So you've probably already seen the article which doesn't quite convey what the red pill is, or give it much of a fair shot. I'm actually surprised, he managed to keep a more level head than I was expecting, but I'm sad he didn't really present the points I gave him.. if anybody can explain the purpose of this sub I think I know what I'm talking about..
Anyway, thought I'd post up my interview, since very little got quoted, and some of it out of context.
- I realize there's a lot to unpack here, but what are the ideas behind Red Pill?
Most of the ideas revolve around the idea that men and women are fundamentally different, due to evolution. Both men and women have different strengths and weaknesses. Men evolved traits that complimented women’s traits, and vice-versa. For instance, women have a 9-month gestation period, and can give birth. Men certainly don’t have that ability, but they have a complimentary ability. They developed larger muscles and can take care of and protect women during their gestation period. We can observe that today- men statistically have better upper body strength than women. We extrapolate on these types of known facts and theorize that they are just a few of many differences – both physically, but also instinctually and preferentially.
We call our group “The Red Pill” in reference to the Matrix movie. Cheesy for sure, but it’s an apt analogy. We see that most cultures today have deemed it politically incorrect to recognize or even discuss gender differences, with no regard for whether or not such differences actually exist. Our focus is accepting these differences, despite being told they’re politically incorrect.
A lot of people view this as sexism, in a malevolent way, and I think it’s important to point out that in fact we hold the principle of equal opportunity in high regard; it’s the desire for equal outcome that we disagree with- something that we strongly feel feminism pushes for.
- I hate phrasing the question this way, but it's the way a layperson would ask it: Do Red Pillers hate women?
Delving into red pill ideas is sometimes a very shocking experience for some, especially for those who were raised to believe the politically correct ideals reflected nature. The road to our forum is paved with bad experiences, men who have never been loved, have loved and lost, men who have tried and failed, or men who succeeded and were taken advantage of.
So when they realize their failures were within their control to avoid, it can induce a bit of anger. They are angry, they’re upset that they feel lied to, that our society repeats lies and half-truths about the nature of attraction- and even about the nature of themselves! It’s a jarring experience.
I think that a lot of the men have a misplaced anger towards women. I wouldn’t say it’s hatred- no, they’re interested in red pill theory because they want to learn how to be better with women. But there is a temporary anger. We have examples posted every day of women acting contrary to what we’re told women would do… because in our culture, women are mostly regarded as the good sex, the one that does no harm. Our subreddit pulls back the curtain and says, “hey look, these women are human just like everybody else. It’s time to put away your idealistic views and embrace reality.”
A lot of onlookers think that means we hate women, or that we’re all very angry. I think it misses the point. We’ve provided one of the very few spaces where men can feel comfortable communicating openly with other men. The fact that we demonstrate women acting in these ways might look like we’re blaming women. It’s a subtle nuance that is missed by most onlookers- we’re not blaming them. We’re trying to understand them. Why they might act the way they do.
One of the major reasons we’ve grown so quickly was the moderation decisions we’ve made not to censor anger and bitterness. Instead, we understand it to be a natural part of the healing process. It would seem to me that society deeming these perfectly natural emotions as wrong is a big portion of why these men are seeking out a space like The Red Pill in the first place.
We take that anger and bitterness, and we try to use it to be constructive. Eventually the anger passes, and all that’s left is the future and the question: What are you going to do with this information?
Most guys take their new understanding of relationships and women, and apply it. They go to the gym, work out, get fit, and learn how to communicate with women in ways that produce successful relationships.
The understanding that we have is that a majority of relationship failures can be prevented by improving ourselves. That certainly doesn’t sound like we hate women. Most people are too blinded by the course language and hyperbole that is inherent in male communication to see past it- these guys just want to find belonging and love, like anybody else.
- Do Red Pillers have a word or name that refers to the collective group? What about a term for Red Pill ideas/platform?
The Red Pill is a collection of ideas and theories encompassed by what we refer to as the “manosphere” which is a collection of blogs that focus on masculinity and personal philosophy for men.
We typically just call ourselves red pillers, though there are a lot of sub-groups in the manosphere. Men going their own way (MGTOW), puerarchs, married red-pill men, MRAs… to name a few. The major differences between the groups aren’t really ideological, but instead philosophical looking at their answers to the question: “what should I do with the knowledge I have?”
Some men use this information to make better relationships with women. Some men decide to avoid women altogether.
- Does this ever go offline? Do people write Congress to urge for changing laws identified as emasculating? Meetups in the meatspace? Other stuff?
Currently, there isn’t much offline group activity outside of the men’s rights movement (which the red pill overlaps with in some places).
One major issue is that feminists tend to try to censor those they disagree with. One of the best tools we have with our community is anonymity. We’ve seen what happens when a feminist starts getting upset and making waves. People lose jobs, people lose families, people get death threats from white knights.. Adria Richards comes to mind.
Individually, however, we take this information into the world every day, and apply it in our lives.
We’re definitely a little different from the men’s rights movement, in the sense that we don’t seek to “fix” society or our government. In fact, a lot of us feel that things are beyond fixing. Sure it’d be nice if reproductive rights were equal between women and men, but nobody’s holding their breath about it.
A majority of our goals are personal and interpersonal improvement. Not really something to write your congressperson for.
- In general, is there a "type" of person that ends up subscribing to Red Pill ideas?
I think anybody and everybody could apply red pill ideas in their lives and improve dramatically in their jobs, relationships, and families. Some people grew up already understanding these basic ideas. Some people have hit rock bottom and come to them with an open mind. When everything you try doesn’t work, you start looking for less conventional options.
A common theme among new-comer posts reflects that the ideas seem to “click,” and there’s always a little embarrassment that they didn’t come to these ideas sooner.
Some people think the ideas are so obvious that we must be social outcasts for not having understood these ideas sooner. I guess different upbringing makes a big difference.
- Care to share a personal story (non-identifying is obviously okay) that affirms Red Pill ideas?
It’s hard to demonstrate precisely the changes I’ve made in my life and how profound of an effect they’ve had in a short story- but I can give you a glimpse:
Some of the basic skills I’ve learned include learning to be confident and learning how to pass what we refer to as fitness tests (shit tests). It feels a little unusual at first, doing and saying things that you’ve learned your whole life are wrong, but I manned-up and tried it anyway..
Sure enough I found myself being far more successful in relationships. Meeting women was easier. Women liked me more. And the best part was that I didn’t feel like navigating a relationship was like flying blind- I was confident in what I was doing, and it kept attraction alive in places where I’d otherwise kill it.
We get stories every day from husbands rekindling their marriages, guys being more successful meeting women, guys having more luck at work, and most importantly: guys feeling better about themselves. It’s absolutely amazing to watch some of these guys grow from being depressed and feeling helpless to becoming strong and confident. It’s a very rewarding experience, from my perspective.
- How did TRP start? Offshoot of men's rights movement? Something else?
The red pill started when another fellow founded it- he has since left. He and I were in communication when he started it, his intention was to give men a place to discuss life as men openly. He was an avid men's rights supporter, and a regular contributor to the pickup forums. But the problem was that these places were starting to fold to appease the feminist narrative- they wanted to change their language to make it more palatable to feminist sensibilities, which took a toll on the very communication that was supposed to be taking place. They were afraid to appear as though they "hated" women, even though they didn't.
This is a common problem that we've identified, when feminism invades a space, they control it by controlling the language. Nobody wants to be politically incorrect, lest they suffer the scorn of the feminist movement.
- What's the difference (if any) between TRP and men's rights?
The men's rights movement identifies and recognizes legal injustices. The Red Pill recognizes inter-personal differences. There is some overlap. I think that the changes the men's rights movement suggests could help all men, and it's an important movement. But it still doesn't really address the personal problems that we see today: divorces and relationship failures... these aren't necessarily legal issues, but they are real.
- Fair to call The Misandry Bubble something of a TRP Declaration of Independence or manifesto?
The misandry bubble is a unique look at our culture, in economic terms. It was written long before the red pill forum was constructed, but has always been seen as a rather apt analysis of the problems we face today. For a lot of men, they're issues that we're told don't exist- so we almost feel crazy when we read it and it makes sense.
The red pill group is very loosely tied together, with a focus on reality and truth. So in that, I wouldn't say we have a manifesto, but if we did, that would be it.
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