'Slag culture' has destroyed dating

CastAway_77 · 2017-09-11T13:31:57+00:00

Go somewhere else, meet someone different. Not all men are as you depicted.

I am not sure where/how you normally look for a partner, but I was once told to imagine the "perfect other half", and guess what they are doing with their (spare) time - and go there, too.

In other (symbolical) words, you'll find a farmer on the fields, and a bookworm in the library

You are into traditional, conservative men? Try a church meeting, a lecture about gender roles, a classical concert, or... Well, you might have much better ideas.

nonamanuensis · 2017-09-12T03:53:09+00:00

I think of marriage like a business partnership - I got married to create and maintain a family and have a partner to achieve our visions of that life. There are a lot of bonuses and love is part of this arrangement but it's not the focus. The energy of love certainly helps keep everything running well. :)

"Dating" is holding job interviews for someone who wants to create that kind of company/family. I have this position of "husband" open for someone who wants to create more people, take care of them, teach them, and continue to live our values of xyz as we live life and enjoy each others' company. I have X list of qualities to offer and I'm looking for the equivalent in a husband (and I made that list to keep my expectations in mind before I fell for someone emotionally).

Once I looked at it like that it was much easier to separate out and not take personally the rejections of many men who viewed dating as fun or more light-hearted without a care to values or long term end goals. And there were a lot of passes. There are not a lot of people who systematically date to plan their life but they are out there and wondering where their counterparts are spending time. :)

We met through online dating - I disagree with the advice to just let things happen. Online dating, because of profiles and a large network, seemed much more efficient to me than just continuing to meet random people in life. I also go to practice "job interviews". This was 10 years ago so I don't know if it's changed but I knew if someone like me was using it, my equal was possibly using it.

Neither my husband nor I are religious otherwise I would have focused on religious communities. But we both knew we wanted a family and we wanted the right person who was serious about that.

And before I dated I knew I wanted to get a prenup. My husband jokes that he almost proposed the night I told him I wanted a prenup while we were dating. I don't want a man's money or his family's money for me but I did want our kids to be the beneficiaries and I did want to have very thorough discussions about money expectations before creating a business. My husband and I still joke on our anniversary that we are renewing our contract for the marriage.

platewrecked · 2017-09-11T13:52:30+00:00

Travel to old Europe. Spend some time in Poland, Hungary, or Slovenia. Head over to Ukraine even. England is dead. Western Europe is on a final suicidal bender. American culture is no better in many respects though the level of sport drinking and whorishness of the modern English woman is unprecedented.

You'd be pleasantly surprised at the differences in old Europe. Good luck OP.

BTW, if you keep finding yourself in these same positions with these same kinds of men, you're simply doing the same thing expecting a different result.

cerahhh · 2017-09-11T13:36:03+00:00

My question would have to be: how are you meeting these men? Where and how you are meeting them makes a big difference in what caliber of men you're coming across.

Drakkenrush · 2017-09-11T16:24:24+00:00

Would it be so bad to tell them the truth and say that you were in an abusive relationship and needed to take a break from relationships for an extended period as a means of self-therapy to get over the abuse? Being honest in a potential relationship from the beginning is important, and lieing about your past on the first date could come back to haunt you later on. They might wonder why you weren't honest in the first place. Would you prefer to attract men who would understand your reasoning behind staying single, or cast your net wider and pull in men who you won't know whether or not they'd understand because you weren't completely honest on the first date? I think you have an opportunity to filter out a lot of men who would be a waste of time by trying to find the ones who respect you for being honest with them. Any man who is off put or skeptical about the facts of your previous relationship probably isn't worth your time. Same deal with the sleeping together on the first date thing. Do you want the man who understands your feelings on that or the one who only wants to satisfy his needs? Put up a strong filter and you'll save yourself a lot of trouble in the long run.

loneliness-inc · 2017-09-11T14:41:44+00:00

Wow. That's a very long rant.

If we're gonna discuss what destroyed dating, we ought to define what dating is.

Go back 100+ years and dating was courtship. It was about looking into a person, speaking to their friends and family and spending time with them getting to know each other. It was a research project into the family and friends and then into the person themselves. It's purpose was one thing - to determine whether this person is a suitable marriage partner.

Speaking of marriage - marriage itself has changed drastically over the past 100 years. Gender roles used to be solid and defined. Men were responsible for x and women were responsible for y. The onus was on whoever wanted something different to negotiate that.

Men used to rule the home. They had the final say on everything. However, this also means that women were the ones who were protected and cared for. The man worked hard to earn money so the wife and children can eat. In this sense, men had overt power but women had covert power. Thus, women had the ultimate power because everything was being done for them by their men.

In such a society, there was a balance between the sexes. Each had their role, their perks and their responsibility. A balanced world can last a long time. Indeed, this system has been going on for thousands of years.

Feminism stripped men of entitlement to their perks while fiercely protecting the perks of women. It stripped women of their responsibility while fiercely insisting that men keep their responsibilities. Today, a man is still expected to be the primary breadwinner while also doing dishes and diapers, not expecting sex, getting berated and nagged to death and when it all goes to hell, he is more likely to lose his children and have to pay alimony and child support.

Additionally, sex used to be sacred and only allowed within marriage. Sure, prostitution always existed, but it was not accepted culturally. Today, sex outside marriage is accepted culturally.

So when you add all of this together, why would a sane man ever get married or date? Why pay for the cow when you can get the milk for free? Why would any man want to court a woman when he can just have casual sex?

The only answer I can think of is if you're religious and live in a community that still upholds the institution of marriage and shames slutty behavior. Otherwise, sure, dating is dead and for good reason.

[deleted] · 2017-09-11T23:26:15+00:00

Oh sweetie you're right and they're all wrong. It's sad that our dating culture has devolved into animalistic behavior rather than forming a deep connection with another human being.

You're meeting the wrong men, or perhaps you are meeting men at the wrong stages of their lives.

Men usually categorize women into two categories: wife/gf material and shag material. Not all men are at the stage in their lives where they are looking for a wife/gf but almost any man will go for a quick NSA shag, because fuck it they're investing nothing and it feels good.

Maybe try to meet someone through family? Close friends? I wouldn't do Tinder or anything like that for something serious. And when goodbye comes give a kiss on the cheek and a sincere hug if you like the guy and tell them you like them but want to take things slow.

Be honest. Trust your heart. If the man you're seeing is on the same page as you it will work. If not, it won't. No harm, no foul.

HB3234 · 2017-09-12T20:15:23+00:00

Have you heard the phrase "play stupid games, win stupid prizes"? When you meet your men while out drinking and clubbing, even of you're doing it in moderation, you're playing a hookup game.... no surprise that your prize is a man who, then, wants to hookup.

You could say anything on Earth and they would try to reposition it as "so you're looking for something more casual?" This is because they want casual, but they want to make it sound like YOU suggested it. I don't actually think rephrasing your hiatus from dating will change this because it is part of their sexual strategy. You could say you've been enjoying single life and they'll say you want somethong casual to keep it going; say you got out of an LTR and they'll phrase it like you want casual as a changeof pace; say you were in nun mode and they'll suggest casual is a good way to ease back in. See where I am going?

Slag culture doesn't exist everywhere. It has hubs: bars, clubs, shows of certain genres or bands, festivals, etc. Make sure you are meeting men outside of those hotbeds and you'll be fine. Don't waste your time meeting the same men on the same spaces but trying different sexual strategies. It's a stupid game and the only prizes to be had are stupid ones. You deserve better.

MarquisDePaid · 2017-09-11T20:54:19+00:00

Its very unfortunate but right now in the west (germany and england especially) european social norms with dating are absolutely destroyed. Its absolutely horrible to hear about and difficult to deal with but thats the reality rn.

Honestly one of the few cases where I can think of finding attractive men who dont treat women like trash is if you join either a church community (more difficult as churches are undermined) or a conservative nationalist organization.

Natrix03 · 2017-09-12T02:04:29+00:00

I definitely think it's fine to say you came out of a bad or damaging relationship ( you can say abusive or shitty, whatever works for you) and as a result you kept to yourself trying to sort your self out. I think it sends guys a better idea that you haven't been riding the CC vs just telling them how long you've been single. Because most guys will imagine that as you 'finding yourself' and 'not commiting' aka riding the cock carosol as you said, which considering the culture is not a leap.

I think it's fine to be upfront and concise. Tell the guys that you really aren't interested in something short term and that they have plenty of of other options if they want an easy girl, but that won't be you.

Also whatever method you are using to find guys for dates might not be the best so explore different options to meet a man that will be worthwhile.

mrpthrowa · 2017-09-11T13:50:52+00:00

Honestly I think the whole "dating" thing, as in the dating market in and of itself as a target, is to be avoided.

The best relationships I had grew organically, through friends, sports, social circles, etc...

Sure, I sometimes went to these events with the implicit purpose of finding a mate, but that was all implied and never out in the open.

I think dating for the sake of dating, with dating apps and websites and all that jazz is just too artificial. The vast majority of people "on the dating market" have already been on so many dates they just go through the motions and it kinda feels pushed and drone like, and it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy, oh yeah "here is another date, they haven't totally amazed me". Yes, it can produce ONSes and all that.

The whole dating scene puts too much pressure on the spot and takes away from the thrill and natural feeling of just finding someone and it clicking without explicitly looking for it.

The "surrendered single" has this right in that what you should do is concentrate on yourself, up your SMV and RMV, mingle in social circles and something will develop. It won't take long, have some patience.

spcarlin · 2017-09-14T10:16:06+00:00

Some of those men go off in a huff because they're annoyed at themselves. They thought they knew what was going on like: "this date went really well so I guess its time to get sexy" and when you rebut them they think "I wasn't expecting this reaction, how did I get this so wrong?" or "what the hell she was totally leading me on! screw this i'm out" and bail.

Maybe qualify men a bit more before actually meeting for a date? - if most men you date have the expectation of sex on a good first date then you have to set a new expectation. So tell them via text/phone/PM etc when setting up a date. Say something along the lines of "Hey, I think going out together sounds really fun, but I think I should tell you I've only just come out of a long term relationship so I don't want to rush into anything, is that cool?". If the guy is just looking for an easy lay he'll back out - good because thats not what you're looking for and now you've saved yourself some time.

I know this could dramatically decrease the number of dates you go on, and some guys might have red flags like "oh, she's still pining over an x, I don't want to deal with that" but what you're doing now isn't working for you, so maybe swing tactics a 180 degrees could help?

jrdn-mnly · 2017-09-16T02:20:34+00:00

Make first dates simple. Really simple. Coffee or one drink, two at most. No full meals no activities longer than 90 minutes.

On the one hand, I don't think you can realistically filter people before meeting them in person. On the other, the longer and more costly the date, the harder it is to sync your expectations with his.

If a guy suggests dinner and a museum, say, "that sounds great but unfortunately, I don't have that much time. Could we grab a drink at <venue> from <60-90 minute window>?"

60-90 minutes will give you a great feel for the person without any one feeling that they over invested time or money. Take care of your own transportation on the first date.

Though I wouldn't recommend it, you can always find a way to make a first date longer, but it is very uncomfortable to cut it short if you both start with a 2-4+ hour expectation.

This won't make men better, but it will give you a more manageable framework in which to evaluate them and take care of yourself.

If it goes well, be warm and enthusiastic about the possibility of seeing each other again. Otherwise, it's easy to be cordial and say good night.

Some folks may disagree, but if you don't think it's a good match, I recommend being particularly willing to split the cost.

[deleted] · 2017-09-12T00:14:52+00:00

Someone on this subreddit once gave an advice saying: Always do (a term that means dates where you and the other party bring some family along), never do regular dates.

As much as i recall the original adviser explained that someone who is serious won't mind such an arrangement, also you get to know who they really are since they won't be able to put on any masks in front of family. I'll add that this would prevent any of the improper behavior you mentioned in the post.

Title	'Slag culture' has destroyed dating
Author	cerahhh
Upvotes	53
Comments	48
Date	September 11, 2017 1:12 PM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWomen
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/6zfax2/slag_culture_has_destroyed_dating/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/slag-culture-has-destroyed-dating.73405 https://theredarchive.com/post/73405