Did you end your marriage with no big problems?

starlord0770 · 2019-12-03T18:02:01+00:00

Not to hijack your thread, but I see alot of what you are experiencing in your own life in mine as a fellow traveler and have been wondering about the same things. You are not alone. I am 49 and my wife is 10 years younger than me. We have two boys under 10. We both have well paying jobs, a stable home, and no major issues of infidelity or abuse, but the fights we have are never resolved until one of us (mostly me), accept the blame and even the awkwardness and coldness will remain for some time. It has always been this way, but some reason, either financial insecurity, fear of being alone, or desire to build a life I didn't grow up with, have kept me here. My wife is confrontational and often aggressive in our arguments, but those standards do not apply to me. If I raise my voice or express even the mildest form of counter narrative or criticism, she will either narrow the parameters of the argument or straight up gaslight me. I have no voice unless its the voice she expects. I feel unsafe, alone, a failure as a husband and a father, and an all around bad person. My self esteem is in the gutter and my motivation to pull myself out is reading negative. I have started seeing a personal therapist to work on my own personal issues of not having good role models in my parents who openly despised each other though they stayed together throughout my childhood. We have tried marriage counseling a while back with very little result and when I brought it up going again, she seemed completely uninterested. I brought her into one of my personal therapist sessions to help provide perspective and she immediately went into how unhappy our marriage is and that my therapist is my last chance to "fix me." No recognition or validation of my unhappiness and no self introspection to her role in our marital issues. If I didn't have two little boys, I would have already left. Like you, I have fantasies of living alone without all the toxic BS and know I am on a slow motion train wreck waiting for the day when one of us finally musters the courage to end it.

Sad_Dad_0613 · 2019-12-03T16:34:20+00:00

Is she in individual therapy? It sounds like she may be codependent or maybe have borderline traits. Not certified in anything just guessing based on my experience.

If she is looking for you to make her happy, her head is not screwed on right. She needs to first find that love in herself and allow you to complement that love. You will never be able to fill that void and self doubt she has. My guess is a lot of the fights you have are just projection. You think she’s fat because she thinks she’s fat. Etc. she gets upset with the things you do or say because she feels a certain way about herself and there is a fear or a self doubt there. If those aren’t being worked on and trying to be resolved nothing in the relationship dynamic will change.

No amount of couples therapy is going to fix her deep seated shame and lack of self love. If she doesn’t love herself no one will be able to love her as she will believe all the negative (as it agrees with her) and she will discount all the positive (as a fluke or a lie or just flattery).

Those who attack others and criticize others I’ve found are only doing so out of fear or their own suppressed pain. Once you have a solid sense of self and who you are, collaborating without insult, criticism and attacks is much easier.

JustOkIsOk · 2019-12-03T17:26:56+00:00

My STBXW and I ended our marriage with no big problems. No cheating (none that I am aware of) occurred. She changed, not necessarily for the bad, and we just were not compatible. I tried to change for her and with her to accommodate her new lifestyle. Eventually, she wanted to pull the plug and move on with life and I didn't fight her. There is someone out there that is a better fit for me and a better fit for her. No animosity other than our kids being impacted and having to split and undo everything we accumulated over the last 20 years.

It hurt at first. Still in disbelief at times, but it is for the best. She and I are still living together until the divorce goes through, but we talk everyday for our kid's sake. She is also a good person and we will be friends, but not lovers.

I am probably setting myself up for disaster, but we are not lawyering up as we think we can be upfront with each other, talk through our issues that may arise and walk away as allies after the process is complete. Listen to others regarding the process if you decide to go through with it regarding the lawyers and the process.

relationshiptossoutt · 2019-12-03T16:22:50+00:00

Life is short. YOU deserve to live happily. Most marriages don’t end in a clusterfuck until the divorce actually starts. Have the conversation again sternly and follow through. Make sure you speak with an attorney BEFORE officially separating. Donot let the shared home or your routine with the kids as it can be seen as abandonment.

poorlyplanned · 2019-12-03T17:10:48+00:00

As a divorced dude, here's some hard truth. It will make you uncomfortable, so feel free to ignore me.

Did you end your marriage with no big problems?

No. You won't either.

I feel like I disgust her. I'm very good at making her angry, but cannot seem to make her happy no matter what I do.

You've had a lot of couple's counseling, but have you discussed this in particular? Are y'all actually using what you're learning? Have you had any individual counseling?

We have 2 kids, age 7 and 3

This will hurt them even beyond what the two of you acting like children is already doing. Make sure they get counseling if you split.

I do not feel safe or comfortable with her.

This is a problem, but it's hard to empathize with you when it sounds like you're not really trying.

She wants me to be emotionally available

A reasonable ask

but I always regret the times that I do it, because I say the wrong thing and get blamed and make her angry

Either you're saying something wrong or you're getting blamed. You aren't "getting blamed" if you are the one that fucked up. Again, this is something that should have been covered by now in counseling, and it speaks volumes of just how little you're (as a couple if not individually) not using what you're paying for.

But I also feel like it's silly to end a marriage without any of the big problems that worse marriages go through.

It is.

I am fully checked out and am not interested in making this work.

And here we see the issue.

Look. Get divorced or don't. You're hurting everyone else in the house right now, and the divorce isn't going to do your kids any favors, either. By your own telling of the story (so I have to assume it's slanted in your favor), you either aren't paying attention in counseling or aren't using what you're learning. You're checked out mentally while you go through the motions so you can act like you did what you are supposed to do.

Divorce is going to hurt you in ways you can't imagine at this point in you're life and, to be completely blunt, you kind of deserve that wake up call. Make a choice and go with it. You're a man with his mind made up, so start acting like it.

VariantArray · 2019-12-03T18:49:52+00:00

You're miserable. You've mentally and emotionally 'checked out'. There's no need for 'big problems'. You're unhappy and it's not going to get better. That sounds to me like a 'big enough problem'. No further justification needed.

dogsrule2019 · 2019-12-03T18:56:55+00:00

I, too, am in a similar situation. Married 20 years, I'm 50, she's 46, kids are 16, 14, and 10. Get along overall fine. Tried selling the house in fall and will relist in January. That will enable everything to move forward. But I question too if this makes sense since we actually get along better now than we have for several years. There was infidelity on her part a few years ago but it's in the past now afaik. I'm not even pissed off about that anymore. She acknowledges she is the one that changed. With no kids, we'd already be divorced. But it weighs on me heavily. Just taking it a day at the time... I too look at homes and think about peaceful/no stress living. Hang in there...

ceegster · 2019-12-05T09:35:02+00:00

I am currently going through a pretty similar situation. My wife and i have been together a total of 7 1/2 years married 3 1/2. Like you, our marriage hasn't been one for the fairy tale books, yet hasn't quite made it to the horror section yet. No major issues, infidelity (at least that I know of), abuse, drugs, ect. From a personality standpoint, we are polar opposites. I am very reserved, non-confrontational, don't raise my voice in anger, logical. She, on the other hand is out spoken, confrontational, goes almost instantly to yelling, and very spontaneous. To give some background, she has a daughter from a previous relationship (which the biological father has never been in the picture) since day one I've done the best that I could to treat her as my own. When we met, her daughter was 4 years old, and had behavioral issues, again nothing major, she is just an envelope pusher. Hindsight being 20/20 I know I wasn't perfect raising her the textbook way, but I always showed patience and tried to understand where the daughter was coming from when she would try to cause issues. Adversely, my wife instantly turns to yelling at her daughter when she tries to push her buttons. Fast forward to present day the daughter is now 11 and has even more behavioral issues and tries to intentionally cause fights between my wife and I, too many to list here and each story is impossibly long to type out. Anyways, We had a child together after a year of marriage, things were going well for a few months after that, I had started a new job with better benefits, pay and work life balance, she had got a promotion at work. About 4-5 months later the arguments started back up, again, nothing hostile or overbearing, just over silly things. Like your relationship, the arguments would leave us in that awkward state of walking on lonely egg shell for the next few days. Finally, she sits down with me and says, I don't feel happy with where we are, we never get to go out just us anymore, I don't feel that the effort is there. So I apologize for not being more cognizant of her needs, and say hey why don't we have a date night every other week, just us, and go out and do stuff. It's a start right? She gives the I don't want to leave the kids with my mom all the time (as her mom was basically our nanny while we worked). However, about once every other week she'd send me a message saying "hey after work I'm going to go out for a few drinks with some friends, I won't be late". Which usually meant I'll be home when the bar closes. In that scenario, to avoid confrontation, I'd just say ok be careful. In the rare occasion I went out with friends I'd usually get a text about an hour after leaving saying when are you going to be home, and then random texts throughout the time I was gone. That was a long back story. Short version, divorce has came up once last winter, it tore me apart emotionally and mentally. I worried about what I was going to do. How they are going to financially make it (even though my wife has a great job), how are the kids going to adjust, etc. this lasted for about 4 months, at the end of the bad times, we really made an effort to fix what was broken in our marriage. However, my self confidence was non existent, I didn't know how to even talk to my wife without it feeling forced. I had lost the way to make her feel like I once did. I felt and still feel like a total failure as a husband not being able to satisfy my wife completely. The divorce conversation came back up this past August, without the blinders on we really had good conversation around us as individuals and us as one. We ultimately decided it was time to throw in the towel. I moved out at the end of September. I didn't leave with anything but my clothes and a few odds and ends. Oddly enough over the past 2+ months our relationship has improved (not as a married couple but as friends). There is something nice about just being alone, however, what I would give for just one more day (a good day) with her as a husband. Sorry this comment seems all over the place but thats kinda where I am at present day... all over the place.

arun_bala · 2019-12-03T16:32:35+00:00

Despite my situation, I'm not envious of the slow death marriage. With my WW was clear cut infidelity with a literal orgy of evidence, 50 pages of emails, texts, semen stained panties, meetup attempts after DDay. The divorce is going to suck, no doubt but I don't have to question if the right move was made. We have two kids 6 and 3.

chimera1337 · 2019-12-03T17:26:26+00:00

What about a trial separation?

runnfree1 · 2019-12-03T18:07:02+00:00

You are not alone, my friend. I am in the same struggle you are in. Nothing is wrong, just nothing is right. Married a long time, working hard on the marriage the last few years, ironically with all the marriage counseling, I think things are actually worse than ever. Unlike the guy at the bottom, I understand. We had an issue that was my issue the other week. The counsellor even said, she was surprised to find an issue for me and that everything up till now has been my wife's issues. She is trying, but since the main issue is that she hates herself, the more we work on things, showing her how many of our issues are from her, it just breaks her down some more which in turn projects back on our marriage. Like you, with nothing really wrong, and the damage it will do to the kids, I have been trying to make it work. I just can't imagine the next 20 years being like the last 20.

CarGuyM1985 · 2019-12-03T22:28:13+00:00

You only get one life, you have to decide if this is the life you want.

If you’re having these types of problems and writing this post - they aren’t small issues...

Good luck!

ABrownLamp · 2019-12-03T23:01:02+00:00

My wife and I are the same age as you. Two girls, same age. No cheating, abuse or drugs. No money issues. But we are just "best friends" and that's all she wants and at this point I'm feeling the same way.

I started listing the similarities in what you wrote about your wife that I can very much relate to, but the bottom line is this... how long are we gonna do this? I mean let's say we did keep this going, what happens when our kids finish school in the 2030s? There is no way you or i would put up with this if we didn't have kids, so what happens when the kids are adults and it's just the two of you again? I've really been thinking a lot about that over the last few months, what are your thoughts? Think I'm gonna pull the trigger after the holidays. 25 year marriage is a while lot different than a 10 year one in the eyes of the court

dday_throwaway3 · 2019-12-03T23:18:46+00:00

I went through Gottman marriage counseling. Waste of money, brains and time. It lasted as long as the counselor agreed with my then-wife. It should be self evident that you are the way you are, and she is the way she is. Accept that and move on.

I divorced 2 years ago when my kids were 7 and 11. We're all doing much better now.

> I'm very good at making her angry, but cannot seem to make her happy no matter what I do.

That's because she does not respect you.

> I frequently visit realtor sites to find houses in my neighborhood so I don't have to be far away from my kids.

Be sure to stay in the marital residence until the divorce is final. Moving out before divorce is final is the worst mistake you can make.

nicole2mom · 2019-12-04T18:19:14+00:00

OP, what are you waiting for? How long are you going to allow yourself to be absolutely miserable continuing down this road. Unhappy and unloved are valid reasons to divorce, which are major problems you are glossing over for some reason. How long until you see another woman who will love you and make you happy, resulting in an affair? You need to find the courage to go through with it. Since you are checked out of the marriage, I highly suggest you be involved in your children's lives to the utmost even at the expense of your career if necessary.

Title	Did you end your marriage with no big problems?
Author	relationshiptossoutt
Upvotes	10
Comments	54
Date	December 3, 2019 3:58 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/Divorce_Men
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/Divorce_Men/comments/e5j3x3/did_you_end_your_marriage_with_no_big_problems/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/Divorce_Men/did-you-end-your-marriage-with-no-big-problems.818962 https://theredarchive.com/post/818962