CMV: Playing hard to get is actually a good strategy in order to get with a high value male

neualgae · 2020-05-31T12:53:39+00:00

playing hard-to-get makes no sense to me because you're actively selecting for men who ignore signals of disinterest

i would advocate for women to actually BE hard-to-get (have a busy social life such that you can't easily drop everything to make time for him, be the kind of person who likes to get to know someone slowly because you have boundaries and know that you have other options), but you should still make it clear that you're actually interested and not play games

the_purring_jew · 2020-05-31T13:10:34+00:00

They are using THEIR definition of "high value", not yours. So they are correct in that sense

NUE4T9x · 2020-05-31T13:18:16+00:00

There is no playing. The guy needs to see you as high value, and at that point it doesn't really matter. "Playing hard to get" only increases your value in the eyes imbeciles.

Low/high value is not objective and depends on preferences, standards, and environment. Depending on environment, I can have immense or low value. In your eyes, my value can change quickly depending on career choices. I would be persistent if I found something I liked, but if you have the wrong face or bad history, there is no chance whatsoever.

This idea of "how to marry a high value man" where value is defined by "how easy can he get laid" is broken, for many reasons.

TRP view is incorrect, but your view is not correct either.

Texan2116 · 2020-05-31T14:06:00+00:00

Hmm, As an above average male....I have no desire to play head games at all. Personally, I have zero desire for sex on the first few dates as well. So, if someone is being too slow to respond to texts/playing standoffish, or whatever, I am out.

Meydra · 2020-05-31T13:42:56+00:00

Sounds like a bullshit theory, sorry.

Why exactly does being interested in playing stupid games make you "high value".

ElectricalStatement7 · 2020-05-31T14:07:57+00:00

It's not that guys won't go for women that ARE hard to get (I.E. they're busy and have options), it's that PLAYING hard to get is just immature and juvenile. Some guys have patience for game players sure, but in my view they're fools. Game playing is not conducive to a healthy relationship at all.

I wouldn't define playing hard to get as not having sex with them after 1-3 dates either. I mean sure, maybe it works out for some folk moving that fast, but let's face it, most of the time it doesn't. I have to say too, as a guy I've never understood this "we must have sex by the 3rd date" type shit from red pill ideology. My last girlfriend, we waited about a month and a half after seeing eachother virtually everyday. To be completely honest, I wouldn't have wanted it sooner. I wanted to get to know her first (yes I realize I'm probably in a minority there).

NarniaFox · 2020-05-31T13:07:39+00:00

I always thought that "hard to get" game is about telling him "no" when he asks you out. No, I'm busy, maybe next time. Not calling him first, not texting him first, making it clear that you aren't that interested in him.

And I've never liked it, it's bullshit in my opinion. My husband and I waited to get sex two months, but these months were fun and full of dates, kissing, touching and being affectionate to each other.

BudgetSeaworthiness1 · 2020-05-31T13:25:50+00:00

To some degree, yes. I definitely get bored if it’s too easy. But that doesn’t mean it should feel like I have to bash down a brick wall with my forehead either.

That said, make sure you’re actually worth chasing. If you’re a 5/10 you’re not going to get a 8-9/10 to chase after you.

Playing a little bit of hard-to-get can be fun, but you have to keep it balanced and not overestimate how much work you’re worth. That’s where most fail miserably.

And no, saying that you’re a queen doesn’t make you one.

flyinghorse1 · 2020-05-31T15:45:12+00:00

I love how online everyone is either high or low value people. In reality most people are pretty normal and not some extreme end of the spectrum of being a loser who lives with their parents or a millionaire big shot.

CommanderOfTheDeath · 2020-05-31T13:06:56+00:00

The only chicks where that works are chicks who are 9.5/10. The hottest of the hottest of the hottest chicks are the only women who can get away with playing hard to get. Some 35 year old FDS chick which is a 6 on a good day can never pull that. No high value man keeps pursuing an average chick if the interest isn't reciprocated.

wtknight · 2020-05-31T14:15:57+00:00

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DareyFathom · 2020-05-31T12:54:29+00:00

Doubtful. I find the entire idea moronic from either side. Would you play "hard to get" with a potential employer? If not, then I would ask what your psychological standpoint is that this is justifiable for a potential partner. Probably extremely unhealthy if this is the strategy you employ.

phlegmdawg · 2020-05-31T13:33:44+00:00

“High Value” is a subjective term, so I don’t understand how any absolutes can be determined at all here.

So this is partially true for those that think a “high value man” is one that values mental connection over physical.

reluctantly_red · 2020-05-31T14:06:43+00:00

Its a great strategy to get a compliant easy to manipulate guy with few other options. Only problem is that most would not consider such a guy high value.

2020-05-31T17:30:53+00:00

Playing hard to get ironically will get you with an emotionally-manipulative person (which would fall in the low value category). Emotionally healthy people like me see this behavior and nope the fuck out because it’s blatantly emotionally manipulative. Like attracts like.

There’s a difference between bending over backwards for someone and playing hard to get. Both are terrible extremes, a nice middle ground needs to be struck

mrbill1234 · 2020-05-31T13:13:41+00:00

Hi value men have a lot more to loose these days when No means No. The smart ones just move on.

PapyrusLover420 · 2020-05-31T13:47:39+00:00

I think playing hard to get, gets you a very unkind male.

TechnicalMight0 · 2020-05-31T15:29:51+00:00

Just the other day I was discussing with an acquaintant of mine who is a high value man and he basically let it slip that he dumped a girl because they did everything on the first date and he felt that there was no use in pursuing her anymore. He admitted it.

What makes him so high value? Sounds like he possibly has issues (maybe a Stacey-widower because of some hot but crazy ex) that would be problematic in a relationship (of course that might not prevent women from thinking he's high value, but FDS women suppose themselves to see through superficial high value...)

If he just got bored because the girl in question couldn't flirt or be playful then that's something else, but playing hard won't really satisfy his desire for playful banter either and the end result would still very likely be him dumping her.

bakedpotato486 · 2020-05-31T15:55:36+00:00

If a woman sees value in a man, she should just go for him. If she plays hard to get, the only men that go for her are the men that are disrespecting her boundaries from the get go. Is that what women should want from a man?

asdf333aza · 2020-05-31T18:27:15+00:00

Just a few discrepancies

1) a HVM, should have options and no problem finding another girl. HVM make good and logical decisions. That's what leads them to be successful in life. They don't become rich or high status by being thugs and chasing any and every girl to turn her into a "baby momma", unless theyre rappers. So why is he going to waste time chasing a female when he could be doing business, working on himself and courting another female.

2) you think a HVM with options is going to wait for u to put out? He is just going to be like "forget all of the other girls. This one is playing hard to get, I'm just going to focus all my attention on her". Thats what you think is going to happen? HE MIGHT play your game, and that's a maybe. But if he has options like all HVM should, he will most likely be fucking other girls on the side, while pursuing you. HVM get what they want. If you aren't satisfying him, I assure you he will find someone else who will and then continue chit chat with you like it's nothing. He might even double dip on the same day when u do put out.

3) age needs to taken into account. A lot of these older men and women, do not play games. They are not trying to bs around and wait forever for it. There's an expression called "strike while the iron is hot". And for the men and women who are ready to start a family, they aren't going to wait around forever.

4) you really think a hvm is sitting around saying, "damn I wish these girls would put out less. It wish it was harder to get sex. I really want a challenge or a chase"... Numerous guys who are dating and married on reddit wishing their wives or gfs would put out more and you think there is a group of men who are thinking "I want you to stop sleeping with me so much. Make it a challenge". What your friend tells you, and what he tells the boys are tok different things. Same way, way that what a girl tells a guy is different from what she tells other girls.

5)and most importantly, you have to be worth chasing. And that's where a lot of you females mess up. Be real with yourselfs. The average weight of the American female is 170 pounds. Literally 2/3rds of American females are overweight or obese. And then 25% of American females are single mothers. And then that's assuming your education level is up to Par with his. And then there is your history and it matters. You think a HVM will want to put in work for a female who has a sex tape online or an onlyfans account? You think he will work hard for the same vagina that you was giving out for free in college? Your past may just catches up to you. And then are you even in his tax bracket? And then your age. We keep telling ya'll, but ya'll just don't want to listen, which is why the sub datingoverthirty exist. You lose value after 30. You literally just aren't as attractive to men, as you used to be and you're usually working too much nowadays to keep up your looks. And then are you even date material or wife material? Can you cook? Are u bad with money? Is your house a mess? Do you have toxic ass friends whispering in your ear? Are you a stuck bitch? Are you even good at sex? Are you a female who just lays there and takes it and can't suck a Dick to save her life? Do you have a criminal record? Drama with your exes? Nudes or you floating around. Ask yourself, why is a hvm going to chase you? You're so concerned about his worth, but are you even worth it or are you just a quick fuck?

"Bbw, SIngLE MoM Of two, cuRReNtly UneMpLoYed CurreNtly Look For a hvM fOR A seRIOuS RElATIoNsHIp. NO hOOK UpS.My kids are mY LiFe. 6'0"+, nICe care, niCE HOUse And be wilLIng to lOVE ME and My ChIlDRen.JUsT Got oUt oF aBUSivE RElATiONSHip. yeAh, I'm a BitCh, Deal wItH It"

Yeah, he is definitely gonna chase that.

901735 · 2020-05-31T18:54:22+00:00

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wizard_down_there · 2020-05-31T13:01:28+00:00

If Chad doesn't need to work hard then I won't work hard either. Making me work hard means you think Chad is a superior choice you'd rather be with. Because a woman only opens her legs if she wants it.

I don't chase, I just masturbate

Troy016 · 2020-05-31T12:44:53+00:00

No it isn’t lmao unless your high value like him.

wtknight · 2020-05-31T13:00:19+00:00

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gaylord_fag · 2020-05-31T15:09:42+00:00

Well I'm trying to get with a high vaule man and he admits all the time that he supposedly doesn't want sex but I still hit on him. In this case he's not being fake like the guy was in your example. Because the guy I'm going after is upfront about wanting more than sex. Because he's high vaule.

So I still hit on him cos I'm a massive slut but he will just reject me. It's the same way guys on here say women are like goalkeepers who have to defend against someone pitching a ball into the goal (idk much about sports here). Women repeal men's advances all the time while still leading them on. It's the same for me with how I interact with this guy but he's in the role of the woman rejecting my advances. He still doesn't penalize me for being horny. Like someone who says yes to fucking but then just leaves the next day would. He just says no to the sex stuff and then tries to change the subject. Rather than taking advantage of me just for being a nymphomaniac.

There's no law that stops men from saying no to sex.

rosmaskinen · 2020-05-31T15:49:10+00:00

For some of us, it works if we are guilty of having a tendency to over-invest in new relationships – especially romantic ones, but it also applies to platonic ones sometimes. But then again – ''play hard to get'' is more like a codeword for ''don't answer a text from a guy if you're trying to fall asleep/working/studying''.

2020-05-31T18:28:34+00:00

Nope . Why would really attractive dude with 6 figure salary wait for some avarage girl who thinks she is 10/10 ? Instead of you he can get a younger and more attractive girl who doesn't play hard to get .

Appomattoxx · 2020-05-31T23:04:57+00:00

Animals fall somewhere along a spectrum between sexual dimorphism and monomorphism. Monomorphic animals mate for life, and both parents take an active role in raising the young. Almost all males find mates, because females mate with one and only one male.

Dimorphic animals, on the other hand, are polygamous or promiscuous. Either way, a small number of males mate with most females, and most males never mate at all. Male investment in offspring is minimal or non-existent.

Humans are somewhere in the middle.

So the definition of "high value male" really depends on which strategy a particular female is pursuing. If she's pursuing a promiscuous or polygamous strategy, a high value male will be the male who is most successful at mating. In this scenario, testing males (by playing hard to get, for example) is important.

If you are looking for a monogamous partner, on the other hand, your strategy is probably different. You probably want to be actively looking rather than passively waiting. Once a potential monogamous partner is taken, he's gone forever.

Sid_Insidious · 2020-05-31T23:34:12+00:00

Average and lower value men are probably just playing a numbers game. They're not going to waste time investing in someone who is playing hard to get, because in his experience, that ultimately means "will never get".

If a woman is high value herself, she won't have any trouble getting a high value man. The trouble is.

a) She may have an overinflated sense of her own value (Becky with the degree who just won't settle).

b) She may be pursuing a high value man who doesn't want commitment (yet/ever).

In any case, playing hard-to-get won't "trick" a high value man by activating some "must pursue" imperative. Although being TOO available can have a negative effect, the opposite (playing hard to get) is no assurance of a positive effect.

In other words, just because being too available is a turn off doesn't mean being hard to get is a turn on.

katiesaysthings · 2020-05-31T14:03:48+00:00

It’s not about playing hard to get.

It’s about making your life so full and exciting that he has to EARN his time in it. Because you’re busy.

I’m so over these grossly simplified dating strats.

2020-05-31T13:41:14+00:00

I think that's half true.

First off, how attractive are you?

If you're feminine, young (18-29)/(30-35 for men 45+), in shape/not fat, not contentious, and have a sensual/friendly demeanor (bonus points for having huge boobs/booty, yes us guys are stupid and that is a factor) then yes, "playing" hard to get can work in your favor.

Of course if you mean hard to get as in not sleeping with someone on the first date, not being desperate and jumping in your car anytime he wants to see you, and having a push/pull conversation type flirting. Then yes it could work for you if you have a fun high value guy that likes the playful banter. Some high value guys can be super serious though and have C Level / business owner careers that dont leave much time to play games. So maybe blowing them off and not seeing them when they dont have much time might get you deleted and blocked on the phone.

So yes, be hot, be young, be fun, and feminine and you can probably get away with playing hard to get . But hey my dude if you got like you do dont sell yourself short lol if you're hot and fun then any guy is going to be chasing you.

Also I hope this guy is potentially marriage material and you're not bouncing around monkey branching around different guys being hypergamous seeing how much you can get away with. Take advantage of your position and make an effort to be this guys wife if you see him as a good partner.

There is a guy on YouTube who has a red pill approach to dating for both men and women. His name is Kevin Samuels and he believes in hypergamy and that guys should be high value if they want to get high value women. Check him out, hes pretty good.

Silly_Field · 2020-05-31T13:08:39+00:00

If by hard to get you mean don’t have sex on the first date, I agree. Having sex on the first date is usually too soon for everyone - you don’t know each other well enough for there to be the right sense of safety or build up of tension.

If by hard to get you mean ignoring someone/being unavailable all the time, I think play stupid games, win stupid prizes. You’re bound to end up in a relationship with someone who values emotional distance and finds closeness off putting.

2020-05-31T15:03:00+00:00

I realize changing your view is probably impossible on anything feminist but your view is horribly flawed.

This could only work if the woman involved is a much higher SMV than the man, and the man is something of a simp.

The idea of hard to get is part juvenile thinking given by parents which means "don't get pregnant before you get married" or romance novel tier thinking.

I'll explain. There is this fantasy that some really high value man is somehow intrigued by the woman he can't get and turns him down. He becomes enthralled by her lack of interest. He strives to be some awesome romantic to break down her walls of resistance. She slowly open up, starts to make some time for him, and finally, in a burning passion with only eyes for her and her only does she maybe give in.

Just think what sort of mentality a person like that has beyond her if thats how he views thing? Sounds awful.

The only real acceptable hard to get for a high value man would be something like this.

Him: Wants to get together for something

Her: "Oh I'd love to but I have to fly to London on Thrusday for a presentation on Saturday, I'll call you when I'm back."

Not:

Her: "Oh, well I'd really like to work on my some hobby so maybe some other time".

If shes not making time for you, if shes not excited to spend time with you, or at least seems to enjoy it, any guy with RMV is going to just move on.

MirrorThaoss · 2020-05-31T12:56:41+00:00

The problem with these posts and debates is that terms are poorly defined and can be interpreted in any way.

What is "hard to get" ?

If it's waiting 3 months before sex, no exception accorded and no context can change it. Then "playing hard to get" is shit.

If it's not being a simp, well obviously it's good to play "hard to get"

Now almost everytime someone mentions "hard to get" , they mean something that is between the two, with possible variations. And sometimes the definition is what is convenient.

If i ask you what is playing hard to get, chances are that you'll explain to me something that exactly the right amount of "hard to get" to get men interested. And we'll reach that point where you said that to be attractive, interesting and mysterious to men you need to be just enough interesting, attractive and mysterious.

xinf3ct3d · 2020-05-31T14:21:20+00:00

Nah. Playing hard to get will bore most guys to death. It will lead to cheating. Why should an objectively "HVM" play along that shit with his wife/ partner if he has all the other options available.

akihonj · 2020-05-31T15:04:12+00:00

Personally the whole hvm lvm hvf lvf is utter bullshit and straight out of femaledatingstrategy ideology.

Here's an example, if you consider a man to be hvm, who you play hard to get with, who in turn says he's not into playing games, he drops you like a hit stone. Where does that leave your assessment of his status, is he now lvm or still hvm. If he drops you then according to you he's lvm, but again then you're wrong because you judged him to be hvm earlier.

If you play hard to get and he stays around, is he lvm because he's willing to put up with your games, well again that says your assessment was wrong because you judged him to high value earlier and that's why you played hard to get.

What still if you judge him to be hvm, but he judges you to be lvf, doesn't that place emphasis on your assessment being wrong, wouldn't we all agree that high value dates high value and low dates low.

In essence then judging anybody by status is a shallow and corrupt and doomed to fail as judging a rapist by how many women he/she hadn't raped.

Why not try to drop the status or emphasis on status and get to know the person, why not date somebody for who they are, because there is a real connection there.

Surely that's got to be better and more real than dating somebody for how much they earn, it reminds me of that reality TV show where a woman is marrying a man and states how she doesn't want to be getting married to him, how much she regrets what she's doing, only to find out later that he's actually a millionaire and turns around to say just how much she's in love with him.

Maybe it's just me who thinks it's really tragic for people to think like that. That those who do think like that should actually do the world a solid and stay away from dating and relationships.

Matt_Door · 2020-05-31T15:11:08+00:00

As someone high value in some areas and low in others, this strategy would likely make me back off thinking she is not interested. I’m not the type to hang around where I am not wanted.

_pinkpearls · 2020-05-31T16:07:45+00:00

I agree with you to an extent.

Further elaboration on my individual perspective, is that I believe it solely depends on one’s definition of “high value.”

In my opinion, a man that doesn’t come from a prominent family and born into an affluent lifestyle — could never truly be “high value.”

‘Mediocre Joes’ overcompensating to compete in getting chose with their everyday essentials, appealing to bottom tier women, merely operate in the illusion of value. This — primarily built on the basis of communal sentiment, in which they selfishly adapt an abundance mindset for vajayjay profit. (Even men with a ‘rags to riches’ trajectory, will never be WASP quality. )

I work in Private Wealth Management, old money employ a completely different set of principles, values and strategies. Their approach to masculinity purpose, preserved quality, and appreciation of sensual divine femininity is something a man of warped upbringing, can not fluently comprehend.

This would eventually transpire to my dating experience, when I added a high value WASP to my rotation... I don’t even recall playing hard to get or directly putting him in a position to chase me. However at the time, commitment wasn’t a goal of mine so we naturally elevated. I’ll never forget the first time I made a sexual pass at him lol, will spare the embarrassment but his reaction was gold. (Note, true high value men are sexually disciplined. ) — He continued setting the bar very high for me, without ever hitting the sheets. And I’d rather be alone for the rest of my life, before I normalize the dating standards of what low caliber men try to sell as ‘Alpha’ or high value.

thetoitestnoice · 2020-05-31T16:19:36+00:00

Hahahahah a “high value male” I swear, sometimes y’all sound so ridiculous. The title sounds like someone selling a farm animal at the local fair

WIA20XX · 2020-05-31T16:20:26+00:00

> he basically let it slip that he dumped a girl because they did everything on the first date and he felt that there was no use in pursuing her anymore. He admitted it.

This doesn't sound very high value (under the FDS version of high value). Sounds like he only values the sex/pursuit of sex. What about the woman's other qualities? Did having sex with her early on, erase all of her accomplishments, achievements, values, personality?

Sounds like he's not a good person to begin with.

People that emphasize Sex Timing, early or late, usually aren't "high value".

As for the tactic of purposefully delaying sex/affection in order to psychologically condition someone else - it's an effective tactic in that you can increase their investment - but it's not without costs.

geraltsface · 2020-05-31T16:23:21+00:00

A man who loses interest in a woman for ‘giving it up early’ is the definition of a LVM. Plus, if sex is what they want, they’ll fade no matter how long she waits to give it up. A high value man wouldn’t be so easily deterred. They’d also understand it takes two to tango. My opinion.

Another thing I’ve noticed is all men love to chase, regardless of value. I’ve had many toxic, commitment-phobic exes pursue me relentlessly. As soon as they knew they had me, they went cold almost immediately.

The saying ‘play stupid games win stupid prizes’ comes to mind here. Like other commenters have said, I think there’s a way to be hard to get by actually having a life outside of the guy. There’s no need to purposely try to get him to chase. If he likes you, he’ll show it regardless.

Edit: consistency

Syduka · 2020-05-31T16:59:31+00:00

I don't think HVMs like to chase but they will certainly pursue and wait for a women they care about.

PMmeareasontolive · 2020-05-31T17:12:07+00:00

he basically let it slip that he dumped a girl because they did everything on the first date and he felt that there was no use in pursuing her anymore.

This just gave me so many douche chills I thought I had corona virus. It just makes zero fucking sense. And this is a from a "high value man", he's gonna judge like a child? gtfo.

The real reason women should wait a little is because they often have horrible, basically incompetent, taste in men and choose morons like our "hIgH vaLuE MaN" above.

edit: After reading another thread I realize that there's probably a huge difference in the kind of women who approach HVM and the kind of women who approach average guys. Both sets of women are probably chasing some sort of fantasy projection, but with the latter set she has to use imaginative leaps to transform that blue collar frog into a prince of some sort. It's kind of brilliant to find value is something that isn't trendy (where you are told what to like). Maybe that accounts for why on the rare occasion that a woman approaches me I respect her for being smart enough to see something of value in me, whereas HVM are probably bored with just another girl chasing him because for him there's a certain vacuousness to it all.

2020-05-31T17:12:38+00:00

Dunno about getting a high-value male.

I am a guy and I like women, and this is my experience.

Back in high school I played hard to get, and... to be honest I was good at it, very very very good, so much so that.... I won that (stupid) game: nobody "got" me.

I am now older and wiser, and somewhat successful in the SMP, I am a firm believer in the SMP, and I do believe in an honest assessment of one's SMV, I believe in not settling for less that we bring to the table, which is not "playing hard to get" it's more like not wasting time with lower value people and interact fairly with people with whom there's a mutual attraction.

When and if I interact with a woman who likes to play the "hard to get" game, I let her win..... so I move on to smarter women.

vinx_finx · 2020-05-31T17:28:06+00:00

No playing hard to get is bullshit. I’d love to see how this goes with a guy that has options. Just be careful with what you lead with. Lead with your ass you’ll be gone in a week. Lead with your personality it then depends on how much he likes you.

GreenSatyr · 2020-05-31T17:51:17+00:00

The really confusing thing about this is that the internally consistent position is the opposite of the espoused one

TRP / RPW should be saying "withhold sex" because they repeatedly claim that promiscuity in women is undesirable and perhaps even morally degenerate

FDS should be saying "have sex whenever you want" (assuming you wouldn't be sad if the sex didn't involve commitment) because they would define a valuable man as one who is not put off by promiscuity.

reluctantly_red · 2020-05-31T17:52:48+00:00

Eh, I tried it both ways and got mixed results. I was crushing hard on this guy and he texted me that maybe we should try dating and I demurred that we would be better as friends and the was the last I heard from him. Ah well, moving on. My current boyfriend chased me for a long time on Match before I gave up my phone number. That was not a strategy, I legitimately had bronchitis. And despite the common wisdom around here about LVMs and all that rot, he is very high value. We are still in love and it all worked out.

So YMMV.

soloesliber · 2020-05-31T18:06:28+00:00

You're 100% correct. My s.o. was super attracted to the fact that I have a lot of passion projects and am always doing things. When we first met, I liked him but in no way was I willing to make him the center of my attention or drop what I was doing for him. I'm sure part of it is also that I prefer to take things slow anyway. It took us months to get to where we are now. He's admitted that other girls in the past were much easier and willing to spend as much time with him as he wanted at the drop of a hat. None of those relationships lasted particularly long and while many of those girls still actively pursue him, he's over here asking me to move in with him and asking when I want to get married.

Pontifex_Lucious-II · 2020-05-31T18:06:28+00:00

Women have no skill.

You just hope a “high value man” walks into your life and disco dances to make your life better.

YveisGrey · 2020-05-31T18:11:26+00:00

I dont think “playing hard to get” has anything to do with HVM vs LVM the only thing is that a man who really likes you will continue to pursue you. If you give it up to easy in the beginning then the man may stick around with you because they just want sex. Playing hard to get isn’t about showing disinterest mind you it’s more about setting and keeping boundaries. You can be clear and intentional about your feelings for a man but you should have boundaries.

Kaisern · 2020-05-31T18:51:15+00:00

you seem to have “playing hard to get” confused with “being hard to bed”

playing hard to get is being aloof, non-respondent, not communicative, not affectionate. it’s a game to make it seem as tho she is so far above you that she’s disinterested. this is very unattractive to everyone but simps

being hard to bed means that she can still be passionate, involved, talkative and romantic and even physically show that she’s attracted, just hold out on intercourse until commitment

also FDS definition of a high value man is a doormat that spends money on them (only after Chad smashed with no effort tho)

therealMericGetler · 2020-05-31T19:22:59+00:00

Personality is a bigger factor.

CosmicBioHazard · 2020-06-02T10:10:15+00:00

I've spoken to women I know who've been in the position of trying to use sex, and especially early-access sex, to secure commitment from, in their view, high-value males. The thinking seems to be that, if she has sex with him he'll pair-bond to her and commit.

That line of thinking should work, for a guy whose butterfly factory is fresh out of its' box, but these women are going after men who have access to a lot of women. Why would sex push your brain in the general direction of 'spending the rest of your life with one particular person' if you've had the same or similar experience with a pool of women? Forget being 'easy' or 'hard-to-get' for a minute; you're trying to secure commitment, you need to be thinking 'which space in this persons' mind can I secure a monopoly on?'

Because sex releases such a large amount of the hormones responsible for feeling attached to someone, it's basically the ideal spot in the mans' mind for you to have said monopoly, if you want commitment. The problem is that for a large number of women, that's exactly what a low-value male looks like.

Now, plenty of guys with an N-count do end up committing eventually, but just who do they commit to, and why?

As the bearer of potentially bad news here, what I can say is; That's got everything to do with the individual. There's no method. You wanna secure a virgin guys' commitment? There's still not a method, per se, but you do have access to a bargaining chip of sorts. For a guy who can't single you out as that very special first time? No method, no chip.

SeemedGood · 2020-05-31T14:24:04+00:00

Playing hard to get only works on men who have no other options. If a man has 2 or more other women vying for his attention, why should he put up with one who is playing hard to get?

What is the hard-to-get woman offering that the other 2 women aren’t? That’s the question that women need to ask themselves, answer it honestly, and make changes where necessary

Peacheslikeyou · 2020-05-31T13:57:17+00:00

Yep, BE hard to get.

Be busy, have an active social life, pursue hobbies and interests. No sex or intimacy until commitment has been established. This will get you the best man.

Barely-moral · 2020-05-31T14:53:58+00:00

I am sure some high value men want a woman that is hard to get as in someone that has a busy life.

But that is not universal. It is perfectly possible that a high value man already has enough competition, effort and chase in all other aspects of his life and just wants a soft place to land when the day is over.

A woman that plays hard to get can be the exact opposite of what he wants, more of the same shit that he already has plenty of during the rest of the day.

dalia-chan · 2020-05-31T16:06:21+00:00

Tbh most people that told me to wait and how making the first step will make me less worthy, were men themselves.

Most of the guys that tells you that they love it when a woman do the first step, tend to be those who need an ego boost.

Yes! They will love it when they’ll see a girl approaching them, and rushing things fast, and saying yes to everything but it doesn’t mean that they will LOVE YOU FOR THAT. That’s a detail that makes a huge difference. They love it cause they will feel loved and valued but they won’t value you In return

Plus remember that redpillers are literally against mariage and LTR relationship, so so don’t expect advices that will benefit women.

Now there are some women that won a HVM’s commitment even if she slept with him on the first date but that’s like winning the lottery. It’s extremely rare and happen in one in a million cases

taapy234 · 2020-05-31T14:50:29+00:00

Women always struggle to comprehend how simple statistics work. Like, we keep repeating that 80/20 thing here every other thread like a broken record, and it always get past their heads.

This post is prime example.

Playing The Game works for men because we throw a much wider net. We approach women ranging from an average jane (5) to above average woman (8) to supermodel tier woman (9) occasionally.

For women, thanks to them basically only relying on hypergamy to select a man, playing hard to get game will never work. The competition for men you desire so much is so high that you won't even register in his radar unless you..., you know, actually compete for that man with other women. Like what we men do on a daily basis except its 100x times hard.

Its like me constantly trying to approach supermodels all day long. If I said that to men, even guys will tell me I am being stupid. That's not how this works.

Hard to get strategy might work when chad is drunk enough and falls for your bait and he can't find any stacies in the vicinity.

paint-the-world-red · 2020-05-31T15:45:57+00:00

I’m shaky on agreeing with the opinion of one HVM. The thing is majority of HVM don’t have the time or tolerance to put up with games because he has options. Why would he care about losing a single gold coin when he has hundreds already?

I have no way of proving or having my stance disproven but when we all think of a 'HVM' I doubt it’s the same one that FDS women can actually get. Let’s be real, you can’t really compete with the HVW and this is where the Wall begins to come into play. It doesn’t really mean that age alone puts you at a disadvantage in dating. It means that because of your age, it puts you at a disadvantage against younger women. Younger women are in better shape, are less jaded, have less baggage, and force you to jump through less hoops if she already sees you as HV because her ovaries aren’t a time bomb yet. It’s like comparing a Lamborghini Aventador to a Toyota Camry, you can’t compete no matter how hard you try.

You have to factor in all sorts of things such as the specific HVM that you want, the women who want him, the women he already wanted, what he offers, what you offer, and everything else under the sun that would factor in a relationship. The thing about effectively working this strategy is it has to be a 'maybe, maybe not...catch me if you can' scenario. Any sort of disinterest or no or obvious game-playing goes right out. And even then, this isn’t going to work for your average plain Jane.

SeemedGood · 2020-05-31T15:58:16+00:00

Just the other day I was discussing with an acquaintant of mine who is a high value man and he basically let it slip that he dumped a girl because they did everything on the first date and he felt that there was no use in pursuing her anymore. He admitted it.

Interesting what you consider an HVM.

TheNewBo · 2020-05-31T16:24:03+00:00

I don't believe the right term is hard to get, but low and slow. Give up just enough to keep him/her interested, but not so much that they feel entitled/haven't earned it.

This is how kids learn everything and I firmly believe that this simply continues into adulthood. You need to work with other people to find the right carrot at the right distance ahead of them, but once you can dial that in, training your partner is easy, as well as it becomes easier to be trained.

Positive reinforcement, desirable goals, and enough challenge to keep the person going. It's why video games are so addicting.

jordanxbox1 · 2020-05-31T17:46:02+00:00

I would agree because high value men don’t normally stop just because of one little thing that gets in their way, they keep trying their luck until something works

Frankensteins_Poet · 2020-05-31T17:47:15+00:00

Playing hard to get is ridiculous, but that doesn't mean you don't have any self respect either. Don't fuck the guy on the first date, but don't string him along either. Go on a few dates, get to know each other, and make your intentions clear. Playing hard to get implies edging the guy on, which is a good way to make a guy lose interest

Alberic2092 · 2020-05-31T17:49:07+00:00

Goddamn, that hurt my brain to read.

Just the other day I was discussing with an acquaintant of mine who is a high value man and he basically let it slip that he dumped a girl because they did everything on the first date and he felt that there was no use in pursuing her anymore. He admitted it.

Ok, first off, this never actually happened. Moving on.

If anything, it is low value men who don't want to chase. They are used to get everything the hard way so they get pleasantly surprised when a girl is easy. High value men are the opposite, they are more likely to pursue you if you are not easy. FDS is right to tell women to wait.

This literally makes no sense - just because you're different or unique, doesn't mean you're automatically valuable. If you were a man, you would know that. Sure, a high value man will pursue a high value woman even she is difficult, but an average woman (and I'm gonna be generous here and assume that despite being on both PPD and FDS you are average)? The type that he can dozens of without effort? Why would he bother?

Being catty and "hard to get" may raise your status in the FSM - which is really the only thing you and most other women care about, so by all means keep doing it - but it certainly won't raise your attractiveness level in the eyes of men.

2020-05-31T18:38:57+00:00

You’re not wrong, assuming your value is equal to or greater than the effort put into the chase, otherwise they’ll just leave.

Appomattoxx · 2020-05-31T19:25:53+00:00

Just the other day I was discussing with an acquaintant of mine who is a high value man

What is a high value man?

brackenz · 2020-05-31T19:38:58+00:00

Reality is that good looking successful people go for other good looking successful people, what you're proposing is trp "nagging" and it works as well as gambling on penny stocks

This sounds like something a catlady would think

painiskindafunn · 2020-05-31T20:37:01+00:00

Every human is going to be more attracted to anything thats less obtainable, in some form, just in your subconscious. Diamonds. Etc lol

thetruthishere_ · 2020-05-31T20:54:09+00:00

You dont play it, its be hard to get, have a life.

M4sterDis4ster · 2020-05-31T21:08:05+00:00

Depends.

If she had "sexually liberating" years of her life and now she thinks playing hard to get will just land her HVM. Sure, try it out.

She can do that if she was "hard to get" from the start.

Beecher-Frank · 2020-05-31T21:37:54+00:00

I agree. I think a lot of men get disinterested if a girl has sex with them too soon or too easily. It shows that she is easy and subconsciously makes him think she is not high quality because he didn’t have to work hard to get her. How many amazing, fulfilling things in life are easy to achieve? Not many.

I don’t think girls should necessarily “play hard to get” because that can make the guy just give up. I’m just saying they should wait for several dates before having sex.

Killer_Queen_Daisan · 2020-05-31T21:40:49+00:00

You don’t “play” hard to get. You become hard to get. Just like how a man can’t “act” like he’s confidant, he has to be confidant.

LeJacquelope · 2020-05-31T22:01:33+00:00

A high value woman is one who will work hard to get her man.

purelypopularpanda · 2020-05-31T22:01:45+00:00

In my personal experience, the exact opposite is true. I’m guessing there is some leeway if you’re punching above your weight or if your ideal match is into mind games. I wouldn’t have the first clue about how to date someone where every text, every contact is littered with subtext and you’re bound by some arbitrary rules that the other person has created in their mind. Been with my bf for just over a year and from the very beginning we were both very honest and upfront about our intentions, feelings etc. It’s so much nicer if you can both allow yourself to be vulnerable and get excited about a person.

Wander1900 · 2020-05-31T22:39:19+00:00

I wouldn't waste time in a hard to get woman

Xemnas81 · 2020-06-01T00:08:31+00:00

This is Rules bullshit, and suggests anxious attachment with a fear of intimacy and abandonment, being covered by trying to game men such that you always have the power to abandon them first.

oOGrumblesOo · 2020-06-01T00:15:23+00:00

A "high value man", isn't gonna be playing these games with you. They're gonna look for someone who's actually interested in them.

It's like jobs. If they're actively seeking you to work for them, it's prolly a shit job or a scam.

Aesthetys · 2020-06-01T01:13:43+00:00

Not having sex on the first date is not playing hard-to-get.

2020-06-01T01:16:57+00:00

I don't think this is right. I think the double negative is true.

I don't think that 'playing hard to get' is necessarily a good strategy.

I think that 'playing easy to get' is definitely a bad strategy.

SilentLurker666 · 2020-06-01T01:38:16+00:00

If anything, it is low value men who don't want to chase. They are used to get everything the hard way so they get pleasantly surprised when a girl is easy. High value men are the opposite, they are more likely to pursue you if you are not easy. FDS is right to tell women to wait.

Yes and no and it actually more complex then that. Economics call it "game theory".

The Strategy of "playing hard to get" works to weed out those who are serious and those who are not, but it's only effective when you know the party is at least interested. It's also fail safe because if the other party isn't interested; You have nothing to lose. It fails when the women is interested but the guy is only iffy, then the women just show a negative sign and the guy would certain move on, especially in today's social and political climate dominated by the #metoo movement. On that aspect it's very close to the "negging" and "push-pull", and again you can't neg when a girl doesn't have IOI and show interest to begin with.

SunflowerBurst · 2020-06-01T01:51:22+00:00

I agree with you but what I am going to change about your view is that they will never agree with you because they have a different idea of a high value man than what most women have. And it’s usually along the lines of “I am a high value man because I value cheap and free sex with no love and I would totally not fall for that trick so therefore playing hard to get does not work.”

12112019 · 2020-06-01T02:14:04+00:00

In your case if you try making such men wait you will just stay single, the best thing for you is to be easy, at least you get some sex from hot men.

As for 8's and 9's they might be better served by making men wait, that is correct.

2020-06-01T02:20:49+00:00

I personally believe that if you are a "high value male" you'll attract high level women, and you can avoid all of this. Sometimes it just "clicks" without games and you make time for each other.

That's the way it was with my wife. and the same with the woman before her, and i had to decide. (I think the other woman was "the one that got away")

Ubermensch-1 · 2020-06-01T02:27:34+00:00

The surest way to score high value partners is to be high value yourself, regardless of your other behaviour.

LatterInside1 · 2020-06-01T03:18:29+00:00

Playing hard to get wont get you a high value man, but it will filter out men looking for short term relationships. Likewise, red pill / pua advice will filter out women looking for long term mating.

Jimmaey · 2020-06-01T03:21:08+00:00

Your hard to get tactic is only there to make yourself feel better. Proper high value playboys can intercept your interest in him from a mile away. So your hard to get routine is just putting on a show for him while he reels in the bait. And hard to get will only work if you’re straight fire . If you’re ugly or a decent looking woman, men will lost interest almost instant .

ClearManufacturer8 · 2020-06-01T04:50:35+00:00

It only resembles a time where all women behaved like that and men had to accept it, play by said rules and offer commitment in exchange for sex.

Thing is back in the old time women WERE hard to get, and when got it you were damn sure you were getting something few guys had the privilege of enjoy (it must hace been a satisfying feeling, I admit). They weren't playing shit, that was how women supossed to behave, that was "default setting" in the old dating scene.

Not anymore.

Do it for fun? To play mind games? I could see some men looking for this kind of entretainment, absolutely. "Roleplaying" old romance and "hunting" and "chasing down" women, yeah I get it.

Not my thing. I ask once. Want to go on a date? Done. No? Ok wish you best. I'm moving to the next chick.

Life's too short to waste my time chasing just one cunt endlessly while there are 4 billion pussies out there I've never met.

SwaySh0t · 2020-06-01T06:13:14+00:00

In short: Hvm see through the bullshit right away and this usually gets the girl ghosted or passed up by the next girl in his DMs.

Hv people don’t play games. They don’t have the time because they actually have a life (hobbies goals other interests, and chatting up other people lol etc)

Hvm also are able to easily discern and gauge the true interest level of women he is courting. If there’s is any indicator of indifference or lack of interest he’ll next you In heartbeat.

In my personal experience, more times then not, it’s usually the girls that put out quickly that I end up committing too. The women who are willing to break the “rules” and give in to there deepest desires for you are the only women worth Hvm commitment. Those relationships tend to be easy going and stress free as well. The 3 date rule is arbitrary, robotic and extremely transparent, I guarantee I’ll ghost you after. Any man who has slept with hot women (and I mean 8’s up, perfect 10’s don’t exist) know that 3months is never worth the wait no matter how hot she think she is or no matter what stupid games she plays.

party_dragon · 2020-06-01T11:08:30+00:00

plyaing hard to get =/= waiting for sex.

playing hard to get means not being proactive, waiting for his calls, not putting in any effort to plan dates, blowing him off ("he should try harder") etc.

you can be very into a guy and wait for sex

he dumped the girl because (1) she signalled she was a slut (lowering her value), and (2) she was otherwise not high-value enough to overcome being a slut

usa_foot_print · 2020-06-01T12:30:57+00:00

Yes and no.

You never fuck on the first date, ever. Playing hard to get will have some HVM as you call it, drop you. Some of them don't want games. But you don't open up everything to a person right away, ever.

You slowly get to know each other.

2020-06-01T14:14:14+00:00

Way to compare to extremes and make a conclusion. Typical ppd.

Women who put out on a first date better be virgins.

2020-06-01T16:06:08+00:00

I think it depends on the strategy he is employing at the time. To use your example, he still dated her and had sex with her, which is a priority. And it doesn't mean that he won't do the same to a woman who makes him wait a few weeks before sleeping with him.

Sex mode vs relationship mode are kinda of two separate but parallel agendas for him.

ModernMedia · 2020-06-01T21:17:24+00:00

Stop the larping, you know very well that there are no HVM's in greece. Everybody with potential left years ago

DubsPackage · 2020-06-02T05:05:21+00:00

True to an extent but I think there's such a thing as playing /too/ hard to get.

Most guys don't want you to be too easy, because then there's nowhere else to go, it's anticlimactic, it's like you expect a certain progression, you want a kiss to feel special, or feeling her boob to be like "oh she's letting me feel her boob, that's nice." The anticipation, the build-up, it's kind of like long-term foreplay.

You want that to be playful and to feel natural, not forced, not like "ok 3 months are up, you may fuck me now" but just go a little further each time you see each other.

Also the whole "high value/low value" male thing sounds pretty forced/contrived, it's like you're not even taking into consideration your OWN feelings, forget about value for a minute, ask yourself "Do I actually LIKE this guy." And if you don't, then it doesn't really matter how high value he is, and if you do, then "low value" shouldn't mean much either.

I think it's good to have strategy but bad to have "rules."

Strategy : I'm gonna play hard to get and build up the interaction slowly so that he feels like he's progressing and that this relationship has somewhere to go.

Rule : I'm gonna make him wait 1/3/6/12 months, then demand that he marry me.

The first one is smart, the second one is stupid.

angry_ogunsoto · 2020-06-06T21:32:02+00:00

To get a high value man, the woman must be a high value herself. If she is not high value, no matter how hard she plays she will not get the high value man.

As for the high value woman, she can choose the man she wants by filtering out all the low value guys.

In general dating has to do with value.

verdantsound · 2020-05-31T13:53:03+00:00

so just because one guy said it, you’re going to adopt this viewpoint?

LotBuilder · 2020-05-31T17:04:49+00:00

It’s not a bad strategy if you can handle him fucking other girls early in the dating process with you. I will put up with the chase if I have a FWB on the side taking care of my needs.

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Title	CMV: Playing hard to get is actually a good strategy in order to get with a high value male
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	116
Comments	330
Date	May 31, 2020 11:30 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/gtxilx/cmv_playing_hard_to_get_is_actually_a_good/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/cmv-playing-hard-to-get-is-actually-a-good.669716 https://theredarchive.com/post/669716