Summary: The best defense against oneitis isn’t to remind yourself how much women suck or to kill your emotions. It’s to embrace your emotions and learn to actually like women, but like them appropriately.
A chronic problem for men who are not accustomed to having a lot of casual sex is over-investment. Colloquially, this situation is sometimes referred to as “oneitis”. When a man who isn’t usually successful with a woman is suddenly graced with the favor of sex with her, he convinces himself that this woman is special and he is in love. After all, in his universe, she is special. Every other woman on Earth won’t have sex with him, and this one woman will, which makes her special. So his mind begins to play tricks on him and convince him that in addition to the relatively minor fact that this woman chose to have sex with him, this woman is also outstandingly beautiful, kind, loyal, loving, or any other litany of positive traits. He is then surprised and extremely hurt when she doesn’t turn out to be an amazing girlfriend, or sometimes even a girlfriend at all, because in her universe, the fact that the two of them had sex isn’t that big of a deal. Many men desire sex with her. She has sex with many men. The fact that they were having sex was only special to him, not to her.
This tendency to over-invest is one of the reasons men who suck with women do poorly. If a woman is kind to a man who is not accustomed to having a lot of positive interactions with women, his mind will make a very big deal out of this interaction. After all, most women are not kind to him, so the fact that this one woman is being kind must make her special. Because she is special to him, he begins to invest time and attention and emotions and resources into this woman. The very fact that he invests too much too quickly is often what drives women away from him. An inappropriate level of investment that a woman has not earned is creepy. After all, the fact that she was kind to him is not special to her, only to him. Many men are kind to her. She is kind to many men. So in her mind, he is over-investing in her for no reason at all.
It is a deceptively difficult feat for a man that has been mostly unsuccessful with women for his entire life to suddenly stop over-investing. When sex and kindness from women have been extremely scarce for so long, our tendency is to dig in our heels and do whatever we can to keep a woman around, so we never have to go back to a life of sexlessness, unkindness, and loneliness. Obviously, that comes across as desperate, needy, and creepy behavior and can be the very reason we lose women who would otherwise continue to have sex with us and treat us well.
One way to attempt to overcome this self-defeating tendency to over-invest is to educate ourselves regarding the true nature of women, men, and intersexual dynamics. Once we learn how things actually work in the world of sex and relationships, we can spot bad patterns in our behavior and address them. For example, learning some basic “game” to help us emulate the tactics of guys who are part of the casual sex culture can go a long way toward increasing our success. Acting confident, aloof, uninvested, outcome-independent, and even a bit like an asshole tends to attract women, because these behaviors mimic an appropriate level of investment for a woman you’ve just met.
Other ways we attempt to defeat oneitis before it starts is to remind ourselves that women are opportunistic, manipulative, slutty, and dishonest. And that all women are like this. No woman is ever ours forever, no matter how we behave or how good-looking we are. It is only our turn until she finds someone else or gets bored. Part of the reason we adopt the “all women are like that” mentality is to help ourselves remain emotionally detached. To avoid feeling “love” for a woman, which is what would naturally occur if a man for whom sex has been scarce his entire life allowed his feelings to take their natural course. But one consequence of constantly reminding ourselves that women are opportunistic, manipulative, slutty, and dishonest is anger. Even hatred. In our effort to remain constantly aware of their negative traits and make sure we never place too much undue trust in a woman, we end up disliking them.
Men who have been having casual sex with women for most of their adult lives don’t hate women. And the slutty women they have sex with don’t hate those men. In fact, these people like each other. You’re supposed to like the people you have sex with. Not marry them, obviously. But like them. Enjoy them. Enjoy their company, their human characteristics, their behaviors. Have fun with them.
If sex were solely about the orgasm, we could masturbate and avoid dealing with women entirely. But sex is more than just the orgasm. Sex is all about the involvement of another human. Not just the validation or the sense of power, but also the fun and the human connection. Other humans can be fun. Every woman is unique. While most women share certain traits, obviously, it is fun to recognize the things that one particular woman has in common with most other women, as well as the things that set this one particular woman apart. To enjoy her as a human. To enjoy her company, the way she interacts with you, the way she fucks. To really let yourself like her.
It’s okay to like a woman who’s having sex with you. It’s okay to like a woman who’s kind to you. It’s okay to connect with another human being and enjoy it. It’s okay to let yourself feel things for a woman.
The best defense against oneitis for one particular woman isn’t to become some kind of stoic, aloof asshole who feels nothing for women and simply uses them as friction for his penis. Sure, that leads to orgasms and a sense of power and validation, but not a lot of fun or connections with humans. The best defense isn’t disliking women.
The best defense against oneitis is to allow ourselves to like the women we have sex with. All of them. When you have sex with ten different women and enjoy all of them as humans – the things they have in common, the things that make them unique, the things they do that are fun, and even the things they do that are annoying – then you are truly protected against over-investing in any particular woman. When you can learn to like somebody as a human and a sex partner, but appropriately, as just a human and a sex partner, not only do you avoid over-investment, but you also have better sex and better connections.
Many men complain about the emptiness of casual sex and find it unfulfilling. The fix to that is to have healthy casual relationships and actually connect with partners, enjoy them as humans, like them, and maybe even love them. But to learn to love appropriately, without over-investing. Don’t get married, but learn to love women for what they are and truly connect with them, and the sex is better and more fulfilling. Plus, you don't chase women off by being too invested. In fact, the lack of over-investment tends to get the women to chase you instead.
Something happens to you when you realize you can honestly "get women" whenever you want. When it stop being a focus on your life or your nights out and something that just runs in the background. You start enjoying the energy of women and flirting, that is sexy as fuck, plain intoxicating to them.
Men who don't "get it" will hate you, women who are hurt will call you a "fuck boy", and both men and women who "get it" will be drawn to you. A very playful attitude towards this whole game starts to emerge and you'll just start having a good time with everything that happens, seemingly nothing can phase you.
Many call it "being in state", people try to replicate with various drugs, nootropics, or alcohol, but at the end of the day it has to come from an enjoyment of life and love. It comes from pure experience of just getting out there, finding your own quirks and working them out. Focus on making yourself an enjoyable person to be around and people who are at the same level can't help but be around you.
Sometimes that takes tossing your old life and friends away, sometimes it takes "monk mode", sometimes it take fucking 50 women. Whatever it takes for you, you have to find out yourself and you do that by going out there, allowing yourself to be vulnerable to life and love. Take the punches on the chins, get up laugh them off and continue on your way.
Essentially, people who are part of the casual sex culture give off small tells and are able to identify each other. A guy who gets it is able to spot interested women, approach appropriately, behave appropriately, and interact in a way that demonstrates knowledge of the game. She does the same back.
Playing the game is supposed to be light hearted and fun. Interacting with each other is supposed to be fun. It's not a job or a burden. Once a guy gets it, the game isn't about doing the work to get laid. It's about enjoying an interaction with a woman, that sometimes leads to sex.
Can you give more details about "casual sex game identifying" signals? I've been thinking about it for a pretty long time now, wonder what are your thoughts, sir.
When I can tell a girl is into casual sex:
Being open to late night first dates (past, say, 10pm)
Willing to travel to you
Works long hours or has a stressful job (no time for dating)
Little online presence: means they are discreet and more laid back then your typical IG model stuck up girl
In person:
Above average height
Dress down during the day even though they have good bodies (they're not trying to impress other girls and they have enough sex that they're not fishing for cat calls)
Seem a little dismissive or impatient with typical first date stuff (i.e. a romantic wine bar with cheesy music). Not the disinterest of a typical girl being bored and wanting to check her phone, but more fidgety with sexual energy (i.e. messing with a coaster, picking at a beer label)
Crass sense of humor
Interested in unique elements of your personality or quirks of yours. Meaning, she is not evaluating you as a beta male provider, but maybe as a guy who is into kinkier stuff or BDSM
All women are into casual sex....with the right man
Thanks for the input. I recently get more and more interested in this topic, but I can't come up with anything constructive or decent, so any feedback helps a lot.
I’m fairly certain he’s referring to IOIs which lead to some push/pull.
I suppose girl giving IOIs not necessarily means she's open to casual sex and ONS. Even the most concervative girl can give you IOIs, yet she'll most likely will never be into casual sex.
Find and read a book about indicators of interest.
Girl brushing her tits while close, what do next? Just ask her number? Different languages but we both speak basic english
Ugh. I'm so fucking far away from that that it is inconfuckingceivable.
Start small. Do the work. Work out, clean up your diet, dress well, and talk to 1,000 women and get laughed at every single time. 10,000, if that's what it takes. A million if that's what it takes. Talk to girls until you're comfortable talking to girls and you just don't care any more.
It sucks. It's embarrassing. It's discouraging. But there just aren't any short cuts. There's nothing you can read on the internet and nothing any other guy can tell you that's going to short cut doing the work.
Don't compare yourself to those guys who have been having casual sex for their entire adult lives. You're playing catch up. You have 20 or more years of not getting it to make up for. You're not going to break into the casual sex culture after reading bullshit on the internet for a month and going to a bar once or twice to talk to girls. You have to do the work, and it sucks, and it's embarrassing. But that's how you get there.
I like this idea. It's almost like playing "Where's Waldo?" for sex. Everyone wants to find a "Waldo," but there's no fun going around and shouting it. There is no chase. There is no need for interaction. You turn into exactly what you were saying
Thanks for your insight!
Funny you say that, I was thinking exactly that this week... the grin Jess at the office gave me... or Anna at the gym.
Almost immediately I know: im gonna fuck her brains out
So, like it will take me 15 more years? FeelsBadMan.
On a serious note,
I know what you mean, but you can't get there fast nor can you fake it till you make it, so there's that problem with women: before we figure out how to be an "alpha", i am afraid i will be too old to be able to attract teenager girls that IWLTF.
Dude I'm in my mid thirties, just went to a beer festival in a college city. I was flirting with 18-22 year old chicks all day. Men age like wine, stay in shape, take care of your body and you can pull 20 year olds well into your 50's.
The more you go out and start talking to people the easier it becomes. The biggest breakthroughs I had were some of my WORST nights as a beginner. I would go to bars, make a huge deal about talking to 1 decent looking chick, half the time pussy out or drink to much to "get into state" and just be a mess. But after each failure or week of failures would come introspection and that is where you truly grow.
Why was I drinking and smoking weed to "pump myself up" if it just made me clam up and be self conscious to the point I was terrified of talking to a woman even if they were giving me signs?
So I stopped, issue cleared itself up. I'm a lot more interesting ,animated, and attractive with 0 drinks in me then I ever was 4 drinks and 2 bong loads in. Do I have a beer, a whiskey, or a puff every once in a while? Sure, if I wanna celebrate or try a new brew but I haven't been drunk or stoned stupid in like 6 months. My buddy couldn't talk to a chick that is eye fucking him with out a drink or 2 in him, but once he calms the nerves with a shot he's fucking Casanova. Find your sticking points and work them out.
Why was I going to a bar or event to SOLELY hit on women?
As much as I love to discuss theory on here and with other men, having the pressure of "Having to talk to 10 women tonight" or "practicing direct openers 5 times and indirect openers 5 times tonight" fucks me up. It makes me awkward and keeps me in my head. I lose any ability to hold a conversation with a woman, and the "conversations" I did have were more interviews then conversations. So I stopped that shit, I go to places to have fun and talk with people. Sometimes I talk to dudes all night, sometimes the bartender for an hour then leave, sometimes its a group of women. Removing the "Mission" to talk to women from my head keeps me present. I like not knowing where the evening with take me. Other guys need that mission or they will just stick with their same 2 friends all night. Gotta make the mistakes and learn from them to progress.
I had the same issue with drugs, people say it makes them better but it made me much worst, I found being sober I was way more articulate. One thing that help me was to understand what I truly wanted, I Just wanted to fuck women, I didn't go to events for the event.
I didn't change this, I found women who just wanted to go out , get drunk and sleep with a random guy, I found I had to read people, not every women is there to fuck a random guy, and no amount of game will change this, game isn't turning a no into a yes, it's about connecting with people with like mindsets.
and that's a skill you build over time right?
I have been extremely shy all my life, still am, I am never the one to initiate a conversation. When spoken to, I speak and talk and make jokes and stuff, but it never happens because I initiate it. EVER.
How can I just start talking to people in more casual settings like a gym, work, a bar?. I usually dont bother myself to talk with ANYBODY, because I just dont feel like talking, it is more of a burden to me when I speak to an unknown human being.
Also, I go to the gym regularly, however I have found that before speaking to girls, I would like to speak and talk to guys, and create my male social circle (social proof) so then I can speak to girls. How to do it?
From someone who went through the same thing, here's my best advice: You're not a mind reader.
When you walk up to someone, they look at you, right? The first thing you probably think of is what kind of judgement they're making about you. Are they annoyed? Upset? Do they think you're pathetic? Thoughts like these are driven by anxiety and are a huge barrier to making any social connection.
In reality, people aren't thinking about you at all. Unless you have a personal relationship with them, they don't give a fuck. It's not negative, it's not positive, you're just another person in an endless sea of people.
Stop trying to predict what people think about you. If you need to know, just ask.
Here's a challenge for you. Go into a bar and strike up a conversation with the first person you see. Compare their reaction to how you thought they would react. Get them talking about themselves, people fucking love talking about themselves.
Repeat the process until you're comfortable with it. Pretty soon you're going to meet some interesting people and you'll go from avoiding conversation to wanting to start it to get to know more about people.
Here's my current dilemma. Strike up a conversation? About what? What if my interests are not small-talk based. What if what I'm interested in and what my passions are (currently) are that of art, introspection, societal reflection and not being a "part" of society. Pretty hard then, huh? If you're not a "part" of something, you're doomed.
I've met some of my best friends at the gym over the years, and the vast majority I had to engage first.
Small talk is key. Curious about a lift someone is performing? Ask them about it. Wondering if someone is using a piece of equipment? Ask a nearby person. Need to get your squats in but they're all taken? Ask to work in with someone (this one is great). Interesting game on the TV? Make a comment to someone you see who is equally interested.
It's all about small talk. I could go on, but those general openers are all I've ever used. On men and women mind you. Once you initiate, guage their interest. Keep in mind people may be in a hurry, so mindfulness is key.
The relationships I've created in the gym were planted early with a few short, but positive interactions. With time they grew. This was due to engaging them in conversation, but also not stalling their entire workout. That's not to say you won't have long convos, I've met some people who I talked to for 2 hours, which is fine if you're both cool with it.
Alright, hope that helps. End of the day it's not awkward or weird or complex, it's just talking to another human being who may or may not want to interact. Best of luck.
start with Hi and just engage people you'll get over the fear of rejection soon enough. Being "shy" is just an excuse to not get rejected
Read this: Psycho-Cybernetics, trust me it will help :)
You have a point. Whenever I consciously think of what I need to talk , I tend to fuck up or end up without anything to say. The moment I shift my attention towards having fun , everything just flows.
Advice on going to bars without drinking? I feel retarded if I don’t order a beer to even nurse. What do you do?
You can always just get a soda/tonic water and have the bartender dress it up. I just get a water, if I get asked I'm driving so I don't drink.
It's not as big a deal as you think it is really. But then again I go to places that have good food and usually a band or stand up going on, if your just going to a dive bar where people are drowning their sorrows away you might get some attitude initially but once you get into conversation people don't care.
Much appreciated, I’ll try those things.
Thats right, you might be too old when you figure it out but you don't know if it will happen at all if you don't try. So try, and try your hardest so that you can get there earlier than your expecting.
i doubt it will take 15 years...i was n count 13...3 year LTR. 6 months later n count 30. Thanks to the red pill
Maybe just increase your number of interactions broseph.
I can’t get woman whenever I want lol but it was a good read
How do you get to this point post college?
> When it stop being a focus on your life or your nights out and something that just runs in the background. You start enjoying the energy of women and flirting, that is sexy as fuck, plain intoxicating to them.
So don't focus on women, but flirt with them, and go to places where they are and fuck them? This circular logic makes no sense, you want women, but you realize that coming off to strong doesn't work, so you move slower
> allowing yourself to be vulnerable to life and love
And we got feminism 101, you don't ever be vulnerable, being yourself isn't vulnerable, letting out personal secrets makes you vulnerable. In essense
> Focus on making yourself an enjoyable person to be around and people who are at the same level can't help but be around you.
And self hatred , focus on doing things you enjoy, if you don't enjoy parties you won't ever fit in , focus on groups you like, do what you want, since you aren't special you will never be alone
Man you have a lot to learn
Flirting with women doesn't mean I focus my whole night on them, The world doesn't work in your A or B logic. You can talk to women without your whole night revolving around getting with them. I know it's hard for you to believe that. Of course I want to be with women, I love women but they are rarely if ever the focus of my nights out anymore. I go out to be social and connect with people because there is a lot of value in that.
Being vulnerable doesn't mean being a pussy or a "beta". Letting out personal secret is being stupid, not vulnerable. I don't have to walk around all day and night stone face killa status stop being a tough guy.
Parties are fun, everyone enjoys a good party. If you "don't like parties" think about it this way, if all your friends were there would you have a good time? Yes you would, so it's not "parties" you don't like it having to meet new people who are strangers that you don't like. You can dress it up as being an introvert or "shy" all you want but ultimately people that think this way are just Terrified of rejection that is all.
There is a lot of talk lately about how much you should focus on women, I say focus on what you want
> When it stop being a focus on your life or your nights out and something that just runs in the background.
It is still a focus in your life, just not your only focus
> The world doesn't work in your A or B logic. You can talk to women without your whole night revolving around getting with them
Strawman argument and personal attacks
> I love women but they are rarely if ever the focus of my nights out anymore.
They are the focus, otherwise you would never connect with them in a sexual way
> status stop being a tough guy.
I'm not, I'm just not opening myself up to attack, why frame life inside of a women's ego, men can't have a independent thought ,
Vulnerable gets redefine because women can't be wrong, society can't be wrong, only men can be wrong, vulnerability is the height of stupidity which is why you don't do it
> You can dress it up as being an introvert or "shy" all you want but ultimately people that think this way are just Terrified of rejection that is all.
At the end of the day people get what they really want, if I wanted a bunch of friends I would have them, everything I had I put in effort, I'm not afraid of rejection or anything, Fear isn't something most men have but rather understanding.
> Focus on making yourself an enjoyable person to be around
No, focus on being around people you click with, This is wearing a mask, why not say what you truly feel
Great post.
Even simpler: the fact that he's investing in her too much and too early is a crystal-clear symptom of his lack of success with women, as you accurately depicted. Aka, this is a really obvious tell of low SMV, so Nature would have built in women to find it repulsive... that is until such a time that she needs investment and is struggling to get it.
Which is the opposite of the effect noted above, and the reason why aloofness, jerboy/asshole game works to physically arouse women. A high SMV guy by definition has a lot of sexual success, and a lot of sexual success translates in zero investment in any one woman since he has dozens waiting their turn to have a go at him. And because it's a tell of high SMV, Nature would have built in women to find it attractive that a man doesn't want to invest in her.
I agree on this and know it's true (basic TRP truths) but do you happen to know any actualy scientific studies which investigates this behaviour pattern? I think this behaviour is exceptional in animal kingdom and typical only for humans.
Can't name any studies, but the behavior is the norm for the animal kingdom. It's the reason so many animals (lions, gorillas, chimps, walruses, etc.) end up with a patriarchal social order where the alpha male of the group ends up impregnating the bulk of the females to ensure the most useful genetic material is passed forward.
The only difference is that in humans we've built up some social conventions that say that behavior is wrong, despite the fact that the drive for it is still present from our tree swinging days. The cause of the conventions are up for debate, but the end result is the world you see before you.
It's not mere social convention, it's the fact that it's antithetical to civilization. Without monogamy and the promise of a female for every male, you can't keep all the betas (who by definition are the majority of men) pulling in the same direction to build and/or sustain civilization.
Soo many ppl don't get this, is soo true!
alphas are like queen bees, and betas are like servant bees, it's disgusting but it's the truth.
How do you daygame without "investing" in a girl then?
Do you just play bored in the conversation?
Can you talk more about the difference between “enjoying a connection” and “love”? Specifically, what is the difference or delineation between those two phrases?
Enjoying a connection is voluntary. Love is involuntary.
At least thats how i perceive it.
Involuntarily love isn’t love. That’s a chemical reaction in your brain - infatuation. Love is a choice you make. It’s voluntarily, because you have control over your love. You love something or someone by investing time, effort, energy, and attention into them. You consider them valuable enough to be worthy of those things from you. You choose to let them in a little deeper than someone you just casually fuck. You’re still in control. You can just as easily remove them from that coveted place. It’s your choice.
Love is sacrifice. Don’t cheapen love by making it out to be something as pedantic as brain juice.
Love is enduring the shit your ex wife puts you through just to continue to have a relationship with your kids. Love is staying home to take care of and be with your dying family member because they can’t afford anything else or because of what it means to them. Love is laying down your life for a friend. Taking a bullet for a brother. That shit comes from character, not chemistry. Someone with character is someone worthy of respect, because character costs something to obtain. Don’t cheapen that.
Love is deciding you won't fuck any other women even though you really want to. For her sake.
If you're not sacrificing anything for her, it's probably not love.
that isn't love, that loyalty, you don't need to sacrificing anything because good relationships are built upon synergy, where she is being selfish and you are being selfish, compromise is for old married couples.
Didn’t tell my girl I loved her until 4 months in. Hell, I told one of my places that I loved my gf before i told my gf. I waited until I was sure it wasn’t just infatuation talking, and that I was willing to actually follow through on the words with sacrifice. Because she definitely demonstrated love to me long before I let her know.
Doesn’t mean her ass isn’t out on the street tomorrow if she pulls some AWALT shit. Thankfully I’ve got her trained pretty well. Think she might manage to make this relationship work for a while. She’s scared shirtless of losing me, and almost has several times. (Great teaching moments.)
There really need to be more posts like this. People like you who actually know what they're doing. I've lurked for a while here and only made an account last week but theres been way too many posts about anger and hate of late.
You are absolutely right aswell. Some people seem to want to become a cold, robotic machine that only see women as a disposable pleasure. But thats not the right way to go about it. They are only acting like this because they've been hurt recently and dont want to feel vulnerable again. If you think about it, who doesn't want to feel love or be loved in this world?
Exactly. Vulnerability is hard. But you don't avoid hurt by never being vulnerable and never liking anybody ever again. You avoid it, or at least reduce its severity, by having an abundance of love in your life.
How would you advice men cultivate themselves or fix their habitual over investment? I see people saying "adpt a mindstate of abundance" without talking about the critical steps that guide mens behaviour in maintaining a healthy amount of investment.
I believe alot of well intentioned men fall into this gap where they arent really shown how to recover from patterns of over investment. More important, what to do instead i.e. How they can change their mindset to truly fix those behaviours at the core.
there is no need for recovery because nothing is wrong with them, once they understand the perception of reality they will auto correct
They have to change their perception of the situation in order to internalize abundance mentality. There’s no need to “recover” really, I’m not sure what you mean by that. Being a bit more specific might help.
I’ll try and think of an example/explanation that won’t take me long to type, and if I can’t then I’ll come back when I have more time tonight and explain then.
Thanks for that bro. Since I got dumped I actually thought that it was my fault for being vulnerable in the first place. So, to never get fucked over again, I swore to never be vulnerable again.
Maybe you screwed things up. Maybe your girlfriend just sucked as a girlfriend. Maybe both. It happens.
When you've liked dozens of women and regularly find more that you like, and have sex with many of them, it becomes less of a big deal who does and doesn't have sex with you or how a woman behaves. It's a lot easier to enjoy a woman when you're in that place, even when she does something shitty of annoying sometimes.
Yeah this is the hardest lesson to learn to me: to be hopeful during the despair periods, to love when you are vulnerable, to be calm during a storm and to enjoy life being happy when life is always non-ideal conditions.
Love isn't vulnerable, love yourself first, love what she does for you, love is conditional, I love my job because it gives me money if my job stops giving me money my love goes away, same for my wife, my love is a gift to give, that
You avoid hurt by loving yourself if a women leaves you , you find a new women, being vulnerable is always bad , but it gives women control over you.
Can't blame them, some had it rough and some hadn't had just one rock bottom relationship. They'll get there eventually, they just had to start with themselves.
no one here thinks that this is just more male shaming and mental masturbation, we praise.
> But they are only acting like this because they've been hurt recently and dont want to feel vulnerable again.
No, they are acting like that because it's in their best interests,there have been 0 post about anger or hate, but rather understanding reality , they haven't been hurt, they have been lied too, the truth is vulnerable isn't the answer, doing what you want is.
Why are men told to be anything but themselves, you put down other men, and act like you are a enlighten nice guy by saying feminist things.
If you run in the street and get hit by a car, you aren't avoiding the street because you were hurt, you avoid it and change your actions because you aren't stupid
You should read his post again and try to understand why he says that. You've been replying to a lot of responses here, bringing a toxic attitude. I did not say anything feminist. Please point out where I did?
OP is basically trying to tell you to learn the game, not hate the game. You can either try what he says or you can stew in an anti-feminist induced rage. Choice is yours.
There is no anti-female, what did I say that is anti-female, red pill has 0 anti-female, as I said you are using shaming tactics from blue pill , you yell insults , make false accusations
There are 0 post of hate, but prove me wrong and show me 3 post, you said there are too many,I know you won't show me those three post because they don't exist
False accusations, straw man arguments, in short I disagree with you, but I can do so without personal attacks, but I have to deal with a lot of feminist ideology that men don't realize they have , a negative experience with a women doesn't mean you hate women or her, but that experience
I also encourage you to make more posts about this topic. This is very relatable about the anger part for me and some middle way reconsiliation of the factual (at first disappointing) traits of women and some perspective that doesn’t lead to anger while spending time with or thinking about them would make things easier for many I think
The last part is definitely a panacea for the affliction of promiscuity for its own sake. It's ok to enjoy the ride emotionally, not just physically. Forget about conjured attachments and truly bask in the moments you are together.
What you're suggesting isn't a perfect defense from oneitis, but it is the most effective. I employ a strategy similar to yours, but I still fell victim to oneitis earlier this summer. I usually allow myself to feel for the girls that I'm with, but when I met this one girl, let's call her KeKe, I fell hard. I dropped all of the plates I was spinning for this one chick. I saw red flags and ignored them. I put her on a pedestal. I got feelings and she did too.
Then all of a sudden she started "getting bored". I took it personally. I was thinking that if she was bored with me she was about to be REALLLLY disappointed with the rest of the male species. She ran off and it broke my heart. The next day I had a girl that I was keeping warm come over. It's been 2 weeks since she dropped me and I've fucked six girls since. I did start to feel better.
The girl I had oneitis for is coming to my place tonight. I'm not sure how my feelings are going to react. She is telling me things like she loves me and wishes she didn't run. I'm pretty sure that I've withdrawn my feelings to an acceptable level, but the only way to test it is to put her in front of me. Wish me luck boys!
It sounds like you may have a Cluster-B woman on your hands.
Dude, don't f'n buckle. If she doesn't know what she wants, you don't need her.
Damn, I guess Keke wasn't riding
The only way to internalize, to strengthen your frame and not fall in love wrong way is to be burned many times. That is reality fo 99% of men and I think it is ok.
When your heart gets broken few times, you will get it. it is a mans path to just about anything.
But imo, the oneitis guys are not the ones who have it the worst. The ones who have it the worst are guys whose emotional love is a straight horizontal line - they dont love and they are not loved. Zero emotions. Id choose oneitis anyday over that stoic bullshit.
This is me. I do not love. They do not love me. Love doesn't exist.
Just flying warm loads of jizz. Sandwiches, cold beer, sleeping in.
If it is what makes you feel good, do it. However I did not mean just love in a sense that you love someone or not. I mean for other things in life also. I find that guys who are devoid of love life also are not feeling any passion whatsoever in life. Or they do not enjoy doing many things.
If it is just a lack of love for a female, you still have my green light, cause this hoes hardly want to receive love anyway. Dicking and jizz is what they want.
Yep that’s it I don’t really love anything nor have a passion for anything at all, hobbies and women alike. Ive decided that being heartbroken was shit so I closed off any negative feelings like that. I’ve realized how that can be wrong, thanks
I am hoping this is the case. I stumbled upon TRP earlier this year after being ghosted by a former oneitis. The wheels began spinning after this, but nothing was internalized. Ive probably had oneitis 8 or so times in my life.
Here I am now, 8 months later, burned yet again by another oneitis, making practically the same mistakes I did before.
Ive had my fair share of casual hookups in my life, probably 25+ partners (im 23 FWIW), but it could probably be a lot higher if I didn't pedestalize hot girls that I game up thinking that everything is going to go perfectly and they are going to end up as my girlfriend. I now recognize that this thinking is going to get me burned.
However, for those starting out (like me) I feel like its natural to do this with women who are hotter than ones you've previously talked to. Thankfully, thats what TRP is for.
Hey, you are just 23. I am 30. Trust me, you will learn and change much in coming years. Pain and failures forge a man.
But even with that, I think any man ever lived in any stage of his life was or is capable of oneitis. It is just the question of meeting that person or not.
If I had to give you any advice on oneitis, it would be that I differ a "boy oneitis" and "man oneitis". Boy is suffering, needy, desperate, stuck in past, oneitis is causing chaos in his head. Man oneitis is when you look in the mirror, yourself in the eyes, and you say fuck, I loved that women, now she is gone. You get sad for a milisecond and continue doing whatever you are ought to do.
I’d say those descriptions are accurate. I thought I was making progress, as the one i had before this most recent one was “man” oneitis where i was over it in a matter of days. This most recent one felt like relapse or “boy” oneitis because i was seeing the girl longer. But anyway I’ve came to the realization that I’ve been here before, it’s no different than any other time, and i will meet better, hotter girls. Each time after this has happened, this has proved to be true.
Well you should not enter relationships with expectation to get oneitis after its done. I mean, as I said, it is ok ot have it, for few women in your whole life. For others you really should not give a fuck.
A bit more of psychology, I think (well this is my opinion, havent actually read it anywhere) that guys suffering from big boy oneitis or from a string of oneitis(es?) are having abandonment issues. I think they are clinging because they dont want to be abandoned, not because they truly love and feel the other person. Strong oneitis awakens some very deep seated fears in man sometimes replicating those from childhood. There is imo a big difference between being scared and loving other person. Well this is my theory, it is possible that it is bollocks.
I think its just due to the way I was conditioned with women growing up being fed a bunch of false pretenses. Thats why abundance mentality is paramount and a focal point on this sub.
As for oneitis, identifying it at its roots seems to alleviate some of the issue. It can literally feel like an internal battle at times. The mind will fixate on whoever after they are gone because of fear of abandonment or trying to remind you of good times to restore dopamine and serotonin similar to how it was balanced in the brain when you were with someone. The most important thing is that im glad this is happening when im 23 and not when im 35 and have 2 kids.
Such a good post, thank you
I’m an avid reader of TRP and have enjoyed implementing many of its teachings in my interactions with women, but this post seems contradictory to me. From a biological perspective, men are naturally possessive and don’t want their partners to be sleeping around with a bunch of guys to insure their child will be their own. The idea of being being affectionate and forming a bond with a woman that is sleeping around with a ton of guys seems counterintuitive to the male biological imperative. How are you supposed to shut off your programming and be ok with forming relationships with women that are by nature temporary and will only yield fleeting satisfaction? I’ve already done fairly well for myself in terms of partners, but the idea that I have to be ok with women’s promiscuity to continue getting laid seems incredibly depressing. If all they can offer is sex and temporary affection then why bother interacting with them other than to have sex? I have friends that would take a bullet for me—spending my time and emotionally investing in them seems like a far more feasible and rewarding strategy than emotionally investing in women.
The sex is better, and the entire experience a lot more fulfilling, if you actually let yourself like, enjoy, and appreciate the human company of the person you're having sex with.
You like your friends. You like your parents. You like your co-workers. But you don't like the women you have sex with? That's silly.
you're not answering his questions, you're just repeating things you've already said.
Sex is very easy to have when you dont care about if she LIKES you. This need to be LIKED is a disease.
Sex is a lot better if you actually like and connect with the person you're having sex with. You don't have to be in some kind of serious exclusive relationship on the path to marriage to like someone, enjoy her company, appreciate her human qualities, and connect with her.
As far as I'm concerned, the only real prescription for oneitis is to become a man with tangible options. You won't over-invest with one woman when you have the certainty of replacing her without too much effort.
More game, more SMV -> less oneitis
Teaching love i think is kinda difficult but ok
Yeah right a little easier said than done.
I 100% relate to this problem, and had that exact situation of a woman being intimate and I can’t just let that be. I’m 20 and only gotten close to a woman once, and that made me over-invest and I’m even still after almost a year being broken up thinking about her.
Do you still talk to her? Is she on your social media or in your friend groups? What are your connections to her now? Depending on these answers, it might be best to cut ties completely, especially if it's almost been a year. Don't get me wrong, you need that time to heal but understand that if you keep working on yourself, developing character, learning how to casually date, you're going to come across many more women who will want to be intimate and affectionate towards you. Especially at 20, just worry about yourself. Lift, eat well, read, learn, socialize and make friends. As time goes on and you keep improving your life, the opportunities to meet and engage with women will become more and more apparent.
But again, the lesson out of OPs story is to not become some cold robot who fucks just to fuck. There's something special about intimacy with multiple women, sharing experiences and stories with them, bearing your vulnerabilities but also remaining aware that these beautiful moments you share are more than likely temporary. But you'll take that love and pay it forward.
There'll come a day when that ex will pop into your head and you'll think plenty of good, thankful thoughts with a healthy mix of "good riddance." Stay strong and keep working on yourself, you've got this man!
This is a good post that reiterates the core points of TRP, and it does overcome ONEitis, for sure. However, I'd like to re-emphasize that if you're feeling and emptiness, you need to find a way to lead a fulfilling life without depending on a woman to give you meaning. Of course we are social animals and we need meaningful company, absolutely, but you need have a goal or a purpose in which you can invest yourself and grow as a person. An LTR is never a goal, it should always be second at best.
Informative and helpful, but misguided. The point of TRP is to establish independence from that certain type of thought, I would think, not to learn how to flirt more with women. It's good dating advice but the movement doesn't need to go this way.
Men need to start seeing women as their own species, not objects for sexual gratification. Just the same, my life story is a great example of how this game BS can backfire. I grew up very shy, but had some help at points in my development. Long story short, I was influenced to believe that at least in my social environments, the more interaction some men had with women, the more accepted they were. I ended up spending years drifting in and out of different interactions with women. None of them were meaningful the way they should've been. I'm older today, still chronically single, and other parts of my life have suffered greatly because of the lack of focus on what should've been priority.
Know how to interact with a woman, but don't make women a focus. Don't think that flirting more or any amount of sex can add fulfillment to other areas of your life. Don't think that this is a healthy dependency. I promise sex was never meant to be a priority in a man's life. It's indeed way more unnecessary for us than them.
By no means are women and connections with them the be all and end all, central focus of a man's life. Of course you should have a real life going on, of which women are just a small part.
But when it comes to that small part, liking the women you interact with, enjoying their company, and connecting with them as human beings leads to better sex and a lot more enjoyment for a man. Reminding ourselves every 15 seconds that women are slutty, manipulative, evil, dislikeable creatures to prevent ourselves from liking them is silly. It's okay to like the people you have sex with. You're supposed to like the people you have sex with.
That makes alotta sense. Thanks for the clarification. It's definitely a confusing middle ground for many, which is why TRP helps so much. It's equally toxic to love too much and to shut it all out and embrace hatred. I'm still learning how to look forward and not feel vindictive towards women, from childhood throughout adulthood. Sometimes it's hard to let go but some of us have had too much negative experience. That's partly where I was speaking from, but as long as you are a stable person, it's always okay to have some new entertaining moments with equally stable women.
Remember guys, it's highly important to filter the women you associate with. I'm still learning this one.
> This tendency to over-invest is one of the reasons men who suck with women do poorly.
No, the tendency to over invest is due to emotional abuse with a society that reinforces worthlessness , if you get a women, you will be worth something.
> Other ways we attempt to defeat oneitis before it starts is to remind ourselves that women are opportunistic, manipulative, slutty, and dishonest.
The only way to get over it is to have options, if you have 1 apple left and you are starving in a jungle, that apple will be the greatest shit you ever seen. If you have plenty of apples in a buffet
> When you can learn to like somebody as a human and a sex partner
Feminism 101, men always see women as human, they don't see themselves as human, women aren't the issue, men emotional state is and self worth, once you realize you aren't suppose to give your life to a women to satisfy societies morals you will do fine
About the point where you say: "women are... slutty and dishonest."
I have a very clear example of that, for those who don't believe it yet. Turns out that somehow I started chatting with my first ex, the classic unicorn, just for fun and curiosity. After all we were like almost 3 years together. Yesterday she tells me that will soon start to live with her new boyfriend and that kind of stuff. Today we started to flirt heavily and now I have some fresh pictures of her naked boobs and her opened naked ass, telling me that she is ready and waiting me back to put my dick in her mouth, vagina and ass. Dude, I'm really impressed. I'll fuck her, I don't care for her new boyfriend anyway. Those pictures made my cock go crazy again, so I'll fuck her brain out.
AWALT dudes, REMEMBER, AWALT. You only have yourself, so you can only trust on you, you idiot.
As a guy currently fucking two women who have "boyfriends" (who knows) abroad, I can tell you this man is speaking the truth. AWALT MOTHER FUCKERS!!! Goddamn it's crazy this isn't accepted as mantra.
I have a similar story- my first ex also came back on to the picture ALMOST IMMEDIATELY when I unblocked her on facebook just to see what would happen (After she broke up with me I was heartbroken etc etc.. But I accrued such a hate that just the sight of her name pissed me off so I neglected to delete her while wallowing in heartbreak)
Surprise surprise, she messages me, and within a couple of days, one early morning before uni, I made my way to her house and gave her that dick she obviously hadn't had in a long time, and then have her drive me to catch my train that morning.
Oh, even made effort to get to my student flat in London where I was studying, she happened to have a female friend living in London which was her alibi.
All while she was with a guy who she even said she wanted a child with, seemingly for the sake of having one, with the minor complication that she had endometriosis, and would only be able to conceive via IVF, AWALT is real
What the actual fuckin fuck hahahaha have fun with her... sell that bitch a dream, fuck that bitch three times and then toss that bitch to the side of the road and git you another motherfuckin bitch nigga.
How long have you been off? I might try to get one of my ex to cheat on his bf with me because I want the thrill of it.
Eehm I broke up with her back in 2013, so it's been a while. But honestly, it's always better to taste new pussy. I only took contact back with her to learn about my young self. But you can really do whatever you want, so have luck.
Yup. I already have another pussy. But I am just curious on how it feels to be a part of cheating.
Although I appreciated your perspective to a certain degree, I also got the sense that you were skirting around the poly playbook a little too close in your argument. You're essentially advocating for maintaining 'detached" relationships simultaneously, rather than dating multiple people on a more casual basis. I don't generally consider myself cold or detached in my interactions with the women that I date, but I do draw a clearer line as to how far I'm willing to take it with them on an emotional level. I mean, I would find it difficult to drop someone I'm casually dating using your M.O. if things were to go south; I would have less emotional buffer to rely on this way. I'm not against your approach per se; just not in a casual dating format. Maybe if after a while I'm still hanging out with the same person, then would I want to invest more time getting to know them.
Prior to picking up Rollo's books, I would communicate my intentions with women more directly, as to how many dates roughly I'd be willing to go on with them because of my busy work schedule—and that never stopped most from jumping in bed with me or hanging around for a while. I see my approach as a sort of unspoken courtesy by cluing women in on what expectations they should have of me from the start, so that there's a lesser sense of betrayal once I feel that it's time for us to part ways.
But getting to know, like and enjoy the company of someone and learning what makes them special, compared to the other nine you're purportedly hooking up with at the same time? Sorry, but that's a hippy type of emotional investment that's especially rampant here in the Pacific Northwest.
Based off the accounts of people I personally know who practice this lifestyle, the burnout and turnover rate is quite high, and what usually ends up happening ironically, is that partners who were considered primaries in these hierarchial relationships (yep, not all created equal) wind up committing to a monogamous relationship together in the end, after complications (usually jealousy) arise from the intimate bonds that were established in these poly affairs.
Somewhere along the way, people forgot that you're supposed to like the people that you have sex with. Women forgot this, too, actually. Lots of women will go home with a guy they just met and don't really like or want to date for casual sex. Then, if they meet a guy they actually like, they won't have sex with him for a few dates.
Having sex less enthusiastically and less often with guys they actually like seems pretty backward to me.
It's the same with guys. Liking the women you have sex with - but appropriately - is way better than a lot of sex with women you don't like at all. That's just friction. Masturbation using somebody else's body. That's not about connecting with another person at all, just enjoying the sense of power when a woman gives it up. That's not a very good look.
This sentence conficts with itself
You can do things mentioned there but if you do them with one girl (your only girl), you probably get oneitis. Only way to avoid oneitis is to have abundance with girls and even then I've seen guys fail.
Just because you, God forbid, actually like a woman you're having sex with and appreciate her as a human being and connect with her on a human level doesn't mean you have to be in some kind of serious committed exclusive relationship on the path toward marriage. You can like a lot of women and appreciate all of them.
Sure, it hurts sometimes when a woman that you like moves on, but when you like and connect with lots of women, then it puts your hurt into perspective. Instead of this one special woman who was the over-invested focus of your life gutting you, it's just somebody you like and connected with moving on. Not as big of a deal.
So basically you are saying the same thing than I'm. Get abundant with girls (at the same time or develop capability to get a replacement really fast). When you are abundant or you have an abundant mindset (because you can get new girl fast), you don't need to over-invest and you can put things in perspective.
Yep. But there's a difference between "I can get another girl, or ten other girls, whenever I want, so that stupid bitch doesn't matter and I can treat her like the disposable little slut she is" and "Katie doesn't want to fuck any more? Whatever. We had a lot of fun. I wish her the best, hope she finds what she's looking for, and I'll go fuck Stacy tonight."
If you actually like Katie and enjoy her as a person, the sex is ten times better, and you actually have more fun. Putting up with Katie's little idiosyncrasies and annoyances doesn't feel like work and shit tests and a hassle just to get your dick wet. That's just how Katie is and how the two of you interact. And when she moves on, it hurts a little and you miss her, but you had fun, and she's the 50th girl to have come and gone from your life, and there are more. No biggie. The fact that you really liked Katie and enjoyed your time with her far outweighs the small hurt you feel when she moves on. Whereas if Katie was just a worthless slut you used for orgasms and the feeling of power and validation, you probably woudln't feel much when you lost her, but also wouldn't feel that much when you had her either.
Yeah, I agree but you are somehow expressing the matter in oneitisy way so that may contribute to some level of misunderstanding.
You absolutely nailed it, in a really insightful and articulate way. Thanks for this post!
I find myself oscillating between oneitis and anger as I feel the girl I am with is special and then fight it by focusing as you say on the reasons I know she isn’t. I feel embattled between the emotion and reason, and neither emotion winning, reason winning, or stalemate is a satisfactory outcome. I either end up overinvested, angry at women and at the male condition, or in psychic turmoil between the two. I am sure others have been there. How did you get past this and find some inner peace?
I had to let my anger go. There was this point where I realized that here I was, in my 30s, with a single-digit number of sexual partners and absolutely no casual sex under my belt, dating women who had spent their entirety of their 20s having casual hook-ups. For many of these women, the majority of the sex they'd ever had in their lifetime had been casual. They'd done some things that would make your jaw drop, and saw nothing wrong with it.
I had to ask myself why this bothered me so much. These women were perfectly decent human beings who were fun to be with, good in bed, enjoyable company, and completely likeable. Why was I angry about what they had done in the past? I'd have done the exact same things in their place. Hell, I'd have done even more.
I realized wasn't angry about what these women had done. I was more jealous than angry. I was angry about what I hadn't done. When I was younger, I didn't get it. I didn't know the rules or the game. Everybody else was getting it, while I was playing the wrong game under the wrong rules and getting nowhere.
So yeah. I wasn't mad at the women and what they had done. I was mad at myself and what I hadn't done. Maybe even a little jealous of the women I was dating.
I had to forgive myself for who I used to be and let that guy off the hook. Once I did that, it was a lot easier to actually like slutty women and enjoy them instead of seething with inner anger and hatred while putting on a brave face so they'd date me.
Preach. I’m in my late 20s, have had some casual sex, but I’ve still spent most of my adult life in the drought and I can’t help but feel the anger. I relate to the jealousy aspect, but there’s another component. I suppose part of it is that we’re sold the notion that women are supposed to be after commitment but even that seems so backwards. These days, men seem like the ones who really want commitment, and women don’t want that until they’ve already given their best years to a string of randoms. We’re taught even here on TRP that women are the gatekeepers of sex and men of commitment, but it seems like women are actually the gatekeepers of both. I suppose it really all boils down to realization that commitment really doesn’t exist. Maybe I’m being unfair in believing that I would never treat anyone, let alone the object of my affection, the way that most women seem to. Maybe I’m being ridiculous in my own imagining of the restraint and loyalty I think I’d display were I given the opportunities and affection that most women effortlessly receive but that most men can’t even dream of. Maybe I’d be the biggest branch swinger among them. Still, I can’t help but want to commit and believe that I’d never stray, while the women I meet and date don’t even remotely think that way and frankly shock and disgust me with the things they openly and unashamedly tell me they’ve done both with and to the men before me. It’s hard to accept even the way they share with one another the most intimate and personal things that any man I know would hold sacred and private.
For all the talk about objectification of women, men generally care about women’s feelings, and it just seems to me that no one cares about ours. It feels like a sick joke that we’re all supposed to pretend women are the oppressed class when it is so clearly the case that women hold nearly all the power and privilege in Western society while men do all the heavy lifting, figuratively and literally mining diamonds for female fingers, the owners of which then scorn that effort as soon as it has been expended.
I don’t know how to not be angry about that other than to slide into the fuzzy drunken loving emotionality that sleeping with a beautiful woman brings on.
I hope any of that made sense. I’m not nearly as eloquent about these things as you are.
At the end of the day, men are stronger than women. If you really, really wanted to, you could rape, murder, beat, or rob nearly any woman you came across.
Women live in constant fear of this. They are always aware of the men in the room and always on some level aware that they are powerless where it really counts.
The only reason a woman can travel safely today without being raped or killed is because men let her. Men choose to behave well. But any one man could just decide, all of the sudden, to quit behaving well, and that day becomes the worst day of a woman's life. Any one man has this power at any time.
Men don't have to respect a woman's space or comfort. That's why stupid issues like catcalling and not taking a hint and leaving a woman alone at a bar is such a big deal to them. Because even though mostly harmless things like this don't really hurt women, they serve as a very in-their-face reminder that men don't have to respect a woman's comfort if they really don't want to. It forces women to realize that the only reason they have any power and any rights at all is because men are playing along and letting them have this power.
Our modern, liberated, feminized society is a product of social engineering by powerless women, lashing out against their powerlessness, attempting to defeat the biological fact that men are stronger than women using social engineering.
I know it seems like women are powerful and privileged to you, but given the choice, I don't think I could live my life being as powerless as a woman, all the time. I'd be angry and bitchy, too.
I need to do a better job of remembering this. All power ultimately boils down to one on one physical power.
VERY well written.
I say it a lot, AWALT is simply a term that shouldn't be so easily thrown around the newer members who simply don't truly get it. They instead lazily rationalize that they cant keep women because they are untrustworthy assholes that men should view as sub-human.
You have to realize the difference between most women and men is options. The men who "get it" understand that they have options and women have options, so to vilify a women for not wasting the rest of her life with one man because she wants to have different experiences is borderline pathetic. AWALT isn't some purely "born with" mentality. It is forged from years of getting used to the societal norms that boys must approach girls, and men must approach women. AMALT would be a RPWomen thing if societal norms were about "women must approach men" because men would have options constantly coming to them with little need to work on themselves to attain these options. When men begin to realize all this (or "get it"), everything becomes clear.
Just remember that some investment isn’t a bad thing either if you really like the woman ,as long as it isn’t obsessive or too fast.I don’t think there is anything wrong with zeroing in on a woman that appeals to you on many levels .The common mistake we have all probably made is going too quick too fast.Suffocating them by trying to obtain the one resource that’s precious to everyone ( their time) usually turns them away.This I learnt the hard way a few times and now I’ve managed to fix that issue .
I have a lot of guy friends who tell me “ bro you don’t care she is going to a work party and then out with her gfs again tomorrow night to?” .Old me should have been insecure or trying to figure out why she wanted to do these things alone etc . The new me just doesn’t care enough to bother because I have my own hobbies to keep me occupied .Shooting clubs ,gym,motorcycling with the guys, quading up north and the list goes on.The whole notion of ownership of another person is long dead .When we decide to do stuff together like go up north to a cabin for a weekend or whatever she dedicates herself to me 100% what more can a guy want? Since Redpill I tend to enjoy my own like aside from here much much more , I honestly get annoyed if I’m spending more than 3 -4 days a week with her because I’m letting my hobbies and interests drop to the side.
Maybe I’m wrong here and if I am please correct me , but I don’t think life is designed anymore to have two people always together at the hip .Woman get bored fast ,but I’d even say men are starting to be more this was as well .Those who don’t figure this out will be miserable,if you want a companion that’s always at your side at your beck and call get a dog you can’t go wrong.
Dopamin turns into oxytocin so we enjoy their company after sex.
True. That's also why boobs make great pillows. Skipping out on the after-sex cuddling is lame.
You will also never see a woman more open, more free, and more uninhibited than after she's hooked up with you. You already know she's slutty, since you just had casual sex, after all. But you like her anyway, you're cuddling with her post-sex, so she feels free and un-judged, so she's more open and more herself than at any other time or place. It's the best time to really get to know a woman.
"Don't get married" <-- so this is the final advise.... is this where this road leads to?
Governmental wealth distribution contracts really don't have any place in the bedroom.
So how do we go about having children and family then?
This might be the most enlightening post/comments I've ever read on Reddit. Great stuff, all of you.
While I am fairly new to this sub I think this is the best post I’ve ever read on here. This is where RP philosophy really shines as a positive way to live your life and enjoy it to the fullest. It’s truth. Not dumbed down or sugar coated or mis-interpreted, just good old plain truth, and it’s something I needed to read.
I agree. Love women not woman
Goddamn, I don't know what's happened to this sub lately, but gems like these keep showing up on my front page. I've been subscribed for, shit, 3 1/2 years now and it seems like this past year has reached a new tier of quality. Seemed like back then it was nearly all posts by guys role-playing as Dirk McLargeHuge about treating women like slam-holes and living life through a sea of pussy and protein powder. And sure, everything has its place and maybe some people need to go through a "have a hundred one-night stands" phase, but it's great to read posts that feel--I dunno--more "mature." Sure, I want to bang hot women and look good and make money... but I also want to be a good person, and it's great when folks drop some redpill wisdom on what that looks like.
Life's a lot better when you can connect to the people around you in a genuine way. Not in a cocky 19 year old way--most women can spot that act from a mile away; not in a Dale Carnegie "Hey Ted, nice to meet you Ted, I hear people love hearing their first name so, Ted, I'm trying to do that to get you, Ted, to like me" sort of way. Just in a... natural way.
I’ve been a long time lurker here as there does tend to be a pretty solid stream of noteworthy life advice that emanates from this sub. Your post is another fine example. It’s just not necessary to loath, despise, or look down upon the women we have sex with. Granted, I’ve been in a LTR for about 10 years so my days of swinging the hammer are likely behind me, but looking back I’ve enjoyed sex with every partner I’ve ever had. That’s the whole point for crying out loud! I think that seeing women as disposable is an unhealthy approach to relationships regardless of the duration. Absolutely don’t over invest yourself only to be left high and dry, but at the same time, be open to letting yourself actually feel some emotional connection with the other person. As long as you can manage your own expectations, I’d say without a doubt it makes the sex better, if nothing else.
That's really the key. Having reasonable expectations.
If you don't expect a woman to love you forever and unconditionally, even if you do all of the "right" behaviors, and just accept that people we like, appreciate, and connect with eventually move on, it's easier to let these positive feelings we have for women come and go. It hurts when somebody we like moves on or does something shitty, but when your life is filled with an abundance of love and people you enjoy, the hurt is put into perspective. You're not losing this one special woman you were over-invested into and hyper-focused on, gutting your entire life. Someone you like and appreciate and connected with is just moving on. Not as big of a deal.
All in all I agree with your post except having healthy 'casual relationships'. What a word. Come on. If you are doing it casual you can barely call it a relationship. And if you do a relationship then it's not casual. Sooner or later you always have to chose.
We can debate the definition of "relationship" if you'd really like. In the broadest sense, you have a relationship with your parents, a relationship with your boss, and a relationship with your friends. You've also had relationships with girlfriends, and with girls you've just dated casually.
There are different kinds of "relationships". A casual relationship is still a relationship, even if it's not a serious exclusive big deal romantic relationship on the path to marriage.
But whether or not you consider that a relationship, the sex is a lot better and more fulfilling if you actually like the person and connect with the human you're in a not-relationship with, versus reminding yourself every 15 seconds how evil and dislikeable women are to prevent yourself from liking her.
I think this should be sidebar material. IMO it's a healthier take on the whole AWALT concept and the negative side that can dominate it. The positive side of this perspective is being at peace with it and enjoying it for what it is. Great post.
The thing is, when you start to love them, you fear losing them. What if they arent faithful to you? What of they fake their love becouse they know you wont invest as much as they would like. Thats why most have shallow relationships with woman becouse they are affraid of being rejected in its most vulnerable state. I think the answer isnt about chasing woman, but chasing yourself and doing what you want. Acts of self love that leave you in a state of mind consistent, even when they don't like it, contenting the only person that matters, that is you
Vulnerability is hard. It sometimes leads to hurt. But the answer isn't to never be vulnerable again and never like a woman ever again. It's to fill your life with an abundance of love. For lots of women. Hell, lots of people in general. Including self-love.
Then, if something hurts you, sure, you still feel it, but you feel it appropriately, in perspective with the rest of your life. It's not this one great woman who was the center of your universe that you inappropriately invested your life into suddenly leaving you. It's just somebody you liked and appreciated moving on.
I don't get how this post gets praised and then TRP generally mocks the concept of polyamory. That's a true contradiction.
I think you're confusing liking a woman that you have sex with and enjoying a human connection with her with having a bonefide romantic relationship with her.
You can like someone, in fact lots of someones, without being "in a relationship" with them, and you can see a lot of women casually, and like those women just fine, without that being some kind of polyamory kink bullshit.
That's what casual dating and casual sex is. You, and all of the women you're having sex with, are all seeing other people. Nobody is "in a relationship". But you can still like each other. There's no need to scoff at the slutty women you're fucking and remind yourself how shitty and dislikeable women are at every turn to prevent yourself from liking the ones you're having sex with. It's okay to like them and connect with them.
What you're advocating is exactly polyamory. To be "in a relationship", as you are using it, implies some degree of exclusivity. Open polyamory is about having non-exclusive, casual sex with many different people and liking/appreciating them individually.
It's not a kink really, it's just what you're describing.
I think at this point, we're devolving into word definitions.
In your universe, non-relationship "casual sex" necessarily requires -not- liking the person you're having sex with, not connecting with them on a human level, and using their bodies purely for physical release and a sense of validation.
If you actually like that person, enjoy her company, and connect with her, then under your definition, that constitutes a relationship. Which means under your definition, every guy who actually likes the women he's non-exclusively sleeping with is poly-amorous.
That's not my understood definition of polyamory, but whatever word definitions you or I like to use, I think we both understand the overarching point.
Straight from the Wikipedia definition of polyamory:
So yes I think this is what you're describing. Not that it really matters. I just think the community is a bit hypocritical on this point.
I think there's a difference in thought among what's really just regular dating in 2018, and polyamory.
In regular dating, men and women are not exclusive but go out with and have sex with different people, often casually with no intention of becoming a "relationship". But they still like each other, sometimes go out or hang out, and enjoy the sex. They're just casually dating and having sex.
Then, there's modern polyamory, where everybody knows everything and discusses everything and consents to everything and agrees on boundaries, and there's this official polyamory arrangement, which strikes most people as really weird and like some kind of kink or cultural weirdness. Because if you don't want to be exclusive with someone, you can just date non-exclusively like everybody else without trying to turn it into some kind of official arrangement or way of life.
I don't think most people who are participating in regular modern dating in 2018, going out with people, and having casual sex consider themselves poly-amorous.
I struggle with this, but literally with only one specific woman in my life, my ex-wife. The divorce was the best deal a man can get literal 50/50 split of stuff, no alimony, no child support, just 50/50 on the expenses the children incur. I don't believe she cheated at all because her patterns never really changed even after an 800 mile move to a different state. Getting over her has been the hardest thing I've ever had to do, but I'm doing it. Women I've dated since her I get what you are saying I appreciate them as a person, and just enjoy the moment I have with them in my life knowing one day it will end, and that's ok. Those women treat me with so much passion and lust it's great.
FUCK THANKYOU SO MUCH. It fucking sucks not having a girl. I have never had and I have learned alot in this subreddit. And in my mind i basically through women in the back burner and focused on shcool. But right now theres a chick and i started to notice i was getting oneities immediatly. But thankyou very much. In a TLDR its just enjoy and go witht the flow. Joke as much as you can and if gives it gives, if not theres is someone else.
Very well written. I know a few people I need to print this out for.
This post was spot on. I've dated all kinds of women, the difficult part for me is if I'm attracted to a girl I get true feelings and I really enjoy it. If I'm not attracted to her I can't make myself feel it, I'm pretty much indifferent, it doesn't even matter if she's hot. It's that chemistry thing I suppose. On the flip side when your really into a girl and seeing her, it makes it much harder when it ends. My back up plate doesn't even matter at that point. It's a catch-22 I suppose. Poorly worded but I hope my point is clear. I'm on my iPhone.
Spot on, but i still hate them hoes!, or maybe i just hate their nature or maybe i dont like to share and i am hypocritical and selfish or maybe i hate the way simps gass them up. Probably all of the above, great post though.
another good test for over-investment - am I ignoring my own desires and wishes for the sake of another? (man OR woman). Am I betraying my own integrity? Sure, compromise is often necessary for human relationships, but if you're skipping the gym even though it's important to you so you can talk on the phone with a girl for 4 hours, you need to re-evaluate your priorities.
So I'm not going to disagree with you that it is possible to keep your guard up while genuinely liking someone, and I'm not going to go the route of "must fuck multiple women at all times", either.
However, I generally disagree with the premise of the post. To like someone and build on that connection is dangerous if you're not doing it with express intent and letting it happen naturally. I prefer to feign connection while remaining disconnected to keep my focus on my personal goals.
Sounds psychotic, but it is a simple matter of realizing that your emotional connection to someone is just chemicals in your brain reacting with the sole intent of making you mate. If you let those chemicals control you, irrational decisions are more likely and oneitis is most likely.
Tread carefully.
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Nicely put sir, bookmarking this one
The best defense against oneitis is pump and dump, not matter how childish it may sound. Also having a career and hobbies help tremendously too. The less you invest, the easier you can walk away.
And this word "connection" should be out of any man's vocabulary. It's a woman's word, it means nothing. It's wishy washy and only leads to oneitis. One should not look for "connection" with women but with men. Men connect with women mostly through sex.
Thank you for such quality post
Sorry, this post is shit.
The best way out of oneitus is to fuck other women. If you can't do that, then you have to interact with more women. This is how you develop a sense of abundance.
The problem with your post is that you say like women appropriately. That's such a vague fucking description and liking a woman leads to oneitus in the long run, the very thing you want to avoid in the first place.
Yes, that made me a bit confused too, to keep going after the same booty is not healthy and will develop oneitis, it’s a very thin rope. We should move on at some point.
Abundance does save you from getting oneitis, but it doesn't prevent it entirely. Hooking up with my first hb10 earlier this summer fucked with my brain hard. She went right through my abundance armor. I dropped all my plates and went after her.
I am feeling better now after being dumped two weeks ago. It's because I started slaying vagina the very next day. It took a while but now I'm feeling better. I'm seeing the girl I had oneitis with for the first time since tonight. I hope my frame is strong enough to keep the feels at bay this time!
The problem is your confusing healthy human interaction with polite and entertaining indifference. If you actually liked them as humans, you'd tell them to go to church to confess their sins, and then be on your way.
You're basically buying into the BP-narrative of casual sex being wonderful and perfectly healthy - once you figured out the rules, you quickly forgot how rotten the game itself is.
Casual sex isn't going anywhere, and it's beyond the scope of you, me, or the Red Pill to change the world.
So at the very least, why not have better sex and actually enjoy the company of women and appreciate and connect with them as human beings. You don't have to be in some kind of serious exclusive romantic relationship on the path to marriage to like a woman, enjoy her company, appreciate her as a human, and have sex with her. And ten other women like her.
That's way better than reminding yourself every 15 seconds that women are slutty, manipulative, dislikeable creatures to prevent yourself from actually liking any of the women you fuck.
The very reason this sub exists is because we already did change the world from how it was for our grandfathers, and not just for the better.
You do sound bp - "Women are human beings too, you pig!" There's plenty else one ought to appreciate even more, and whatever "as human beings" means - you're not appreciating them at all, if you don't (make them) realize that they - someone's daughter, someone's future mother - would be better off having meaningful bonds instead of wasting their youth away. Although I guess that's better than being an incel.
Is anyone ever going to post anything new? Its always the same rehased shit...