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[–]pickmieshaexorcistFDS Apprentice308 points309 points310 points 3 years ago (67 children) | Copy Link
It just shows that men hate women. Misogyny is pervasive and ancient. I always wonder how it started, and why it’s so ubiquitous across cultures. I can’t wrap my mind around why the males of a species would hate and oppress the females of their own species. And yeah there’s theories that misogyny took off with the rise of Abrahamic religions, but you find it where there they don’t have those religions.
[–][deleted] 238 points239 points240 points 3 years ago (28 children) | Copy Link
I read once in a book that the reason men have hated women throughout history is two-fold:
(1) Women have the ability to "control" a man's body and thoughts--men have invasive sexual thoughts and can't control getting erect at the sight of an attractive woman, and they hate that she has that "power" over him without even trying. This is why some men accuse women of acting promiscuous for totally innocent things, the implication being that men are slaves to their biology
(2) Women can create life, and there would be no human civilization without us. As much as men insist they're superior, women have the ability that is closest to a "God," which is the ability to create life and live to tell the tale. Men have been trying to put us down for centuries, coming up with all sorts of lies to justify why we're inferior, so that they can trick us into forgetting about this incredible ability. Of course not all women are able to have kids but that doesn't change the fact that we are genetic powerhouses. We're far more resilient to disease, have a higher pain threshold, etc
Can't remember what book it was, but these points were pretty interesting imo
[–]Queen_Of_Ashes_FDS Newbie123 points124 points125 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
I think also
3) Men are genetically stronger than women which has helped them physically beat them down for centuries when women did something men didn’t like. Being physically stronger was interpreted as “better” in monkey-brain world when that once mattered. Now men can’t beat women without (hopefully) getting sent to jail but the idea of “I’m bigger and stronger and from an evolutionary standpoint that’s always helped me be better than you” has disappeared, but the mindset of “men are better than women” remains.
[–][deleted] 56 points57 points58 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
idk if that's disappeared, the number of times I've seen some variation of this thought: when society breaks down, women will be beholden to men again/women will be cattle/fantasizing about rape, harems, murder, etc.
[–]Queen_Of_Ashes_FDS Newbie21 points22 points23 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Ugh that’s a disgusting thought.
[–][deleted] 22 points23 points24 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
it is. sometimes I look at 4chan when I'm feeling masochistic and it is WIDESPREAD in spaces where men talk to each other without women around.
[–]kwallioFDS Newbie11 points12 points13 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Honestly I think law and order protects men more than women. Men have to sleep sometime.
[–]siberiansummerFDS Disciple34 points35 points36 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I think so too. We are not allowed to live the way WE want, we were always told how to live. I often see manosphere and pickmeishas saying "Women were happier in the house!" That shit makes me laugh. I spent a year at home after giving birth, it was the most miserable year of my life! I'm much happier being a corporate slave lol
[–]Queen_Of_Ashes_FDS Newbie15 points16 points17 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Ahahah you know what, ME TOO!
[–]FitncurlyFDS Apprentice59 points60 points61 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Even my husband agreed that this is a likely reason behind worldwide misogyny—men are envious of our life-giving power and our sexual power.
[–][deleted] 83 points84 points85 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Yeah I've heard tons of men say "women live life on easy mode" just because we "can have sex anytime we want," as if that's something that's necessary to survive. Ridiculous
[–]Queen_Of_Ashes_FDS Newbie37 points38 points39 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
For men, sex will always be the most important thing in their life. Certainly it was from an evolutionary standpoint. I hope we’re on the cusp of seeing evolution past “bby want sum fuk”
[–]suspended_animation_FDS Newbie30 points31 points32 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
On point number 1- My ex used to whine and complain about how "unfair" it is that women turn men on. Poor baby.. Lol
[–]Queen_Of_Ashes_FDS Newbie11 points12 points13 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
Urgh. Ex is an ex for a reason eh?
[–]suspended_animation_FDS Newbie17 points18 points19 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
He's turned me off from men altogether
[–]Queen_Of_Ashes_FDS Newbie9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Ah, I see we dated the same man. Haha
[–]jackrusselterror1FDS Disciple6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
He must get around a lot, I dated him too apparently, lol
[–]Queen_Of_Ashes_FDS Newbie2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Lol what a JERK
[–]suspended_animation_FDS Newbie7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Was he a 5' 2" manlet?
[–]Queen_Of_Ashes_FDS Newbie3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
No, a 5’10” emotional abuser :/ maybe they’re friends
[–]suspended_animation_FDS Newbie6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
How can they have friends at all? They are so rotten.
[+][deleted] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
[deleted]
[–]--wellDAM--FDS Apprentice66 points67 points68 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I know which is more satisfying for me as a woman.
[–][deleted] 43 points44 points45 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yep, there's videos of guys trying those "labor pain simulators" and "period cramps simulators" on YouTube and they wimp out after like 2 min lol
[–]lluuniFDS Newbie63 points64 points65 points 3 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link
It’s biology, men are just more narcissistic. It’s really that simple. It’s the reason why they enjoy violence and sadism. It’s why they can’t empathize with women. It’s why they believe they are better than women. Their biology forces them to be violent, narcissistic, hypersexual, and hypercompetitive.
We like to pretend that it’s socialization, but it’s not. Socialization may contribute to their misogyny, but it’s not the primary cause. They’ve treated us like this in every culture for all of history. It’s not possible for such universal behavior to be socialized when so many of those ancient cultures never even had contact with each other. We as women need to start being realistic about men if we ever want to protect ourselves.
[–]Queen_Of_Ashes_FDS Newbie44 points45 points46 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I just wish men would also be realistic about men. I’m tired of all us women screaming at the top of our lungs “THIS IS SEXIST” and only a few men taking note while most men deny, deny, deny.
See: was just commenting on a post that was stereotypical “girl does dumb thing, boy does clever thing” meme (surely you’ve seen them?). When I and another female poster pointed out it was sexist we got downvoted because it’s “just a joke” and “not harming anybody.”
No. It’s not harming men. So then it must be harmless. Fucking BULLSHIT.
[–]weasted_FDS Newbie3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
Oml I just watched a Bollywood movie which portrayed women to be either really stupid, or cunning people who are gold diggers and have no passions of their own other than shopping. I was literally irritated 20 mins into the movie, because the way the female characters were framed implied that the shitty misogynistic2 attitudes their boyfriends had towards them were justified.
(For anyone that's asking the movie's name is Pyaar Ka Punchnama 2. )
[–]neon-riotThrowaway Account0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I wonder about this...nature vs nurture in men's misogyny. There are matriarchal cultures like the Mosuo in China that contradict this. Granted they are a minority in a larger trend of humanity existing as a sexist patriarchy.
I think our species (men and women) would flourish if women were in charge...not equal...IN CHARGE.
[–]PottyMouthxFDS Newbie53 points54 points55 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I think men are dependent on women for things they want (sex, emotional support, offspring, home) and men need women more than women need men.
They fear to lose these things, so they resort to abuse and manipulation to get and keep what they want.
[–][deleted] 25 points26 points27 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yeah once you take away the "Build house. Make money. Chase bears away" type things than men provide and do that for yourself... Of course they're upset. Now they have to be pleasant people to get a wife, which is difficult for a lot of them.
[–]husheveryoneFDS Apprentice98 points99 points100 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Misogyny is why. Well said. Eleanor Roosevelt was one of many women in history who’ve known this to be true: “Do what you feel in your heart to be right – for you'll be criticized anyway.”
[–]--wellDAM--FDS Apprentice70 points71 points72 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
The Roosevelt’s were fucking bomb. She made her husband create a gigantic daycare program for the working moms who held the economy in the early 40s.
They tried to have taxpayer funded universal healthcare, which we will now never see. The Roosevelt administration tried TONS of stuff to get the economy fixed and to get power out of the hands of the robber baron upper class. They were fucking heroes, and minced no words.
We need another 12 year run of that administration.
[–]neon-riotThrowaway Account23 points24 points25 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
God I think about this all the time! We need Teddy to bust the Trusts of Amazon, Apple, Google etc. There is no moral justification for a system that creates multi-billionaires.
[–]--wellDAM--FDS Apprentice22 points23 points24 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Stealing. From. The. Workers.
[–]shmarharFDS Newbie46 points47 points48 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I've mentioned it before on another post, but I recommend reading "The Chalice and the Blade" by Riane Eisler. Very enlightening book on the rise of misogyny and the displacing of women who were previously central to ancient societies. And yes, it does predate the Abrahamic religions. Those religions provide a rationale for women-hate but they didn't exactly create it. There's a very interesting part where the author discusses how the original texts of both Judaism and Christianity were heavily edited at some point to make them more male-dominant, for example removing references to Yahweh's wife, the "Queen of Heaven."
[–]QuodpotFDS Newbie1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Thanks for the book suggestion! I just started it and it's really interesting already
[–]sugaredberryFDS Newbie31 points32 points33 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I’m guessing that it was caused by “muh penis” and them being larger than us
[–]throwawayneverminditFDS Disciple60 points61 points62 points 3 years ago* (8 children) | Copy Link
I know you're about to get inundated with theories that make misogyny out to be a response to some kind of cool power women have, like men are just jealous or something, but those are bullshit.
We can't "create life" any more than men can, in fact it's very convenient for them that they are not the gestating sex because gestation is a huge drain on bodily resources and very risky.
Sex appeal isn't power and they know it. If it was do-able to leverage it in a way that got us significant social power it'd be done by now, trying that avenue is nothing new.
There is no fEmInIne PoWeR for men to be jealous of... power is power, we mostly have less of it.
The answer is simpler and more definitively negative than people want it to be: what we read as "misogyny" is basically just there to help them control us sexually and reproductively, both for the sexual/repro benefits, and because it helps them regulate sexual resource competition amongst themselves, which makes life less dangerous for them.
Coveting an exploitable resource =/= wanting to have the traits of the resource yourself.
+ There's a side of typical in-group/out-group politics.
They're able to get away with exerting this kind of control because they're bigger/more aggressive than we are, more effective bullies - the reality of that permeates even the most "civilized" aspects of society.
It's not that complicated, deep or mysterious.
[–]QuodpotFDS Newbie5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
I don't see these ideas as mutually exclusive. Humans are complicated
[–]throwawayneverminditFDS Disciple15 points16 points17 points 3 years ago* (5 children) | Copy Link
Entertain yourself with at best non-foundational, at worst mythical causes if you want. Don't blame me when your solutions prove ineffectual because the diagnosis was ever-so-subtly off.
Maybe in some modest % of men the desire to control women as a reproductive resource, when frustrated, manifests in these kinds of ways. But it is a modest %, and the underlying cause is still the desire to control women as a reproductive resource. The rest is just a series of psychological permutations of that. It's dressing.
Most misogynistic men don't even experience misogyny as active hatred IME. It's honestly colder than that. Ex. The reason why the way terms like "prude" and "slut" keep women on a contradictory tightrope is because they're used opportunistically, by individual men, as directional commands to try and get women to manifest the sexual behavior that man wants to see in the moment.
Occam's razor and experience of reality should be enough to make it obvious that most men are quite content not being the ones to push watermelonheads out their genitals, and women that trade primarily on sex appeal don't tend to be the people ruling the world.
But a lot of men will jump right behind these kinds of theories 'cause they keep women barking up the wrong tree/pursuing influence in areas with very limited potential.
[–]QuodpotFDS Newbie1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
It's definitely more of a subconscious thing in the vast majority of people. Never said it was an active hatred - although active hatred can also obviously be found in a lot of cases, as a basic Google search would show you
I'm not going to read all that, but I will say that I disagree that these kind of arguments are "barking up the wrong tree" and honestly it's pretty narrow-minded of you to think that way, especially considering that most of the history of women is forgotten. I just started a book called "The Chalice and the Blade" somebody else in this thread suggested, and it's got a lot of archaeologically-backed theories of the way that most prehistoric cultures viewed women, which is very very different than societies in the past several millenia have treated us. Even if not every single fact is correct (everything regarding history needs to be taken with a grain of salt, obviously) it's still useful to think about the issue from multiple possible perspectives, since the truth is usually a little bit of everything.
Honestly, your ideas seem pretty firmly entrenched in very black and white thinking, and I'm not sure why you're being so hostile 🤷♀️
[–]throwawayneverminditFDS Disciple7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link
Confidence in one's ideas =/= hostility.
And most of what I've said has very little to do with history of how women have been viewed lol. Most of what you've said def. shows you didn't read me.
(Like I guess I might speculate that silly shit like the concept of women being "life givers" in contrast to men might have proliferated more before reproductive biology - ex the fact that semen is a necessary ingredient in "creating life" - was widely understood... but we're so far past that understanding of how things work that it'd hardly have much to do with modern misogynists. + If envying women as creators made more sense then, and envying women is what causes misogyny, wouldn't you expect more gender inequality then, instead of less? Gender inequality seems to have become more consistent/common and organized in human groups through and after the Neolithic revolution and I feel like it'd be hard to miss the no babby without semen connection as agriculturalists.)
Male dominance is common in a whole lotta primate relatives of ours that probably aren't quite sentient enough to conceptually envy stuff like reproductive traits and there IS evidence of it having been a thing throughout human history - the degree varied but human females have never lived in a sexual violence and control free world. Why? Males' sexual and reproductive interests + men are bigger and might makes right (in the minds of the mighty anyway...) Of course how that surfaces would vary over time and across cultures? But the underlying cause is very consistent.
The fact remains that solid evidence for popular origin stories of misogyny like "womb envy" even really being things is scarce af. There are better, surer, less neo-Freudian explanations. Listen, or don't.
If you're going to read the Eisler book I suggest you make sure to read critiques of it because it skews Sex At Dawn-level idealistic in its interpretation of facts. The fact that ancient people carved and carried around rocks with big boobs and labia doesn't tell us nearly as much as some want it to about how ACTUAL women were treated in ancient societies. It's also old as hell.
[–]shmarharFDS Newbie3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I get what you're saying, but the Eisler book doesn't claim men took power because of womb envy. She says they took power because they wanted power ("worshiping the 'blade'"). She actually discusses much of what you do--how and when certain groups of violent men decided to dominate and use women as technologies of reproduction and then conquer other civilizations and immediately, aggressively impose that paradigm. Yes, it's largely theoretical--it has to be since it deals with ancient human history, and there is a distinct lack of written material by women or about women's lives.
In regards to primates--we're equally distantly related to both Chimps and Bonobos. Chimps are patriarchal. Bonobos are not. Just food for thought.
However, you are correct in saying we should take these theories with a grain of salt. I'd love any other recommendations you have. Is there an FDS book thread somewhere?
[–]throwawayneverminditFDS Disciple1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yeah, I wasn't responding specifically to the arguments in the Eisler book so much as to the direction I know people take these discussions in. :)
WRT Bonobos, they're less male-dominant than Chimps by far, but I've seen it pointed out that the tendency of female Bonobos to defuse conflict with sexual contact can still be interpreted as sex in response to pressure. If we were to totally anthropomorphize, it could be construed as coercive, and still not necessarily something to idealize.
I'll try and compile some book reccs and post them later, either here or in another more appropriate thread (will try and remember to tag you if I do).
[–]goblinwiseauFDS Newbie1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You nailed it!
[–]suspended_animation_FDS Newbie14 points15 points16 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Testosterone has really screwed with their brains
[–]IwantyoualltoBEDAVEFDS Newbie1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Reproductive jealousy. Men cannot deal with the fact women control life. They get anxiety because if women chose it, we could end them.
[+]cutestainFDS Newbie-36 points-35 points-34 points 3 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
Wait from Cardi B (a woman who admitted to drugging and robbing men) to Abrahamic religions. You lost me. This sub is usually good.
This post is absurd at best.
[–]pickmieshaexorcistFDS Apprentice29 points30 points31 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
So you think that because Cardi B is shitty, misogyny doesn’t exist. My post was perfectly clear; you are being deliberately obtuse.
[+]cutestainFDS Newbie-29 points-28 points-27 points 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
You can't imagine any reason besides misogyny that men hate Cardi B? And i am being obtuse?
Come on now. That's just ridiculous. This whole thread is borderline crazytown. The opposite of what is usually posted here.
[–]pickmieshaexorcistFDS Apprentice33 points34 points35 points 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
I’m hesitant to even respond because you’re obviously not here in good faith. So let’s break it down for you, Barney-style:
Zeroing in on Cardi while ignoring the rest of the list. 🙄 It’s not about Cardi; replace her with any famous woman. If you think famous, successful women aren’t treated more harshly and under more scrutiny due to misogyny then you are blind. Your profile tells me you’re in tech and and an entrepreneur of some kind. You’re really telling me that you’ve never experienced this? I doubt it.
Discussing misogyny in a broad sense is not my tacit endorsement of everything these particular women have ever done, or that every woman has ever done. Acknowledging misogyny doesn’t mean I think women are angels.
Calling a discussion about misogyny “crazytown” and clutching your pearls about the state of this sub really makes me give you the side eye.
[+]cutestainFDS Newbie-8 points-7 points-6 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
i'm absolutely here in good faith and usually am impressed by this group. That is why this thread is surprising.
I don't know the others on the list. You are making assumptions that just aren't true.
I am certain I understand the effects of misogyny better than most of the young women here precisely b/c I have worked in tech for 20 years.
But none of that means that poorly behaving women should be praised here. I find drugging and robbing people abhorrent. So, yes I think it is crazytown to suggest that she is great and there is no reason to be down on Cardi B.
But keep judging me. That is reasonable.
[–]hazelbroomFDS Newbie13 points14 points15 points 3 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link
Those "people" were men trying to coerce a woman they deemed vulnerable financially into prostitution with money. They were trying to commit abhorrent crimes against her. They deserved a lot worse.
[–]alivebut-justbarelyFDS Apprentice7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Wooooahhhh I had no idea. OF COURSE there's more to the story than just "Cardi B drugged and robbed men". When that came out the were posts about it on the front page every day full of men talking shit about her because that's what happens on reddit anytime a woman commits a crime typically committed by men. But they never mentioned why she did it. Typical reddit scrotes.
[–]alivebut-justbarelyFDS Apprentice9 points10 points11 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Nobody is defending Cardi B drugging and robbing men, but you can easily replace her name with another female rapper who is open about her sexuality and everything still applies. Men hate women and they hate our sexuality even though they are obsessed with it.
[–]pickmieshaexorcistFDS Apprentice7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Also, nobody on this thread said Cardi B is "great". I can't even with this one.
[–]alivebut-justbarelyFDS Apprentice5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Unrelated but I love your username 😂💖
[–]habsbdbjfFDS Newbie-3 points-2 points-1 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I agree 100%, this post is way off
[+]cutestainFDS Newbie-7 points-6 points-5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yep I left this sub for good. If man hating just to man hate is part of it, I want no part. And mods seem cool with it. Now I know.
I was here for the high value woman behavior and understanding and even calling out the LVM behavior.
I'm not into defending disgusting behavior whether it is from a man or woman. The majority of women commenting in this thread are not my tribe. Bye.
[–]cantstopthemachine77FDS Newbie161 points162 points163 points 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
And males on reddit actually compare Cardi to bill cosby because she admitted to drugging clients to rob them in the past, because getting robbed is totally the same as getting raped 🙄 /s
[–]jupiter_sunstoneFDS Newbie30 points31 points32 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
I got into with someone over this exact thing. Rape >theft plus men were paying her to exploit her body, they got what they deserved.
[–]cantstopthemachine77FDS Newbie23 points24 points25 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
There have been 3 different replies to this either from pickmeaisha or scrotes that got removed, 1 that slipped through and is who the other person in this thread replied to, and 2 that were deleted before they could be posted, but I could see some of the comment in my notification previews and they were saying it is the same thing or at least that there is a comparison to be made.
It’s like dudes that use “divorce rape” as a term, males really believe any money coming out of their pocket is akin to rape, I’m surprised they don’t call it tax rape. Oh, probably because it doesn’t allow them to blame, and talk shit about women
[–]jupiter_sunstoneFDS Newbie10 points11 points12 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Oh the tea is hot tonight!
[+][deleted] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
[removed]
[–]heythere360FDS Apprentice40 points41 points42 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You can’t make the comparison because men only pretend to care about the worthless prostitute hiring vermin that Cardi robbed.
If a man came up to another man and said “ugh the stripper I harassed and paid to have sex with robbed me!!” No one would give a shit because if you play sick illegal games you win sick illegal prizes.
Not defending the action simply calling out the double standard, gaslighting and hypocrisy of men. These same men who dragged Cardi said Cosby’s accusations weren’t that bad or “in the past”.
You don’t have to like Cardi or what she did. But don’t ignore why women are constantly bashed for breathing wrong while male predators are constantly protected and celebrated.
[–]purziveplaxyFDS Newbie106 points107 points108 points 3 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link
People are not buying houses with OnlyFans can we please fucking stop acting like they are. My Facebook friends are selling nudes for $7. The value of naked pussy is plummeting.
Otherwise right on I appreciate the rest of this sentiment.
[–][deleted] 94 points95 points96 points 3 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
Yep I read one of the top OnlyFans models makes $100k a year...that's less than my salary but she experiences significantly more stress, harassment, and judgement than I do, plus it's completely unsustainable. I feel so bad for the women who turn to OnlyFans out of necessity, it's such a horrible predatory industry
[–]purziveplaxyFDS Newbie50 points51 points52 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
That is a significant salary though, I'm sure it's pretty rare. And oh yeah it is predatory, the owner of that site makes a ton of money he's essentially an online pimp.
[–][deleted] 45 points46 points47 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Exactly, she's in the top 0.001% so I expected her to be making much more given she's one of the top performers! She could've had the same salary with a graduate degree in finance but without the horrible PTSD, it's so terrible how they've made it look like a fun easy thing to do
[–][deleted] 33 points34 points35 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
thanks for posting this, it's tiring seeing men complain about how so many women are becoming millionaires through onlyfans. 🙄
[–][deleted] 35 points36 points37 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
It's all propaganda! There was an AMA on reddit from a woman claiming to have made more on OnlyFans than with her previous job. In her post, she says she got laid off in January due to COVID, but that only started happening in the US around March. The whole post was extremely fishy and a number of commenters pointed out the inconsistencies, very scary
[–][deleted] 31 points32 points33 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
ooh that's interesting. so it's basically an effort to trick more women into sex work... shocker.
[–]onemoredaydreamFDS Newbie26 points27 points28 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Right, and a career that will probably only last 5 years tops
[–]Inspection-CriticalFDS Newbie32 points33 points34 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
completely unsustainable
Ten years ago, I had a friend who was a stripper in her late 20s. I said, "So what's the game plan?" Stripping is a tough gig for all the reasons you just outlined, and of course you can't do it forever. She didn't have a plan for what would come after and didn't want to talk about it so I had to drop it.
[–][deleted] 38 points39 points40 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Yeah it's not good in the long term, hope your friend ended up okay. Another occupational hazard is being stalked and attacked, or even blackmailed when you start applying for other jobs. People will fire women from jobs if they have performed in adult entertainment in their past, they'll also ruin their relationships with potential boyfriends/husbands or girlfriends/wives. Really terrible
[–]Inspection-CriticalFDS Newbie50 points51 points52 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I've had two friends who were sex workers. They loved their jobs but my observation as an outsider was that it was brutal, degrading, dangerous work with no future in it. The libfem voices touting sex work as empowering and lucrative fail to mention the vast majority of women don't make fortunes, can't get ahead, and face violence on the job that most working women never do. Both my girlfriends shared stories with me that made the hair on the back of my neck go up, but they brushed it off as part of the job.
I'd add that both women endured horrific abuse and poverty in their childhoods. So I can understand how that would color their view of sex work as empowering. When you come from nothing, and you have no agency over your body, I can understand how making money from your body can seem like you're getting somewhere. I disagree with it, of course, but trauma is a mindfuck.
[–]notbasic4karenFDS Newbie10 points11 points12 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
What’s she doing now?
[–]Inspection-CriticalFDS Newbie44 points45 points46 points 3 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
I ran into her last year and she's still stripping. She's still living paycheck to paycheck, still dates toxic men, still has an unstable life. It sucks.
EDIT: "Paycheck to paycheck" is a figure of speech. Strippers don't get paychecks. You actually have to rent the stage on which you're performing, which means you're paying to work. Yes, you read that right. You also don't get any benefits, no paid time off for vacation or if you get injured, and of course you're not getting promotions like at other jobs. It's horrible what the sex industry is trying to sell to women as empowering.
[–]lskfjd743FDS Newbie34 points35 points36 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I conclude that men are a bunch of bitter bitches who can't be happy for no one (they don't even like it when other men get money, love, fame, or success!)
[–]Eat_Pant_b0ssFDS Newbie50 points51 points52 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
What I concluded from this is that women objectifying and degrading themselves the way that men do is the way they find to become a staple in pop culture and it disgusts me. Its bad enough when men do it to us but im deeply ashamed and angered to see us doing it to ourselves and then having it be celebrated by other women. We need to be holding ourselves as women accountable and stand against this super patriarchal crap topping the charts. WAP is just dehumanizing porn but in song form. Andrea Dworkin is rolling in her grave.
[–]habsbdbjfFDS Newbie11 points12 points13 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
thank you!!!1
[–]abstractsadgurlFDS Newbie6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
THIS
[–]rrrrrrrrrreallyFDS Newbie0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Girl this is the first time my broke ass has wanted to give someone gold.
The "feminist" movement of the last 15 years or so has made aggressive sexualization (usually in a way that panders to the male gaze) equivalent with empowerment and it's absolute bullshit.
I am more worried about the girls learning that than about the girls who were raised under repression of female sexuality. At least the latter doesn't put you in danger when you still need to operate in a world where men code sexual women as "whores" and are overwhelmingly okay with dehumanization of and violence against anyone they put in the "whore" category.
[–][deleted] 18 points19 points20 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Stupid people don’t make sense.
[–]Time_BarracudaFDS Newbie17 points18 points19 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Misogyny enables and justifies men oppressing women- its a self serving means to an end. If men saw women as equal humans it'd be a lot harder to subject us to the brutalities and deprivations that are historically part and parcel of being a woman. Believing women are dishonest, stupid, disloyal and generally less than human allows men to see their abuse as not only justified, but ethical.
[–]Wise-JellyFDS Newbie6 points7 points8 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Men continue to perpetuate misogyny and sexism because they want to. Even when they may not recognize their behavior as sexism, their sheer ignorance and defensive posturing when problematic thinking is called out prove this.
*Trigger warning* I was reading about Michael Jackson's past and apparently a close friend finally worked up the courage to ask why he invited young children to his "sleepovers" and said with so much at stake, why don't you stop?
He said, "I don't want to."
I think this really sums it up, men do not work to change these mindsets that benefit them.. because they don't want to.
They have the privilege and the power systemically- and they don't want that to change. That's why so many seemingly opposing things are hair triggers to their egos, they upset the status quo.
If they do appear "woke" from the outset in the fight for equality, usually there are still deep-rooted ways of thinking about women that they will continue to exploit. Then they will go on the offensive when called out when they were only trying to be "allies."
[–]siberiansummerFDS Disciple12 points13 points14 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I love Cardi but why the hell would she take that cheating scrote back?
[–]samarsharqiFDS Newbie12 points13 points14 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Men want women to be [promiscuous, rich, fun, maternal, sexy] unless they themselves are the direct and sole benefactors of it.
They hate women who are independent of their approval, and they hate women who are dependent on them for anything BUT approval.
[–]cutestainFDS Newbie45 points46 points47 points 3 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link
Wait are we really holding Cardi B up as a positive role model?
I would think any HVM wouldn't want to touch her with a 10 foot pole.
[–]pascalinesFDS Newbie81 points82 points83 points 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
I don’t think the post is about who is a positive role model. The post is about men’s contradictory misogyny. Even women who aren’t role models deserve to be free of male hatred.
[–]pickmieshaexorcistFDS Apprentice42 points43 points44 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
It’s EXACTLY about the contradictions. Zeroing in on Cardi B is disingenuous. Substitute any famous woman for her and the post is still true.
[–][deleted] 30 points31 points32 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
And what bugs me the most is how male rappers say just as graphic if not more graphic things, have way more sexualized videos, and cheat/abuse women in their lives left and right. Like please, quit hating on Cardi and Meg thee for this
[+]cutestainFDS Newbie-7 points-6 points-5 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Didn't say male anything about male rappers being great.
Beginning to realize this sub is not about powerful, positive woman treating themselves with respect. But instead pretty hateful and trashy. Sad.
[–]rivkadiditFDS Newbie4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
They took down all our radical feminist sanctuaries so we will need to educate the girls here. Don't give up yet.
[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I think you misunderstood. I was talking about society in general giving male rappers a pass but dogging on Cardi and Meg. Not you lol. But I get your sentiment. Cardi B is DEFINITELY not a role model.
[–]rivkadiditFDS Newbie1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
It still comes off that way whether that's the intention or not and these women co-sign on prostitution and that's just not okay.
[+]cutestainFDS Newbie-18 points-17 points-16 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Uh. She admitted to drugging and robbing men. It might not be misogyny in this case. I personally find her positively disgusting and it is not b/c of misogyny.
https://www.vox.com/culture/2019/3/27/18284220/cardi-b-drug-rob-controversy-scandal
[–]beautysubthrowwFDS Newbie30 points31 points32 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Yeah I 100% agree with the sentiment in this post but let's not forget Cardi took back her SO after he cheated.
[–]honeybeerollFDS Disciple22 points23 points24 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
What I was going to comment. I like cardi b but she's not like, the best person lol, and I wouldn't call any woman who stays with a man who not only cheated, but embarassed her in front of the entire world by letting that fact get out, a good mother. Part of being a good mother is showing your children how to have self worth and protect it.
[–]Pumpkinhead82FDS Newbie-1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
You’re being a little hard on her. Her kid isn’t in danger as far as we know. Sometimes it takes a while for people to leave these types of situations. I just hope she makes the best decision for her peace of mind in the end.
[–]honeybeerollFDS Disciple1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I didn't say her kid was in imminent danger. My point is she's showing her daughter it's okay to accept disrespect from men.
Many women on this sub talk about the negative influence their mother's relationship w/ their father, stepfather, and/or their moms attitudes about men had on them. Your mother and father/stepfather is the first male to female relationship you see, and it's one you see in intimate detail for years potentially. It has a huge impact on you and your concept of what a relationship should be like.
Cardi herself even said something like this in her Harper's bazaar interview. That was when she was split from offset last year. She said something like she can't just do whatever she wants w/ guys bc she has a kid to think about. Now she wasn't specifically talking about her estranged husband, but she's aware what she does with men has an affect on her daughter. You stay with a cheater, it says to your daughter she should accept cheating, and if you have a son, it tells him it's okay to cheat because women will get over it.
[–]shiftgearautomaticThrowaway Account16 points17 points18 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
She got into stripping to escape an extremely abusive relationship, then pivoted to social media, reality TV, rapping, and is now a millionaire.
Obviously she isn’t a perfect role model for women whose lives are already going well, but she’s done a hell of a lot better making it out of poverty and abuse than I would have done.
[–]rivkadiditFDS Newbie5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I get what OP is trying to say but, this is liberal feminism aka PickMe Feminism.
Cardi B and Megan Thee Stallion and any other woman in power endorsing pornography, prostitution, stripping, and other forms of female exploitation are not helping women's cause.
They are selling the idea that being an escort is empowering and that's just a lie. A sexist, backwards, brainwashy, misogynistic lie.
[–]crypytotoadsFDS Newbie5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
They all have the same few personality disorders?
[–]LieberAalFDS Apprentice7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
That they are not only hateful, but also really stupid. Which is curious, since I always thought that men were the lOgIcAl gender ;-)
[+][deleted] 3 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]rivkadiditFDS Newbie3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Exactly. Mods removed my comment for saying that Cardi B and Megan Thee Stallion are endorsing pornagraphy, prostitution, stripping, and indirect sex trafficking.
And Cardi B paid Blood gang members to beat up two women, one of which her husband had an affair with.
She's also extremely racist towards Black women. She berated and verbally abused a Black makeup artist for no reason.
[–]Suspicious_TrickFDS Newbie1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Been going on for centuries. Check out the poem “Hombres necios que acusáis”
[–]AdisssaThrowaway Account0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
What a paradox..
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Women are just objects for them to use and view however they want 😠 sad because is the US people we have so many more freedoms than other places but the male mindset is still the same here even if legally we have more rights and they have been forced to think differently.. it’s still the same though
[–]BorderComprehensiveThrowaway Account0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
PREACH. Omg
[–]sadcelloFDS Apprentice0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Will the day majority of women finally realize and accept that men hate women come soon? I hope so.
[–]rivkadiditFDS Newbie2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
No, because the mods of the subreddit literally censor critical feminism.
They removed my comment for saying that Cardi B and Megan Thee Stallion are endorsing pornagraphy, prostitution, stripping, and indirect sex trafficking.
© TheRedArchive 2024. All rights reserved.created by /u/dream-hunter
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