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liondale
[–][deleted] 133 points134 points135 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
People don’t care how their son’s treat women.
But they do care if their son is treated like a woman.
[–]lagomlagumeFDS Newbie18 points19 points20 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Damn, I'm blown away from this realization.
[–]Selena33321Throwaway Account2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yep
[–]MixWideFDS Newbie324 points325 points326 points 3 years ago (19 children) | Copy Link
It has been my experience that any person who says boys are easier to parent than girls is a person who isn't actually parenting their boys.
Even at preschool ages their boys are the ones that push other kids, steal toys, and otherwise show lack of regard for the boundaries and feelings of others. And their parents usually look on this permissively, if not down right fondly, because a boy who is sweet and kind and thoughtful might be a fag.
[–]sstenaFDS Apprentice145 points146 points147 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
Just brilliantly said. Also a boy who is kind and thoughtful will get bulldozed by other men, and we all know this.
[–]SlumberAddictFDS Newbie81 points82 points83 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
This is my fear with my son. He is so sweet and thoughtful at 11. I have taught him to care about others, about sexism, racism, and classism. He isn’t really competitive (maybe Minecraft and MarioKart and classic video games) He doesn’t have any close friends that are into the same stuff as him other than Minecraft and he’s starting Middle School. They’re about to go in person and I’m just worried they are going to walk all over him and pick on him. I try to instill confidence in him and to accept himself for his fun quirks and to embrace people’s differences, but it’s so hard to raise him into a well-balanced man. The Momma life is hard
[–]DangerousRiver9FDS Newbie85 points86 points87 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Getting him into some form of martial arts might help. I recommend this for all girls, but your son could benefit from learning how to physically stand up for himself and others (especially girls who are afraid to stand up to boys harassing them).
[–]CB4lifeFDS Newbie47 points48 points49 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Also a lot of martial arts isn’t just about beating people up. In my tae kwon do class the instructor also talked about avoiding situations, listening to your instinct and getting out before you put yourself in a potentially dangerous situation. Trusting tour mind was just as important as trusting tour body. It was also cool to break a board in half with my own hand😂.
[–]DangerousRiver9FDS Newbie22 points23 points24 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Oh for sure, that’s why I say martial arts and not self defense. There is a whole mind/spiritual aspect to it, but I figured they’d learn all about that if they decide to look into it.
[–]PooPooMeeksFDS Newbie4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link
I agree with the martial arts, but it would be dangerous for him to physically defend girls that are being bullied with violence. And when I say dangerous, I mean mainly dangerous to his school record, not so much amongst other boys(though he also has to be careful of posible gang members or guys sneaking in weapons).
I mean i guess if the girl is getting bullied by a bunch of guys, and he says “leave her alone” and they start pushing him, etc. I can see that scenario, but only if she’s bullied quite heavily. And only if it’s REALLY super bad, because schools don’t care who is right or wrong a lot of times, and might treat him as yet another “troublemaker” and taint his record.
Now If he defends himself, I think that’s a great idea, whether he gets trouble or not - heck, I’ve been bullied in school and had to fight to defend myself, unfortunately. I’m just saying that defending girls with his martial arts skills might be a battle on his record, no latter how chivalric he might be acting.
It sucks and is really unjust to have to think like this, but families have to be careful, with the way kids get suspended and expelled nowadays. So he has to pick his battles wisely.
[–]DangerousRiver9FDS Newbie10 points11 points12 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
How schools handle bullying is atrocious, it’s all about saving face and not the actual issue at hand. I was thinking more along the lines of the martial arts background giving him the confidence to say “leave her alone” vs swooping in and fighting them off. If they start attacking him just for saying that, he’s in self-defense mode again. Unfortunately it’s not just schools, assault laws also make it so it’s almost never a good idea to throw the first punch at any age.
Yes, having the wisdom to know when to fight and when to be careful is a paramount life skill. You sound like you know what you’re doing in teaching them the difference. We need more moms like you out here.
[–]PooPooMeeksFDS Newbie4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Thanks, I appreciate that :) I was saying most of my reply from experience. I’m close to 5’9 and was always taller than the other kids. However I was very timid and meek, thus got bullied a lot and had to defend myself. Unfortunately, I spent time in all day detention right along with the bullies, since i was swinging right back at them. Later I realized I was in a sense “lucky,” because the outcome could have been suspension or eventually expulsion. But still, those damned schools...
And oh yeah, I see what you mean about the “leave her alone” situation. I’m just saying that schools, and like you said other authorities, might look at him as an violent contributor as well. One fight I was in was due to a 5’3 girl slamming me in the door. I was able to pin her down with a few scratches, and the vice principal threatened ME with the police! My dad came to the school and verbally ripped him a new a-hole, but I definitely learned what injustice meant that day.
And yep, i am a Mom too :) I have a 10 year old boy, and am working on training his mindset when he starts middle school and might approach these type of situations. It’s hard because the kids can only be innocent for so long, up until a point that we have to start teaching them how to swing 🥺
[–]Inspection-CriticalFDS Apprentice77 points78 points79 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
Former daycare teacher here. I stopped teaching because of the parents. Most people shouldn't have children.
[–]QuodpotFDS Newbie14 points15 points16 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
It sucks that there is no respect for teachers in America. When I taught abroad I loved it, and even the problem kids I could handle. Parents worked with me and listened to my suggestions and even took me and my partner at the time out for dinner (with the whole class and all the parents there too, it was really sweet!)
[–]Inspection-CriticalFDS Apprentice15 points16 points17 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Teaching in America sucks. The majority of American parents are brats.
Too many people here seem to view children as a given rather than an option that needs to be carefully considered.
[–]SlumberAddictFDS Newbie28 points29 points30 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
This so much. I mean, I am not an amazing parent. I lose my tempter quick and my 6 year old walks all over me, and we have good Ol’ Mexican Standoffs in public when I don’t let her have her way. She has my stubbornness for sure, but thankfully all I get is compliments on her behavior and manners from the teachers and daycare staff. Now, some of the other kids are down right terrors. I feel so bad for some of the teachers and daycare workers. Overworked and underpaid dealing with the shit head kids.
[–]Inspection-CriticalFDS Apprentice20 points21 points22 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Honestly? I know mental illness is always possible, but in my experience, shitty kids just had shitty parents and would shape up quickly once I set boundaries and instilled healthier habits. Granted, my kids were toddlers so it was easier to undo the damage. Young children are sponges and reenact what they're seeing at home.
[–]psilocybeanieFDS Newbie6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
This made me chuckle, you sound like an awesome mom. And honestly your experience is far more common than you might realize; you're raising a stubborn girl who will grow up to be a leader.
[–]LevelTurbulentFDS Newbie10 points11 points12 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yeah, I'm a boy mom and I've wondered about this. I know girl moms and their households seem easier in all honesty. But people will go on and on about how girls are so much harder. I don't see it.
But if a lot of parents of boys aren't doing anything it makes sense.
[–]randomgirl34861FDS Newbie85 points86 points87 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I wish people feared their sons being pedophiles, rapist or abusers more than they feared their daughters developing a healthy sexuality of their own as they become of age
[–]WTFseriouslyWTHFDS Newbie97 points98 points99 points 3 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link
So true! The saddest part is usually their mommas are the ones who raise them to be men who can hardly take care of themselves and treat their women like slaves. Then their mommas continue to enable their behavior. The next step is gaslighting the girlfriend/wife that his behavior is totally normal. It is a huge red flag of his mother is ever trying to justify his behavior!!
[–]MoundOlympusFDS Newbie37 points38 points39 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Hey! I am a momma bear to 4 and I insist that everyone chip in on the chores and treat me well. I only accept pleases and thank yous, no grunts or groans. I also accept labour of love around the house. Everyone chips in because Mom's time and Mom's efforts are valuable and not, and this is the most important part i think, I am not an infinite resource. I get tired. I get cranky. I get frustrated when messes are left for me. I am a human being too and will be seen as one and treated like one.
Mom isn't a cleaning robot; mom has expectations.
Ooooh, how i love expectations! They are the greatest!! I have a LOT :)
[–]SlumberAddictFDS Newbie5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You are my goals. Haha. I grew up with my mom doing everything. She was a stay at home mom and my brother didn’t do his own laundry for the most part until after she passed a few years ago. (My father as well haha) I used to clean the kitchen and rest of the house whenever they went grocery shopping and she would get so excited so I would do it every time I could. I regret not doing it... while she was there! Why did I think I had to wait until she was away from the house on her once a week outing. Now, I’m a working mom of two kids and I’m being run ragged. So far I just have my 11 year old son only unloading the dishwasher and keeping his room clean (finally), but I’m working on incorporating a household responsibilities chart. Momma works and you all live here too.
[–]FitncurlyFDS Apprentice0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yup! Momma of two here with the same ethos!
[–]willowgrowingrootsFDS Disciple25 points26 points27 points 3 years ago* (7 children) | Copy Link
Women (or other men, but this is a notion that targets especially women) are not responsible for the LV behavior of a grown up man. Enablers are bad but the main issues are the abusers. Don’t let them gaslight you into blameshifting.
[–]sstenaFDS Apprentice38 points39 points40 points 3 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link
I disagree with you partly, we don't send an abuser's mother to trial as the main culprit of his crime. That is extreme, and to me, it is also extreme to assume mothers have no responsibility over how their sons turn out.
I have seen a few families where the mother doesn't set boundaries for her son(s) who grow up lazy and entitled while his sister grows up cleaning, cooking, caring, studying and working.
Then when these sons get bulky with age and turn on their mothers they throw their hands up in the air. No, mam, you played a role in this.
Women don't do that out of malice but out of unconscious biases and a desire for her children to be safe, healthy and content. It just backfires, and it is very sad to me.
Mothers know their daughters' survival depends on them not being dependant on a man. And their sons' survival depends on them finding a woman who will do all the caring and emotional labor for him.
[–]willowgrowingrootsFDS Disciple2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
Your second paragraph is my ex & his family to a t so it resonates very much. Grown ups do walk around harmed by their FOOs, myself included. Yet when this harm is knowingly directed onto another person, the only one to be blamed is the abuser. Otherwise we assume people don’t have free will and/or full responsibility for their actions. There’s no doubt my ex’s serial cheating and lying flourished thanks to his mama’s 0 boundaries and loads of admiration, and I’m angry with her too. But as a grown up he needed to heal himself. No matter how people harmed us, that is not a reason to harm another uninvolved person. His mother should take her part of responsibility for his massively flawed character, but he was fully aware of his deeds. Just like I don’t go and cheat on my bfs due to my childhood trauma (which my parents are 100% in charge of). Edit: his father is also a BIG part of the problem but I’ve noticed that I tend to blame his mom, and after much reflection I understood that it happens thanks to internalized misogyny.. Edit2: sorry if I sound angry, I’m trying to direct my anger rightfully and I have a hard time with people in my family who minimize abuse. So if my tone is harsh it’s definitely not upon you.
[–]pineycitrusforestFDS Newbie0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link
No one ever talks about the role of the father, though. It's always the mom's fault. Boys follow the example set by their dad, and if dad sees his wife as a servant, so will his sons.
[–]sstenaFDS Apprentice3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Nobody said it's the mom's fault. We are having a nuanced conversation about mothers now, though. We do talk about the roles of fathers in this sub, just not right now in this comment thread.
[–]pineycitrusforestFDS Newbie0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
It's not a nuanced enough discussion if it leaves out the role of the father. Why, even in this sub, are mothers being villified for their sons behavior, but the fathers are off the hook as usual?
[–]sstenaFDS Apprentice1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I really disagree with you. So let me ask you this: do you think women play no role whatsoever in how their sons turn out and if they do we shouldn't talk about it?
[–]pineycitrusforestFDS Newbie5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
I never said that. I'm saying I am dead tired of women in society being blamed for everything and it's disappointing to see, even here, women blamed and the fault of men left out of the conversation entirely. And men are certainly going to have more of a role when we are talking about raising sons. Sons tend to emulate their father's behavior.
[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
People worry how they raise their daughters so that they are perceived positively by men/are what men want.
People dont worry how they raise their sons in how they can potentially be harmful towards women.
[–]halfwaysFDS Newbie7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
For real though...
[–]sagenjaxFDS Newbie5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
SAY THAT!!
[–]JesusisKingisLordFDS STRATEGY COACH1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Wow, this is perspective.
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[–][deleted] 133 points134 points135 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]lagomlagumeFDS Newbie18 points19 points20 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Selena33321Throwaway Account2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]MixWideFDS Newbie324 points325 points326 points (19 children) | Copy Link
[–]sstenaFDS Apprentice145 points146 points147 points (8 children) | Copy Link
[–]SlumberAddictFDS Newbie81 points82 points83 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]DangerousRiver9FDS Newbie85 points86 points87 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]CB4lifeFDS Newbie47 points48 points49 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]DangerousRiver9FDS Newbie22 points23 points24 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]PooPooMeeksFDS Newbie4 points5 points6 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]DangerousRiver9FDS Newbie10 points11 points12 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]PooPooMeeksFDS Newbie4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Inspection-CriticalFDS Apprentice77 points78 points79 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]QuodpotFDS Newbie14 points15 points16 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Inspection-CriticalFDS Apprentice15 points16 points17 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]SlumberAddictFDS Newbie28 points29 points30 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]Inspection-CriticalFDS Apprentice20 points21 points22 points (0 children) | Copy Link
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[–]WTFseriouslyWTHFDS Newbie97 points98 points99 points (13 children) | Copy Link
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[–]SlumberAddictFDS Newbie5 points6 points7 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]FitncurlyFDS Apprentice0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
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[–]sstenaFDS Apprentice38 points39 points40 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]willowgrowingrootsFDS Disciple2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]pineycitrusforestFDS Newbie0 points1 point2 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]sstenaFDS Apprentice3 points4 points5 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]pineycitrusforestFDS Newbie0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]sstenaFDS Apprentice1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]pineycitrusforestFDS Newbie5 points6 points7 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]halfwaysFDS Newbie7 points8 points9 points (0 children) | Copy Link
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[–]JesusisKingisLordFDS STRATEGY COACH1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link