How do you cope with the fact that you need to work your ass off at least 40 hours a week only to survive? Even when working 8 hours a day it seems like there is no time left for yourself after the work, and earning big money also seems like magic.

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April 14, 2020
193 upvotes

By no means do I want to undermine the necessity of working. But I'm a young man and am bothered by this thought all the time now and I don't want it to translate into problems when talking with other people.

The very concept of losing 5/7th of my week til I retire is crushing me like a tonne of bricks. How do you live with the fact that from Monday til Friday you are a prisoner who needs to work for food?


Post Information
Title How do you cope with the fact that you need to work your ass off at least 40 hours a week only to survive? Even when working 8 hours a day it seems like there is no time left for yourself after the work, and earning big money also seems like magic.
Author Vouch33r
Upvotes 193
Comments 193
Date 14 April 2020 01:37 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit askTRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/653654
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/asktrp/comments/g15nni/how_do_you_cope_with_the_fact_that_you_need_to/
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Comments

[–][deleted] 27 points28 points  (2 children) | Copy

Read Millionaire Fastlane. Sounds cliche, but it's one if best books on finance philosophy I've read.

[–]new__vision9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

His sequel is also very good, and goes into more detail about how to setup your finances. MJ Demarco.

[–]rplad4203 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Better yet go to his fastlane forum. One of the best finance forums with tons of gold advice

[–]brngamer176 points177 points  (10 children) | Copy

Don’t wish the game was easier, wish you were better.

[–]beingamannotadayjob23 points24 points  (3 children) | Copy

Jim rohn

[–]burn-all-bridges15 points16 points  (0 children) | Copy

This man is fucking amazing. He has a 4 hour video on YouTube called best year ever and I've seen it so many times in like 30 minute to an hour chunks.

This shit should have been in our education.

[–]MrAnderzon16 points17 points  (1 child) | Copy

  • Michael Scott

[–]S54E46M35 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Wayne Gretzky

[–]OkDonkey2221 points22 points  (2 children) | Copy

Sounds like something someone who created the game or who was favoured by it since their youth would say

[–]QueenSlapFight7 points8 points  (1 child) | Copy

Sounds like something a defeatist would say. Whine all you want, the world is the way it is. Make the most of it or don't, nobody cares how hard you have it.

[–]diogenesdooky0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

haha yea...ok....

[–]ComfortOverated107 points108 points  (21 children) | Copy

Seems like you are a perfect candidate for FIRE. Bust your ass in your 20s to retire in your 30s. Invest in building a stock and real estate portfolio by living substantially below your means. Reap the benefits later. Its like hitting the gym, but for your finances.

On a related note I will be starting a blog soon documenting my journey to accumulating a million dollars worth of assets by 30 and how someone could copy what I have done.

[–]sandokanjungle15 points16 points  (0 children) | Copy

I did the opposite, nearing 30 and did shit career wise just had fun

[–]Street_rat242622 points23 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'd read your blog. You have my attention

[–]L0nerizm13 points14 points  (3 children) | Copy

don't do this. I know plenty of people who are miserable they worked away their youth. not worth it

[–]ComfortOverated15 points16 points  (0 children) | Copy

The idea here is to work smarter and not harder. Everyone can go at whatever pace they feel comfortable. Optimizing your finances at an early age and investing in assets that generate passive income allow you to not be dependent on wages to survive.

[–]SuperCrazy079 points10 points  (1 child) | Copy

I did this (worked my ass off until approx 32) and am not miserable. In my mid 40s I have more fun and options than most people my age that I know (I know a couple other guys who are basically at the same point). It’s been that way for over a decade.

For guys my age, there’s a strong correlation between whining about how unfair things are and how much they fucked around when they were younger.

[–]L0nerizm0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

People are different I guess. Just giving the sample size I am familiar with.

[–][deleted]  (7 children) | Copy

[deleted]

[–]ComfortOverated7 points8 points  (5 children) | Copy

I'm currently not a millionaire, but will be by age 30 (currently 25). The secret to becoming wealthy is not by having a large income, but rather having investments produce unrealized gains (i.e. stock and real estate appreciation).

[–][deleted]  (4 children) | Copy

[deleted]

[–]ComfortOverated5 points6 points  (3 children) | Copy

The whole point of the blog is to show the process. I'm sure I will have many ups and downs along the way that people can learn from. I've been learning about the stock market and real estate for years and have a lot of knowledge (CFA level 1 passed and realtor). The blog is mainly for myself to keep myself accountable by posting my net worth monthly among other things I find interesting. Most of the content about building wealth is very unspecific and general from people who have it, often they don't document or care to get into specifics.

[–]RedBloodHunter0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I’d be very interested in reading your blog. Is there somewhere I can follow?

[–]tyalanm0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I'd be interested as well. Please PM the link.

[–]Payanasius1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy

FIRE is bullshit. It's all based off of an unprecedented market bullrun. All those FIRE yuppies are getting destroyed by Corona.

[–]ComfortOverated1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy

You sound butthurt my guy. I'm sure there are plenty of early retired people that cut some corners and may have to go back to work during this unprecedented black swan event, but I know many who are just fine and are deploying cash reserves while equities are cheap.

Historically equities have returned 8-10% over the duration of the entire stock market. Long term holders of equities don't really care about bull or bear runs.

[–]Payanasius1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

Maybe you're right. I chickened out of losing 500 dollars more on options and had I stuck to my plays I would have made 40k. So salty.

[–]ComfortOverated2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

Gambling is a surefire way to never accumulate wealth. Most people I know who are successful with options stick to one strategy and they are usually selling premium, taking the opposite side of the outrageously speculative bets where $500 could yield 40k that you are taking. Not that reading WSB and acting like a moron with your money isn't fun, but at that point its nothing more than adrenaline and entertainment.

[–]Payanasius0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Lol, just no. For most people yes, but I've been studying options for years and nope. I look for plays for months.

[–]ComfortOverated0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Be honest. What is your net ROI on all the years you have traded options?

[–]Payanasius0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I didnt really trade much volume so I'm only down a few hundred. I do put mostly into blue chip stocks and index but I only started this year. I put in about 5000 and down 1000 because the corona but that's just timing amd I'm still contributing.

However, if I do see some exceptional play I will still put about 1000 into it. But now only buying calls over long term periods.. no active trading. Will sell covered calls once I have enough assets on appropriate stocks.

However in my dumber days I did lose about 4k in penny stocks and crypto... but I did trade it up to about 30k I just got greedy and didnt sell til I lost it all. But those were totally different strategies.

[–]mr4kino44 points45 points  (20 children) | Copy

Work from home.

This literally changed my life. Going to this office was exhausting. 2hours commute every day, even if you do NOTHING at the office you would come back home at 5/6 PM exhausted. Now I work more than 8hours a day (sometimes up to 11h), fully concentrated, I sleep well, I can go to the gym midday, and still have plenty of time left without being a zombie in the evening.

[–]RavenLeonhartXX8 points9 points  (13 children) | Copy

What do you do for a job?

[–]mr4kino20 points21 points  (12 children) | Copy

Software engineer. But that goes for most of the IT jobs like platform engineers, production engineers, Professional services etc. Most important thing is to find the company that is fully remote or have a good remote mentality. For example GitHub is half remote (half of their employees are fully remote) if I'm not mistaken. Same for stackoverflow. Other IT companies offers couple of day per week as remote. This is good too.

[–]trpppp1239 points10 points  (7 children) | Copy

While I attribute software engineering to have negatively impacted my sex & social life in university (and somewhat even now), as I've gotten older I've realized that tradeoff I made back then has put me in a very good position now.

I enjoy the work and don't mind the 40 hours unlike most people. I make more than any peer/friend that I knew from high school or college, I'm making 6 figures in a low cost of living city, not even 30 yet, I can work remotely from a different country or home when I feel like it, I can go to the office whenever I feel like and leave when I want as long as my work is done (no real set hours).

Sometimes I do regret the missed young, prime-age college pussy I could have had probably in another discipline, but overall life is very comfortable now.

[–]mr4kino3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Indeed, I do agree there could be drawbacks but overall I haven't seen anyone complaining about working from home and earning 6 figures.

[–]diogenesdooky1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy

Why did you miss out on the poon? I realize many of the classes are male dominated but couldn't you meet girls through social events/ just been on campus?

[–]trpppp1234 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy

Well one factor was that a good chunk of my time was spent studying and working minimum wage part-time quite a bit to support my college fees. I came out debt-free out of college because of it.

Then the second factor. It was heavily male-dominated. My classmates were all video game nerds and while I didn't become super close to them, it rubbed off on me being in that environment and I spent my little free time doing the same. I'm sure I could have found a way if I really wanted to despite the odds being against me, but I guess I wasn't self-aware enough to do it and my mind was pre-occupied with other shit. Or maybe I'm just making excuses. I was also a naturally shy kid/introvert growing up and I guess I didn't have enough momentum to push for change yet along with the constant "be yourself" bullshit that's propagated through society.

Looking back, I do wish I put myself in a position to make more outgoing and social friends throughout college. I think I would smashed a lot more prime pussy. But there is definitely a driver that pushed me for change and which set me up for a lot of success due to the lack of pussy... so I can't say it would have be beneficial overall.

[–]smolzino2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

Honestly do not regret it. I spent my college years being a fuckboy and neglected my education. Now I can say "oh it was fun" but I would much rather be in a better place financially. I'm actually going back to college because of this. It's a waste of time, I didn't even keep the friends I made and honestly a good party and a good fuck are extremely forgivable, I don't remember the half of it. The only stuff you remember is falling in love or meaningful relationships and that's achievable anywhere anytime.

Many times have I wished I was a shy nerd because then I probably would have fulfilled my potential already instead of being sidetracked by futile things.

[–]trpppp1232 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Right, the grass is always greener. I'd say I've made up somewhat for missing out in college for sure, but the grass is always greener I suppose.

I'm sure I would feel the same if I were in shoes similar to yours so I'm still happy with how my life has gone but just know there's value in having been there, done that. You don't have to wonder.

[–]_DonDraper_1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'm guessing he was also probably busy studying...

[–]cactushatter2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yes and yes. I am an IT consultant and normal hours are about 3-4 days per week remote. Clutch af!

[–]rprookie2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

See that’s different when you refer to “working from home”. It takes a couple of years to develop some software/ coding engineer skills.

Edit: and getting a degree in computer program isn’t easy. Takes lots of work and logical thinking and doesn’t work for everyone. You made it seem like “ oh yeah just get a degree in CP” noooo bro

[–]mr4kino0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

What do you mean it's different? I'm fully remote (so working from home every day, meetings are online etc).

Regarding the "couple of years it takes", yes it's easier having some experience. I had some infra experience before I jumped into software engineering. Still It took me 6 months and applying to 100 companies (selected one, with remote) to get the job opportunity. On the other hand I have colleagues, junior ones, that started directly being remote. Though I wouldn't recommend for a junior to start directly remotely, it's good to have some mentoring at least for 2 years.

[–]rprookie0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yes I get that but that’s besides the point. You reference computer programming as the only “ at home job” or “ work at home”

Is there not any other job you can find to work from home?

[–]notastupid_question2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

Lol this seems hard to attain once you are 30 years old, on your way to obtain your second master degree and living in a third world country while being average on your capabilities. Okay just ranting here and whinning like a little bitch.

[–]mr4kino0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Exactly, you are just ranting. Do some research, apply to remote companies, it will take time but you will get a job.

I've colleagues working from eastern Europe, Egypt, Nigeria, India etc. I wouldn't call those "rich countries" but still, the guy made the efforts and got rewarded.

[–]notastupid_question0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Do you have to necesarilly be an IT specialist or related careers? I am just a mediocre economist not working in my career.

[–]mr4kino0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Hmm this I will be honest, I don't know. I know some guys working remotely in Europe and everyone that can work behind a computer is working from home currently so "technically" it is possible.

Now "economist" is a pretty broad domain I believe so try to look for remote opportunities related to your domain in all the indeed, linkedin, remote.co, weworkremotely platforms.

[–]millenialprincess-2 points-1 points  (1 child) | Copy

The gyms are closed, buddy.

[–]mr4kino2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Yes, my comment is based on "normal times", not covid19.

[–]Chad-MacHonkler42 points43 points  (6 children) | Copy

You do something way harder and more soul crushing than that for an extended period of time (multiple years). Then when you go back to it, it seems like easy street.

[–]Vouch33r3 points4 points  (5 children) | Copy

How much depends on working hard, and how much depends on the fact that your rich daddy connects you with the right people and a vacancy is yours?

[–]i-am-the-prize62 points63 points  (0 children) | Copy

your Frame is so bent.

  • STOP being envious of others (of others' connections, wealth, height, cocksize, whatever)
  • WORK on yourself. understand what you can improve and what you cannot. focus and dwell only on what is changable.
  • YOU will be the reason your win or lose. Understand that fact. Until you do, you're destined to walk around whining and being a bitch.

[–]Chad-MacHonkler5 points6 points  (2 children) | Copy

I don’t understand the question. How’s that pertain to your soul crushing 9-5?

[–]Vouch33r8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

I'm easy to panic and apparently all these career worries resulted in one chaotic post asking for perspective of other people since I have nobody to talk about it. That is another worry of mine but now I see it's just irrelevant mental masturbation

[–]alikebabay6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

You are here with like minded people. The people who actually want you to succeed. People who welcome your questions. Who had your problems before.

[–]1DonaldBaelish3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Well you just pointed out your main issue and probably the reason you made this post in the first place.People are trying to give you advice. Nobody brought up jealousy or envy but you.

What’s the situation like? You saw a rich kid driving a car that represents the idea of the successful person and made a post about how working 8 hours is unfair because in your mind the rich kid is probably not working at all?

What do you work?

[–][deleted]  (5 children) | Copy

[deleted]

[–]Seredusc2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Well done man! That’s incredibly rare.

[–]SalporinRP2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Until now I've lived a bodybuilder lifestyle. A good part of the day goes on shopping for food and cooking my meals. I would hit the gym around 1PM. Then come back eat my post workout meal and have a quick nap.

Man I'm jealous. This was me during a stretch of the first half of 2019. I took a job with a significant pay bump but I wasn't going to start for another 2 months.

So for 2 months I just hit the gym around 11, lunch afterwards, then went to the beach and read during the afternoon. I honestly enjoy my current job but those were the best two weeks of my life.

[–]SanatanaDharmic0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

What business are you doing online?

[–][deleted]  (1 child) | Copy

[deleted]

[–]SanatanaDharmic0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Thank you.

[–]beingamannotadayjob12 points13 points  (5 children) | Copy

Take some months of and figure out what you want in life.

I want to do photography on a professional level and that’s why I learn about photography a lot.

If I do shoots It doesn’t really feel like work.

Got a homie that sells beat and makes YouTube, he is making like 7k a month.

[–]-Skizzy2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

Same boat as you, trying to start up a photography business.

[–]beingamannotadayjob2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy

Nice! I’m located in Berlin. Where are you from?

[–]-Skizzy2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

I’m from America!

[–]beingamannotadayjob1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Okay, let’s Talk! I’ll DM you

[–]-Skizzy0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Cool, always open to talk.

[–]paul_ernst9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy

Start stacking. You lose most of your free time being unprepared.

Use the crushing feeling to throw out aaaalll the fucking bullshit you piled up into your life. Hours wasted on social media for one. If you're in a good company that has a gym for employees or you're gym is close, hit the gym before lunch and eat faster afterwards or just during afternoon work. If you want to do something after work (gym, sport, whatever), don't go home first, just come prepared to work. Save yourself an extra hour easily. If you can, reduce your commute as much as possible. It is shown to increase people's overall happiness a lot. Make the most of of your commute. Either by biking, reading, listening to podcasts.
My golden tip: nap when you get home before dinner. Yes it takes about half an hour, but at least you'll be far more awake and relaxed in the evening and be able to be productive instead of being a zombie in front of your tv waiting for the next day. If you're tired: sleep! An extremely valuable skill. Powernapping takes time to learn but I love it. Another option is to shift your freetime to the morning during the week instead of the evening. Wake up at 4am. You'll be fresh to work on your own goals. After work, eat and sleep around 9pm.

[–]xerxes315 points16 points  (0 children) | Copy

I don't agree with the comments like "40 hours is nothing" or "you just need to be better." No, work sucks and it's supposed to suck. Having to work to make someone else rich just so you can scrape by is demeaning. This is the fundamental problem of capitalism aka wage slavery. Feudalism was a system wherein the serfs gave up most of their time and fruits of their labor to a lord just for the right to be a tenant on his land. Unless you have equity/capital, you are by definition a serf, and capitalism has not improved income equality for the vast majority of people. If you want to be free you need to own the fruits of your labor - start your own business, or invest your excess profits.

Bushmen in Africa hunt for about 5-10 hours a week. Thats what the human being has been conditioned to over hundreds of thousands of years. We have only had dawn til dusk work for the last 10k since the agricultural revolution - but even then, it was seasonal, you'd have late fall and winter off. We have improved labor conditions since the 1800s but being on call thanks to tech means that few of us truly work only 40 hours anymore. And this isn't even getting to the absence of paid vacation time, family and sick leave - which are considered human rights in Europe. Germans work less and have higher productivity.

Tldr it's not you, it's the system. Short of Bernies revolution emancipate yourself by owning property and capital.

[–]redknobmirror85 points86 points  (27 children) | Copy

Working 40 hours a week is actually super easy. Most people with jobs over 50k work more than that.

If you didn’t work 40 hours a week you would honestly be super bored with all the free time on your hands.

It’s honestly not that hard to get a 50k business job. Just get an accounting degree from literally any college and apply to literally any company.

You are working yourself up, take a deep breath and solve your problems one at a time.

[–]Vouch33r39 points40 points  (0 children) | Copy

You're right. That's what I needed to read. I am panicking needlessly and should take things slower

[–]Hungboy696942014 points15 points  (8 children) | Copy

Come to tech, you can work 40 hours (or less) and make good money. If you shoot for the stars and end up at FAANG , you can make a killing although you'll have to work longer

[–]chiefsmurf1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy

Are you talking IT or more CS programming?

[–]schrono1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy

Programming is an amazing job, it’s definitely not hard and earns you lots of money

[–]JW_20 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

How does one get into it if they are out of college already?

[–]8bitmadness2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy

coding bootcamps. There's some really good ones out there.

[–]JW_20 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Thanks! Any ones you suggest?

[–]8bitmadness1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I've not gone through any of them so I can't recommend any myself, but the in person ones are really good from what I know. Just know that they range from short term (6 weeks or so) to long term (2 years) so you should do the research yourself and find the one that will work for you.

[–]JW_21 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Thanks!

[–]schrono1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Maybe go to a programming subreddit and ask them there?

[–]Endorsed Contributorvandaalen20 points21 points  (12 children) | Copy

If you didn’t work 40 hours a week you would honestly be super bored with all the free time on your hands.

LOL. Speak for yourself.

I am a self-employed head of production for live events and i am forced into unemployement due to lockdown.

i didnt feel a single second of boredom up to now and the lockdown here in europe started weeks before it did in the us.

there is so much shit i want to learn and so many skills i want to possess, i will never run out of shit to do.

if work is the only thing that keeps you from getting bored, you have a pretty pathetic life my friend, especially if you are working in corporate land.

also you clearly lack a mission.

[–]throaway4000s2 points3 points  (10 children) | Copy

I want to use this time to better myself. What are you learning and what skills are you improving on?

[–]Endorsed Contributorvandaalen3 points4 points  (9 children) | Copy

I am working on my color grading skills atm and I have decided to start filming documentaries once that shit is over. I put much time into those two things and besides I am filming some stuff in order to have material to grade.

I have bought a new camera specifically for this and much time went into research as well as for what camera to get, but now also about what additional equipment makes sense.

i also have my own bjj school and i am training more than ever with my partners atm.

i also am thinking about taking up my very old hobby of building scale models and have put some research into both the craftmanship as well as what the right tools i would need.

i have put some time into watching various masterclasses as well, mostly on film making and photografy and plan on watching a couple more.

and finally i am trying to reach legend at hearthstone atm. unfortunately i am not good enough though. can't make it beyond diamond 3. :(

i am also working on some other things, but i dont want to talk about them, because i dont feel like getting doxxed.

[–]throaway4000s0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy

Is it a bad strategy to just play Xbox and watch Netflix non stop for six months? The Australian government is paying unemployed people like myself $600 a week AUD, and I am almost done with college and have a great job lined up already once this virus stuff goes away and then sell the tv and Xbox and never own one again? If that makes sense

[–]Endorsed Contributorvandaalen3 points4 points  (7 children) | Copy

there is nothing you want to know? nothing you want to learn? no skill you want to possess? i pity you.

[–]throaway4000s0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy

Well I'm reading heaps and upskilling mega in chess. But I've always kept my hobbies relatively simple and I imagine when society goes back to normal without a TV, laptop or Xbox there would be so much time to pick up hobbies etc? Therefore this is the last chance in my life to indulge in such meaningful activity guilt free

[–]Endorsed Contributorvandaalen2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy

if you lead a busy life, you'll never feel guilty for playing some xbox.

[–]throaway4000s0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

meaningless*, but if it's busy enough which I'm ultimately hoping for, there won't be time for it. Is it still a pathetic plan?

[–]Endorsed Contributorvandaalen1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

i wont provide you with plausible deniability for being a lazy asshat

[–]ilo8oli0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Yes, it is pathetic and you know it. Will that change your actions is the real question, are you satisfied with being mediocre is the question,

[–]hrm08940 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

He lost me with that line. Wtf is this guy on? Lmao

[–]DerpJungler2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

I have a bachelors in Accounting and a Masters' in Management & Finance.

I make 12k/yr (EUR) working 38hrs per week lol.

And my salary is considered to be above average where I live.

My ambitions are high tho and I'm still 24. Hope to make 50k/yr before I am 30.

[–]1DonaldBaelish4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

Mind if I ask what country you are talking about?

I’m only asking because you claim that 12 000 € is above average and you are trying to jump to 50 000 € and I assume you are trying to progress in the same firm in your country. Correct me if I’m wrong.

If in your country 12 000 € is above average and let’s say 24 000€ is a really high salary, how do you plan on making 50 000 € in your exact field in 6 years? I’m curious.

[–]DerpJungler1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I live in Cyprus.

And no, I plan on changing industry completely, work to bring up my own business at some point and most importantly, leave my country.

[–]Brodin691 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I was in grad school doing 50ish a week. Now im out of school working 35-40 a week making 2.5x my student stipend and I feel like I have so much extra time its amazing. IDK why this guy is saying 40 hours is too hard.

[–]Endorsed Contributorvandaalen7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

become self-employed and even more important: become self-employed with something you love to do. you'll never have to work a day in your life again.

[–]Archammes27 points28 points  (3 children) | Copy

Maybe its because I went straight into the military after high school, but I'm honestly confused what you're asking.

I grew into manhood working 9-12 hour days, or 24 if I was on ambulance team. Then two Iraq deployments. When I got out after six years, I haven't found a civilian job yet that makes me feel like I dont have enough time for myself.

Maybe its just your perspective?

[–]Vouch33r10 points11 points  (1 child) | Copy

Definitely a matter of perspective. Thank you for sharing your views and a bit of your life. I hope to be just as hard one day.

[–]Archammes4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Its got nothing to do with being hard, and everything to do with appreciating what you have and maximizing the use of your time.

[–]TalaHasse6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'm an active duty Marine and I honestly feel the same confusion. 40 hours a week is pretty nice tbh

[–]RedSkeller6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy

Give Meditations a read as it addresses most of this concern. As for me personally, I struggled to find my career and hated the idea of drone 9 to 5 work - good news is there are plenty of jobs where you don't have to adhere to that schedule and that alone was a big factor in where I'm at now. Also realize you need to decide if you want to 'work to live' or 'live to work' the Europeans have a great view on the first part. Make a list of things you want, imagine your ideal life or lifestyle and then back up from there. I think if you're aware the corporate lifestyle isn't for you, I'd start looking into trades. Once you get a solid career or profession going you can start to invest in a side job or figure out a hobby but you need one to do the other, having a good cash flow is apart of all of it.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Seneca also addresses it

[–]dimmy6665 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

Medical resident here. 70-something hour work weeks are the norm. I don't mind it because:

  1. It's temporary (my residency lasts 4 years, and it gets significantly easier on the last two)

  2. I can still manage to take care of myself on the off hours

  3. Work is fun. Sure it has it's stressful moments, but it's enjoyable for the most part. Can't see myself ever retiring, so long as I'm still having a blast.

[–]MeanBomo3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

I'm an M-2 and have been Redpilled for a few years now, but I can say that it was once I started med school that my life got significantly better - even with a 70+ hour work week.

Everything really started falling into place when I started chasing this career and made the most from those 6 hours of freetime on the weekend.

OP needs to sort his own shit out and find a long-term goal. Complaining about a 9-5 is pathetic.

[–]tilleuno5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

A cliche response but one that always bears repeating:

If you don't like working 40 hours a week, then you better start working 70+ hours a week until you don't have to anymore.

I put in a year and a half of 12+ hour days to reduce my work days to an hour a day. My particular case was an easy one, but the risk was high and path unproven. If you follow a more proven path, you may be looking at longer years higher output to get to a point you can coast.

Whatever it is, you'll rarely ever get to a place of happiness working for someone else. No matter how much you bust your ass for your employer, your time is always just going to be a smaller component in someone's else's leverage.

[–]Vouch33r0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That's exactly how I feel. Unfortunately what I'm lacking now is the experience to even see the paths which NOT end in 9-5. I'm sure opportunities will pop up as the time goes by and I'll more than likely catch on to something to get out of that 8 hour hell working for other people.

[–]OkDonkey225 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

Dude ur right it’s ridiculous only advice I can give you is find a job u have fun in and that dosent seem like work, there’s countless amount of different jobs in the world there’s definitely one that’s fitting for you if you look hard enough , and like you said : ur gonna work there 5/7 days a week for the rest of your life so you can most definitely put some time and effort into finding the right job for you.

[–]MisterRoid2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Working 40h/week just to survive does sound soulcrushing. How much do you earn every month and what do you pay in rent?

[–]bestsparkyalive3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

40 hours a week leaves you with tons of spare time. Try working 14 hour days regularly and then go back to 8s.

[–]Logical_Insurance3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

If you could train a 12 year old to do your job in a couple days, why should you expect to get paid a high wage?

(I don't know what you do, and it doesn't really matter.)

If you have to work 40 hours a week to feed yourself, you are doing a job that simply isn't that hard. It doesn't require that much intelligence, skill, or training.

Find something that does. Improve your skills. Do the work other people are too lazy to do. That's the only way to move yourself into a better career without just getting lucky or having family money.

[–]Dark_Archangelo3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Coming from someone who was in the military, 8 hours of work for 5 days to total 40 hours weekly is nothing. It’s only 1/3 of your 24 hour day. Now working 16 hours or more a day because reasons, like in the military, freaking suck. You just need to change your perspective and find other things to occupy your time while off work.

[–]WonderfulPipe3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

I think that feeling is because somehow we feel that work shouldn't exist or is not inherent of life. It is. Before our system we would have to kill our own food, survive, run, found water, etc...

We came to the point where you just need to do some kind of easy and fucking safe work and you can buy anything you need.

Life has never been easier.

[–]RedRiver04158 points9 points  (4 children) | Copy

Working 40 hours is nothing. I worked 70+ through my mid 20s in order to get a startup off the ground.

[–]Vouch33r3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy

How are you now? Did it pay off?

[–]RedRiver04155 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

I am 31. My business partner and I sold our startup when I was 29. The last 2 years I have been traveling and working as a consultant in the industry. I sometimes get paid as a consultant for the gentleman that bought our business.

[–]masterpiece0012 points13 points  (1 child) | Copy

He sold his soul and realized chasing money is a bullshit goal.

[–]Peruaan1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

He most likely did get paid though..

[–]ShoesDoctor2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Truth is. Find an occupation you love doing and showing up to work(at least at first) will be addicting. You'll be so ready to show-up, learn, and get paid that it won't seem like work. Easier said than done, trust me I know. It's an uphill mountain, but for me I just reached the summit at age 28. Now it's time to savor doing what I want to do. Also a steady gf helps. A little blue pill, but if you find a good one that looks out for your interests it will help you tremendously along the way.

[–]letmereadthatshit2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

8 hour a day is nothing. There's people working 10 hour or more a day on a job they hate just so they can have the cash flow to invest in building their own business to eventually have financial freedom. You gotta sacrifice. If you are in quarantine use it it build a new skill or try to start an online business.

[–]ReaperX4414 points15 points  (3 children) | Copy

Lol 40 hours a week? Come back and bitch when you're working 50 and still manage to go to the gym for 2 hours daily. Damn, kids really are too soft these days.

[–]Vouch33r0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

That's why comments like yours are welcome to show me some real world, thank you

[–]ReaperX448 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy

The concept is to work your ass off and staying on your purpose to attain financial stability as early as possible. The byproduct of this is being busy which develops being high value and in return helps you to have the ever illusive abundance mentality. Always be in the mindset where your purpose is your goal and women are only there to spice it up so you don't develop oneitis. coz once you actually achieve your purpose in life, everything will be easy and you'll have this sense of accomplishment and can say confidently, "yeah, I did that." In short, chase paper not whores.

[–]Greek-God-Brody4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

More like some real US world. A 9 to 5 leaves you with so little free time.

[–]amwfhunter1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Then you need to have a goal and purpose. Am I trapped in doing this just for survival and is there anything I can do to improve this?

These are questions you have to ask yourself and assess critically about your life. Where do I see myself in 5 years with this trajectory vs. Where do I want to be?

If they are far apart it is your responsibility to close the gap and devise a strategy to get there.

For starters, try budgeting if you arent already and set a financial goal.

[–]Sin-Silver1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I had the same dread as I was leaving high school. The solution is to find a line of work you enjoy and derive a sence of satisfaction and purpose.

You’ll still have work/life conflicts, but it’s better than hating every hour at your desk.

[–]_nein_danke1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I had some of the same issues but really what it comes down to is how you’re spending that 40 hours per week. For example, I worked normal boring ass stale office jobs or bar jobs working these hours and hated it, couldn’t wait to get home. Then I took a year out and did a research based masters (like a mini PhD) and would regularly stay doing research until 7/8pm in the evening and barely take a lunch break. I was interested, focused and my time felt like MY OWN instead of someone else’s. I also came to a realisation that unless you live in a sizeable city the job market is probably not going to have many interesting opportunities. I.E. if you live in England and want to work for a big magazine publication, you’d have to move to London or maybe Manchester.

Also, I’m currently setting up a blog and learning to code. Things that could potentially take me out of the 9-5 and work from home.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Life is about mindset. Opportunity is only seized when open to it

[–]pilot3331 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

try working 80. with 40 you have evenings and weekends off, which is nice

[–]throaway4000s0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Happy cake day!

[–]pilot3330 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

[–]Narcius1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Most works can be done in 3 hours but people take 8 hours to finish it. It's just called 40 hours. It's very less than that to be honest.

[–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

If you are barely pulling by each week, then you are living inefficiently.

It is possible, at any level of income, to retire early after only 10 years of working. It all comes down to your spending habits.

Check out Mr. Money Mustache.

[–]Vouch33r1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

It is possible, at any level of income, to retire early after only 10 years of working.

Fascinating idea, I will check him out immediately.

[–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Begin with his main intro blog post, "Getting Rich: from Zero to Hero in One Blog Post". It's accessible by clicking "Start Here" from his main page.

[–]rn78891 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I work two 13 hour shifts a week and make 54k a year as an RN.

[–]Vouch33r0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Are you working in the USA?

[–]rn78890 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yes

[–]Fat7ace1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

In addition to all of the great responses I will share what may seem like obvious yet seemingly difficult advice - learn to wake up earlier and stay healthy to maintain energy throughout the day. Sounds stupid but once you get used to working 40 hours per week, this will help you exceed that. Getting more done in the mornings before your workday starts, and sustaining energy afterwards.

[–]QueenSlapFight1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

If you're only applying 40 hours a week to survive + get ahead you're fucking lazy and don't deserve anything more than survival. There are 168 hours a week. Assume 8 hours a night for sleep (generous) and that leaves 112 hours. Assume 2 more hours a day for cooking, cleaning, and hygiene. That leaves 98 hours. Subtract 40 for work and you still have 58 hours. Assume you have to travel an hour every day for work, and you're at 53 hours.

There, you have more time a week available to get ahead, than you spend "surviving". If you wast 13 hours (almost 2 hours a day) on entertainment and "staying sane", you still have as much time to spend getting ahead as you spend "surviving".

TL;DR STFU and get to work

[–]rockyp321 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Tbh this shit is terrifying. I don’t even want to start the race because I’m afraid I’ll End up getting no where. And if that’s gonna happen might as well enjoy my own time

[–]BlamingBuddha1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

I've been thinking about this same thing lately man. Like what is life if you're just working the majority of your waking hours doing something that you thoroughly dont enjoy?

[–]wegsty7971 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

i cope with it by having the understanding that i dont need to do anything, but i have the opportunity. it's my choice if i want to go to work, no one forces me, if i feel like my job isn't worth it, i make changes.

[–]Cvevea32 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

If you're that upset about working 40 hours a week then you'll never do anything worth big money. Everybody who starts their own company works (or should be working) at least 60 hours a week. Hell, I work almost nonstop with my business, but the benefits outweigh the cons.

Benefits: Haven't lost my job because of corona (shocker, I'm the ceo), will get to retire by the ripe age of 25-28, will get to retire with more money by that time then most people see in their lives, make my own schedule (who cares if I wake up at 1pm as long as I get everything I need to done), I ooze confidence due to the fact I built everything from scratch

cons: no longer get to bitch about how hard 40 hours a week is

[–]throaway4000s4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Stop lying

[–]Fabulous-Craft1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

Life skills are like a muscle, you need to build them through hours of hard work.

You aren't losing 40 hours of your week, you are building your character.

[–]masterpiece0028 points29 points  (2 children) | Copy

Spoken like a true reprogrammed slave

[–]Dripshiro1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

On god. This comment section is pathetic

[–]masterpiece00-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

So is your spelling.

[–]throaway4000s1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

I had the same epiphany recently.

a) Do something you enjoy and you won't work another day in your life as corny as it sounds. b) No one owes you a living in this world so stop being entitled and earn it. c) If you didn't work 40 hours a week you would be super bored. d) In any given day there is 8 hours sleep, 8 hours working, so with 8 hours left where do you get off on saying there is no free time? Not to mention weekend and holidays

[–]Vouch33r1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

While what you say is true, there is 8 hours sleep, 8 hours working, probably 1-2 hours commute, 1-2 hours gym, 1-2 hours meal prepping. As you can see, the free time diminishes quite rapidly. What you are the most right about however is the fact that we should not be entitled, it's the hardest thing to get over.

[–]throaway4000s0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Well meal prepping should be done in bulk on Sunday. So that's still a good four hours free.

[–]fannyfire1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

It’s super easy. You just have to make sure you do one thing.

Don’t be a lazy faggot, faggot.

[–]MonkMode20190 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

What's your career path?

[–]kingofclubsmorde0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Time management

[–]youngblazejp0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Hey man im in the same boat. Im currently a junior in college and also thinking the same. I tell myself that i the 40 hour work week is only to survive on while i work on my side hustles that will one day earn me more more money so i wont have to work 40 hour work weeks anymore. The 9-5 is just to survive in the real world until we earn enough money to fund our dreams or side hustle and quit the 40 hour job. But honestly with this pandemic going on the world is definitely changing im just hoping they dont shut down schools and i cant even finish my degree

[–]PaddingtonBear8880 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Lmao I’m on 5/8’s right now. Feels like a vacation after a month of 7/12’s.

[–]z2a1-90 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Theres no way around it everyone has to in some shape or form, you are not special so toughen up buttercup and get to it.

[–]SIR_SKINNYPENIS690 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Looks like someone is new to full time work

Honestly you get used to it

[–]Kn1ght00 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah it fucking sucks. Makes me want to end myself

[–]Tambamwham0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I work 60 hour weeks

[–]OnceUponAMind0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I work 60 hours on average and still manage to hit the gym twice or trice a week, finish a book every month, and continuously learn new skills via tutorials and online courses. Nothing is more satisfying than going to bed exhausted knowing that you had a highly productive day

[–]jonnyjuk0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Find a job you enjoy doing and you’ll never work a day in your life again.

[–]nordicpolarbear0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Or the next best thing, find a job where you’re learning something. Once you learn it, move onto the next job that can teach you something. And on and on. After a while the money will definitely follow

[–]myfirsttimecoding0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Everyone commenting ‘try working x hours’ sound like little bitches trying to compare how bad they have it instead of answering OPs question.

OP. Either work 60 hour weeks (only paid for 40) for an employer or create something yourself.

[–]fenlx19060 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Get a sugar momma

[–]flatox0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

You aren't a prisoner. Working is a choice, there are alternatives.

[–]Sylvester_Sterone0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Find a career you enjoy. For me I supervise preschools and lead assessments while thinking any concerns to special education services.

[–]Houston2NYC0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

40 hours a week really isn’t that bad. Sorry to break it to you but you have a shitty work ethic.

[–]Yaking720 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Adds insult to Injury that those on unemployment are getting 2400 a month, for free... Those of us still working are going to appreciate it.

[–]nordicpolarbear0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Jokes on them I earn double that per month.

[–]Yaking720 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Let's say they normally got 450/ week from unemployment. That's a total to 1050 a week! All for doing nothing but getting fired or laid off. It is going to make a lot of people spoiled and entitled...

[–]DatRedSheep0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The key is to find something you love doing. I’d rather make $30,000 a year doing something I thoroughly enjoy doing than $100,000 a year doing something I don’t enjoy.

Find that something you love doing that can also be your source of income. And with the Internet, nearly anything is profitable.

You may have to do some less enjoyable work until you can fully transition to full time doing what you love. But with regards to that, try to find the most enjoyable unejoyable work possible until that transition happens. You don’t wanna be totally miserable on your journey because it could take time.

That’s where I am at the moment. Can’t wait to complete the transition.

[–]johnnywins11210 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It’s fine. In fact, I love it. As with many things, your mental frame is key. I work in a very challenging profession and apply a „military“ approach: I lead teams on difficult missions where we crack complex and sometimes really new problems. I inspire and mentor my juniors. I’m the quarterback for my bosses. For our business partners and customers, often I’m the only light, when otherwise there is only darkness.

I don’t actually know any better way to spend my life by now. I always work 60 hour weeks or more, often far more. In my mid 30s, I reliably make $300k in cash per year, with massive bonuses on top if we win.

Recognizing that you have to work most of your life (and you will even want to do something that is challenging if/when you become financially independent), you might just well go all-in on your job. I think you can have this mindset in any industry and with any background.

[–]bradotu0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Try to think of it like this, we have it easy. People worked 16 hours 6 days/week for thousands of years just to survive. And we don't have to do hard labor, we can do something we love.

Also 8 hours for 5 days a week leaves you 72 hours of freetime if you sleep 8 hours a night.

You have time you just need to find it.

You can also find jobs that aren't 5 days a week. For example I'm an EMT and work 3 12s for a week, then 4 a week, alternating. Half my days are days where I don't work.

[–]erottawa0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

8 hours a day to work, 8 hours a day to sleep. Still leaves you 8 hours per day to play and have fun. It's way better than it was in the past.

[–]TheStumblingWolf0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That's why there are such things as the FIRE movement.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I’m a young guy, 20 years old, and going to college for accounting. I was also depressed at the thought of being an office monkey. Then I realized that if I put in a couple years at a good accounting firm, I can eventually go out on my own and start my own business. It can be an accounting firm or another type of business, but at least it will be mine. That’s something not a lot of people can say.

I am also actively working on investing in real estate, that way I’ll have some financial freedom down the road. Once this corona shit ends I’m gonna look into acquiring a property. You need to acquire assets that have value today and will have value tomorrow. There is tremendous power in this. Most people have nothing to their name, and as a result, they become a slave to the system you are worried about.

Bottom line is this - it’s all about mindset. Life is always gonna involve work. The only way we can sustain a society is when everyone does their part. You need to change your mindset from the “9 to 5 grind” to “I’m gonna own the fucking place, and all these assholes are gonna work for me.”

Don’t just have a “job” or “career” - have a purpose.

[–]167167167abc0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Wait a second! You are swimming against the current. I get a feeling like that. Are you actually working a job you like?

Pussy is a biproduct. Do you agree? Yes.
Money is a biproduct. Do you know? No! Money is a biproduct of helping others.

[–]Dr_Van_Nosstrand0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

The issue here is that your entire viewpoint of this matter is being made from the wrong angle. You're not losing 5/7th of your week. Your using 5/7th of your week to have an opportunity to learn skills and improve yourself in various areas. Work only needs to be soul crushing when you let it be. When you treat work like a chore, that's what it will be. When it is viewed as an opportunity for you to better yourself, that's what it will be.

Right now you are your own worst enemy. Stop complaining and start figuring out how to better yourself.

[–]nordicpolarbear0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Exactly. If you’re in a job that is not teaching you something then change jobs or ask the boss for some different responsibilities you can learn from.

[–]Johnny_Monsanto0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

8 hours a day? Lmao thats fucking easy kid. I work 9-12 hours a day and sometimes I even have had to work 20 hours a day. Its fucking depressing yes and the worst part of all is that even tho I have a good job for the standards of my country I still make considerably less than American wages. The cost of living here is insanely high just as high as american cities like new york and we earn considerably less. Next time put things into perspective before bitching. I dream of a 40 hour week.

Oh and btw, we don't get payed for that overtime I just wrote about earlier.

[–]RoyBattyLives0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I made 27k after taxes last year.

Gym is cope and am passively suicidal lmao

[–]Siyuen_Tea-1 points0 points  (3 children) | Copy

I was working 60 doing blue collar.

A 9 to 5 is a dream come true. After 5 you can still hit the gym. The weekend is still yours, and even if you get fucked up on a weekday you should still be able to get 4-5 hours of sleep. Which is much better than none.

A 9-5 is no different than continuing school. Now don't get me wrong, having more free time is better but usually more time means less money.

What exactly are you trying to do that requires so much time?

[–]Vouch33r1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

What exactly are you trying to do that requires so much time?

Nothing in particular. Just the feeling of working for somebody else than myself feels like I'm exchanging my lifespan for some scraps under the table. Maybe it's a good idea to move on and abandon this thought and start working on myself. Anyway, I really appreciated your comment because I respect people working blue collar jobs to make money for their families. Hope you have some bearable job right now too.

[–]Siyuen_Tea1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You're always working for somebody. Just in some cases you get to choose your boss( the customer). If you have a shit boss you just need a new a job.

Right now, you're probably looking for something that matters and finding nothing does. You need to choose something and make it matter to yourself.

There was a book that gave me a good idea on how to do this. Write down 3 things you want to change or improve. Be specific , not something vague like " I want to be happy or I want to lose weight." It could be like I want to go skydiving or I want to lose X amount of pounds. Set a time frame for when that needs to be done and things you need to do today, 3 months and even a year from now to get that done. Then write down 3 positives of getting it done. And 3 negatives if you don't do it.

Its a lot of writing but it helped me get pussy when I wanted it and get through college when I needed that focus.

[–]Siyuen_Tea0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Best part about blue collar is you if your good at it, you can make 60k and if your smart, 100k. Even the biggest pieces of shit can find work in blue collar because no matter what there's always work. Your job can't be written out by a program ( give it another 20 years and maybe). And the holy grail of blue collar, you work for a school or something like it and you can get paid to basically chill out 4 out 5 days. Plus whatever benefits they might give ( college tuition, shit ton of vacation time). Couple that with having free time after work and you're living pretty stress free. You're biggest stress will be the same you're suffering now. Having no idea what to do with your time.

[–]dtyler86-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

How old are you? What’s your realistic lifestyle? I became a freelancer at 27. I earn close to $200k at 33. Most of that, at least $100k is from photography and video production. As a result, I travel a lot, ride my bike to the beach with my gf today, snuck in (quarantine), still earning $500-$800/day even during the pandemic. If you’re creative, learn a valuable skill online for free, you’re so much better off than thinking $60k/year is worth staying in the field you graduated college with a degree for.

[–]2319Skew-2 points-1 points  (1 child) | Copy

In nature you'd work 24 hours a day to survive with no breaks or sick days. Be thankful that you are able to "work" 8 hours and have the remaining 16 hours to do whatever you want including lowering those 8 hours by improving yourself.

[–]Vouch33r0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

In nature you'd work 24 hours a day to survive with no breaks or sick days.

Interesting. I've read that the primitive people in Africa are so "backwards" and can't even compare to Europeans (and by extension - Americans) because all they have to do is... nothing. They have bananas literally falling into their laps. Maybe swarm off a tiger or two from time to time.

Don't get me wrong, I am thankful even for that 8 hour work which I cry about, I am thankful for the fact that it is not hypercapitalist XVIII century England. Still, there is something that doesn't let me be fully comfortable in the current situation.



You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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