Aging women can't find husband to bare child with, says men of this generation refuse to grow up and are commitment-phobes

zthumser · 2015-02-03T19:51:00+00:00

"No one wants to be with me, clearly there's something wrong with everyone but me."

No one owes you a relationship; you want one, try bringing something to the table the other party wants. Or you could do what you want with your own life and not conform to anyone else's desires or expectations, good for you, but don't go your own way and then act all surprised to find yourself alone.

dangerousopinions · 2015-02-03T21:26:01+00:00

I liked this comment:

I am a single woman but I am so tired of other single women saying "there are no good guys" but then refusing to date Asian or Black men...or men without graduate degrees...or men under 5'10. I am sure this author says she wants an equal but doesn't realize she is getting her equal: a flaky self-absorbed jerk.

utmostgentleman · 2015-02-03T20:52:22+00:00

"There's something wrong with the men of your generation."

No mention that her predicament is the result of her choices. She chose to pass on marriage when she was younger and focus on her career while the men of her generation who were interested in marriage got married and had children. Now she complains that the ones who are left aren't interested in marriage or at least aren't interested in marrying her.

This is the reality that lurks behind years of being told that "you can have it all" when, in fact, options narrow with each passing year.

919849134914116 · 2015-02-03T20:15:39+00:00

Is anyone else disturbed by the recurring theme of 'just go ahead, have a kid all by yourself?'

Who needs family. Who needs fathers? Boy or girl, I feel sorry for that child.

And then I remember feminist quotes like 'the nuclear family must be destroyed' from Linda Gordon, and I think, they won.

ThePigmanAgain · 2015-02-03T21:38:50+00:00

Men aren't commitment-phobic, they are asshole-phobic, and these women are assholes.

Demonspawn · 2015-02-03T21:42:12+00:00

This reply nailed it:

The old deal was you spend your youth with us and we will stick by you when you get old. Now women just want the latter part of the deal. No, thanks.

babno · 2015-02-03T22:43:12+00:00

So women initiate the majority of divorces because they love commitment so much?

mwejnenn · 2015-02-03T21:39:51+00:00

my sense of what the right relationship for me was — or wasn’t — lacked the normal range of experience. My sense of who I was lacked the normal range of experience. We broke up, when I was 32, because of what I didn’t know as much as what I did.

What the fuck does this even mean?

Dnile1000BC · 2015-02-03T22:21:23+00:00

I really don't understand this type of writing. She has numerous occasions where she had male partners but she turned them all down. She then does the usual "where are all the good men gone" complaint. Not sure if stupid or completely lacking in self awareness.

McFeely_Smackup · 2015-02-03T23:02:26+00:00

There’s something wrong with the men in this generation. They won’t grow up.

"Grow up" being defined as "marry a woman to fulfill her life goals, pay for her expenses, father the children that she wants and pay their expenses too. Then get divorced at her whim and write her checks every month for the next 18 years while she tells your children what a piece of shit you are".

I'd say men ARE growing up. Growing up in the sense that they are logically evaluating the shit sandwich Feminism, marriage, and parenthood are serving them, and rejecting it in favor of pursuing THEIR OWN goals.

So yes men, do grow up. Make adult decisions for yourselves and your own lives, not elses.

MantusPlantus · 2015-02-03T22:21:13+00:00

Women can take care of themselves and have the option of being independent nowadays. I thought she was living the dream?

I kinda feel bad for her because everyone around her is constantly giving her the wrong information. Your youth is fleeting, and men won't wait around for you to decide you're ready. This is exactly what women of the past feared and grandmothers had to constantly drill into their granddaughters heads so they didn't end up as some crazy hag in poverty that no man would ever even glance at.

“It isn’t you,”

It is.. it totally is.

"There’s something wrong with the men in this generation. They won’t grow up."

I don't understand why men aren't lining up to support your early retirement and list of demands at age 40.

"and you can't rely on men,”

You can, you just can't expect it to be the same at your age. They probably know most of the games at that point and you haven't been practicing at all.

“Forget them,”

Might as well. What you are looking for will continue to be in short supply until society wakes up.

blueoak9 · 2015-02-03T23:18:14+00:00

Word of the day: "baggot" - Scots dialect for female salmon who has failed to breed and will now drift down the river and die.

Spikemaw · 2015-02-04T12:38:49+00:00

"What it did do was expose me, again and directly, to the ways we treat women when there is a decision to be made about their bodies: We judge, pressure, and publicly debate a woman’s ability to direct her own life."

Earlier in the article, a statement she identifies strongly with: "There’s something wrong with the men in this generation. They won’t grow up.’”

This shows the total disconnect. Women are allowed to be whatever they want to be, live their lives however they want to live. Men have to "grow up" and apparently have long-term monogamous relationships, father children, and then pay alimony if the woman gets bored of her spermdo-whoops-husband.

Women today are reaping what they've sown in spades. They're interacting with generations of men primarily raised by women, their fathers excised and demonized. Those men grow up, but they aren't choosing to have children. Because they saw their own fathers pushed out, the pain their fathers felt, the pain they felt watching their family implode, watching their mothers work part time and forcing their fathers to SUE for even partial custody.

Of course many men are cagey. We don't want to be caught in the same sort of man-traps many of our fathers fell into. I don't just mean women, I mean the whole social black hole that a father falls into unless the mother is unusually saintly.

What risk is a woman taking, getting pregnant? Raising the child herself - with the state and/or the father supporting her decision financially- that is pretty much the worst case scenario. Maybe finding dates is harder, maybe she is poorer than she might have been before.

The worst, and very common case, with men impregnating (NOT barring rape OR fraudulent conception) is that the man is basically enslaved to the system for the rest of his life, or at least many, many years, with little or no contact with his progeny. If he loses his job and can't make a payment, or can only find lesser paying work, the courts (where he stands without a public defender, regardless of poverty, often unlike the mother) may send him to prison, likely meaning he is rendered homeless.

But men today are "commitment-phobic." The sheer pigheaded blindness to the reality of the SOURCE of the clearly logical fear can just leave me gob-smacked. This entire article leads one to ask "why are men so CHILDISH?" and heavily implies that the commitment phobia is a result of internalized cultural tropes of the "the ever-alluring, ever-evasive single male." Looks like "toxic masculinity" strikes again, boys! What bollocks. Acknowledging the truth would require these women totally re-evaluate their entire world-view. They would have to acknowledge the wholesale disillusionment of the men of their generation, the work of their mothers and ex-wives and judges. They'd have to acknowledge that they have all the options and that all men are permitted, once sperm leaves urethra, are shackles and responsibilities.

This woman writes an article begrudging men their decision to not have children, or their unwillingness to trust completely when they have so much to lose.

The best thing I can say about this article is at least it doesn't openly advocate for "accidental" conception. Barely.

2015-02-03T23:43:35+00:00

We are strong, independent men who don't need no woman.

A man needs a woman like a bicycle needs a fish.

p3ngwin · 2015-02-04T12:33:03+00:00

great comment from the article:

You're all strong, independent women who don't need a man these days. Now you're all shocked that men don't need you either.

pazz · 2015-02-04T01:03:54+00:00

This article is assuming men have always in the past wanted a family and children. I don't believe this is the case. We live in a time when sex and pregnancy have been separated from each other and women are finally seeing that a lot of men only wanted the sex and relationship...but not the children. They were just unavoidable in the past.

I personally think kids look like way more trouble than they are worth. I don't give a shit about passing on my genes and I know I'm too selfish to devote that many resources to an unappreciative whiny brat so what's the point of having kids. I'll just save that money I'd have spent on my kids and retire in style.

InBaggingArea · 2015-02-03T19:56:45+00:00

Female entitlement. A yalp thereof, perhaps. (cf Scott Aaronson and Amanda Marcotte)

Or maybe, deep down, her real problem is she's insecure.

Compare with feminist responses to complaints from lonely, or once lonely, men concerning their problems.

Pz5 · 2015-02-03T21:59:43+00:00

She seems to think she is spectacular. Thankfully no man has married her. Thats 1 less husband suffering under the weight of a selfcentered egotistical woman.

McFeely_Smackup · 2015-02-03T22:54:05+00:00

It's not you. None of us were responsible for the fact that so many men see relationships as a giant albatross.

It's you.

Wargame4life · 2015-02-03T23:52:05+00:00

Well when you live in a time where men have no incentive to being committed in a relationship, don't be surprised when men wish to stay single and live their life instead of submitting to your bullshit.

I also find it quite childish that people are still using the "fear of commitment" line in this day and age to insult men who wish to stay single.

mafiaking1936 · 2015-02-03T23:53:29+00:00

Hey fish, need that bicycle now?

rocelot7 · 2015-02-04T01:42:39+00:00

Ladies, if you don't know where all the good guys are the simplest answer is away from you.

PerniciousOne · 2015-02-04T04:44:27+00:00

Desperate people give off subtle unconscious clues which deter relationships.

For the last ten years she has been giving off the "baby-rabies" vibe to the majority of men who have been screwed by divorces, bad relationships, and do not want to have children with a woman who just wants to get knocked up.

She has the expectation that the better quality men will still be there and available like she was in her early twenties. She is still holding out for one of those men to come in and whisk her off her feet.

Those men have already been locked down, and have not yet been screwed until they are close to retirement. And those men are not interested in starting a second family with a woman who puts career over family.

Lrellok · 2015-02-04T04:54:37+00:00

Matt asked me to marry him not long after my mother’s death. I had pressured him to propose while she was still alive, but with her gone, the ring stayed in my jewelry box. Everything I thought I knew about my life had changed. Sometimes I think about an alternate universe in which I marry the guy I met at 25 and have children in my early 30s. But what I realized in the wake of my mother’s death was that my sense of what the right relationship for me was — or wasn’t — lacked the normal range of experience. My sense of who I was lacked the normal range of experience. We broke up, when I was 32, because of what I didn’t know as much as what I did.

Um, yes, this is clearly the MEN who are not growing up. Projection much here sweety? To quote the song, "You had your chance, you blew it."

“I don’t know, do it on my own?” I replied.

“You can’t do that!” he said, but as the words came out, he caught himself.

“Of course I can!” I protested.

“Of course you can,” he said.

Man speaks the truth, gets yelled at by radfem, lies to her just like she wants. And people wonder why feminism is falling apart. The emporor has no cloths meets shooting the messengers.

“It isn’t you,” he said. “All day long, I see patients like you. You’re smart, beautiful, accomplished, nice. It makes no sense. I go home to my wife and I say, ‘There’s something wrong with the men in this generation. They won’t grow up.’”

It makes perfect sence. There are a limited number of highpaying jobs. If all of them are occupied by women, non will be available to men. If all these high powered women want high powered husbands, they are not going to find them, because they are occupying the job that husband would need. Its not that "Men have not grown up". its "Men are no longer entitled to the things necessary to meet the obligations the doctor thinks they should."

If society wants me to go do something, society can provide me everything necessary to do that. When feminism removed the structures necessary for men to meet those obligations, like it or not, they removed the obligations as well.

p3ngwin · 2015-02-04T12:19:06+00:00

The people and situations were different but the broad outlines were all too often the same: The dude was cagey. He acted erratically, pursuing and then retreating. He was evasive when confronted with our wants and needs, or agitated, or defensive. Sometimes he simply disappeared. Of course, not all of the men we met and dated were commitment-phobes.

and how did YOU react when HE was given a chance to present HIS "wants and needs" eh ?

I watched one beautiful friend in her late 30s fight off attention at every party we attended, only to have each man who sought her number intentionally and epically self-destruct weeks later.

and...

But when another friend, a gorgeous, sardonic wit, was dumped by her yearlong boyfriend, who employed a communication strategy just one shade away from a Post-It, it woke me up. It's not you. None of us were responsible for the fact that so many men see relationships as a giant albatross.

right, "it's not you" eh ? that's why she dated a guy for a year with such undesirable qualities in communication ?

what a surprise, women describe themselves as smart, compelling, witty, gorgeous, beautiful and the men are "commitment-phobes".

gee, couldn't possibly be biased and maybe you're just a bunch of undesirable and desperate commitment-addicts?

"Matt was kind, handsome, honest, loyal, and humble."

Then you dumped him, for no reason, because you think you are a special snowflake that hasn't figured out her "Normal range of emotions" yet.

Sweetie, if you don't know who you are by middle-age, you never will.

Wargame4life · 2015-02-04T15:24:24+00:00

This needs to be pointed out everytime but here we go again.

in a population of equal numbers of men and women (near enough) by definition, if women receive a surplus of offers in their youth this has to be at the cost later in life.

since for every single man leaves a single women and two men competing for one women leaves another woman without a partner.

What this means is that its statistically certain that if women (as a whole) enjoy a sellers market in their youth, this must then become a buyers market in their old age.

Its an inescapable fact

scanspeak · 2015-02-03T22:01:00+00:00

Yeah I have a phobia against slavery.

Jerkie_Cokehead · 2015-02-03T20:43:24+00:00

These hos are all 5 and 6 at best but they all want a 10 man. That's their problem!

shemmie · 2015-02-04T04:48:16+00:00

Taking the words someone uses when they're lying to you, to reassure you; to massage your ego - and then using them as the foundation of an article...

Coming tomorrow: "My Mom Says I'm A Lovely Guy - All Women Are Mean".

Or not, because that's a none event.

Likewise, you're not faultless because 'all men are wrong'. Also, men aren't walking sperm machines on legs, despite the narrative of the medical community seemingly addressing us as such. Although they aren't really the medical industry in this context.

They are salesmen. Which is why he lied to you.

He wanted a sale.

Archaous · 2015-02-04T14:52:38+00:00

I'm not afraid of commitment, I'm afraid of alimony and child support if it doesn't work.

2015-02-03T20:02:58+00:00

round and round she went until she hit the wall

thehumungus · 2015-02-03T22:59:43+00:00

it's bear

one bears a child.

Unless you're stripping it nude. then you bare it, I guess.

Frittern · 2015-02-03T20:35:56+00:00

Go ahead and freeze your eggs but these women better freeze some fertilized blastocysts as well..blastocysts have much better odds than frozen eggs.

Wargame4life · 2015-02-04T15:04:09+00:00

Wow who would have thought that in a relationship a man's perceptions or desires would somehow be a factor. you live you learn.

I absolutely love posts like these. when reality finally catches up to delusion, share more if you got em

Clockw0rk · 2015-02-03T23:47:29+00:00

One of the best interactions I had with online dating was an incredibly blunt woman who had "matched" with me and sent me the following message, paraphrased:

"I want to settle down and have children right away."

She was attractive, educated, had a good job according to her income metric. We even had similar tastes in philosophy and entertainment.

But I said no.

She didn't want to get to know each other first, this was a binary "you're in, or you're out" choice.

And I said no for a lot of reasons. I'm still working to pay off debt. I'm not sure I want to live here for another 10 years. I don't want to put my potential child through the hardship of a tight income, or moving around a lot.

I haven't been on a date in 7 or 8 years. I have to quantify "or" because it's been so long, I literally can't remember.

You want to rush into having babies, without considerations for housing, schools, or careers of the parents? And then opinion rags like this horseshit have the audacity to say men refuse to grow up?

I think we have a difference of opinion on who the mature party is here, ladies.

I'm sorry your biological impetus clouds your judgement, but if you're thinking about your desire to "have a family" before the needs of your children... You don't deserve to have kids.

timoppenheimer · 2015-02-04T01:19:15+00:00

But the ambivalence — the unambiguous acts of devotion followed swiftly by hand-wringing and confusion, the breakups followed by tortured emails, the everlasting stringing-along — it got old. It even became the subject of a well-received novel.

It's just so good. I've watched many of my friends be strung along by various young women, and it feels good to watch this woman struggle with the shoe on the other foot.

Schadenfreude? Schadenfreude.

MisterDamage · 2015-02-03T20:50:47+00:00

No, men are; getting stolen from, shit on and marginalized phobes.

Blarty97 · 2015-02-03T22:06:36+00:00

Definition of *bear: Carry

Definition of bare: not clothed or covered.

zawadz · 2015-02-03T22:30:22+00:00

Why would a man go for a used car if they can get a brand new one for the same price?

Akesgeroth · 2015-02-04T04:31:05+00:00

Gee, I wonder why?

q-_-p · 2015-02-04T17:33:17+00:00

I have so may stories about going out with groups of friends... or being at a friends birthday, and the strange behavior of the women there when guys leave to go to a club...

I don't get what they were expecting (especially since one invited me back to her place but then said "I don't sleep with someone who isn't my boyfriend"... ok, this is awkward, have a nice night...)

The fact is, there's no economic reason for men to have families anymore, and a massive, massive risk of having one (ending up alone, paying all your income to someone else who gets to take credit for providing for the kids).

2015-02-04T01:28:40+00:00

For a few years after the split, my doctor said little about my fertility. She would gauge my interest in having children someday (high) and how I felt about my current partner, if there was one.

What kind of fucking doctor is that? I usually go to the doctor when I'm sick.

Turtle_Color_Accents · 2015-02-04T01:42:23+00:00

WHAAA!! No one wants a frigid bed partner who demands that he pay his own bills, all of my bills, put up with my mood swings, and treat me like an equal! BEWHEW!! Where have all the good men gone!?

CrazyInAnInsaneWorld · 2015-02-05T00:57:44+00:00

Just as Women aren't required to give men the sex they think we feel entitled to, we men aren't required to settle down and give women the commitment they feel they are entitled to, if we want sex. Women got rid of that obligation when they dismantled traditional gender roles. "Why should we buy the cow when the milk is free?" to put it in terms my Grandmother would use...

It's the age of Gender Equality, women! Ditch those stuffy gender roles of the past and get with the times, already!

xNOM · 2015-02-05T05:32:23+00:00

“It isn’t you,” he said. “All day long, I see patients like you. You’re smart, beautiful, accomplished, nice. It makes no sense. I go home to my wife and I say, ‘There’s something wrong with the men in this generation. They won’t grow up.’”

About a year after my initial conversation with Dr. Keefe, I went uptown on my lunch hour and bought $4,000 worth of fertility drugs, which I would inject over the following two weeks.

LOL smart man...

lazydonovan · 2015-02-05T10:45:17+00:00

This was originally posted on Craigslist and can probably still be found on "Best-of".

What happened to all the nice guys?

The answer is simple: you did.

See, if you think back, really hard, you might vaguely remember a Platonic guy pal who always seemed to want to spend time with you. He'd tag along with you when you went shopping, stop by your place for a movie when you were lonely but didn't feel like going out, or even sit there and hold you while you sobbed and told him about how horribly the (other) guy that you were fucking treated you.

At the time, you probably joked with your girlfriends about how he was a little puppy dog, always following you around, trying to do things to get you to pay attention to him. They probably teased you because they thought he had a crush on you. Given that his behavior was, admittedly, a little pathetic, you vehemently denied having any romantic feelings for him, and buttressed your position by claiming that you were "just friends." Besides, he totally wasn't your type. I mean, he was a little too short, or too bald, or too fat, or too poor, or didn't know how to dress himself, or basically be or do any of the things that your tall, good-looking, fit, rich, stylish boyfriend at the time pulled off with such ease.

Eventually, your Platonic buddy drifted away, as your relationship with the boyfriend got more serious and spending time with this other guy was, admittedly, a little weird, if you werent dating him. More time passed, and the boyfriend eventually cheated on you, or became boring, or you realized that the things that attracted you to him weren't the kinds of things that make for a good, long-term relationship. So, now, you're single again, and after having tried the bar scene for several months having only encountered players and douche bags, you wonder, "What happened to all the nice guys?"

Well, once again, you did.

You ignored the nice guy. You used him for emotional intimacy without reciprocating, in kind, with physical intimacy. You laughed at his consideration and resented his devotion. You valued the aloof boyfriend more than the attentive "just-a-" friend. Eventually, he took the hint and moved on with his life. He probably came to realize, one day, that women aren't really attracted to guys who hold doors open; or make dinners just because; or buy you a Christmas gift that you mentioned, in passing, that you really wanted five months ago; or listen when you're upset; or hold you when you cry. He came to realize that, if he wanted a woman like you, he'd have to act more like the boyfriend that you had. He probably cleaned up his look, started making some money, and generally acted like more of an asshole than he ever wanted to be.

Fact is, now, he's probably getting laid, and in a way, your ultimate rejection of him is to thank for that. And I'm sorry that it took the complete absence of "nice guys" in your life for you to realize that you missed them and wanted them. Most women will only have a handful of nice guys stumble into their lives, if that.

So, if you're looking for a nice guy, here's what you do:

1.) Build a time machine. 2.) Go back a few years and pull your head out of your ass. 3.) Take a look at what's right in front of you and grab ahold of it.

I suppose the other possibility is that you STILL don't really want a nice guy, but you feel the social pressure to at least appear to have matured beyond your infantile taste in men. In which case, you might be in luck, because the nice guy you claim to want has, in reality, shed his nice guy mantle and is out there looking to unleash his cynicism and resentment onto someone just like you.

If you were five years younger.

So, please: either stop misrepresenting what you want, or own up to the fact that you've fucked yourself over. You're getting older, after all. It's time to excise the bullshit and deal with reality. You didn't want a nice guy then, and he certainly doesn't fucking want you, now.

Sincerely,

A Recovering Nice Guy

CaptainChewbacca · 2015-02-04T15:27:48+00:00

Bear, not bare.

StrikingEarth · 2015-02-04T17:14:33+00:00

Feminists complaining that they can't find anybody, it's clearly men's fault.

xNOM · 2015-02-05T05:20:54+00:00

Does anyone else find this a bit creepy?

I have had the same gynecologist since just after college, and even though I see her for a very limited amount of time each year, she has always known my life by its most personal details: whom I was dating, how I was doing when I was alone. And because she has known me since I was practically an adolescent, her observations land heavily.

SCROTAL-SACK · 2015-02-03T19:19:04+00:00

http://i0.wp.com/memecollection.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/jennifer-lawrence-oh-yeah-thumbs-up.gif?w=900

hermes369 · 2015-02-04T02:08:29+00:00

I want a family. I'm afraid of commitment but I can control myself (this wasn't always the case) but I don't make much money and I'm overweight. I'm not morbidly obese but I have a big belly. I'm also old. I'm basically unfuckable. I could do the red pill thing and get sex, I suppose. I just don't care about that much anymore.

I find articles like this could be gender-flipped and be more accurate. Men basically have their own built in freezer for eggs (I mean we're fertile longer) but I've never heard of a guy having the option of an artificial womb in which his kid may gestate. I might consider that were it an option.

What I notice is that we're ruled by money and things. Work, especially hard work ,doesn't pay, and most jobs out there just require ones body to be present on time. Of course, slave wages are better than no wages. If it weren't for my folks having a room and a car for me to share, I'd be truly fucked.

It seems to me we could figure this shit out so we could better spend our time exploring space, or learning an instrument, or raising a family. Instead we're too happy with our stuff and our bubbles. Why get married when you can simply be a disease vector? Why raise a kid when you can play your PS4 or schedule yoga, pedicures, massages?

I guess this is our future. We seem happy enough to blame each other for all our problems. Feminism certainly seems to have the answer: eliminate men. I do think men are waking up to this but how much better would it be if we worked towards finding each other? Why is that off the menu?

2015-02-04T01:31:23+00:00

Funny, I cant find many womens who like being raped either.

PL0XPL0XPL0X · 2015-02-03T22:26:48+00:00

MRAs are just as autistic as feminists.

Title	Aging women can't find husband to bare child with, says men of this generation refuse to grow up and are commitment-phobes
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	127
Comments	167
Date	February 3, 2015 7:15 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/2uo0ht/aging_women_cant_find_husband_to_bare_child_with/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/aging-women-cant-find-husband-to-bare-child-with.988952 https://theredarchive.com/post/988952