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The men who harm women the most are not incels, they are the men who women choose to be around.

December 3, 2022
25 upvotes

Women somehow believe incels and low-status men are their oppressors, even though they work very diligently to keep them out of thier lives.

How can these men be blamed for most of women's ills, when these men are pretty much completely excised from women's lives in any capacity?

The men that truly harm women are the men women choose to be around. The men they choose to be their boyfriends and husbands are the ones who bear the most statistical likelyhood of harming them. The men they choose to keep as close friends come in a close 2nd place. And the high-status men in power come in 3rd place when it comes to indirectly oppressing women (though this has diminished greatly since the women's suffrage movement).

Where exactly do incels and low-status men fit into this? They are not being selected by women as thier boyfriends and husbands. They are very rarely selected to be close friends with women. And I can't think of any self proclaimed incels in a high position of governance that can indirectly oppress women.

With the exception of a few deranged psychos in the incel community who have harmed women, the threat seems extremely overblown. And I think even that is putting it lightly... if you could actually quantify the threat incels pose to women, I would bet my life it would be next to nothing.

So why do women scare monger so much about incels? When the men who harm women the most, are the men who they allow into thier lives?

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Post Information
Title The men who harm women the most are not incels, they are the men who women choose to be around.
Author Antisocial_Nihilist
Upvotes 25
Comments 88
Date December 3, 2022 12:36 PM UTC (3 months ago)
Subreddit /r/AllPillDebate
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/AllPillDebate/the-men-who-harm-women-the-most-are-not-incels.1143101
https://theredarchive.com/post/1143101
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/AllPillDebate/comments/zbfb5j/the_men_who_harm_women_the_most_are_not_incels/
Red Pill terms in post
Comments

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (22 children) | Copy Link

It's political. The war on terror is now domestic. There needs to be domestic boogeymen to justify further censorship and online monitoring. "Incels", "alt right" etc are perfect scapegoats to use as examples and to lie and exaggerage about. Why? If you mention the statistics of crime and race, you're racist. If you mention the fact that a lot of trans people engage in grooming, you're transphobic... but what if you hyperfocus on "white supremacy" and the myth of violent lonely men? You have a free rein to say what you want about them.

The US knows it's invicible from the outside but the nation is riddled with identity politics and division. Keeping everything at bay means canceling out opposing ideas and dissidence long term.

[–]Antisocial_NihilistRedPill[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I've suspected this also.

The amount of media attention and Federal Law Enforcement budget that goes into researching and monitoring incels is just a gigantic front, an excuse, to ramp up the surveillance state. The government needs a boogeyman to justify this kind of expenditure and stripping away of the 4th amendment, so the boogeymen they've chosen are incels.

Without the Joker, Batman is just a crazy guy in a mask.

[–][deleted]  (4 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

I put the scare quotes in place because alt right is neolgoism which means experts i.e politically motivated think tanks and study groups decide what political beliefs are fringe and what ones aren't. The same thing applies to "incel".

[–]TsugaC1 points [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

Ha ha what? Violent criminals we all watched destroy property and attack authorities and threaten to hang the VP are antisocial deviants, full stop.

The same thing applies to "incel".

You realize the FBI monitors social media, including reddit, 4Chan, and the dark web. Some violent men who self-identified as incel posted manifestos threatening the very crimes they committed.

 

Like it or not, words and labels matter. If you identify with the violent insurrectionists, you're probably on a list. If you identify with incels and post hateful, violent rhetoric against women or the general public, you’re probably on a list.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

We also watched countless BLM rioters destroy property and attack innocent people. Your generalizations for thee but not for me isn't helping your case. You're just full of biases it's so obvious ahaha

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

It's statistically true that loneliness in men creates a heightened rate of sexual violence. Either that, or we have to accept that most lonely men are lonely due to the fact that they are violent.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

Statiscally? Do you even know what that word means? How on earth can you possibly prove this, "statiscally"?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (12 children) | Copy Link

Do your research. Im lazy

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

It's literally impossible to prove this "statiscally"

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Really

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Interesting.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy Link

Every single one of those "studies" doesn't even describe "loneliness" the same way you described it above as in virgin men who get no female attention. The first one literally is conducted in poor neighborhoods riddeld with gang violence in Chicago. Has it ever occurred to you that young men with no families have to join gangs and engage in criminal activities due to higher chances of poverty in order to survive?

The second one is literally just an article about men lacking friendships by a liberal white woman womansplaining "toxic masculinity".

Literally, the lenghths you people are willing to go to prove that unattractive men are a threat to society is laughable. What's next? Feminists advocating for a panel of women who send men without jawlines to concentration camps? 😂😂😂😂

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

I never described it that way. Calm down bozo. There is no need for mental gymnastics. We both know. Pretty much every notorious serial killer was an outcast. Womansplaining also does not exist.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Outcast ≠ ugly male who has no one attracted to him

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Same thing reallt, except for ugly. Plenty of uggos have relationships. Its the whining, needines, and antisocial behaviour that makes them outcasts. Incels.

[–]infinitofluxo 10 points11 points  (50 children) | Copy Link

Women can't admit they like the personality of cold narcissists and bad boys, so they hate the undesireable man and project on them what they see the bad boys doing. It is pretty easy as the losers are already criticizing women on their shit so they can deny the accusations plus find the scapegoat.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Based.

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (16 children) | Copy Link

Women hate unattractive men so much, they want them to be punished for the crimes of their attractive boyfriends. You can't make this shit up, the memes keep writing themselves

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

Men literally get annoyed when they see women they would not fuck. I shit you not. The same part of their brain activates as when they are highly annoyed. It's literally biology.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (13 children) | Copy Link

yeah, men are vicious to women they deem unfuckable. this is why i cannot give a fuck less about some guys screaming its the same as being ignored by some 8/10 stacy

that being said, its not biology imo, just fucking porn and entitlement.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (12 children) | Copy Link

It's biology. They get that response in their brain. Same as women.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (11 children) | Copy Link

source?

you evopsych spazzes claim "muh biology" over studies with a n35 sample, with the conclusion being an inconclusive hypothesis instead of something actually consistently neurologically or biologically observed, then run with it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (10 children) | Copy Link

Any source that porn or entitlement is the cause? No? Cool. Shut.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (9 children) | Copy Link

LOOL you made your claim first buddy.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy Link

And mine has some kind of basis. Yours does not. Go ahead and do some research, i am not your google assistant.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy Link

ok entitled porn addict who's ashamed of himself, sorry you felt personally attacked ig

[–]NotARussianBot1984 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

No those women are just treated like men.

If that is harshly. Then we'll that's how men are treated

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

Undesirable men can't admit nor accept the fact that BOTH their personality and looks are the reason they won't get laid, the biggest issue actually being their personality and lack of confidence. Undesirable men also don't seem to understand how abusers act to get ANYONE of ANY GENDER hooked. They don't act bad at the beginning. They act perfect in the beginning, actually. That gets almost anyone hooked. What ensues is hell.

[–]no_bling_just_dingself-aware MSTOW and self-impoverished janny 2 points3 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

you said on ppd that women ignore red flags if they felt attached to a guy before getting to know him

which implies looks

halo effect it applies to you me and everybody unless we make a conscious effort to check out of it

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy Link

You realize this also applies to friends, cults, co workers and other relationships, right? Bozo. Bro literally dug to prove something that doesn't happen. If i told you how mf hooked my friends are one some medium ugly to ugly guys...

[–]no_bling_just_dingself-aware MSTOW and self-impoverished janny 1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

"sister" i didnt dig i remembered that comment from the first time you posted it its how i recognized your username

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

Red flags and straight up abuse are different. Also, attractiveness is subjective, and personality traits are even more important.

[–]TsugaC 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Because their narrative requires painting Chad as the villain. Chad is perceived as a rival, so he must be a terrible person. Chad is having sex, and sex is sinful, so Chad is a bad person. Chad is loud and charismatic and jokes around, so Chad must be a jerk. A few women complain if Chad doesn’t want to commit, so Chad must be a cheating man whore.

 

The real Chad is the life of the party. He’s fun, and he’s exciting to fuck because he isn’t nervous or inhibited. The real Chad is funny and entertaining. The real Chad isn’t jealous or insecure. The real Chad isn’t perfect, but he’s a lot more fun than the awkward, judgmental and unpleasant guy in the corner.

 

But who Chad is and what Chad does is nowhere near as fascinating to women as he is to men.

Their fixation on Chad is obsessive and homo-adjacent.

Incels don’t want women. They don’t even like women. But they do harbor a bizzarro fascination with Chad.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

This makes so much sense. Especially the homo-adjacent part. They will do anything and everything to seek male approval. What makes this even funnier is the raging homophobia they have daily in their spaces. They are conflicted. They don't know if they want to be Chad, or if they want to be bedded by Chad.

[–]no_bling_just_dingself-aware MSTOW and self-impoverished janny 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

The real Chad is the life of the party. He’s fun, and he’s exciting to fuck because he isn’t nervous or inhibited. The real Chad is funny and entertaining. The real Chad isn’t jealous or insecure. The real Chad isn’t perfect, but he’s a lot more fun than the awkward, judgmental and unpleasant guy in the corner.

this is all true (except it's more about appearing as these things than being them & shy chad also has a market) but you forgot his looks. without them, you can multiply all this stuff by 0. the "awkward" dude might also not be any of those negative things you said, again he just lacks the looks.

[–]TsugaC1 points [recovered] (20 children) | Copy Link

so they hate the undesireable man and project on them what they see the bad boys doing.

I'm sure that's true for some women. There will always be assholes who punch down.

It is pretty easy as the losers are already criticizing women on their shit

What can incels criticize about women?

[–]infinitofluxo 3 points4 points  (19 children) | Copy Link

Some are getting redpilled, some think it is unfair they only go for money, power and looks, but maybe most of them are blaming themselves that is why it is so crazy they associate men that can't get laid to woman beaters and murderers.

[–]TsugaC1 points [recovered] (18 children) | Copy Link

Some are getting redpilled

So, brainwashed so some dumbass can make money on clicks, shares, views, and subscriptions.

some think it is unfair they only go for money, power and looks

Everyone prefers the most appealing mate they can land. That’s normal and healthy.

 

but maybe most of them are blaming themselves that is why it is

I’ve never seen this. If I did, I’d feel very sad and empathetic. All I’ve ever seen are men blaming women, blaming their parents, blaming the media.

 

is why it is so crazy they associate men that can't get laid to woman beaters and murderers.

Because men who are openly, actively spewing hatred towards women are scary. It’s true that a few violent men hide their true nature behind charisma and good looks, but there are women who do the same. Blaming the victim serves no purpose other than punching down. It’s ugly and vindictive.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Usually, serial killers have the same reason behind their acts:loneliness. Usually other men are the victims though. I don't see incels as a threat to women. I do see serial killers as a threat to society though. The fact that most murderers share the loneliness is just a coincidence. Lots of people are lonely, but people only who are lonely, vindictive, and entitled are dangerous.

[–]infinitofluxo 1 point2 points  (16 children) | Copy Link

What the fuck dude, you asked about incels and I answered, I don't care if they are right or wrong in your opinion, we aren't talking about this

[–]TsugaC1 points [recovered] (15 children) | Copy Link

I appreciate your answer and I’m giving you my perspective. I don’t speak for women.

And I’m not fragile. You can lay into me and I won’t flinch. Or you can block me. But I do want you to understand that as a woman in STEM, I’m working with and teaching incels daily. I’d like to understand so I can relate. Being hated isn’t fun, thought you would know that.

[–]Green-Quantity1032 4 points5 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

Most incels or nearcels I know blame themselves, with some bitterness towards women and society as a whole. When I was having women trouble I (rightly) blamed myself alone, I never look to society to fix issues, it’s both non pragmatic (for oneself) and not utilitarian (for society).

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yep, this is it. People who are lonely are 90% of the time lonely due to no one but themselves. They are the only ones who can spin their situation around.

[–]TsugaC1 points [recovered] (12 children) | Copy Link

Unless a man or woman willfully skipped a social circle, it isn’t anyone’s fault. Attraction either is; or it isn’t. There are no cheat codes or magic pick up lines or favors that will cause someone to feel attraction.

Most of us have to box our weight. And that’s fine. It’s better than obsessing jealously over every potential partner who might tempt them.

 

But the people who deliberately seek out fringe groups and hatred? They’re fucked. They pulled the plug on their chances the moment they repeat ragebait or pseudoscience.

[–]Green-Quantity1032 3 points4 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

It’s kind of your responsibility to be attractive if you want to… attract. If your posture is fucked, if you’re scrawny, if you’re fat. Lack social skills, lack fashion sense, etc. All these things are 90% in your sphere of influence.

So yeah, not everyone has model face and height, but optimization goes a long way.

[–]TsugaC1 points [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link

Physical health and posture make a good first impression. But it’s hard to make up for a lack of a social circle.

If they refuse to make friends and socialize, there isn’t anything anyone can do to reach them.

[–]MegaGigaTeraBased 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

It’s kind of your responsibility to be attractive if you want to… attract. If your posture is fucked, if you’re scrawny, if you’re fat. Lack social skills, lack fashion sense, etc. All these things are 90% in your sphere of influence.

So let me get this straight. If you are a man and can't find a partner, you have become ripped and muscular, become highly extroverted and charismatic, develop a massive social circle, spend lots of money on trendy new clothes, etc.

And all that just to get a 4/10 chubby woman who hasn't put in 10% of the effort you have. No thanks, sounds like a raw deal to me.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Look at you, speaking the truth and getting downvoted by incels. Ironic.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

There’s a reason why fathers chose the husband for their daughters (no, I’m not referring to the ones who sold their daughter for three goats and a glass of milk).

[–]TsugaC1 points [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

Political and social clout.

Do you even history?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

No.

[–]NotARussianBot1984 -3 points-2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Yup nowadays if all I cared about was casual sex, I'd skip university, sell coke, get tattoo sleeves, become abusive and manipulate, get a street bike, and never hold a job longer than 6 months. It's like chick crack lol. Like they want to pick the opposite their fathers would

[–]TsugaC1 points [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

And you would date women who are the female counterparts to those men, or so broken and damaged they can’t see the signs until it’s too late.

Is that what you want?

[–]NotARussianBot1984 -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Well when I saw my Chad friend date girlsz he was like what I said, even decent girls chased him. University educated even

[–]no_bling_just_dingself-aware MSTOW and self-impoverished janny 3 points4 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

water

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

What does MSTOW stand for?

[–]no_bling_just_dingself-aware MSTOW and self-impoverished janny 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

men Sent their own way

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Meaning?

[–]deadinsidefemale 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

i disagree with your hypothesis for 2 reasons

- most of the violence, rape, pedophilia etc. happens around people you know, this is both for male and female victims. for example a teacher is more likely to do pedoshit than some random stranger on street, a family member is more likely to murder you than some guy on street too. therefore it's true that familiar men are more likely to harm you, it's because people who know you get more opportunities to do shit to you in general than some guy who probably leaves the house once a month.

- incels, while might not be the most likely to commit harm due to being too loserly or not getting enough opportunities, still aren't innocent babies either if you read their forums, it's filled with pedophiles lusting after 12 year old girls, racists, violent psychpathic texts, hate.. it's not surprising some normie who reads them comes to hate incels, even if not all virgin men act like this, the ones who identify as incels do give them a bad name.

- yes there are legit some women who like psychopaths, however they are usually a minority of women who are filled with psychological problems... i honestly think the badboy trope is dying and even a dued who outright acts like an effeminate cuck gets more attention than an ugly badboy if he's cute. which is still shallow yes, but not the same thing as your hypothesis.

[–]HateSpeechFanBoy 0 points1 point  (10 children) | Copy Link

There is nothing they hate more than an unattractive man. Actually I am wrong, they hate most an unattractive man who doesn’t accept his place and dares speak up about it. That is why they blame all the ills they possibly can on unattractive men

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

Speak up about what? Being offensive to look at? That's on him. No one owes him the time of day, just like everyone else.

[–]HateSpeechFanBoy 2 points3 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

So no one is allowed to say anything about how they don’t like it about being alone. I never said he is owed the time of day, incels have places to discuss things but females and their white knights want to take it down. An incel is allowed to think, hate or say whatever he wants

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

If they are allowed to say just about anything, then we are allowed to hate them and take their spaces down. The authorities then are also allowed to put them on lists. Saying things actually has consequences. If all you talk about is how you want to rape "foids", commit shootings and engage in pedophilia, expect to be not on a list, but multiple lists. I have been on countless spaces like that. The shit they say is vomit inducing. They often share illegal porn on there. They are openly racist and threaten violence. No wonder people hate them. No wonder those spaces get taken down. Good thing they are. There are plenty of spaces for lonely people that are not cancerous. Head there.

[–]HateSpeechFanBoy 3 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

Taking a space down because you disagree with someone is against the principle of free speech, something the west is supposed to value.

Hating someone or saying mean things is not against the law. Why would authorities put someone on a list for not breaking the law?

The only incel forum that has produced a mass shooting is r/incelexit, apparently gaslighting and belittling concerns doesn’t work. Who knew?

Incels don’t commit rape. Men who are attractive to females commit rape. The essence of the OP. You just proved the point.

If you don’t like spaces where people say things you don’t agree with, don’t go there or close your eyes. You are not entitled to the whole world agreeing with you

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

Hating someone and saying mean things is one thing. I am not worried about that at all. Free speech does not mean free of consequences. If you threat bloody murder, there WILL be consequences. If you groom minors online (is that also free speech in your head??), there will be consequences. They do technically break the law. Nothing is an excuse to commit mass shootings, btw. Mo amount of gaslighting justifies it. Plenty of uggos raped women. Don't delude yourself. You can have incels in your family. My uncle was one. Husbands and boyfriends are not the only people in your close circle. You are right, i am not entitled to people agreeing with me, but neither are monster entitled to a place to plot the next mass shooting, threaten murder, spew racist theories, or share child porn.

[–]HateSpeechFanBoy 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Free speech does mean free from consequences. That is exactly what it is. If there is a risk of violence from free speech then that is not free speech.

On incel forums it is just hating and expressing emotions. Murder threats and grooming minors is something that men who have sex and relationships do.

As I said earlier, the only mass shooting from a current incel forum is on Reddit and it is still up. So Reddit should be taken down? I would be absolutely fine with that lmao.

There is no record of an incel raping a female. Even Elliot Rodger didn’t do that. That is a characteristic that females find attractive.

[–]TsugaC 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Free speech does mean free from consequences. That is exactly what it is. If there is a risk of violence from free speech then that is not free speech.

[–]HateSpeechFanBoy Talking about raping isn’t harassing anyone.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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