In a LTR, women often turn down sex to gain power and leverage. What happens if a man turns them down? What does the hamster do? Any theories? Experiences?

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February 7, 2018

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Title In a LTR, women often turn down sex to gain power and leverage. What happens if a man turns them down? What does the hamster do? Any theories? Experiences?
Author Jsieijejeieokkd
Upvotes 76
Comments 71
Date 07 February 2018 11:24 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit askTRP
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Red Pill terms found in post:
hamsterlong term relationship

[–]1319Skew144 points145 points  (36 children) | Copy

Here's an anecdotal story. Take from what it what you will.

When I was married, I noticed that I'd instigate 9/10 of our sex sessions and was getting annoyed. So I decided to try an experiment. For a solid month I decided that I'd obtain from any form of sex. No masturbation or sex or anything. I wouldn't escalate or create any sexual tension beyond making out. Here's what I observed:

Week 1

No real change. I became irritable as fuck as I tried to keep myself busy and distracted. No difference in regards to her behaviors. Super easy to play off sex as she didn't catch on or suspect anything.

Week 2 Again nothing major but I noticed that she would occasionally try to instigate but I kept playing it off saying that I was busy, tired, not feeling to well. I NEVER told her what I was doing but kept up appearances.

Week 3 This started to get interesting. I started to get really horny but was managing it really well. I'd tease her with kisses and then just vanish. I'd have reasons to keep busy and I noticed that she started to become VERY affectionate and almost concerned. She'd mention how we didn't have sex in awhile and she missed that. I'd apologize and just tell her that it's OK. I still found her attractive but I was just busy. Things will get better.

Week 4

She started to get really horny and would try to fuck whenever we were alone together. We had family stay with us so it made it a challenge but she was trying. She also started to get paranoid that she wasn't as attractive or that I was seeing someone else. I worked all the time and spent my time with her so I kept playing it off as her paranoia. I also started to enjoy the role reversal and wanted to extend the experiment to two months. By now I was pretty good at self control and knowing how much she wanted me kinda gave me a cruel ego boost.

Week 4.5

I woke up with her sliding my pants off and trying to blow me. She was desperate. I tried to play it off saying that I didn't feel clean or something but she didn't care. She wanted it. She wanted my D so bad that she just proceeded to slide me into what I swear is the most wet I've ever seen/felt her and just fuck me like crazy.

I didn't last or stop myself. I just gave in and we banged like it was our first time. What followed was her on her best behavior for a few days.

She mentioned that she missed me and was feeling like we were growing apart and she was worried about losing me. I didn't know what I know now but this stuck with me for years.

The one thing a woman can give her man that he can't get for himself is sex. You can get better companionship from other men or a dog but if you're straight that's the one thing that she'll always have over you (if you're in a monogamous relationship). You take that away and she's got nothing. On some primal level she knows that.

I hope this helps. Again this is from my experience with my EX. I've done this again with a few plates and it works to different degrees but never to the point where I was almost raped by my own wife.

[–]Senior Endorseddr_warlock101 points102 points  (12 children) | Copy

Technically it was sexual assault, you're just not being a faggot about it.

Readers should also know that this sudden spike in interest isn't permanent unless you continue to do what got her that way ==> detachment. This isn't the green light to get back into your honeymoon phase. She'll just repeat what she was doing before. It's a power game. That's the red pill. The magic's gone.

Always invest noticeably less than her if you want to keep her inline.

[–]Luckylancer9610 points11 points  (7 children) | Copy

"In marriage sexual assault" makes me sick. You are married after all not random people on street. State should nor other people should not fuck the relationship.

[–]1ANGRY_ATHEIST14 points15 points  (0 children) | Copy

My now ex-wife sat on the stand and accused me of raping her 4 months into our marriage during our divorce hearing (which was years later).

I did not end up in jail, nor were any charges brought up. YMMV.

[–]pilljourney-1 points0 points  (5 children) | Copy

Look, feminism pisses me off, false rape accusations make me rage, but if you believe you can't rape your partner you're a moron. Marriage is a symbol, you're still two separate human beings. You can't just physically force yourself on your partner if they don't want you to. If you're sexually frustrated, that sucks, control your marriage better, make sure she wants you. Yes, the climate of rape accusations is absurd in this country, but rape still happens. A husband can rape their wife.

You are made sick by a law that attempts to protect women in marriages? Jesus

[–]Luckylancer961 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Someone you fuck periodicly and intimate person is diffrent from hormone filled creeper.

Diffrence is similar to a common thief and your son. It is not ok for him to steal but it is not same thing as actual theft.

[–]pilljourney0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It's so funny you guys talk so much about not being beta, but you're downvoting me and arguing it's okay to fuck your wife is she actively does not want you to and is saying no.

Christ, if you're such a fucking alpha she'd be wet and begging for it. Your analogy is stupid by the way, it makes no sense. If your son steals it's fucking theft

[–]1DubbleFUPAwitCheez0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Smarter and harder men than you have told me the opposite. I have no opinion really but their's was based on "religious" grounds.

[–]pilljourney0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

What does this even mean? It's funny you're comparing my intelligence, someone you've never met, with strangers I've never met. Especially considering your grammar, sentence structure, and overall point is nonsense. You'd do well to learn how to articulate yourself better because I have no idea what you're even trying to say.

[–]1DubbleFUPAwitCheez0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I don't expect you to be understanding of the comparison, it's just to elucidate a bit of the reasoning why people would disagree with you. I guarantee the men that I am conjuring in my sentence are superior to you in both respects. There is no doubt. If you are top .01% in intelligence and a veteran spy then I respectfully withdraw my comment.

[–]Trowawaycausebanned47 points8 points  (3 children) | Copy

That's just a forever game and who wants to keep that up?

[–]SelfUnmadeMan3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Welcome to TRP. It does not matter if you want to keep up the "game" or not. Either you do and she remains interested, or you don't and she eventually loses interest.

TRP preaches that you learn how to become a man with strong frame--one who can continue the "game" indefinitely with a minimum of effort.

[–]Senior Endorseddr_warlock3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

How long you wish to play is up to you. But the game will go on.

[–]V_GMan12 points13 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yes, you basically applied dread.

[–]do_it_or_leave4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

Post this on the main sub.

[–]1319Skew0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

My story is posted in the mainpage

[–]tigertigar 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

The experiment doesn't make sense.

Ultimately, she wasn't withholding sex from you or using it to get her way, you were both having enough sex but you wanted her to be the aggressor more.

The fact that you were both desperate after you abstained for a month doesn't mean she wanted you more -- she just inadvertently revealed to you what it looks like when you're desperate, except you're doing it 24/7. It gets old.

What works is TRP mindset 100% of the time and taking intermittent breaks -- like fasts -- in relationships that keeps everything going. Spend less time together: stay busy; leave and stay with friends or family for a weekend with minimal contact; go on trips when things start to get dull. TRP and absence is the key, not withholding.

Withholding is a trick that preys on the other's insecurities -- no better than her withholding to get you to paint the garage. At the end, she's fucking you because of her insecurities, not because she respects you or wants you more.

You're also having way less sex using this method, so who's the real loser?

If you have enough self control to abstain for over a month, then reconsider your approach overall for better results.

Sorry about the divorce, man.

[–]Merwebb16 points17 points  (3 children) | Copy

Reverse it. She doesn't want sex and she wakes up with your face between her legs after a month of denying you.

Bam. Jail time.

Not saying anything, just pointing out.

[–]daxxipro9 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

Reverse it. She doesn't want sex and she wakes up with your face between her legs after a month of denying you.

I have to disagree. Even if you're just in a relationship with a chick, if she wakes up with your head in between her legs - I HIGHLY doubt she will take offense to that. And if she does, boy you missed all the red flags.

Maybe if you're at a random party and do this to a rando? Sure, jail time.

[–]SeamusAwl1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

if you're just in a relationship with a chick, if she wakes up with your head in between her legs - I HIGHLY doubt she will take offense to that.

I can emphatically agree based on my own historical data. Sometimes, i just want a midnight snack.

[–]RPAlternate420 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I don't think you'd get jail time were this an actual relationship.

However I think if she complained, the relationship is over at the exact moment she complained.

[–]sd4c2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Bravo. Bravo, sir, bravo.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

she missed me and was feeling like we were growing apart

Crazy how when a woman is the one holding out, telling her this is just going to lower you in her eyes, and she'll just say something like ""oh I'm sorry, we're not growing apart I've just been busy. You have nothing to worry about" without actually giving a shit. That's the point where she starts texting chad.

[–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

A man CAN get sex for himself - by going to another woman. That's why your withdrawal tactic worked. She began to awaken to the fact that sex is not the ultimate trump card she thought it was.

Yes, men need sex. But it doesn't matter from whom we get it, so long as the woman is comparable in attractiveness. What counts more is what she puts us through to get it, which is why a woman's enthusiasm and affectionate demeanour improve when she believes she is on the verge of losing you to a competitor. She is making sex with her a more enticing prospect that sex with a different woman.

[–]Trowawaycausebanned41 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy

What were the long-term ramifications of inducing paranoia and a sense of abandonment in your spouse? Is that what contributed to your divorce or no? Did your sex life frequency increase after that in general or did it go back to how it was before?

[–]1319Skew8 points9 points  (6 children) | Copy

There were no real ramifications from this.

I'll post my divorce story on the main page because it is seriously messed up and would have been avoided entirely if I had discovered this website prior or during my marriage. I also hope to open some eyes and prevent some men from going through the ordeal.

My sex life did increase as soon as I realized that passion cannot be coerced or negotiated with. Sex 3-5 week with bjs being a regular thing and anal on the table. During her period the bjs would increase as she'd be more affectionate. In fact, I believe that the sex kept the marriage going as long as it did.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

Dude, you’ve got to expand on your divorce story. That’s what’s bringing a lot of people here, to learn from.

[–]1319Skew2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

My story is posted in the mainpage

[–]1319Skew1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'll post it on the main page when I get to the office.

[–]feminazi_oppresor0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I'm curious. Avoided entirely as in you wouldn't have married this girl in the first place or avoided entirely as in you would have never gotten divorced?

[–]Trowawaycausebanned40 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Would you link me to that post?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

She also started to get paranoid that she wasn't as attractive or that I was seeing someone else.

Funny how when THEY reject sex, and the man assumes she is seeing someone else, he is seen as paranoid and a bad husband.

[–]kimchi-22 1 points1 points [recovered] | Copy

from my experience with my EX.

Attaboy! I'm not sure what reason was that you broke up with her, but as I was reading your post I was thinking to myself that you'd better off without someone who uses her vagina as power over you.

[–]1319Skew1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

She went into the deep end of crazy after first born came out of her.

[–]electrogenisis29 points30 points  (1 child) | Copy

Two reactions.

They get clingy or they get bitchy and impatient.

Depends on how much they want you though.

[–]W_O_M_B_A_T5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Usually spend the next couple of days indulging in self-loathing as well.

[–]Hunter2isit21 points22 points  (1 child) | Copy

I've had them blow the fuck up in my face. She was BPD

I've also had them realize that sex isn't a leverage tool, panties get wet.

[–]W_O_M_B_A_T8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

Control issues centered around mitigating potential abandonment is a big Type symptom of Borderline Personalities.

Rejecting her is enforcing a boundary, and BPD's can't distinguish between boundaries and existential danger. They see this as some kind of attack.

[–]Austinisfullgohome41 points42 points  (14 children) | Copy

The hamster goes fucking nuts. “Did I gain weight? Does he not find me attractive? Is he getting it somewhere else? What the fuck? Guys always want it, right? Did I piss him off or something?”

Before I continue please note that this only applies to the men that women are actually attracted to. If you suck in bed or she’s uninterested, she’ll allow you to slide right out into orbit.

We, as women, are not used to rejection. It goes all the way back to childhood. Boys are told to suck it up while girls are consoled. Guys went to prom as a group because no girls said yes. Girls went to prom as a group because their first choices didn’t ask them. We do not get turned down because we never have to ask anyone out. This is not to say we never ask guys out, but it’s not our sole option. If a woman gets rejected, she can generally find a willing partner elsewhere. A romantic rejection like this is something very few women understand.

So it’s a new and uncomfortable feeling, just as it was for you in middle school. Except in adult relationships it’s unclear—“Is he really that tired? Or is it me?”

Then the self-doubt and a little insecurity sneaks in. We know how much guys like sex because the world never shuts up about it. “So why the hell isn’t my vagina good enough?”squeak squeak

[–]Jsieijejeieokkd10 points11 points  (13 children) | Copy

“We” you are a woman? I realized at 43 that I never said no to a woman, maybe it’s time I started.

[–]Austinisfullgohome26 points27 points  (12 children) | Copy


Yep. Been reading TRP theory for a few years now. Came to find out why all of reddit was hating on it, stayed for the logic.

[–]Trowawaycausebanned42 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy

Not sure if you're allowed to announce that. Not in /r/trp you're not

[–]Austinisfullgohome2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

It doesn’t really matter here. There are rules in TRP and RPW against announcing it but generally people don’t care as long as the post has value and is consistent with RP theory.

The rule is mostly there to put the kibosh on “TRP is sexist/RPW are chained to the stove” bullshit we used to get from white knights and sjws, or plain bad advice.

[–]Irishminer931 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

we use the tits or gtfo rule, basically, we treat all posters as men. There isn't a rule about saying your a woman, at least not to my knowledge.

[–]Trowawaycausebanned42 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

For asktrp or trp? Because for trp there is

[–]Irishminer932 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

asktrp, btw /r/trp and /r/theredpill are completely different subs

[–]W_O_M_B_A_T18 points19 points  (0 children) | Copy

Read some of the posts by women on /r/deadbedrooms

(Also read some posts by men if you want examples of pubescent BB's in their natural habitat.)

1) They get frustrated, bored, and resentful.

In the short run, women will get competitive and generally try harder next time. This is a good thing as women should never take your sexuality for granted in an LTR.

In my opinion, It's important to turn her down or ignore IOIs for sex occasionally. This is because women need you to provide them with contrast and perspective.

Women have a strong Sour Grapes Response, but in this case they're not going to risk further rejection/humiliation.

So they'll just become resentful and lose respect for you after a few rejections.

2)However, if you fail to Fuck Her Good on a regular basis, the resentment and boredom wins and she'll just branch swing.

Note: this is assuming that you don't already bore and irritate them with low value behaviors, such as surrendering your frame to them. In which case they don't care whether you fuck them. Turning them down just makes them feel more justified in chasing more attractive men.

[–]nomba7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

If it goes on long enough, she’ll rationalize why it’s alright for her to cheat.

[–]Voshe2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Explosive anger from one woman. Big tears from another. It's like mentioned earlier in the thread, this is completely unknown territory for women.

[–]RPAlternate422 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Women go apeshit when they are turned down for sex. I believe it stems from the fact that women know, deep down, that sex is the only power they have with you.

The problem for them is that they are not strong enough or aggressive enough (in most cases) to force you to have sex. A woman's weapons are social whereas a man's are physical.

So when you turn her down for sex, you will shamed, insulted, talked about to her friends, and if she's a real piece of work, start looking for another dude to try to make you jealous; her solipsism makes her believe that you will react as she would in that same situation.

Except any self-respecting man would just leave if she did that. But then he should have left if he's not in a position to fuck his girl.

This all assumes you weren't otherwise busy.


Early on in RP I started turning down my wife for starfish sex. Whereas before I would have relished any sex I was armed with the understanding RP provided. So when she went starfish, I simply said, "eh... nevermind."

She immediately softened up, but as I was getting dressed she wasn't trying to get me back in bed. She did say, "I don't know what you want."

"I want you to give a shit about fucking me. I'm better than all this." Then I left the house.

The texts that followed accused me of not caring about her (shaming and gaslighting), accused me of cheating on her (gaslighting and avoidance). When I didn't answer, then she claimed she can't get into it because I don't spend enough time with her and the kids (more gaslighting.) Then when I didn't answer, THEN she pulls out the "I was tired" classic.

So I responded: "You should get some sleep, then."

"You're an asshole."

"<smiley face emoji>"

When I returned home a couple hours later (around midnight but later) she was still awake (I thought she was so tired!) I got undressed, brushed my teeth again, and climbed into bed. She was still awake. Hamsters must make a lot of racket in their wheel. She said nothing.

The next day I went about my business as usual: yard work, garage organization, etc. About midday she busts out more crap: "I don't know why you're being like this... you left last night, not me."

"Like what? You seem upset, not me."

"You're an asshole."

"I've done, literally, nothing to you. and you've openly insulted me, twice. Don't talk to me unless you can be nicer."

"Well stop being an asshole."

I considered some amused mastery, but her face looked legitimately pissed. Still, I walked up to her and invaded her personal space, making her step backwards. I stared at her eyes, moving closer. She backed up. This continued until she hit the wall. I went to kiss her and she turned her face. I stepped back, shrugged, changed my clothes and left.

I returned a few hours later, but she wasn't home. When she did return, I said hello from the other room. no response. As the night wound down she eventually went to bed. I got the kids in bed. I watched a movie in the living room. I got a text: "We can have sex if you want."

Suddenly she's not a starfish that night. Not the greatest sex, but a vast improvement.

There were a couple more episodes like that, and my time away got longer and longer. She gave up that shitty behavior pretty quick. The third time it happened, she was just laying there, and instead of walking away, I said "so you're just going to lay there like a despondent hooker?"

And again: "I don't know what you..."

I just flipped her over, pulled her to her knees and fucked her doggy. I was pretty violent about moving her and I pounded her hard; if she wants to act like a despondent hooker, then i'll treat her like a despondent hooker. I finished in her, pulled out, got dressed ("where are you going?"... I responded in silence) and went to the living room to watch some show I had missed some episodes of while I drank a beer.

The next day she was like a kitten in my lap.

General rule is don't turn your girl down for sex. There are exceptions, but always give her the benefit of the doubt when it comes to sex. If you start in on it and she's just a dead fish, you can make that call. Early on you can deny her the satisfaction of thinking she has you wrapped around her cunt. Later, as your frame is better developed and you are more swole (you are lifting, right?) you can go a different route and ignore her nonsense and just treat her like a backpage escort.

And to answer your question: her hamster tells her:

  • you're cheating on her
  • you think she's fat
  • you think she's ugly
  • you don't love her anymore
  • you're an asshole
  • she doesn't really like you much anyway
  • she misses you
  • you're a loser
  • you're going to leave her
  • she needs you
  • she doesn't need you

Basically the hamster just tells her all the things.

[–]joedevice1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Turning down sex in an LTR will cause dread that will make the hamster spin faster than you've ever seen it.

[–]Pluglord1 point2 points  (11 children) | Copy

Don't listen to these autists commenting. If your girl is horny and you turn down sex enough times she will go get it elsewhere.

Keep in mind that any mildly attractive female doesn't understand the feeling of NOT being able to find sex at a time that they need it. They don't have a discipline like we do.

[–]Austinisfullgohome12 points13 points  (10 children) | Copy

Women don’t “need” sex like guys do. The idea that they’ll cheat out of sheer sexual frustration doesn’t make any sense. Women cheat because they lose attraction and respect for the man, not because he won’t have sex with her. She can get dick anywhere. Dick itself has very little value because it’s in such abundance.

Not to mention women are perfectly content to go years without sex as long as there’s commitment and resources. But then after that dry spell who does the she end up sleeping with? Her trusty little betabuxTM? No lol. She goes out and fucks a Chad or three. Not because she needs the D, but because she needs the tingles.

[–]trancedj3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

So, have you found TRP to be helpful as a woman? Has TRP affected your relationships?

And don’t forget to PM me those titties ;)

[–]Austinisfullgohome2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Oh, yes and yes. I originally used it to try and help myself (nun mode and undoing feminist mentality post-breakup) and subsequently my boyfriend. When I found him he was your typical broken, skinny, doormat B.B. who was doing everything “right” yet was still miserable. But he had potential. He has never been to r/TRP but just last week he got (another) raise, has some friends and hobbies of his own, we just bought a beautiful house, he lifts, he quit drinking (his choice, but I quit too out of respect) and he told me he’s saving for a ring. We never fight, have plenty of sex, and it’s because of RPT. He’s so much happier now and that makes me happy because I love and respect him. Without RPT I’d probably be a bitter, fat, aging cat lady waiting for the Prince Charming that’s never coming. No thanks.

I can honestly say no pictures of my titties exist anywhere. They’d have no value to my man if just anyone could see them :D

[–]Pluglord0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Pics or it didn't happen

[–]Pluglord1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy

Not to mentiom women are perfectly content to go years without sex

Where's proof that they're actually not having sex and not just saying it?

[–]OGAbunai2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Pics or it didn't happen? LOL

[–]trancedj0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

It’s been discussed here in depth. Most all women can easily shut their sex drive off for extended periods of times, even years. The idea being that this ability evolved from our days as hunter / gatherers.

[–]Pluglord0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Bullshit. If she's asking you for sex then how is her sex drive shut off?

[–]trancedj1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I wasn’t talking about OP’s example. All I’m saying is that women can absolutely turn their sex drive off for extended periods of time. What’s your point?

[–]Pluglord0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

My point is that if a woman wants sex and her bf/husband continuously withholds sex from her she will get it elsewhere.

[–]trancedj2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

No argument there. That should be common knowledge.

All I’m saying is that women can turn their sex drive off. In my experience women do this primarily for two reasons,

1) they want to try and reverse years of riding the cc and decide to try and regain some form of chastity,

2) they simply get tired of being pumped and dumped so they check out of the dating game entirely. My ex wife falls into this category.

I don’t believe they do it while actively in relationships, but I don’t know because that’s never been an issue in my relationships (nor should it be for any red-pilled man).

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I would find after 2-3 weeks should would get really horny and we'd fuck. Hoeever that would be another 2-3 weeks.

They don't do it on purpose. If they arent attracted they arent attracted.

When we first started dating we fucked average 4 times a day.

[–]1DubbleFUPAwitCheez0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

One got so horny that she grabbed my dick and started blowing me in the middle of the driveway, outside the car. The other just would not stop pestering me for an hour until I said fine and we fucked.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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