I don't really have a friend that I can sincerely talk to so I wanna share with you guys here, English is not my mother tongue so please forgive my mistakes.
A little bit of background : We met in high school and we were in a relationship ever since, we had broken up once for 6 months in 5 years ago but we got back together eventually. She's innocent and overprotected by her parents. I'm a nice guy but I love parties and having fun. We had amazing times and memories together and we had never got into a fight with each other, since I was always making concessions. She wanna keep her virginity for wedding and always acted like she was abused when I'm about to penetrate. So I respected her decision and enjoyed sex without penetration
Recently, she was working 2 jobs and cant seems to find the time for me. I understood that but I still tried find chances to meet such as dinners or weekends. Then I found out she acted cold to me, I sincerely asked her if she has something to talk about. As always, we can never have a deep conversation since she's always end up crying or staying silent. I thought it might be the stress she has from work so I planned a trip for 2 of us. We both had fun in the trip, but she continued to act the same when we got back to our daily grind. As this time I really had a bad feeling about that.
Then one day she asked me to design her company's website, I was checking her phone for a logo then suddenly she deleted a conversation and I saw that. The day after I got into her account despite she has changed her password. I found out she was talking with her manager for a while and asked him out that night. I've gone insane and trying to catch her in hand but I cant. The day after I met her for a talk, she denied and said that they was just colleagues having dinner together. I said I wanna break up because our relationship recently has no sex, no time spent together, and now my faith in her love is also lost. She cried and admitted she was having sex with him but only for one time. I felt so pity for her because the guy that she having affairs with is married and he even had a kid. She knew that but she cannot help herself. I still loved her so much and it hurts like hell, but I know one thing that I can't continue with this toxic relationship. I don't wanna ruin her life and that fucker's family so I didn't tell anybody about this even her parents.
Maybe I cared for her feeling so much I ended up being a dumb fuck.
It is so hard keeping it to myself, I think it would be better to write it down here.
TL;DR! : 7 years girlfriend cheated on me with a married man
[–]atiqLegend1334 points35 points36 points (4 children) | Copy Link
7 years of no sex relationship..😂😂 that's the painful part.
[–]NoCharism18 points19 points20 points (0 children) | Copy Link
and then she allows another man to penetrate her, while telling him that she wants to be a virgin lol
moden women have a disgusting mindset
[–]FritzLn3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
For him. I suspect this isn't actually the time she lost her virginity.
[–]Vafster2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
😂
[–]Chakra_Devourer14 points15 points16 points (0 children) | Copy Link
Hopefully he can stop being a sim-panzee after this experience.
She's fucking the other guy more than one time. Don't believe the bitch.
She's getting hammered harder than a jackhammer pounding against a pavement, and this guy here is acting like his girlfriend is a harmless, pure angel. AHAHAHA!
[–]Strypes46868 points9 points10 points (1 child) | Copy Link
The comments section....
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Gee,I Wonder........
[–]ThirstySasquatch3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
Ive never seen a comment section with so many removed posts
[–]pilotmgtow2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
I would straight off tell her parents first lol. We need to call out these whores... not that it would do anything good but still it's the principle. Her mom is probably the same. AWALT gentlemen.
[–]Astral-Projector1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
HAHSHSHAHHAHAHSJDJFJHAGGSYAHAHGAGAGGAHAJAHAHAJHAJSJAJSJAJHAHAHAJHAHAHAHAHAHHAHSHFJFJDGAHSGEYSHHAHAJHAHAHAH
[–]xeroxe1 point2 points3 points (19 children) | Copy Link
She cheated on him, lied for 7 years, she is obviously using him about something, but he doesn't want to ruin her life. God, when did everyone become such wimps?
[–]FritzLn0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
It's only because she has a vagina. Biological programming
He'd stab his brother through the heart for her
[–]Shiva-The_Destroyer0 points1 point2 points (17 children) | Copy Link
Because it won't make him feel any better, it's just more drama. Revenge and escalation is for women and children. Real men walk away and don't look back.
[–]xeroxe0 points1 point2 points (16 children) | Copy Link
Radically disagree, and it's harmful to you and to others to propagate such a submissive mindset, much worse attributing it to "real men".
Revenge it's not about making you feel better emotionally — in fact it does — but it's practically beneficial because it sends a message to all future wrong doers that there are consequences for crossing your path. The prime reason that keeps people in line are consequences. Keep turning the other cheek for some time, and no one will have a reason why to refrain them-selves from walking all over you. Let no wrong go unredressed.
[–]Shiva-The_Destroyer0 points1 point2 points (15 children) | Copy Link
Fair enough. I admint you have some points. I have a different view on this subject though.
Depends strongly on the person I guess.
That's the critical point. For me this consequence looks like: "You wronged me, you'll never wrong me again, get the fuck out of my life!" and not "You hurt me, now I'll hurt you in return." That'S children's mentality and leads to a dark place I don't want to go. It just drags you down to their level.
There is a huge difference between seeking revenge and not turning the other cheek. Stand up for yourself. Draw a line. Set boundaries. That's sufficient enough self preservation most of the time.
Let god do the judgement! It's not my purpouse to punish and discipline people for morally wrong behaviour. Those people are their own worst enemies already. Karma will get them soon enough. When there are legal issues, go the way of the law!
[–]xeroxe0 points1 point2 points (14 children) | Copy Link
Sure there are exceptions, but in most of the cases retaliation is a pleasant experience.* There is a reason why vengeance is an insanely popular trope among movies, because it taps into the human nature of intense gratification when justice is served.
You have to understand that most aggressors couldn't care less if you would just walk away. Even if they slightly do care, the consequence should be proportional to the damage done. That is justice. Simply walking away is a very convenient punishment for an aggressor who wronged you tenfold. I would rather prey on you as a victim than someone as myself, because I already know that no matter how variably unjust I might act toward you, you will always provide a constant template punishment of just walking away.
Granted I used the wrong idiom here, but the point still remains: Having a merciful reputation devoid of retaliation power, will hardly discourage anyone from walking all over you.
It is precisely your job to that, there is no invisible man in the sky keeping score of who wronged you and getting back at them for you. It would be great almost fantastical to have such a powerful bodyguard free of charge. If we don't take care of it ourselves, no one will take care of it for us. We are not as important as we like to think for supernatural entities to look after us.
There is no such thing as Karma either. These are all wishful thinking designed to make us feel better about injustices of the world, much worse they are really harmful because it does paralyze us from taking concrete actions against injustice in the hope that some magical invisible force will do that for us.
Unfortunately law is very limited and it's only there for serious issues. There is a plethora of room for people to wrong you that is not encompassed legally.
*https://psycnet.apa.org/record/2016-52939-001
[–]Shiva-The_Destroyer0 points1 point2 points (13 children) | Copy Link
No, you got that wrong. If you could harm me, that's because I made a mistake, maybe I trusted you and in the future I won't make that mistake again.
I wouldn't say retaliation is a necessery element for this. Just don't let people walk all over you and if it happened once, don't let it happen again.
I consider myself an atheist. I don't believe in god as an entity but there is something to this concept. Everybody's action have consequences, visible or not. Justice will be served, one way or another.
Don't be so fast with your judgment here. God, Karma, these are ancient concepts and there is much likely more truth behind it than you think.
We are getting philosophically here pretty fast, haha. This is what I wrote about this some time ago:
We have a justice system to deal with conflicts. If everyone took his conflicts into his own hands we would have chaos. Everybody has a different oppinion what is just and what not. Self served justice often leads to escalation. That's why I see this kind of revenge thinking rather problematic.
[–]xeroxe0 points1 point2 points (12 children) | Copy Link
Most of the fragments you addressed are less important than the ones you left out, such as:
In essence, we have an emotional and a practical benefit to retaliate, and I have yet to see a good reason or counter-argument that discredits these two points, beside assertion that revenge is a childish behavior.
Now, I am emphasizing the keyword proportional here for the second time in order to differentiate between our positions because in last replies you seemed to embrace consequences as well by claiming that walking away is a sort of revenge/consequence. Obviously I agree that some reaction is better than no reaction at all — imagine if you wouldn't at least walk away — but a proportional reaction is what I am arguing for as the most rational and beneficial approach psychologically (1) and practically (2).
How does this invalidate the claim that I would rather happen to harm you than someone as myself? The point is that simply walking away isn't really a scary threat.
A proportional consequence is a necessary element if you want to fully utilize the beneficial capacity of (2). If the consequence is less than the damage done, hence dis-proportionally insufficient, then it would always be worth for your aggressors to gamble by harming you, because their net gain will almost always end up positive.
All other variables being equal, the person that employs point (2) has a better chance of dis-persuading people from harming him rather than the other one who has a merciful reputation devoid of retaliation power. Remember I am not arguing against your other techniques of self-preservation, instead I am arguing for retaliation advantages (2), which can also be used in conjunction with those other techniques delivering a greater cumulative outcome.
"don't let it happen again" — And how exactly you plan to achieve that? Becoming a ghost and following each step of your future partner? The more efficient way to achieve this (using the framework of this discussion) is by the threat of the proportional consequence (2) instead of simply walking away.
Are we living on the same planet? Most of the injustice since the dawn of man will get away without repercussions. This is so self-evident and empirically demonstrable it sounds like a waste of time debating over this. 14000 kids die every day, most of them in terrible pain from starvation and curable diseases. 6 million deaths during holocaust. Hundred millions killed under the communist regimes. Billions of innocents wiped off the face of the earth because natural disasters. And don't forget to read about the horrors of Unit 731. Where is the justice here exactly? It's precisely what a said, wishful thinking designed to make us feel better about the horrors of reality.
If there is some truth behind it, it's because of earthly flesh-and-blood men who carried out the principles I am advocating for in this discussion, not some magical supernatural intervention. And if you insist on the latter then you're damn right I will be fast with my judgement.
[–]xeroxe0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
In case you're insinuating a negative connotation here — there is nothing wrong at feeling pleasure when taking revenge, on the contrary it is an evolutionary instinct planted purposefully to reward the successful self-preservation. Put it simply revenge has survival advantages, and it's only natural to derive pleasure from it. We should only be concerned when someone lacks the passion and the will for self-preservation.
The main reason why legal justice has a higher rate of conflict resolution it's because governments have monopoly on force — not because they were able to devise an ideal ethical system, far from it. Consequently, when the pig who raped your daughter receives the same sentence as your son for selling weed, there is nothing you can do about it beside concluding the conflict. You can obviously kill him yourself but you will end up in jail and conflict will be concluded sooner or later because not everyone is willing to face the unbeatable force of the state.
Nonetheless, no retribution system is foolproof, granted, and self-served justice surely has its flaws compared to legal system. Although I wouldn't paint them in such a heavy contrast of black and white idolizing legal system as all fine and dandy while self-served justice dangerous and escalative. On the contrary, often enough filthy-rich psychopaths with good lawyers get away with just a slap on a wrist for serious crimes. In such cases a self-served retribution with a bullet between the eyes comes much closer to an ethical ideal. Yet, we are better off with an imperfect legal system rather than nothing at all. The same goes for self-served justice.
We are already on problematic grounds here, you have been mistreated for 7 years, it is quite hard to beat this problematic magnitude. As the saying goes it can only go up from here and at least what you can do for yourself as a victim is the emotional gratification of getting even (1), in fact it is something you are owed to.
Not to mention we're far and away from escalation, telling her parents what she did is the least you could do and miles inside safe margins when compared to being cheated and lied for 7 years. But apparently OP is too much of a wimp to even do that. Everyone may have a different view of justice, but pretty much everyone would agree here unanimously, except you and OP. Worrying about overstepping and escalation regarding even this ridiculously microscopic "punishment" is not only unreasonably cautious, but bordering on the verge of paranoia — strongly indicating effects of a preconceived ideology.
Such ideology produces wimps exactly like OP who lack the emotional will to materialize the slightest inconvenience and paralyzes men into fragile butterflies. It is no accident at all that he still cultivates compassion for her. It's no accident at all that she chose to pick precisely on him knowing his weak character and ideology. These people are ideal targets to prey on, because instead of discouraging their potential predators, they lure them back like bees to honey. All these personality traits are a dead-on predictable markers of his tragic outcome, and I am not surprised in the least that this happened to someone like him.
She would have refrained herself much better if he happened to be a dangerous crazy maniac who would have made real sure to get back at her regardless the cost. You don't see this happening to eastern Muslims living under Sharia law who stone their partner to death for doing what she did, no sane woman wouldn't even cross her mind to cheat and lie on him for 7 years. Now, as I am arguing against you for having way too modest consequences — if at all — I would argue that stoning partner to death for adultery is an extreme measure. Both are equally disproportional on diametrically opposite ends.
Just like there exist consequences that are noticeably dis-proportionally excessive (stoning to death), logically there should also exist consequences that are noticeably dis-proportionally insufficient — and right here we have it — OP explicitly backing out from causing even the slightest inconvenience to his ex abuser, which is clearly evidently noticeably dis-proportionally insufficient, and I can't help but find appalling the sheer amount of wimp proportions observed here. If this isn't dis-proportionally insufficient then I can't name one that it is.
As conclusion, the ramifications of this submissive ideology are seriously harmful, it pushes men further away from a beneficial character that could shape them a bold reputation capable of radiating a "don't fuck with me" aura, which would ultimately serve them best in the future (2) and in the present (1). All these tendencies to attach a bad stigma to revenge stem from a naive hippy new-age outlook that overrates peace and flowers in a world of wolves and hostility. As much as idealistic and virtuous it may sound, it is devastatingly un-pragmatic.
[–]Shiva-The_Destroyer0 points1 point2 points (10 children) | Copy Link
Maybe I left this out because personally I just can't relate to that.
It's not meant as a threat but as an act of self defence.
What is a proportional consequence? What you seem to see as proportiona the other party may deem as way too much. There is a lot of potential for escalating conflict here. Eye for an eye and the world will go blind.
If you can't trust somebody hiw can this person be a partner?
I wouldn't want to be around somebody I need to threaten to stay loyal to me in the first place.
There is a price for everything in this world. Cheaters and liars will never stop cheating and lying, this kind of existence is punishment all by itself.
Yes the world can be cruel and many who deserve to live die and many who would deserve death live but it's not for us to decide that. It's from Gandalf I believe and I agree with him.
Yes of course, without them those concepts wouldn't exist.
God is justice but definitely not revenge. Revenge is surely karmic in some way, I just doubt it brings good Karma.
[–]xeroxe0 points1 point2 points (9 children) | Copy Link
I dedicate a great deal of attention to my replies, but it seems you have a habit to hastily read them and then respond misapprehended bits selectively which usually miss the point or shift the goalpost.
Here is an example of shifting the goalpost. Your initial claim I disputed was "revenge won't make him feel any better" and now you're making it about you.
And that's precisely why I would rather happen to harm someone like you who lacks tangible threats than someone who possess retaliation power. I am still unsure how was this supposed to invalidate this claim, instead it further supported my point.
It surely is more than telling her parents that she lied and got hammered behind your back for 7 years. It surely is less than stoning her to death.
Why? Because most would agree that they would rather get cheated on for 7 years than get stoned to death, and likewise most would agree that they would rather have their parents know their adulterous actions rather than being the victim of the affair them-selves.
Your argument seems to be since we can't get everyone on board regarding what proportional consequence is, then we should give it up altogether, but name me one thing that we can get everyone on board? We can't get everyone to agree about anything.
And whats more, we don't need unanimity, as long as there is convergence we're good enough — in fact we're far better than providing a constant reaction of simply walking away which is guaranteed to end up more often than not disproportionately insufficient.
Now you're just repeating old arguments although I extensively addressed and rebutted them:
We're far and away from escalation, telling her parents what she did is the least you could do and miles inside safe margins when compared to being cheated and lied for 7 years. Worrying about overstepping and escalation regarding even this ridiculously microscopic "punishment" is not only unreasonably cautious, but bordering on the verge of paranoia.
What you're basically doing is refusing to get on a 2 feet deep pool because of the risk of drowning in the ocean. You are not even close to the ocean. We're not even in the ballpark of escalation. I didn't even get the chance to argue pro swimming in the sea because you're already afraid and refusing to get on the 2 feet deep pool. I didn't even get the chance yet to argue for proportional consequences, because you are already afraid and refusing to embrace even the obviously insufficient consequence.
For your escalation argument to have any validity, you should first move past 2 feet marker and agree that backing out from telling her parents is in fact a wimp move. Until then this argument is futile.
This is all irrelevant. It doesn't disprove nor even address the question whether consequences contribute to self-preservation. Not to mention that this isn't about you or your preferences but about the OP. You keep injecting yourself in his scenario. Also, you did neither answer the question here, you just typed the very first thing that came to your mind and left it at that.
Asserting that cheaters and liars are voluntarily punishing themselves is a bizarre mental gymnastic attempt to attribute suffering to evil-doers. They don't cheat and lie because it makes them suffer, on the contrary because they gain a ton from such behavior — they just have to pick the right victims cultivating your submissive and over-empathetic ideology.
And that is called injustice, not justice. The universe is random, chaotic, indifferent and does not share our petty values and ideals for justice and equality. Our attempt as human beings to correct this unjust reality is a drop of water in an ocean of pitiless indifference and injustice, and you're not helping it by wimping men around you.
Of course, it is not for the sufferer to decide anything here or god-forbid to take any action. Instead, lets leave it to some invisible mystical magical force, while we all become passive sedated hippies. Nothing instills more fear at our predators than this invisible almost in-existent force. That's why sheep are the most dangerous animals in the wild, they figured out how to use this karmic power.
The question is not whether such concepts exist, but whether if they have some truth merit. Concepts can exist even if they are false. If they have some truth merit it is precisely because of vengeful men who went after wrong doers and made sure they got what they deserved — not some magical supernatural intervention.
God is art but definitely not gallery. Such sentences are barely intelligible, let alone demonstrated.
[–]Shiva-The_Destroyer0 points1 point2 points (8 children) | Copy Link
Too bad we don't seem to understand each other. Looks like we are going in circles a little yeah.
I don't agree with you mindset of using fear and punishment for control. You may feel safer this way, I understand that. I just don't think it is right and you are doing yourself or other people any good with that.
Here's an interesting post I found yesterday: Even 30 years later
No matter if the story is true or not, this would be a perfect example of Karma in action.
I like this comment about it aswell:
Karma is coming for everyone in the end. No doubt about that.
[–]LiveTheTruth3211 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
This poor sap couldn't see he was getting used. 7 years and he couldn't see that. The no sex is one thing but everything else. Ffs, he saying he's a nice guy and that she's innocent, Lmaoooooo!