I think we're starting to look a bit petty...

PublicStranger · 2009-11-18T02:45:28+00:00

[permanently deleted]

junkeee999 · 2009-11-18T16:19:20+00:00

Cannot upvote enough.

I regularly check the men's rights forum because it has been an area of interest since I went through a tough divorce years ago. The posts of any value are getting fewer and fewer. A story about a woman saying or doing a bad thing does NOT belong on a men's rights forum. This is not a contest to see which gender can dredge up more shit about the other.

That's not 'men's rights'. That's just petty bullshit. Because guess what? Feminists can play that game all day long too and have mountains of material to work from.

What does that prove? Hey did you hear the shooter at Ft. Hood was a man? Quite a douchebag too from the sound of it. OMG...What profound point was made by relating that? What brave blow was struck for feminism? What greater truth about men can be gained?

2009-11-18T00:53:38+00:00

I concur, Proglottid.

nooneelse · 2009-11-18T02:54:18+00:00

As what I would call a observing bystander in this subreddit... I'd say "starting" is an understatement. The pettiness I see isn't helping your case(s) any, and it has overshadowed what legitimate message there was on more than one occasion. Just imho, of course.

60secs · 2009-11-18T08:22:19+00:00

Hear hear, lots of love for women.

Equality doesn't mean taking away, only equal and fair rights under the law. True feminists should support Men's Rights hand in hand with Women's Rights. Mutual respect, dignity and equality under the law are principles we all can agree on.

When it comes to using the legal system to "force balance", that only creates an imbalance. E.g. Title IX and affirmative action.

Hangly · 2009-11-18T02:24:00+00:00

I've been saying this for months. Granted I haven't been saying it very nicely...

Men need to rediscover the masculine virtues, not copy the tactics of shrill disagreeable feminists.

I recommend starting with Ben Franklin and Marcus Aurelius.

Are we not men?

kanuk876 · 2009-11-18T02:58:28+00:00

I don't mean to sound like an ass, but this reddit is like every other; those who post get to define what gets posted.

If you want to read something different, post it.

Nobody's getting paid here. Nobody owes you anything, balanced or otherwise.

I find most people post on topics they feel passionate about. In the MensRights, that usually means people post on topics they have personally suffered through, from divorce to misandry in the workplace. My shtick is child abuse and circumcision.

Topics seem to go in waves here.

If someone is struggling to see women as something other than the god-like-pure-goodness mainstream media has programmed us to believe, you can expect a lot of WBB posts.

This place is a place of healing, sharing and growing. Programming and worldviews are hard to break out of.

PierceHarlan · 2009-11-17T22:55:14+00:00

Sometimes to tell the big story, you need to tell the little stories. Come to my site, False Rape Society, and you will see one instance after another of "a woman did this terrible thing." Our blog is the antidote to the feminist insistence that women DON'T do these terrible things; specifically, the feminist mantra that "women don't lie about rape." We show day in and day out, all year round, one example after the next that some women DO lie about rape. And we sprinkle studies and scholarly pieces throughout that discuss the false rape problem.

We highlight the injustices the falsely accused face when they are not afforded anonymity (their names are plastered all over the internet based on even far-fetched rape lies); they are not afforded the same due process protections other criminal accuseds are afforded (e.g., Fed. Rule Evid. 413); they are arrested on less evidence than for any other serious crime (even on the say-so of a serial rape accuser); and they see their false accusers escape with little or no punishment-- so the problem is not being deterred.

It would be impossible to tell the whole story, the big story -- it would be impossible to tell the stories of the falsely accused -- any way other than to tell one story at a time, and to discuss how each fits into the larger picture.

ignatiusloyola · 2009-11-18T14:32:55+00:00

I applaud your statement, Proglottid, and I agree with much of what you said. But I think the issue is deeper than we think.

On one level, this subreddit could be about legislation and systematic discrimination among men. But on another level, men have found what amounts to a support group. They feel powerless and frustrated at injustices that they see and experience, and are expressing that frustration here. Perhaps it gets us off topic, but it offers a place to vent for a number of people.

On another level, and I talked about this in a post I made on Men's Rights Activism, is that our Activism is also about dispelling myths and pointing out double-standards. One of the myths is that things such as rape, sexual abuse, physical abuse, emotional abuse and the like are only (or primarily) perpetrated by men. And one of the main double standards is that punishment appears to be gender based for identical crimes.

When I see a post about a topic such as "so-and-so female did a horrible thing", I consider two things about it first: (1) if the genders were reversed, would the situation be different, and (2) is there a common societal perception about this that glosses over the responsibilities and consequences that a female should receive for that horrible thing. If either of these are an issue, then I think it may be a valid Men's Rights issue.

In the end, perhaps it would be best if the posters could include in their title the reason they feel that this is a Men's Rights issue. It could be something like: "So-and-so woman did this terrible thing - there is a double standard in her punishment."

Many posters do this already, fortunately. But maybe not enough of them do.

razorfantasy · 2009-11-18T01:04:33+00:00

You make a great point, but unfortunately I've seen way too many whiny posts here and not as much grown up discussion. I joined expecting some more balanced perspective on male to female relations and gender roles. Unfortunately what I found was a lot of woman hating (sometimes justified, but usually not) and a bunch of crybabies.

I believe a man earns respect by his actions, not by complaining that things are unfair, or by pointing fingers at others.

So I'm unsubscribing. You guys want to be negative? That's cool. Count me out.

citizenmouse · 2009-11-18T17:59:42+00:00

I don't really follow this subreddit much for that very reason. I'm not really a men's rights activist either (I'm more of an /r/TwoX kind of girl), but I do support gender-equality whole heartidly to any extent possible.

Unfortunately, every time I've stopped by this reddit, I haven't really seen much about advancing against discrimination and stereotypes against the male population- but mostly people railing against crazy feminist bloggers that most normal feminists also think are completely insane, people being pissed off about all alleged female rape victims actually being liars who want to entrap men, all women who accidentally get pregnant being liars who want to entrap men, all women who get married being liars who want to entrap men.

That stuff does happen, but not really to the extent that some of the followers of /r/MensRights would have you believe- they are legitimate issues, but that really isn't the main goal of this subreddit, is it?

If it focused more on things like legislative issues and less on things like ranting about how evil women are and that the feminists have some great evil agenda to rule the world and enslave all men.

Thats really untrue. One would think that feminists and MRAs would be more eager to work with one another. But I suppose on both sides, there are a lot of people who have turned to extremism because they were burned by the opposite sex in one way or another. Even so, your average MRA is just a normal guy and your average feminist is just a normal woman. No hatred or secret agendas on either side.

So I guess it's just a matter of "Can't we all just get along and focus our efforts on obtaining more gender equality instead of bashing one-another's genders when we really have a lot of very similar goals?"

AnnArchist · 2009-11-18T02:47:49+00:00

I don't have a problem with false rape cases, I do have a problem with constantly talking about a woman doing anything wrong.

I think its pointless and waters down the argument. HOWEVER, I encourage you to post examples of them getting lighter sentences with a link to the same crime committed by a man. But try to wait until sentencing because thats when they always get the slap on the wrist.

garyp714 · 2009-11-17T23:15:23+00:00

Let's not give ammo to the femos

Well now, that seems incredibly petty to me.

I don't have much problem with 'woman does bad thing' articles because this literally is a place men come to blow off steam or feel they are among friends despite a society that has turned them into the bad guy. 'Bad Women' articles can help give a guy perspective and maybe start realizing he is not evil incarnate. And so there is gonna be a certain amount of 'circle jerk' and a bit of commiserating because this is a safe place.

We went through this months or year back when people started bagging on r/mensrights for being full of women haters, etc. But to me it was just a safe place for guys to go and express whatever pain they were feeling without a massive downvote judgment by an other community.

So, all I'm saying is, who cares what the 'others' think and reddit is big enough to hold all the good stuff you mentioned along with the flawed 'women bad' stuff that gives thrown in the mix.

EDIT: Bold

Gareth321 · 2009-11-18T00:36:40+00:00

With all due respect, Proglottid, I disagree. The reasons have already been outlined in other posts.

citizenmouse · 2009-11-18T03:40:19+00:00

Could we please tone down the 'woman did this terrible thing' kind of post?

Ugh you're acting as though "being the bigger person" ever, ever gets anyone anywhere. The bigger person gets shat upon and takes it. Let's not be that.

PierceHarlan · 2009-11-17T22:24:09+00:00

It's OK for you to say until some woman beats the shit out of you. I guess you would not tell anyone, right?

ristin · 2009-11-18T05:11:45+00:00

Those posts are to show that such events occur. Consider them points of data and as evidence.

But yes, it should be presented as data not with malice.

Nikola_S · 2009-11-18T09:27:28+00:00

I don't care if some batshit insane lady says some stupid crap on a blog that nobody reads.

Me neither, but I don't recall such a blog ever been posted. All the blogs I seen here were well-visited, judging from the number of post comments.

EDIT: Why the downmods? I'm really curious.

citizenmouse · 2009-11-18T14:56:29+00:00

You don't have to try hard to find fault in women. They are backstabbing, vindictive, narcissistic whores. I find it quite easy to find faults in women themselves. Systematic discrimination of men? It began when women could say things about men like I just said about women above, and got away with it. Modern media is full of men being punched, kicked and ridiculed. Don't be guilty about saying what you feel. You get bombarded with the feminine perspective every day.

cryptogirl · 2009-11-18T12:08:36+00:00

A plea from the eunuch chorus. Well, my answer is no. I think women have, are and will be doing terrible things because the liberal laws allows them to abuse men. Feminism is all about hating men and things masculine. It has nothing to do with equality at all. They have more rights then men, they are perverting the educational system to the point most boys flunk out. No, feminism and its followers are a cancer and it needs to be cut out and destroyed.

Title	I think we're starting to look a bit petty...
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	125
Comments	94
Date	November 17, 2009 10:19 PM UTC (14 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/a5f0j/i_think_were_starting_to_look_a_bit_petty/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/i-think-were-starting-to-look-a-bit-petty.1051954 https://theredarchive.com/post/1051954