Do Men actually want women to take the lead when it comes to dating?

cloudydays84 · 2020-10-21T10:01:45+00:00

I don't like mind games and I don't like chasing people, other guys might and that's cool no judgement from me, just never vibed with it.

JohnDoe9564 · 2020-10-21T09:42:28+00:00

They just want them to show some sort of interest and reciprocity.

No one wants their date to be holed up in their phone while they're chatting. It's disrespectful

Karmanger · 2020-10-21T13:36:36+00:00

The only guys who are going to complain that when a women approaches them is a LV women, are guys who either...

Get approached a lot
Like to chase
super relgious/tradecon

The guys who want women to approach most likely

Don't have much female interaction
are tired of getting rejected from mis reading signals
Are not the type who like to have all the burden of the relationship on their shoulders.

passepar2t · 2020-10-21T09:39:59+00:00

Yes, why would I want a woman I'm interested in to show interest or affection towards me? That's crazy talk. I'd rather chisel at an ice wall for several weeks. That's what really gets me off.

Nu_Guy · 2020-10-21T12:54:57+00:00

Every time a girl was open with me about wanting to get sexual, sexual things happened.

mensahi41 · 2020-10-21T10:28:35+00:00

Yes. Not sure what's wrong with the guys who seem to love trying to convince someone to like them. It's a waste of time to spray and trying to understand hints etc. Would be easier for everyone if all people would just be upfront with their intentions

MasterTeacher123 · 2020-10-21T10:29:46+00:00

Define “go after” in your opinion.

Is approaching a guy and saying “I think you’re cute/handsome” count?

rivetcitymayor · 2020-10-21T13:41:10+00:00

I don’t know one guy that “likes to chase “ wtf lol . Women don’t need to be direct about dating a guy but at least show him that you’re receptive and feeling him so he can keep going but most women don’t even do that

Pastelitomaracucho · 2020-10-21T10:14:11+00:00

I personally don't chase. It's either fun, spontaneous and equal effort or I will look somewhere else.

If a woman comes to me and I reject her, it is simply because I did not like her enough. I guess women experience this all the time.

madchendesu · 2020-10-21T13:45:58+00:00

[deleted]

upalse · 2020-10-21T09:38:19+00:00

Imagine if companies wanted customers to "take lead" in the market and withdrew all advertising - "customers" (women in this case) know best, right? In theory, that would be great - more informed customer leads to better market choice.

In practice, few companies would keep advertising and dogging on customers, gaining significant edge and bankrupting the now passive competition. You're slave to demand curve and who is the consumer and who is the producer here.

cuckspace · 2020-10-21T13:05:01+00:00

Do Men actually want women to take the lead when it comes to dating?

Can’t answer for all men but reciprocating is an absolute must and leading is fine.

Women who go after men are seen as easy & LV.

That’s because the women who do that are usually the ones that are not attractive. The act of being upfront or taking the lead is not the unattractive part, it’s the woman. If a woman I actually like would do that it would be an absolute yes from me.

So when you get down to it men don’t actually want a woman to pursue them, men like to chase.

Not me.

Typically men preffer more subservient women, you don’t actually want someone assertive. You can’t have submissive women who simultaneously show you strong IOIs.

Not me. But 99.99% of women are submissive, so we have to play with the cards we’re handed. I wish dominant women existed in the real world.

Moobx · 2020-10-21T16:16:09+00:00

I wouldn't want a guy that loses interest in pursuing me if I show I am in fact interested in them. Guys like that will always be after the chase and once they win you over they will move on to another chase. I will stick with the guys who are not put off by a woman being forward even if there are less of them. They can stay with the mind game playing women.

zerofeetpersecond · 2020-10-21T10:39:01+00:00

Men just need to know it is safe for them to talk to you. Once woman establishes that man will do the rest.

OXOzymandias · 2020-10-21T12:11:02+00:00

just 50/50, but no lo women wont do it, they lazy

Women who go after men are seen as easy & LV.

BY OTHER WOMEN

atlas explained the whole fsm and pussy cartel, this girl lower pussy price for you guys lol, thats it we all know that, if a woman is mad into you she wont mind making move

2020-10-21T14:40:39+00:00

I want women to initiate. I don't like having to chase. I don't like having to risk not just rejection, but ruination and calamity. In the era of #metoo, pushing when you get a no, which many women try to force men to do, is risking jail time and cancellation. It's just not worth it.

Also women are the more selective sex -- it just makes sense for them to be the initiators. It means more happiness and less negative feelings for everyone.

abaxeron · 2020-10-21T10:48:10+00:00

Have any of you, EVER, tried to be honest and kind with a man? Even if their rational brain will mumble something about "easy == LV", most will melt and go into joyful frenzy.

Was there ever a study that showed women who asked men out were rejected more often than women who played mind games? I suspect there wasn't; enlighten me if I'm wrong.

Jaylen-Gads · 2020-10-21T10:02:42+00:00

“Women who go after men are seen as easy and low value”. That is not true at all, that theory is a fallacy that is being perpetrated by women who go after men who were never attracted to them AT ALL in the first place and imagined the whole interaction in there head, that’s the equivalent of a guy chasing after a woman who never had feelings for him and did not realize he was never really a option he was just “that guy” the “friend”. The reason why men are the ones “chasing” is because the majority of women are going after the top men, so the average men are chasing women to get them attracted to them that is what the majority of dating is like for “average” men, it’s common sense. As for your question, I do not speak for all men but as for me, yes I would like her to take the lead every once in a while, but in reality it will not work because subconsciously women are attracted to dominate men who take charge and lead the interaction. This is one of those cases where it sounds good on paper but won’t work in practice.

renfsu · 2020-10-21T10:51:54+00:00

Taking the lead, approaching isn't necessary. More obvious IOIs would be fine, you can pretty much tell if someone finds you attractive by the way they look at you. Approaching in itself is rare for women, and I'd add it's untrue that men find it unattractive. Women usually think this because they approach guys that are out of their league

2020-10-21T11:45:47+00:00

In the initial stages, such as approaching and actively trying, a resounding yes. The only people who see women approaching and call them low value are other women who want to keep their privileges

mae1995111 · 2020-10-21T10:05:51+00:00

Yes because even if you don’t like her you still get the attention.

Cabbageboigirlwhat · 2020-10-21T17:50:22+00:00

It's a generalisation that men prefer to chase, just like most things it's not clear cut like that, there are men who prefer to lead and also men who prefer when women take the lead, but just like how some women prefer to lead and some don't, one of those two options is closer to the traditional gender roles and thus much more familiar. It's just seen as far less weak or shameful to pretend to be a manly Masculine nan than anything else. And both men and women propogate this.

SecondHandMatron · 2020-10-21T17:56:17+00:00

Yes. I would like a woman to say "I'm attracted to you. You have to do your best to fulfill my requirements, and in return you get my complete loyalty. If you have requirements, I will also do my best."

lorddane · 2020-10-21T18:07:03+00:00

Take the lead, no. Show interest and dont play childish games, yes.

2020-10-21T18:45:16+00:00

My girlfriend made the first move and I don't view her as low value, I legitimately can't believe my luck. My insecurities are mostly focused on feeling overwhelmed by how I can be a satisfying partner for her.

In my case, sex isn't a big deal for me, and a dating life defined almost entirely by rejection has left rejection a profoundly unpleasant experience for me. These combined mean I won't stick my neck out unless there's some indicator of interest I find totally unambiguous.

ninja_deli · 2020-10-21T22:14:42+00:00

" But when asked men seem to think that women who are upfront are only doing so for lack of better options & not because they are genuinely interested in them in particular. "

Who says this? I've literally NEVER heard any guy say this.

Expensive-Guitar3609 · 2020-10-21T23:41:07+00:00

I've been aproached by women all my life, all guys ask me how do I do It.

I always tell them "Well, I'm good at being 6.3", white, with black hair, blue eyes, ripped and with a good dick."

But yeah, most of the women that had aproached me are quite average at best. Sometimes they are stright ugly... Like...

"Girl... How dare you? I was trying to have a good time and now I have to think a way to reject you politely without hurting your feelings."

They add me to social media, they like my photos, all of them, eating, lifting, driving, shitting... Then say "hi, do you remember me?". No, I don't, why should I? "Oh I sent you a friend request becouse you were so nice to me the other night". No girl, I was being polite, becouse you were alone and sad. "Oh where can I find a guy like you!". IN THE NEXT LIFE WOMAN!

Like come on, why the fuck I would want more entitled ugly women aproaching me? I even have to reject some of them multiple times before they get the memo.

I don't know what's wrong with women anymore. Some of them have plenty of options yet they want to shot so out of their league that I'm starting to think they are stupid or have severe dementia or brain damage, it's the only possible explanation.

Stop saying women to aproach guys they like, becouse they won't go ask YOU, they will aproach ME, and I'm currently engaged and running out of excuses to reject them politely.

cmvmania · 2020-10-22T02:04:29+00:00

1) Most men hate mind games unless if they had to, or theyll learn eventually.

2) “women who are upfront are only doing so for lack of better options and not because they are genuinely interested in them.” Let me be honest just to draw the line, some men will only judge you with such if you are: Over 30, and they knew you never liked him in the past or they knew you had lots of casual flings/high body count before you decided to pursue him.

sigma1932 · 2020-10-22T07:20:07+00:00

It doesn't matter who chases who for most men... he's going to ~~chase~~ put effort into a relationship with a woman he wants regardless of who makes what move first... the problem is most women fail to work at being women that men actually want.

IMO, men generally want women who proactively pursue the active female role in the relationship... however, they have to be GENUINE about it, which takes a certain amount of maturely feminine (seductive) tact and a sense of duty to the relationship that most women (particularly assertive modern women) don't have... mainly because they have no social pressure to have it.

Impressive-Spot-1191 · 2020-10-22T07:48:22+00:00

with #metoo around, chasing someone who is not clearly into you is playing with a loaded beartrap

clear indications of interest or nothing, thankyou

2020-10-22T07:58:58+00:00

So when you get down to it men don’t actually want a woman to pursue them, men like to chase.

Yes, we absolutely love wasting our time and money on hoping we're getting some later on while doing things we don't actually want to do.

Makes perfect sense.

WilliamWyattD · 2020-10-21T14:34:13+00:00

I know few men who really like the thrill of the chase. In general, scenarios where the guy getting some thrill of the chase was a major factor in the overall outcome are not ones that end up in great relationships.

I don't think a woman showing interest is going to turn off many men in a situation where the relationship had a chance.

That said, whether as a culture we should or could go to a female pursuit model, or even a gender neutral pursuit game, is far more complex. It really depends on the overall rules of the game and the culture in question. In today's insane dating game, I suppose more female initiation couldn't possibly make it even more of a shitshow.

The real issue has more to do with female initiation when the man isn't truly interested. I think men know less than women how to handle that kind of situation, though I suppose they could learn. But in some ways it goes against nature and this can cause problems if a culture doesn't compensate--you could make a culture that works well with female initiation, but I'm not sure this is the one.

A main problem I see is that in a situation where a man would have sex with a woman if handed it on a platter, but wouldn't consider her for more, most of the time (not always) he isn't going to make the work of initiating. The dangers and efforts in initiating do filter for a degree of interest somewhat. But if a woman whom a man isn't really interested in initiates, that filter is gone. He's more likely to see this as easy sex and play whatever easy games he needs to to get that sex. Then end it should things get complicated and the effort not be worth it.

In general, women are more upset if used just for sex than men. So the female initiates model in the current dating culture would yield more of this IMO.

Cobra_x30 · 2020-10-21T19:46:39+00:00

Spacey... I think you have uncovered a key piece of MGTOW male hypocrisy. Yes, they want women to do more approaching, but are consistently dissapointed when the girl is not extremely attractive.

crookedsummer2019 · 2020-10-21T10:30:37+00:00

Female here: I always got the impression that it’s not that men want women to lead when it comes to dating, rather, they want women to respond affirmatively to their advances when they show interest in her and to be agreeable people to date.

Yeah some guys want a subservient woman and on this subreddit we see more of that because red pill and stuff but I’m referring to what I observe in real life.

When a woman likes a guy, even if she never asks him out she usually makes it easy to be pursued by showing that she is positively receptive to any interaction she has with him, touching his arm, smiling a lot and all little things we do when we like a guy.

I also don’t see anything wrong with a woman approaching and I’m sure there are men who may prefer that. Again I’m just going by what I have observed over time of what seems to be the norm.

midwesternMD · 2020-10-21T16:32:06+00:00

I like the chase, but I can be pretty bad at picking up signals. Particularly in the age if metoo, I’m hesitant to make physical advances without clear interest and consent. Sure, plenty of women like passion, but fuck if I’ll indulge them at the risk of a sexual assault allegation. Not until it’s clear that I have a green light to proceed as desired. Even then, I exercise restraint on the first time.

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acron5n5 · 2020-10-21T10:46:15+00:00

Yes.

akihonj · 2020-10-21T16:05:04+00:00

So what you're getting here is because most me have no choice, either they approach or never get a date because most women never approach.

So then if you look it from that perspective it's not too hard to understand why men would see a woman who approached them as either desperate or low value and slutty, simply because us men just aren't used to it.

Try imagine what you'd be like walking into a store and being told you can pick any item or set of clothing you want and walk out without paying, you'd instantly ask what's the catch, for us men it's like that.

Where's the catch, but if I ask where the catch is then I'm looking a gift horse in the mouth and might lose out on something great but where's the catch.

So until it becomes common for women to approach those that do are going to continue to face this behaviour from men.

It might not be nice for those women who have the balls to approach but it's the way it is until women change their behaviour.

ShangoRaijin · 2020-10-21T17:39:07+00:00

I think there is a middle ground where a woman can show her interest without seeming too brazen. I will admit it is a dance.

I also think that men hear woman complain about unwelcome contact a lot and aren't sure how to approach without being a creep.

TinsleyCarmichael · 2020-10-21T18:32:38+00:00

No not really. Some of them just don’t want to deal with it themselves.

Throwawayforshitt · 2020-10-22T02:12:54+00:00

As a man? Fuck no.

I wouldn't trust a woman who takes the lead fully, it would be weird. Now, there is a sweet spot of course. I want the woman to be in to it and reciprocate. I don't want to be chasing for nothing; I'll just lose interest in that case. But i want to be the aggressor, yes. And my girlfriend says it turns her on when I aggressively pursue her so... I don't really think anything is going to change on that front for men and women, sorry boys

juliana_san · 2020-10-22T06:46:38+00:00

I have a rule that if I'm interested in a guy and relatively confident it's mutual, I will invite them out once if they don't invite me out first.

After that I leave it up to them. It's not that I don't want / like to make the first move but like. I think many men are in denial that they get bored when women do the initiating. Every single time I expressed interest in a guy he's gotten weird and backed off eventually. Even when I was positive (LOTS of flirting and innuendo) that they were interested. And I'm a VERY cautious dater, I won't assume it's anything more that surface flirtation without enough evidence to the contrary.

jdobrila · 2020-10-22T07:36:55+00:00

Some of them do. You often see it in romance fiction aimed at males. Bottom of the barrel SMV males.

yum_yum_yamaguchi · 2020-10-22T16:37:12+00:00

can't the women go after what they want the same man can? Nobody got time for games. If you like someone you show a bit of interest and see what comes about it. If at the end of the day ya both go home to your cat or dog, ya still blaming each other for not making the first move. In the end, a job isn't going to come to you, you need to fight for it. Those High school days are over, where the football jockey keeps asking u out to prom.

_Neon_Shadow_ · 2020-10-23T03:12:41+00:00

Easy and straightforward.

Workaholiconew · 2020-10-23T04:08:25+00:00

We want some reciprocity by women, some would like women to go all the way, some don't. But almost all men consider women way too passive. Or worse, tend to flee and expect us to chase. which is just irritating.

But when asked men seem to think that women who are upfront are only doing so for lack of better options & not because they are genuinely interested in them in particular.

You reversed the causal connection here. We don't think women who approach to be low value. We are not women, we value those who show value. and a woman who approaches actually slightly increase her value.

We just got used to low value women approaching, and thus are kind of set back when someone whose have no clear low value actually approach, but as any woman which is neither a landwhale, crazy or a trans, can tell you, it tends to ends up working well for the woman at least 20% of the time if they are REALLY approaching.

(Some women say they approach when they smile to a guy or look at him in the eyes... thats... not approaching).

Women who go after men are seen as easy & LV.

And thus, valuable in a sense.

So when you get down to it men don’t actually want a woman to pursue them, men like to chase. Typically men preffer more subservient women, you don’t actually want someone assertive. You can’t have submissive women who simultaneously show you strong IOIs.

What an enormous exaggeration.

So gents what will it be? An “easy” Chase where you know she wants you or head games where there’s more “suspense”?

An easy chase of someone worth chasing. Obviously.

staceface · 2020-10-23T05:41:27+00:00

Men like to complain that women have it so easy because men are the ones putting in all the work. Yet, if a woman pursues them they have no interest, probably because they think the woman showing interest will eventually reject them.

sony_anumo · 2020-10-26T01:21:48+00:00

All you need to do is something. Often it is anything.

In my experience, most women expect men to take all the little risks.
No one wants to be left hanging on a kiss.
Well unless the girl is very drunk, then there is no holding back and they can get very pushy.

But when sober, I have had girls who show almost zero signs of being intrested until i push forward.
And later they tell me "Yeah i was really into you at that point, it must have been so obvious".

It is as if there is no nice middle.
Either they hide it extremely well or they kling on you like a drunk monkey

Aubrey_D_Graham · 2020-11-06T13:12:02+00:00

We want to lead the relationship. They want women to be genuine in their interest with them. We don't want to play games, and we don't want to be gamed.

Canary897878 · 2020-11-27T15:58:50+00:00

Normally if a girl approaches me instead of me having to take the lead I am more attracted to them cause from what I seen, woman who approach men are basically never pillow princesses, and the fact that she approaches you means that she has some level of confidence which is also quite attractive to me I really dislike insecure people. And its also nice to get a change of pace every once in a while considering that I have to approach women like 99% of the time.

HoneyNJ2000 · 2020-10-21T13:15:47+00:00

Men have become such pussies at this point that they want women to approach them, they want women to ask them out, they want women to decide where they're going on the date, and they want women to pay for the date, as well.

These pitiful feminzied "men" who have been primarily raised by single mothrs would have never lasted even 25 years ago when they didn't have a dumbass cell phone to text women with or social media to hide behind to meet women. Nope, back then, a guy had to actually man the HELL up and approach a woman and ask for her number - and then he had to - GASP! - call her and ask her out for a date.

The horror!!!

Today's wimps would never have the cajones.

Pitiful.

Gravel_Roads · 2020-10-21T09:44:49+00:00

No, and when men say this what they mean is "I wish the women I wanted to date would pursue me".

I'm bi, and I've had men and women pursue me at different times. If I like them, it's awesome. If I don't like them, I don't want them to pursue me at all.

tl;dl People only want to be offered things they want and don't like to be offered things they don't want (see: jehovah's witnesses vs girl scout cookies)

Quikdraw7777 · 2020-10-21T14:37:57+00:00

To me, if a woman isn't giving you IOI's there's no reason to engage further, regardless of the level of physical attraction you have for her.

She is directly showing you that she isn't interested.

Pick it up and move on.

Hargabga · 2020-10-21T16:00:19+00:00

Yes, let's pretend that putting all the burden on guys does not benefit women at all. It's not like they want to avoid rejection and instead get a pick of those who want her and compete for her. What a ludicrous thought!

And let's also pretend that the ones who mark women who actually show initiative as "easy" and "low value" are men, instead of other women, who are in no way threatened by this particular paradigm.

Indeed, why would anyone prefer dating to be simple and straightforward, instead of a guessing game in which your chances are low, but you still have to take a shot after shot, sometimes leading to a mutual frustration when they are chasing those who aren't interested in them, while not noticing subtle signals from those who like them.

After all, it isn't at all the case that both men and women lose out in such a situation, women when men they want don't pick up on their signals (and for some reason do NOT chase after every skirt they meet) and men when they waste their time being strung up along for the sake of satisfying some girls ego.

Yes, we prefer our dating life to be a torture, why do you ask?

Copperstoner · 2020-10-21T11:47:31+00:00

I don’t know about men in general, but for me it’s a clear no.

I enjoy the initial „chase“ way too much fun and it would be less fun if she takes all of this away.

HCHDGSH · 2020-10-21T12:28:10+00:00

I've had girls I've dated make the first move on me. Like my most recent relationship, I appreciated how upfront she was, it didn't make me think any less of her, but it seemed like she kind of expected special treatment for breaking the norms and being the one who approached me. We've had countless discussions where she wondered if I'd have ever made a move on her if she didn't, to which I had to explain to her that I very well might have, but seeing as we were colleagues and I was the new guy who just came in, me just walking up to her and saying I was interested in her like she did to me might not have gone over so well (not if I barely know the people there etc). I wanted the job to make money, why would I play it like that and risk creating a situation where I'm looked at as "that guy"? But if a connection developed and I noticed basic signs of interest I would have pursued them for sure.

Now maybe the density of this particular girl's skull prevented her from being susceptible to this line of reasoning, but through this experience I found myself thinking I'd rather be the guy who makes the first move.

And honestly guys make it a bigger deal than it is to make the first move in my opinion. If you set your little ego aside and accept that you will fail more than you succeed it's not that bad. But instead most guys like to think 2 things: they can kick someone's ass, and they could get women if they wanted to. They just don't want to take the plunge and be confronted with the reality that might destroy their delusion.

Then guys like to harp on how it's not fair and why should we have to do all the work. But the personal growth alone from having to confront the resistance of approaching girls is more than worth the cost imo. Idk, I'm pretty fine with things being the way they are honestly.

Kaisha001 · 2020-10-21T15:53:42+00:00

Most of my relationships (wait no all), were her chasing me. Course I had a lot chasing me so, I was fortunate because my 'game' was abysmal.

Asbelowsoaboveme · 2020-10-21T16:09:12+00:00

No, they just want easy pump and dumps

HumanSockPuppet · 2020-10-21T16:13:27+00:00

Men don't want women to lead. They just want women to be more direct about giving signals that they're interested.

AquarianScientist · 2020-10-21T18:44:31+00:00

Men who approach punch above their weight too.

I approach men. Yes I punch, but I almost always secure at least a long term fwb relationship.

I’ve approached and secured many LTRs which I later broke but I was happy to have the relationship while it was good.

I really haven’t had any men complain about me being aggressive and approaching.

reignoferror00 · 2020-10-21T19:30:31+00:00

Prefer a women to approach - would be welcome.

Maybe when I was much younger I might have been skittish with a hard direct approach from a woman but that is no longer the case.

DerekMorganBAU · 2020-10-21T20:41:32+00:00

Personally I like the chase but I don't want the chase to be too easy because then I get bored. Like really bored.

Id still fuck them and see them but the "thrill" is over and I have to bench a bitch.

But there's a saying that goes "If she really likes you, then she'll make it easy."

Just don't make it too easy sheesh give me a reason to want to keep talking to yo ass 😂

darksoldierk · 2020-10-21T23:59:11+00:00

Some men like to chase, but those men don't like to chase what women want those men to chase. When men say they like to chase, they aren't referring to chasing after a woman with a good personality. they aren't referring to chasing for a relationship. They are referring to chasing for pussy, one night stand, chase after a living fleshlight, and never talk to her again. That's what men like to chase. Why? Because "the chase" which is men putting in effort now, is rewarded with sex, which is also a "now" type reward. Relationships are supposed to provide rewards over time, not now. And men don't enjoy the chase if the reward may or may not come in the future. Relationships, good ones, as a reward, are not a "now" reward.

Women want relationships, but they want men to chase them for relationships. Men don't want relationships, but they want sex. And men are willing to chase women for sex. If women want relationships, then women should chase men for relationships.

If I'm looking for sex, easy is the way to go, so she should chase. If I'm looking for a relationship, I sure as hell don't want one that starts off with "head games" and "suspense", and would prefer a relationships with a mature person who act like an adult and doesn't play games. So either way, there is no reason why a woman should not be chasing. The women I "chase", are the ones I pump and dump. You want games? I can play games too. I can be charismatic, tell you what you want to hear, make you feel wanted and loved all in a matter of hours, then, the use you as a cum bucket later that night, and disappear from your life the next morning. Women want to play games? Men can play games. Les us know know when you become adults, so we can start treating you like adults.

Slyfer_Seven · 2020-10-21T11:24:12+00:00

This is a classic case of actions speak louder than words. We dudes don't want to chase and we'll tell you we would like a woman to be more forward, direct, etc. However, we NEED the chase, it's imprinted onto our DNA, so don't listen to anything we say that's contrary to that.

The same biological shit that drives women towards horrible partners because it fires off some lizard brain synapses, is what keeps us from truly valuing a partner we didn't have to work hard to get.

If a dude tells you otherwise he's lying/in denial or has settled and plateaued in what they desire. Simple as that

blobyqube · 2020-10-21T13:05:04+00:00

Submissive women are just boring.The "spank me daddy" is just cringe and getting repetetive.Assertive women are a nice change.

Skadi793 · 2020-10-21T14:47:06+00:00

I don't know who told you that women who pursue men are considered low value

Sure, if a girl throws herself indiscriminately at guys, but

If a girl sees a great, high-value guy that would make an excellent mate, and makes herself available to him, gives subtle hints, and makes a general plan to get with him --well that is just good strategy.

2020-10-21T10:03:23+00:00

I find women are generally extremely upfront with making the first move, and it's quite obvious what they're doing, if you're confused as to whether or not they're actually making a move it's most likely miss reading friendly. Something like the majority of my hook ups and most of my relationships I was not the one to make the first move. If you're engaging in some sort of PUA fuckery you're going to end up in that game because you're going to attract those into that, if you don't want that then don't play that game, set the rules to the game you want to play and you'll win. Also if you're just running around hitting on every girl then everyone is going to see that as well. You're going to get a reputation unless you travel to new scenes every week.

xFallacyx69 · 2020-10-21T14:00:46+00:00

I think I prefer a woman who shows very clingy signs, but also respects herself enough to not let me take advantage of genuine interest... like I need to know you’re not just flirting for fun, but also that you will (and have) left guys for taking advantage of your aggressive approach.

MessiahOf21Century · 2020-10-21T14:33:28+00:00

I don't want a subservient woman, I want someone assertive. It would be good if a girl were open with me. As about "doing so for lack of better options", the quality of her personality I'll judge by other factors.

SucreLavande · 2020-10-21T16:23:07+00:00

I doubt it. I’ve never had to try this and it would make me feel uncomfortable. A friend of mine has had lots of failure with it. However her current partner who is loving, generous and successful and appropriate age and looks match for her (she’s a little cuter) she met from a OLD where he had a profile and she messaged him first but then he took the lead. So maybe a single message on OLD where people are Obviously there to date is ok?

doublestuf27 · 2020-10-21T17:25:04+00:00

As far as the interactions between you and any specific guy are concerned, it’s a personality thing as much as a gender-role thing. The big gender-role difference to bear in mind is that most men, even relatively attractive and sociable ones, get extremely little positive unsolicited attention from women (except maybe mom and grandma), and may not be sure how to respond. Also, if they have more experience with being propositioned, it’s likely that a non-trivial fraction of the propositioning was unwanted attention from prostitutes or addicts. So the most important thing for you is to stay true to yourself and your own personality, and don’t try to manipulate yourself or someone else into a crappy relationship just because it’s there.

Appropriate_Host2540 · 2020-10-21T17:35:16+00:00

This depends on 2 things, approach and chemistry. Approach: If some lady i don't know came up to me and was like lets date, it would be strange. However, if she came and started a conversation and during that conversation there was chemistry, it would be ok. Also, if this was someone who I've met, and there is chemistry, then it would be welcome. I've been approached by women at work before where there is no chemistry, and it is just weird.

SwaySh0t · 2020-10-21T17:55:48+00:00

From my experiences and observations I’ve found that both parties take the “lead” in dating within healthy relationships.

The women sends the “invitation” the men approaches and initiates. The men hooks her then sits back to let her chase. (Chasing too much as a man lowers your perceived value in her eyes)

After she chases for a bit then she pulls back again, only a little less then before this time( she started to get invested) then repeat the cycle for the men until both parties are “hooked”

That’s generally how dating/flirting(teasing and bantering ) work. It’s about knowing when to chase and when to run. Ironically while we all grow older we really haven’t evolved passed chasing each other on the playground as kids.

TrenWarrior · 2020-10-21T19:24:05+00:00

lol......fuck no.

LooseIndication · 2020-10-21T19:32:05+00:00

NO

Men have been brainwashed into submitting to female caprice to get sex. But the female brain perceives that as servitude and low status, because that's exactly what it is: male servitude and low status.

Women are right into rejecting those men, because those men are mentally broken. They had been abused, emotionally broken, and are incapable of working correctly. They are stuck in childhood.

wtknight · 2020-10-21T19:55:05+00:00

If women who I were attracted to approached me, that would be great. But most of the women who hypergamously approached me in the past I was not attracted to, so I’d rather just approach myself.

throwawayhouseissue1 · 2020-10-21T20:04:00+00:00

I have been in both situations and the real answer is that it is somewhere in the middle. I am not trying to be obtuse but both men and women will "try too hard" if they feel like they are the lower value person after a higher value person, and the person with more value has more power. You want to be in a relationship where you both feel like you're with a higher value person, but just a bit, not extreme.

That's the only way I think relationships work, but don't look at me, it isn't like I have everything figured out.

Ecl1ps3_O · 2020-10-22T00:15:04+00:00

Neither, I don't want to be in their gravity wells, at all.

SpencerWS · 2020-10-22T00:30:35+00:00

Men who want women to approach them are seeking to avoid risk and rejection. But that’s unmanly, so not a productive wish. The better course is to figure out how to take those risks and handle rejection.

That said, rejection is painful and a pattern of it is severely demotivating.

TheBookOfSeil · 2020-10-21T11:51:31+00:00

Not all the time, personally. Shit is exhausting. If I’m to get with someone, she’d better have a mind of her own and an ability to make decisions too. Far too often, it seems like women are looking for a second father as a partner.

michael1962-01 · 2020-10-21T12:30:21+00:00

[deleted]

ModernMedia · 2020-10-21T12:45:57+00:00

The thrill of the chase is mostly a young men's game. I'd say starting at even the mid 20's most guys would prefer openness, signs of interest and no games. Some women might be too direct, which can signal a lack of class and I feel it's often those women who harp on the theme of men not wanting to be approached etc.

Imperial_Marcher · 2020-10-21T15:11:53+00:00

Being chased would be a turnoff, Besides women are far likely to do it wrong (see r/Nicegirls). Instead, being upfront like grown-ups and showing interest when chased by men (if it exists) would be enough.

sthlmtrdr · 2020-10-21T14:19:01+00:00

No. I want to take on leadership and be the leader in the relationship. Being a dominant, assertive man with high confidence I natural gravitate towards submissive, "insecure", "shy" type of girls that want a strong, driven, ambitious man to lead them.

Title	Do Men actually want women to take the lead when it comes to dating?
Author	spacechicken1990
Upvotes	78
Comments	398
Date	October 21, 2020 9:24 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/jf9lyv/do_men_actually_want_women_to_take_the_lead_when/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/do-men-actually-want-women-to-take-the-lead-when.327685 https://theredarchive.com/post/327685