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The truth about female beauty. These guys are absolutely correct. Discuss.

August 29, 2022
3 upvotes

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Post Information
Title The truth about female beauty. These guys are absolutely correct. Discuss.
Author SaltyGeekyLifter
Upvotes 3
Comments 64
Date August 29, 2022 4:32 PM UTC (2 months ago)
Subreddit /r/AllPillDebate
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/AllPillDebate/the-truth-about-female-beauty-these-guys-are.1139631
https://theredarchive.com/post/1139631
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/AllPillDebate/comments/x0t6m7/the_truth_about_female_beauty_these_guys_are/
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Comments

[–]nicethingyoucanthave 3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Here's the underlying article: https://www.jsanilac.com/dispelling-beauty-lies/

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Thanks. I was too lazy to go looking.

[–]Marzipan-Happy 2 points3 points  (27 children) | Copy Link

I watched the whole thing. I am a woman, heads up.

-womens own sense of self and beauty is also defined by the male figures in their lives. My father loved "heroine chic". So I've always thought I was too fat.

-I'm surprised by the thigh gap thing. It is very true that around women, it's spread that if you don't have a tight gap, you are basically unseen by men.

-I'm a lot more attractive than I realized.

-the filters that are used now can really destroy a woman's confidence. It has mine. There is so way I could ever look like those perfect women, and as more use it, it gets harder and harder to feel like I could meet those standards.

-I think that for some women (like myself) the unrealistic ideals that are pushed have made them wNt to just quit rather than try and compete with it. As a result I own very little makeup and wear clothes I think are comfortable and cute.

[–]nicethingyoucanthave 4 points5 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

It is very true that around women, it's spread that if you don't have a tight gap, you are basically unseen by men.

I find it hard to believe that women think anything makes them "unseen by men"

I might see how it could be a relative issue like what women encounter with aging, where they get older and the amount of attention they receive declines a little ...though they still get attention. And so, relative to when they were younger they feel "unseen" (even though they still are)

But the thigh gap thing - how many women had it and lost it due to weight gain, and would therefore have that relative experience? Not many, it seems.

So why would women without a thigh gap, living as they are in a world where they get lots of attention, say they are "unseen?"

[–]Marzipan-Happy 4 points5 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

See, here's I think where a huge disconnect is between what Red Pillers think and what reality is. A lot of women do feel invisible to men. There arent hordes of them knocking on our doors, asking us out, telling us how pretty we are. Unless a women is on some dating app, she's not going to be approached by men very often.

The thigh gap thing is seriously a huge stupid thing, at least was a few years ago, and in the Los Angles area, a lot of my peers were obsessed with having one. I will never, ever have one, ever. I've been all over the map weight wise, and my thighs just don't gap. I would have to be a massively unhealthy weight. My dad loved painfully thin women, and spent a lot of time telling me what a huge gross ass I had, even when I was 115 pounds. This is how insecurities are made. My mom constantly shamed me about my breasts and how anything that wasn't high necked was obscene, because I am a 36 g.

I'm now at the age where my fucks to give are minimal. I wear what I want, my makeup is minimal, and it's not very often that I reflect on what makes me feel like the human veserion of a manatee.

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 2 points3 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

“A lot of women do feel invisible to men” - that’s all relative. You compare things to the way they were when you were young, and men would say anything to get in to your underwear.

Here’s some context: I had the first unprompted compliment on the way I look in my life last year. I’m late 40’s.

What was that about invisibility?

[–]iamatwork24 4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

It’s not a competition you muppet. Your anecdotal experience is not different, it’s all relative, from the one posted by the woman you responded to. I get complimented regularly by women and have since I was teenager, well over half my life.

What was that about invisibility? See it works both ways. Not a competition, woman or man, we all have different lived experiences.

[–]Marzipan-Happy 2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

The last time I was complimented was back in June when I was in Chicago for a work thing. It was a woman, and she was complmenting my hair. Most of the compliments I get are on my eyes, so at least I know people are looking at my face. I have pretty great eyes. Ngl.

[–]Admirable_Bee_8714 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Women aren't invisible to men for having no thigh gap. Rather women become invisible to men the older they get. Men value youth. So when a 45 year old asks why she can't get a date Friday night it's because men by and large are not looking to date 45 year olds.

[–]HodgekinWhitePill 3 points4 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

I actually find no makeup more attractive as a dating prospect. My wife hasn't weared any make up since our wedding 4 years ago.

I agree that make up can make the illusion of a more beautiful person, but because I understand how much make up can transform a person, I make the assumption that that person is actually ugly when I see them with a lot of make up on (specifically contouring).

[–]Marzipan-Happy 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Contouring is the worst. It's an awful trend. I know so many people that do it, and I feel like... dont they feel smothered? For parties and Buisness stuff I do light foundation because I have vitiligo, and I want to smooth out my skin tone a bit so I don't look like the human equivalent of a calico cat. Otherwise, on a day to day basis, it's lipgloss and a little bit if eyeshadow if I'm feeling it. Right now I'm doing concealer regardless because my stupid ass got nailed on my Eyebrow with a big peice of metal, but that's so people don't think my husband beats me.

[–]HodgekinWhitePill 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Lol. Ouch about the nail. I'm glad it didn't hit your eye!

[–]Marzipan-Happy 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Abridged version- I'm short, the shelves in our garage are high, the step ladder wasn't tall enough and the box slipped.

[–]Holiday-Reach-8948 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

This! My husband prefers light makeup at most. I typically wear a light foundation, some sheer lipgloss or a natural tint on my lips… and for work I’ll through in some mascara. Done. I consider myself average looking… not a 10 but also not a 5. I don’t really give a sh!t about what’s “in”… like contouring, the glue on lashes, etc. I feel prettiest with a sun kissed glow (I live in Florida), a smile, and a cutesy, feminine/chic outfit. 🤷‍♀️ I think women, in general, look pretty when they feel pretty (you can tell). For example, I think Alison Wonderland (the EDM DJ) is absolutely BEAUTIFUL and she wears long, baggie t-shirts and light makeup. Nothing extraordinary but it’s HER style and she totally feels herself in it. She’s fine AF. And she could not careless about modern day beauty standards. Do your own thing, ladies.

[–]Marzipan-Happy 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

It's so unhealthy for your skin and pores to do that (thr face spackle) I cover up my vitiligo, because in buisness, appeance is everything, but I keep wipes in my car to wipe that shit off as soon as my day is over. Because ew. I personally live in leggings and dresses in the winter, and dresses in the summer. I own two pairs of jeans, that's it, and I'm happy with that

[–]nothatyoucare 1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

it's spread that if you don't have a tight gap, you are basically unseen by men.

Not true at all.

the filters that are used now can really destroy a woman's confidence. It has mine.

Why though? You're still getting flirted with or approached by men. You still get external validation that you are sexually attractive. I guarantee if you posted selfies and compared the amount of validation you got versus a looks match male the differences would be in multiples. So the question is, why is your self confidence so fragile when you get so much more validation from others about your looks compared to men?

I think that for some women (like myself) the unrealistic ideals that are pushed have made them wNt to just quit rather than try and compete with it.

Compete? You're still getting much more sexual attention from the opposite sex compared to the other way around. You're "winning" in this regard, you're getting results. Where is this "woo woe is me" coming from?

[–]Marzipan-Happy 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Reacted. According to my husband I get hit on all the time, and he agrees with you that women get hit on all the time. I am apparently too oblivious to notice

[–]Marzipan-Happy 1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

It's "woe " is me., and what I was saying was that I am surprised by this, that is all. I do not feel sorry for myself, I was just commenting that filters and such can make a person feel less than, because one realistically can not compete with that. I was saying that based on that, I feel no need to attempt to attain that because it's just not reality. I could do what some women do, and put on ten tons of makeup and massive caterpillar eyelashes, but at the end of the day that's just as fake as those filters. If anything, the video made me feel better about myself. That's all I was saying.

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Your last two sentences? Good - that’s what I was hoping would happen.

I find heroin chic repulsive.

[–]nothatyoucare 0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

It's "woe " is me

Lol oops.

can make a person feel less than, because one realistically can not compete with that.

But what are you competing FOR? If you're trying to out pretty other women just to out pretty them... that's on you. Typically we make ourselves attractive so we can attract members of the sex we're interested in. And women (for the most part, generally speaking) don't struggle with that at all. ESPECIALLY when compared with men.

This is what I'm getting at. Women's confidence and egos are Fabergé eggs. They're so incredibly fragile when in life they're getting so much external validation in this regard.

[–]Marzipan-Happy 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Compete with each other because it's all about who the prettier one is. Seriously. It's stupid, but a lot of women do it. If there is a pretty woman at a party, then all of the inherent women want to be just as pretty as her. Haven't you ever heard a woman say "Wow, she's really pretty, that bitch!" ? Maybe it's just a California/Los Angeles thing.

[–]HodgekinWhitePill 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Aren't they just competing for attention? It doesn't have to be exclusively male attention. Getting attention from other females is just as good.

[–]h1shman 4 points5 points  (61 children) | Copy Link

The thicc girls in the video are too big. I don’t want a girl that has a bigger looking frame than I do. Big boobs when natural are often saggy outside of a bra. Most women aren’t anywhere near those proportions either.

Below is IMO a much more attractive physique.

https://cdn.fstoppers.com/styles/full/s3/media/2015/02/allison_stokke.jpg

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 4 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Each to their own. I guess the point is that you aren’t keen on runway models.

[–]h1shman 3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Yeah thats definitely true but I’d choose a runway model over say Ashley Graham.

Tho if you don’t know her off the top of your head search for images that aren’t touched up.

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Fair enough. Although that does make you atypical. My envelope does include Ashley Graham, and does not include Kate Moss.

[–]HinduProphet 2 points3 points  (34 children) | Copy Link

I am a man with a tiny frame, so am I bound to be a single virgin despite having great educational credentials and IQ ?

[–]no_bling_just_dingWhitePill (self aware MSTOW) 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

if you're a framelet boyo im sorry your only hope is to hit the gym to hide (not fix, that's impossible) your tiny frame.

or you're female in whcih case i dont think it's too much of a problem

[–]TheRealDJDarkwaters 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

This comment made me choke on my spicy ginger ale 😂

[–]h1shman 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

As far as being attractive IQ and Education only help if you meet a looks threshold.

I recommend resistance training for a multitude of reasons including appearing the have a larger frame. Shoulder and trap muscles being the focus.

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 1 point2 points  (29 children) | Copy Link

Your educational creds and IQ are irrelevant to men. Sorry.

[–]HinduProphet 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I am a man looking for a woman 😑

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

LOL. Sorry dude. Misread your post and it went from there.

...in which case my advice would be:

  1. Go to the gym and learn how to lift heavy. Continue that.
  2. use that IQ and education to leverage as much status and / or money as possible.
  3. Ensure you display the potential for money and status that you have.
  4. Don't bother with dating apps. They won't work for you.
  5. Looksmax yourself. Pay attention to grooming etc.

[–]HodgekinWhitePill 1 point2 points  (14 children) | Copy Link

Don't be too harsh on the lady. Iq is still relevant, genetic offspring iq are similar to that of their parents.

Education on the other hand is indeed irrelevant, or can be seen as a negative (indoctrination) from my perspective.

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I don’t mean to be harsh. Just truthful. IQ might be something that helps with charm or something. It’s not really something men find attractive in their gut, though. She’s better off using that IQ to understand what men actually want, and advertising that instead.

[–]anonymous-platypus1 2 points3 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

I disagree. I work in a field that requires an advanced degree, most of the men want women that have their degree or just one below. And honestly, when they have one below they complain about the woman not understanding the lifestyle. The similar can be said if the roles are reversed

[–]nothatyoucare -2 points-1 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

Not to me. I want a partner not someone I have to support.

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 2 points3 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

Interesting set of assumptions you have there.

You’ve also rationalised this quite hard. The fact is you don’t find IQ anywhere near as attractive as a good set of titties. Because what you find attractive is decided in your monkey brain, not your white-knight brain.

You’ve rationalised that you should find girls with a high IQ attractive. You still find titties attractive but you try to override it.

You, as a man, are not hardwired to find those with lots of resources attractive. You’re hardwired to find women attractive who can produce healthy children and raise them through infancy.

Women are hardwired to be attracted to those who can provide safety and security for their young, and a good set of genetics for those young.

The sad fact is that, statistically, u/HinduProphet thinks having an education and high IQ is attractive because that is what she thinks she finds attractive herself.

[–]Taipanshimshon 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

How's the face?

And diploma doesn't really seem all that sexually attractive. Piece of paper isn't most guys kink

[–]bludkrazeRED AF 2 points3 points  (12 children) | Copy Link

Id say a prime Gina Carano is pretty perfect including the boobs

[–]h1shman 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah any athletic build usually looks great

[–]iamatwork24 0 points1 point  (10 children) | Copy Link

Nah she has a manly face and shit personal views. Great body though.

[–]bludkrazeRED AF 2 points3 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

Nah she has a manly face and shit personal views.

Those personal views are only shit if your a fucking snowflake.

[–]iamatwork24 -1 points0 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

It’s so funny how people who use snowflake without any irony are always the biggest snowflakes. They’re shit personal views because they’re ignorant and reductionist. Being actually informed and having compassion doesn’t make them a snowflake, it’s makes them a good human, unlike the selfish and backwards views you and Gina believe in.

[–]nothatyoucare -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Damn someone got big mad.

[–]Holiday-Reach-89481 points [recovered] (8 children) | Copy Link

I can tell you now she has big boobs. She’s wearing a sports bra which smushes them to the body so they stay in place.

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Yep. Big boobs are gooooooood.

[–]h1shman 2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Sorry by no reasonable standards does she have “big” boobs. Though I find them ideal personally

https://thespun.com/.image/ar_4:3%2Cc_fill%2Ccs_srgb%2Cfl_progressive%2Cq_auto:good%2Cw_1200/MTgzMTI4ODM5NzI2NDQxODI0/allison-stokke.jpg

[–]Holiday-Reach-89481 points [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link

That’s the sane girl?

[–]h1shman 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Yes Olympic athlete and model Ashley Stokke. You can google search and confirm.

Yes men like bigger breast but not at the expense of shape. Bras were invented to push breast both upward and inward negating breasts tendency of drooping both down and out.

Implants are the best of both worlds being both large and perky but obviously have some limitations of realism.

[–]Peacesquad 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Meh

[–]FightMeCthullu1 points [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link

Hey so I want to add - I’m a bra fitter. As in, I fit women for bras for a living. Specifically large breasts (it’s a large cup size retailer).

We stock everything from D-K from a 28 inch band to a 44 inch band.

Breasts are NOT as large as they think you are. AT ALL!

Most traditional gra fitting involves measuring the ‘underbust’ (top of rib cage under the boobs) and then the ‘bust’ (widest part of the boob). Then they add 4 inches to that underbust measurement and the difference between the underbust and the bust is the ‘cup size’.

Each inch is a cup size.

By that measurement, women end up wearing too large a band and too small a cup and get the wire digging into their breast tissue, etc etc etc.

How we measure is we count directly up from the first measurement to the second. We don’t add the unnecessary 4 inches. This means several things: cup size is relative to band size, and no one is wearing the right size.

DD is not large. DD is a five inch circumference difference from the top of your rib cage. The shape of your breast, where it sits, etc, all affect breast size. DD is actually fairly small all things considered. Fun fact: your breast tissue actually starts under your armpit usually, and all of that has to be in FRONT of the wire of the bra.

There’s also the shape of the breast, placement on the upper torso, and fullness, which all affect sizing. Also each retailer sizes differently, each country too. French cups are smaller (I’m a French I cup, UK/AUS don’t do I cups, some places have DDD, some places don’t do double letters like HH or FF).

Example: I am an UK8GG. That means I have a 30 inch band/30 inch top of rib cage circumference, and the largest part of my bust is 10 inches larger, 40 inch circumference.

8GG sounds massive, right? Nah. Actually not that big. Honestly the average size we fit is a 12H. So a 34inch underbust and an 11 inch difference to bust.

I fit dozens of women every week and let me tell you, it is EXCEEDINGLY rare to find any women who look anything like the ‘large breast’ pictures.

Looking at those pictures of sex dolls, guessing by the protrusion based on the width of their ribs The ‘small’ would be between a C-E cup, the ‘medium’ would be at LEAST a HH-J and the ‘large?’

I’ve met one person who looks like her. One. She is a 24 inch band (a UK4) with L Cups. Bras aren’t even made in that size commonly. My boss has been fitting for 10 years and not seen anything like her before. 10 years of fitting over 2 countries, in major cities both times.

I’ve never seen anyone with the ‘huge’ category boobs in real life. I imagine she’d be very uncomfortable.

None of those dolls would have a band size bigger than a 34 at MOST. More likely a 30.

So the breast ideal in this article is, frankly, fairly unobtainable.

Anyway I’ll read the rest of the article now but seeing as I know my shit here I thought I’d interject.

Ladies - find a bra fitter who doesn’t do the +4 method. Your bras will fit tighter at first but they’ll actually fit BETTER. At least go down ONE band size. Start on the LOOSEST hook and work your way in as the bra stretches. Your bras should be replaced every two years (I’d prefer one some stretch quick especially when super cheap) but to make it last wash them by hand in cold water. Make sure you scoop all your breast tissue so the wire is behind it and you aren’t spilling out the front. Make sure the wire sits right underneath your breast tissue, so your breasts are properly in the cup and keep your straps tight. The weight will be held up by your ribs and back not your shoulders and neck.

MEN: boobs aren’t as big as you think.

Anyone in between: Take what advice you need.

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

All good stuff, but…

…you don’t get to say what men do and don’t find attractive.

[–]FightMeCthullu 3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I didn’t say you had to stop liking it, just be aware that of what can and can’t be achieved naturally :)

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

👍

[–]TheRealDJDarkwaters 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Tbh what I find most attractive about a girl is the bass.

[–]kokorwqac 2 points3 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

This is kind of a captain obvious article, the reason why female models often have masculine face and body type is because homosexual men weren't allowed to make their preferences too obvious back in the day.

[–]HinduProphet 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Some "heterosexual" guys are also into that...

[–]SaltyGeekyLifter[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Eh?

[–]BumblingBeta 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I thought I was the only one lol. No idea what she's saying.

[–]HodgekinWhitePill 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

In the video, they talked about why fashion run way models looked androgynous, tall, skinny and chisel jaw-line. It was because the men who were in charge of the fashion industry were homosexuals.

If a heterosexual man was in charge, his preferences would be on full display, and the runway models would look more like your typical porn star.

[–]HodgekinWhitePill 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

That was informative. Mainly it help explain why runway models look androgynous lol. Now it all makes sense.

[–]Marzipan-Happy 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

It's true that women think that's how they need to look, but that comment about the looks and the designers was a classic.

[–]resavr_bot 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

A relevant comment in this thread was deleted. You can read it below.


Hey so I want to add - I’m a bra fitter. As in, I fit women for bras for a living. Specifically large breasts (it’s a large cup size retailer).

We stock everything from D-K from a 28 inch band to a 44 inch band.

Breasts are NOT as large as they think you are. AT ALL!

Most traditional gra fitting involves measuring the ‘underbust’ (top of rib cage under the boobs) and then the ‘bust’ (widest part of the boob). Then they add 4 inches to that underbust measurement and the difference between the underbust and the bust is the ‘cup size’.

Each inch is a cup size.

By that measurement, women end up wearing too large a band and too small a cup and get the wire digging into their breast tissue, etc etc etc.

How we measure is we count directly up from the first measurement to the second. We don’t add the unnecessary 4 inches. This means several things: cup size is relative to band size, and no one is wearing the right size. [Continued...]


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