Men are 93% of prisoners and 97% of those executed globally. Should this be considered a men's rights issue?

DarkMage11 · 2022-01-04T12:36:40+00:00

It seems you have answered your own question. The fact that the legal system seems to be favoring women over men in terms of conviction, sentence length, and punishment (death penalty) means they should be considered a men's issue since it looks like it's discrimination on the basis of sex.

SaracensFlanker · 2022-01-04T13:30:36+00:00

To an extent. Thing is, if those men have committed criminal offences and therefore deserve the sanctions they are sentenced to, I have nothing against that.

However, the point at which it *becomes* a men's rights issue is where two people who have committed the same criminal offence are given vastly different sanctions on the basis of their sex. If a woman would not be sentenced to capital punishment or lengthy imprisonment in a case, then neither should a man.

Furthermore, there is also the upstream issue of the assumption of innocence for women vs. the assumption of guilt for men, especially when it comes to "violence against the person" or sexually-related criminal offences. The benchmark for triggering a criminal investigation is so much lower for male suspects compared to female suspects, so that disparity is also reflected in crime stats where men allegedly commit at least a supermajority of criminal offences.

AbysmalDescent · 2022-01-04T17:04:33+00:00

I've always found it interesting how quickly people are to presume socio-economic factors when it comes to incarceration/crime rate disparities when it come to skin color, but then completely dismiss all socio-economic factors when it comes to gender. This isn't just a problem of police being harder on men(though that is its own issue, including police brutality disparities) or that judges are harder on men, it's also the countless expectations and pressures placed on men to be providers/protectors, to project strength and to establish status. It's also the many ways on which women can just fall back on countless safety nets so that they never really have to fall back on crime. It's also the way men are offered far fewer social services when they fail or fall into drugs. It's also the countless other social struggles that men face, often alone(not because they don't want to talk about it but because don't want to hear about men's struggles), which can lead them into drug use, violence or theft.

No one really wants to look into all these factors when it comes to men, either because it doesn't play into their narrative or just because they don't want to care about men. It's often just dismissed and downplayed "men are evil" or "men are inherently violent".

DavidByron2 · 2022-01-04T17:40:37+00:00

Amazed it's as high as 3% women executed.

mathewcallahan · 2022-01-04T13:33:53+00:00

anytime some slack jaw points to the disparity of races in the prison system to point out "systemic racism". I mention that women are 50% of the population, but under 10% of the prison population and get far less sentancing then men across the board. is the system systematicaly sexist. they never have a reply.

CobraPL · 2022-01-04T21:15:07+00:00

"Women most affected" of course

elebrin · 2022-01-04T13:08:17+00:00

On it's own, no.

Two of the things that we should consider men's rights issues are disproportionate sentences being given to men, and wrongful imprisonment, however. Once you have been found guilty, the system has a very strong bias against you and once you that is difficult to overcome, and prison sentences seem to be more about punishing people than protecting society and righting wrongs.

biccat · 2022-01-04T13:48:59+00:00

Well men commit more crimes so this is a non-issue!

Another dimension beyond sentencing disparity is the laws that we're enforcing against men.

Society generally criminalizes male behavior, not female behavior. Male behavior can be worse, but we prioritize making men behave, not women.

A man who rapes a woman goes to jail for most of his life. A woman who baby-traps a guy will never see the inside of a cell.

A man who assaults another when there is a slight to his honor will go to jail. A woman who socially ostracizes a woman who slights her honor will never be imprisoned.

A man who engages in physical domestic violence goes to jail. A woman who engages in verbal domestic violence is a victim.

That's not to say these things shouldn't be crimes, rather that the justice system is designed to curb the behavior of men, not women. Women who are caught in the justice system are outliers.

LondonDude123 · 2022-01-04T12:51:29+00:00

The stats alone dont make it a MRs issue...

What makes it an MRs issue would be something systemic. For example, the UK telling judges to be lenient towards Women when sentencing... THATS the Mens Rights issue...

LiquidDreamtime · 2022-01-04T15:06:19+00:00

Absolutely, the justice system is far too harsh against men. The cold justice men are served is vastly different than the warm infantilization that the courts serve women.

Women deserve more justice for their crimes, men deserve less. Equality is somewhere in the middle for them both.

MiddleReasonable647 · 2022-01-04T12:36:46+00:00

Criminals belong in jail. Females deserve the exact same prison time for the same offenses. Instead, what will happen if you politicize the disparity (which is quite reasonable to do, actually) is that liberals will let everybody out of jail instead of putting women into jail. That’s how Social Justice Warriors behave: “oh, there’s a disparity. Let’s end the disparity by lowering standards on everyone!”

thealphateam · 2022-01-04T15:54:59+00:00

If 93% of people in prison were women....holy shit. We'd stop everything in the world to save them.

Fast_Box_8509 · 2022-01-04T17:25:01+00:00

It won't be, because the popular response to the fact that men are the ones most often ground up in the gears of the legal system is to point out that they're the perpetrators of most of the violent crimes that end them up in there, and kill other men at such high rates to begin with.

Is that reductive, harmful and just an all-around crappy way to respond to that? Yeah, but victim-blaming is fine, according to western culture, so long as men are the ones being mocked. And nobody wants to talk root causes. Most feminists are a couple of ugly epiphanies away from a mental breakdown, acknowledging that men have problems too - ones that can't be warded away with the "patriarchy hurts men tooooo"-talisman.

I don't see this narrative changing anytime soon.

IncidentAware6786 · 2022-01-04T13:54:20+00:00

It should. But you'll just get hit with the men commit more violent crime bullshit.

Imo it's a vicious cycle.

MintIceCreamPlease · 2022-01-04T15:25:37+00:00

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berzio · 2022-01-04T15:18:08+00:00

When it comes to the crime disparity, boys are neglected way more from a young age than girls. It all starts in childhood.

RandylVlarsh · 2022-01-04T21:17:55+00:00

Bro, girls get whistled at sometimes while walking down the street. Know your fucking place /s

312Michelle · 2022-01-04T20:54:08+00:00

I don't think it's a "men's rights" issue, I think it's a HUMAN rights issue. How about we start caring about people of BOTH genders and end injustice against people of BOTH genders instead of just one gender? And how about we stop dividing issues by race, gender, ethnicity, gender identity, etc, like the stupid divisive Feminazis do with their intersectionality shit? Men, women, boys, girls, let's just end injustice against everyone, irrespective of race, skin color, gender, or gender identity. Let's make people's lives better, irrespective of race, skin color, gender, or gender idenity.

The problem is not that there's more men than women in prison, I think the problem is that the incarceration rate over all is too fucking high, that's a serious issue that needs to be adressed. For example, the United-States has the highest/biggest prison population or incarceration rate in the world and the prison system in the U.S.A is so in need of reformation and so bad and so horrific and the people in there are subjected to such horrific abuse that they get out of jail ten times worse than when they got in because of the trauma and mental scarring and this doesn't make the society and streets and the U.S.A safer, in fact it makes them even less safe and it makes the recidivism rate higher because mentally scarred and traumatized offenders might commit more crimes, this is a huge problem and something needs to be done about the huge incarceration and the prison system in need of reformation.

"Men are often subjected to rape, torture, and other unpleasant experiences in prison. Many commit suicide or self harm."

Women experience the same thing at the hands of other women in women's prisons, they are subjected to rape, torture, beatings, etc, at the hands of fucked up and controlling female inmates and they too commit suicide or self-harm. People of BOTH genders experience this. This is why we need to solve problems like the huge incarceration rate and reforming the prison system and replace "punitive justice" with restorative justice (treating offenders humanely and rehabilitating them, like the Norway system which has a very low recidivism rate) and reform the prison system so people don't come out of jail worse than when they got in and so they can get treatment for their mental health issues instead of being further mentally scarred. Also, people who have mental health issues to begin with don't belong in prison, they belong in a psychiatric hospital. AS NAMI a mental health organization said, prisons are not mental health facilities and are not equipped to treat people with mental illness.

I highly recommend those articles:

https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/blog/the-career-within-you/201408/restorative-justice-or-punitive-justice

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restorative_justice

https://e4e.org/blog-news/blog/its-time-restorative-not-punitive-justice-our-schools-and-society

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/opinion-eggleton-saint-germain-restorative-justice-1.4884839

I watched this video a couple of this and it's a very good one so I highly recommend it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxAQqC5KB18

Also, this guy has many good points about the prison system:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMAKkUO-HnA

I fucking love this TJ Kirk guy because he's calling the radicals out on their bullshit and point out why these radicals are wrong and he has so many good points as to why the radicals are making things worse instead of better. I might not agree with everything he says, but he has good points about many things and there are quite a few things I can agree with him on. Also, he calls both the radical Right and the radical Left out on their bullshit, propaganda, lies, bigotry, insanity, hypocrisy and double standards, he calls out the radicals in BOTH parties. So he's not a partisan hack or a fucking sell-out. He's against ALL radicalism period. I respect him for that..

Here's some of the things I definitely agree with him on:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLzG_3q50DuPmwGeMm3s37IcXFQoTCRe6U

Edit:

As for the death penalty (because I see that you mentioned it in your post), I totally support the abolitionists and I highly recommend these:

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/the-death-penalty-is-prem_b_3431814 ("The Death Penalty Is Premeditated, Unconstitutional Murder" by Michael Shammas, this article show that the death penalty is premeditated unconstitutional murder, as well as torture, and creates more victims)

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLzG_3q50DuPlhb38axadVYGieTwTKGC9r (Why the death penalty should be abolished worldwide, there's also a couple videos about how it's unjust to ignore the voices of victims' families against the death penalty)

http://www.worldcoalition.org/ (World Coalition Against The Death Penalty)

https://www.amnesty.org/en/what-we-do/death-penalty/ (Amnesty International)

https://www.hrw.org/tag/death-penalty (Human Rights Watch)

DoYourBestest · 2022-01-04T22:29:39+00:00

In any other area of society, a % skew like this would be considered ‘systemic sexism’, but because it’s against men they ignore it.

Crime rates in the black population are passed off as systemic racism, low female participation in sectors of employment are passed off as systemic sexism…

The statement ‘well men just commit more crime’ would result in HUGE amounts of RREEEEE’ing if applied to anyone else - ‘women just choose lowering paying work’ etc

tenchineuro · 2022-01-04T14:54:15+00:00

Men are 93% of prisoners and 97% of those executed globally. Should this be considered a men's rights issue?

I'm pretty sure that somehow women suffer more. /s

Doc_Steelhammer · 2022-01-04T18:55:21+00:00

Who the fuck cares ahahajha

mcPetersonUK · 2022-01-04T21:36:18+00:00

Not many women are campaigning to change this and equal out the numbers. Same as suicides, homelessness and deaths in combat. Some stats women are happy to let men lead on.

dontpet · 2022-01-04T17:43:32+00:00

I'd also frame it as a men's health issue. In a world where men aren't experiencing sexism in sentencing etc it is still something society would be wise to focus on to improve the well being its citizens.

Unnecessary-Spaces · 2022-01-04T19:45:53+00:00

Remember this next time you hear a woman say "Are you going to let him talk to me like that?!"

Yes bitch. 93% of the time.

ThePigmanAgain · 2022-01-04T20:42:28+00:00

Yes it should and it already is. Same studies that find blacks get crapped on by the US justice system find the same thing for men. Under the same circumstances, both these groups are more likely to be charged, convicted, and given longer sentences.

FIVE_6_MAFIA · 2022-01-04T23:52:06+00:00

Women get extremely short sentences compared to men. A woman in my local news got 15 years for murdering her 3 kids. She'll be out in about 10 years or so because of "good behavior" and "credit for time served"

ijustdontcare74 · 2022-01-05T10:22:58+00:00

I'd love to know what percentage of those executed globally were raised by single mothers ie without a positive male role model? I have a suspicion that the answer would be very high....I think that speaks volumes to a major factor in what drives young men towards crime and bad behaviour.

I know, for example, that gang members often seek out the gang lifestyle for the sense of male family and bonding as they lack that at home, often in a household where they're seen as the enemy by a mother bitter about her ex-husband or wayward baby daddy.

TheMightyCluck · 2022-01-04T14:36:37+00:00

Men commit an overwhelming amount of violent crime and murder…. Sooooo….

About 80% of violent crime and nearly 90% of murders are committed by men, so these numbers seem fairly correct. I suppose there’s a slight difference in percentages, but it’s a pretty small margin.

Non-violent crimes often come with more lenient sentencing. Shorter time/community service/probation. Given that men disproportionately commit more violent crimes, I’m not surprised men make up the vast majority of harsher sentencing.

Stirred_not_Shaken8 · 2022-01-04T20:14:27+00:00

Wow, that is incredibly sad. It´s really disapointing to see how society sees men as expendable. In the amnisty page it says that from 483 executions globaly in 2020, only 16 of those were women.

Very sad.

stetovid · 2022-01-04T22:02:51+00:00

Criminal men are more dangerous than criminal women

I do not support more leniency for criminals

coloradocaniac · 2022-01-04T13:27:51+00:00

Naturally.

2022-01-04T16:34:30+00:00

Men must drink from lead water pipes I guess

vhisic · 2022-01-04T20:00:55+00:00

this all stems from a myriad of other mens issues so yea i would say so.

Golden_disrepctCo · 2022-01-04T21:09:57+00:00

No because they did commit crimes but some times they're innocent

Training_Position642 · 2022-01-05T02:10:44+00:00

The reason men account for nearly all prisoners is covered by Jordan Peterson, according to studies mens vs women's aggressions are 60/40, as in out of 100 it is 20 percent more likely for an aggressor to be male. Now remember that's just physically speaking, which is actually fairly close. Much closer than most would think. Women express anger more so through verbal abuse, almost everyone knows this aspect of it. But physical responses are what ends up putting people in jail. Here's the thing, although men are only twenty percent more often resorting to physical abuse, think about that being represented by just one percent of a population. That's who's in jails because we can't just fit everyone. That's why nearly everyone in prison are men is because that twenty percent difference is magnified when you get down to the extremes. People don't realize this at all. Look up his speeches they're incredible.

InfowarriorKat · 2022-01-05T05:59:42+00:00

End the fucking drug war for starters. That would take care of it real fast.

Huffers1010 · 2022-01-05T15:30:22+00:00

I sat next to a girl at school who later served time for murder. Only eighteen months, though. I wonder how long I'd have spent behind bars if I'd murdered her.

I'm presenting an argument here that I don't particularly agree with in the interests of everyone becoming better informed, and I present what I view as the correct counterargument at the end.

I've had people tell me that women are actually punished more severely than men. I'm fully aware this is not true overall, although there are actually ways to build that conclusion if you want to torture the statistics enough.

The argument is actually quite similar to the one used for the gender pay gap. Yes, women overall get paid less than men if you control for literally nothing. And yes, men serve longer prison sentences than women, if you control for literally nothing. However, if you control for (that is, mangle the figures in a way that you think represents) the sort of crime people are actually being sent down for, you can, with some superficial validity, reach the opposite conclusion.

Put simply, women sent to prison are likely to receive longer sentences because when women are sent to prison, it tends to be for more serious crimes; the average sentence given to a woman is longer after controlling for the type of offence. There is some speculation that this is the case because they're more often not sent to prison for less serious crimes, whereas men likely would be.

I hope it's clear why this is entirely circular and self-justifying. Controlling for variables in statistics doesn't just mean ignoring all the things that don't support your argument, as you need to in order to make women look hard done by here.

The extra layer of turd on top of this shit pie is someone like Jean Corston, an extremely unpleasant British politician who has seriously contended that women should, in all but the most serious cases, be excused imprisonment altogether. Corston's argument that imprisonment actually does these women very little good does actually hold some water, although she never really makes it clear why that doesn't apply just as well to men.

(It does apply just as well to men.)

My solution to a lot of this is that we can reduce the number of people in prison, avoid the expense of police enforcement action, vastly reduce several important societal problems and increase tax revenues simultaneously by legalising most drugs.

ThaddCorbett · 2022-01-04T15:43:56+00:00

In many countries women aren't as free and don't have the chance to do as much damage as men do.

In Europeanized countries it's complete BS how women get away with a ton of stuff but outside of those nations it's a totally different story.

Title	Men are 93% of prisoners and 97% of those executed globally. Should this be considered a men's rights issue?
Author	JackieNaper1907
Upvotes	1182
Comments	150
Date	January 4, 2022 12:15 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/rvt1zw/men_are_93_of_prisoners_and_97_of_those_executed/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/men-are-93-of-prisoners-and-97-of-those-executed.1094657 https://theredarchive.com/post/1094657