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Cohabitation with other men prior to marriage is predictive of dramatically higher divorce risk

TriggurWarning
August 4, 2022
15 upvotes
/r/AllPillDebate
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Title Cohabitation with other men prior to marriage is predictive of dramatically higher divorce risk
Author TriggurWarning
Upvotes 15
Comments 57
Date August 4, 2022 7:36 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit /r/AllPillDebate
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/AllPillDebate/cohabitation-with-other-men-prior-to-marriage-is.1139710
https://theredarchive.com/post/1139710
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/AllPillDebate/comments/wga4lf/cohabitation_with_other_men_prior_to_marriage_is/
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Comments

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 8 points9 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

Mods in /r/purplepilldebate wouldn't allow me to post this image. Enjoy.

[–]Glad-Discount-4761 5 points6 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Mods in /r/purplepilldebate wouldn't allow me to post this image

Lol.I bet it is Mrs.Degree who is disallowing

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Correct, and I bitched her out for it in the mod chat. Made no difference of course, but it felt good calling her corrupt in front of the other mods.

[–]Glad-Discount-4761 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

it felt good calling her corrupt in front of the other mods.

Wait,mod chat? How do you get into mod chat in reddit,like you chat with all mods together?

By the way,in my case.Whenever ppd sub post question for women flair.I always replied since I joined it.

But in one case,there was another post with question for women flair,I replied and then got message automod please.I asked why .She replied woman are supposed to answer it and I am woman.I found it weird as I replied to similar earlier post before but didn't got same message.

I guess she didn't like what I replied in post

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I mean I sent a message to the mods complaining about her, and we went back and forth for a while, with a couple other mods chiming in when they felt like it. She's an intellectual coward and it's real transparent.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

That chick has some serious issues.

[–]Glad-Discount-4761 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah,I wonder how the hell she became moderator of that sub

[–]Antisocial_NihilistRedPill 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

That's why this sub was made, fam. Facts and research should not be censored just because they're controversial and don't fit into a narrative.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

I like these studies.

Though I wish they would do a factor analysis.

The subject age is very broad, 15-44.

We can imagine that women who cohabited first with husband or none at all are probably women that choose to get married at younger age. Then that would beg the question, if it was a choice to get married at a young age, what other co-factors would be associated with that demographic? Perhaps they are more religious and conservative.

Maybe women who cohabited more are also women who tend to be older. Maybe older women that choose to get married later did so because they pursued their careers first. Maybe women who pursue their careers first tend to follow a more liberal/atheist ideology. Maybe women who are, lets say feminist, tend to not respect the institute of marriage. Maybe because they have a career, they tend to be more likely to accept divorce as a solution for a failed marriage. Maybe women who marry older have less kids and are less obligated to stay in that marriage. We can go on and on about what it means to be older before the 1st marriage, I think you get the point.

Correlation doesn't mean causation. Maybe the rate of divorce/break up has more to do with other co-factors. My bet would be it has more to do with the women's ideology. And the act of cohabitation is only a symptom of that ideology.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 4 points5 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

My hypothesis is that a large part of this phenomena is explained by having a reference point to constantly compare you to that they've intimately experienced in the past. And in some aspects, you'll never match X, Y, or Z, associated with her previous cohabitation experience, even though you may be clearly the superior option due to A, B, and C. This inadequacy is tolerated for a while, but not forever, and eventually manifests in escalating divorce risk. It's not necessarily an alpha widow situation (though it certainly can be), but something similar yet far more complex in nature.

In the case of marriage, I believe ignorance is truly bliss for many. You don't know what you're missing if you don't know it exists. This sort of knowledge can only be acquired by living with a man for a while, dating isn't really the same thing at all. And that knowledge is inherently corrupting of the institution of marriage as something meant to last a lifetime. Our ancestors knew this, and therefore created taboos associated with premarital sex to ameliorate this problem.

I agree one must be careful with correlations like this, but my gut is telling me there is profound wisdom to be mined from this correlation.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

I agree with the idea overall.

It's the same idea with the pair bonding studies. They compliment each other. I also think we can accept it as face value, because actions are derived from ideology. Someone who tends to sleep around is probably into the whole sexual liberation movement, which has a whole host of other ideologies that are tied to it (like mention before, the lack of respect for the institute of marriage).

I'm pretty sure if they ever come out with a study of political alliance vs divorce rates, we would see very similar results.

There was a study that showed college educated women have a higher divorce rate (90%) than non-college educated women (60%).

To top it off, since we're discussing this, we can assume women who are more into the left political sphere, choose(or settle for) beta males as partners.

The main reason I brought up age as a probable co-factor, is because the idea of co-habiting with different people is probably a lengthy process. I doubt people are jumping week to week in different houses. They probably spend on average 1-2 year. So if you have several co-habiting partners, we can assume you're probably several years older than someone who had only 1 or none. Age comes with various life choices so for me, it's not a surprise that such a pattern emerged.

[–]Siukslinis_acc 2 points3 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

There was a study that showed college educated women have a higher divorce rate (90%) than non-college educated women (60%).

College educated people generally have bigger earnings, thus it can influence the financial dependence to the spouse. Thus a college educated person is less dependent on the spose for financial stuff and thus can afford to divorce and be single.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

This is true.

There's also the idea of women holding their husband in contempt when they start to out earn them financially.

There's also the idea of college educated people looking down on non-college educated people as a status symbol. I think the current women:male ratio in college is 3:2.

When women use wealth and status as markers to find a quality mate, but find that they are the ones out earning men, women start to have a dreaded feeling of settling for a man who is beneath her.

You can imagine the sort of relationship this will produce. Its no wonder women initiate 80% of divorce.

[–]Siukslinis_acc 0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

When women use wealth and status as markers to find a quality mate, but find that they are the ones out earning men, women start to have a dreaded feeling of settling for a man who is beneath her.

There is also the notion that the man must be a breadwinner and earn more that is still pervalent in our society, so men tend to be shamed by it for earning less than the woman and it gives tention in the relationship.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

Indeed.

I would say that notion of the male breadwinner stems from biological rather than any social or economical necessity.

It's wired into females to seek providers as they are burden with the responsibility of child rearing.

That's another reason why our society(west) is falling apart. We've introduce ideologies that are counter intuitive to the biological nature of man and women.

[–]Siukslinis_acc 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

I would say that notion of the male breadwinner stems from biological rather than any social or economical necessity.

As I remember, in hunter/gatherer societies, the women provided 70% of the food.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Not 70% of the protein though, which is arguably the most essential nutrient for human life and brain development.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

That's true, but it doesn't discount the obvious reason why.

It's about the women when she's pregnant/child rearing.

If your biological system was to evolve, it would evolve in accordance to what state of being is more important to the survival of the species. A women is most vulnerable when she's is in that mother/child diad, it's more important that a women has an innate desire for a breadwinner than to become the breadwinner.

You can imagine, the women who don't have the proclivity to seek a breadwinner, did not reproduce as successfully as those that did.

[–]MasonSub4BlackPill 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

It's already hard getting woman to look at me! Now I have to filter out for cohabitation too!?

ovER!

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Welcome to the blackpill. It arguably requires too much effort and ignorance of the risks associated with cohabitation to blindly walk into the fire. Even if you got a woman to look at you, is it really worth all the trouble? For an increasing number of men, the answer is clearly, no (even if they're not invisible to women).

[–]WOPR-19831 points [recovered] (24 children) | Copy Link

You mean just like second marriages are more likely to end in divorce?

Once people have ANY cohabitation arrangement with the opposite sex they are far less likely to tolerate any situation they find any less than blissful.

Not to say that people should stay in bad relationships...

Just that "previously cohabited" is not much different than "previously married".

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 4 points5 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

The divorce studies do reflect the increased risk of second divorces, so yes, because cohabitation is so closely related to marriage to begin with. The issue is women are initiating roughly 70% of these disengagements with the opposite sex. They are the chaotic and volatile function in the equation. They are the one that's difficult to keep happy in the long run, whereas men are generally easier to please. So for any man who is risk adverse when it comes to these issues, this data is extremely relevant and valuable.

[–]WOPR-19831 points [recovered] (7 children) | Copy Link

They are the one that's difficult to keep happy in the long run, whereas men are generally easier to please.

The most vain pursuit a man can even embark on is keeping a woman happy.

They're never fucking happy.

I say leave them alone, to their continual misery and ongoing shenanigans and drama.

Life is better without one.

Source: Single since my divorce 10 years ago.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

That is certainly a viewpoint worth considering for some. But sometimes people have a need to learn the hard way. People are social animals by nature, which means we are drawn like a moth to a flame to dangerous and volatile situations like relationships.

[–]WOPR-19831 points [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link

I find relationships to be black holes, sucking in infinite time money and energy all for mediocre returns at best. And I've never encountered a vagina that's as right as my right hand... and my hand never gets a headache or asks how many beer I've had.

I love my hand. (kisses hand)

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

That's great brother, but what about all the other people who live their entire lives in blissful happiness in marriage? Studies indicate men die quicker outside of marriage. And divorced men are more likely to seek remarriage after divorce. Perhaps some men need women more than others do for a variety of reasons. You may fall on the far end of the distribution, whereas others would not be content in a mgtow situation, which would be harmful to their health.

[–]WOPR-19831 points [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

50% of marriages end in divorce.

How many marriages of the remaining 50% are actually happy?

Many men WANT to leave that nagging witch and dead bedroom but it's cheaper to keep her so they just cheat and hope they don't get caught.

MGTOW isn't harmful once a man is over his sex addiction.

To me, orgasm is no different then urination. It's a pesky sensation that is easily mitigated, with no cost to me whatsoever.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I think many men, especially younger ones, have an emotional need to feel desired by a woman, and that's partially about sex, but not all of it. For some men, scratching that itch is all that is required, and in your case, you seem fully compatible with a mgtow lifestyle, however I am concerned this isn't the best fit for everyone's needs. I would go so far to say men are the true romantics in relationships.

[–]IrrungenWirrungen 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

🤴🏼

[–]mcove97NeutralPill 1 point2 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

Once people have ANY cohabitation arrangement with the opposite sex they are far less likely to tolerate any situation they find any less than blissful.

What I don't understand is why people try to paint this as a bad thing. Divorce and breakups are good when staying with your partner will decrease your quality of life, life satisfaction and happiness.

[–]WOPR-19831 points [recovered] (11 children) | Copy Link

They're bad when you, as a man, have to keep paying for someone no longer in your life.

[–]mcove97NeutralPill 0 points1 point  (10 children) | Copy Link

I completely agree, which is part of why I'm strongly against marriage, at least the modern form we have. I'm fully for spreading public awareness. At the same time I also think the onus is on the individual people who want to marry to research what marriage actually entails and means. It absolutely baffles me when people get married on a whim without familiarizing themselves with the laws surrounding marriage and divorce. Doing research is absolutely essential when entering a new contract. I understand that people are ignorant but goddamn, we are talking about marriage. It's not the same thing as signing a contract for rent or signing a contract for work. You just don't sign a marriage contract without reading the fine print and knowing what you're getting yourself into unless you're incredibly ignorant. I understand that if you got married before the internet, research was a bit harder to do, but we live in 2022. Being ignorant is no longer an excuse to not know what marriage means where you marry.

An educated and smart man will not be so foolish as to marry someone when they can end up having to pay for a divorced spouse. A smart man also do not accept that their spouse is a financially dependent SAHM because they know this can backfire on them in the future. Any intellectual man or man with a brain should know that if they divorce their spouse in the future and the wife was a SAHM their entire life or for many years that she would be left on bare feet if they divorced if not for his support. I'm just a 25 year old woman and I know this. I've known this for years. Granted I'm a curious and intellectual person who actually asks questions and don't just take "marriage lasts forever" bullshit for granted. I'm probably more "red pilled" or realistic pilled than most women.

Anyway, I suppose I'm taking a dig at those who were dumb enough to fall into the marriage trap. It really just bugs me that people can be so stupid but at the same time I do sympathize (I've done some dumb shit in my life though I'll never make marriage level dumb mistakes) and want to spread awareness. There's other alternatives to marriage such as co habitation or roommate situation (of course familiarize yourself with these laws as well!). There's also practical advice such as not entering a relationship with someone who is poor or who would financially benefit from leaving you, or dating women who have the same socioeconomical background such as yourself and who has her own job. There's also the matter of considering how you would deal with a divorce before marrying. Yes I know it's not exactly what someone who wants to marry someone wants to think about, but not thinking about it is how people get in divorce pickles.. straight facts. It's better to prevent a divorce pickle then it is to deal with the messy aftermath of a divorce.

Anyway, rant aside, do your own research. Use your brain before you use your heart when it comes to matters of love or in the future get annoyed being told I told you so because you wanted to live in blissful ignorance.

[–]WOPR-19831 points [recovered] (9 children) | Copy Link

​

Anyway, I suppose I'm taking a dig at those who were dumb enough to fall into the marriage trap.

That's okay. We deserve it.

It really just bugs me that people can be so stupid but at the same time I do sympathize (I've done some dumb shit in my life though I'll never make marriage level dumb mistakes) and want to spread awareness.

True but the information was always out there. Certain drugs are deadly. Unprotected sex causes babies, or AIDS, or other STDs. People gonna people.

There's other alternatives to marriage such as co habitation or roommate situation (of course familiarize yourself with these laws as well!). There's also practical advice such as not entering a relationship with someone who is poor or who would financially benefit from leaving you, or dating women who have the same socioeconomical background such as yourself and who has her own job.

This is all Red Pill does when it comes to marrige. Outline the risks.

There's also the matter of considering how you would deal with a divorce before marrying. Yes I know it's not exactly what someone who wants to marry someone wants to think about, but not thinking about it is how people get in divorce pickles.. straight facts. It's better to prevent a divorce pickle then it is to deal with the messy aftermath of a divorce.

My divorce was mostly amicable, with reasonable coparenting. And it still almost killed me. The break-up of my family left me sobbing and throwing up for three consecutive days. Never know more pain before, never known more pain since.

Anyway, rant aside, do your own research. Use your brain before you use your heart when it comes to matters of love or in the future get annoyed being told I told you so because you wanted to live in blissful ignorance.

Marriage is a contract where one party does not need to keep their end of the deal yet walks away with all kinds of benefits and privileges. That's not a contract. That's fucking bullshit.

Anyways, for a 25 y.o. female indeed you are a critical thinker and intellectual.

I enjoyed reading your post and was surprised that you were a young lady.

Maybe with your mentality you CAN find someone and be happy.

[–]mcove97NeutralPill 0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy Link

Sorry for what happened to your family. You're right marriage is a BS contract. Personally I have no interest in marriage as I want to be able to leave partners if they don't make me happy anymore. I do not want to be stuck in a situation that's hard to leave. This is also part of why I don't want kids. I know relationships and marriages don't always work out unfortunately (I've left a trail of my own relationships behind), and single parenthood or being a widowed mother doesn't have any appeal. (It also frankly lessens my value in the dating market let's get real) I wish I could say my mentality helped but unfortunately for me lots of men still do want to get married and have kids, if not now then someday (even after I lay out why that could be a horrible idea for us both but especially them).

[–]WOPR-19831 points [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link

I wish I could say my mentality helped but unfortunately for me lots of men still do want to get married and have kids, if not now then someday (even after I lay out why that could be a horrible idea for us both but especially them).

Well, no matter what "pill" people take, I recommend they be really really honest about their lifestyle and family leanings from day one. Men (or women) who say "We'll cross that bridge when we get to it." are crazy. Many women end up with men who suggest they want a family and then put it off indefinitely.

Other times, women will be adamant about not taking kids but out of nowhere there is a whoopsie baby and (wait for it) turns out despite not wanting kids at all, she's against abortion, or simply "Can't kill your baby, I love you!"

I promised myself I would not have sex again until I got my vasectomy. Men don't have reproductive choice beyond abstinence anyways. 10 years after divorce, I still haven't gotten that damn vasectomy.

Maybe it's a trick on myself to be celibate... yeah. That's what I'm doing.

[–]mcove97NeutralPill 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

We'll cross that bridge when we get to it." are crazy

I fully agree. Turning a blind eye doesn't make the issue go away.

out of nowhere there is a whoopsie baby

That's why you have to be in control of your own birth control. For men that's either condoms (not really that reliable) or a vasectomy unfortunately, or abstinence, even though that's not really a realistic solution. Or, finding a woman who is staunchly against having children and verbal about it, or perhaps preferably have gotten sterilized.

10 years after divorce, I still haven't gotten that damn vasectomy.

Why not?

celibate...

If you don't want to have sexual relationships, why not. I get it, but if you do I'd go for the vasectomy.

[–]WOPR-19831 points [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link

If you don't want to have sexual relationships, why not. I get it, but if you do I'd go for the vasectomy.

I dunno. After going without for so long I don't miss it anymore.

In fact, the concept of getting nekked and doing the horizontal monkey dance seems patently alien to me now. It's like why would I even do such a thing.

Weird. Never thought I would think this way in a million years.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Post-trauma avoidance, perfectly normal.

[–]mcove97NeutralPill 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Haha. That's understandable.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm a strong proponent of people seeking happiness in life, but it's sad when it's only one partner that is unhappy and the other gets devastated by the choice of another to break up.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

My viewpoint is that a lot of divorces are bordering on frivolous and this is harmful to kids, since it results in being raised by a single mother. In cases of legitimate abuse, psychological or physical, of course it's better to leave no matter what the circumstances, however the fact women are initiating 70% of these breakups (when it's usually women ready to get married sooner in the first place) is somewhat disappointing from a male perspective. I don't think people put enough effort into their marriages to salvage a less than ideal situation. It's sad fact that nearly 50% of marriages end in divorce.

[–]mcove97NeutralPill 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I see your point, but then your concern is mainly in regards to kids and not married couples without kids who divorce, am I correct?

Sure, divorces are harmful to children, but is it not also harmful for the children to have parents who stay together for the children in a dysfunctional or just simply unhappy relationship? Then this also portrays to the children that it's okay and acceptable to sacrifice their own happiness and well being for others in the future. It's a double edged sword I don't think will be resolved by staying togheter either.

Overall I just think people should be more careful about who they have children with and in what situations they have children in. Too many people have children in situations where they really have no business having children. Too many people rush to have children and then they find themselves in child custody battles and divorce pickles. All which can be avoided if people, both men and women, vet their partners properly and take their time to marry and have children. One way to do this is to co-habit togheter for some years before deciding to get married and having children and merging assets etc. Also using contraceptives properly is incredibly important.

You're right people probably don't make effort to salvage their marriages, but how can we expect people who didn't make the effort into making sure their partners would be good spouses or parents in the first place to make the effort to salvage their marriages? Cause if you ask me there's definitely a correlation there. The solution starts with prevention. It is easier to take measures to prevent a divorce then it is to deal with the aftermath of a failed marriage.

This is why I as a woman wouldn't even consider getting married unless I had lived with a partner for years and felt incredibly secure that they would be a good spouse, and if I wanted children, (which I don't for a multitude of reasons, such as the issue you brought up in regards to children of divorce.. can easily be prevented if you don't marry and have kids) I would wait years before even considering it. It would be highly irresponsible of me to rush into marriage and especially kids without making damn sure my partner is fit to be a spouse and father. So I guess the conclusion is.. people are irresponsible. How do you make people more responsible? By educating them, but not everyone is willing to hear this of course. They don't want to consider the consequences of rushing into marriage and kids because it ruins their idealized and sugar coated ideas of marriage and kids. It bursts their bubble, and then they get mad at me for telling them. Red pilled? Perhaps..

[–]Glad-Discount-4761 1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

Judging by graph,I am getting that cohabitation with men is bad idea for women . Is this related to live in relationship before marriage? Because in my area, women are told never live or cohabitation with man if you are not married to him as his commitment is inversely proportional to time spend living together without marriage lol, relationship will end no matter what.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 1 point2 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

That's correct. I'm curious what area you live in. It seems like your culture is very wise.

[–]Glad-Discount-47611 points [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link

South east Asia.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Well, it looks like all hope is not lost for the human race then. It's unfortunate Western countries are too far gone to reverse course now.

[–]Glad-Discount-4761 2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Oh .why I feel like all hope is really lost lol.

By the way,I don't know much about live-in relationship or cohabitation.It seems relevant in Western.

Sometimes I get confused as I follows rpw sub,there is always at least post about living with "boyfriend or captain"or whatever they call.They share routine what they do.In replies,I see advice about how to show your value,what to not do even from contributer.Being non - western, I get confused like isn't cohabitation bad idea?Even my experience with it ended in bad way.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Cohabitation is the default in western societies, so women have to adapt to that reality no matter their pill color. It is absolutely a bad idea. But it's an idea firmly ingrained in our culture now, even for religious and conservative people.

[–]Glad-Discount-4761 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Cohabitation is the default in western societies, so women have to adapt to that reality no matter their pill color.

Damn women are doomed! Whenever I see women agreeing to cohabitation with partner thinking it will improve their relationship,

I am always like ," Bitch run away"

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

We all are, sadly.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'll give you my interpretation why cohabitation before marriage is more prominent in the west.

Distrust. Women and men are more distrusting of one another. Women are taught that men are a part of a patriarchy who's main purpose in life is to subjugate and exploit women. Men are taught that marriage is a risky proposition and getting married is akin to gambling your life away. This breeds a situation where trusting someone at face value is frown upon, and many people opt to "test" the relationship with cohabitation before marriage.

The divorce rates in the west is actually high compare to the east. I know in my wife's village, divorce is frown upon, even if the husband or wife are acting foolish.

Old tradition overlay on different circumstance. There's this western idea of sending your child out at the age of adulthood that's still prevalent today. It's still embraced by the youth as a form of freedom and independence from the control of their parents. The problem occurs when the cost of housing has risen dramatically over the past 30 years, while wages have stagnated. Top it off with younger people on mass attending higher education, which is a burden financially, which prolonging their access to a stable income. This causes young people who seek that independent lifestyle to either resorting to finding a roommate or giving up and moving back in with their parents. You can imagine the incentive women have to cohabitate with their boyfriends. Most of the time, the boy ends up sharing more of the financial burden. This isn't to say the male is innocent. He has his own motivation for living together with his partner, mainly sexual access.

Finally, sexual liberation. Even mainstream religious people have given up on the idea of saving your virginity. Sex has become a source of income for women and it's promoted in society for women to engage in sex work. Cohabiting is frown upon in the east because we all know, sex is inevitable when a man and a women share the same bed. To stay platonic is actually a difficult thing to do when given the opportunity every single day. That's why best practice is avoidance of temptation. The west no longer shames women for being sexually liberated. So the idea of cohabitating with a partner becomes less of a barrier and more of an invitation to satisfy their sexual ideology.

None of this is actually good. As the west has fragmented and is becoming more unstable.

[–]MacaqueOfTheNorth 0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

Living with a romantic partner is, for all pratical purposes, marriage. This is probably true for the same reason that having been divorced once is predictive of divorcing again.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

In some aspects it is, but knowing you can get up and leave anytime you want is significant. Once married, once you own property together, once you intermingle finances to a significant degree, and have kids together, it's way different and more complex. If a dead bedroom situation develops in a cohabitation situation, the simple solution is to just leave. But making that choice in marriage carries with it way more downsides for all involved. If marriage wasn't a significant step forward women wouldn't be pining for it so aggressively.

[–]mcove97NeutralPill 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

You're absolutely right that knowing you can leave is significant, but this is why I as a woman isn't pining for marriage. I want to be able to leave men who do not make me happy or satisfy me. I honestly don't think most women who want to get married consider the fact that it's way harder to leave a partner when you're married, or that they may want to leave someday if they're no longer happy with their partner. Anyway this is why I think the institution of marriage is deeply flawed. Being married doesn't stop people from growing apart, falling out of love or not making each other happy anymore. Some people who believe in marriage and who want to get married think marriage is guaranteed happiness. Spoiler alert: It's not.

[–]OberOst 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Once married, once you own property together, once you intermingle finances to a significant degree, and have kids together, it's way different and more complex.

This also happens when cohabiting. Cohabitation makes incompatible people slide into a bad marriage that eventually ends because it is harder to break up with someone you live.

[–]TriggurWarning[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Sometimes it does, but often it doesn't. Hell, it doesn't even happen 100% of the time in marriages.

[–]Search-United 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

This is fact more bodies less stable a relationship can be

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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