy

funnily enough I tried the programming thing. I would take one or more drugs and for the duration of their effect would do whatever it is I want my brain to be more inclined to do. Its surprisingly effective, I noticed the phenomena by chance after realising i was automatically behaving in a way which i had reinforced with drugs. Being mindful of this really makes you appreciate how drug users can get cemented in their ways extremely quickly.

An application would be if you wanted to be more mindful you would spend the duration of your high in mindful meditation, or if you wanted to be more active or do your homework ect. It reinforces behaviour which is a double edged sword that the majority are unaware of, smoking pot and sitting around all day will teach your mind that sitting around all day is what you should be doing.

[–]brideboy points points [recovered] | Copy

You got that right.

I discovered that around my late teens and have been using weed as a reset button ever since.

Id literally sit around and and notice the way my body configured itself on the couch. Notice my posture, notice my anxious thought patterns, notice my fear of other peoples opinions.

And id correct it. I started transitioning before theredpill, but the redpill gave me a frame of mind I could add to my already exsisting, admittedly weak, frame.

[–]IWonTheRace32 points33 points  (16 children) | Copy

Hijacking this thread because I am being redpilled right now. I am 27 years old and I finally understand the redpill.

I am looking back at my childhood and all I can think about is how I was raised that made me into who I am today. A pot smoking, lazy ass, PC gaming, no-body.

I feel ashamed of myself of my current state, and I sit here high off of trees as I type this.

I don't blame anybody but myself for not being a productive person in my community.

I get up and go to work, spend 12 hours away from home and bring home barely more than a liveable wage, and a live lifestyle that I currently now dread.

Everyday, I come home and sit down at my PC and play video games all night. That's my type of gratification in this scenario. Once I start to play games, I feel a "reward" type gratification when I do play games. I work hard a work, and come home and relax to play games. It feels good, but I don't feel complete.

If I have a day off, I am playing video games all day. I have only a few friends I see and talk to everyday, but I'm insistent to go out and pursue my old hobbies again and restart friendships I have lost.

I tell myself everyday that I want to do this, and that. I never thought of that I will "feel better" if I actually do those things. I have intrusive thoughts about the rewards of completing something, but my mind tells me "no I should be doing this", which is my current state and I am going to try and break out of it tomorrow morning.

I have been programmed to think about, "sitting at home and do nothing because there is 'nothing' to do", kinda thing everyday. I see the pill, and I'm going to swallow it.

Mind you, I am hard-of-hearing and many other HoH, Deaf Culture folks will tell you what it is like growing up in the Hearing world.

I find myself to be very highly rational person, but my social skills is very bad, and my childhood history has a huge role into who I am today. see description of me above.

I can be social when I force myself to engage, but it's not just a constant struggle, I just don't want to. When I do socialize, I don't often say the words correctly, or my voice will mumble, and I would get harassed by peers who I am engaged with everyday for 27 years. Being a HoH, ASL and spoken English user has a HUGE toll on my life. I am currently stuck living with my mother This type of social circle for me was much prominent in my childhood years until after I dropped out of college nearly 2 years ago.

I was skeptical that my college system here at home over-saturates the job market by hosting large classes with very narrow career paths that you can't get not only with out a diploma, but with a HUGE pool of talent that you will have to compete with to get that "one" job.

I am already in the trades, but the trade I am in is taking a toll on my body at the moment and I am thinking about becoming an electrician. There is a decline in this trade, and a lot of "men" where I live think they are entitled to more money without having to do any work or learn a desired skill.

I have many skills, and I am sure many of you have many skills. But we aren't utilizing ourselves of how we should be because not only have MANY men have been redpilled and actually carry out having a "life" that a lot of basement dwellers dare to have, but have lack of motivation to do so.

My childhood consists of "go to your room" type parenting. Although I had freedom, but I also did not have a father around and my mother "became" a lazy person, and does absolutely nothing. Her health is declining, and I still want to continue having a mother for the next 20 or so years because family is important, but her simply not combating the problem by doing something about it by getting off her lazy butt and walk up a block or two every fucking day instead of "when I feel like I can do it", even though I know she perfectly can despite her declining health. I help her everyday, but my words don't affect her one as she refuses to listen and has a "do what she wants" do to attitude. She also blames others for her "pains" she feels, but it does not affect me at all when she throws that crap at me.

I am glad I can see these things now. Having to address them in a new profound way will be difficult, but having to do it and put my mind to trying the things I should be doing is going to start tomorrow.

I can't fix my old issues, it will never change. I can change the future, I just have to manipulate it into my favor and that "reward" will come. All I can do is move forward and create new opportunities for myself so that in 30 years, I can thank myself and this post for waking me up to realizing I should be human by going outside and getting more involved with my community and contribute and tap my inner self to be a civilized human being. I'm going to complete a mother fucking task now and keep moving forward until I drop dead asleep on my bed tonight and stop being a lazy fuck.

tl:dr/ I have been redpilled today and I think I am going to stop being a lazy fuck* and actually do something about my lazy ass lifestyle and complete some tasks until I go to bed tonight.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (4 children) | Copy

Remember, when starting down a path of improvement, the changes you see in yourself must be significant enough to make up for the withdrawal of dopamine. For example, if you're dieting (depriving yourself of dopamine from tasty food) the dopamine you receive from your visible change in body composition must at least be equal. If not, you won't feel motivated enough to keep it up. This is why no one sticks to their goals. The reward isn't enough in the short term, so they cave. My point here, is make sure you give everything you do a full effort; it's required to stick it out.

[–]IWonTheRace0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

So the harder I push myself into continuing myself to success, the discipline into releasing the euphoric feeling of dopamine becomes greater once goals, long and short, start to be met?

If I go to the gym to work out 4 days a week until forever, and the significant effects of the change I see in myself is immensely positive and rewarding... does that mean I'm winning?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

You got it! The only thing reinforcing one behaviour or action as "good" or "bad" is our brain's reward center. If you gym it 5 days a week for two months and see no progress (because you aren't training like a savage) you won't be rewarded that much. It'll be proportional to your effort, at least.

[–]RedDeadCred0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

On that note, this is why habits are much more likely to stick when you incorporate them gradually. Instead of giving up everything at once and learning new healthy recipes and totally changing your diet, you can stop just cutting out processed junk food and soda, then once that becomes a habit after a month or longer, you can move to the next thing.

Once the dopamine from the change normalizes it is no longer stressful to maintain.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I suppose this is true. I tried quick and dirty dieting for years. Cutting calories without counting them or watching my macros. For years I fucked around, starved one day, binged the next without any clear plan. For me, everything changed when I got MyFitnessPal and a digital scale and weighed everything. Within three months I went from 20%bf to 15, the 15 to 10 in the next 4 or 5. I've come back up to ~14 in the last couple months despite "trying" to continue cutting. Getting off track was due to final exam stress (imbalance of hormones) and then moving back home (distraction and environment change). I so badly need to be back living on my own so I can be focused again.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

Well written. You may also be suffering from depression. If possible look into seeing a psychologist or a councilor. Start taking baby steps in the right direction.

[–]IWonTheRace1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I suffered from depression. I have seen them before. I grew out of depression and has no affect on my life at all. I know what depression is like and having to fight through it. I am no longer fighting depression because I ended up telling myself to not let it control my life any more and snapped out of it.

Thanks for your concerns though!

[–]brideboy points points [recovered] | Copy

Too much talk about the future, not enough do.

Come back and let us know when youre actually started.

[–]IWonTheRace2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

So I started by walking into my locals electrical union and gathered information about becoming an apprentice. Second step is getting my Grade 12 physics credit in June. It's free to get here, just have to take online courses. I'm going to take an advantage of this opportunity to get that on my transcript so that I have a higher chance of getting on in the pre-apprentice program.

So yes, I started today. Baby steps man. :D

[–]theONE8436630 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Don't shit on PC gaming bro. It saved my life once. Still got a top end PC but I rarely play. But I still play. Why? Cuz I can do it guilt free now.

[–]IWonTheRace3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Masterrace reporting in. I love PC gaming. Playing CS series for 17 years and Starcraft franchise for 19. I play other games too, but those are my main games.

Mind you, I'm not a 400 lb hacker.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Damn well put. I do that same exact thing daily. Multiple times I'll evaluate my current mental state and either smile because my frame and thoughts are rock solid or if not, will positive, testosterone fueled thoughts into my head. The more you catch and edit your unconcious thoughts, the more it comes naturally.

[–]BasketCase5594 points5 points  (25 children) | Copy

Interesting. I smoke pot, but I only smoke at night after I've done everything I need to do for the day. So at that point if I want to just sit around before I go to bed, it's okay.

My question is, is this habit programming me to be lazy, because when I'm high I'm not doing anything? Or does it program me to be productive because I don't get high until I take care of all my shit for the day?

[–]brainsack2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

very loosely put, nothing is wrong if it doesn't get in the way of your goals and progress.

[–]RedDeadCred7 points8 points  (9 children) | Copy

Weed reduces the areas of your brain that respond to dopamine. It should be used sparingly, certainly not every day. All drugs do. Even caffeine and nicotine. People need these drugs because they use these drugs.

[–]DeathToTheZog2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

I wish I could show you how wrong you are. Weed actually makes me want to lift harder, heavier, and longer. Coffee doesn't even effect my sleep in the slightest. I could drink a cup and go to bed right after.

Everyone is not the same.

[–]RedDeadCred0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

So you're a special snowflake

[–]DeathToTheZog-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy

I bet you would never say that to my face.

[–]TunedtoPerfection4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy

Weed reduces the areas of your brain that respond to dopamine.

Totally incorrect.

It has been theorized that heavy marijuana users have a slower release of dopamine in a very certain area of the brain. The area concerned is responsible able for attention, memory, and learning new skills. But as far as I know that study failed to prove that this finding wasn't a pre existing condition or not.

All that means is you'll be slower to pick up new skills if you smoke a log of weed. If you stop eventually the release rate will be restored.

[–]RedDeadCred5 points6 points  (3 children) | Copy

I'll link the study when I'm not on mobile.

It's a nice fantasy that there's some perfect drug that drastically alters your conciousmess that you can use every day with no real side effects, but that's just not how the brain works.

Weed culture is a provider of many blue pills. It's fine in moderation, and it's far from the worst thing you can do, but you are believing in a unicorn.

[–]TunedtoPerfection0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

I know and understand the long term side effects of smoking(vaping) marijuana much better then most people. It's far from the perfect drug and 95% of users overdose to get "high". But used as an actual medicinal product, it's not nearly as bad as everyone tries to make it out to be. Especially when you have a temperature control vaporizer and you can basically chose which compounds to release and which to not.

But what your actually talking about is THC which is the compound that is psychoactive. But did you know if you release CBD and THC-A at the same time while minimizing heat that THC-A no longer becomes psychoactive THC?

Weed has progress much farther past just smoking joints, sadly most people don't realize the this.

[–]RedDeadCred0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I've heard about medicinal weed that can be consumed in a way that's it's not psychoactive, but admittedly I don't know much about it. Perhaps in that form it works more as a nutritional supplement and the drawbacks are inconsequential.

Without knowing much, though, I can still safely say that if it's not lighting your brain up and drastically altering your conciousness than it can't be compared to what 99% of people are using weed for.

[–]TunedtoPerfection0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The only medicinal weed that can be consumed ad nauseam no matter the delivery device is extremely high CBD strains(Charlotte's web, Harlequin, etc.) that are specifically manufactured for medical patient and relatively hard to find unless you have a CBD activist in your area.

But if you start look into the vaporization temperature of the various marijuana compounds you can tart to see trends in when the compounds release vs their medical/psychoactive benefits. This allows users with the proper equipment and knowledge to utilize any marijuana strain for medical relief without risking psychoactive effects if they wish.

I work with many families, including co workers, to share that knowledge to provide relief and happiness to their families. I'm a big CBD activist in my area for that very reason.

[–]Bisuboy2 points3 points  (13 children) | Copy

I do the same with video games. ONLY after a hard day of doing things, or for a whole day as a reward for a hard exam or something.

I have put some thought into this. Of course, if you stop being productive at 8PM you will not do some things that you could have done. You could be more efficient.

However, what is life about? Is it about spending every second being productive? Not for me. I think I would get depressive or burned-out if I didn't allow myself to relax for a few hours every night (if I have the time).

What about you?

[–]RedDeadCred3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

The paradox is the more you allow high dopamine activities, the less you have available for the shit that matters. So letting loose every day only makes you need to let loose more often, as your brain adjusts to the expectation of high dopamine at night and then begins screaming at you to provide it when you dont.

[–]BargainBinBoyfriend1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

My problem is that when I play video games at night as a "reward", I end up staying up way too late... I've had too many "holy shit, it's 2 am" moments while playing Fallout.

[–]BasketCase5590 points1 point  (9 children) | Copy

Interesting response. Personally, I like to be as productive as possible. However, if I'm playing a video game, I'm already being somewhat unproductive. So, although I don't play video games to be productive, I do like to get as much stuff done as I can, as quickly as possible.

[–]theONE8436630 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy

You can play video games to be productive by playing a racing simulator with full wheel a shifter setup. Practice your heel toe and what not. At least you're learning skills.

[–]BasketCase5590 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy

While there are some minor benefits from playing video games, I think in the vast majority of cases you could find a better use for your time.

[–]theONE8436632 points3 points  (6 children) | Copy

Going to the track costs $200. I ain't spending that. I'm gonna ride from the comfort of my home. But it's funny how people on here are fine with smoking weed and drinking alcohol...but shit on video games cuz it's cool to shit on video games.

[–]BasketCase5590 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

I know what you mean. I play video games whenever I get some free time and have nothing better to do, like before bed on week nights. But I think the extrinsic value of it is very limited.

Your case is a unique one and I can see the value in that. It's an exception to the rule. I don't have much interest in racing games, but I could get into them if I had a steering wheel and pedals and gear shifter. How much would all that cost?

[–]theONE8436632 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

Depends. Anywhere from $100-$10,000. For all intents and purposes, a used Logitech g27 will suffice. I got mine used (mint) for $250 Canadian. Recommended game is project cars and/or asetto Corsa.

Also, it's better if you have triple displays. I've got 3 27" curved monitors aligned nicely although I do think VR is going to make it useless for gaming. But it's very nice for productivity. You won't know how much you need multiple displays in your life until you​ get it. Works wonders for productivity.

You won't know how much you need curved monitors until you get em lol. Practically no eye strain.

[–]BasketCase5591 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

Yeah sounds like a big investment. I just spent around $400 for a GTX 1060 and a better power supply (including installation) so I am in no hurry but it does seem like a lot of fun! You think it would be worth getting the wheel/pedals/shifter if just have a standard 1080p monitor?

[–]rovon22 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I smoke pot and it helps me focus on whatever task I need to get done. I actually feel guilty sitting around doing nothing.

[–]ag_blank1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

being high is artificial happiness

the drug gives you tons of dope-amine, telling you that everything is cool. after it wears off, the shittyness of life strikes you

I prefer to be sober and frustrated with my deadlines most of the time, at least it keeps me pushing forward

[–]Shaman66240 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Wow, a bit late but this totally connects to a saying I heard somewhere about the (indian?) god of mj or so that when you don't do anything he works against you but when you do something it works with you.

[–]Shaman66240 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

So would you go out and game girls while high? Or is only mentally reinforcing the way you want to go with your life enough?

[–]_Goebbels-2 points-1 points  (1 child) | Copy

This whole thing kinda reminds me of that one episode in Breaking Bad

[–]new__vision44 points45 points  (2 children) | Copy

Great article.

Charles Duhigg, author of 'The Power of Habit', says that every habit consists of three parts:

  1. Cue - Leaving gym clothes by the bed
  2. Routine - Go to the gym
  3. Reward - Feel good after the workout from endorphins/anandamide

He recommends temporarily using an artificial reward like chocolate until the intrinsic reward (like feeling good after a workout) becomes enough to drop the chocolate.

Your strategy is similar, but instead of using a temporary reward, you bring the future intrinsic reward to the present. It seems like this could have advantages over using an artificial reward.

How to create a habit: With Charles Duhigg and Ramit Sethi

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

I lol when I read the chocolate part. When I have a cheat meal, I go buy 6 or 12 donuts and eat them all. I find I'm only satisfied (dopamine) when I eat that many.

[–]Nikelu0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I'm happy if I eat half a kg of meat with a carb so it seems as I have programmed my brain to work like this

[–]areks12317 points18 points  (1 child) | Copy

Thanks for that advice. It sounds simple and straightforward but I never thought about it like that. Im gonna try.

[–]BasketCase55925 points26 points  (2 children) | Copy

Great post. There have been related studies on children regarding their ability to delay gratification. In these experiments, a child is sat down at a table with a jar of cookies. They are instructed that they will be rewarded with 2 cookies if they promise not to touch them for a indefinite amount of time. The children are then left alone with the cookies and watched on hidden cameras.

What's interesting is that the children who were able to delay gratification and not touch the cookies were generally smarter, and if I'm not mistaken, the researchers followed up with the participants years later and found that the ability to delay gratification was a strong predictor of future success. Not sure how they quantified that, but it makes sense and parallels your post.

Our ability to delay gratification is only being diminished further by today's society of "I want it now." Having to voluntarily delay reward is becoming a thing of the past. My 13 year old brother can't even comprehend the concept of me making him wait until his birthday before I give him his present.

[–]G_Petronius points points [recovered] | Copy

There's a different experiment with more immediate applicability to this method. Children were placed in front of candy and told that if they didn't eat the candy they would get popcorn. Research then instructed a portion of the children to think about how good the popcorn would taste, its warmth, its crunchiness etc; that measurably helped the kids pass the test. It's one of the pieces of research that pushed me in this direction.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

My Arnold posters serve me well

[–]aigamithite5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy

I would add that after you do it spend 30 seconds or so congratulating yourself even if it's something trivial. If you don't do it, very gently say "Next time I will do my best to do it".

This type of positive reinforcement goes a very, very long way, because parts of your brain wants you to stay inert and others want you to become active. Positive reinforcement consciously, signals these parts that it's good for the organism to stay active, and over time changes their response.

Just go back in time and find any intimidating task you had to do, and that you enjoy now, and think about how the tables turned. What was going on through your mind while doing it the first time? The second time? What were you feeling?

Also always exaggerate the rewards and downplay the difficulties.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

I would add that after you do it spend 30 seconds or so congratulating yourself even if it's something trivial.

This is advice I got from a psychiatrist when I was trying to persuade my way into a legit prescription for a certain stimulant. With my method I did notice a natural tendency to want to celebrate even after just a little achievement, which I definitely didn't have before; I'd like to explore the potential usefulness of celebration in the future.

[–]aigamithite2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

This is what I do following the instructions from the Mind Illuminated; it pertains to meditation and attention that scatters during practice, but it has really, really helped me in everything else as well.

One more thing is, as long as the intent is there you always succeed. Just think of how you played catch as a kid; you intended to catch the ball and eventually you developed the eye-hand coordination required. As long as you intend to do something, and the intent itself does not abate, you will do it eventually. Intent does not mean "I will go to the gym tomorrow", it means to constantly and gently push yourself towards that direction, e.g. "I skipped gym today, but I resolve to do my best and go there at 8 pm tomorrow". And when you do go evoke as many "good feels" as you can.

100% guarantee or your money back

[–]Shortbull3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Great post! This is really interesting shit you know, would love to read more about this kind of stuff, definitely going to try it.

it's not because he has a complex rational understanding of your psychology and knows you'll reward him, it's because you've conditioned him to feel anticipation and eagerness while he's performing the tricks, which is why he performs them even when there isn't an actual food reward

Aaah poor dog

[–]ownthatshitmanup4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Amazing thank you for your contribution. These are the types of posts that's valuable.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

Your instincts are correct: discipline comes from simplifying.

Discipline comes from living with "proper form." It's like a golf swing: you want simple and repeatable actions. Over time, you learn to streamline your form and get really, really good at it.

Simplify, simplify, simplify. There is tremendous power in being single-minded.

[–]Cycix2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

This here is exactly why I stay consistent in the gym. Aside from the obvious benefits of lifting, I love how it makes me feel - I enjoy the tangible sense of progression as I lift heavier with more efficiency as the weeks go by. It has become something that goes beyond "getting a nice body," and it legitimately makes me feel good in my head. It also stops me from becoming a complete mess and trickles into other goals I have in life.

[–]truecrisis0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I'm super pissed off because I was feeling the same. Then 3 weeks into it I got sick. When I finally made it back I had lost my momentum and now struggle to get that high I had when I went every day.

I'm so jealous of you :(

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Try implementing option two for a few years, make sick gainz in physique and career. Then, get a prescription to option 1. Holy fuck, see you in Forbes bitches.

[–]hbPUA2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Great post and this is something that is super valueable to practice, as you try new things where you haven't had much success previously as reference.

Or even when it's time to take your craft to the next level. I've been procrastinating a part of my life that could really benefit from this hack. Thanks for reminding me.

[–]postreformedpua2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I really like this advice. It means you should allow yourself to feel good about the small victories. As a big picture thinker and a perfectionist I find myself putting down my accomplishments regularly because they are never 'good enough'. This post reminds me we are simple creatures. If you hit a dog for doing something right he will very quickly stop doing it.

[–]johnnygeeksheek2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Sounds like you discovered neurolingistic programing on your own.

[–]Eastuss2 points3 points  (8 children) | Copy

This is something I've tried. But from reading stuff like that, I feel like I just can't feel pleasure or pride... I just don't get it.

At the end of the day, when I've everything perfectly, I'm not happy, I feel that I hadn't time for myself at all.

When I work out, I'm satisfied by the results, but that's not strong at all. The work out itself doesn't make me happy at the end, I feel exhausted and uglier than ever. A bit like the guilt people describe after masturbating.

When I have an orgasm, I only feel the pleasure of having the physical orgasm, I've already had orgasms without ejaculation and they don't feel especially good.

When I eat junk food, I just eat until I hate myself, there's no satisfaction threshold. I'm proud of myself when having done an effort into eating well, but that's weak.

I feel like I only have the conscious reward of things, but nothing biological.

Is my reward network just broken?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

No, you're just focusing wrong

[–]Eastuss0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Have ideas of what I should do to focus right?

[–]MrTwister9595950 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

At the end of the day, when I've everything perfectly, I'm not happy, I feel that I hadn't time for myself at all.

Are you doing stuff that you actually want to do? Stuff that will lead you to where you want to be? Do you have short and long term objectives, like a year and 5 years from now? Do you know who you want to be, and not just rationally, but as in a passion?

When I work out, I'm satisfied by the results, but that's not strong at all. The work out itself doesn't make me happy at the end, I feel exhausted and uglier than ever. A bit like the guilt people describe after masturbating.

Try looking in the mirror to see the results after having a shower. Also, ugly based on what? What you think women think or what you think of your own body? Would you rather work out but remain skinny?

When I have an orgasm, I only feel the pleasure of having the physical orgasm, I've already had orgasms without ejaculation and they don't feel especially good.

Have you tried a prostate induced orgasm? Those are either mental or they don't happen at all. If it's an orgasm you achieved by having sex with a girl, does it still feel the same?

When I eat junk food, I just eat until I hate myself, there's no satisfaction threshold. I'm proud of myself when having done an effort into eating well, but that's weak.

Try paying closer attention to the flavors. I only eat junk food once in perhaps a month or two, when I do I try to get the most of it.

The same happens to me when I eat healthy, but I try to have a 70% vegetarian diet anyway. Like the article says, I focus on how my body feels after a week of eating healthy, how my abs show whereas eating pasta at least once produces the contrary effect.

It seems to me like you are more guilt driven than pleasure driven. Well, there you have my two cents. Hope it helps.

[–]Eastuss0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Hey, thanks putting time answering! :)

Are you doing stuff that you actually want to do? Stuff that will lead you to where you want to be?

living longger is one of my goal, yep... Being proud of my body, having actual abundance SMV wise. Being generally comfortable exhaustion wise. All this is rational.

My more passionate goals have more impact on my satisfaction, but they do not induce a healthy lifestyle.

Try looking in the mirror to see the results after having a shower.

well that's what I do...?

Also, ugly based on what? What you think women think or what you think of your own body? Would you rather work out but remain skinny?

I am built fat/chubby. I have a shitty looking skin (keratose is the name of the desease? skin is white with red dots), everything is flabby, molles, ect.... The overall just looks disgusting.

I am small on top of it. I can seduce women, but I know it has nothing to do with my body. Otherwise I am invisible to them.

Have you tried a prostate induced orgasm?

Masturbation/sex with anal q stimulation sometimes spice things, but anal itself doesn't build up pleasure.

Sexis basically more exhausting masturbation, the only thing making up for it is the rational mental pleasure.

Try paying closer attention to the flavors.

I try to chew more. I have no smell sens, the basic flavours: salt, sugar, sour, carbs, texture , those are the only thing making things taste good. I have found lit of healthy thing that I like, but it'll never beat carbs and fats effect in my mouth.

Like you said I am probably guilt driven. I may eat healthy for several day, stomach and belly would deflate and mzke me feel well, therefore the bad feeling of overeating disapears and I feel like eating shit again. The longgest died I've done was 4 month long and I lost 15 pounds during it.

Guilt driven motivation disappears at first progress. I,should look how to gather motivation elsewhere.

[–]MrTwister9595950 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Hey, thanks putting time answering! :)

No problem pal, let's see...

living longger is one of my goal, yep... Being proud of my body, having actual abundance SMV wise. Being generally comfortable exhaustion wise. All this is rational.

I was thinking more of "five years from now, I want to be a surgeon" kind of goals. For example, I want to be majored in International Relations 5 years from now.

My more passionate goals have more impact on my satisfaction, but they do not induce a healthy lifestyle.

Try finding something that does and that you love. For example, I'm learning a martial art and five years from now I want to be a black belt, which forces me to train regularly and the training keeps me fit.

well that's what I do...?

Haha sorry about that one.

I am built fat/chubby. I have a shitty looking skin (keratose is the name of the desease? skin is white with red dots), everything is flabby, molles, ect.... The overall just looks disgusting.

Have you checked with a dermatologist?

I am small on top of it. I can seduce women, but I know it has nothing to do with my body. Otherwise I am invisible to them.

I'm small too. Don't let that discourage you. Through workout and good diet you can develop an athletic body; then what's left is your hairstyle and what you wear. Personally I go for classy hairstyles, nothing fancy or that you'd see a soccer player wearing. And I always dress sharp, which helps show off my athletic body.

If you're American, let me tell you that this is what I found to be a common mistake among American men. Try a more European style if you haven't, I'd recommend that you shop at Zara, and go the extra mile and wear slim fit shirts instead of t-shirts. If you do wear a t-shirt, make it slim fit and classy - no patterns or drawings, plain black, white or go with a bold color. What you wear also improves confidence. If you're chubby then you might want to ask a second opinion since slim fit clothing could have adverse effects, but since you work out I believe you should be fine.

Masturbation/sex with anal q stimulation sometimes spice things, but anal itself doesn't build up pleasure.

That's what I meant, if you're aiming for a prostate orgasm you don't touch your dick at all because then you don't have one, it's just a spiced up regular orgasm. The only way you can have a prostate induced orgasm is by concentrating on the feelings and letting go of thoughts like "this is gay" or "now I don't feel much". The sensation builds up until you orgasm like a woman would, it's stronger than a regular orgasm. Otherwise you can stimulate it all you want but you won't orgasm from your prostate. You can do this with your fingers but you're likely to end up tired - I'd try a prostate hands free stimulator if you can afford it. If you don't enjoy regular orgasms that much this could help you be more pleasure driven and teach you a few things.

Sexis basically more exhausting masturbation, the only thing making up for it is the rational mental pleasure.

That's unusual, I get less tired from sex. Are you a passionate guy in bed? Do you touch the girl everywhere, all the time or do you just focus in the in and out motion?

I try to chew more. I have no smell sens, the basic flavours: salt, sugar, sour, carbs, texture , those are the only thing making things taste good. I have found lit of healthy thing that I like, but it'll never beat carbs and fats effect in my mouth.

No smell sense? Do you know why?

As for the healthy diet, I eat salad. Most people think you grow tired of it but it's not true if you know how to prepare one. I stack layers of ingredients. I add a layer of lettuce, then a layer of rocket/roquette, tomatoes (the little juicy ones) and small pieces of onion. I then add olives, tuna, blue cheese, carrot slices, hard boiled egg - whatever I feel like adding really. Layering helps it look much tastier. Afterwards I add salt, vinegar, some high end olive oil (not the cheap stuff), or go with ceasar salad dressing which you can find in most supermarkets.

Sure, nothing beats a good piece of meat, and pasta is great too, but I don't feel like shit after eating one of these.

Like you said I am probably guilt driven. I may eat healthy for several day, stomach and belly would deflate and mzke me feel well, therefore the bad feeling of overeating disapears and I feel like eating shit again. The longgest died I've done was 4 month long and I lost 15 pounds during it.

Perhaps the issue is that you do "a" diet (a challenge). To me eating healthy is not about losing fat although that comes with it, it's about the good feeling it leaves in my body. I like being fit, that's why I stick with it.

Guilt driven motivation disappears at first progress. I,should look how to gather motivation elsewhere.

In my experience the motivation that doesn't disappear is the one that is always going for more. I just snapped out of like two weeks of feeling like shit by realizing I wasn't in control of my life and that I didn't have any long term goals, even though I had a few short term ones. After setting some by writing them and sticking them to the to my bedroom's door I feel much better and I really want to stick to the plan. Of course, this is where discipline comes in since the initial motivation always whithers a bit, but that's another topic.

[–]Eastuss0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I have a steady job that is about what I like to do, I don't want to work more than 40h a week so I am not likely to try and seek a better job of the same kind because they'll expect more responsibilities and availabilities. I have personal projects on the side that could eventually turn into business, and, with luck and hardwork, could make me really wealthy. It just requires me to put time into it, which is the problem.

I love martial art but I'm picky, the only available ones in my area are not very versatile, I used to practice one in my teenage years that would work on most aspects of martial art.

Have you checked with a dermatologist?

Yep, I can sightly mitigate the shit look of my skin through lot of effort. It should get better now that I'm 30 but I don't see it. White men that are very muscular and bathing in testosterone tend to have the same shitty skin quality tho.

I'm small too. Don't let that discourage you.

I'm not creepingly insecure, I'm married with a kid (and that's mostly why my discipline took a hit this year), what I do is mainly to improve and to keep my relationship with wife healthy as well as give a good example to my child. I'm just aware that I'm not gifted and shouldn't expect exterior attention to boost my ego.

Sharp dressing is for when I'll have flatten that belly. Good posture and more defined shoulders improved my aspect significantly and it does work with most clothes.

I'm european. :3

Are you a passionate guy in bed? Do you touch the girl everywhere, all the time or do you just focus in the in and out motion?

Yes. I also need lot of time to build pleasure, that's why it's sometimes exhausting. I do want to have sex often, but 1h to 1h30 of sex once per day is just not acceptable considering my little free time.

No smell sense? Do you know why?

Nose infections + medicine apparently burned it when I was a baby. Outside that, I don't know.

I can eat vegetables, salad, spinach, broccoli, green beans. They just taste like nothing and there aren't much thing that can bring in taste. usually I use fat free cheese. Olive oil, spices, aromatic plants, these things aren't likely to help. :P

What changed since last year is what I put in my normal meals. But there are still "cheat meals" and they're way too common. When I say diet, I mean eating normally with only one cheat meal per week and without shitty snacks here and there. I know my macros and what's contained in what I eat, I weight carbs and can be careful, the problem is really just discipline at that point.

[–]Not_Me_Here2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Hey, I am an adderall user and this is what I have to say about this:

I simply can't achieve what I'm doing without my medication. I think I remember my first day being high. I was about 6 years old, I don't remember which medication it was, it was likely methylphenidate (ritalin) since this is what they normally gives to kids, but I think it was amphetamin since I remember eating caps that looks like the dexedrine brand (pure dextro-amphetamin) and it wasn't concerta nor ritalin brand (got ritalin later).

I would walk out of the bus to my sitter's home, then I get in front of the door and I am suddenly stressed. I normally knock, say 'Hi [name], I "didn't" (or "did", but that was less common at that time) get a star' (the teacher would stamp a star in a calendar when good behavior).

Do I have to knock the door? I do it all the time, why? Do I say hi ? Do I talk about the star I've got? Isn't all that weird stuff to say? Am I behaving awkwardly? What should I do?

So I entered without knocking, didn't say anything. My sitter told me about this and asked me why I didn't say the stuff I usually say and asked me to say it next time.

And I guess it explains why I became so awkward and weird by the time. So I took different kind of medication for 16 to 17 years, ended on adderall at 12 years old. I remember still being awake at 3 AM, trying to sleep at 15 years old pretty much every day on medication, I've had a lot of sleep disorder when I was young. I was a gamer at that time, I would go through my day just so I could finally play games, loved them. Then, I stopped medication at 16 years old for about 8 months. I suddenly had more friends, hanged out way more often, still played video game, but less. So yeah, something is mess up with these, I guess I didn't live my childhood, I remember my parents giving me ritalin to go play baseball at evening, I wonder why I couldn't sleep (I didn't like baseball, weather I was or wasn't on medication by the way). I don't know what would have been my life if I haven't been on med (or at least, being dosed the right way when I started adderall, I seriously had heavy sleep disorder because of it, and knowing how potent adderall is today, it defenitely is dumb as fuck to give that to teenagers, damn need to sleep, what the fuck... still can't believe it when I think about it, so nasty).

Today, I guess I can't recover from that, in fact, I might even need it for real (I'm considering the fact that I've used it my whole life, which might have caused a bigger issue). My parents told me that I was a different kid (before my medication), explaining that other kids would go there and I would do whatever else I was into. I believe I wasn't made for the system I had to undergo. I get a deep look at my past, and I have screwed so much. My future is clean at least, now I know, I guess I won't ever be able to be close to my family.

Why I'm still taking those ? Cause I know how it works, I have found how to use it properly and I also lowered the dosage (my doctor always want me to raise the dosage... doesn't want to give me shorter brand like dexedrine which would be better for sleep). I also use speed paste, and I'll have to make a longer run on random meds cause now my insurance cover less of adderall medication. I tried many time to stop, I'm just uncontrollable, it's non sens. I sometimes have a hard time doing what I actually want to do without medication. Not only this, but I am also not as performant, I'm simply even more good at everything (except maybe social).

Definitely don't recommend, I have been through a lot of procedure before getting medication, psys, doctors, brain scan, I don't know what they found, but they seem to have found something. Or I'm just another junkie kid, who knows...

Tips for those who use it:

1) Stop it

2) Repeat step 1

3) If you're still reading, you might be screwed, stop it before it's too late...

4) Use vitamin D and eat grain (nuts, seed, lentils, pea, natural butter peanut, food containing magnesium), I haven't tested on full dose, but I now even wake up earlier naturally and sleep very well (finally)

5) Lift 6 times a week, every muscle, try to do it before dosing or during come down

6) You can set your alarm to take your pill about 1 hour before waking so you wake up easily and promote the fact that it will come down earlier so you might be able to sleep, but you might be wasting productive time if you don't start working right away out of bed.

7) Remember to eat. Keep sunflower seed around or whatever healthy food you can afford to eat all the time.

8) Drink tons of water, it's good for tons of reasons.

9) You can at least try to lower your dosage. Since adderall is extent period, you can try to find short meds (or speed paste, but you have to check it is pure and know the heck you doing!!! Don't really recommend unless you're really good at getting stuff). I always keep some on me so if I'm not high enough, I can dose it, it will start very quickly if you do it subliminally (in case you need it fast).

10) Remember to not give a fuck about what other people think

Another thing, if you're on these meds, then you should definitely do more stuff. I mean, it allows you to be over productive, so instead of just fucking with dopamine, you should assert that you're doing way more than you could, so maybe one day you can stop it cause you have enough wealth.

[–]Subbs1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'll be sure and try this. I believe your method is definitely linked with why positive visualization is so heavily recommended in self-help books, basically convincingly simulate the experience of getting a reward and you'll feel like you really did, putting you in a mindset where really getting your desired outcome becomes easier.

[–]MisterMandanglelow1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

This is a good post. Seems society has been built to favor instant gratification, which is counter to what we as men need to think/feel about our actions in order to build the badass lives we want to live. Yeah of course there's a time and a place for instant gratification, but those times should be in part manifested by the hard actions we have taken earlier to better ourselves. So the moments of instant gratification are really happening because of the work we put into improving ourselves

[–]Frinkey1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I've been a lurker in this sub, don't think I've ever posted. But this is one of the best posts I've seen on here. Nice job, OP!

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Conversely to positive emotions, you can conjure up guilt and shame.

Instead of envisioning the reward of completing a task, imagine not doing it. Let that shame of being a sloth motivate you to complete your goals, maintain discipline, etc.

Guilt and shame can be powerful motivators but if left unchecked can do a lot of damage to your psyche.

[–]Endorsed ContributorAuvergnat1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Very interesting...

Mind sharing some specific examples of activity/feeling induced pairs you've used?

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's simple stuff really. For example, there's a cert I've delayed working on for a long time. Now, I get started by recalling how good it feels at the end of a workblock to have that behind me and to not have lost yet another day not working at this opportunity.

The trick is not in summoning some special type of feeling that does the trick, but in consciously reinforcing a mechanism that is already there; a mechanism which is atrophied in most people because they're not used to using it. You're already meant to know that you'll feel good after doing some useful work, you just need to remember and actualize that feeling to put you over the laziness edge.

[–]Frigzy1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Every effort has a certain point at which it becomes fun. Fun can occur in various different ways. (Feeling strong after workouts, actually solving hard equations with ease, mental clarity after meditation, ...)

Instead of focussing on the hard part that proceeds the fun part, prime your brain with the idea of having fun while doing the effort until the fun becomes reality.

The problem is that the hard part always proceeds the fun part, hence the term effort. It is very easy to narrow the effort down to the hard part while subconsciously erasing the fun part that lies behind it. By doing so, you condition yourself to believe that no amount of hard work will ever enable you to enjoy the fun part. You have lost confidence in your ability to reach the fun part.

At the end of the day just thinking about the fun part is not enough. It is the genuine confidence that you can and will (eventually) reach the fun part that will help you do the necessary work.

The best part in all of this is that the benefits from reaching the fun part are cumulative and empower your confidence to succeed in the future. It's an upward spiral for success that in turn will grant you the fun of being a succesful and accomplished person overall.

It's basically a quick guide to getting high on life.

I have experienced that it is best to start with one action and focus on it until it forms a habit. Then on to the next. Too many at once will be counterproductive.

[–]glowing_eyed_monster1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Thanks for the article.

A very similar idea is covered by Maxwell Maltz in his book Psycho-Cybernetics (Wikipedia).

His core idea is that one operates according to his own self-image; what one believes to be true about himself. He argues that we must replace a negative self-image with a positive one in order to change our habits. We can do this using imagination; by vivdly imagining ourselves carrying out certain tasks in a perfect way, we can create new memories and thus change our beliefs about ourselves. That in turn changes our self-image and one will find himself acting automatically in a new way.

Some motivational speakers including Tony Robbins use the methods described in the book as foundation for their own theories. The psychological training of Olympic athletes is also based on the concepts of Psycho-Cybernetics.

For those who are interested I recommend reading the book. It was written 1960, when self-help books were still self-help books.

[–]CallMeHaseo2 points3 points  (7 children) | Copy

Adderall eh? how would I get a hold of some? For research purposes of course 😜

[–]TheRiseAndFall8 points9 points  (4 children) | Copy

Adderall trades future energy and ability for right now. You are borrowing against yourself and have to take long periods off to recover after.

A more sustainable solution can be had using much safer nootropics. I have recently come across it and began hacking my way in. So far the results have been positive.

At the moment I am using racetams in combination with modafinil to keep myself alert and concentrating. I recommend doing some research on both. There is even a sub with plenty of info on these called nootropics.

I am using adrafinil, because modafinil is illegal without prescription, but this takes a toll on your liver, so can only take it a couple times a week. Adrafinil gets processed by the liver into modafinil. Somehow the FDA majorly fucked up and made modafinil a scheduled drug instead of adrafinil. Modafinil has almost no negative sideffects to speak of. And the ones it does are minor at worst.

This will not quite give you the Adderall feel, but these supplements are well researched and known to have few sideffects, and none of them are very negative.

The best part about these is that they do not fuck with your dopamine levels and thus do not fry your brain from the inside out.

[–]landon0420 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

I wonder how modafinil is, also you can check out plenty real modalert sources even on reddit I think it's r / modadropship .

I think that stuff is better than nootropics, I tried nootropics and they're definitely good so I'm excited to test that.

you could look up blends of nootropics on the subreddit and buy bulk powders on the cheap or this website

I remember coming up on it on amazon years ago when I was younger and tried it, during this huge english test(high school) I was like holeeey shiet. I remember my friend trying it and his vision got better(all your senses will I think, not just mental focus) he said he could read the hand on a clock from down a long hallway lol.

I'd suggest checking out there other products, not advertising for them just giving my .02 you could probably buy bulk powders and recreate their formulas because they're expensive it's just a trade off. time or money.

I gotta try modalert in the future to see what's better because people don't realize these things exist and yes there is a hyugeee difference

[–]RedDeadCred2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

The reality is every peak has a corresponding valley. There are no free drugs. The brain is adaptive. When external substances alter it, it adapts to the stimulus. It's like Newtons law of physics. Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.

Nootropics are for acute use. When you have some event you need to perform better for, with the understanding there will be a corresponding reduction in your capacity following the use.

The only truly consequence-free substances are quality nutrition and sleep. Some nootropics fall in the nutrition category, like low doses of Choline, but it's easy to cross into a dependent state when taken regularly.

By the way, this is coming from someone whose used a fuuuck load of nootropics. There is no free lunch.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I took modafinil (with a prescription) for a while, tested myself as best as I could and noticed zero effect apart from increased wakefulness (annoying more than anything as I have trouble catching sleep). Others report entirely different experiences so don't take mine to be representative.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

In my experience, modafinil makes me feel like a robot for about 10-12 hours. Diminished, practically non-existent need for food, sleep, and water (which isn't particularly healthy) but with a superhuman attention span and ability to focus on simple or complex tasks for extended periods of time. You gotta be careful though, it's very easy to spend the period doing something useless, like playing some video game, instead of something productive. Just like adderall, it only increases your ability to get shit done, it doesn't help you get started on the shit you should be doing.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It may be easier to get modafinil instead of adderall. It's far less stimulating, and as a result is much less damaging to your system (and less addictive) but you can still get the superhuman attention span. You can get modafinil with bitcoins from many places online.

[–]CallMeHaseo0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I actually have some modafinil in my room lol I haven't used it in a while.. but do you use these for studying?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

No. I tried moda for a while, never did anything except keep me awake.

[–]landon0420 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

after the first sentence thought it was gonna be a post on modafinil,

some people says it makes them god like. still have yet to try it

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

The only thing modafinil (bought with a prescription in a real pharmacy, so little doubt over the actual content) ever did for me was keep me awake. Which is not surprising given that that's what it's supposed to do. Never noticed any nootropic effect, although many swear to it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I dunno if I'd call modafinil a nootropic, as far as the conventional definition goes. I don't think it increases mental capabilities at all, just lets you work on boring shit for a long time without getting distracted.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Wow, man ! Can't thank you enough for this ! I'll definitely give it a try !

[–]whenfoom0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This is all NLP you've never heard of it.

[–]bookofcookies0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

For me I have the mantra find the joy while doing the task and not before. Helped me since.

[–]Zeparic0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I suffer tremendously from the issues you have detailed here, particularly the incessant toiling I have with myself on a biweekly basis; where I'm either feeling on the right track for a while or as though I'm wasting away. Presently I'm on the downhill side of things, I'm tired, late for work, masturbate habitually, and all around disconnected. It's a drag just to write this down, but I know I need help and I'm willing to try anything at this point.

I just wrote down this post in a notebook and titled it "G_Petronius' 'Back-Shift' Method" I have a couple of questions.

As a preemptive safeguard against my own undisciplined lifestyle I'm going to list, as it were "Areas of Improvement" for instance financial, academic, physical, aesthetic, etc., in order to compartmentalize these facets of my life and in them I'm going to recall as many positive rewards that I've experienced and write them down. In doing so I can review these notes and hopefully ease the process of evoking the desire of reward.

Does evocation need to be more organic or do you think there's utility in this? Do you have any difficulties summoning practical emotions? Have you done something like this? I'd like some of your notes if you have any.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I think you're overcomplicating it. Start simple, build a system with notes and compartmentalization later. Take the simplest activity in which you lack discipline - it may be doing your bed every day, for example - and the rewarding feelings connected to it - both the pleasure of having smooth sheets instead of a crumpled mess on you, as well as the feeling of being a proper adult.

[–]Soggywaffle630 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Amazing post, I'll have to try this.

[–]markfeel0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It had indeed, in a sense, been tried in certain psychological studies, where people were induced to visualize their rewards to stimulate them into completing a non-rewarding task

This happens to be a topic in a book called Psycho-Cybernetics. I recommend it to anyone who struggles with the sorts of issues discussed in the post.

[–]stankovic320 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

My biggest regret is ever having taken adderall.

[–]barrelsroll0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I think Nietzsche would agree.

[–]FlatEarthShill690 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Ive used your method but gone sort of the opposite with it. What I do is shame myself endlessly when I dont do what im supposed to. At this point its second nature. When i dont go to the gym, violate my diet, or let my girl get away with some childish bullshit i feel bad about myself. Its been working out pretty well so far.

[–]Shaman66240 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Bit late but you can probably do it even faster if you also focus on the NEGATIVE consequences of not doing the task or of not changing certain aspects about yourself.

What if I stay a pot-smoking gaming loser How will I feel about myself then? What kind of results will I get in my life if I keep being who I am now?

In essence you already said this when you said " not feeling like a disgusting fat fuck " But you still framed it as a reward. This theory of yours is Tony Robbins 101 and he and others agree that avoidence of pain is a stronger motivator then pursuit of pleasure. So imagining the stick in conjunction with the carrot is the most effective.

[–]Lefeudufou0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Thank you, very interesting!

[–]Sumsar010 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Dont take any ADHD drug. It might help with concentration. But it will stress you out and make you beta. It made me almost fail Quantum mechanics (wish i had so i could re-take it). If you have a tendency to overthink it will only make it worse.

I took Elvanse for little more than half a year on prescription and it have probably fucked any chance of me getting a PhD in physics.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Can't say that was my experience, but your mileage may vary quite a bit of course. Either way I don't recommend resorting to chemicals.

[–]foodie69-3 points-2 points  (0 children) | Copy

It makes sense why "uncensored news" is shit and not uncensored news, the mods post in redpill like little autists.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Have to agree with you there. While it makes you able to focus much better, it throws your mental hormones for a fucking loop. The paranoia, depression and anxiety that follows my study sessions were actually terrible. This is just my experience, however. Very useful during exam periods, but not a way to live.

[–]jumpinglane0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

microdosing, peeps. microdosing LSD at 10ug every third day reduces anxieties, enhances creativity and works like a 12-hour coffee. i love it, give it a shot!

[–]Not_Me_Here1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

LSD is a stimulant. It acts on serotonin similarly like MDMA and methamphetamin (methamphetamin also acts on dopamine), but it binds to a certain serotonin receptor (5-HT) instead of releasing serotonin.

LSD is a drug that is also expensive and it isn't safer than other drugs. A lot of people seems to put LSD above all, not a good idea, neither encouraging it's usage.

[–]ghosts_of_me-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy

Good call. I bet you could write an entire book exploring this topic.

[–]GOATmar-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

Hacking discipline:

Imagine I have a gun to your head and force you to do what you gotta do to not be a chode.

Would you do it?


Then you can do it without the fucking gun to your head.


[–]schmolch-1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy

There is no hacking and there is no system, there is only you. You have to be satisfied with the way you act. If you need more time, get up earlier. You might think you need the sleep, but you probably don't. Wake up 90 minutes earlier, get out of the house immediately and drive/cycle/run to the gym. By the time you are back home at the time you usually get your lazy ass out of the bed to grab your first coffee, you will already be at 100% and fully operational, proud of how you started your day. The whole fucking day you will be happy and satisfied with yourself and surprisingly it was not more difficult, it was easier because you liked what you did. Ignore the bitch, get out and lift.

[–]stawek1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Telling people to cut their sleep is the worst idea ever.

[–]schmolch0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Have a good night's sleep then. Sweet dreams.

[–][deleted] -3 points-2 points  (9 children) | Copy

"If you could take a magic pill that made you disciplined, would you?"

No! and I mean that seriously. The Nazis were disciplined, did not do them any good did it?

I know you are talking to the "lazy ass gaming nerds" here and I know your intentions are "good". However, most of the inventions that make life more comfortable come from lazy ass fucks looking for a way not to work.

So no "magic pill" for me...thanks

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (8 children) | Copy

The Nazis were disciplined, did not do them any good did it?

They did start as a tiny fringe movement, take over a major country and completely turn it around economically and militarily, so I'd say discipline definitely proved its worth there.

However, most of the inventions that make life more comfortable come from lazy ass fucks looking for a way not to work.

That's a nice meme but it's not true at all. Most inventions that make life more comfortable come from people who were so obsessed with their field that they were at it 24/7 and eventually came up with some good results that have practical applicability. Very few worthwhile inventions were produced on the impulse of laziness.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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